Open Mike 21/11/2017

173 comments on “Open Mike 21/11/2017 ”

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1. eco maori 1

   21 November 2017 at 7:51 am

   If They try an pin that on me people any more than personal its a setup they have all the means to plant my personal property anywere I have given them to many RED FACES .
   Which is what Te Kooti did to them but Te Kooti did not have this 21 century communication device that puts my story out to the WORLD Ka pai and they put a bounty on his capture of $600.000
   they made sure he was not killed because all Maori would have risen up an well you no what the out come of that would have been my tepuna Rapata Wahawaha was coned into assisting them in the chase and war in the Urewera’s . I would like to see Te Kootis words on his story I’m not sure If this is out there.
   I agree that a lot of the beggars are on crack I can spot a crack head easy as crack is a human wasting substance don’t give them money give the money to some outfit that gives these people rehabilitation . This is Keys legacy homeless crackheads and a chronic crack problem and the talk is more about the houses that have traces of crack than all the people affected by this crap this shit is the flow up of money to some very bad people in NZ. My words on the weekend must have really got up there nose A because they were going hard yesterday but they can go and get ________ what do they expect me to do drop off the face of OUR earth well that is not going to happen.
   Many thanks to the winning NZ Ladys Rugby League team Ka pai There is a explanation on the differences between these team I have allready writen about part of this Kia Kaha
   • eco maori 1.1

     21 November 2017 at 6:19 pm

     I can tell a national supporter they give me the stink eye when they see my Eco Maori signs on my truck ha ha the left supporters smile they are going ahead of me and telling the road workers not to wave and what do the people do well I can SEE.
     I have got to close to there reality with my older post because they backed off today.
     They backed off but they were still present I see all there moves what a waste of resources chasing the Eco Maori . The best thing about my situation is I get to let my people know exactly how OUR system works and this will help them up there ladder of life stop some these kids slipping into jail I.E scared strait and behave like OUR Lady’s do and think before one acts .
     Now all the people with Trust Farms If I was you I would get the farm management to run more stock for meat for you this will not affect the farm profits and will be a big saving to the share holders a extra 5 cows a year they wont even no they are there but make sure you own them get home kill to process the meat the farm killed meat is 10 x better than shop brought meat no fat in the mince and on dairy farm raising pigs is cheap as there is waste milk most time so just get 5 cows 5 pigs and you will be saving big time man average $15 a day on meat for 2 . My brothers and sisters want to raise there own stock I am going to get the farm lessor to raise them for them I have seen inexperienced people try to raise stock an was not impressed this is the work smarter way of doing things. I don’t take smokes to work and my work is getting easy as my lung heal I will be smoke free soon P.S I know whom reading my post. I have to cook tea so byby Kia Kaha
     • eco maori 1.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 8:03 pm

       So what do I no about OUR law well any bullshit evidence gathered will be inadmissible in a court of law if the law is broken while gathering this bullshit evidence. Kia kaha
2. Grey Area 2

   21 November 2017 at 8:25 am

   After listening to Brownlee on Morning Report I sent the following email to RNZ:

   “It would be good if RNZ realised the “National” in its name doesn’t mean National Party. A lot of air time seems to be being given to the National Party in a way I don’t remember Labour being treated when they were in opposition.

   “Balance, not bias please”.

   I also picked up Brownlee referring to the “minority coalition”. It seems to me the underlying message taken from the attack lines sheet is minority = illegitimate.

   I didn’t hear the former government referring to themselves as a majority coalition.
   • CLEANGREEN 2.1

     21 November 2017 at 8:35 am

     100% Grey Area.

     I think RNZ is being used by Natioonal still now as a propaganda tool.

     When is Claire Curran going to get rid of the national cling-ons inside RNZ????
     • james 2.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 12:33 pm

       So you think staff should be got “rid of” by a government minister because of perceived political viewpoints?
       • KJT 2.1.1.1

         22 November 2017 at 7:26 pm

         Didn’t stop National from packing broadcasting with ignorant right wing prats.
         Don’t need to ask them their political views. Just make them pass a “facts” test.
   • ianmac 2.2

     21 November 2017 at 9:02 am

     Kelvin Davis was embarrassed by technical questions about the Economy. Had English/Joyce asked say Bennett the same questions, she would have stumbled.
     English wanted the Manus Island refugees discussed so sent an expert Brownlee in his place.
     Do you see? Horses for courses a privilege denied Kelvin.
     • Grey Area 2.2.1

       21 November 2017 at 9:11 am

       But Billshit didn’t send an expert. He sent Brownlee.
   • Wayne 2.3

     21 November 2017 at 9:31 am

     Generally the media have some regard to the level of support a party has. Between 2014 and 2017 Labour had 25% of the seats in parliament. National now has 45%, and is in fact the largest party in parliament.

     So you can expect, across visually all media outlets, that National will get more coverage in the next three years than Labour had between 2014 and 2017.

     But as far as I see, National is pretty absent at the moment. Virtually all the media focus is on Jacinda. Even the Deputy PM gets virtually no coverage. It is not likely to change till next year, since for the time being Jacinda is having her political honeymoon.
     • Chris 2.3.1

       21 November 2017 at 9:53 am

       Hey Wayno! You any relation to Pete George?
     • Bearded Git 2.3.2

       21 November 2017 at 9:57 am

       44.4% Wayne
       • Colonial Viper 2.3.2.1

         21 November 2017 at 11:24 am

         After 3 terms of National Government, Labour + Greens achieved a result in 2017 a mere 2.5% higher than the 2008 election.

         That’s a weak start to a new government.
         • North 2.3.2.1.1

           21 November 2017 at 6:30 pm

           “That’s a weak start to a new government”. Care to tell us what you think the percentages you quote actually mean, or will mean, CV ? Without identifying the upshot as you see it it’s not much better than saying it’s not very pretty. So what to that.
           • Colonial Viper 2.3.2.1.1.1

             21 November 2017 at 6:43 pm

             1) “Jacindamania” has only brought Labour up to a level slightly above Labour’s losing 2008 election result.

             2) This current government in its first term governs with 50.4% of the party vote, only 1.2% more than National’s third term of 49.2% of the party vote

             3) With margins this narrow, the fledgling government has no time to waste in terms of delivering on its promises. It won’t get a second term without clear, fast results.

             There is almost no room for any erosion of its popularity.
             • North …

               22 November 2017 at 9:03 pm

               I’ve forgotten……what’s the balance……two seats 61/59 ? Read some figures somewhere which suggested that National got by with a sometimes 2-3 margin during nine years of retention of power.
               At this point talking percentages and not seats suggests troubling moral concerns. ‘Legitimacy’ and all that. I really get the feeling that you’re champing at the bit to come out with something more definitive of where you stand CV? C’mon bro’…….declare your quirky lefty ‘preferences’.
     • marty mars 2.3.3

       21 November 2017 at 10:01 am

       Same old nonsense eh Wayne – I hope no one pays you for that rubbish. The gnats lost, and are still losing – hearts and minds wayne the gnats are clueless lol.
     • Grey Area 2.3.4

       21 November 2017 at 10:23 am

       But as far as I see, National is pretty absent at the moment.

       Wayne if you truly think that you need to get out more. On the Manus Island issue alone Brownlee has been given regular opportunities to advise the government to not annoy the Australians, cut them some slack because it’s a complex issue, etc.

       Even the Deputy PM gets virtually no coverage.

       Yes he has had some particularly around his performance answering questions in the House in the absence of of Ardern and Peters.

       Generally the media have some regard to the level of support a party has.

       So how come the ACT “party” gets as much coverage as it does then?
     • Brigid 2.3.5

       21 November 2017 at 10:30 am

       “National now has 45%, and is in fact the largest party in parliament.”
       Wayne, I’ll give you some facts.
       Of the 3,569,830 estimated voting age population 92.54 were enrolled to vote.
       Of those enrolled, 19% did not cast a vote.
       Of those who voted 55.6% did not vote for national

       Therefore, of the estimated voting age population of 3,569,830, only 1,152,075 voted for National.
       Wayne, 67.7274548% of the population did not vote for National.
       So it could logically be claimed that only a little over 32% support National.
       That’s about one third, so for every three people you encounter today, or tomorrow, or anytime for the next wee while, only ONE will be a National supporter.
       The figures are all here http://www.elections.org.nz/

       Now that you know this I expect you wont want to show a lack of honesty and integrity by disseminating mis-information again.
       • Wayne 2.3.5.1

         21 November 2017 at 11:18 am

         Brigid

         Your post, while technically correct is nonsense. On the same basis Labour got about 26% of the vote. That is, just over one in FOUR actually support Labour!

         The proper way to look at the vote, is the votes cast. These are the ones that actually determine the composition of parliament and the government. Under MMP it all depends on getting 50% or more of the MP’s in the parliament. Pointing that out is hardly a “lack of honesty and integrity by disseminating mis-information”. It is simply the facts about our parliament. Having an Opposition that is the largest party in parliament will (and should) change the political dynamic.

         Grey Area,

         I am not suggesting the Opposition has had zero coverage, clearly they get some. But apart from the selection of the Speaker, they are not the dominant player in the media.

         In contrast, every day there are two or three articles/newsclips on Jacinda. The Deputy PM, maybe one tor two per week. I am not objecting or complaining. She was inevitably going to get that level of coverage.
         • Brigid 2.3.5.1.1

           21 November 2017 at 1:39 pm

           “Your post, while technically correct is nonsense. ”
           “The proper way……..”

           Behold the arrogance.

           It is only you Wayne, who is comparing National votes with Labour.
           In case you hadn’t noticed the present government comprises a coalition of three parties, Labour being one of them.
           FPP is sooo last century Wayne.

           Do you STILL believe National should be leading the government?
         • CLEANGREEN 2.3.5.1.2

           21 November 2017 at 11:54 pm

           Wayne,

           You are technically ‘incorrect’, as we live in a MPP electoral process so get off the old FPP system anmd get over it for gods ake man!!!!!
     • Carolyn_nth 2.3.6

       21 November 2017 at 10:40 am

       And yet, Mr 0.1% David Seymour?!
     • Johan 2.3.7

       21 November 2017 at 2:52 pm

       Hey Wayne, how many honeymoons are the RWNJ allowing Jacinda to have?
   • Whispering Kate 2.4

     21 November 2017 at 10:00 am

     Also how many Morning Report listeners have noticed such a huge difference to last week with the fantastic rapport between Kim Hill and John Campbell, they were a star act. Lots of serious stuff went down and also lots of banter and laughter, especially with Giles on the Finance report. Just what us morning listeners want from a morning show.

     If the management of RNZ didn’t take notice of this then they need to be replaced. The ratings would soar through the roof if we had these two stars on. I realise Kim Hill wouldn’t want to do 5 days a week with early starts but surely they could accommodate such a quality act and allow her 2/3 days.

     This morning it was just so dull and dreary that even Philippa Tolley couldn’t rescue it. Espiner needs replacing and quickly. Just my criticisms I know but it would be interesting to know what other TS browsers have to say on this matter.
     • veutoviper 2.4.1

       21 November 2017 at 10:16 am

       Yes, last week on Morning Report was excellent and this week is just … dull. Sorry, Guyon just does not have it. Checkpoint last week was also just … dull.

       However, John Campbell made it very clear last week that the early mornings were not him in any way, shape or form so I don’t expert to see him there too often.

       On Friday morning also I woke up c 6.30am to catch a little bit of snark between JC and KH (I was only half awake and did not catch the issue*) and that seemed to temper their rapport for the remainder of the programme.

       So I don’t expect to see a repeat pairing for a while, sadly.

       * Maybe it was this tweet. LOL

       John Campbell‏Verified account
       @JohnJCampbell
       Nov 14
       More
       John Campbell Retweeted RNZ
       Having had to get up at 3 bloody 45 to participate in this one week switcheroo (an hour so indecent it should be banned), I can now confirm the entire Morning Report team are vampires.
       
       https://twitter.com/JohnJCampbell/status/930703166630518784
     • Brigid 2.4.2

       21 November 2017 at 10:33 am

       I agree entirely. Kim Hill is a national treasure.
     • Chris 2.4.3

       21 November 2017 at 10:57 am

       “The ratings would soar through the roof if we had these two stars on.”

       Yes, but RNZ could at least start with your suggestion of axing Espiner. The guy’s got no ability to formulate questions in a way that suits the context. Accordingly he just comes across as a fuckwit.
       • garibaldi 2.4.3.1

         21 November 2017 at 12:28 pm

         Chris he always has been a fuckwit. The main problem at natrad is the fuckwits running it. They should have resigned the day after the election, as should so many other political appointees. But oh no, they all want to carry on shafting us until they get an unearned golden handshake. Fuck them and fuck our silly system for letting them do it.
   • Tuppence Shrewsbury 2.5

     21 November 2017 at 3:57 pm

     And yet the prime ministers boyfriend is on the panel this afternoon? Is that enough “balance” for you?
     • North 2.5.1

       21 November 2017 at 6:34 pm

       Get the pain from Tuppence.
   • rod 2.6

     21 November 2017 at 5:21 pm

     Grey Area. please let us all know when you get a reply. Be ready for more spin and bullshit. RNZ obviously think that National are still the Government.
3. ScottGN 3

   21 November 2017 at 8:33 am

   Anyone else hear Gerry Brownlee waffling on about Manus Island on Morning Report this morning?
   He sounded exactly like an ex-minister who no longer gets his talking points from ministry officials before he fronts the media.
   It was particularly amusing when he tried to suggest Ardern should go easy on Australia because they take 5 times as many refugees per capita as we do. Well Gerry, the reason for that is, your government steadfastly refused to increase our quota, even in the face of the dreadful humanitarian crises we’ve seen in the last few years.
4. Kay 4

   21 November 2017 at 8:35 am

   Today’s Stuff red -meat- to -the- wolves anti-welfare tirade is courtesy of Mike Yardley.
   (I haven’t linked it it because it doesn’t deserve more clicks but will if mods want me to).

   The usual routine- RW anti-benefits/anti-Greens rant, followed by opens comment section of course. To date 250+ comments. I can’t bare to look at them, but easy to guess- dominated by the ‘I couldn’t agree with you more Mike’ brigade, usual rednecks, paid Natz trolls, and general pricks, all up-voting each other of course. And the few that dare to dissent getting heavily down-voted by the above.

   So business as usual at Stuff really. But it does beg the question- these “opinion” pieces are always very careful not to cross the line of course but come bloody close at times. They are, however, deliberately written with the sole aim to provoke, not to provide another point of view, which is evident by the fact the comments sections are always left open, the editors knowing full well what will happen.

   I believe this practice is inciting hate speech. Is that an extreme statement? Maybe not “hate” under any current legal definition, but certainly encouraging the public to gang up on and at a bare minimum severely bully a group of society. How can this be stopped? (Closing off comments would be a start- the one decent thing the Herald did).
   • Rosemary McDonald 4.1

     21 November 2017 at 9:39 am

     Fresh meat….

     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY4V3UUY95A
   • One Anonymous Bloke 4.2

     21 November 2017 at 10:50 am

     I just had a quick look and the balance between sanity and National Party hate speech isn’t as bad as you think.

     Each and every talking point is rebutted, and it’s clear that people are familiar with them, and the facts.

     I agree: I think they should be held accountable when the consequences of hate speech spill over into legally sanctioned human rights abuses, such as this gross attack on privacy and freedom of expression.
   • patricia bremner 4.3

     21 November 2017 at 11:11 am

     Actually Kay, 4, a huge number of comments were supportive of solo Mums getting that money, and saying Dads dodged. Also a number said Mike was stirring.
   • tracey 4.4

     21 November 2017 at 4:34 pm

     Rather makes you wonder what he thinks a Godfather does…
5. Grey Area 5

   21 November 2017 at 9:09 am

   +1 Kay. I thought it was an appalling piece full of exaggeration, assumptions and bile. Just like most of the comments.
   • OnceWasTim 5.1

     21 November 2017 at 9:28 am

     +1. I’d never heard of the prick so I decided to google, check out his self-promoting website and other places.
     What a privileged ‘bloke’ – no doubt work-life balanced, well-connected but at a respectable distance from those dirty filthy solomums rorting the cistern.

     Maybe that’s what has rubbed off on Jack the boy Tame
     • Chris 5.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 9:49 am

       Notice his “I don’t have any children that I know of” line. What a lad.
       • marty mars 5.1.1.1

         21 November 2017 at 10:03 am

         Someone should check the sheep paddock…
         • Brigid 5.1.1.1.1

           21 November 2017 at 10:35 am

           Hilarious!!
         • mary_a 5.1.1.1.2

           21 November 2017 at 1:44 pm

           @ marty mars (5.1.1.1) … oh dear, oh dear, oh dear. Can’t stop laughing. Brilliant response 🙂
         • North 5.1.1.1.3

           21 November 2017 at 6:37 pm

           Marty Marty Marty……
         • rhinocrates 5.1.1.1.4

           21 November 2017 at 6:43 pm

           I did not spray coffee all over my keyboard through my nose, but only because I wasn’t drinking coffee.
         • CLEANGREEN 5.1.1.1.5

           21 November 2017 at 11:58 pm

           Ha ha ha, thanks marty mars.

           Has the idiot gone to mars? Mabe came from mars?
6. Anne 6

   21 November 2017 at 9:30 am

   Two Herald opinion pieces by Claire Trevett and Rachel Smalley about Jacinda Ardern’s unfortunate interview with Jack Tane yesterday morning:

   Claire Trevett

   Quite reasonable in my view. I saw the offending clip before the fallout started and wasn’t too impressed with the way Jacinda handled it. In my view she should have launched into a short, simple explanation (no smiles etc.) then shut the story down. If Tane refused to accept the explanation then she should have ended the interview. Sometimes its the only way to handle youthful upstarts like Tane who think they “know it all”. Instead she pussy footed around and made things worse. I’m sure it was a lesson well learned by Jacinda.

   As for Rachel Smalley. Not worth a link. A biased piece of claptrap from a sulking Nat. supporter.
   • Bill 6.1

     21 November 2017 at 9:48 am

     Just watched the edited vid that’s through your link.

     I didn’t see too much wrong with Adern’s responses. Reporter seeks to give substance to gossip. PM laughs.

     I’ll assume she’s learned the lesson that you don’t tell “your mates” fuck all about the incidental bullshit that goes on in such meetings.
     • Anne 6.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 9:59 am

       ….she’s learned the lesson that you don’t tell “your mates” fuck all about the incidental bullshit that goes on in such meetings.

       Essentially what I was getting at… and I think it was the message Trevett arrived at too. Don’t know how long it will last, but have found Trevett’s columns reasonable since the change of government.
     • Grey Area 6.1.2

       21 November 2017 at 10:05 am

       I’ll assume she’s learned the lesson that you don’t tell “your mates” fuck all about the incidental bullshit that goes on in such meetings.

       That was my reaction as well Bill. I know it’s a steep learning curve with lots to learn but I hope she doesn’t have to learn too much by making mistakes. She doesn’t want to be handing out sticks for our biased media to beat her with.
   • Chris 6.2

     21 November 2017 at 9:50 am

     She’s Ardern, not Jacinda.
     • Anne 6.2.1

       21 November 2017 at 10:06 am

       Uggh? I know “Jacinda” and I will call her by her christian name if I think it is appropriate.

       NB: I used her full name in the first sentence. That is enough.
       • veutoviper 6.2.1.1

         21 November 2017 at 10:19 am

         + 1, Anne.
       • Chris 6.2.1.2

         21 November 2017 at 10:26 am

         The obsession with use of her first name comes from treating her as a child. She’s Ardern.
         • veutoviper 6.2.1.2.1

           21 November 2017 at 10:31 am

           “Ardrern” ??????? Really?????????
           • Chris 6.2.1.2.1.1

             21 November 2017 at 10:33 am

             Thanks, you gave me time to fix it.
         • Anne 6.2.1.2.2

           21 November 2017 at 10:46 am

           What an offensive and arrogant assumption to make. Yet another upstart who makes claims with no backing evidence? Grow up and act your age.
           • Chris 6.2.1.2.2.1

             21 November 2017 at 10:58 am

             Hey hey!
         • One Anonymous Bloke 6.2.1.2.3

           21 November 2017 at 10:57 am

           If you’re going to insist on formal speech and manners, Chris, The Right Honourable Jacinda Ardern, Prime Minister of New Zealand, will talk to you when she’s good and ready.

           On Earth, however, you can relax.
           • Chris 6.2.1.2.3.1

             21 November 2017 at 11:00 am

             Thank you, Master Po.
             • One Anonymous Bloke …

               21 November 2017 at 11:04 am

               I get where you’re coming from, maybe, but don’t forget Dr. Sir John Key more or less encouraged journalists to call him “mate”.
           • veutoviper 6.2.1.2.3.2

             21 November 2017 at 11:18 am

             Chris also needs to be consistent – example 2.3.1 above
             Hey Wayno! You any relation to Pete George?

             https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-21-11-2017/#comment-1416649

             I don’t usually agree with the POVs of either Wayne * or Peter George, but I found that comment both childish and mildly offensive.

             * AKA The honourable Dr Wayne Mapp
             • greywarshark …

               21 November 2017 at 11:28 am

               I notice Chris getting attention from silly little comments. Various people will use various ways to reduce the vitality and standing of TS while Labour is in government, showing up lefties as easily diverted. Taking them seriously will only reduce TS as a place of intelligent, informed discussion.
               • Chris …

                 21 November 2017 at 11:47 am

                 Too bloody right. I should’ve said “Mapp, your analysis of the relationship between the number of MPs a party has and the level of media coverage they should expect is as relevant as something that’d come from Pete George”. Seriously though, if anyone will “use various ways to reduce the vitality and standing of TS while Labour is in government, showing up lefties as easily diverted” it’s in fact Wayne. The guy’s a disgrace.
               • CLEANGREEN …

                 22 November 2017 at 12:02 am

                 100% Greywarshark.

                 TS is anoother public media platform that offers alternative views to n the scribbed corporate media we live inside of today, so to TS & TDB long live free speech.
   • Bearded Git 6.3

     21 November 2017 at 10:00 am

     Ardern handled it well…can’t believe it warranted any further media coverage.
     • Grey Area 6.3.1

       21 November 2017 at 10:08 am

       “…can’t believe it warranted any further media coverage.”

       It didn’t but biased media + any opportunity =?
   • CLEANGREEN 6.4

     22 November 2017 at 11:03 am

     100% Anne you summed this perfectly.

     “As for Rachel Smalley. Not worth a link. A biased piece of claptrap from a sulking Nat. supporter.”
7. Morrissey 7

   21 November 2017 at 9:41 am

   Deadbeat Dads
   No. 4: This scumbag still boasts that his parents were two of Auckland’s most notorious criminals (significantly, they were grog-runners)

   A 16-year-old who died of alcohol poisoning earlier this year was reportedly egged on to drink by the son of Auckland Mayor John Banks.

   Witnesses who saw Kings College student James Webster on the night he died say he was urged to keep drinking by fellow student Alex Banks…

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10670194

   He’s a deadbeat husband as well….
   http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/new-zealand/2017/08/john-banks-told-mum-of-alleged-love-child-to-get-an-abortion-court-hears.html

   Deadbeat Dad No. 1: Sir John Key
   Deadbeat Dad No. 2: Bill English
   Deadbeat Dad No. 3: Sir Douglas Graham
   • DH 7.1

     21 November 2017 at 10:30 am

     You need a new attack angle, this one is out of line.
     • Morrissey 7.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 10:35 am

       In what way is it out of line?
       • marty mars 7.1.1.1

         21 November 2017 at 7:25 pm

         It’s stupid and cruel and meaningless imo. And alsò, why bother?…
8. Morrissey 8

   21 November 2017 at 9:54 am

   GROPERS
   No. 6: Arnold Schwarzenegger

   “Did he rape me? No,” said one woman, who claimed that the actor had touched her breast in 1980. “Did he humiliate me? You bet he did.”

   https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/oct/03/usa.filmnews

   “GROPERS” is researched and presented by GroperWatch, a division of Daisycutter Sports Inc.

   No.1 George Herbert Walker Bush

   No. 2 Bill O’Reilly

   No. 3 Al Franken
   No. 4 Robin Brooke
   No. 5 Lester Beck
   • Puckish Rogue 8.1

     21 November 2017 at 10:33 am

     Hes back!

     http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11/20/bill-clinton-facing-four-sexual-assault-lawsuits-fresh-allegations/
     • alwyn 8.1.1

       21 November 2017 at 11:53 am

       You really have to admire the chap, don’t you?
       Seventy one years old, a survivor of major heart surgery and still has the get up and go of a teen-ager.
       He must follow the Hugh Hefner diet. Large doses of Viagra.
       Actually calling Bill a randy old goat is probably more appropriate.
       • Colonial Viper 8.1.1.1

         21 November 2017 at 12:18 pm

         Please note, Bill Clinton is from the correct side of the political aisle so we must go easier on him and his long time enabler wife, former presidential candidate Hillary Clinton
         • alwyn 8.1.1.1.1

           21 November 2017 at 1:46 pm

           From my random observations there is absolutely no difference in the behaviour of the different sides of politics.
           For every John Kennedy there is a Nelson Rockefeller.
           For every Don Brash there is a David Cunliffe.

           It is probably something that Morrissey should consider. He considers Bill English to be a deadbeat Dad for Christ’s sake!
           From what I can see Bill has been a truly admirable father and his family have all turned out to be fine adults.
           If only every parent was so caring and successful in the most important activity of their life.
           • Colonial Viper 8.1.1.1.1.1

             21 November 2017 at 3:40 pm

             Yes, when English had children appear in his election campaign ads they were usually his own, and he was very proud of them justifiably so.
           • tracey 8.1.1.1.1.2

             21 November 2017 at 4:29 pm

             Shame his parenting includes teaching his children that lying is ok to get what you want…
             • Colonial Viper …

               21 November 2017 at 6:45 pm

               English has been the Prime Minister. He knows you have to lie sometimes.
           • CLEANGREEN 8.1.1.1.1.3

             22 November 2017 at 12:10 am

             “For every John Kennedy there is a Nelson Rockefeller.
             For every Don Brash there is a David Cunliffe.”

             For every john key there is a George Soros or 100 other carpetbaggers?
         • North 8.1.1.1.2

           21 November 2017 at 6:42 pm

           Still working your Clinton obssessions CV ? Your “long time enabler wife” comment is straight out of Repugs’ talking points and is utterly offensive. Mind your own fucking business about their personal dynamic. There’s something ‘crypto’ about you CV.
           • rhinocrates 8.1.1.1.2.1

             21 November 2017 at 6:45 pm

             Hillary ate his cat. He’s never forgiven her for it.
             • Colonial Viper …

               21 November 2017 at 6:46 pm

               Hillary has enabled decades of Bill’s bad behaviour. Turn a blind eye if you wish, but more is coming out shortly.
               • rhinocrates …

                 21 November 2017 at 6:57 pm

                 What, she’s eaten other people’s cats too? There are plenty of villains active and in power in this world today. Your obsession with someone who’s never going to hold significant office again is peculiar.
               • North …

                 22 November 2017 at 9:12 pm

                 Same old CV what?…….still busybodying Ena Sharples like over someone else’s marriage. Phew! And then going all Trump like……”more is coming out shortly……” Better be better than a relaunch of Anthony Weiner’s weenie CV!
       • tracey 8.1.1.2

         21 November 2017 at 4:28 pm

         Nope dont admire sexual assault, not even tongue in cheek as you have just done.
         • alwyn 8.1.1.2.1

           22 November 2017 at 10:54 am

           Admired sexual assault?
           Do you think saying what I did “Actually calling Bill a randy old goat is probably more appropriate” is expressing “admiration”?
9. Morrissey 9

   21 November 2017 at 10:36 am

   Farmers ruin another river
   17 November 2017

   The Kaiapoi River is turning salty, and irrigation is to blame: A freshwater Canterbury river is on the brink of turning into a saltwater estuary, in part due to water abstraction, new data shows.

   It has blindsided some in the community and would permanently alter the river’s character if the trend continued.

   “The prospect of that river turning to a smelly, scum-filled seawater estuary is just totally unacceptable,” Waimakariri District councillor Sandra Stewart said.

   The problem is caused by farmers taking too much water from the Waimakariri River, meaning that its flow is too weak to prevent salty tidal flows from entering the Kaiapoi. The solution is obvious: reduce irrigation flows. But that means reducing farmers’ profits, which was unacceptable under National. Hopefully with a different government (and a soon-to-be elected ECan) they’ll be able to stop the farmers poisoning this river before its too late.

   http://norightturn.blogspot.co.nz/2017/11/farmers-ruin-another-river.html

   https://resources.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/l/f/i/z/s/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.620×349.1lfi0o.png/1504501119377.jpg
10. patricia bremner 10

    21 November 2017 at 11:26 am

    I hope Clare Curran is making a list of government appointments in broadcasting, to change the tenor of the interviews (kind calling them that!!) questions and topics.

    The childish point scoring, voices of the right, judgmental name calling going on currently does nothing about informing.

    Thank heaven for the internet, there is always someone reasonable out there talking to climate change world politics, and scientists’ warnings among other important things.
    • Colonial Viper 10.1

      21 November 2017 at 12:20 pm

      Sorry, but politicians should never be making hire and fire decisions of journalists that they like or do not like.

      The CEO’s ability to hire the best person for the job has to remain independent.
      • veutoviper 10.1.1

        21 November 2017 at 12:25 pm

        +1 CV.
        • CLEANGREEN 10.1.1.1

          22 November 2017 at 11:12 am

          CV,

          No I dont buy that as CEO;s are also ‘political appointments CV.

          Take a look at the RNZ CEO???

          Totally absent when I asked the RNZ CEO why we did not have a ‘local HB/Gisborne repoprter two months ago and never got any reply from the CEO even though we asked for his response under OIA rules!!!!!

          Best let the new Minister decide as then we wont get Steven Joyce and Brownklee hugging RNZ news every week now as is going on.

          This morning it was Steven joyce featuring as if national was still in charge!!!!!!

          When do we get the new government to take charge here??????
      • Karen 10.1.2

        21 November 2017 at 12:35 pm

        But the government can make sure they hire the right CEO for the job
        • Colonial Viper 10.1.2.1

          21 November 2017 at 12:38 pm

          Indeed, technically the Minister chooses the Board members who then pick the right CEO/senior managers
          • garibaldi 10.1.2.1.1

            21 November 2017 at 12:45 pm

            Exactly , and over the last nine years they have all been Right.
          • CLEANGREEN 10.1.2.1.2

            22 November 2017 at 11:18 am

            CV You love dictatorships or Beaurocrats do you?

            First you want the CEO to act alone and now you embrace “Boards'”????

            Far to many people as not elected members here so we think boards should be disbanded/sacked; – and a single elected chair preside over the media not a bunch of ‘self interseted idiots’ whom are bought by corporates and well heeled right wing factions.
      • tracey 10.1.3

        21 November 2017 at 4:26 pm

        CEOs should never hire journalists. Editors should
      • patricia bremner 10.1.4

        21 November 2017 at 4:49 pm

        Colonial Viper, 10.1 I didn’t know journalists were government appointments. sarc.
        • Colonial Viper 10.1.4.1

          21 November 2017 at 6:47 pm

          hmmm fair enough.
        • CLEANGREEN 10.1.4.2

          22 November 2017 at 12:13 am

          I believe some Journalists were National government appointments.
          Claire Curran & Jacinda both need to clean house there.
      • North 10.1.5

        22 November 2017 at 9:14 pm

        Right……like Campbell and weak man Key tool Mark Weldon. Quite right! Quite right!
11. Ad 11

    21 November 2017 at 1:40 pm

    Did anyone notice the United States is going to be prosecuted by the International Criminal Court for its conduct in Afghanistan for crimes against humanity?

    http://www.dw.com/en/us-afghanistan-forces-likely-to-face-war-crimes-investigation-alongside-taliban/a-41459624

    Puts U.S. military on the same level as the Afghanistan Security Force and the Taliban.

    I’m keen to see how President Trump – and Premier Xi and other world leaders – react to this investigation.
    • One Anonymous Bloke 11.1

      21 November 2017 at 4:30 pm

      Trump will insult the investigators. Xi will say “they do it too!” and then lock up anyone who mentions it.
12. alwyn 12

    21 November 2017 at 2:19 pm

    This, from the Economist’s daily Espresso newsletter, sent out by e-mail to subscribers..

    “Uber will buy up to 24,000 self-driving cars from Volvo, potentially the biggest ever autonomous-vehicle order. The deal adds to the ride-hailing firm’s 200-strong fleet of driverless sport-utility vehicles, which it began testing in America last year. The XC90 SUV, with a starting price of around $50,000, will have both the carmaker’s and Uber’s self-driving technology”.

    I hope that the current Governments Transport Minister sees stories like this. Then they can decide whether they should abandon current plans to waste billions on a technically obsolete technology like the “light rail” system proposed for taking people to Auckland Airport.

    Autonomous vehicles are the way of the future. Who wants to travel in a tram to the airport when an autonomous vehicle will be able to pick you up from your home and take you in comfort to wherever you want to go?
    This may be only a small start but it is certainly a great deal closer to the wide spread use of self-driving cars than most people seem to anticipate.

    Ms Genter, who is concerned about traffic accident deaths may also like to keep in mind that these vehicles, as well as being cheaper to operate than public transport or self drive vehicles are also expected to be much, much safer.
    Don’t let us waste money on old style travel technology. Let us plan for a 21st century solution. This is it.
    • Draco T Bastard 12.1

      21 November 2017 at 2:33 pm

      I hope that the current Governments Transport Minister sees stories like this. Then they can decide whether they should abandon current plans to waste billions on a technically obsolete technology like the “light rail” system proposed for taking people to Auckland Airport.

      /facepalm

      No amount of self-driving is going to make cars economical for moving large numbers of people in the same direction at the same time.

      Face it alwyn, you’re going to have to use public transport to get around.

      Autonomous vehicles are the way of the future.

      Such vehicles are one of the ways of the future but certainly not the way of the future.

      Who wants to travel in a tram to the airport when an autonomous vehicle will be able to pick you up from your home and take you in comfort to wherever you want to go?

      It’s not a question of who wants, but what the country can afford and it can’t afford personal cars. No country can. Everyone having their own car or two was a 20th century delusion.

      as well as being cheaper to operate than public transport

      [citation needed]

      Or, put it another way: What a load of fucken bollocks. They must be more expensive because they use more resources to achieve the same end.

      Why are you RWNJs so in denial of reality?

      Don’t let us waste money on old style travel technology. Let us plan for a 21st century solution. This is it.

      We are planning for the 21st century. You, and other RWNJs just like you, are trying to hold us back in the 15th.
      • alwyn 12.1.1

        21 November 2017 at 3:16 pm

        I’ll just comment on a couple of things you say.
        “as well as being cheaper to operate than public transport”
        Have a look at this article. It was in the Fairfax papers on 31 August this year. The suggestion is that an AV from LaGuardia Airport to Manhattan could be as little as $US6.50. That is cheaper than the bus.
        https://www.pressreader.com/new-zealand/the-press/20170831/281805694066377

        “Everyone having their own car or two was a 20th century delusion.”
        You don’t need to have your own car. You can call one when you want it. If you aren’t using a vehicle it won’t have to sit idle. Someone else will be travelling in it, or it will park out of the way and recharge itself

        “No amount of self-driving is going to make cars economical for moving large numbers of people in the same direction at the same time”
        You will be travelling to where you want to go when you want to do it. The vehicles won’t all be going to the same place. The only reason you have to do that now is because public transport forces it on you.
        You also won’t have to have your own vehicle to take you to the station, and you won’t need parking at the station while you continue on the tram.

        “They must be more expensive because they use more resources to achieve the same end.”
        Are you going to tell me that a bus with 5 passengers costs less to run than a car with 2? These vehicles will only be on the road when they are actually needed. They will also be available without the cost of a driver, which is the single greatest part of public transport fares.
        • tracey 12.1.1.1

          21 November 2017 at 4:24 pm

          Yes but they showed it as a 4 seater… Even with amazing technology that will have to be an amazing loss leader to cost that upin launch.
        • Draco T Bastard 12.1.1.2

          21 November 2017 at 4:58 pm

          The suggestion is that an AV from LaGuardia Airport to Manhattan could be as little as $US6.50. That is cheaper than the bus.

          This should tell you something about our present socio-economic system. Something that’s really important.

          See, the whole point of economics is to reduce resource use. Using cars, even AVs, does the exact opposite of that.

          The reality is that it is not cheaper than the bus.

          BTW, the bus can also be an AV.

          You don’t need to have your own car. You can call one when you want it. If you aren’t using a vehicle it won’t have to sit idle. Someone else will be travelling in it, or it will park out of the way and recharge itself

          /facepalm

          What happens when everyone wants to go to work at the same time in their own personal space?

          AVs may make taxis viable during the middle of the day and late at night. Peak time will be just as bad as it is now.

          You will be travelling to where you want to go when you want to do it. The vehicles won’t all be going to the same place.

          Wow, amazing. Alwyn just solved traffic congestion at peak times.

          /sarc

          The only reason you have to do that now is because public transport forces it on you.

          Could have sworn that it was businesses that set the start and end times.

          You also won’t have to have your own vehicle to take you to the station, and you won’t need parking at the station while you continue on the tram.

          I thought you said that trams were out of date and going the way of the Dodo. So, which is it? Going the way of the Dodo or an integral part of transit system?

          Are you going to tell me that a bus with 5 passengers costs less to run than a car with 2?

          Probably. But that’s not actually the point.

          It’s when we have tens of thousands all going down the same road at the same time that buses and trains come into their own. Thing is, once there are buses and trains even AVs aren’t economical. Why waste resources on a small, inefficient vehicle, when there’s already the big efficient ones going round their set ways that can get anyone from anywhere to anywhere efficiently?

          They will also be available without the cost of a driver, which is the single greatest part of public transport fares.

          Yep, quite aware of that. The Autonomous buses and trains also won’t have drivers.
          • alwyn 12.1.1.2.1

            21 November 2017 at 7:02 pm

            “You also won’t have to have your own vehicle to take you to the station, and you won’t need parking at the station while you continue on the tram.”

            “I thought you said that trams were out of date and going the way of the Dodo. So, which is it? Going the way of the Dodo or an integral part of transit system?”

            I thought this would have been clear enough but obviously from you comment it wasn’t.
            My remark was saying that, because there won’t be any trams that you have to use, you don’t need to get to the station and you won’t have to leave your vehicle there while you switch to another form of transport, a tram.
            You will have a vehicle pick you up at your home that will take you directly to where you want to be. Is that clearer?
            • Draco T Bastard 12.1.1.2.1.1

              21 November 2017 at 11:57 pm

              Yes, much clearer – and still delusional.

              You really haven’t done the figures. Haven’t considered how many vehicles will be on the road at peak times if everyone used a car with one to four people in it instead of public transport.

              HINT: The congestion will be a lot worse.
    • Ad 12.2

      21 November 2017 at 2:44 pm

      Jesus Alwyn.

      Come up to Auckland and figure it out.

      Autonomous vehicles will barely fingernail-scratch the congestion that people face here.

      Whereas light rail can pack into one carriage about 600 metres full of autonomous-car-filled motorway.

      Failing that, go up to Shanghai.
      • alwyn 12.2.1

        21 November 2017 at 3:26 pm

        “light rail can pack into one carriage about 600 metres full of autonomous-car-filled motorway. ”
        I’ll take you word for that. So what. How close together do light rail vehicles travel? More that 600 metres I would suggest and there won’t be more than one tram every 10 minutes I should think. And bear in mind that AVs can travel much closer together than cars with drivers. The 2 second rule doesn’t apply to machines that can communicate their intentions to their neighbours.
        • Ad 12.2.1.1

          21 November 2017 at 4:41 pm

          Here’s some nice hopeful analysis for you on autonomous vehicles also operating as ride-share could eventually start to compete by cost against the train:

          https://www.bcg.com/publications/2016/transportation-travel-tourism-automotive-will-autonomous-vehicles-derail-trains.aspx

          I’m still waiting for my jetpack.
          • rhinocrates 12.2.1.1.1

            21 November 2017 at 6:56 pm

            An invigorating rant from Robert Llewellyn (whom you might remember as Kryten):

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2Y8crkXcaU

            Start about 6:11 for when he has a good vent. Hi-tech, super fast, smart and luxurious electric cars are great, but… how about car-sharing instead of this commodity fetishism? Why spend a fortune on a lump of metal that spends 90% of its time just sitting and rusting. Moreover, electric cars, autonomous or not, aren’t particularly green. People ignore the enormous expenditure of energy that goes into manufacturing them and the environmental destruction that results.

            The whole series he does, Fully Charged, is an inspiring thing. He’s quite the enthusiast for new electric technologies.

            This is quite an interesting episode where he looks at a company trying to change the standard industry model:

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utmkddBFUg0

            Riversimple is the company’s name and they’re looking at cars as a shared mobility service rather than penis extensions.
          • alwyn 12.2.1.1.2

            21 November 2017 at 7:19 pm

            I have glanced at this but I don’t have the time right now to give it the study it deserves.
            I would note though that it still talks about people having privately owned, even if shared AVs. I see no need for that at all. They can all be in a pool and one that suits you can be despatched from the pool.
            I also believe that they will all be electric vehicles. As required they can charge themselves. Maintenance will be much lower than in current fossil fuelled vehicles. You only have a few parts and no gearbox in an electric car.
            I will have a full read later when I have the time.
            Thank you for the reference.
            • CLEANGREEN 12.2.1.1.2.1

              22 November 2017 at 12:39 am

              Alwyn,

              Apart from your apparent love of roads vehicles, what will you do about the tyre dust that is toxic to humans and animals?

              All tyres contain serious health risks whereas rail uses steel wheels.

              http://publications.jrc.ec.europa.eu/repository/bitstream/JRC89231/jrc89231-online%20final%20version%202.pdf

              So if you wish to place ‘road vehicles’ as “environmentally friendly” to the rail please show how you will get rid of using tyres made from petrochemicals pleasse as I want to know if there is such a solution here please?
              • alwyn …

                22 November 2017 at 10:45 am

                I presume you will get rid of all the buses then?
                After all they run on tires.
                Actually some of the Paris Metro lines (only a few) have trains that have tires. They are quieter and much more comfortable than the ones that use steel rails.
                • CLEANGREEN …

                  22 November 2017 at 11:33 am

                  Alwyn,

                  Please learn what we are saying!!

                  Read this report, you are not listening here.

                  http://publications.jrc.ec.europa.eu/repository/bitstream/JRC89231/jrc89231-online%20final%20version%202.pdf

                  Fact; every tyre is toxic to our human existance now as the report clearly says we are expecting emissions from tyre particles to increase and it cleary states tyre particles are damaging our health.

                  I asked do you have any answer and if you dont then say it as we are trying to find an answer.

                  Rail is good but only if steel wheels are used.

                  This is so far the only answer.

                  Petroleum produced PVC tyres on rail is not the answer to public our health issue here either.
        • Draco T Bastard 12.2.1.2

          21 November 2017 at 5:03 pm

          And personal AVs still won’t get anywhere near the density that public transport will get.

          They simply cannot due to physical limitations.
        • JC 12.2.1.3

          21 November 2017 at 10:06 pm

          Ever been to Singapore Alwyn?….. Brisbane/Melbourne/ Paris/London/US? Seattle/Portland/San Fran…. or you could try Bluff. Or https://www.teararoa.org.nz/contacts/Take a Trip! You’ll be enlightened….
          • dv 12.2.1.3.1

            22 November 2017 at 7:35 am

            Or Tokyo.
            Recently there was an apology for a train leaving 20 seconds early!!!

            (the next train was in 4 mins!!!)
            Cars are still a problem, with lots traffic.
            Often people don’t own a car and rent when need for a longer trip.
            • alwyn 12.2.1.3.1.1

              22 November 2017 at 10:35 am

              Please tell me what the relevance of Tokyo is to New Zealand?
              The population of the Tokyo Metropolitan area is, I believe, about 8 times that of New Zealand.
              Of course people don’t own cars, if they have any sense. With AVs neither will we. We will call one whenever we want to go out. They will, having no drivers, be much cheaper than taxis are today and we won’t have to worry about parking them or maintaining them. Why do you think than anyone will want, or need, to actually own their own private car?
              • Dv …

                22 November 2017 at 1:26 pm

                Oh well nothing to learn
                Let’s move on
                • alwyn …

                  22 November 2017 at 2:18 pm

                  Of course we can learn something from Japanese trains.
                  Here is a job for brawny young men.
                  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E7kor5nHtZQ
                  Somehow I don’t really look forward to living in such a society.
                  I really do think the smaller autonomous vehicles where I can sit in comfort are preferable.
                  • alwyn …

                    22 November 2017 at 2:46 pm

                    Actually, I really should have explained why I put in this clip. It wasn’t just meant to show what people in such a large crowded city have to put up with.
                    There are so many people in Tokyo that it simply doesn’t compare with anything we have in New Zealand. Of course trains, crowded trains, can be on a four minute schedule. There simply aren’t the number of passengers on any given route in a New Zealand city to be able to justify such a timetable.
                    I spend a lot of time in Paris. The Metro there doesn’t really have any sort of published timetable. You don’t go to a station to catch a particular train. You just get the next one along which is normally within about 4 minutes of you getting there. It is rare for there to be a gap of more than 8 minutes between trains on any given line.
                    They can do that because there are so many people living in what is quite a small area.
                    We simply aren’t that crowded which is why I don’t think comparisons with very large cities like Paris or Tokyo make any sense.
          • alwyn 12.2.1.3.2

            22 November 2017 at 10:17 am

            Of your list I have been to Singapore, Melbourne, Paris, London and San Francisco.
            I hope you realise that they are mostly much larger than any city in New Zealand and that a number are larger than New Zealand?
            Greater Paris is about 11 million. Greater London about 9 million. Singapore about 6 million. Melbourne is around 4.5 million.
            All of these, except Singapore have very old light rail networks and none of them are expanding them to any extent.
            I am most familiar with Paris. Thirteen of the 14 Paris Metro lines opened more than a century ago. The last, 14, opened in 1998.
            They have never been extended outside the Peripherique
            They, like those in large cities were opened when they were the best choice, not today.
    • Graeme 12.3

      21 November 2017 at 2:57 pm

      Autonomous vehicles are the 21st centuries monorails. They are expected to do all sorts of things. Especially extract money form investors. Lets just wait and see how these things work in the real world. Like around pedestrians, weather and other drivers and AVs.

      And seriously, you take investment advice based on the behaviour of a company that’s bled how many billions of investor funds, and their only strategy is to “invest” how many billions more in unproven technology to take human interaction out of their business.
      • Stephen Doyle 12.3.1

        21 November 2017 at 3:25 pm

        I’ve a monorail to sell you.
        
      • alwyn 12.3.2

        21 November 2017 at 3:31 pm

        Yeah. Reading it was Uber did put me off a bit.
        On the other hand almost every car manufacturer and some pretty good technical organisations are getting into it. Alphabet is a pretty well run organisation don’t you think?
        I don’t say they are working now. They will be by the time the tram line to the Airport is working though, and the billions wasted on light rail will be gone for good.
        • Graeme 12.3.2.1

          21 November 2017 at 4:52 pm

          My reading of where the tech is heading is more as augmented rather than totally autonomous.

          The autonomous angle is just good for pulling in investment from cost side managerial types. Fully autonomous is only practical if human control and interaction is removed totally from the transport corridor.

          Now, can you see how this is going to fit into early 21st century human society?
          • alwyn 12.3.2.1.1

            21 November 2017 at 7:20 pm

            “more as augmented rather than totally autonomous”
            Not by 2025 it won’t be.
            Within 20 years I don’t think people will be allowed to drive on public roads. They aren’t safe.
            • Graeme 12.3.2.1.1.1

              21 November 2017 at 8:48 pm

              Very nanny state socialist of you alwyn.

              I’ll be watching to see how that’s accepted by the personal responsibility and freedom loving right wingers in society. Should be rather entertaining.
              • alwyn …

                22 November 2017 at 10:41 am

                Rubbish. Most people have accepted the desirability of wearing helmets when riding bicycles and putting sun hats and shirts on kids in the sun.
                The helmetless cyclists I have seen in Wellington generally seemed to have straggly beards and look anything but right wingers.
                I think that safety in vehicles will be readily accepted.
                • Graeme …

                  22 November 2017 at 1:49 pm

                  Wouldn’t it be even safer to reduce the number of vehicles, and go towards busses, trams and trains.
    • Macro 12.4

      21 November 2017 at 10:51 pm

      It’s not often I have to agree with Alwyn but here is a fascinating video I urge every one to take a look at – its long (1 hour) but the guy really does know his stuff and backs it up with a massive amount of examples.:
      Tony Seba 0n Clean Disruption – Energy and Transportation.
      Cars will become a thing of the past and very quickly he predicts. Why? because it will become economically foolish to own one.
      
      • alwyn 12.4.1

        22 November 2017 at 3:33 pm

        I have finally had the time to watch this.
        My friends tell me I am an optimist about when the shared, electric, self driving car will take over.
        If Seba is right, and I can’t really see any reason to doubt it, I may in fact be a pessimist. It is going to be even sooner than I think.
        Thank you for the link. It is quite fascinating, and extremely thought provoking.
        Anyone who doesn’t accept what I have been saying should watch this. Maybe he can persuade you.
        • Macro 12.4.1.1

          22 November 2017 at 4:54 pm

          I think the 2 photos of Wall St NY taken just a few years apart are quite telling – one is full of horses and the next full of cars. His examples of the uptake of digital technologies surpassing all the expert consensus at the time, and how even Kodak – the developer of the digital camera failed to see the impact it would have on their own business, and their going into bankruptcy just several years later.
          He references the business style of AirBnB and Uber as the business methodology of the future, and he may well be right. The fight back we are seeing now against AirBnB by the hospitality industry shows that the old is giving way to the new.
    • CLEANGREEN 12.5

      22 November 2017 at 8:24 pm

      Alwyn,

      Finally has showed himself as an anti rail advocate.

      So thanks for confirming what I suspected.

      I am not surprised you are a road lover.

      You want tyre dust pollution and will be happy killling us all prematurely then.

      I wont take you seriouslly again.
      • alwyn 12.5.1

        23 November 2017 at 8:23 am

        My dear chap.
        I am not anti-rail.
        I am in favour of rail where it is a sensible option.
        That means, roughly, in the following areas.
        The main trunk from Auckland to Wellington. The Auckland/Hamilton/Tauranga triangle. Christchurch to the West Coast. Possibly Picton to Christchurch although, if most of the freight is really coming from Auckland, coastal shipping may make more sense. Urban transport from Porirua and Upper Hutt to Wellington City. Except for the Wellington commuter corridors, which make sense because of the topology of the region, everything else is for freight only.
        That is about it. It doesn’t mean crazy schemes to bring back little trains from Gisborne to Napier which can be handled by a dozen trucks a week or suchlike.
        And it doesn’t mean “light rail” in Auckland and Wellington cities. They are obsolete.
13. Draco T Bastard 13

    21 November 2017 at 2:39 pm

    Merkel fails to negotiate a coalition:

    Exploratory talks to form the next German government collapsed on Sunday night after the pro-business Free Democratic Party (FDP) walked out of marathon negotiations with Merkel’s Christian Democrats, its Bavarian sister party, the Christian Social Union (CSU), and the Green party.

    After the RWNJs walk off in a huff.
    • Carolyn_nth 13.1

      21 November 2017 at 3:53 pm

      And they claimed Peters was holding the NZ potential government to ransom, and was taking too long to make a decision!
14. lprent 14

    21 November 2017 at 3:10 pm

    If anyone has been wondering where i have been for the past 3-4 days. It has been due to the most awkward (and embarrassing) of injuries – bruising the tailbone..

    While dismounting from my new commuter e-bike on Friday morning, I managed to catch my foot in a strap of the bag of work clothes on the back of the bike. Over I went landing arse first with the bike on top of me, and my blessed helmet managing to stop my brains from spilling on to the concrete.

    Apart from wondering about concussion (got someone to keep an eye on me) and having my dignity bruised, all appeared to be ok.

    But alas later that afternoon it turned out that when I stood up out of my chair for lunch, that wasn’t the only thing I’d bruised. My arse hurt to the point that I was having to waddle around my tail bone. Headed home early to get a med check (ok – nothing particularly busted), some anti-inflammatory support (mostly too late apparently), and several days lying in bed with my arse poking up in the air either bemoaning my fate or sleeping.

    Sitting down or even rolling over in bed has brought a new meaning in just bloody painful. And somehow I have never managed to master the art of coding or writing on blogs standing up…..

    Anyway, it seems to be subsiding, although the best advice is that it is going to be a pain for at least a month. It will be a few days I suspect before my normal attentions to the site resume. Currently all of my limited sitting down time is allocated to income generating activities.

    But I’m not going to do that again. I’m going to be a lot less blase about getting off the bike – which appears ro be my least remembered skill (either that or my joints are a lot less flexible than they were when I was 30)..
    • garibaldi 14.1

      21 November 2017 at 3:17 pm

      And I thought riding them in traffic would be too dangerous. Good luck with your recovery, and empathy for the dent in your pride for such a landing.
      • lprent 14.1.1

        21 November 2017 at 3:46 pm

        I’d agree. That was why I stopped biking in Auckland about 30 years ago. It got frigging dangerous. Fortunately Auckland is starting to try to make itself habitable, and to get some people out of cars and off the roads.

        There is a bike way that does virtually all of the way between home and work. It crosses roads, but the lights now often have separated bike and pedestrian sections.

        Which is a damn good thing in commuting hours. It is about 2.6km to work as a bird would fly. But there isn’t a direct route and a fair chunk of hill either way.

        It would take me about 40 minutes to walk if I didn’t have an arthritic big toe – which makes it seems like a lifetime.

        It reliably takes me about 15-20 minutes to bike. Most of the time is waiting to cross at the lights.

        It takes at least 25 minutes (two buses and 0.5km walking) and usually more than an hour on public transport.

        It takes anywhere from 5 minutes (off peak) to an hour (peak) by car depending on the degree of jamming. Median is greater than 25 minutes. My ‘brief’ visit yesterday took 40 minutes to get there and 8 minutes to get home at midday. I had a cardio checkup at Greenlane (the treadmill did nasty things to the tailbone). Today it took 18 minutes to get to work. Variability is the biggest pain.

        I have a car for the longer trips and shopping, but commuting is going to be by bikeways and bike as I’m just outright tired of the damn traffic and paying road taxes that don’t get used to alleviate the major traffic issues in the country.

        They need to get the bloody trucks off the road or get them to pay their full whack – so we aren’t subsidizing the road wreckers and the frigging bridges and heavy duty maintenance.
        • Whispering Kate 14.1.1.1

          21 November 2017 at 4:14 pm

          You have my sympathy Lprent, I fractured my coccyx birthing my first child. It was sheer purgatory. The sitting down was okay – it was the rising up which brought tears to my eyes. Good luck with your recovery. Tailbone pain is not very nice at all. Try a ring cushion, its the tried and true accessory for all new mums with sore nether regions, they do work.
        • Ad 14.1.1.2

          21 November 2017 at 4:36 pm

          Terminal Hipster Syndrome definition

          “While dismounting from my new commuter e-bike on Friday morning, I managed to catch my foot in a strap of the bag of work clothes on the back of the bike.”

          Top work and commiserations.

          Just as soon as they complete the New Lynn-Avondale cycleway that in turn joins to the Avondale-SH16 cycleway, I’ll be joining you.
        • Draco T Bastard 14.1.1.3

          21 November 2017 at 4:37 pm

          They need to get the bloody trucks off the road or get them to pay their full whack

          The latter will achieve the former.

          All the nelo-liberals always say that all businesses should pay their way but then they come up with all sorts of reasons why some are special and need subsidising. Some of those reasons even make sense when what we’re talking about is social services but, then, we’d be better off if those were simply a government service paid for through taxes.

          Trucks don’t meet any sort reason for continued subsidy and need to have their subsidies discontinued ASAP.
    • Anne 14.2

      21 November 2017 at 3:57 pm

      If anyone has been wondering where i have been for the past 3-4 days…

      I doubt it but nevertheless our sincere commiserations. I have bad news for you. Having once damaged the same part of my anatomy some time ago, I now suffer painful arthritis in the base of my spine requiring frequent anti-inflamatory support. The good news is: it will take a few years before the arthritis sets in. 🙂
      • lprent 14.2.1

        21 November 2017 at 4:04 pm

        Arrggh…..
        • Prickles 14.2.1.1

          21 November 2017 at 10:01 pm

          Don’t depend on anti-inflams – get yourself to an osteopath and an acupuncturist as soon as you can and ward off the arthritis before it happens.
    • One Anonymous Bloke 14.3

      21 November 2017 at 4:32 pm

      Get well soon, broken-arse 😉
    • Draco T Bastard 14.4

      21 November 2017 at 4:44 pm

      Fell off my bike a couple of weeks after I got it (bad transition from road to footpath) and bruised my ribs. Spent a couple of weeks living on painkillers after that. Hurt like hell when I tried to lie down but it was fine when standing/sitting thankfully. Still, the ibuprofen had me feeling sick after a couple of days so I switched standard panadol.
    • patricia bremner 14.5

      21 November 2017 at 5:03 pm

      Oh Iprent, my heart went out to you.

      Many years ago as a fit and active hiker and tramper, I was climbing a bank and was offered a hand literally.

      Suffice to say when the grip slipped so did I. Right onto a large stone. I had broken my tailbones, all 3!!!

      The pain was almost unbearable, and it was before anti inflammatory meds. It was six weeks of misery.

      When the story was told people would snigger, then apologise. I guess where the injury was “seated” caused the mirth.

      Get well soon
      • McFlock 14.5.1

        21 November 2017 at 11:16 pm

        I must confess, my first thought upon hearing of Lprent’s misfortune was a well-meaning “that’s a bit of a bugger”, then thought better of it due to the double-meaning. Words failed me.
    • weka 14.6

      21 November 2017 at 5:24 pm

      Is there a reason for having a man’s bike not a woman’s? Seems odd that women’s style bikes aren’t standard. No throwing the leg over the back end.
      • Carolyn_nth 14.6.1

        21 November 2017 at 5:46 pm

        Traditional reasons. The men’s version was originally stronger, while women rode bikes wearing skirts. So, for “propriety” they were given the lower cross bar, but weaker frame.

        These days, apparently, it’s not so much where the cross bar is, but other aspects of design. All designs tend to have stronger frames.
        • weka 14.6.1.1

          21 November 2017 at 9:25 pm

          That’s what I would have thought Maybe it’s cheaper to build a bike with a cross bar.
        • Draco T Bastard 14.6.1.2

          22 November 2017 at 1:28 am

          Interesting article. I bit caught my attention:

          There are about one billion bicycles in existence world-wide. For reference, there are “only” about 500 million automobiles in the world today.

          Now imagine how much damage to the environment would have been done if all those bicycles were actually cars as the RWNJs want.
    • Macro 14.7

      21 November 2017 at 10:40 pm

      I gave up cycling years ago because, it was for me, literally a pain in the arse. (I guess I could have had it seen to – but those bike seats…)
      Now it seems that there are two ways to develop such a malady.
      Sorry to hear of your accident Lynn and hope the healing is speedy. I know about the worry of concussion too. On rushing back one evening to the dance hall, because I had left my pullover behind, I put my foot where I thought the gutter should be – but was instead a monsoon drain – the civil engineering in Thames in places leaves a lot to be desired – but that is another story (the town having been in administration from 1931 to 1947) and I ended up flat on my face in the middle of Queen Street (the one in Thames). When I came too I couldn’t move – having smashed my left shoulder- and thought “I hope no one runs me over!” Then I saw a flashing light and a police car stopped in the road in front of me. He had been on a call out – the Police station being just up the road a way, and had seen this person running down the street! Hmmm that looks suspicious and he watched me and saw me fall. A large box of chocs was presented to the Police station on my return.
15. joe90 15

    21 November 2017 at 3:26 pm

    Makes me wonder about our own hacks, commentators and opinion makers.

    In hearing these individual tales, we’re not only learning about individual trespasses but for the first time getting a view of the matrix in which we’ve all been living: We see that the men who have had the power to abuse women’s bodies and psyches throughout their careers are in many cases also the ones in charge of our political and cultural stories.

    https://www.thecut.com/2017/10/halperin-wieseltier-weinstein-powerful-lecherous-men.html
16. patricia bremner 16

    21 November 2017 at 5:03 pm

    Oh Iprent, my heart went out to you.

    Many years ago as a fit and active hiker and tramper, I was climbing a bank and was offered a hand literally.

    Suffice to say when the grip slipped so did I. Right onto a large stone. I had broken my tailbones, all 3!!!

    The pain was almost unbearable, and it was before anti inflammatory meds. It was six weeks of misery.

    When the story was told people would snigger, then apologise. I guess where the injury was “seated” caused the mirth.

    Get well soon
17. greywarshark 17

    21 November 2017 at 9:52 pm

    The dead hand of Ozment.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/344353/canberra-rejects-claim-it-s-wrecked-norfolk-economy
18. greywarshark 18

    21 November 2017 at 10:06 pm

    This seems underhand. Immigration should be transparent. We need to work on this because so often their actions indicate they are a bit thick in the head.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/344341/anti-semitic-blogger-detained-for-nearly-six-weeks

    More on Oz.
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2018621702/richard-denniss-every-time-we-waste-money-we-count-it-as-wealth
    • McFlock 18.1

      21 November 2017 at 11:23 pm

      It’s certainly irregular, and disconcerting.

      The court thing is odd – I was under the impression that even if he had name suppression for something, it would still be on court documents and just not publishable.

      Weird.
19. Tanz 19

    21 November 2017 at 10:44 pm

    Why doesn’t someone in the Labour ranks tell Ardern to pull her head in? She is embarrassing NZ on the world stage, and only four weeks in. Out of her depth and childish, NZ deserves much better than this. Winston, what say you now?? The silence is deafening…are people who voted Labour having buyers remorse?? I knew she wasn’t up to the job, but it’s an absolute nightmare so far. There is a reason more people voted for National than Labour and the Greens combined!
    Bill English runs circles around Ardern in the PM stakes.
    • Draco T Bastard 19.1

      21 November 2017 at 11:24 pm

      She is embarrassing NZ on the world stage, and only four weeks in.

      No she’s not.

      And I’m pretty sure you didn’t say anything about when John Key embarrassed us on the world stage.

      Why the double standards?
      Is it because Jacinda is a woman?
      Or is it because she’s Labour?

      There is a reason more people voted for National than Labour and the Greens combined!

      And there’s a reason why most people didn’t vote national at all – no matter how much you try to hide from that fact.

      Bill English runs circles around Ardern in the PM stakes.

      No he doesn’t. Too bloody conservative.
      • McFlock 19.1.1

        21 November 2017 at 11:33 pm

        Grieving is a process.

        Personally, I quite hope that national stay aroung 37-44%. Otherwise the tories might ditch the nats and come up with a competent friend for them. At the moment Billy No-mates and his band of moaning minnies have nobody to make them look sane.
    • Grey Area 19.2

      22 November 2017 at 1:07 am

      Always good to get an update from the alternate universe on Planet Key.
    • North 19.3

      22 November 2017 at 9:35 pm

      You were just panting for some bullshit controversy weren’t you Tanz? Fuck off with your ‘remorse’. Run around in any circle you care to stumble into troll!
20. CLEANGREEN 20

    22 November 2017 at 11:43 am

    Get better soon Iprent,

    I did my left knee in during a capsised 12ft dingy accident last december, and it is just comming back to use now, as I had many weeks restup and slow exersise using a $30 floor cycle “mini exercise bike” from Kmart, to slowly mobilise my knee again and lots of hot baths using hydrogen peroxide or baking soda.
    • North 20.1

      22 November 2017 at 10:13 pm

      Oh you poor folks. Hope conditions are improving and pain goes to nothing. Not comparable to your accident injuries but being of an age I’m noticing that I’ve always bloody well got something ‘niggling’. Bit annoying really. And blow me down I’ve got very cognisant of that institution ‘the weather’. And I need korero about ‘the weather’. What is it?

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