sigh two of my colleagues received freshly minted 90 day notices yesterday… Landlords selling up due to changes…. I guess the changes are having the desired effect not so good for solo mums thrust back into the exploding rental market…
Yeah its not alot of fun… effects schooling as well end up having to look in the same zone… expensive to time off… moving costs… finding bond… tenancy services is running behind on bond refunds by the sounds…
Pretty worried for one of them piles more shit on…
Hoping but not holding my breath that govt will move quickly to help renters… to my mind if you make renters rights really strong you deflate the market anyway… would put anyone in it for the short term off…
Unfortunately there will be a few landlords that decide to cash up now which was always going to happen as an unintended consequence. I fear these announcements may not be good for renters as rents will increase. Hopefully your colleagues can find another place but there is a shortage of rental places in many areas, thus the problem we have.
I actually have a nice landlord story. A friend of mine the landlord has cut down 2 big trees, cost 8k so the homes are warmer. Landlord said he was not selling.
Usually when costly land shaping is done either selling or a rent rise is in the horizon.
I do have nosy extractor fan issues 24/7 where I live due to a house divided into 3 tenancies with 6 people. Loud footsteps and doors banging can also annoy me and keep me up or wake me up.
The rental market is so tight and I have had the experience of the landlord selling and needing to move out. I had the last laugh they sold for 200k 4 1/2 years ago and the place is now worth 400k.
Some landlords might find the price of their home dropping. I do give a thought to those struggling to pay the rent and this cannot continue.
Agree Cricklewood. Renters rights need to be very strong. Rent freeze, long tenancies. Evictions only for anti social activities that bother the neighbours or destroy property.
I do also think it is a good sign if landlords are selling up(although very sorry for your friends). Hopefully too many who thought they would buy property to invest, changing their minds…
How are landlords selling good? Those who rent and will never be able to buy where do they go ? Perhaps into the waiting list for a HNZ property and with the demand there. With obvious outcomes where is the govts action on coping with the consequences? A plan to build more in the future. When and what if those living in the present ???!
Thereon lies the big flaw in the govts announcement, it may slow house price inflation which has runaway but they did nothing to help renters at the same time… once again its help for the upwardly mobile.
Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…
Something like this from Switzerland perhaps…
Tenants have the right to know the grounds for termination. Notices of termination not made in good faith (such as notice of termination because the landlord is exercising his landlord's right, or on account of the tenants' changed family circumstances) may be contested before the conciliation authority. The official notice form explains how tenants should proceed when disputing a termination.
If the termination is likely to cause undue hardship for the tenants (financial or family difficulties, housing shortage), an extension of the term of the tenancy may be applied for at the conciliation authority.
The other oversight I would add that in Feb 21 the average property in me rose $50,000 and our leaders talk of substainable price rises going forward 🤷♀️. Not of the damage done in recent times.
I am yet to read anything or contributor here as to what this country looks like in 3,5+ years . IMO that outlook would frustrate many . As J Ritren sang “ no future, no future for me ..”
well done to the govt for being seen to do something but deliver crap all.
Couple of ways….if the property was being held empty for capital gain it adds to the available stock….if the property was being used as an AirBnB, it adds to available stock.
If future rental stock is available at a lower price the pressure to reduce rents is increased, but most important of all, the realisation that property values are no longer a one way bet will bring some sanity back to the housing market and allow us to use housing as it should be….to house our population, not as a credit line for the few who seek to extract wealth from the many (and the broader economy)
There is no point in investors s buying property for a capital gain if there is no (or a CPI equivalent) capital gain….that capital will seek a new home, especially if they see their existing gains disappearing in a falling market.
In short, investors selling is a symptom of changed expectations….and that is beneficial to both FHB AND renters.
Has extending the brightline test and cutting the tax reduction on interest turned into a house being like a car sitting in the garage for years not knowing what you can sell it for?
The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller.
Id suggest what the extended BL test and (especially) the change to interest deductibility have done is increase the costs to investors while they wait for the capital gain…it is a signal that if you are investing in existing property for capital gain then we are going to make it hard for you…especially when aligned with the exemption for new builds….that makes the business model for many investors, especially recent investors who have paid high prices, unworkable.
There are pretty much two questions that we are waiting to see the answer to….how many investment properties will re enter the market?…and will the Government stick to its position, or will they soften their message?
"The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller."
Dont think anyone can put a percentage on it…there are too many variables, but the sellers will not necessarily lose …if you bought your rental say 6 years ago and you sell now you take out that capital gain of around maybe 60-80% (median house 2014 $457000—median house price 2020 $725000) and not subject to BL….not a bad return Id suggest.
Hopefully the latest changes put a brake on property investors who only buy to sell due to house prices rocketing.
Government cannot soften their message because nothing else has worked. It's a vicious cycle as renters now need more government assistance to pay the rent and landlords know this.
1. How to support people to pay the rent without it going into the landlords hand is what needs to be actioned?
2. Some sort of tier percentage system on when the rental was purchased and how much the rent can increase?
Rent caps or other forms of rent control are another option but I suspect that would only be used if there is widespread rent hikes….and as noted yesterday many landlords have already had their annual shot at rent hikes so they cant till the years is up….I dont think many of them will wait until next year to decide what to do.
I think that, before evicting a tenant or increasing his rent, a landlord should be required to apply to Kainga Ora for a review of the situation to determine whether the eviction/rent increase would be justified. I would regard the recovery of the no longer deductible interest as not constituting an adequate reason for either action.
I’ve always wondered about banning tenders in the sale process. It creates a lot of anxiety which I reckon drives up the selling price as FOMO pushes people to put in bids way above the estimated value
Auctions get the second best price (the winner only has to outbid the second best bid not bid with their top offer). Tenders means the seller gets the best price because everyone has to put in their best offer.
And this morning the deputy PM had fuelled the fire by “not ruling out rent freezes”. So what will landlords do … hike the rents as much as they can in the meantime to kick off any rent controls from a higher base.
However the deputy PMs credibility went from hero to zero this week so maybe we can just ignore him and carry on.
"investors have been offered a generous exit package"
Indeed – they get to keep the extraordinary wealth passively accumulated at the expense of others (including future generations) over the last two decades – minus a short blip post-GFC. Does anyone dare to go after some of this deplorable stash with a wealth tax – maybe to help fund a large state house building programme?
The wealth accumulated in the last couple of decades is going to perpetuate unequal access to housing into the next generation through inheritance. I don't see it as retribution so much as correcting market perversity and returning to a slightly more level playing field. I do agree though that the primary purpose of a wealth tax is not raising revenue and that state house building is not tax take-constrained.
Not entirely sure how say 5 separate people being forced out of a flat due to rent rises from this, for the sake of one of the few couples left, who manage to buy the flat as a home helps the 5 separate people find more affordable flats, when there are obviously less of them and the sudden demand, means the rent will just go up even more.
People to me seem to forget some people will just never be able to afford to own a house, and have to rent.
I dont forget that at all…and is why property prices (and consequently rents) need to fall to affordable levels….10+ times median income is not that.
"But she said there were warning signs beneath the surface and many people were still doing it tough. More than a third were still living “payday to payday”.
“We know we are not out of the woods yet, there are more Covid-19 effects to roll through the economy and this research highlights some concerns. The fact that more than a third of people have less than a single week’s expenses available to them and almost half have less than $1000 in rainy day savings rings alarm bells for me. This puts them in a potentially vulnerable position."
There are going to be people selling flats to couples (or other investers who sit on them for 10 years) or raising rents, to cover it, which means less flats available, which means even higher rent prices.
You can argue all you like the rents will be too high for people to cover it, but this just means more people joing the state housing waiting list, which is getting immense.
If first home buyers buy the properties landlords sell and prospective landlords change their minds and don’t but, those first home buyers will no longer need a rental. Good
For your info Pat these investors still have an advantage – Rates, maintenance etc are still able to be deducted for a reduction of tax and still allows a cash back advantage.
And what many have not understood these recent increases in price also distance new home purchasers with an increase of an already substantial deposit required. In feb the average price of a property increased by $50,000 a 20% deposit means that these 1st Home buyers in 28 days now required another $10,000 in deposit, and think what the impact of the increases that were achieved pre Feb 21??
And all of that explains why prices must fall or we consign home ownership in NZ to the dustbin.(and the likely exodus of our youth offshore….again)
The Gov have been bolder than I initially thought with this package and appear willing to accept a fall in property prices although they havnt explicitly said so…my guess is they would be happy for them to revert to what they were around a year ago ….good luck controlling the decline, theyll probably be the first in history if they pull it off, but at least theyre trying.
I dont rent but some of my children do, so do some of my friends and who knows circumstances may decide that one day I will….why is it so difficult to understand that peoples motives are not necessarily self serving?
This economic model is destroying everything that was best about this country/society so you may find that many of that 65% are quite happy for the 10% of the population who are investors to lose their gravy train…especially when it is wrecking their communities
My house value could fall 50% tomorrow and I wouldnt care, nor would my mother if hers did similarly, 50% may cause a problem for one of my children but theyd survive….dont forget roughly a third of properties in NZ are mortgage free.
"So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?"
Obviously not, and the size of the fall will be determinant however you were asking about how voters would view house price falls and I gave you a couple of voters perspectives.
While there are potential downsides to property price falls there are also upsides so what is the net position?…not just for individuals but the economy as a whole.
And if the expectation is the current trajectory is unsustainable then the correction will happen anyway….and the greater the debt the bigger the impact when it does.
Some pain today or lots of pain tomorrow?
I know every investors thinks they will be out before that happens but history shows most mistime it.
Actually David I know of many many fhb who have the deposit, but keep missing out due to investors. They will now have far less competition and will be able to secure their own first home.
What I don't get about investors bleating on about interest payments no longer being tax deductable is that any good business person who took out a loan at record low interest rates should have forecasted in a potential for interest rates to increase substantially, or even for the govt to make interest no longer tax deductable. Any person with half a brain who is investing should have factored that in.. They took the risk, things change, too bad.
And yes bring on a rent freeze. Or even better a national rent strike.
Sounds awesome – that could highlight/solve a lot of issues.
The case for a rent strike in New Zealand under COVID-19 Nevertheless, there is still a key difference between these landlords and renters: if things get really bad, they can always sell their house to pay their bills. Renters don’t have that option. This is the true class difference between those who own private property and those who don’t. It’s about material security, not varying levels of personal greed.
2, 4, 6, 8
we don’t want to pay our bills in a commy state
Nice one David – cue the dancing Cossacks. Tbh, I don't know what Muldoon was so het up about. National governments always 'transfer' public assets into private hands – it's what they do.
One 'problem' facing a fairly sizable minority of NZ citizens is the inability to pay for the necessities of life, wouldn't you agree? Maybe inequality in NZ has gone a little too far…
Why poverty in New Zealand is everyone's concern
Liang describes poverty as a "heritable condition" that perpetuates and amplifies through generations: "It is also not hard to see how individual poverty flows into communities and society, with downstream effects on economics, crime and health, as well as many other systems. Loosen one strand and everything else unravels."
A Kete Half Empty Poverty is your problem, it is everyone's problem, not just those who are in poverty. – Rebecca, a child from Te Puru
Wrong target David. It is land speculators who have been getting a free ride at the expense of tenants, people who need a home and those of us who do pay taxes.
"Communism" is fine when they benefit, it seems.
If we all end up paying much higher interest rates, it will be because of their borrowing also.
Coincidentally, they released their Annual Report on Friday in which that information was made available to the public. Have you read the report? The photos of pristine New Zealand nature wouldn’t go amiss in a NZ Travel & Tourism brochure or a publication by DOC, all super-neutral, of course.
I know the identities of two NZers (maybe three) who were working for a 'foreign agency' in the 1970s and 1980s. They infiltrated the NZ Labour Party. Since the country concerned was a close geographical ally I guess that was alright. They could do what they liked and harass whoever they liked.
Please don’t even go there, thanks. Some other commenter might be stupid enough to put this site at risk and that would be a real shame, don’t you agree?
So why is this happening, all over the country it seems?
It its not just short staffed, it is arrivals at hospital for treatment have vastly increased – especially for this time of the year.
Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?
Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ?
Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?
The A & E model needs to change so serious cases are triaged and a separate clinic run like a GP clinic adjacent to the premises. Fully staffed GP clinics need to run over the weekend at no extra cost.
More doctors and nurses are required. A shortage of specialists as well.
There needs to be a change in the way health care is delivered.
When someone is referred to ED/clinic etc the next steps must be available at the same time. eg Cat/MRI scan, Xray, dietician/nutrionist, mental health…
Folk often struggle to take that morning/afternoon/hour off as it is without scheduling further engagements.
I do like your answers at 5.3, gsays; enough so that I won't spoil them by replying directly.
But another cause behind the ED bottleneck is the drain of nurses to MIQ, vaccination, and more rewarding private work. Public health work conditions, in Dunedin hospital at least, are apparently pretty grim at the best of times for them.
The 2 ED nurses I know that are/were doing the MIQ stuff, where either working in Oz (clinic work in a remote town) or looking to exit health and grow their small dingo/digger truck business.
Both have talked about dismay with junior/inexperienced staff, cultural politics and being too busy, too often.
“Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?”"
A lot of the aforementioned immigrants, are staffing the wards and EDs. This may influence the militancy/stauchness of the workforce, therefore the nursing unions.
“Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ? ”
Yes, along with increased presentations of folk who cant afford to see a GP, drug seekers, alcohol impaired, mental ill health, entitlitis etc.
“Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?”
Yes. Nor do we pay them well enough.
“What is the root cause ?”
Neo-liberalism. Letting a market decide. When your DHB has a Chief Executive Officer as the highest paid on the payroll, its a sign of the times.
A random meeting between the self-centred driven entrepreneurs being lauded in this country, trying hard to acquire enough custom from those with spare everything, and someone who has to count the pennies to get near that lifestyle and resents being pushed to the fringes.
And this is just a light touch on the cheek from the group finding social mobility difficult to achieve, tantalisingly available and then removed, perhaps in the 'gig' economy, or regularly denied and facing deprivation. Below such people are a mass who are at their wit's end, lacking wit for some time actually, becoming hopeless, munted, angry and holding in vengeful thoughts, just.
I saw this while looking for a source of retirement income apart from the traditional residential property, exchange traded shares, funds and fixed interest.
"We’re on a mission to simplify investment into high growth Kiwi companies.
"We want to make the capital market work much more efficiently for growth companies, so they can focus on selling their products to the world. We want to provide investors with a simple way to gain exposure to interesting investment opportunities – facilitating the flow of national savings into wealth-creating assets.
We’re driven by the significant positive impact we can make by building a thriving marketplace to connect growth companies with the capital they need.
Along the way we hope to develop the general financial literacy of the New Zealand public, and bring far more meaning and excitement to investing."
This shit should be a massive red flag for the left. Actually for everyone. Next time you see a woman being told that no-one is stopping them from speaking about their reality, understand that this is what is now routine in academia and has been increasing for quite some time. In another decade we, women, will have lost our ability to academic freedom around our own realities, and it's not like we were in a great place to begin with. And it won't end with women.
No McFlook, it looks like cancel culture to me. And it pisses me off because it is cancelling the existence of the women's liberation movement and menstruating at the very least.
“I was encouraged to abandon about the problems menstruation posed ……..because it was deemed trans exclusionary.”
I would be interested to hear you views on what I have written below.
Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently.
As for your comments below, one doesn't have to be male to perv at women, so it's not as if self-id would automatically stop police or anyone else objecting to someone behaving objectionably.
And no, zoom-calling in a conference room isn't "kosher". It might even be a criminal offence (intimate visual recording).
btw, I’ll be offline for several hours very soon – I should have held off rather than getting into a discussion.
Actually McFlook you are discounting my concerns about having men who id as women in changing rooms with your glib comment about “One doesn’t have to be a man to perv at women”. I am sure I have shared many a changing room with lesbians (guess that’s who you are referring to) and I have never felt uncomfortable about any women’s behaviour in a change room. I have also NEVER heard of police being called to women’s objectionable behaviour towards other women in a change room. It is a completely different dynamic with a man. Also women often walk around without towels etc in a change room. If gender self id “women” who were really men did this it would be very unpleasant. Surely you have heard about flashers. But how could it be proved “she” just walking from the shower to “her” locker.
I think women will feel really concerned about this, even if you men can’t imagine how that will be for a women. You have never lived with the unwanted male gaze. Have you not read the paper about how many time men have been filming women in bathrooms changerooms etc????
As for flashing in the changing rooms, sure, the possibilities for human stupidity are limitless. Some non-trans guy might try it. How do you see that conversation with the cops or changing room staff going down, realistically?
Flashing in a public change room human stupidity????? WTF McFlook. That jut tells me you know nothing about what it is like being a women. Your o.k. for men who have changed their gender to do these things and of course the police/change room staff with make it o.k………..Think by this stage the horse has bolted. If the "woman" acts like other women in the change rooms, then there will be nothing that can be done about it. All they have to do is walk from the shower to their locker without a towel with or without an erection and they are women right? Police could probably say wear a towel mate, but can't enforce.
Thinking that self-id will avoid any repercussion is the stupidity part of it.
So we have a flasher of the subtle breed who are acting completely normally without eye contact to see what reaction they're getting? Ok, not the usual type I've had to call the cops over back in the day, but ok. Assuming there is nothing, nothing, to show dodgy intent, they can still be barred by the facility because of their behaviour, because it makes other people uncomfortable.
Point is McFlook, I don't want men in women's changing rooms. Full stop. Most women I have run this by feel the same.
I understand you side with the gender self id bill/trans rights side. Yours entitled to your opinion. But I don't think your opinion on how its going to operate in women's changing rooms has any merit. It can't have. You have never been in one (I hope except maybe when you were a child).
I didn't need to go into the women's room to control access, catch flashers, or see how people dealt with men who thought they were discriminated against because they weren’t allowed to run for women's rep positions.
The idea that self-id makes facilities management and the police powerless to deal with offensive behaviour just isn't reflected in the real world.
But transwomen being unsafe in one changing room and unwelcome in the other? That is reflected in the real world.
"Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently."
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on. Academics are afraid to speak out. This isn't hyperbole. The ones that do get their office doors pissed on, they get rape and death threats, they lose their careers. The women more than the men of course. To suggest that in this environment an appeals process is going to be useful other than as a political act is incredibly naive.
What’s happening on the left is the dismissal and the position that there is no debate, so there is no way for the issues to be aired and resolved. That too should be a big fucking red flag for the left. It’s not like the left is immune to authoritarianism.
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on.
It's a bit unfair to post links about getting marked down in assignments and then argue that anyone who responds should be responding to unmentioned but more serious complaints.
Try writing a paper about a steady-state model of the universe sometime (as opposed to "Big Bang" theory), and see how that gets marked.
good to know you are ok with academia redefining feminism to mean a liberation movement for all people and educating its students to that effect against the wishes of many feminists including MA students.
I mean, it's always enlightening when men give away women's rights. Again. Maybe try putting up some actual arguments, I'd love to know where this goes. Feminist academics are raising the issue, and men are going, yeah, nah, nothing to worry about there.
When you can not conduct a study on women (biological or trans) and you can not discuss the impact of menstruation and menstruation products when in this country we have young vaginal beings not going to school for lack of menstruation products (and maybe there even is a trans boy or five in the group ) then academia is getting dumb, and discriminatory. Cause women who identify as women and would like to get treated as such exist. And we too would like to be identified as to our on self ID. And we would like our rights, and our safety taken seriously, cause we die the world over often at the hand of penis humans.
And i would just venture a guess that you have never refused an outing or been refused a promotion a job or such on the grounds that you may get your period, or that you may get pregnant, or that you may have given birth, or that you may have lost a pregnancy.
So really please, take your male privilege and ask yourself why women who identify as women, who were born as women, who have born literally every man that is, need to take what little rights we have gained over the last hundred years and give it up to accomodate and be surplanted by trans women. Cause the discussion is only affecting women.
Is this a discussion about a seat of the table and only 10 seats are there, so one needs to be knocked of to free up a seat? Or will this be a discussion about finding another seat and adding it the table?
McFlook then what do you see as the solution for trans women in changing rooms? What if women aren't comfortable with this?
Every concern and reservation I have have had about the gender self id bill you have dismissed. It sounds like you think women like me and there are many of us should put up and shut up. Is this how you see it?
You can see why as feminists it is a double problem for us. A. Maybe we don't want trans women in our change rooms. B. Men such as yourself seem to be dismissing this.
You also didn't answer whether you though it was a credible scenario that men would change their sex to have easy access to women and children. Is that o.k. by you because we can ring the police?
1: Trans women already use womens' changing rooms.
2: I have also listened to other non-trans women who disagree with your position. And trans women, and trans men. I suspect that you are, as they say, "on the wrong side of history", and quite possibly the legislation will change within months, regardless of any arguments here.
3: Some feminists and non-trans women agree with you. Others disagree with you. There does not seem to be any middle ground on this issue.
4: "Credible"? 2.5 million men, sure. Someone might try changing their birth certificate as an excuse to get unchallenged access to women and children. Will it work? Significantly less likely. Will it result in greater harm than if 50,000-odd trans people are policed about which changing rooms they go into regardless of birth certificate, not even including instances of non-trans women being challenged because they don't conform to feminine norms? I don't think so. That's why I have the position I have.
“Being on the wrong side of history” would never stop me from supporting a cause I believe in. Standing up for women’s rights is not something I d we oils drop because I might be on the wrong side of history.
but thanks to discussion on this blog and to you I have become better informed. What I have discovered about these issues worries me more. How debate/women’s voices are being silenced. Only this weekend gone at the pride event in Wellington a woman who is a lesbian who has terminal cancer was on a stall at the event. She left the stall briefly to take scissors and tape to a group of “reefs” in this case elderly lesbians who had been banned from pride who were protesting outside. In trying to re-gain entry 4 organisers including a very large male person intercepted her, accused her of carrying an offensive weapon. She still had her bag at the stall. She stood up to them and refused to budge. They man handled her and called the police. These older women have fought the good fight for lesbian and gay rights. What sort of treatment is this? Young people gathered and started chanting fucking terfs. An aggressive and vocal minority is shutting women’s. Voices down
Btw in the last week two cases of trans being barred from women’s changing rooms
Yes I think that is reasonably accurate, i.e. a generation divide.
Having read a bit more about it i.e. trans issues, I understand and feel free to disagree, that a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm. They also experience gender dysphoria. An approach that has been encouraged with their parents is to validate their wanting to be a different sex. This started to occur 20 years ago and so now we have a generation of young people who identify as trans. This I don't believe has ever happened before. From this point of view I acknowledge how very vulnerable some of these individuals must feel.
My perspective is a rigorous radical campaign has been mounted for trans rights, including the right to say there are real women. My understanding is if this is challenged is it vociferously, aggressively shot down. I think there is an enormous amount of solidarity in numbers group think going on.
I noticed McFlook that someone accused you of mysogeny and others implied as a man you shouldn't be taking about this issue. But I don't want to stop you from doing this, because this is a part of what I am objecting to with the trans activists. People have their voices shot down/cancelled.
You are still denying that trans is actually a thing. A while ago i said that i see this as where the gay thing was forty years ago. Back then there was still a lot of people who saw being gay as a mental illness. Now when people say that they are not taken seriously, they are considered bigots. So yes the wrong side of history you are on this i think also.
It is not surprising that trans people experience mental health issues with so many people denying their identity is real:
Cheers – the accusation did give me pause for thought, but that's usually a good thing.
The issue of trans kids and their mental health has a fair bit of research, which is why validation starts early. The main worry is suicide and depression. But are these comorbidities, or are they the consequences of social responses to how trans people are treated by society? When social discrimination is killing people, there's a strong campaign for rights for those people. And trans people have been part of the queer rights movement all the way back to before Stonewall.
I have friends with trans kids (in both directions). The kids and young adults seem to be happier now than my peers from back at the same age who have since transitioned. But also the young thesps just seem more fluid and accepting of themselves and each other, by and large. Still dramas (natch lol), but less judgy of each other's bits and more willing to stand up for each other (although they still have the young person thing of going overboard without thinking, maybe like in responding to that protest you mentioned).
The babies my friends had in their early twenties are leaving/left the nest. They generally seem to be better people than I was (and many of my peer group) at that age.
I am not sure where you get that I am still denying trans is a thing Solkta. Please let me know.
you are entitled to think it like where the gay thing was forty years ago. I accept that is your view. I see it differently. Gay people were not telling me they were really heterosexual nor were they deconstructing my identity, eg referring to me as a person who f…Ed men.
I was still a heterosexual woman.
I don’t believe I have ever been anything but pleasant and respectful when I have met trans people. You then accused me of being disrespectful about them on-line, but when challenged didn’t provide any evidence that I had been. I did a check with Mc flook who said I hadn’t been.
I am still reading and finding out about this stuff.
I am a feminist and hearing things about elderly lesbians being banned from pride, because they are not prepared to say trans women (not those who have transitioned) are real women. Said women who have been attending pride since it began don’t deserve to have 100 or so young people chanting fucking terfs at them.
there was a woman who happens to have terminal cancer who was staffing a stall at pride. She went out to give the protesters some tape and scissors for their banner, and when she went to go back in 4 people including a large man tried to man handle her out of the venue. She stood her ground and so they called the police. Utterly disgraceful in my opinion. Also because she had scissors caused her of carrying an offensive weapon. I mean ffs. This is disgraceful. She told them she had cancer.
I accept mental health issues are significant in the trans community. I did comment that they were vulnerable. Btw, I do have a criticism of the study. It really needed to have a control group of non trans young people, rather than extrapolating from other studies.
I still think we need to look at the Dunedin multi disciplinary study for gold standard research on this issue.
Surveying trans people and comparing their responses with previous and more general surveys might be the spanner for that job, rather than the dunedin study.
Can't see anything searching their journal publications database. But if you see an article you don't have access to, we might be able to sort something out between us. I could remember how to use dropbox, or flip email it to a mod and they can flip it to you, if willing. There's also an openaccess research site somewhere (like pirating movies, but for academic research because journals cost $$$).
a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm.
That can only be taken to mean that you consider being trans to be a mental health issue. If that is not what you meant then why say "other"? You say offensive things and then complain when people are offended.
DSMV1 talks about gender dysphoria. and I assume that many Trans people have gender dysphoria. This would cause psychological distress.
I don't deny trans is a thing. Checked out some trans activist blog sites tonight as I was trying to become more informed.
When I trained it was called Gender Identity disorder.
You seem to want to cast me as anti trans. This is not true. I don't really care too much. But I do care about how women's voices are being shut down and how my identity as a women is being de-constructed.
Would it help if we (again) re-acquainted ourselves with the meanings of the words "sex" and "gender"?
SUFW prefers (and why not?) the United Nations' definitions….
…it is our recommendation that New Zealand policy makers adopt definitions set up by United Nations Equality Glossary (2017). In particular, we suggest the following:
Sex (biological sex)
The physical and biological characteristics that distinguish males and females.
Gender
Gender refers to the roles, behaviours, activities, and attributes that a given society at a given time considers appropriate for men and women. In addition to the social attributes and opportunities associated with being male and female and the relationships between women and men and girls and boys, gender also refers to the relations between women and those between men. These attributes, opportunities and relationships are socially constructed and are learned through socialisation processes. They are context/time-specific and changeable. Gender determines what is expected, allowed and valued in a woman or a man in a given context.
Sex, what you were born with, is forever. It can't be changed.
It is possible with a great deal of medical and surgical intervention to alter one's appearance so as to look like the other sex, but you'll still be the sex you were born with.
Gender, on the other hand, has forever been whatever society/culture/fashion tries to dictate. Today it is possible to express yourself in whatever way floats your boat. Good on you.
But just because you dislike wearing frocks and would not be seen dead in stilettos,and putting on make-up seems like an act of dishonesty, it does not necessarily follow that you were 'born into the wrong body'.
Today, and because many women have fought long and hard to throw of the shackles of what we used to term 'sex-role-stereotypes', you can be yourself without have to resort to extreme medical and surgical interventions.
What The Bill intends is to make the impossible…changing one's sex…possible.
If you had any insight into how the women reading this are assessing you I'm sure you would be horrified. But honestly you clearly have no idea and little insight. It's good really seeing frank misogyny laid bare. Dissolves any illusion we can't unsee it either.
Having done an English degree a little over a decade ago, I ran across a little of this. Our feedback system had no box for us to object to it – but I felt it was a gratuitously offensive waste of time at my and other students' expense. If I'd wanted to do gender wars, I'd've taken a course in it – my expectations were literary, a bit of Trollope maybe. No surprise that the humanities have been obliged to downsize.
Thanks Weka for posting this. We need to speak up about this sort of shit.
I commented last week about the gender self id bill and have written to the Minister about this.
Our identity as women is being deconstructed. I read today that the term maternity care and being a mother is being challenged as the language needs to be more inclusive. As is not just women giving birth.
I have been thinking about how sexist this is. I don't know of the equivalent i.d men being referred to as people who get erections or people who ejaculate. Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
My go to for the best information is the Dunedin Multidisciplinary study. I say this because it is a prospective study that measures health and social outcomes. I would be interested to know what the rates of trans people there are in this cohort who are now in their 40s. Unfortunately I. have not been able to find out about whether that has been published or not. I suspect the rate is extremely low.
I am also objecting to the term Terf. When one group (trans activists) give another group a pejoritive label then it is deeply problematic to say the least.
More on this, I commented last week about the gender self id bill and some people poo pooed what I said.
Anybody dare to tell me that it is fanciful to imagine a scenario where sex offenders (and other men who might want to film women changing or peeing but don't have a criminal recored), change their gender to become a women. Then merrily waltz in to changing rooms at gyms, pools, woman's stores etc. They are free to perv at women and girls, free to expose themselves to women. And then when women call the cops, the cops can only say, sorry but he is a woman. This week alone there appears to be some sort of fracas with a "person" who had the body of a man being restrained by cops because of some incident in Glasons. There was also a report about David Farrar (yes I know I have no time for him) but he was in a male change room at the gym and some goof was on a zoom conference call. Farrar wasn't sure whether it was kosher or not
That is a very worthwhile read, thank you. Thought she said things very clearly.
I still believe people retain rights generally to set their own personal boundaries, individually and in groups. I, for example, avoid being in company with proudly public misogynists, but – crucially – I do not assume that every man I meet is in silent sympathy with them either. I would expect to be described as unfairly harsh if I did so, and this is where those holding exclusionary stances sometimes seem to want the impossible – to not be criticised when taking judgmental stances, especially when some of those stances involve not just social exclusion but the denial of civil rights.
I can only speak for myself Sacha, but what civil rights do you think I am denying?
What Civil Rights do you think groups such as the speak up for women are denying?
I am commenting on this issue because I am against the Gender Self ID Bill. That doesn't mean trans people can't change their sex on their birth certificate, it just means there is a process they have to go through.
I understand some feminist groups are not wanting to involve trans women in their meetings. But I think that is their right. Our experiences from trans women are very different. We have grown up with sexism since we were young girls. They have grown up with a very difficult situation of not feeling like the sex they were assigned.
In the 70's when I first became a feminist there were lesbian women who were separatists. So they wanted to meet and associate with each other and not with us. I had no problem with that.
As I have posted before the language now being used by some about women (menstruators, birthing units and people with vaginas I believe de-constructs my identity as a woman. I find it de-humanizing. As already posted it has been proposed to have a judicial enquiry into the gender self id bill on the basis of it nulifying what a women is.
I wonder what your thoughts are about what Weka is saying about academia?
BTW you asked a question about me assault last week. I gave quite a lengthy response about what happened. I guess you missed it.
The process of changing your birth certificate as it stands is very dehumanizing itself, as you are no doubt aware Anker. Also rather expensive.
But it does seem appropriate that you champion separatism. Given the link explaining how an early version of TERF that never really caught on was TES (trans-exclusionary seperatist).
Go online, .govt – change birth certificate and reduce any fees. That is something government can do.
I don't exclude Trans when i ask why i am now called a pregnant person, menstruating people etc. The question is why can we not called pregnant women? Because a transman is being a partime women in order to give birth? A man is pregnant? Really? Does that make me exclusionary?
Maybe it should be pregnant people when talking about trans women, and maybe it should be pregnant women when a women gets pregnant? Or would that too be exclusionary?
Before covid I had hired a transwomen. She lived for 28 years a man, and in her country that afforded her all the trimmings of male privilege, and she admits it. She is not going to be trans in her country as it would be deadly, so she came here. Do i feel her as a women? No, i don't Why – god knows, maybe its pheromone etc.? In saying that i don't feel her as a man. Go figure. But will i treat her as a women as a human being, as i would like to be treated by others, and ever now and then help her understand what it is to be women in our world, yes. Very funny tho when her boyfriend and her both applied at the same business for line cook postitions and she was offered a lower wage…….Welcome to the world of women, i said. Her look? Priceless.
I am not aware of what is involved in changing your birth certificate. That in my opinion is not a good reason to allow gender self id. It may be that there are aspects of the process that can be altered e.g. the cost. I would need to know more about the process to understand how it is de-humanizing. Going through life most of us will encounter difficult processes.
I am not championing separatism as such, merely offering that there are many occasions where we are all excluded from some groups.
I am not part of any feminist group currently, so whether I exclude trans women is mute. Like Sabine when I come across Trans people, I am respectful and civil, just like I am with any person I meet. So the label Trans exclusionary seperatiist doesn't really fit.
But surely that's the substance of the Gender Self ID Bill that you oppose?
The legislation – Births, Deaths, Marriages and Relationships Registration bill – was introduced in August 2017…
Currently, if someone wants to legally change their gender they need approval from a doctor or a judge.
Medical evidence of a sex change has to be provided as well…
In some cases, someone who wants to change their gender on their birth certificate needs to go through the family court – a process that could take up to a year.
But the legislation would change that so that the only thing needed was a statutory declaration – an official written statement
the current process seems appropriate to me. It is a big thing to change the sex on your birth certificate. I am sorry if it is a lengthy, expensive and difficult thing to change. Some things are e.g becoming a NZ citizen, immigrating to NZ especially under Covid. That doesn't make the processes wrong or right.
I don't support the Gender self id bill. Labour didn't as far as I can see have it as one of their election promises.
More that NZF held it up procedurally for the three years of last term.
It is a small change that will mean a lot to many Aotearoans. I don't believe that you are at all sorry for those whose identities are in limbo for years if not decades (17 years being the waiting list for the bottom surgery alone, even before the Pandemic). Plus there's still a lot of room for improvement around Nonbinary people too.
Biblical literalism, and centuries of colonialism have not left us many examples of that. Even Takitapui feels a bit reconstructed as much as extant culture. Good to have Kerekere in the parliamentary mix though. I guess the Heritage foundation's strategy of turning those with nontraditional gender expression against one another is working out pretty well for them…
Rambling, but at least you know what's in the bill you are opposing now, Anker.
RMcD, thanks for the link. I have tried to wade through the legalese of that a couple of times before, but my eyes just glaze over! The NZH summary above is more readable, though hardly complete.
Forget now, I hear it will mean a lot to many. You don't have to believe whether I am sorry or not. You are entitled to interpret what I say any way you want.
I think Sabine raises a very good point about the process of immigrating here. A rigorous costly process.
Trans people are still entitled to identify whatever gender they want to.
I also agree with Greywarshark that a minority are trying to change gender and sexual identification. No one is stopping them being trans. We are talking about a significant change to official documentation.
As I have said before, I can't change my ethnicity (at all) or my age for that matter.
Bend me, break me, anyway you make me… That is how many women and people feel about this minority that have taken centre stage to turn ordinary life on its side because they have a strong desire to make change! It's a tide of demands that is flooding us trying to stuff up the whole world and our very basic identities to suit the discontented.
There are only so many James Morris' around; the present growth of supplicants is through a power grab by gripe-merchants over young people faced with a convusing, fast-changing world, the control of which has been wrested from the orbit of ordinary people. A majority are facing poverty and homelessness and uncertainty because of ploys of the callous people pulling golden strings at the top. The meme is education and technology is the answer for all ills yet we can see the ills clearly but nothing can or will be done till the technocrats and the pollies trying to use them, have decided on the value to them of fixing them, affecting our fate, and devised a suitable budget to display. We are drowned in theoreticians words and economic inertia and the sort of science that wants to experiment in real time on real people.
This struck me as pertinent; Terry Pratchett's Thief of Time excerpt:
The concept of 'orders' was yet another and immensely unfamiliar one for any Auditors. They were used to decisions by committee, reached only when the possibilities of doing nothing whatsoever about the matter in question had been exhausted. Decisions made by everyone were decisions made by no-one, which therefore precluded any possibility of blame. (p.314 in my p/back.)
I have no issues with a transman wanting to be a 'parent', I have an issue with the statements of a 'man ' being pregnant, it is the female body of that transman who is pregnant. So the fair description would be 'transman' or 'self identified other'. And then feel free to call these groups of people people. But the vast majority of pregnancy happens to women who identify as women and historically it is the women bodies have been doing all of the worlds breeding. But thanks for the education, were would i be without it. .
And if you think that providing a medical certificate is dehumanising think about migrating. I presented several medical certificates to the immigration services, police certificates from every country i ever lived in, birth certificate, marriage certificate and photos, and letters, and more to prove that i am legally married and that my marriage was consumed. And it costs an arm and a leg and we are quite happy to demand even more from migrants today.
Maybe we really need to re-think the term of de-humanising and realise that it is not dehumanizing to prove that you went through a process to change your physical appearance of whom you were born into your real self in order to change every offical document ever issued to you.
Yes trans men and non binary people have vaginas and menstruate, because they were born with women’s anatomy I assume.
arkie, I assume you are a man? I am unhappy with my identity as a woman being deconstructed. As someone posted last week the gender self I’d bill, nulifies a women’s identity and if they try and pass I understand there will be a judicial review.
I didn’t read the whole article about who coined the term terf. It appears to be a woman who was speaking up for transgender rights. That isn’t the issue. The issue is what happens when a term not chosen by a group is used by an opposing group in a perjorative way to write that group off.
I belong to a number of groups that are exclusive. That is normal. I can’t join my husbands tribe because I am not Maori and he is. I very much doubt I could easily change my ethnicity. Trans people may or may not be members of groups I am a part of.
I don’t exclude trans people when I meet them in my day to day life
Hi McFlook, yeah I have checked the Dunedin study and they don't seem to have done anything on Trans. I choose that study as my go to source of science, because they really are scientists who are interested in what their research discovers rather than trying to prove a theory. For example their marvellous work on self control. Not popular with many people on the left because they have an ideology that they use to explain social problems. I am not saying that some ideology doesn't explain social/health issues e.g poverty's long term effect on health outcomes, even if people become financially well off in adulthood.
I would be interested to see the numbers who identified as Trans in the Dunedin study and at what age and what mental health outcomes and were the mental health outcomes correlated to other factors. Twelve is a very small sample, but I would be fascinated to see what the trajectory was for Trans people at all ages and stages. I would trust whatever they found.
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David Farrar writes: Graeme Edgeler wrote in 2017: In the first five years after three strikes came into effect 5248 offenders received a ‘first strike’ (that is, a “stage-1 conviction” under the three strikes sentencing regime), and 68 offenders received a ‘second strike’. In the five years prior to ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has surprised everyone with his ruthlessness in sacking two of his ministers from their crucial portfolios. Removing ministers for poor performance after only five months in the job just doesn’t normally happen in politics. That’s refreshing and will be extremely ...
TL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy in the two days to 6:06am on Thursday, April 25:Politics: PM Christopher Luxon has set up a dual standard for ministerial competence by demoting two National Cabinet ministers while leaving also-struggling ...
Hi,Today I mainly want to share some of your thoughts about the recent piece I wrote about success and failure, and the forces that seemingly guide our lives. But first, a quick bit of housekeeping: I am doing a Webworm popup in Los Angeles on Saturday May 11 at 2pm. ...
It is hard to see what Melissa Lee might have done to “save” the media. National went into the election with no public media policy and appears not to have developed one subsequently. Lee claimed that she had prepared a policy paper before the election but it had been decided ...
Open access notablesIce acceleration and rotation in the Greenland Ice Sheet interior in recent decades, Løkkegaard et al., Communications Earth & Environment:In the past two decades, mass loss from the Greenland ice sheet has accelerated, partly due to the speedup of glaciers. However, uncertainty in speed derived from satellite products ...
Buzz from the Beehive A statement from Children’s Minister Karen Chhour – yet to be posted on the Government’s official website – arrived in Point of Order’s email in-tray last night. It welcomes the High Court ruling on whether the Waitangi Tribunal can demand she appear before it. It does ...
Mr Bombastic:Ironically, the media the academic experts wanted is, in many ways, the media they got. In place of the tyrannical editors of yesteryear, advancing without fear or favour the interests of the ruling class; the New Zealand news media of today boasts a troop of enlightened journalists dedicated to ...
It's hard times try to make a livingYou wake up every morning in the unforgivingOut there somewhere in the cityThere's people living lives without mercy or pityI feel good, yeah I'm feeling fineI feel better then I have for the longest timeI think these pills have been good for meI ...
In 1974, the US Supreme Court issued its decision in United States v. Nixon, finding that the President was not a King, but was subject to the law and was required to turn over the evidence of his wrongdoing to the courts. It was a landmark decision for the rule ...
Every day now just seems to bring in more fresh meat for the grinder.In their relentlessly ideological drive to cut back on the “excessive bloat” (as they see it) of the previous Labour-led government, on the mountains of evidence accumulated in such a short period of time do not ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Megan Valére SosouMarket gardening site of the Itchèléré de Itagui agricultural cooperative in Dassa-Zoumè (Image credit: Megan Valère Sossou) For the residents of Dassa-Zoumè, a city in the West African country of Benin, choosing between drinking water and having enough ...
Buzz from the Beehive Melissa Lee – as may be discerned from the screenshot above – has not been demoted for doing something seriously wrong as Minister of ...
Morning in London Mother hugs beloved daughter outside the converted shoe factory in which she is living.Afternoon in London Travelling writer takes himself and his wrist down to A&E, just to be sure. Read more ...
Labour is calling for the Government to urgently rethink its coalition commitment to restart live animal exports, Labour animal welfare spokesperson Rachel Boyack said. ...
Today’s Financial Stability Report has once again highlighted that poverty and deep inequality are political choices - and this Government is choosing to make them worse. ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to do more for our households in most need as unemployment rises and the cost of living crisis endures. ...
Unemployment is on the rise and it’s only going to get worse under this Government, Labour finance spokesperson Barbara Edmonds said. Stats NZ figures show the unemployment rate grew to 4.3 percent in the March quarter from 4 percent in the December quarter. “This is the second rise in unemployment ...
The New Zealand Labour Party welcomes the entering into force of the European Union and New Zealand free trade agreement. This agreement opens the door for a huge increase in trade opportunities with a market of 450 million people who are high value discerning consumers of New Zealand goods and ...
The National-led Government continues its fiscal jiggery pokery with its Pharmac announcement today, Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall says. “The government has increased Pharmac funding but conceded it will only make minimal increases in access to medicine”, said Ayesha Verrall “This is far from the bold promises made to fund ...
This afternoon’s interim Waitangi Tribunal report must be taken seriously as it affects our most vulnerable children, Labour children’s spokesperson Willow-Jean Prime. ...
Te Pāti Māori are demanding the New Zealand Government support an international independent investigation into mass graves that have been uncovered at two hospitals on the Gaza strip, following weeks of assault by Israeli troops. Among the 392 bodies that have been recovered, are children and elderly civilians. Many of ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
Tonight’s court decision to overturn the summons of the Children’s Minister has enabled the Crown to continue making decisions about Māori without evidence, says Te Pāti Māori spokesperson for Children, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “The judicial system has this evening told the nation that this government can do whatever they want when ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
The government's decision to reintroduce Three Strikes is a destructive and ineffective piece of law-making that will only exacerbate an inherently biased and racist criminal justice system, said Te Pāti Māori Justice Spokesperson, Tākuta Ferris, today. During the time Three Strikes was in place in Aotearoa, Māori and Pasifika received ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
Te Pāti Māori is disgusted at the confirmation that hundreds are set to lose their jobs at Oranga Tamariki, and the disestablishment of the Treaty Response Unit. “This act of absolute carelessness and out of touch decision making is committing tamariki to state abuse.” Said Te Pāti Māori Oranga Tamariki ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
Te Pāti Māori co-leader Rawiri Waititi, and Mema Paremata mō Tāmaki-Makaurau, Takutai Tarsh Kemp, will travel to the Gold Coast to strengthen ties with Māori in Australia next week (15-21 April). The visit, in the lead-up to the 9th Australian National Kapa haka Festival, will be an opportunity for both ...
The Green Party has today launched a step-by-step guide to help New Zealanders make their voice heard on the Government’s democracy dodging and anti-environment fast track legislation. ...
New Zealand lost a true legend when internationally renowned disability advocate Sir Robert Martin (KNZM) passed away at his home in Whanganui last night, Disabilities Issues Minister Louise Upston says. “Our Government’s thoughts are with his wife Lynda, family and community, those he has worked with, the disability community in ...
Good evening – Before discussing the challenges and opportunities facing New Zealand’s foreign policy, we’d like to first acknowledge the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. You have contributed to debates about New Zealand foreign policy over a long period of time, and we thank you for hosting us. ...
From today, passengers travelling internationally from Auckland Airport will be able to keep laptops and liquids in their carry-on bags for security screening thanks to new technology, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Creating a more efficient and seamless travel experience is important for holidaymakers and businesses, enabling faster movement through ...
People with an interest in the health of Northland’s marine ecosystems are invited to a public meeting to discuss how to deal with kina barrens, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones will lead the discussion, which will take place on Friday, 10 May, at Awanui Hotel in ...
Kiwi exporters are $100 million better off today with the NZ EU FTA entering into force says Trade Minister Todd McClay. “This is all part of our plan to grow the economy. New Zealand's prosperity depends on international trade, making up 60 per cent of the country’s total economic activity. ...
There are heartening signs that the extractive sector is once again becoming an attractive prospect for investors and a source of economic prosperity for New Zealand, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The beginnings of a resurgence in extractive industries are apparent in media reports of the sector in the past ...
The return of the historic Ō-Rākau battle site to the descendants of those who fought there moved one step closer today with the first reading of Te Pire mō Ō-Rākau, Te Pae o Maumahara / The Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill. The Bill will entrust the 9.7-hectare battle site, five kilometres west ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced 25 new high-speed EV charging hubs along key routes between major urban centres and outlined the Government’s plan to supercharge New Zealand’s EV infrastructure. The hubs will each have several chargers and be capable of charging at least four – and up to 10 ...
The coalition Government will not proceed with the previous Government’s plans to regulate residential property managers, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “I have written to the Chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee to inform him that the Government does not intend to support the Residential Property Managers Bill ...
The Government has announced an independent review into the disability support system funded by the Ministry of Disabled People – Whaikaha. Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston says the review will look at what can be done to strengthen the long-term sustainability of Disability Support Services to provide disabled people and ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith has attended the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva and outlined the Government’s plan to restore law and order. “Speaking to the United Nations Human Rights Council provided us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while responding to issues and ...
The Government and Rotorua Lakes Council are committed to working closely together to end the use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua. Associate Minister of Housing (Social Housing) Tama Potaka says the Government remains committed to ending the long-term use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua by the ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay heads overseas today for high-level trade talks in the Gulf region, and a key OECD meeting in Paris. Mr McClay will travel to Riyadh to meet with counterparts from Saudi Arabia and the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC). “New Zealand’s goods and services exports to the Gulf region ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford has outlined six education priorities to deliver a world-leading education system that sets Kiwi kids up for future success. “I’m putting ambition, achievement and outcomes at the heart of our education system. I want every child to be inspired and engaged in their learning so they ...
The new NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) App is a secure ‘one stop shop’ to provide the services drivers need, Transport Minister Simeon Brown and Digitising Government Minister Judith Collins say. “The NZTA App will enable an easier way for Kiwis to pay for Vehicle Registration and Road User Charges (RUC). ...
Whānau with tamariki growing up in emergency housing motels will be prioritised for social housing starting this week, says Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka. “Giving these whānau a better opportunity to build healthy stable lives for themselves and future generations is an essential part of the Government’s goal of reducing ...
Racing Minister Winston Peters has paid tribute to an icon of the industry with the recent passing of Dave O’Sullivan (OBE). “Our sympathies are with the O’Sullivan family with the sad news of Dave O’Sullivan’s recent passing,” Mr Peters says. “His contribution to racing, initially as a jockey and then ...
Assalaamu alaikum, greetings to you all. Eid Mubarak, everyone! I want to extend my warmest wishes to you and everyone celebrating this joyous occasion. It is a pleasure to be here. I have enjoyed Eid celebrations at Parliament before, but this is my first time joining you as the Minister ...
Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced Pharmac’s largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff. “Access to medicines is a crucial part of many Kiwis’ lives. We’ve committed to a budget allocation of $1.774 billion over four years so Kiwis are ...
Hon Paula Bennett has been appointed as member and chair of the Pharmac board, Associate Health Minister David Seymour announced today. "Pharmac is a critical part of New Zealand's health system and plays a significant role in ensuring that Kiwis have the best possible access to medicines,” says Mr Seymour. ...
Hundreds of New Zealand families affected by Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder (FASD) will benefit from a new Government focus on prevention and treatment, says Health Minister Dr Shane Reti. “We know FASD is a leading cause of preventable intellectual and neurodevelopmental disability in New Zealand,” Dr Reti says. “Every day, ...
Regional Development Minister Shane Jones today attended the official opening of Kaikohe’s new $14.7 million sports complex. “The completion of the Kaikohe Multi Sports Complex is a fantastic achievement for the Far North,” Mr Jones says. “This facility not only fulfils a long-held dream for local athletes, but also creates ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters’ engagements in Türkiye this week underlined the importance of diplomacy to meet growing global challenges. “Returning to the Gallipoli Peninsula to represent New Zealand at Anzac commemorations was a sombre reminder of the critical importance of diplomacy for de-escalating conflicts and easing tensions,” Mr Peters ...
Ambassador Millar, Burgemeester, Vandepitte, Excellencies, military representatives, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen – good morning and welcome to this sacred Anzac Day dawn service. It is an honour to be here on behalf of the Government and people of New Zealand at Buttes New British Cemetery, Polygon Wood – a deeply ...
Distinguished guests - It is an honour to return once again to this site which, as the resting place for so many of our war-dead, has become a sacred place for generations of New Zealanders. Our presence here and at the other special spaces of Gallipoli is made ...
Mai ia tawhiti pamamao, te moana nui a Kiwa, kua tae whakaiti mai matou, ki to koutou papa whenua. No koutou te tapuwae, no matou te tapuwae, kua honoa pumautia. Ko nga toa kua hinga nei, o te Waipounamu, o te Ika a Maui, he okioki tahi me o ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
Overseas models for regulating the oil and gas sector, including their decommissioning regimes, are being carefully scrutinised as a potential template for New Zealand’s own sector, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. The Coalition Government is focused on rebuilding investor confidence in New Zealand’s energy sector as it looks to strengthen ...
Emergency Management and Recovery Minister Mark Mitchell has today released the Report of the Government Inquiry into the response to the North Island Severe Weather Events. “The report shows that New Zealand’s emergency management system is not fit-for-purpose and there are some significant gaps we need to address,” Mr Mitchell ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith is today travelling to Europe where he’ll update the United Nations Human Rights Council on the Government’s work to restore law and order. “Attending the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva provides us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while ...
Associate Agriculture Minister, Mark Patterson, formally reopened the world’s largest wool processing facility today in Awatoto, Napier, following a $50 million rebuild and refurbishment project. “The reopening of this facility will significantly lift the economic opportunities available to New Zealand’s wool sector, which already accounts for 20 per cent of ...
Hon Andrew Bayly, Minister for Small Business and Manufacturing At the Southland Otago Regional Engineering Collective (SOREC) Summit, 18 April, Dunedin Ngā mihi nui, Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Ko Whanganui aho Good Afternoon and thank you for inviting me to open your summit today. I am delighted ...
The Government is delivering on its commitment to bring back the Three Strikes legislation, Associate Justice Minister Nicole McKee announced today. “Our Government is committed to restoring law and order and enforcing appropriate consequences on criminals. We are making it clear that repeat serious violent or sexual offending is not ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has today announced four new diplomatic appointments for New Zealand’s overseas missions. “Our diplomats have a vital role in maintaining and protecting New Zealand’s interests around the world,” Mr Peters says. “I am pleased to announce the appointment of these senior diplomats from the ...
New Zealand is contributing NZ$7 million to support communities affected by severe food insecurity and other urgent humanitarian needs in Ethiopia and Somalia, Foreign Minister Rt Hon Winston Peters announced today. “Over 21 million people are in need of humanitarian assistance across Ethiopia, with a further 6.9 million people ...
Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Paul Goldsmith is congratulating Mataaho Collective for winning the Golden Lion for best participant in the main exhibition at the Venice Biennale. "Congratulations to the Mataaho Collective for winning one of the world's most prestigious art prizes at the Venice Biennale. “It is good ...
The Government is reforming financial services to improve access to home loans and other lending, and strengthen customer protections, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly and Housing Minister Chris Bishop announced today. “Our coalition Government is committed to rebuilding the economy and making life simpler by cutting red tape. We are ...
Sir Robert devoted his life to disability rights after living in institutions in his younger years, says Kaihautū Tika Hauātanga | Disability Rights Commissioner Prudence Walker. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Anastasia Powell, Professor, Family and Sexual Violence, RMIT University Violence against women is not a women’s problem to solve, it is a whole of society problem to solve; and men in particular have to take responsibility. Those were the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jessica Allen, Senior Lecturer in Chemical and Renewable Energy Engineering, University of Newcastle Snapshot freddy/ShutterstockPlans to revive an old coal-fired power station using bioenergy are being considered in the Hunter region of New South Wales. Similar plans for the station ...
Responding to the long-awaited release of judges’ special allowances, including free air travel and hotels for spouses, generous sabbaticals, and access to limousines, Taxpayers’ Union spokesman Alex Murphy said: “In what world does your employer ...
Analysis - The United States has unveiled plans to boost the weapons trade with Australia and the UK, on the same day that Winston Peters is expected to sketch NZ's position on AUKUS. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Andrea Carson, Professor of Political Communication, Department of Politics, Media and Philosophy, La Trobe University Since Australia’s First Nations Voice to Parliament referendum in October 2023, diverse commentaries have sought to explain why it failed. But what does an analysis of media ...
Lawyers representing two iwi as well as the Māori Women’s Welfare League on Wednesday asked the Court of Appeal to overturn last week’s High Court decision on the Waitangi Tribunal’s decision to summons Children’s Minister Karen Chhour. The Tribunal is currently investigating the Government’s decision to repeal section 7AA of ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra The Albanese government will introduce legislation to ban deepfake pornography and provide more funding for the eSafety Commission to pilot age-assurance technologies. The contribution of internet sites to gender-based violence was one major issue ...
Average ordinary time hourly earnings, as measured by the Quarterly Employment Survey (QES), increased 5.2 percent in the year to the March 2024 quarter, according to figures released by Stats NZ today. Annual wage cost inflation, as measured by the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Dimitrios Salampasis, FinTech Capability Lead | Senior Lecturer, Emerging Technologies and FinTech, Swinburne University of Technology Clem Onojeghuo/Unsplash In the digital era, the job market is increasingly becoming a minefield – demanding and difficult to navigate. According to the Australian Bureau ...
As of the March 2024 quarter, we can now look back on 20 years of data related to youth not in employment, education, or training (NEET), as collected by the Household Labour Force Survey (HLFS), according to figures released by Stats NZ today. "The ...
Thousands of workers attended public events in Auckland, Wellington and Christchurch today to celebrate International Workers’ Day (May Day), but union representatives are urging caution and vigilance over the Government’s blatantly "anti-worker" ...
The seasonally adjusted unemployment rate was 4.3 percent in the March 2024 quarter, compared with 4.0 percent in the previous quarter, according to figures released by Stats NZ today. ...
The PSA is warning the Government that the sensitive information of New Zealanders held by various agencies will fall into the wrong hands if the latest round of proposed cuts goes ahead. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Talitha Best, Professor of Psychology, CQUniversity Australia Victoria Rodriguez/Unsplash How do sugar rushes work? – W.H, age nine, from Canberra What a terrific question W.H! Let’s explore this, starting with some of the basics. What is sugar? ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Karinna Saxby, Research Fellow, Melbourne Institute of Applied Economic and Social Research, The University of Melbourne MART PRODUCTION/Pexels Increasing income support could help keep women and children safe according to new work demonstrating strong links between financial insecurity and domestic violence. ...
ANALYSIS:By Olli Hellmann, University of Waikato When New Zealanders commemorate Anzac Day today on April 25, it’s not only to honour the soldiers who lost their lives in World War I and subsequent conflicts, but also to mark a defining event for national identity. The battle of Gallipoli against ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Mark A Gregory, Associate Professor, School of Engineering, RMIT University The telecommunications industry faces a major shakeup following the release of the post-incident report on last November’s 12-hour Optus outage. Telecommunications companies will have to share more information with customers during future ...
Welcome to The Spinoff Bookseller Confessional, in which we get to know Aotearoa’s booksellers. This week: Eden Denyer, bookseller at Unity Books Auckland.Weirdest question/request you’ve had on the shop floorA mother came in looking for anything we might have on Alaskan bison as that was her little boy’s ...
NZCTU Economist Craig Renney said new data released by Statistics New Zealand shows the need for Government to act now, with unemployment rising from 3.4% to 4.3%. ...
The outpouring of anger over Maiki Sherman’s hyperbolic presentation of this week’s ‘nightmare’ poll is itself an overreaction, argues Stewart Sowman-Lund. Politicians love nothing more than to pretend they don’t care about polls. This week, deputy prime minister Winston Peters said he didn’t give a “rat’s derriere” about a TVNZ ...
Asia Pacific Report Ngāti Kahungunu in Aotearoa New Zealand’s Hawkes Bay region has become the first indigenous Māori iwi (tribe) to sign a resolution calling for a “ceasefire in Palestine”, reports Te Ao Māori News. Reporter Te Aniwaniwa Paterson talked to Te Otāne Huata, who has been organising peace rallies ...
By Dale Luma in Port Moresby “We want grants and not concessional loans,” is the crisp message from Papua New Guinea businesses directly affected by the Black Wednesday looting four months ago. The businesses, which lost millions after the January 10 rioting and looting, say they need grants as part ...
Happy May Day. Join a union. Q: What’s worse than a staff break room where the only place to sit and have a cup of tea is on a teetering stack of old pornography magazines? A: Your boss replacing the magazine stacks with chairs that are “heartily encrusted with ...
By Koroi Hawkins, RNZ Pacific editor Former opposition leader Matthew Wale has been announced as the second prime ministerial candidate ahead of the election in Solomon Islands tomorrow. He will face off against former foreign affairs minister Jeremiah Manele, who was announced by the Coalition for National Unity and Transformation ...
We get but one birthday a year – why not make it last as long as possible by scheduling as many meals with friends and family as you can? This is an excerpt from our weekly food newsletter, The Boil Up. How do you celebrate your birthday? Do you celebrate at ...
A Koi Tū discussion paper released today proposes sweeping changes to New Zealand’s media industry. The principal’s key author, Gavin Ellis, explains how journalists have a key role to play in making others value their role in society. This is an abridged version of a piece first published on knightlyviews.com ...
The Government’s spending cuts are again targeting support for Māori with proposed reform of the agency charged with advising on Māori wellbeing and development. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ian Douglas, Honorary Senior Lecturer, UNSW Aviation., UNSW Sydney The history of budget jet airlines in Australia is a long road littered with broken dreams. New entrants have consistently struggled to get a foothold. Low-cost carrier Bonza has just become the industry’s ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rosalind Dixon, Director, Gilbert + Tobin Centre of Public Law, UNSW Sydney Australia is finally having a sustained conversation about violence against women and what we can do about it. It is more than time. Australian women and girls continue to experience ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Stephen Duckett, Honorary Enterprise Professor, School of Population and Global Health, and Department of General Practice and Primary Care, The University of Melbourne stockfour/Shutterstock Preliminary bulk billing data released this week shows a 2.1% rise in bulk billing up to March. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Samantha Schulz, Senior Lecturer, University of Adelaide Australia is once again grappling with how we can stop gendered violence in our country. Protests over the weekend show there is enormous community anger over the number of women who are dying and National ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Martin, Visiting Fellow, Crawford School of Public Policy, Australian National University AnastasiaDudka/Shutterstock What if the government was doing everything it could to stop thieves making off with our money, except the one thing that could really work? That’s how it ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Erin Harrington, Senior Lecturer in English and Cultural Studies, University of Canterbury The Conversation It seems to be a time of old favourites. This month our experts have recommended two new seasons – the second season of Alone Australia (although ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jonti Horner, Professor (Astrophysics), University of Southern Queensland A bright Eta Aquariid meteor photobombed this photo of comet C/2020 F8 (SWAN) in May 2020.Jonti Horner Meteors – commonly known as shooting stars – can be seen on any night of the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tim Flannery, Honorary fellow, The University of Melbourne Shutterstock Current concentrations of carbon dioxide (CO₂) in Earth’s atmosphere are unprecedented in human history. But CO₂ levels today, and those that might occur in coming decades, did occur millions of years ago. ...
Winston Peters has been keen to dismiss speculation on our involvement in Aukus but will give a speech tonight on the direction of our foreign policy, writes Anna Rawhiti-Connell in this excerpt from The Bulletin, The Spinoff’s morning news round-up. To receive The Bulletin in full each weekday, sign up here. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Patrick Usmar, Lecturer in Critical Media Literacies, Auckland University of Technology Getty Images With the coalition government’s ban of student mobile phones in New Zealand schools coming into effect this week, reaction has ranged from the sceptical (kids will just get ...
Hospitals around the country are not allowed to make a single hiring decision without the approval of Te Whatu Ora's head office, including for cleaners and administration staff. ...
A new report on protecting journalism and democracy in New Zealand recommends a levy be charged on global platforms like Facebook and Google to fund media firms undertaking public interest reporting. It also calls for the reinstatement of a powerful Broadcasting Commission to distribute public funding for journalism and other ...
On International Workers' Day, also known as May Day, the New Zealand Council of Trade Unions Te Kauae Kaimahi and the wider union movement are celebrating the proud history of the labour movement during a tough time for working people. ...
From bills to beards, a walk through the former Green co-leader’s time in politics. After close to a decade in politics, James Shaw is preparing to bid farewell to parliament. Tonight will see the former minister deliver his valedictory address, certain to be a speech filled with Shaw’s trademark wit ...
Two months ago, MPs unanimously voted to give themselves a week off in Efeso Collins’ honour. On Tuesday, most were too busy to give even an hour of their time. The day Fa’anānā Efeso Collins died, parliament felt different. In a building that operates at a breakneck pace, everyone stopped ...
India’s election involves hundreds of millions of people and is a months-long affair. Here’s how voting works and what’s at stake.The biggest-ever election in world history started on April 19, with more than 10% of the world’s population eligible to vote. Elections in India, the world’s most populous country ...
Opinion: The impression from the carpark is very inviting. The area is well fenced but barred so there is easy visibility of loved ones. Inside, the spaces are welcoming and clean and staff are friendly and clearly comfortable. I am greeted by ‘Kim’. She has worked here for three years, ...
After the Christchurch earthquake, the then-national civil defence boss compared his experience to “putting a team on the rugby field who have never ever played together before”. Now, eight years later – and following a damning inquiry into the emergency response of cyclones Gabrielle, Hale and the Auckland anniversary weekend floods – ...
“I had just come off the end of a major robbery case which I had been working on for six months when I got a call on the afternoon of September 1, 1992, that some remains had been found at a building site in Devonport, so I drove over with ...
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sigh two of my colleagues received freshly minted 90 day notices yesterday… Landlords selling up due to changes…. I guess the changes are having the desired effect not so good for solo mums thrust back into the exploding rental market…
Oh no, how incredibly frightening for all of them. I really hope they find somewhere that is at a minimum safe for the kids.
Yeah its not alot of fun… effects schooling as well end up having to look in the same zone… expensive to time off… moving costs… finding bond… tenancy services is running behind on bond refunds by the sounds…
Pretty worried for one of them piles more shit on…
Hoping but not holding my breath that govt will move quickly to help renters… to my mind if you make renters rights really strong you deflate the market anyway… would put anyone in it for the short term off…
Unfortunately there will be a few landlords that decide to cash up now which was always going to happen as an unintended consequence. I fear these announcements may not be good for renters as rents will increase. Hopefully your colleagues can find another place but there is a shortage of rental places in many areas, thus the problem we have.
I actually have a nice landlord story. A friend of mine the landlord has cut down 2 big trees, cost 8k so the homes are warmer. Landlord said he was not selling.
Usually when costly land shaping is done either selling or a rent rise is in the horizon.
I do have nosy extractor fan issues 24/7 where I live due to a house divided into 3 tenancies with 6 people. Loud footsteps and doors banging can also annoy me and keep me up or wake me up.
The rental market is so tight and I have had the experience of the landlord selling and needing to move out. I had the last laugh they sold for 200k 4 1/2 years ago and the place is now worth 400k.
Some landlords might find the price of their home dropping. I do give a thought to those struggling to pay the rent and this cannot continue.
Home work for spelling. Noisy not nosy and on the horizon not in. Any other spelling errors not picked up.
I do also think it is a good sign if landlords are selling up(although very sorry for your friends). Hopefully too many who thought they would buy property to invest, changing their minds…
How are landlords selling good? Those who rent and will never be able to buy where do they go ? Perhaps into the waiting list for a HNZ property and with the demand there. With obvious outcomes where is the govts action on coping with the consequences? A plan to build more in the future. When and what if those living in the present ???!
Thereon lies the big flaw in the govts announcement, it may slow house price inflation which has runaway but they did nothing to help renters at the same time… once again its help for the upwardly mobile.
Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…
Something like this from Switzerland perhaps…
Tenants have the right to know the grounds for termination. Notices of termination not made in good faith (such as notice of termination because the landlord is exercising his landlord's right, or on account of the tenants' changed family circumstances) may be contested before the conciliation authority. The official notice form explains how tenants should proceed when disputing a termination.
If the termination is likely to cause undue hardship for the tenants (financial or family difficulties, housing shortage), an extension of the term of the tenancy may be applied for at the conciliation authority.
The other oversight I would add that in Feb 21 the average property in me rose $50,000 and our leaders talk of substainable price rises going forward 🤷♀️. Not of the damage done in recent times.
I am yet to read anything or contributor here as to what this country looks like in 3,5+ years . IMO that outlook would frustrate many . As J Ritren sang “ no future, no future for me ..”
well done to the govt for being seen to do something but deliver crap all.
I think you mean J. Rotten or Johnny Rotten.
"Further stiffening the rights of renters particularly around giving notice needed to be part of the package…"
cough… rent freeze for 24 months…cough cough
"How are landlords selling good?"
Couple of ways….if the property was being held empty for capital gain it adds to the available stock….if the property was being used as an AirBnB, it adds to available stock.
If future rental stock is available at a lower price the pressure to reduce rents is increased, but most important of all, the realisation that property values are no longer a one way bet will bring some sanity back to the housing market and allow us to use housing as it should be….to house our population, not as a credit line for the few who seek to extract wealth from the many (and the broader economy)
There is no point in investors s buying property for a capital gain if there is no (or a CPI equivalent) capital gain….that capital will seek a new home, especially if they see their existing gains disappearing in a falling market.
In short, investors selling is a symptom of changed expectations….and that is beneficial to both FHB AND renters.
Has extending the brightline test and cutting the tax reduction on interest turned into a house being like a car sitting in the garage for years not knowing what you can sell it for?
The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller.
Id suggest what the extended BL test and (especially) the change to interest deductibility have done is increase the costs to investors while they wait for the capital gain…it is a signal that if you are investing in existing property for capital gain then we are going to make it hard for you…especially when aligned with the exemption for new builds….that makes the business model for many investors, especially recent investors who have paid high prices, unworkable.
There are pretty much two questions that we are waiting to see the answer to….how many investment properties will re enter the market?…and will the Government stick to its position, or will they soften their message?
Or put another way, who will blink first.
"The housing market hopefully is going to cool by 10%. This is advantageous to everyone BUT the seller."
Dont think anyone can put a percentage on it…there are too many variables, but the sellers will not necessarily lose …if you bought your rental say 6 years ago and you sell now you take out that capital gain of around maybe 60-80% (median house 2014 $457000—median house price 2020 $725000) and not subject to BL….not a bad return Id suggest.
Hopefully the latest changes put a brake on property investors who only buy to sell due to house prices rocketing.
Government cannot soften their message because nothing else has worked. It's a vicious cycle as renters now need more government assistance to pay the rent and landlords know this.
1. How to support people to pay the rent without it going into the landlords hand is what needs to be actioned?
2. Some sort of tier percentage system on when the rental was purchased and how much the rent can increase?
Rent caps or other forms of rent control are another option but I suspect that would only be used if there is widespread rent hikes….and as noted yesterday many landlords have already had their annual shot at rent hikes so they cant till the years is up….I dont think many of them will wait until next year to decide what to do.
I think that, before evicting a tenant or increasing his rent, a landlord should be required to apply to Kainga Ora for a review of the situation to determine whether the eviction/rent increase would be justified. I would regard the recovery of the no longer deductible interest as not constituting an adequate reason for either action.
I’ve always wondered about banning tenders in the sale process. It creates a lot of anxiety which I reckon drives up the selling price as FOMO pushes people to put in bids way above the estimated value
Auctions are where the FOMO is most powerful, agents generally prefer them for that reason.
Auctions get the second best price (the winner only has to outbid the second best bid not bid with their top offer). Tenders means the seller gets the best price because everyone has to put in their best offer.
And this morning the deputy PM had fuelled the fire by “not ruling out rent freezes”. So what will landlords do … hike the rents as much as they can in the meantime to kick off any rent controls from a higher base.
However the deputy PMs credibility went from hero to zero this week so maybe we can just ignore him and carry on.
Maybe you can….and maybe you cant, how much are you willing to bet?
The investors have been offered a generous exit package, will enough of them take it or will they let greed cloud their thinking?
"investors have been offered a generous exit package"
Indeed – they get to keep the extraordinary wealth passively accumulated at the expense of others (including future generations) over the last two decades – minus a short blip post-GFC. Does anyone dare to go after some of this deplorable stash with a wealth tax – maybe to help fund a large state house building programme?
Whats immediately more important?….giving working Kiwis somewhere affordable to live or retribution?….Id plump for the former.
The state house building programme is underway and its acceleration is not immediately constrained by tax take.
The wealth accumulated in the last couple of decades is going to perpetuate unequal access to housing into the next generation through inheritance. I don't see it as retribution so much as correcting market perversity and returning to a slightly more level playing field. I do agree though that the primary purpose of a wealth tax is not raising revenue and that state house building is not tax take-constrained.
"…so maybe we can just …"
Who is this we you speak of?
Not entirely sure how say 5 separate people being forced out of a flat due to rent rises from this, for the sake of one of the few couples left, who manage to buy the flat as a home helps the 5 separate people find more affordable flats, when there are obviously less of them and the sudden demand, means the rent will just go up even more.
People to me seem to forget some people will just never be able to afford to own a house, and have to rent.
All this does is screw them.
I dont forget that at all…and is why property prices (and consequently rents) need to fall to affordable levels….10+ times median income is not that.
"But she said there were warning signs beneath the surface and many people were still doing it tough. More than a third were still living “payday to payday”.
“We know we are not out of the woods yet, there are more Covid-19 effects to roll through the economy and this research highlights some concerns. The fact that more than a third of people have less than a single week’s expenses available to them and almost half have less than $1000 in rainy day savings rings alarm bells for me. This puts them in a potentially vulnerable position."
https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/300262937/new-zealanders-mostly-better-off-but-some-doing-it-tough-bank-says
Coincidentally roughly a third of the population rent….reckon any more blood can be wrung out of that stone?
Well yes.
There are going to be people selling flats to couples (or other investers who sit on them for 10 years) or raising rents, to cover it, which means less flats available, which means even higher rent prices.
You can argue all you like the rents will be too high for people to cover it, but this just means more people joing the state housing waiting list, which is getting immense.
If first home buyers buy the properties landlords selll …
I always love this argument. If they coulda, they woulda…but they haven’t so they probably won’t
You mean if they coulda outbid an investor with their previously inherent advantage….lets see what happens now the competition is eased.
Assuming of course they have the deposit which is where I suspect the biggest issue lies.
Whether you think it is a good use or not Kiwisaver has provided assistance for many in that space….not all granted, but enough
For your info Pat these investors still have an advantage – Rates, maintenance etc are still able to be deducted for a reduction of tax and still allows a cash back advantage.
And what many have not understood these recent increases in price also distance new home purchasers with an increase of an already substantial deposit required. In feb the average price of a property increased by $50,000 a 20% deposit means that these 1st Home buyers in 28 days now required another $10,000 in deposit, and think what the impact of the increases that were achieved pre Feb 21??
And all of that explains why prices must fall or we consign home ownership in NZ to the dustbin.(and the likely exodus of our youth offshore….again)
The Gov have been bolder than I initially thought with this package and appear willing to accept a fall in property prices although they havnt explicitly said so…my guess is they would be happy for them to revert to what they were around a year ago ….good luck controlling the decline, theyll probably be the first in history if they pull it off, but at least theyre trying.
That will be a sure fire voter winner for the 65% of the population who don’t rent.
I dont rent but some of my children do, so do some of my friends and who knows circumstances may decide that one day I will….why is it so difficult to understand that peoples motives are not necessarily self serving?
This economic model is destroying everything that was best about this country/society so you may find that many of that 65% are quite happy for the 10% of the population who are investors to lose their gravy train…especially when it is wrecking their communities
Sorry, my estimate of property investors was woefully inaccurate….the 0.03% of the population who are property investors
I can imagine the election proposition – vote labour, let’s get house prices falling. Sure to be a winner.
zero point zero three percent….thats one hell of a constituency
Oh dear Pat, you said in an earlier post Labour are being bold to be the first government in history to accept a fall in house prices.
That affects the 65% who own, not just the 0.3% who invest! Sure to go down well with voters.
My house value could fall 50% tomorrow and I wouldnt care, nor would my mother if hers did similarly, 50% may cause a problem for one of my children but theyd survive….dont forget roughly a third of properties in NZ are mortgage free.
So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?
Correction on my correction….3% or roughly 150,000 property investors.
Yeah yeah. But you still didn’t answer the question. Guess you can’t or don’t want to.
It’s a beautiful afternoon, certainly up here on the Kaipara. I’ll let you get back to the vino.
"So to clarify, do house price falls only affect 0.3% of the population as you claim Pat?"
Obviously not, and the size of the fall will be determinant however you were asking about how voters would view house price falls and I gave you a couple of voters perspectives.
While there are potential downsides to property price falls there are also upsides so what is the net position?…not just for individuals but the economy as a whole.
And if the expectation is the current trajectory is unsustainable then the correction will happen anyway….and the greater the debt the bigger the impact when it does.
Some pain today or lots of pain tomorrow?
I know every investors thinks they will be out before that happens but history shows most mistime it.
Actually David I know of many many fhb who have the deposit, but keep missing out due to investors. They will now have far less competition and will be able to secure their own first home.
What I don't get about investors bleating on about interest payments no longer being tax deductable is that any good business person who took out a loan at record low interest rates should have forecasted in a potential for interest rates to increase substantially, or even for the govt to make interest no longer tax deductable. Any person with half a brain who is investing should have factored that in.. They took the risk, things change, too bad.
And yes bring on a rent freeze. Or even better a national rent strike.
A national rent strike … sounds awesome…that would solve all the issues.
Sounds awesome – that could highlight/solve a lot of issues.
Glad you agree David. I see your time on the Standard is teaching you some things! Keep it up!
Perfect. Now we just need to work on our protest song. Here’s a starter for 10. With the brainpower here though I’m sure we can improve on it:
2, 4, 6, 8
we don’t want to pay our bills in a commy state
what do we want?
a free ride
when do we want it?
now
Nice one David – cue the dancing Cossacks. Tbh, I don't know what Muldoon was so het up about. National governments always 'transfer' public assets into private hands – it's what they do.
One 'problem' facing a fairly sizable minority of NZ citizens is the inability to pay for the necessities of life, wouldn't you agree? Maybe inequality in NZ has gone a little too far…
Wrong target David. It is land speculators who have been getting a free ride at the expense of tenants, people who need a home and those of us who do pay taxes.
"Communism" is fine when they benefit, it seems.
If we all end up paying much higher interest rates, it will be because of their borrowing also.
Goodness me, a traitor in our midst!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/124674099/spies-catch-out-new-zealander-working-for-a-foreign-intelligence-agency
A foreign plot revealed coincidentally when the SIS is trying to deflect criticism and expand their surveillance powers? Must be legit.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/439030/sis-expansion-of-data-mining-powers-not-off-the-cards-andrew-little
Coincidentally, they released their Annual Report on Friday in which that information was made available to the public. Have you read the report? The photos of pristine New Zealand nature wouldn’t go amiss in a NZ Travel & Tourism brochure or a publication by DOC, all super-neutral, of course.
“… a traitor in our midst!”
What a surprise. Never happened before?
lightbulb moment:
I know the identities of two NZers (maybe three) who were working for a 'foreign agency' in the 1970s and 1980s. They infiltrated the NZ Labour Party. Since the country concerned was a close geographical ally I guess that was alright. They could do what they liked and harass whoever they liked.
@ Sanctuary (3) ' … a traitor in our midst.' Must have gone full time since quitting politics.
Please don’t even go there, thanks. Some other commenter might be stupid enough to put this site at risk and that would be a real shame, don’t you agree?
@ Incognito (3.3.1) … noted.
He is the Very Model of a Modern Major-General
Prince Harry, AKA "The Big H", that scourge of Afghani shepherds, is obviously not the only "piece of work" in the British Army….
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-dorset-56524730
Connoisseurs of low-level British military scumbaggery might also like to check out the following…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Ingram
Arguably the peers of Major General Welch are far far harsher than any peer of any current UK MP…
“emergency department struggles were symptomatic of the struggles the whole health system is facing.”
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/full-corridors-overworked-staff-an-eye-opener-for-ed-visitor/T67VDH3XGPT6NTUSMWPTPTH6JI/
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/code-black-at-dunedin-hospital-avoid-ed-if-possible/57SUM4GFWY73NWFJUO2HC5EFVA/
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/southern-district-health-board-restricts-surgeries-as-bed-demand-soars/3PPEK6PRGYWX2PKMVNY52ZA664/
So why is this happening, all over the country it seems?
It its not just short staffed, it is arrivals at hospital for treatment have vastly increased – especially for this time of the year.
Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?
Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ?
Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?
What is the root cause ?
The roots are rotten and as every gardener knows that will cause a plant to go limp and die.
The A & E model needs to change so serious cases are triaged and a separate clinic run like a GP clinic adjacent to the premises. Fully staffed GP clinics need to run over the weekend at no extra cost.
More doctors and nurses are required. A shortage of specialists as well.
Had a chat with a senior ED nurse.
There needs to be a change in the way health care is delivered.
When someone is referred to ED/clinic etc the next steps must be available at the same time. eg Cat/MRI scan, Xray, dietician/nutrionist, mental health…
Folk often struggle to take that morning/afternoon/hour off as it is without scheduling further engagements.
I do like your answers at 5.3, gsays; enough so that I won't spoil them by replying directly.
But another cause behind the ED bottleneck is the drain of nurses to MIQ, vaccination, and more rewarding private work. Public health work conditions, in Dunedin hospital at least, are apparently pretty grim at the best of times for them.
How is vaccination ”another cause behind the ED bottleneck”?
The 2 ED nurses I know that are/were doing the MIQ stuff, where either working in Oz (clinic work in a remote town) or looking to exit health and grow their small dingo/digger truck business.
Both have talked about dismay with junior/inexperienced staff, cultural politics and being too busy, too often.
From my one step removed position I would answer:
“Is it the same cause as the housing crises we have and clogged up Auckland streets – ie far too many new immigrants have been allowed into NZ over the last 20 years ?”"
A lot of the aforementioned immigrants, are staffing the wards and EDs. This may influence the militancy/stauchness of the workforce, therefore the nursing unions.
“Is it the Baby Boomer generation aging ? ”
Yes, along with increased presentations of folk who cant afford to see a GP, drug seekers, alcohol impaired, mental ill health, entitlitis etc.
“Have we not been training enough of our own nurses and doctors?”
Yes. Nor do we pay them well enough.
“What is the root cause ?”
Neo-liberalism. Letting a market decide. When your DHB has a Chief Executive Officer as the highest paid on the payroll, its a sign of the times.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/business/439237/letters-mocking-struggling-queenstown-businesses-shock-recipients
A random meeting between the self-centred driven entrepreneurs being lauded in this country, trying hard to acquire enough custom from those with spare everything, and someone who has to count the pennies to get near that lifestyle and resents being pushed to the fringes.
And this is just a light touch on the cheek from the group finding social mobility difficult to achieve, tantalisingly available and then removed, perhaps in the 'gig' economy, or regularly denied and facing deprivation. Below such people are a mass who are at their wit's end, lacking wit for some time actually, becoming hopeless, munted, angry and holding in vengeful thoughts, just.
I saw this while looking for a source of retirement income apart from the traditional residential property, exchange traded shares, funds and fixed interest.
"We’re on a mission to simplify investment into high growth Kiwi companies.
"We want to make the capital market work much more efficiently for growth companies, so they can focus on selling their products to the world. We want to provide investors with a simple way to gain exposure to interesting investment opportunities – facilitating the flow of national savings into wealth-creating assets.
We’re driven by the significant positive impact we can make by building a thriving marketplace to connect growth companies with the capital they need.
Along the way we hope to develop the general financial literacy of the New Zealand public, and bring far more meaning and excitement to investing."
https://www.snowballeffect.co.nz/about
There's no cancel culture, right?
https://twitter.com/Miroandrej/status/1375147768348557324
https://twitter.com/Miroandrej/status/1375147785750724609
This shit should be a massive red flag for the left. Actually for everyone. Next time you see a woman being told that no-one is stopping them from speaking about their reality, understand that this is what is now routine in academia and has been increasing for quite some time. In another decade we, women, will have lost our ability to academic freedom around our own realities, and it's not like we were in a great place to begin with. And it won't end with women.
Stories here:
https://www.gcacademianetwork.org
and this. Women students are being marked down for writing that feminism is about the liberation of women.
https://twitter.com/RoisinMartin14/status/1375397369722908676
Looks to me like "cancel culture" now excuses getting lower marks for not keeping up with the subject area or lecturer's expectations.
No McFlook, it looks like cancel culture to me. And it pisses me off because it is cancelling the existence of the women's liberation movement and menstruating at the very least.
“I was encouraged to abandon about the problems menstruation posed ……..because it was deemed trans exclusionary.”
I would be interested to hear you views on what I have written below.
Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently.
As for your comments below, one doesn't have to be male to perv at women, so it's not as if self-id would automatically stop police or anyone else objecting to someone behaving objectionably.
And no, zoom-calling in a conference room isn't "kosher". It might even be a criminal offence (intimate visual recording).
btw, I’ll be offline for several hours very soon – I should have held off rather than getting into a discussion.
Actually McFlook you are discounting my concerns about having men who id as women in changing rooms with your glib comment about “One doesn’t have to be a man to perv at women”. I am sure I have shared many a changing room with lesbians (guess that’s who you are referring to) and I have never felt uncomfortable about any women’s behaviour in a change room. I have also NEVER heard of police being called to women’s objectionable behaviour towards other women in a change room. It is a completely different dynamic with a man. Also women often walk around without towels etc in a change room. If gender self id “women” who were really men did this it would be very unpleasant. Surely you have heard about flashers. But how could it be proved “she” just walking from the shower to “her” locker.
I think women will feel really concerned about this, even if you men can’t imagine how that will be for a women. You have never lived with the unwanted male gaze. Have you not read the paper about how many time men have been filming women in bathrooms changerooms etc????
I meant that, as far as I know, literally every law in NZ against indecent acts or offensive behaviour, indecent assault or sexual violation, or crimes against personal privacy uses non-gendered language.
As for flashing in the changing rooms, sure, the possibilities for human stupidity are limitless. Some non-trans guy might try it. How do you see that conversation with the cops or changing room staff going down, realistically?
Flashing in a public change room human stupidity????? WTF McFlook. That jut tells me you know nothing about what it is like being a women. Your o.k. for men who have changed their gender to do these things and of course the police/change room staff with make it o.k………..Think by this stage the horse has bolted. If the "woman" acts like other women in the change rooms, then there will be nothing that can be done about it. All they have to do is walk from the shower to their locker without a towel with or without an erection and they are women right? Police could probably say wear a towel mate, but can't enforce.
Thinking that self-id will avoid any repercussion is the stupidity part of it.
So we have a flasher of the subtle breed who are acting completely normally without eye contact to see what reaction they're getting? Ok, not the usual type I've had to call the cops over back in the day, but ok. Assuming there is nothing, nothing, to show dodgy intent, they can still be barred by the facility because of their behaviour, because it makes other people uncomfortable.
Point is McFlook, I don't want men in women's changing rooms. Full stop. Most women I have run this by feel the same.
I understand you side with the gender self id bill/trans rights side. Yours entitled to your opinion. But I don't think your opinion on how its going to operate in women's changing rooms has any merit. It can't have. You have never been in one (I hope except maybe when you were a child).
I didn't need to go into the women's room to control access, catch flashers, or see how people dealt with men who thought they were discriminated against because they weren’t allowed to run for women's rep positions.
The idea that self-id makes facilities management and the police powerless to deal with offensive behaviour just isn't reflected in the real world.
But transwomen being unsafe in one changing room and unwelcome in the other? That is reflected in the real world.
"Most academic institutions have an appeals process if someone feels they have been penalised unfairly or inconsistently."
This tells me that you have no idea what is actually going on. Academics are afraid to speak out. This isn't hyperbole. The ones that do get their office doors pissed on, they get rape and death threats, they lose their careers. The women more than the men of course. To suggest that in this environment an appeals process is going to be useful other than as a political act is incredibly naive.
What’s happening on the left is the dismissal and the position that there is no debate, so there is no way for the issues to be aired and resolved. That too should be a big fucking red flag for the left. It’s not like the left is immune to authoritarianism.
It's a bit unfair to post links about getting marked down in assignments and then argue that anyone who responds should be responding to unmentioned but more serious complaints.
Try writing a paper about a steady-state model of the universe sometime (as opposed to "Big Bang" theory), and see how that gets marked.
good to know you are ok with academia redefining feminism to mean a liberation movement for all people and educating its students to that effect against the wishes of many feminists including MA students.
I mean, it's always enlightening when men give away women's rights. Again. Maybe try putting up some actual arguments, I'd love to know where this goes. Feminist academics are raising the issue, and men are going, yeah, nah, nothing to worry about there.
Thanks again Weka. Yes I feel people are not really aware of what's going on re this issue.
Academic concepts and even disciplines get "redefined" every day. It's called "expanding the sum of human knowledge".
And in this case it's also according to the wishes of many women, and not only trans women at that.
When you can not conduct a study on women (biological or trans) and you can not discuss the impact of menstruation and menstruation products when in this country we have young vaginal beings not going to school for lack of menstruation products (and maybe there even is a trans boy or five in the group ) then academia is getting dumb, and discriminatory. Cause women who identify as women and would like to get treated as such exist. And we too would like to be identified as to our on self ID. And we would like our rights, and our safety taken seriously, cause we die the world over often at the hand of penis humans.
And i would just venture a guess that you have never refused an outing or been refused a promotion a job or such on the grounds that you may get your period, or that you may get pregnant, or that you may have given birth, or that you may have lost a pregnancy.
So really please, take your male privilege and ask yourself why women who identify as women, who were born as women, who have born literally every man that is, need to take what little rights we have gained over the last hundred years and give it up to accomodate and be surplanted by trans women. Cause the discussion is only affecting women.
No, it really isn't. Not according to the opponents of self-id, anyway.
Is this a discussion about a seat of the table and only 10 seats are there, so one needs to be knocked of to free up a seat? Or will this be a discussion about finding another seat and adding it the table?
Hear hear Sabine. Totally agree. Great stuff!
McFlook then what do you see as the solution for trans women in changing rooms? What if women aren't comfortable with this?
Every concern and reservation I have have had about the gender self id bill you have dismissed. It sounds like you think women like me and there are many of us should put up and shut up. Is this how you see it?
You can see why as feminists it is a double problem for us. A. Maybe we don't want trans women in our change rooms. B. Men such as yourself seem to be dismissing this.
You also didn't answer whether you though it was a credible scenario that men would change their sex to have easy access to women and children. Is that o.k. by you because we can ring the police?
1: Trans women already use womens' changing rooms.
2: I have also listened to other non-trans women who disagree with your position. And trans women, and trans men. I suspect that you are, as they say, "on the wrong side of history", and quite possibly the legislation will change within months, regardless of any arguments here.
3: Some feminists and non-trans women agree with you. Others disagree with you. There does not seem to be any middle ground on this issue.
4: "Credible"? 2.5 million men, sure. Someone might try changing their birth certificate as an excuse to get unchallenged access to women and children. Will it work? Significantly less likely. Will it result in greater harm than if 50,000-odd trans people are policed about which changing rooms they go into regardless of birth certificate, not even including instances of non-trans women being challenged because they don't conform to feminine norms? I don't think so. That's why I have the position I have.
“Being on the wrong side of history” would never stop me from supporting a cause I believe in. Standing up for women’s rights is not something I d we oils drop because I might be on the wrong side of history.
but thanks to discussion on this blog and to you I have become better informed. What I have discovered about these issues worries me more. How debate/women’s voices are being silenced. Only this weekend gone at the pride event in Wellington a woman who is a lesbian who has terminal cancer was on a stall at the event. She left the stall briefly to take scissors and tape to a group of “reefs” in this case elderly lesbians who had been banned from pride who were protesting outside. In trying to re-gain entry 4 organisers including a very large male person intercepted her, accused her of carrying an offensive weapon. She still had her bag at the stall. She stood up to them and refused to budge. They man handled her and called the police. These older women have fought the good fight for lesbian and gay rights. What sort of treatment is this? Young people gathered and started chanting fucking terfs. An aggressive and vocal minority is shutting women’s. Voices down
Btw in the last week two cases of trans being barred from women’s changing rooms
Is that generational divide typical of your observations of the different sides to the issue?
It seems to be the case down here, but a heavily thespian social group in a college town is the practical definition of "sample bias".
Yes I think that is reasonably accurate, i.e. a generation divide.
Having read a bit more about it i.e. trans issues, I understand and feel free to disagree, that a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm. They also experience gender dysphoria. An approach that has been encouraged with their parents is to validate their wanting to be a different sex. This started to occur 20 years ago and so now we have a generation of young people who identify as trans. This I don't believe has ever happened before. From this point of view I acknowledge how very vulnerable some of these individuals must feel.
My perspective is a rigorous radical campaign has been mounted for trans rights, including the right to say there are real women. My understanding is if this is challenged is it vociferously, aggressively shot down. I think there is an enormous amount of solidarity in numbers group think going on.
I noticed McFlook that someone accused you of mysogeny and others implied as a man you shouldn't be taking about this issue. But I don't want to stop you from doing this, because this is a part of what I am objecting to with the trans activists. People have their voices shot down/cancelled.
other mental health issues
You are still denying that trans is actually a thing. A while ago i said that i see this as where the gay thing was forty years ago. Back then there was still a lot of people who saw being gay as a mental illness. Now when people say that they are not taken seriously, they are considered bigots. So yes the wrong side of history you are on this i think also.
It is not surprising that trans people experience mental health issues with so many people denying their identity is real:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/health/115867340/kiwi-transgender-and-nonbinary-people-at-higher-risk-of-suicide–survey
Cheers – the accusation did give me pause for thought, but that's usually a good thing.
The issue of trans kids and their mental health has a fair bit of research, which is why validation starts early. The main worry is suicide and depression. But are these comorbidities, or are they the consequences of social responses to how trans people are treated by society? When social discrimination is killing people, there's a strong campaign for rights for those people. And trans people have been part of the queer rights movement all the way back to before Stonewall.
I have friends with trans kids (in both directions). The kids and young adults seem to be happier now than my peers from back at the same age who have since transitioned. But also the young thesps just seem more fluid and accepting of themselves and each other, by and large. Still dramas (natch lol), but less judgy of each other's bits and more willing to stand up for each other (although they still have the young person thing of going overboard without thinking, maybe like in responding to that protest you mentioned).
The babies my friends had in their early twenties are leaving/left the nest. They generally seem to be better people than I was (and many of my peer group) at that age.
you are entitled to think it like where the gay thing was forty years ago. I accept that is your view. I see it differently. Gay people were not telling me they were really heterosexual nor were they deconstructing my identity, eg referring to me as a person who f…Ed men.
I was still a heterosexual woman.
I don’t believe I have ever been anything but pleasant and respectful when I have met trans people. You then accused me of being disrespectful about them on-line, but when challenged didn’t provide any evidence that I had been. I did a check with Mc flook who said I hadn’t been.
I am still reading and finding out about this stuff.
I am a feminist and hearing things about elderly lesbians being banned from pride, because they are not prepared to say trans women (not those who have transitioned) are real women. Said women who have been attending pride since it began don’t deserve to have 100 or so young people chanting fucking terfs at them.
there was a woman who happens to have terminal cancer who was staffing a stall at pride. She went out to give the protesters some tape and scissors for their banner, and when she went to go back in 4 people including a large man tried to man handle her out of the venue. She stood her ground and so they called the police. Utterly disgraceful in my opinion. Also because she had scissors caused her of carrying an offensive weapon. I mean ffs. This is disgraceful. She told them she had cancer.
I accept mental health issues are significant in the trans community. I did comment that they were vulnerable. Btw, I do have a criticism of the study. It really needed to have a control group of non trans young people, rather than extrapolating from other studies.
I still think we need to look at the Dunedin multi disciplinary study for gold standard research on this issue.
It only has a thousand participants, so at 1%, that's 10 trans people to do the heavy lifting?
Surveying trans people and comparing their responses with previous and more general surveys might be the spanner for that job, rather than the dunedin study.
Can't see anything searching their journal publications database. But if you see an article you don't have access to, we might be able to sort something out between us. I could remember how to use dropbox, or flip email it to a mod and they can flip it to you, if willing. There's also an openaccess research site somewhere (like pirating movies, but for academic research because journals cost $$$).
@Anker
I am not sure that you read the words you write.
You said:
a lot of the children who identify as trans have other mental health issues such as anorexia and self harm.
That can only be taken to mean that you consider being trans to be a mental health issue. If that is not what you meant then why say "other"? You say offensive things and then complain when people are offended.
sorry for the confusion Solkta.
DSMV1 talks about gender dysphoria. and I assume that many Trans people have gender dysphoria. This would cause psychological distress.
I don't deny trans is a thing. Checked out some trans activist blog sites tonight as I was trying to become more informed.
When I trained it was called Gender Identity disorder.
You seem to want to cast me as anti trans. This is not true. I don't really care too much. But I do care about how women's voices are being shut down and how my identity as a women is being de-constructed.
Would it help if we (again) re-acquainted ourselves with the meanings of the words "sex" and "gender"?
SUFW prefers (and why not?) the United Nations' definitions….
…it is our recommendation that New Zealand policy makers adopt definitions set up by United Nations Equality Glossary (2017). In particular, we suggest the following:
Sex (biological sex)
The physical and biological characteristics that distinguish males and females.
Gender
Gender refers to the roles, behaviours, activities, and attributes that a given society at a given time considers appropriate for men and women. In addition to the social attributes and opportunities associated with being male and female and the relationships between women and men and girls and boys, gender also refers to the relations between women and those between men. These attributes, opportunities and relationships are socially constructed and are learned through socialisation processes. They are context/time-specific and changeable. Gender determines what is expected, allowed and valued in a woman or a man in a given context.
Sex, what you were born with, is forever. It can't be changed.
It is possible with a great deal of medical and surgical intervention to alter one's appearance so as to look like the other sex, but you'll still be the sex you were born with.
Gender, on the other hand, has forever been whatever society/culture/fashion tries to dictate. Today it is possible to express yourself in whatever way floats your boat. Good on you.
But just because you dislike wearing frocks and would not be seen dead in stilettos,and putting on make-up seems like an act of dishonesty, it does not necessarily follow that you were 'born into the wrong body'.
Today, and because many women have fought long and hard to throw of the shackles of what we used to term 'sex-role-stereotypes', you can be yourself without have to resort to extreme medical and surgical interventions.
What The Bill intends is to make the impossible…changing one's sex…possible.
If you had any insight into how the women reading this are assessing you I'm sure you would be horrified. But honestly you clearly have no idea and little insight. It's good really seeing frank misogyny laid bare. Dissolves any illusion we can't unsee it either.
Given some of those individual's expressed opinions of trans women and many academics of any gender, I would seem to be in good company.
Having done an English degree a little over a decade ago, I ran across a little of this. Our feedback system had no box for us to object to it – but I felt it was a gratuitously offensive waste of time at my and other students' expense. If I'd wanted to do gender wars, I'd've taken a course in it – my expectations were literary, a bit of Trollope maybe. No surprise that the humanities have been obliged to downsize.
Thanks Weka for posting this. We need to speak up about this sort of shit.
I commented last week about the gender self id bill and have written to the Minister about this.
Our identity as women is being deconstructed. I read today that the term maternity care and being a mother is being challenged as the language needs to be more inclusive. As is not just women giving birth.
I have been thinking about how sexist this is. I don't know of the equivalent i.d men being referred to as people who get erections or people who ejaculate. Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
My go to for the best information is the Dunedin Multidisciplinary study. I say this because it is a prospective study that measures health and social outcomes. I would be interested to know what the rates of trans people there are in this cohort who are now in their 40s. Unfortunately I. have not been able to find out about whether that has been published or not. I suspect the rate is extremely low.
I am also objecting to the term Terf. When one group (trans activists) give another group a pejoritive label then it is deeply problematic to say the least.
More on this, I commented last week about the gender self id bill and some people poo pooed what I said.
Anybody dare to tell me that it is fanciful to imagine a scenario where sex offenders (and other men who might want to film women changing or peeing but don't have a criminal recored), change their gender to become a women. Then merrily waltz in to changing rooms at gyms, pools, woman's stores etc. They are free to perv at women and girls, free to expose themselves to women. And then when women call the cops, the cops can only say, sorry but he is a woman. This week alone there appears to be some sort of fracas with a "person" who had the body of a man being restrained by cops because of some incident in Glasons. There was also a report about David Farrar (yes I know I have no time for him) but he was in a male change room at the gym and some goof was on a zoom conference call. Farrar wasn't sure whether it was kosher or not
Yet there is an attempt to describe women as menstruaters or birthing units, or people with vaginas.
This language more about the contrary; some NB and trans-men are people with vaginas and menstruate.
As for the t-word:
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/nov/29/im-credited-with-having-coined-the-acronym-terf-heres-how-it-happened
That is a very worthwhile read, thank you. Thought she said things very clearly.
I can only speak for myself Sacha, but what civil rights do you think I am denying?
What Civil Rights do you think groups such as the speak up for women are denying?
I am commenting on this issue because I am against the Gender Self ID Bill. That doesn't mean trans people can't change their sex on their birth certificate, it just means there is a process they have to go through.
I understand some feminist groups are not wanting to involve trans women in their meetings. But I think that is their right. Our experiences from trans women are very different. We have grown up with sexism since we were young girls. They have grown up with a very difficult situation of not feeling like the sex they were assigned.
In the 70's when I first became a feminist there were lesbian women who were separatists. So they wanted to meet and associate with each other and not with us. I had no problem with that.
As I have posted before the language now being used by some about women (menstruators, birthing units and people with vaginas I believe de-constructs my identity as a woman. I find it de-humanizing. As already posted it has been proposed to have a judicial enquiry into the gender self id bill on the basis of it nulifying what a women is.
I wonder what your thoughts are about what Weka is saying about academia?
BTW you asked a question about me assault last week. I gave quite a lengthy response about what happened. I guess you missed it.
The process of changing your birth certificate as it stands is very dehumanizing itself, as you are no doubt aware Anker. Also rather expensive.
But it does seem appropriate that you champion separatism. Given the link explaining how an early version of TERF that never really caught on was TES (trans-exclusionary seperatist).
actually that could be changed easily by law.
Go online, .govt – change birth certificate and reduce any fees. That is something government can do.
I don't exclude Trans when i ask why i am now called a pregnant person, menstruating people etc. The question is why can we not called pregnant women? Because a transman is being a partime women in order to give birth? A man is pregnant? Really? Does that make me exclusionary?
Maybe it should be pregnant people when talking about trans women, and maybe it should be pregnant women when a women gets pregnant? Or would that too be exclusionary?
Before covid I had hired a transwomen. She lived for 28 years a man, and in her country that afforded her all the trimmings of male privilege, and she admits it. She is not going to be trans in her country as it would be deadly, so she came here. Do i feel her as a women? No, i don't Why – god knows, maybe its pheromone etc.? In saying that i don't feel her as a man. Go figure. But will i treat her as a women as a human being, as i would like to be treated by others, and ever now and then help her understand what it is to be women in our world, yes. Very funny tho when her boyfriend and her both applied at the same business for line cook postitions and she was offered a lower wage…….Welcome to the world of women, i said. Her look? Priceless.
I am not aware of what is involved in changing your birth certificate. That in my opinion is not a good reason to allow gender self id. It may be that there are aspects of the process that can be altered e.g. the cost. I would need to know more about the process to understand how it is de-humanizing. Going through life most of us will encounter difficult processes.
I am not championing separatism as such, merely offering that there are many occasions where we are all excluded from some groups.
I am not part of any feminist group currently, so whether I exclude trans women is mute. Like Sabine when I come across Trans people, I am respectful and civil, just like I am with any person I meet. So the label Trans exclusionary seperatiist doesn't really fit.
Anker
But surely that's the substance of the Gender Self ID Bill that you oppose?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/mothballed-gender-self-id-law-back-as-a-priority-for-govt-will-pass-this-year-minister-says/CIPLGCHFKCK5OB5MOBNYTQ36RQ/
Sabine
Some Intersex & NB, as well as Trans men are also people with uteri.
the current process seems appropriate to me. It is a big thing to change the sex on your birth certificate. I am sorry if it is a lengthy, expensive and difficult thing to change. Some things are e.g becoming a NZ citizen, immigrating to NZ especially under Covid. That doesn't make the processes wrong or right.
I don't support the Gender self id bill. Labour didn't as far as I can see have it as one of their election promises.
More that NZF held it up procedurally for the three years of last term.
It is a small change that will mean a lot to many Aotearoans. I don't believe that you are at all sorry for those whose identities are in limbo for years if not decades (17 years being the waiting list for the bottom surgery alone, even before the Pandemic). Plus there's still a lot of room for improvement around Nonbinary people too.
Biblical literalism, and centuries of colonialism have not left us many examples of that. Even Takitapui feels a bit reconstructed as much as extant culture. Good to have Kerekere in the parliamentary mix though. I guess the Heritage foundation's strategy of turning those with nontraditional gender expression against one another is working out pretty well for them…
Rambling, but at least you know what's in the bill you are opposing now, Anker.
…at least you know what's in the bill…
https://www.legislation.govt.nz/bill/government/2017/0296/latest/whole.html#LMS55955
RMcD, thanks for the link. I have tried to wade through the legalese of that a couple of times before, but my eyes just glaze over! The NZH summary above is more readable, though hardly complete.
Thanks Rosemary.
Forget now, I hear it will mean a lot to many. You don't have to believe whether I am sorry or not. You are entitled to interpret what I say any way you want.
I think Sabine raises a very good point about the process of immigrating here. A rigorous costly process.
Trans people are still entitled to identify whatever gender they want to.
I also agree with Greywarshark that a minority are trying to change gender and sexual identification. No one is stopping them being trans. We are talking about a significant change to official documentation.
As I have said before, I can't change my ethnicity (at all) or my age for that matter.
Bend me, break me, anyway you make me… That is how many women and people feel about this minority that have taken centre stage to turn ordinary life on its side because they have a strong desire to make change! It's a tide of demands that is flooding us trying to stuff up the whole world and our very basic identities to suit the discontented.
There are only so many James Morris' around; the present growth of supplicants is through a power grab by gripe-merchants over young people faced with a convusing, fast-changing world, the control of which has been wrested from the orbit of ordinary people. A majority are facing poverty and homelessness and uncertainty because of ploys of the callous people pulling golden strings at the top. The meme is education and technology is the answer for all ills yet we can see the ills clearly but nothing can or will be done till the technocrats and the pollies trying to use them, have decided on the value to them of fixing them, affecting our fate, and devised a suitable budget to display. We are drowned in theoreticians words and economic inertia and the sort of science that wants to experiment in real time on real people.
This struck me as pertinent; Terry Pratchett's Thief of Time excerpt:
The concept of 'orders' was yet another and immensely unfamiliar one for any Auditors. They were used to decisions by committee, reached only when the possibilities of doing nothing whatsoever about the matter in question had been exhausted. Decisions made by everyone were decisions made by no-one, which therefore precluded any possibility of blame. (p.314 in my p/back.)
I have no issues with a transman wanting to be a 'parent', I have an issue with the statements of a 'man ' being pregnant, it is the female body of that transman who is pregnant. So the fair description would be 'transman' or 'self identified other'. And then feel free to call these groups of people people. But the vast majority of pregnancy happens to women who identify as women and historically it is the women bodies have been doing all of the worlds breeding. But thanks for the education, were would i be without it. .
And if you think that providing a medical certificate is dehumanising think about migrating. I presented several medical certificates to the immigration services, police certificates from every country i ever lived in, birth certificate, marriage certificate and photos, and letters, and more to prove that i am legally married and that my marriage was consumed. And it costs an arm and a leg and we are quite happy to demand even more from migrants today.
Maybe we really need to re-think the term of de-humanising and realise that it is not dehumanizing to prove that you went through a process to change your physical appearance of whom you were born into your real self in order to change every offical document ever issued to you.
.
arkie, I assume you are a man? I am unhappy with my identity as a woman being deconstructed. As someone posted last week the gender self I’d bill, nulifies a women’s identity and if they try and pass I understand there will be a judicial review.
I didn’t read the whole article about who coined the term terf. It appears to be a woman who was speaking up for transgender rights. That isn’t the issue. The issue is what happens when a term not chosen by a group is used by an opposing group in a perjorative way to write that group off.
I belong to a number of groups that are exclusive. That is normal. I can’t join my husbands tribe because I am not Maori and he is. I very much doubt I could easily change my ethnicity. Trans people may or may not be members of groups I am a part of.
I don’t exclude trans people when I meet them in my day to day life
Hi McFlook, yeah I have checked the Dunedin study and they don't seem to have done anything on Trans. I choose that study as my go to source of science, because they really are scientists who are interested in what their research discovers rather than trying to prove a theory. For example their marvellous work on self control. Not popular with many people on the left because they have an ideology that they use to explain social problems. I am not saying that some ideology doesn't explain social/health issues e.g poverty's long term effect on health outcomes, even if people become financially well off in adulthood.
I would be interested to see the numbers who identified as Trans in the Dunedin study and at what age and what mental health outcomes and were the mental health outcomes correlated to other factors. Twelve is a very small sample, but I would be fascinated to see what the trajectory was for Trans people at all ages and stages. I would trust whatever they found.