[People have become lax with linking. Please include direct links when quoting or making references and follow basic courtesy rules on this site. We will start moderating for this.]
In support of what Incognito has said. Also, if you are having trouble linking from any device, please ask for help. Lots of people here that can assist.
Maybe there is a way out of the Poto Williams & Tamati Kruger ethno-vandalisim. (Stuff article quotes)
A spokesperson for the group, kaumātua Paki Nikora, said: “We are here because of the desecration of all our huts that have all had a historical connection to Tūhoe, and also all the hunters and trampers that frequented Te Urewera over 50 years plus.
“You can’t tell me a hut that sheltered our people for that long doesn’t belong to Te Urewera.”
"He said TUT did not represent all Tūhoe."
And local actual outdoor working Tuhoe (as opposed to indoor Ngati Taone) highlight one of my key worries–“Are you, minister, prepared to accept all responsibility … when all huts are removed and there's no shelter in the likelihood of emergencies, search and rescue, extreme weather events?”
And the clincher! “We don’t feel colonised by those huts,” he said. “We’re practical people, we just want the huts to stay in while we go hunting.
[What Stuff article? Provide direct links to quoted text, thanks – Incognito]
TUT and the environmental disaster that is their management of the Ureweras is a classic systemic outcome that inevitably happens when you give people a bunch of money and hand over control of a complex system when those people have no skills, no experience and no desire in managing the asset. Set up to fail, with the best of intentions all round I am sure. Pity about the Kiwi and the Kokako, but you can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs, eh?
TUT can do what they like with the Ureweras. I’m not some poor bastard who spent forty years of my life at war with introduced predators and gloried at the re-introduction of the Kokako. TUT clearly want to use the "park" as an asset to maximise the comfort of a subsistance lifestyle. None of this saving native flora and fauna. TUT are keen on a great leap backwards to the purity of the lifestyle of Te Kooti. Paddocks to graze horses and half-wild livestock. Over-run with pigs for an easy food source. Possums for pelts. Quiet valleys empty of nosy parkers like DOC, the police, and fussy Pakeha trampers are ideal for illegal activity to provide a nice stream of cash.
But like I said, they've got the park now and they can do what they want with it, they can shit in the woods all over the place for all I care. Tuhoe didn't sign the treaty, etc etc.
However, it's going to become our problem when their communities health crashes and the TB infested fauna, predators and lawlessness starts to bleed out of the borders of the third work ethnostate that is being created.
What then? One thing for sure – Tuhoe are busily demolishing any support for further co-governance initiatives in the conservation estate basically forever.
It isn't "Maori blaming". It is a simple statement of class based fact. The thing that needs to be honestly discussed here (instead of being a dick and playing the race card) is what TUT actually want. Everyone sits around singing Kumbaya to a deified idea of tribal Maori as the noble savage in tune with his environment. But what if they are just a bunch of dirt poor hillbillies behaving like dirt poor hillbillies everywhere behave?
If a bunch of middle class New Yorkers spent fifty years in an Appalacian park clearing paths, replanting chestnuts, re-introducing bald eagles and bears and wolves and building and maintaining huts then had to give the park back to a bunch of dumb local hard scrabble hillbillies who don’t like dangerous wild animals and they wrecked the huts and dug up the roads because they just want to be left alone by the federal authorities to moonshine, shoot squirrels and generally live like poor rural people you'd get the same level of dismay, but who is to say they are necessarily wrong? That is how they want to live, leave them alone.
I think we should cut the Kumbaya bullshit and have a grown up discussion about the purpose of the park is as it pertains to a community in grinding poverty. It is Tuhoe’s asset now, but it still part of New Zealand after all. If we were a bit more honest about procedings then we might come to something a bit more workable than what seems to be happening at the moment, which is a bunch of locals lying through their teeth about their real intentions to guillable Pakeha who desperately want to believe.
What role does anyone outside of the legla owners have over land that does not belong to them. There is legislation that appies to all of us and special legislation covering Te Urewera.
Why does this Maori owned land get singled out for attention?
What role will people intent on looking back to what happened when the land was a NP have? Why do they think they have a role? Is there something in our constitutional arrangements that enables beady eyed pakeha to say
Have you read the aspiration and management plans?
Most of all I would like you to reflect on why you feel you have a right or that anyone has a right to blow a lot of reactionary hot air about.
Does it make a difference that Maori here have lived on this land since time immemorial? I think it does.
Pull your head in about using words like 'subsistence' in a pejorative way Not everyone is aspiring to follow the American Dream or a prosperity church where monetary riches mean everything.
More than anything 'will the sky fall in' if we let this group get on with their vision for the land?
I am not a dude and yes I did read it. At first I thought it was supportive of letting Tuhoe do as they want on land that is precious to them. However it was just wrapped up that way with the implied criticism being the stings all the way through like
subsistence life style
and this
However, it's going to become our problem when their communities health crashes and the TB infested fauna, predators and lawlessness starts to bleed out of the borders of the third work ethnostate that is being created.
What then? One thing for sure – Tuhoe are busily demolishing any support for further co-governance initiatives in the conservation estate basically forever.
The myth of naughty Tuhoe being responsible for other joint treaty based initiatives possibly failing. Is it co-governance when iwi hold the majority on the Board, when those appointed by the Minister are not DoC reps but people of vast experience in natural land use management etc?
The myth of this arrangement being co-governance,…it is governance as opposed to co-governance.
The trigger words such as 'ethno-state'
Are you saying that just because Tuhoe have got the land back that they are unable to have access to any of the Govt supports that other groups, land owners have. So TB, no access to any funding? so health no access to any funding, so lawlessness no police presence and access?
This article states "As a contrast to the successful Waikato River Authority, the Te Urewera co-governance agreement provides an indication of flaws the co-governance model can have and how it chafes against the reality that it does fail to give full effect to Treaty principles."
Where do you get the idea this is not a co-governance model?
Because it has a board made up of a majority of Maori and with appointments from Minister of Conservation. Two of these appointment that I know, I think, are not Maori but who knows anyone's whakapapa unless they care to share it. Minister of Conservation is not limited to appointing people from DoC or who are European. They are not there to push an party line or necessarily to espouse DoC's view.
Co-governance is being used as a loaded word to bash all hell out of ideas about Three Waters, Auckland Treaty settlement s etc. The concept is to bring about good governance or Mana Motuhake. The use of 'co' is best avoided unless giving a whistle out to nay sayers about Three Waters which you may be doing for all I know. .
I note your link to the Maori Law Review……I would make a small wager that if this was being written now as opposed to 2012 they would be unlikely to refer to it as 'co-governance' bearing in mind the rubbish being talked about 3 three waters etc.
You make no comment about what the actual paragraph says about Te Urewera and Tuhoe seizing only on references to bash me with your idea of the woes of co-governance.
This commentary is significant. In it Tuhoe are being consistent with their view of a step along the way……
'The issue with this fractured co-governance arrangement is a difficult one to grapple with when divorced from the historical context of the area. Co-governance of Te Urewera is not understood by Tūhoe as the end goal, but is a stepping stone towards a resumption of authority that Tūhoe never agreed to lose. (my underlining) Kruger commented that “we are committed to washing away dependency on the Crown, and raising maximum autonomy for Tūhoe people".[24] Prioritising the authority of the Crown due to their greater resources undermines the purpose of restoring authority to Tūhoe. In practice, it keeps the land subject to Crown control, and does not practically aid mana whenua in engaging with the land.'
What is that is concerning, from my angle it seems you do not wish to allow any group of Maori hold to their own land if it means exercising all the powers that they are entitled to.
Are you now going to get very concerned that there is not wholesale access to Ngamatea Station or Mt Linton Station. Both freehold land where the owners actively restrict access. …….I didn't think so……
Maori are not restricting access. They have a work programme of removing huts. Please do not conflate access with camping in a hut.
"Because it has a board made up of a majority of Maori and with appointments from Minister of Conservation. "
That doesn't make it not co-governance.
"Co-governance of Te Urewera is not understood by Tūhoe as the end goal, but is a stepping stone towards a resumption of authority that Tūhoe never agreed to lose."
So Tuhoe themselves accepted the arrangement was co-governance.
"What is that is concerning, from my angle it seems you do not wish to allow any group of Maori hold to their own land if it means exercising all the powers that they are entitled to."
Legally it is not their land. This is the point you don't seem to grasp. Te Urewera owns itself. Rightly or wrongly, that is what the treaty settlement determined.
You are fixated on co-governance. What is this all about?
Could you call it Mana Motuhake as that is what Tuhoe call it. Then we will know you are not using co-governance as some sort dog whistle to nay sayers about the concept. That is my great concern that people are holding up Tuhoe and saying we don't this so therefore as we don't like this we also don't want any other permutation. Which of course is rubbish if you don't understand the background.
Te Urewera is a 'The fee simple estate in the establishment land vests in Te Urewera and is held under, and in accordance with, this Act.
The management regime is by a board with majority Tuhoe appointments. The remining 3 are appointed by the minister of Conservation and are not DoC people.
Sections 3.4, 5 of the Act are important.
Te Urewera
Tūhoe and the Crown: shared views and intentions
(9)
Tūhoe and the Crown share the view that Te Urewera should have legal recognition in its own right, with the responsibilities for its care and conservation set out in the law of New Zealand. To this end, Tūhoe and the Crown have together taken a unique approach, as set out in this Act, to protecting Te Urewera in a way that reflects New Zealand’s culture and values.
(10)
The Crown and Tūhoe intend this Act to contribute to resolving the grief of Tūhoe and to strengthening and maintaining the connection between Tūhoe and Te Urewera.'
I think that vesting an entity away from NP, crown land etc and appointing a majority board is very close to saying it is administered/controlled by this board, …..as it should be.
The Board must consider and provide appropriately for the relationship of iwi and hapū and their culture and traditions with Te Urewera when making decisions, including—
Many areas of Maori owned land/Incorporations have management committees but no-one says that the owners sitting behind those chosen to be on a committee have lost all connection with the land
The board has members appointed by the trustees of Tūhoe Te Uru Taumatua
'Te Uru Taumatua represents the Tūhoe nation and the lands and wealth held in common for Tūhoe. The purpose of the Governing Board of Te Uru Taumatua is to lead and serve the cultural permanency and prosperity of Tūhoetana by unlocking the unity potential of Mana Motuhake. Advancing Tūhoe social and economic development in a way that is distinctively Tūhoe recognises that we will build the Tūhoe nation with our minds, our hearts and our hands.
Your Board is committed to getting the best and right skills, advice and expertise from within Tūhoe and outside. Tūhoe settlement assets and resources must be preserved and grown to support our development now and into the future. Tūhoe culture and heritage pathways must be directed and grown with this development.
This Board works for Tūhoe and on behalf of Tūhoe'.
You are splitting hairs when you say that the people of Tuhoe have no interest in the land…that they cannot call it 'their' land. Maori hold land interest very differently to the way land is held in the European system, Joint ownership is all, individualism is not.
Over the course of this discussion I have linked to the legislation the settlement, the management documents of Tuhoe. You have let all these drift over you preferring 'gotchas' from ignorant MSM or dated commentaries.
Why is this?
I am coming to the view that your interest is not in acquiring knowledge and therefore learning things about how different people in NZ structure their affairs.
It is an exercise in nit picking, splitting hairs, and mainly avoiding a 'fair, large and liberal' look at ways that land can be held and managed. It is also not about expecting the best of people, or of giving people a chance and neither is it respectful of the different ways that people can manage land.
It is not benign, it is not genuine.
Hopefully that you are not applying this once over lightly approach to the Maunga in Tamaki Makaurau.
If co-governance is to deliver on its very real potential, (and it can), there needs to be a recognition that the co-governance entity, and partners, are in place to deliver outcomes that are best for these special environments, and the people of New Zealand who are willing to respect and enjoy them.
I take that as meaning that many of the people who want Te Urewera returned to a more pristine condition, have secure lives and incomes elsewhere. And that this security is necessarily derived from places that are not, and cannot be, pristine.
So we cannot demand that someone else's land remains in its original condition without ensuring that their economic circumstances don't make it impossible, i.e. humans always and everywhere will do what is expedient to make their lives more comfortable.
I may have totally misinterpreted your meaning though.
to expect pristine when Te Urewera has always had a Maori presence……they have lived here forever.
to expect everything will remain unchanged just because we feel threatened by anything else.
not to give people a fair go on their land especially when they are working to maintain to a standard those areas they can in the span of their workcrews (they are not DoC) Why would a competent manager think it was sensible to maintain huts that are past their use by dates, are outside a span of competent land management?
not to recognise the aspirations of for Te Urewera involving creating biosphere reserve.
It was also mine until I read and digested the last paras, and noted the trigger words in the post. Neither were in quotes to signify that this was a view not supported but quoted from somewhere. I think Sanctuary believes that these words apply.
Unsurprisingly, you continue your preference for missing the points and choosing to misunderstand that your comment was the issue that I responded to; it was neither helpful nor constructive. In addition, you didn’t help your case with the inane response @ 2.2.1.2.1.1. I’d told you already that I read all comments but glossing over that is part of your MO here and you’re too fixated on your own navel.
So Tinderdry you know all about the background to this?
Where have you got your info from to speak on this?
Do you subscribe to the view that Maori are a homogenous race who all believe the same thing or are they like every other human being who when in a group may have differences of opinion and approach.
This homogenous group all thinking the same owes much to the concept of the 'noble savage'.
On every local authority in the land there are groups of councillors who do not think the same as each other or as some of their constituents. In those cases most of us think that having differing ideas is a good thing enabling all issues to come out and be discussed.
Why does this somehow morph into being a bad thing in Maori controlled organisation? You don't believe that differing viewpoints and discussion is of value to Maori groups or Tuhoe in particular.
Why is that?
Could it be because we have been led by the nose by MSM firstly into some false equivalence that 'access equals huts' and that it is newsworthy that a private group has people who disagree with them or as in the update from Tuhoe.
'Waimana taking misinformed pākeha for a ride on their issues and pākeha taking Waimana for a ride with their anxieties.'
Says it all really with a bit of humour lacking in MSM
"Where have you got your info from to speak on this?"
From, amongst other sources, the links I have provided.
"Do you subscribe to the view that Maori are a homogenous race who all believe the same thing or are they like every other human being who when in a group may have differences of opinion and approach."
No, I do not subscribe to the view that ‘all Maori are a homogenous race…’. Tamati Kruger has claimed to speak for all Tuhoe, as in this article, and it is clear that he doesn't.
"You don't believe that differing viewpoints and discussion is of value to Maori groups or Tuhoe in particular."
Differing viewpoints is healthy.
"Could it be because we have been led by the nose by MSM firstly into some false equivalence that 'access equals huts' and that it is newsworthy that a private group has people who disagree with them or as in the update from Tuhoe."
It is also relevant to consider how TUT got to this place. This article provides some background, including disputes between TUT and DoC over maintenance of the huts and bridges inside the park.
In the context of your comment about " false equivalence that 'access equals huts' ", of course access doesn’t equal huts, but you might want to reflect on Tamati Kruger's comment that "opening Te Urewera to the public was “way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi."
‘Kruger told Stuff in November that the relationship with the Crown post-settlement had failed, and Tūhoe wanted a re-set, dealing directly with Crown-Māori Relations Minister Kelvin Davis instead of DOC.’
Your quote
This seems like a good idea. DoC seem to be doing a fair bit of micromanaging.
In the context of your comment about " false equivalence that 'access equals huts' ", of course access doesn’t equal huts, but you might want to reflect on Tamati Kruger's comment that "opening Te Urewera to the public was “way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi."
I have no problem with Tamati Kruger's comment. It is the role of the landowner to set priorities. Their priority is not about opening up. Fair enough. Another priority if you look at the work plans is to manage what they can and not to spread themselves too thinly.
I as a land owner also have my priorities on my land. Public access is also not a priority but I am working with arborists on trees at the front and this will have a benefit for the public as leaves or little branches may be less likely to fall on the pavement or in the stormwater drains.
I cannot locate it now but in some thing that you have linked to is a criticism that Tuhoe closed access during Covid. Really what silly ideas people have, during Covid we were restricted from travelling, warned about going to places where we might need to be rescued, keep close, don’t mix willy nilly. So Tuhoe follows this and is criticised for it.
You can see Tuhoe cannot win with statements like this being trotted out as if they were justified.
"‘Kruger told Stuff in November that the relationship with the Crown post-settlement had failed, and Tūhoe wanted a re-set, dealing directly with Crown-Māori Relations Minister Kelvin Davis instead of DOC.’"
"I have no problem with Tamati Kruger's comment. "
The problem is that Kruger's comments cut across the treaty settlement. He's trying to renegotiate the settlement by media, and that is precisely what will get people antsy about co-governance.
Tamati Kruger is trying to explain things in words of one syllable, comic form might have been easier, to people who are desperately trying not to understand.
Treaty Settlements are often varied, amended etc. If it was found that the DoC input has not been helpful or Tuhoe focussed then it is the right of the Board to raise legislative amendments. Just because a settlement & legislation has been enacted it does not stop dialogue between Tuhoe and Ministers or other Treaty partners.
Kruger is attempting to remove DoC from the conversation, and replace them with the Crown-Māori Relations Minister. It is irrelevant whether you think this is a good idea, it is an attempt to amend the treaty settlement.
Kruger states that "opening Te Urewera to the public was “way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi." Again, that is an attempt to change the treaty settlement. Kruger doesn't make that call. Public access is a right enshrined in the settlement. It is not exercised or prioritised at his whim.
“Treaty Settlements are often varied, amended etc.”
Are they? Can you provide some examples? The ones I’m aware of are financial adjustments that are built into the original arrangements.
“If it was found that the DoC input has not been helpful or Tuhoe focussed then it is the right of the Board to raise legislative amendments.”
To raise them, yes. Not to unilaterally declare them
So the hut protestors are not trying to negotiate by media…..only Kruger. That figures. Goose/gander comes to mind.
What does this mean?
To raise them, yes. Not to unilaterally declare them
What is 'unilaterally declare' them? What is the difference between raise them and declaring them? Tuhoe can only raise them, if it wants to raise them strongly is that some sort of a problem?
In the declaration that public access is "“way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi."". Kruger has done amazing work for Tuhoe, but it is clear he is out of step with a significant number of his iwi, and it is not his call to place the benefit of the iwi over a key element of the treaty settlement.
"What is the difference between raise them and declaring them?"
The difference in this context is seen in this article. DoC have been trying to deal with the safety issues in the park for years, but Kruger's comments mirror the resistance of TUT to allow the work to be completed. This is not in the spirit or the letter of the treaty settlement, and seems designed to exclude the public, at least for a time.
This is a gross over reaction and classic Maori-blaming but whatever floats your boat.
Let's hope this comment earns you a tweet from Moana Maniapoto saying "We see you, Shanreagh, and you're very, very special… a great Totara … a Woman of Great Mana … a unique Go-Between uniting the two noble races". And you'll go all giggly, won't you … like a small child who's just met an All Black.
A great example of an affluent Professional-Managerial Class narcissist – a Luvvie, if you will – paternalistically "protecting" powerful Māori as if they're small children – eternally innocent, eternally virtuous – … no matter the context.
I have no doubt you'd have automatically defended the slave labour thriving under iwi-owned enterprises within the fishing industry. Ostentatious displays of virtue-signaling for in-group reputational enhancement. The pure narcissism, pure self-indulgence of the bourgeois middle to upper-middle class. Entirely at the expense of the good of the Country.
#LuxuryBeliefs
[This is nothing but a personal attack on another commenter. Please cut it out – Incognito]
What tiresome ad hominem rubbish you speak rather than debating the issues.
Have you got any views on the concepts I have been raising like Maor world view, beliefs, legislation, treaty settlements or are you happy with your contribution of
Luvvie?
narcissist, self indulgence
luxury beliefs
What is missing though is your belief that 'I am a pretty little communist' and I really miss that kind of in depth response
Way out with the All Blacks though. Since 1981 they have left me cold. I have not seen a game on TV or in person since being a bystander at the Molesworth st happening and then being barricaded in my house by a Police presence at the top of my street, so buses full of weeing fans could unload, while defending the mighty boks and All Blacks at Athletic park.
Why do you think I would protect the items you have quoted in your last para. I have been talking only about Tuhoe not fishing? I really don't see the connection unless you are talking about the bed of the lake which was not part of the settlement and noting that Fish & Game Council still has jurisdiction.
Your ad hominem and misogynistic comments say more about you than me. That you are afraid to debate the issues so you are only able to take personal pot shots. Most of your suppositions about me are incorrect.
My simple point is this:
On a weighing of righting wrongs or keeping tattered, battered, rat ridden huts I automatically choose the righting of wrongs. In fact I would place the righting of wrongs above almost anything especially when it is the righting of wrongs where the state/crown had inflicted the wrong.
Swordfish presumably your priority is to keep the huts over the bigger picture of righting a wrong. This surprises me.
I do recall some pretty horrendous stories about your parents that may have knocked your view of people and you have automatically applied what you have endured there on a race based view to situations that are not the same.
If that is offensive to you then what can I say?
I'm still laughing at the All Blacks reference…how wrong can you be? I believed then, as I do now, that there is no sporting issue that should guide our diplomatic stance. I can see parallels that those who supported the Springboks could also be the ones to support the huts over the righting of wrongs to Tuhoe.
I like Moana but my favourite NZ poets would be Hone Tuwhare and Api Taylor. I have never heard the term Luvvie and am not paternalistic…a contradiction in terms for me really
I have lots of favorites of Hone's and love Api's He Rau Aroha: A Hundred Years of Love (Penguin), was a runner-up in the Pegasus Book Awards. This is a collection of short stories.
Heavy footed people with no understanding and a swag of entitlement can wreak more damage than a possum.
There are pest management plans covering possum and other introduced pests if you cared to look on the sites run by Tuhoe.
As for pelts being taken instead of just left, this is such an old activity that really compounds the anti posters lack of knowledge about what has been going on here.
An uncle had traplines up here for years prior to and after the area was made into a NP. All legal and above board. there was always a market for good pelts and that was why in the old days when tramping and coming across a trapper hut or bivvy and the inevitable warm welcome you made sure about where you might sleep, that there might be a skin or two stretching out on the wirewove.
Even as late as the 1980s in hut on the big stations up close to the boundaries there were shepherds huts where the occupants were doing the same thing.
The skins had a market here in NZ but my Uncle, in an effort to maximise his returns, and because he did this as a living, used to send his pelts to the London fur & skin markets. These old time trappers did this not because they loved possums, far from it but because they loved the land, the bush and the isolation and could get a living from it. They saw themselves as being able to help in a small way with the recovery of the bush.
"Heavy footed people with no understanding and a swag of entitlement can wreak more damage than a possum. "
Perhaps you could provide a link to support your assertion.
Because there is lots (and lots) of evidence the other way. Possums are a very significant ecological pest – which are largely uncontrolled by any predator (hence the need for trapping and/or poisoning).
You think I am being literal about lots of trampers causing damage as against the damage caused by a possum? Sad. But if this was what I was talking about I am sure there would be evidence about human overuse/degradation of landscape that then leaves the land prone to further degradation by introduced pests. Eg over use of high country land by stock, degrades tussock cover, rabbits get in etc
No I am talking about the damage to reputation, to mana, to a correct and preceptive view of history and an openness to facing the future that is caused by closed minds. The 'heavy footed' people are those of us who want to criticise without knowledge, to indulge in criticism of Maori life styles without knowing what and whether they fit in with a Maori world view, as opposed to a Pakeha world view.
For other 'heavy footedness' just read some of the earlier comments, made over this issue over the weekend.
For a view that draws on the plans for the future pl read the websites for Tuhoe and this about the issue being discussed.
Gosh – I'm glad you're not in charge of conservation….
Being put in charge of NZ conservation/environment is a hospital pass.
Only Parker is still in parliament. Former Minister for the Environment Goff went on to become Mayor of Auckland. Apart from MPs in the 6th Labour Government, no former Minister of Conservation is still in Parliament, although Wollaston and Chadwick went on to do stints are regional city mayors (Nelson and Rotorua, respectively), and that well-know environmentalist Dr Nick Smith is now Mayor of Nelson.
Mike Joy wins battle over ‘dodgy’ water stats
[updated 5 Jan 2022]
“Funny how it is always a mistake in one direction that is downplaying the problem, never a mistake where it was claimed to be worse than what it is.” – Mike Joy
…
You can almost hear Joy shaking his head over the phone about the state of groundwater in the province: “The whole thing, it’s just a train-wreck – intensive farming in Canterbury is a train wreck.”
…
Former Environment Minister Nick Smith had promised in 2011 the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment would undertake five-yearly reporting, something scuppered by his replacement, Cantabrian Amy Adams.
Govt aims to get 90pct of rivers swimmable by 2040
[updated 23 Feb 2017]
Greens co-leader James Shaw told Newshub Nick Smith is "having a laugh" and he is "flabbergasted at the announcement".
…
"He must think we're stupid."
There's also Joe Walding (High Commissioner to the UK), Russell Marshall (High Commissioner to the United Kingdom and Nigeria, and Ambassador to Ireland) and, more recently, Trevor Mallard (Ambassador to Ireland), who was Minister for the Environment towards the end of the 5th Labour Government.
Hopefully some of them had more than just an eye to their career pathways while they were doing their Ministerial duties, although you do have to wonder sometimes.
I'm certainly one who believes that all politicians should be mandatorialy (goodness, is that even a word) retired after a certain number of terms in office (combining local, national and official postings).
I don't think that political re-treads (from any party) do a good job representing our country overseas. Certainly not a better one than the people actually trained and educated to be ambassadors.
Well if you think that all the misinformation about Tuhoe that has been spouted today and over the weekend is theoretical ……
8000 people mislead by MSM 'shock horror' have signed some sort of petition in the belief that Tuhoe are doing something or not doing something on their land. So that is 8000 X 9 (the comms calc about complaints and how they spread to others) I would say that is far from theoretical.
I have not made a false equivalence. One possum destroys, we know that. Tuhoe knows that and has trapping etc programmes.
Just who will be working to ensure that the damage to the reputation of Tuhoe is mended after this onslaught. Will you be? Or do you still think the crown owned/ns the land, it is like a NP and Tuhoe have only a minor role.
You have shown that you are not able to understand my point and that is a pity. I agree that species are endangered, I said so in reply. I also feel that reputational damage is hard to overcome even if you are actually in the right, as Tuhoe is.
And, equally clearly, you have shown that you are …. unwilling … to consider the points that I and others have raised.
8,000 local people protesting – Tuhoe kaumatua among them – but hey, it's all bullshit from MSM (/sarc/). Your blinkers have narrowed your vision to the point that you're unable to see the cliff you're rushing towards.
Happy to consider them if you can get basic facts correct.
Sadly lacking so far and when I tried to broaden the idea that misinformed people can damage reputations you did not get the analogy and we had some fruitless debate. You still don't understand reputational damage do you?
You are now saying that 8000 misinformed people are worth more than the reputation of a group doing its best following the settling of a bad Treaty claim.
I have linked to this before. The ref to ‘Waimana’ are to those grumpy with the Tuhoe Board.
Te Kura Whare received disgruntled individuals and New Zealanders on the outer using a protest as a platform to air personal grievances. Placards displayed reveal the many layers of individual issues, that got 20 minutes of media fame.
Mentioned were DOC, Labour, TUT, Huts, even Trump, e ahu pēhea ana koutou? What is your plan?
Waimana taking misinformed pākeha for a ride on their issues and pākeha taking Waimana for a ride with their anxieties.
Protestors willing to listen, let their guard down saw moments of agreement and understanding. Their anxiety eased, assured of access and Tūhoe structures will go up. A lot of the protesters left a bit embarrassed after Tribals shared wider context. It wasn’t just about huts – as they held firmly to their sign, as the discussions continued, that grip ‘save the huts’ placard loosened considerably.
You are quoting from what looks like an email from the Tuhoe iwi entity. This entity has been at odds before with its Kaumatua council, and the email you quote from reads more like a propaganda piece.
I've already linked to this article that details DoC attempts to progress remediation work on the huts, and Tuhoe leadership being a handbrake on that work.
"He (Kruger) also claimed there had been a decade of under-investment by DOC prior to the settlement – “we haven't really inherited assets, we’ve inherited liabilities” – and the $2m DOC provided each year for Te Urewera’s upkeep was “overly miserly”. But the documents show that money was not the impediment to repairing the dilapidated structures – DOC was offering to pay for everything. Rather, the problem was getting Tūhoe to approve a maintenance plan."
Also:
"In another report, English explained that DOC had provided a maintenance funding agreement to the TUT chief executive (Luke), “with the expectation that she would review it, and we would then proceed to signature. There has been no response. DOC has subsequently sent a reminder about progressing the agreement, but had no response. “Our understanding is that TUB believe that discussion about annual funding is one that should take place with the Minister [of Conservation]. There is no legislative authority for such decision making by [the Minister].”
I don’t know who’s calling the shots here, but this entire arrangement seems to be headed off the rails.
Always good to have a link to the real oil. But don't let any source of reality or another point of view put you off your quoting storm from an unknown MSM source.
Hundreds of tractors were driven into cities across New Zealand. One of those Invercargill protesters, dairy farmer Daryl Swney, said the Government’s new farm emissions' proposal would cost him $150,000 a year. He did not know how farmers would survive the cost, alongside other regulations.
These same farmers will be asking for taxpayer assistance if flooding that is amplified by climate change devastates their properties. The obvious problem is that reducing emissions won't reduce the effects of climate change in the short-medium term, because so much change is already baked in by past emissions.
And that is essentially a fiscal problem: farmers will be paying to reduce emissions (or passing those costs to the public), while simultaneously taxpayers will be paying to mitigate or repair the effects of climate change. The ledger does not balance out here – there is only cost. Public finances will be overwhelmed and living standards will fall at the same time. Hard to avoid the conclusion that we are now on the leading edge of utter chaos.
An article on Stuff this morning listing 11 things that National will repeal/reverse/scrap if they win the election next year. But naturally nothing about what they will do instead to fix the institutional problems of our country.
But we can guess. It will probably start with tax cuts for the rich, new multi-billion roads and fly-overs for Ford Ranger owning rural townies, building new prisons and cuts to public services.
The difference between National and Labour is that Labour valiantly keeps trying to make a rotten system better, but can't do it because it is too far gone, our public service is too small and too protective of its own privilege to do it anyway, and Labour lacks the balls, the money and the people to clean it out completely and start again from scratch. On the other hand National just gives up trying straight away and tries to fool us into thinking that doing nothing is actually doing something.
[What Stuff article? Provide direct links to quoted text, thanks – Incognito]
Over the life of this country (at least since 1840), all the positive legislation that makes life better for ordinary kiwis has come from the left of the political spectrum.
Natz have largely just maintained the status quo.
But that approach will simply not work in the face of the existential crisis of climate change. Frankly, the market has no f*cking idea how to get us out of the environmental mess they have created.
We need interventionist governments prepared to do things: like three waters, fair pay agreements, rebuilding the health system, housing etc.
The rich don't use public hospitals or state school; all they need is roads to get to airports for their overseas holidays. Hence the Natz focus on roads.
This country can't afford another Natz/Act government.
Mike, what operating system are you using? What browser? Are they both up to date? Can you please post the exact text of the message, and if it’s from the browser or the os?
Any legislation to make day to day life a bit better for the "average" person does not and will not come from a National government. Paid parental leave they voted against and Labour has since its introduction steadily increased the payments. Sick leave, annual leave, KiwiSaver …… As long as the better off get a generous tax cut is first and foremost on their policy wish list.
My first reaction:
Blame the Hoskings and HdPAs.
Blame the tabloid media in general.
Blame the Nats and their constant barrage of false and misinformation.
Blame ACT and their constant barrage of false and misinformation.
Could be coincidental but did the culprit wait until Ardern was in Antarctica?
Edit: the article has now been edited. The original reported a man was seen approaching the office… he smashed a window and threw something inside. Fire trucks arrived to put out a fire. There was no staff there at the time.
The last "domestic terrorist" that smashed in the frontage of the Prime Minister's office in Mt Albert electorate did not do it when the PM was there either Helen Clark's office in Sandringham Rd had an axe put through the window one morning. It was very upsetting for the staff – I was upstairs doing some Labour Party work that morning so all we heard was the crash, but the office was closed for the day while the Police did the forensic stuff.
Yes, Visubversa, no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert.
Victims of the venomous Right. There have been quite a few of us over the years who were thus targeted. I was a nobody when it happened to me 30 years ago, so the police weren’t interested.
You know I did not say they only happen to Labour MP's and women PMs.
You know I was replying in the context of visibversa's comment @ 7.1
So why try to start a flame war?
I was similarly targeted by a woman who was planted in the Mt.Albert Labour Party 35 plus years ago. I know who put her there and why… but am not revealing the context or the identities here so don't bother to ask.
You said: "no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
When, actually, yes it is a coincidence.
I've provided one example of an attack on the office of a male PM – there are plenty of others.
Attacks on the electorate offices (and even MPs themselves – cf James Shaw) – are an occupational hazard in NZ (and in other countries as well).
I don't support it – or minimize it – but I acknowledge that it happens to many – right or left. Perhaps you could do the same.
Calling you on misinformation is not starting a flame war.
Oh yes it is starting a flame war when you know I was referring to a specific situation as was indeed Visubversa before me. Maybe I didn't choose my words ponderously enough for Madam but most people here don't mess around with silly semantics just to prove to the world they are always right and the target of the hour is wrong.
And to suggest I'm spouting misinformation on the subject only serves to further the suspicion by quite a few on this site that you are a person who thinks she has to be top dog in all things. 🙄
I'm not suggesting. You were spouting misinformation – as you have done in the past – and no doubt will do in the future.
Have you acknowledged, yet – I don't seem to see it in the responses – that actually attacks on electorate offices and individual politicans happen to members of all political parties – and males are affected as well as females.
Misinformation is not my game and never has been. You do yourself a disservice with your silly 'misinterpretations'.
I find your understanding on some technical matters pertaining to topics discussed here both useful and interesting. Then you go and spoil it.
"I've yet to acknowledge that attacks on electorate offices happen to all political parties?" (paraphrase)
We were talking about one specific office that was attacked yesterday. To suggest that I or anyone else is denying they happen to other political parties because we didn't mention them in dispatches is bordering on the idiotic.
I've been around the political traps on and off for 50 years and believe me I know a thing or two – as do others on this site. You might do well to ponder the fact our experiences are worthy of respect… even if you do imagine you know better.
I can't think of another MP who has physically attacked – rather than jostled in a crowd, etc. Although there have been some things thrown at right-wing pollies – which is pretty borderline, in my estimation.
If you want to argue that MPs are increasingly at risk from both physical and virtual attacks, I'll certainly agree with you. And there is research to back it up.
You’ve offered no good reason for me to revise my reply to your comment @7.2.1, simply because you've subsequently introduced physical assaults into the mix. If for some reason you bring yourself to acknowledge the objective truth of the misogynistic component in the venom directed at our PM then that’s disappointing, but tbh I’m not surprised.
"no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
Yes, it is a coincidence. There are plenty of other instances of non-Labour and non-female (if one is still allowed to use that divisive term) pollies offices being attacked (including PMs)
To claim this is "no coincidence" is to state (with no evidence) that this level of violence is only directed at Labour women PMs. Which is a lie.
Jacinda has a level of vitriol addressed to and about her. As did Key.
Popular politicians also have the converse of that popularity – it's only the mediocre ones who seem to attract little hatred (people go 'meh' rather than froth at the mouth.)
If it is misogynistic in relation to Ardern is is equally misandric (if that is the word) in relation to Key?
I will absolutely agree that online abuse of female politicians outweighs that directed at their male counterparts.
I don't see any evidence, however that physical assaults (on person or property) are greater for women than for men. In fact, the evidence I've linked to seems to show the reverse.
If you have evidence to show that I'm wrong, then I'm certainly open to changing my opinion.
And the initial comment was about the attack on Ardern's electorate office (not about any threats made to her). You are the one who initially widened the scope of the thread.
"Attacks on the electorate offices (and even MPs themselves – cf James Shaw) – are an occupational hazard in NZ (and in other countries as well).
I don't support it – or minimize it – but I acknowledge that it happens to many."
If that's not sufficient for you, then I unreservedly condemn the attack on the PM's electorate office. While acknowledging that it will almost certainly have been carried out by someone mentally unbalanced.
I read Anne's initial comments @7 and @7.2 about the recent attack on the PM's office, and the earlier attack on PM Clark's office that Visubversa wrote about @7.1.
In your first 'contribution', your reply (to Anne) @7.2.1, you wrote:
You then had the gall (@7.2.1.1.1 and @7:56 pm) to write that you were "calling" Anne "on [spouting] misinformation", when it was you, and only you, who had deliberately misrepresented what Anne had written. That's self-serving bad faith behaviour – plain as day.
You bad faith commenting continued when you offered this:
But to claim that only women are affected is simply not true.
– Belladonna @7.2.1.2.1
Once again, you, and only you, had made such a claim in this thread – it would be absurd to suggest otherwise. Readers can make up their own minds about why you would write such an absurdity – I know I have.
I stand by my reply to your comment @7.2.1 – that you subsequently introduced the spurious matter of the physical assault on Shaw into the mix is further evidence that you are not commenting in good faith – rather you are minimising and diverting.
It is open misogyny, visible on every platform and supported and promoted by upvotes on Reddit, laughing emojis on Facebook, comments about “that woman” on LinkedIn, and someone who looks like your Aunty referring to the PM as “Cindy” and calling her a “c…”.
It is targeted and increasingly violent misogynistic abuse and threats – illustrated by but not limited to the escalation in gendered hatred directed towards Ardern – being directed at public-facing women from central and local body politicians to journalists, public servants, academics and chief executives.
Imho our PM has shown considerable fortitude in the face of a veritable torrent of abuse and threats, including death threats – it can't be easy.
To our PM – hang in there – Kia kaha, and be kind
Belledonna's presence on this site appears – in part – to try and undermine this government. Its an age old trick to do it by way of attempting to score points off and ridiculing individuals who stand behind or support them.
It is the same ploy used by the right-wing dirty political brigade when they attempted to destroy Clarke Gayford's reputation by way of spreading false stories about him. Take for example the "nanny": meme. It's Jacinda Ardern they are aiming to hurt by despoiling the reputations of those around her. They did the same to Helen Clark.
"no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
Yes, it is a coincidence. Or, alternatively, your framing. There are plenty of other instances of non-Labour and non-female (if one is still allowed to use that divisive term) pollies offices being attacked (including PMs)
To claim this is "no coincidence" is to state (with no evidence) that this level of violence is only directed at Labour women PMs. Which is a lie.
"Staff evacuated after sword attack" in the headline and yet when you read the article "No injuries have been reported and the building was unoccupied at the time," police said.
So how do you evacuate an empty building.
Not good but the standard of reporting is terrible..
I think you will finds the police told them they couldn't occupy the office until they had finished their forensic examination. That could take several hours.
At the time the article was put together, the reporter wouldn't know the exact turn of events so just labelled it an evacuation.
Whatever, the psychological effect on the staff will be enormous because of a large sword left behind on the ground. I'm picking that was a deliberate act to threaten the staff and the PM.'
A typical example of the level of vitriol thrown at the Prime Minister. She is being criticised for taking her partner with her to Antarctica. A swag of former prime ministers have visited Anrtactica over the years and it looks like they all took their spouses/partners with them. Jesus.
" The original reported a man was seen approaching the office… he smashed a window and threw something inside". Why do we men always get the blame for this sort of madness?
Good to see that 2.75m given to the mob being put to good use by the Mongrel Mob. Did anyone actually believe the PR lady that they were no longer in to drugs? (she is awfully quiet now).
But at least all the gang members now vote Labour.
No I obviously don't personally have any evidence, but the police do as Mark Griffiths will be off to jail now. Actually if he gets the good judge probably home D.
I'm told the drugs were imported via printer cartridges. Well be needing to implement sanctions against the US administration and their cartel of printer suppliers now.
New Zealand's male violence towards women is further demonstrated by the deranged, cowardly attack on the PM's electorate office. There are too many men who cannot seem to accept and adapt to women's involvement in politics, government, local government, business, senior roles in any field. As soon as they rise to the top these pathetic men want to drag them down in one way or another. Anger, jealousy, "pretty communist" "Cindy", "girl in a skirt" that sort of nonsense never gets hurled at Chris Luxon. Time some people grew up.
Define woman. So unless there is a picture or a comment to precise that it was an adult human female – who may or may not identify as a 'woman' you actually have no idea who really committed the crime, i mean anyone who feels like a women can self identify as a woman, one can even change daily their gender expression and no alterations to bodies or faces need to be made in order to self identify as a woman. And i would like to point out that the person was not described as a 'cis' woman either. So really might just not 'sex' the criminal until more information is available.
In saying that, knife attacks, attacks on people with screwdrivers, ramraids, bashings etc is all up and i would assume this is do to mental health issues in many cases. And sometimes these mental health issues need more then just access to a 0800 number.
So give the criminal a few month of Home D, say 9 month? That seems to be a good punishment for crimes against 'human females" of all ages and their offices.
However, it was widely reported to be a man immediately after the attack.
Most of those reports have since been updated and corrected, and unfortunately most NZ media do not bother to follow best practice overseas of notifying readers of corrections. The requirement for links on The Standard is entirely reasonable, but the linked content often changes, and only screenshots (or our own memories) can confirm original reporting.
There were plenty of women involved in despoiling the centre of Wellington in February.
The difference is that deranged men have an additional bone of contention – Jacinda being a woman means that she is "not one of us" and thus more contemptible.
BANGKOK (AP) — New Zealand said Thursday it will not deal with Myanmar under a major 15-nation trade agreement, the world’s largest that took effect this year, citing the deadly violence and democratic setbacks in the Southeast Asian country after the military seized power last year.
New Zealand has joined a boycott of an upcoming counter-terrorism meeting being co-chaired by the Russian and Myanmar militaries, in a move welcomed by activists.
Perhaps you could have a word with the junta's suppliers, China, Russia, Belarus, Iran and Serbia.
/
Meanwhile, the EU and US have banned the supply of arms and any dual use goods, restricted export of comms and monitoring systems that could be used for internal suppression and suspended all and training and cooperation. And sanctions on dozens of individuals and organisations include asset freezes and bans on listed people from entering or transiting through US and EU territory.
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Chris Trotter writes – New Zealand politics is remarkably easy-going: dangerously so, one might even say. With the notable exception of John Key’s flat ruling-out of the NZ First Party in 2008, all parties capable of clearing MMP’s five-percent threshold, or winning one or more electorate seats, tend ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is ...
Luxon will no doubt put a brave face on it, but there is no escaping the pressure this latest poll will put on him and the government. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political ...
This is a re-post from The Climate Brink by Andrew Dessler In the wake of any unusual weather event, someone inevitably asks, “Did climate change cause this?” In the most literal sense, that answer is almost always no. Climate change is never the sole cause of hurricanes, heat waves, droughts, or ...
Something odd happened yesterday, and I’d love to know if there’s more to it. If there was something which preempted what happened, or if it was simply a throwaway line in response to a journalist.Yesterday David Seymour was asked at a press conference what the process would be if the ...
Hi,From time to time, I want to bring Webworm into the real world. We did it last year with the Jurassic Park event in New Zealand — which was a lot of fun!And so on Saturday May 11th, in Los Angeles, I am hosting a lil’ Webworm pop-up! I’ve been ...
Education Minister Erica Standford yesterday unveiled a fundamental reform of the way our school pupils are taught. She would not exactly say so, but she is all but dismantling the so-called “inquiry” “feel good” method of teaching, which has ruled in our classrooms since a major review of the New ...
Exactly where are we seriously going with this government and its policies? That is, apart from following what may as well be a Truss-Lite approach on the purported economic “plan“, and Victorian-era regression when it comes to social policy.Oh it’ll work this time of course, we’re basically assured, “the ...
Hey Uncle Dave, When the Poms joined the EEC, I wasn't one of those defeatists who said, Well, that’s it for the dairy job. And I was right, eh? The Chinese can’t get enough of our milk powder and eventually, the Poms came to their senses and backed up the ute ...
Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is higher than for any other mayor ...
Buzz from the Beehive Pharmac has been given a financial transfusion and a new chair to oversee its spending in the pharmaceutical business. Associate Health Minister David Seymour described the funding for Pharmac as “its largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff”. ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Many criticisms are being made of the Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill, including by this writer. But as with everything in politics, every story has two sides, and both deserve attention. It’s important to understand what the Government is trying to achieve and its ...
TL;DR: Here’s my top 10 ‘pick ‘n’ mix of links to news, analysis and opinion articles as of 10:10am on Monday, April 29:Scoop: The children's ward at Rotorua Hospital will be missing a third of its beds as winter hits because Te Whatu Ora halted an upgrade partway through to ...
span class=”dropcap”>As hideous as David Seymour can be, it is worth keeping in mind occasionally that there are even worse political figures (and regimes) out there. Iran for instance, is about to execute the country’s leading hip hop musician Toomaj Salehi, for writing and performing raps that “corrupt” the nation’s ...
Yesterday marked 10 years since the first electric train carried passengers in Auckland so it’s a good time to look back at it and the impact it has had. A brief history The first proposals for rail electrification in Auckland came in the 1920’s alongside the plans for earlier ...
Right now, in Aotearoa-NZ, our ‘animal spirits’ are darkening towards a winter of discontent, thanks at least partly to a chorus of negative comments and actions from the Government Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on ...
You make people evil to punish the paststuck inside a sequel with a rotating castThe following photos haven’t been generated with AI, or modified in any way. They are flesh and blood, human beings. On the left is Galatea Young, a young mum, and her daughter Fiadh who has Angelman ...
The Government is again adding to New Zealand’s growing unemployment, this time cutting jobs at the agencies responsible for urban development and growing much needed housing stock. ...
With Minister Karen Chhour indicating in the House today that she either doesn’t know or care about the frontline cuts she’s making to Oranga Tamariki, we risk seeing more and more of our children falling through the cracks. ...
The Labour Party is saddened to learn of the death of Sir Robert Martin, a globally renowned disability advocate who led the way for disability rights both in New Zealand and internationally. ...
Labour is calling for the Government to urgently rethink its coalition commitment to restart live animal exports, Labour animal welfare spokesperson Rachel Boyack said. ...
Today’s Financial Stability Report has once again highlighted that poverty and deep inequality are political choices - and this Government is choosing to make them worse. ...
The Green Party is calling on the Government to do more for our households in most need as unemployment rises and the cost of living crisis endures. ...
Unemployment is on the rise and it’s only going to get worse under this Government, Labour finance spokesperson Barbara Edmonds said. Stats NZ figures show the unemployment rate grew to 4.3 percent in the March quarter from 4 percent in the December quarter. “This is the second rise in unemployment ...
The New Zealand Labour Party welcomes the entering into force of the European Union and New Zealand free trade agreement. This agreement opens the door for a huge increase in trade opportunities with a market of 450 million people who are high value discerning consumers of New Zealand goods and ...
The National-led Government continues its fiscal jiggery pokery with its Pharmac announcement today, Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall says. “The government has increased Pharmac funding but conceded it will only make minimal increases in access to medicine”, said Ayesha Verrall “This is far from the bold promises made to fund ...
This afternoon’s interim Waitangi Tribunal report must be taken seriously as it affects our most vulnerable children, Labour children’s spokesperson Willow-Jean Prime. ...
Te Pāti Māori are demanding the New Zealand Government support an international independent investigation into mass graves that have been uncovered at two hospitals on the Gaza strip, following weeks of assault by Israeli troops. Among the 392 bodies that have been recovered, are children and elderly civilians. Many of ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
Tonight’s court decision to overturn the summons of the Children’s Minister has enabled the Crown to continue making decisions about Māori without evidence, says Te Pāti Māori spokesperson for Children, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “The judicial system has this evening told the nation that this government can do whatever they want when ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
The government's decision to reintroduce Three Strikes is a destructive and ineffective piece of law-making that will only exacerbate an inherently biased and racist criminal justice system, said Te Pāti Māori Justice Spokesperson, Tākuta Ferris, today. During the time Three Strikes was in place in Aotearoa, Māori and Pasifika received ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
Te Pāti Māori is disgusted at the confirmation that hundreds are set to lose their jobs at Oranga Tamariki, and the disestablishment of the Treaty Response Unit. “This act of absolute carelessness and out of touch decision making is committing tamariki to state abuse.” Said Te Pāti Māori Oranga Tamariki ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters discussed the need for an immediate ceasefire in Gaza, and enhanced cooperation in the Pacific with German Foreign Minister Annalena Baerbock during her first official visit to New Zealand today. "New Zealand and Germany enjoy shared interests and values, including the rule of law, democracy, respect for the international system ...
The Minister Responsible for RMA Reform, Chris Bishop today released his decision on four recommendations referred to him by the Western Bay of Plenty District Council, opening the door to housing growth in the area. The Council’s Plan Change 92 allows more homes to be built in existing and new ...
Thank you, John McKinnon and the New Zealand China Council for the invitation to speak to you today. Thank you too, all members of the China Council. Your effort has played an essential role in helping to build, shape, and grow a balanced and resilient relationship between our two ...
The Government is modernising insurance law to better protect Kiwis and provide security in the event of a disaster, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly announced today. “These reforms are long overdue. New Zealand’s insurance law is complicated and dated, some of which is more than 100 years old. ...
The coalition Government is refreshing its approach to supporting pay equity claims as time-limited funding for the Pay Equity Taskforce comes to an end, Public Service Minister Nicola Willis says. “Three years ago, the then-government introduced changes to the Equal Pay Act to support pay equity bargaining. The changes were ...
Structured literacy will change the way New Zealand children learn to read - improving achievement and setting students up for success, Education Minister Erica Stanford says. “Being able to read and write is a fundamental life skill that too many young people are missing out on. Recent data shows that ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay says Canada’s refusal to comply in full with a CPTPP trade dispute ruling in our favour over dairy trade is cynical and New Zealand has no intention of backing down. Mr McClay said he has asked for urgent legal advice in respect of our ‘next move’ ...
The rights of our children and young people will be enhanced by changes the coalition Government will make to strengthen oversight of the Oranga Tamariki system, including restoring a single Children’s Commissioner. “The Government is committed to delivering better public services that care for our most at-risk young people and ...
The Government is making it easier for minor changes to be made to a building consent so building a home is easier and more affordable, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “The coalition Government is focused on making it easier and cheaper to build homes so we can ...
New Zealand lost a true legend when internationally renowned disability advocate Sir Robert Martin (KNZM) passed away at his home in Whanganui last night, Disabilities Issues Minister Louise Upston says. “Our Government’s thoughts are with his wife Lynda, family and community, those he has worked with, the disability community in ...
Good evening – Before discussing the challenges and opportunities facing New Zealand’s foreign policy, we’d like to first acknowledge the New Zealand Institute of International Affairs. You have contributed to debates about New Zealand foreign policy over a long period of time, and we thank you for hosting us. ...
From today, passengers travelling internationally from Auckland Airport will be able to keep laptops and liquids in their carry-on bags for security screening thanks to new technology, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Creating a more efficient and seamless travel experience is important for holidaymakers and businesses, enabling faster movement through ...
People with an interest in the health of Northland’s marine ecosystems are invited to a public meeting to discuss how to deal with kina barrens, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones will lead the discussion, which will take place on Friday, 10 May, at Awanui Hotel in ...
Kiwi exporters are $100 million better off today with the NZ EU FTA entering into force says Trade Minister Todd McClay. “This is all part of our plan to grow the economy. New Zealand's prosperity depends on international trade, making up 60 per cent of the country’s total economic activity. ...
There are heartening signs that the extractive sector is once again becoming an attractive prospect for investors and a source of economic prosperity for New Zealand, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The beginnings of a resurgence in extractive industries are apparent in media reports of the sector in the past ...
The return of the historic Ō-Rākau battle site to the descendants of those who fought there moved one step closer today with the first reading of Te Pire mō Ō-Rākau, Te Pae o Maumahara / The Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill. The Bill will entrust the 9.7-hectare battle site, five kilometres west ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced 25 new high-speed EV charging hubs along key routes between major urban centres and outlined the Government’s plan to supercharge New Zealand’s EV infrastructure. The hubs will each have several chargers and be capable of charging at least four – and up to 10 ...
The coalition Government will not proceed with the previous Government’s plans to regulate residential property managers, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “I have written to the Chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee to inform him that the Government does not intend to support the Residential Property Managers Bill ...
The Government has announced an independent review into the disability support system funded by the Ministry of Disabled People – Whaikaha. Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston says the review will look at what can be done to strengthen the long-term sustainability of Disability Support Services to provide disabled people and ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith has attended the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva and outlined the Government’s plan to restore law and order. “Speaking to the United Nations Human Rights Council provided us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while responding to issues and ...
The Government and Rotorua Lakes Council are committed to working closely together to end the use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua. Associate Minister of Housing (Social Housing) Tama Potaka says the Government remains committed to ending the long-term use of contracted emergency housing motels in Rotorua by the ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay heads overseas today for high-level trade talks in the Gulf region, and a key OECD meeting in Paris. Mr McClay will travel to Riyadh to meet with counterparts from Saudi Arabia and the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC). “New Zealand’s goods and services exports to the Gulf region ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford has outlined six education priorities to deliver a world-leading education system that sets Kiwi kids up for future success. “I’m putting ambition, achievement and outcomes at the heart of our education system. I want every child to be inspired and engaged in their learning so they ...
The new NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) App is a secure ‘one stop shop’ to provide the services drivers need, Transport Minister Simeon Brown and Digitising Government Minister Judith Collins say. “The NZTA App will enable an easier way for Kiwis to pay for Vehicle Registration and Road User Charges (RUC). ...
Whānau with tamariki growing up in emergency housing motels will be prioritised for social housing starting this week, says Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka. “Giving these whānau a better opportunity to build healthy stable lives for themselves and future generations is an essential part of the Government’s goal of reducing ...
Racing Minister Winston Peters has paid tribute to an icon of the industry with the recent passing of Dave O’Sullivan (OBE). “Our sympathies are with the O’Sullivan family with the sad news of Dave O’Sullivan’s recent passing,” Mr Peters says. “His contribution to racing, initially as a jockey and then ...
Assalaamu alaikum, greetings to you all. Eid Mubarak, everyone! I want to extend my warmest wishes to you and everyone celebrating this joyous occasion. It is a pleasure to be here. I have enjoyed Eid celebrations at Parliament before, but this is my first time joining you as the Minister ...
Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced Pharmac’s largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff. “Access to medicines is a crucial part of many Kiwis’ lives. We’ve committed to a budget allocation of $1.774 billion over four years so Kiwis are ...
Hon Paula Bennett has been appointed as member and chair of the Pharmac board, Associate Health Minister David Seymour announced today. "Pharmac is a critical part of New Zealand's health system and plays a significant role in ensuring that Kiwis have the best possible access to medicines,” says Mr Seymour. ...
Hundreds of New Zealand families affected by Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder (FASD) will benefit from a new Government focus on prevention and treatment, says Health Minister Dr Shane Reti. “We know FASD is a leading cause of preventable intellectual and neurodevelopmental disability in New Zealand,” Dr Reti says. “Every day, ...
Regional Development Minister Shane Jones today attended the official opening of Kaikohe’s new $14.7 million sports complex. “The completion of the Kaikohe Multi Sports Complex is a fantastic achievement for the Far North,” Mr Jones says. “This facility not only fulfils a long-held dream for local athletes, but also creates ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters’ engagements in Türkiye this week underlined the importance of diplomacy to meet growing global challenges. “Returning to the Gallipoli Peninsula to represent New Zealand at Anzac commemorations was a sombre reminder of the critical importance of diplomacy for de-escalating conflicts and easing tensions,” Mr Peters ...
Ambassador Millar, Burgemeester, Vandepitte, Excellencies, military representatives, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen – good morning and welcome to this sacred Anzac Day dawn service. It is an honour to be here on behalf of the Government and people of New Zealand at Buttes New British Cemetery, Polygon Wood – a deeply ...
Distinguished guests - It is an honour to return once again to this site which, as the resting place for so many of our war-dead, has become a sacred place for generations of New Zealanders. Our presence here and at the other special spaces of Gallipoli is made ...
Mai ia tawhiti pamamao, te moana nui a Kiwa, kua tae whakaiti mai matou, ki to koutou papa whenua. No koutou te tapuwae, no matou te tapuwae, kua honoa pumautia. Ko nga toa kua hinga nei, o te Waipounamu, o te Ika a Maui, he okioki tahi me o ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
Overseas models for regulating the oil and gas sector, including their decommissioning regimes, are being carefully scrutinised as a potential template for New Zealand’s own sector, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. The Coalition Government is focused on rebuilding investor confidence in New Zealand’s energy sector as it looks to strengthen ...
New Zealand Food Safety is monitoring overseas recalls of Indian packaged spice products manufactured by MDH and Everest due to concerns over a cancer-causing pesticide. ...
By Stephen Wright and Stefan Armbruster of BenarNews Fiji’s ranking in a global press freedom index has jumped into the top tier of countries with free or mostly free media after its government last year repealed a draconian law that threatened journalists with prison for doing their jobs. Fiji’s improvement ...
We might be in Invercargill but all anyone can talk about is Gore. Specifically, Salford Street. That’s where three-year-old Lachlan Jones lived, south of the centre of town, between the A&P Showgrounds and the Mataura River. Roughly 1.2 km away from the single level home he lived in with his ...
Keen hiker and second-year MSc student Liam Hewson wears two hats when he’s in the great outdoors. “The scientist in me appreciates nature and goes, ‘Oh, there’s that thing and there’s another thing,’ but then the tramper and the outdoorsy person in me thinks, ‘Cool bush.’” Born and bred in ...
MONDAY I lined up the latest round of civil servants from city hall against the wall, and signalled for the firing squad to drop their rifles. I stepped up onto a wooden crate to look at the office workers in the eye. But that didn’t feel right, so I found ...
After a long and illustrious career as a goal kicker, Dan Carter’s favourite way to unwind is… kicking goals. Why can’t he get enough of it? And what it’s like to watch him do it for an hour straight? A semicircle of people wielding cameras and phones has formed in ...
Dame Susan Devoy takes us through her life in television, including late night ER debriefs, her proudest CTI moment and the show she watches in secret. Quite aside from her four world champion squash titles, Dame Susan Devoy will likely go down in history as one of the best Celebrity ...
Hera Lindsay Bird reveals the best places in Ōtepoti to score more for your apocalypse-prep book hoard.Sometimes I get the feeling I’ve been killed in a car crash, and this second half of my life is just the brain unspooling itself, like one of those episodes of a hospital ...
ThreeNow’s new murder mystery series takes us on a dark, damp journey into the Australian wilderness.This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. High Country is ThreeNow’s new Australian eight-part crime drama, set in a remote part of the Victorian highlands. It tells ...
Introducing a new way to read The Spinoff every weekend. After nearly 10 years of being an online magazine, we’re finally embracing the weekend liftout. Despite our best efforts to convince you otherwise, writers and editors at The Spinoff don’t work weekend. It is through the sheer power of technology ...
Tip one: let yourself be nurtured by this big old man. Tip two: don’t ask him to adopt you. So, you’ve arrived at your first session with a new therapist. He tells you to make yourself comfortable and you opt for the tweed armchair, hoping it makes you look like ...
I didn’t know books could open you back up; that there were books that stayed with you, where reading was like a chemical event. I knew nothing.The Sunday Essay is made possible thanks to the support of Creative New Zealand.Not too long ago, I was listening to the American ...
Former Olympic swimmer James Magnussen has already started training for the Enhanced games, though says he won’t start taking performance enhancing substances until about nine months out from the competition. The Australian world champion was the first athlete to be announced by Enhanced, but he says the organisation has had ...
Everyone thinks he’s dead. Every day they expect his body to be washed up along the coast. Most likely up Karitane way, the way the tide’s running. But nobody’ll be too surprised if his body’s never found. Even in death he wouldn’t have wished for such attention. He would have ...
Council members voted 21 to 4 in favour of Ahluwalia returning to the Laucala campus following a much-awaited meeting in Vanuatu this week. It comes as USP and its two unions — the Association of the University of the South Pacific Staff (AUSPS) and the Administration and Support Staff Union ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicola Henry, Professor & Australian Research Council Future Fellow, Social and Global Studies Centre, RMIT University Shutterstock Following an emergency meeting of the National Cabinet this week, Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has announced a raft of measures to tackle the problem ...
Analysis - A poll showing the opposition is more popular than the government raises questions, politicians go through their 'trial by pay rise' and a Green MP loses her cool in the debating chamber. ...
The entire stretch of Tokomaru Bay on the East Coast will be subject to a joint customary marine title for two hapū, and extending up to four miles out to sea. A High Court judge has found the two groups, who during the case settled a dispute over boundaries for ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By James Hall, Lecturer, Media & Cultural Studies, Edith Cowan University A longstanding feud between TikTok and Universal Music Group seems to have finally reached an end, with both parties signing a deal that will see Universal-backed music returned to the social media ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Siobhan O’Dean, Postdoctoral Research Associate, The Matilda Centre for Research in Mental Health and Substance Use, University of Sydney After several highly publicised alleged murders of women in Australia, the Albanese government this week pledged more than A$925 million over five years ...
Political parties have now fully disclosed the donations they received last year - with National getting more than double the cash of any other party. ...
A Pacific regionalism expert has called out New Zealand's Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters for withholding information from the public on AUKUS military pact. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard de Grijs, Professor of Astrophysics, Macquarie University Bruno Scramgnon/Pexels All systems are “go” for tonight’s launch of China’s next step in a carefully planned lunar exploration program. Placed on top of a powerful Long March 5 rocket, the Chang’e 6 ...
National returned a massive donation the day after a Newsroom story linked the donors to a property being investigated for operating unlawfully as a migrant workers’ hostel. The party’s 2023 donation filings, released on Friday, show it returned a $200,000 donation from Buen Holdings on August 23. That was the ...
Pacific Media Watch New Zealand has slumped to an unprecedented 19th place in the annual Reporters Without Borders World Press Freedom Index survey released today on World Press Freedom Day — May 3. This was a drop of six places from 13th last year when it slipped out of its ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Joshua Black, Political Historian and Administrator Officer, Australian Historical Association, Australian National University Australia has had its fair share of public record-keeping controversies in recent years. Some have been mere farce, as in the case of two formerly government-owned filing cabinets (containing ...
Heavenly Culture, World Peace, Restoration of Light (HWPL), a United Nations-affiliated organization dedicated to fostering peace through civilian-led initiatives, has issued a statement in response to the escalating conflict between Israel and Iran. ...
A poem by Tessa Keenan, from AUP New Poets 10. Mātou These days we are a photograph; one of a farm strewn with cows that used to be bright harakeke or swamp. The kids point at it and say the sun sits behind a smudge (left by someone at Christmas); ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Small Things Like These by Claire Keegan (Faber & Faber, $25)The masterful Irish writer ...
Marriage and civil union statistics record the number of marriages and civil unions registered in New Zealand each year, and divorce statistics record the number of divorces granted in New Zealand each year. Key facts Marriages and civil unions In ...
Marriage and civil union statistics record the number of marriages and civil unions registered in New Zealand each year, and divorce statistics record the number of divorces granted in New Zealand each year. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Lennon Y.C. Chang, Associate Professor of Cyber Risk and Policy, Deakin University Taiwan stands out as a beacon of democracy, innovation and resilience in an increasingly autocratic region. But this is under growing threat. In recent years, China has used a variety ...
In this excerpt from her new memoir, Dame Susan Devoy remembers her turn as star contestant on the 2022 season of Celebrity Treasure Island. The most anxious time of every day was pre-elimination, when you knew this could be your final day on the show. I felt such contradictory emotions, ...
A week that began in triumph ended in an all-too-familiar disaster for the Green Party. Duncan Greive asks if there’s something in the mission that breaks its best and brightest. A long, strange week for the Green party began with a fantastic poll result. On one level this is hardly ...
By Lydia Lewis, RNZ Pacific journalist Vanuatu’s former prime minister and opposition MP Ishmael Kalsakau has stepped down — just two days after he confirmed he was the rightful opposition leader. Kalsakau, MP for Port Vila, confirmed to ABC’s Pacific Beat, and the Vanuatu Daily Post on Thursday that he ...
What’s to blame for the coalition’s choppy start? Six months in, and the mojo meter is in the doldrums. A new poll would put National out of power and sees its leader, Chris Luxon, sliding in popularity. How much is it about policy, how much coalition management and a perception ...
The striking report goes far beyond the proposed repeal of the Oranga Tamariki Act’s Treaty of Waitangi provision, and its impact should be felt far beyond the unique circumstances of the claim it addresses. Earlier this week, the Waitangi Tribunal released an interim report on the government’s proposed repeal of ...
The world has been experiencing a productivity slowdown, from which New Zealand has not been exempt. COVID-19 temporarily boosted labour productivity, but more recently, productivity has retreated. The overall trend since 2007 has been one of slow productivity ...
What’s more wasteful than spending $315k on syrup and machine maintenance? Trying to drum up a controversy about it.Cast your mind back to the pre-pandemic idylls of 2019. A “rat” was a disgusting rodent and not a self-administered plague test; the sixth Labour government was in power; and the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kate Fitz-Gibbon, Professor of Social Sciences, Faculty of Arts, Monash University, Monash University Ken stocker/Shutterstock In the wake of numerous killings of women allegedly by men’s violence in 2024, thousands of Australians have joined rallies across the country to demand action ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Henry Cutler, Professor and Director, Macquarie University Centre for the Health Economy, Macquarie University Oleg Ivanov IL/Shutterstock Waiting times for public hospital elective surgery have been in the news ahead of this year’s federal budget. That’s the type of non-emergency surgery ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Konstantine Panegyres, McKenzie Postdoctoral Fellow, Historical and Philosophical Studies, The University of Melbourne Amna Artist/Shutterstock One of the earliest descriptions of someone with cancer comes from the fourth century BC. Satyrus, tyrant of the city of Heracleia on the Black Sea, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By John Rose, Professor of Sustainable Future Transport, University of Sydney LanaElcova/Shutterstock Electric vehicles are often seen as the panacea to cutting emissions – and air pollution – from transport. Is this view correct? Yes – but only once uptake accelerates. Despite the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Giselle Natassia Woodley, Researcher and Phd Candidate, Edith Cowan University There is widespread agreement Australia needs to do better when it comes to gender-based violence. Anger and frustration at the numbers of women being killed saw national rallies over the weekend and ...
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[People have become lax with linking. Please include direct links when quoting or making references and follow basic courtesy rules on this site. We will start moderating for this.]
👍
In support of what Incognito has said. Also, if you are having trouble linking from any device, please ask for help. Lots of people here that can assist.
Maybe there is a way out of the Poto Williams & Tamati Kruger ethno-vandalisim. (Stuff article quotes)
A spokesperson for the group, kaumātua Paki Nikora, said: “We are here because of the desecration of all our huts that have all had a historical connection to Tūhoe, and also all the hunters and trampers that frequented Te Urewera over 50 years plus.
“You can’t tell me a hut that sheltered our people for that long doesn’t belong to Te Urewera.”
"He said TUT did not represent all Tūhoe."
And local actual outdoor working Tuhoe (as opposed to indoor Ngati Taone) highlight one of my key worries–“Are you, minister, prepared to accept all responsibility … when all huts are removed and there's no shelter in the likelihood of emergencies, search and rescue, extreme weather events?”
And the clincher! “We don’t feel colonised by those huts,” he said. “We’re practical people, we just want the huts to stay in while we go hunting.
[What Stuff article? Provide direct links to quoted text, thanks – Incognito]
By taking sides in a long running inter-tribal squabble?
https://www.teaomaori.news/tuhoe-marae-remove-support-te-uru-taumatua
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/353946/tuhoe-s-post-treaty-settlement-woes-evident-in-wake-of-festival
TUT and the environmental disaster that is their management of the Ureweras is a classic systemic outcome that inevitably happens when you give people a bunch of money and hand over control of a complex system when those people have no skills, no experience and no desire in managing the asset. Set up to fail, with the best of intentions all round I am sure. Pity about the Kiwi and the Kokako, but you can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs, eh?
TUT can do what they like with the Ureweras. I’m not some poor bastard who spent forty years of my life at war with introduced predators and gloried at the re-introduction of the Kokako. TUT clearly want to use the "park" as an asset to maximise the comfort of a subsistance lifestyle. None of this saving native flora and fauna. TUT are keen on a great leap backwards to the purity of the lifestyle of Te Kooti. Paddocks to graze horses and half-wild livestock. Over-run with pigs for an easy food source. Possums for pelts. Quiet valleys empty of nosy parkers like DOC, the police, and fussy Pakeha trampers are ideal for illegal activity to provide a nice stream of cash.
But like I said, they've got the park now and they can do what they want with it, they can shit in the woods all over the place for all I care. Tuhoe didn't sign the treaty, etc etc.
However, it's going to become our problem when their communities health crashes and the TB infested fauna, predators and lawlessness starts to bleed out of the borders of the third work ethnostate that is being created.
What then? One thing for sure – Tuhoe are busily demolishing any support for further co-governance initiatives in the conservation estate basically forever.
This is a gross over reaction and classic Maori-blaming but whatever floats your boat.
It isn't "Maori blaming". It is a simple statement of class based fact. The thing that needs to be honestly discussed here (instead of being a dick and playing the race card) is what TUT actually want. Everyone sits around singing Kumbaya to a deified idea of tribal Maori as the noble savage in tune with his environment. But what if they are just a bunch of dirt poor hillbillies behaving like dirt poor hillbillies everywhere behave?
If a bunch of middle class New Yorkers spent fifty years in an Appalacian park clearing paths, replanting chestnuts, re-introducing bald eagles and bears and wolves and building and maintaining huts then had to give the park back to a bunch of dumb local hard scrabble hillbillies who don’t like dangerous wild animals and they wrecked the huts and dug up the roads because they just want to be left alone by the federal authorities to moonshine, shoot squirrels and generally live like poor rural people you'd get the same level of dismay, but who is to say they are necessarily wrong? That is how they want to live, leave them alone.
I think we should cut the Kumbaya bullshit and have a grown up discussion about the purpose of the park is as it pertains to a community in grinding poverty. It is Tuhoe’s asset now, but it still part of New Zealand after all. If we were a bit more honest about procedings then we might come to something a bit more workable than what seems to be happening at the moment, which is a bunch of locals lying through their teeth about their real intentions to guillable Pakeha who desperately want to believe.
What role does anyone outside of the legla owners have over land that does not belong to them. There is legislation that appies to all of us and special legislation covering Te Urewera.
Why does this Maori owned land get singled out for attention?
What role will people intent on looking back to what happened when the land was a NP have? Why do they think they have a role? Is there something in our constitutional arrangements that enables beady eyed pakeha to say
'hey we know what is best'?
and 'we especially know what is best for Maori.'
Sounds pretty paternalistic to me.
Are you on the mailing list for the Iwi?
https://mailchi.mp/ngaituhoe/te-manu-whititua-issue-n3-1515866?e=f96a1d00b6
Have you read the aspiration and management plans?
Most of all I would like you to reflect on why you feel you have a right or that anyone has a right to blow a lot of reactionary hot air about.
Does it make a difference that Maori here have lived on this land since time immemorial? I think it does.
Pull your head in about using words like 'subsistence' in a pejorative way Not everyone is aspiring to follow the American Dream or a prosperity church where monetary riches mean everything.
More than anything 'will the sky fall in' if we let this group get on with their vision for the land?
No it won't.
Toi tu te whenua
The land alone endures.
Dude did you read what I wrote, or are you a bot?
I am not a dude and yes I did read it. At first I thought it was supportive of letting Tuhoe do as they want on land that is precious to them. However it was just wrapped up that way with the implied criticism being the stings all the way through like
subsistence life style
and this
The myth of naughty Tuhoe being responsible for other joint treaty based initiatives possibly failing. Is it co-governance when iwi hold the majority on the Board, when those appointed by the Minister are not DoC reps but people of vast experience in natural land use management etc?
The myth of this arrangement being co-governance,…it is governance as opposed to co-governance.
The trigger words such as 'ethno-state'
Are you saying that just because Tuhoe have got the land back that they are unable to have access to any of the Govt supports that other groups, land owners have. So TB, no access to any funding? so health no access to any funding, so lawlessness no police presence and access?
"The myth of this arrangement being co-governance,…it is governance as opposed to co-governance."
The arrangement is described as co-governance by the Maori Law Review.
The Deed of Settlement states "Te Urewera will have its own legislation and exist as a separate legal identity. It will be governed by Tūhoe and Crown nominees to act in the best interests of Te Urewera."
This article states "As a contrast to the successful Waikato River Authority, the Te Urewera co-governance agreement provides an indication of flaws the co-governance model can have and how it chafes against the reality that it does fail to give full effect to Treaty principles."
Where do you get the idea this is not a co-governance model?
Because it has a board made up of a majority of Maori and with appointments from Minister of Conservation. Two of these appointment that I know, I think, are not Maori but who knows anyone's whakapapa unless they care to share it. Minister of Conservation is not limited to appointing people from DoC or who are European. They are not there to push an party line or necessarily to espouse DoC's view.
Co-governance is being used as a loaded word to bash all hell out of ideas about Three Waters, Auckland Treaty settlement s etc. The concept is to bring about good governance or Mana Motuhake. The use of 'co' is best avoided unless giving a whistle out to nay sayers about Three Waters which you may be doing for all I know. .
I note your link to the Maori Law Review……I would make a small wager that if this was being written now as opposed to 2012 they would be unlikely to refer to it as 'co-governance' bearing in mind the rubbish being talked about 3 three waters etc.
You make no comment about what the actual paragraph says about Te Urewera and Tuhoe seizing only on references to bash me with your idea of the woes of co-governance.
This commentary is significant. In it Tuhoe are being consistent with their view of a step along the way……
'The issue with this fractured co-governance arrangement is a difficult one to grapple with when divorced from the historical context of the area. Co-governance of Te Urewera is not understood by Tūhoe as the end goal, but is a stepping stone towards a resumption of authority that Tūhoe never agreed to lose. (my underlining) Kruger commented that “we are committed to washing away dependency on the Crown, and raising maximum autonomy for Tūhoe people".[24] Prioritising the authority of the Crown due to their greater resources undermines the purpose of restoring authority to Tūhoe. In practice, it keeps the land subject to Crown control, and does not practically aid mana whenua in engaging with the land.'
What is that is concerning, from my angle it seems you do not wish to allow any group of Maori hold to their own land if it means exercising all the powers that they are entitled to.
Are you now going to get very concerned that there is not wholesale access to Ngamatea Station or Mt Linton Station. Both freehold land where the owners actively restrict access. …….I didn't think so……
Maori are not restricting access. They have a work programme of removing huts. Please do not conflate access with camping in a hut.
"Because it has a board made up of a majority of Maori and with appointments from Minister of Conservation. "
That doesn't make it not co-governance.
"Co-governance of Te Urewera is not understood by Tūhoe as the end goal, but is a stepping stone towards a resumption of authority that Tūhoe never agreed to lose."
So Tuhoe themselves accepted the arrangement was co-governance.
"What is that is concerning, from my angle it seems you do not wish to allow any group of Maori hold to their own land if it means exercising all the powers that they are entitled to."
Legally it is not their land. This is the point you don't seem to grasp. Te Urewera owns itself. Rightly or wrongly, that is what the treaty settlement determined.
tinderdry6 @5.03pm
You are fixated on co-governance. What is this all about?
Could you call it Mana Motuhake as that is what Tuhoe call it. Then we will know you are not using co-governance as some sort dog whistle to nay sayers about the concept. That is my great concern that people are holding up Tuhoe and saying we don't this so therefore as we don't like this we also don't want any other permutation. Which of course is rubbish if you don't understand the background.
Te Urewera is a 'The fee simple estate in the establishment land vests in Te Urewera and is held under, and in accordance with, this Act.
The management regime is by a board with majority Tuhoe appointments. The remining 3 are appointed by the minister of Conservation and are not DoC people.
Sections 3.4, 5 of the Act are important.
Te Urewera
Tūhoe and the Crown: shared views and intentions
(9)
Tūhoe and the Crown share the view that Te Urewera should have legal recognition in its own right, with the responsibilities for its care and conservation set out in the law of New Zealand. To this end, Tūhoe and the Crown have together taken a unique approach, as set out in this Act, to protecting Te Urewera in a way that reflects New Zealand’s culture and values.
(10)
The Crown and Tūhoe intend this Act to contribute to resolving the grief of Tūhoe and to strengthening and maintaining the connection between Tūhoe and Te Urewera.'
I think that vesting an entity away from NP, crown land etc and appointing a majority board is very close to saying it is administered/controlled by this board, …..as it should be.
Many areas of Maori owned land/Incorporations have management committees but no-one says that the owners sitting behind those chosen to be on a committee have lost all connection with the land
The board has members appointed by the trustees of Tūhoe Te Uru Taumatua
'Te Uru Taumatua represents the Tūhoe nation and the lands and wealth held in common for Tūhoe. The purpose of the Governing Board of Te Uru Taumatua is to lead and serve the cultural permanency and prosperity of Tūhoetana by unlocking the unity potential of Mana Motuhake. Advancing Tūhoe social and economic development in a way that is distinctively Tūhoe recognises that we will build the Tūhoe nation with our minds, our hearts and our hands.
Your Board is committed to getting the best and right skills, advice and expertise from within Tūhoe and outside. Tūhoe settlement assets and resources must be preserved and grown to support our development now and into the future. Tūhoe culture and heritage pathways must be directed and grown with this development.
This Board works for Tūhoe and on behalf of Tūhoe'.
https://www.ngaituhoe.iwi.nz/tut
You are splitting hairs when you say that the people of Tuhoe have no interest in the land…that they cannot call it 'their' land. Maori hold land interest very differently to the way land is held in the European system, Joint ownership is all, individualism is not.
Over the course of this discussion I have linked to the legislation the settlement, the management documents of Tuhoe. You have let all these drift over you preferring 'gotchas' from ignorant MSM or dated commentaries.
Why is this?
I am coming to the view that your interest is not in acquiring knowledge and therefore learning things about how different people in NZ structure their affairs.
It is an exercise in nit picking, splitting hairs, and mainly avoiding a 'fair, large and liberal' look at ways that land can be held and managed. It is also not about expecting the best of people, or of giving people a chance and neither is it respectful of the different ways that people can manage land.
It is not benign, it is not genuine.
Hopefully that you are not applying this once over lightly approach to the Maunga in Tamaki Makaurau.
"What role does anyone outside of the legla owners have over land that does not belong to them. "
The legal owner of Te Urewera is Te Urewera.
"Why does this Maori owned land get singled out for attention?"
This claim that Te Urewera is 'Maori owned land' is a distortion of the treaty settlement. Te Urewera owns itself and is co-governed.
"On 11 September 2012, Te Kotahi ā Tūhoe, the Ngāi Tūhoe negotiations team, accepted the Crown offer to settle the historical claims of Tūhoe. The Crown offer includes financial, commercial and cultural redress valued at approximately $170 million; an historical account and Crown apology; the co-governance of Te Urewera lands, which will be vested in a new legal identity created by legislation; and mana motuhake in relation to the delivery of government and iwi services to Tūhoe communities." (emphasis mine).
If co-governance is to deliver on its very real potential, (and it can), there needs to be a recognition that the co-governance entity, and partners, are in place to deliver outcomes that are best for these special environments, and the people of New Zealand who are willing to respect and enjoy them.
I take that as meaning that many of the people who want Te Urewera returned to a more pristine condition, have secure lives and incomes elsewhere. And that this security is necessarily derived from places that are not, and cannot be, pristine.
So we cannot demand that someone else's land remains in its original condition without ensuring that their economic circumstances don't make it impossible, i.e. humans always and everywhere will do what is expedient to make their lives more comfortable.
I may have totally misinterpreted your meaning though.
I have no problem with your interpretation AB.
On the wider I think it is cynical though
It was also mine until I read and digested the last paras, and noted the trigger words in the post. Neither were in quotes to signify that this was a view not supported but quoted from somewhere. I think Sanctuary believes that these words apply.
subsistence
ethno-state
Here's the stuff article link.
TUT is being openly critcised by some Tuhoe Kaumatua. Are they also 'Maori blaming'?
Why are you asking leading questions? Do you have anything useful to add to this debate?
Perhaps you should have waited the 21 minutes between my comments.
Perhaps you could have acknowledged that I provided the link.
Perhaps you should have read the comment I was responding to.
Perhaps you should not ask leading questions in spurious comments.
Perhaps nobody should have to wait for you here for 21 min, or however long, on the off chance that something more/better might be coming from you.
Perhaps the link as such was not such a problem but the linking behaviour was.
Perhaps I do read all comments but your comment was a problem.
Perhaps you have problems with reading comprehension.
Perhaps you should pull your head in.
If you had read the comment I was responding to, you would have understood.
Unsurprisingly, you continue your preference for missing the points and choosing to misunderstand that your comment was the issue that I responded to; it was neither helpful nor constructive. In addition, you didn’t help your case with the inane response @ 2.2.1.2.1.1. I’d told you already that I read all comments but glossing over that is part of your MO here and you’re too fixated on your own navel.
So Tinderdry you know all about the background to this?
Where have you got your info from to speak on this?
Do you subscribe to the view that Maori are a homogenous race who all believe the same thing or are they like every other human being who when in a group may have differences of opinion and approach.
This homogenous group all thinking the same owes much to the concept of the 'noble savage'.
On every local authority in the land there are groups of councillors who do not think the same as each other or as some of their constituents. In those cases most of us think that having differing ideas is a good thing enabling all issues to come out and be discussed.
Why does this somehow morph into being a bad thing in Maori controlled organisation? You don't believe that differing viewpoints and discussion is of value to Maori groups or Tuhoe in particular.
Why is that?
Could it be because we have been led by the nose by MSM firstly into some false equivalence that 'access equals huts' and that it is newsworthy that a private group has people who disagree with them or as in the update from Tuhoe.
'Waimana taking misinformed pākeha for a ride on their issues and pākeha taking Waimana for a ride with their anxieties.'
Says it all really with a bit of humour lacking in MSM
https://mailchi.mp/ngaituhoe/te-manu-whititua-issue-n3-1515866?e=f96a1d00b6
"Where have you got your info from to speak on this?"
From, amongst other sources, the links I have provided.
"Do you subscribe to the view that Maori are a homogenous race who all believe the same thing or are they like every other human being who when in a group may have differences of opinion and approach."
No, I do not subscribe to the view that ‘all Maori are a homogenous race…’. Tamati Kruger has claimed to speak for all Tuhoe, as in this article, and it is clear that he doesn't.
"You don't believe that differing viewpoints and discussion is of value to Maori groups or Tuhoe in particular."
Differing viewpoints is healthy.
"Could it be because we have been led by the nose by MSM firstly into some false equivalence that 'access equals huts' and that it is newsworthy that a private group has people who disagree with them or as in the update from Tuhoe."
This 'private group' consists of Tuhoe Kaumatua. It includes 8,000 people who signed a petition to stop the hut removals. That suggests a fairly widespread dissatisfaction with what is happening within the community.
It is also relevant to consider how TUT got to this place. This article provides some background, including disputes between TUT and DoC over maintenance of the huts and bridges inside the park.
In the context of your comment about " false equivalence that 'access equals huts' ", of course access doesn’t equal huts, but you might want to reflect on Tamati Kruger's comment that "opening Te Urewera to the public was “way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi."
‘Kruger told Stuff in November that the relationship with the Crown post-settlement had failed, and Tūhoe wanted a re-set, dealing directly with Crown-Māori Relations Minister Kelvin Davis instead of DOC.’
Your quote
This seems like a good idea. DoC seem to be doing a fair bit of micromanaging.
I have no problem with Tamati Kruger's comment. It is the role of the landowner to set priorities. Their priority is not about opening up. Fair enough. Another priority if you look at the work plans is to manage what they can and not to spread themselves too thinly.
I as a land owner also have my priorities on my land. Public access is also not a priority but I am working with arborists on trees at the front and this will have a benefit for the public as leaves or little branches may be less likely to fall on the pavement or in the stormwater drains.
I cannot locate it now but in some thing that you have linked to is a criticism that Tuhoe closed access during Covid. Really what silly ideas people have, during Covid we were restricted from travelling, warned about going to places where we might need to be rescued, keep close, don’t mix willy nilly. So Tuhoe follows this and is criticised for it.
You can see Tuhoe cannot win with statements like this being trotted out as if they were justified.
"‘Kruger told Stuff in November that the relationship with the Crown post-settlement had failed, and Tūhoe wanted a re-set, dealing directly with Crown-Māori Relations Minister Kelvin Davis instead of DOC.’"
"I have no problem with Tamati Kruger's comment. "
The problem is that Kruger's comments cut across the treaty settlement. He's trying to renegotiate the settlement by media, and that is precisely what will get people antsy about co-governance.
That is complete and utter rubbish.
Tamati Kruger is trying to explain things in words of one syllable, comic form might have been easier, to people who are desperately trying not to understand.
Treaty Settlements are often varied, amended etc. If it was found that the DoC input has not been helpful or Tuhoe focussed then it is the right of the Board to raise legislative amendments. Just because a settlement & legislation has been enacted it does not stop dialogue between Tuhoe and Ministers or other Treaty partners.
Kruger is attempting to remove DoC from the conversation, and replace them with the Crown-Māori Relations Minister. It is irrelevant whether you think this is a good idea, it is an attempt to amend the treaty settlement.
Kruger states that "opening Te Urewera to the public was “way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi." Again, that is an attempt to change the treaty settlement. Kruger doesn't make that call. Public access is a right enshrined in the settlement. It is not exercised or prioritised at his whim.
“Treaty Settlements are often varied, amended etc.”
Are they? Can you provide some examples? The ones I’m aware of are financial adjustments that are built into the original arrangements.
“If it was found that the DoC input has not been helpful or Tuhoe focussed then it is the right of the Board to raise legislative amendments.”
To raise them, yes. Not to unilaterally declare them
So the hut protestors are not trying to negotiate by media…..only Kruger. That figures. Goose/gander comes to mind.
What does this mean?
What is 'unilaterally declare' them? What is the difference between raise them and declaring them? Tuhoe can only raise them, if it wants to raise them strongly is that some sort of a problem?
"What is 'unilaterally declare' them?"
In the declaration that public access is "“way down the list of priorities” for Tūhoe, as it brought no benefit to the iwi."". Kruger has done amazing work for Tuhoe, but it is clear he is out of step with a significant number of his iwi, and it is not his call to place the benefit of the iwi over a key element of the treaty settlement.
"What is the difference between raise them and declaring them?"
The difference in this context is seen in this article. DoC have been trying to deal with the safety issues in the park for years, but Kruger's comments mirror the resistance of TUT to allow the work to be completed. This is not in the spirit or the letter of the treaty settlement, and seems designed to exclude the public, at least for a time.
.
Shanreagh
Let's hope this comment earns you a tweet from Moana Maniapoto saying "We see you, Shanreagh, and you're very, very special… a great Totara … a Woman of Great Mana … a unique Go-Between uniting the two noble races". And you'll go all giggly, won't you … like a small child who's just met an All Black.
A great example of an affluent Professional-Managerial Class narcissist – a Luvvie, if you will – paternalistically "protecting" powerful Māori as if they're small children – eternally innocent, eternally virtuous – … no matter the context.
I have no doubt you'd have automatically defended the slave labour thriving under iwi-owned enterprises within the fishing industry. Ostentatious displays of virtue-signaling for in-group reputational enhancement. The pure narcissism, pure self-indulgence of the bourgeois middle to upper-middle class. Entirely at the expense of the good of the Country.
#LuxuryBeliefs
[This is nothing but a personal attack on another commenter. Please cut it out – Incognito]
What tiresome ad hominem rubbish you speak rather than debating the issues.
Have you got any views on the concepts I have been raising like Maor world view, beliefs, legislation, treaty settlements or are you happy with your contribution of
Luvvie?
narcissist, self indulgence
luxury beliefs
What is missing though is your belief that 'I am a pretty little communist' and I really miss that kind of in depth response
Way out with the All Blacks though. Since 1981 they have left me cold. I have not seen a game on TV or in person since being a bystander at the Molesworth st happening and then being barricaded in my house by a Police presence at the top of my street, so buses full of weeing fans could unload, while defending the mighty boks and All Blacks at Athletic park.
Why do you think I would protect the items you have quoted in your last para. I have been talking only about Tuhoe not fishing? I really don't see the connection unless you are talking about the bed of the lake which was not part of the settlement and noting that Fish & Game Council still has jurisdiction.
Your ad hominem and misogynistic comments say more about you than me. That you are afraid to debate the issues so you are only able to take personal pot shots. Most of your suppositions about me are incorrect.
My simple point is this:
On a weighing of righting wrongs or keeping tattered, battered, rat ridden huts I automatically choose the righting of wrongs. In fact I would place the righting of wrongs above almost anything especially when it is the righting of wrongs where the state/crown had inflicted the wrong.
Swordfish presumably your priority is to keep the huts over the bigger picture of righting a wrong. This surprises me.
I do recall some pretty horrendous stories about your parents that may have knocked your view of people and you have automatically applied what you have endured there on a race based view to situations that are not the same.
If that is offensive to you then what can I say?
I'm still laughing at the All Blacks reference…how wrong can you be? I believed then, as I do now, that there is no sporting issue that should guide our diplomatic stance. I can see parallels that those who supported the Springboks could also be the ones to support the huts over the righting of wrongs to Tuhoe.
I like Moana but my favourite NZ poets would be Hone Tuwhare and Api Taylor. I have never heard the term Luvvie and am not paternalistic…a contradiction in terms for me really
No Ordinary Sun – a poem for all times since 1945.
I have lots of favorites of Hone's and love Api's He Rau Aroha: A Hundred Years of Love (Penguin), was a runner-up in the Pegasus Book Awards. This is a collection of short stories.
Mod note
Heavy footed people with no understanding and a swag of entitlement can wreak more damage than a possum.
There are pest management plans covering possum and other introduced pests if you cared to look on the sites run by Tuhoe.
As for pelts being taken instead of just left, this is such an old activity that really compounds the anti posters lack of knowledge about what has been going on here.
An uncle had traplines up here for years prior to and after the area was made into a NP. All legal and above board. there was always a market for good pelts and that was why in the old days when tramping and coming across a trapper hut or bivvy and the inevitable warm welcome you made sure about where you might sleep, that there might be a skin or two stretching out on the wirewove.
Even as late as the 1980s in hut on the big stations up close to the boundaries there were shepherds huts where the occupants were doing the same thing.
The skins had a market here in NZ but my Uncle, in an effort to maximise his returns, and because he did this as a living, used to send his pelts to the London fur & skin markets. These old time trappers did this not because they loved possums, far from it but because they loved the land, the bush and the isolation and could get a living from it. They saw themselves as being able to help in a small way with the recovery of the bush.
"Heavy footed people with no understanding and a swag of entitlement can wreak more damage than a possum. "
Perhaps you could provide a link to support your assertion.
Because there is lots (and lots) of evidence the other way. Possums are a very significant ecological pest – which are largely uncontrolled by any predator (hence the need for trapping and/or poisoning).
https://www.pestdetective.org.nz/culprits/possum/
You think I am being literal about lots of trampers causing damage as against the damage caused by a possum? Sad. But if this was what I was talking about I am sure there would be evidence about human overuse/degradation of landscape that then leaves the land prone to further degradation by introduced pests. Eg over use of high country land by stock, degrades tussock cover, rabbits get in etc
No I am talking about the damage to reputation, to mana, to a correct and preceptive view of history and an openness to facing the future that is caused by closed minds. The 'heavy footed' people are those of us who want to criticise without knowledge, to indulge in criticism of Maori life styles without knowing what and whether they fit in with a Maori world view, as opposed to a Pakeha world view.
For other 'heavy footedness' just read some of the earlier comments, made over this issue over the weekend.
For a view that draws on the plans for the future pl read the websites for Tuhoe and this about the issue being discussed.
https://mailchi.mp/ngaituhoe/te-manu-whititua-issue-n3-1515866?e=f96a1d00b6
Gosh – I'm glad you're not in charge of conservation….
Because actual species being wiped out is just a tad more important than theoretical 'reputational damage'
Being put in charge of NZ conservation/environment is a hospital pass.
Only Parker is still in parliament. Former Minister for the Environment Goff went on to become Mayor of Auckland. Apart from MPs in the 6th Labour Government, no former Minister of Conservation is still in Parliament, although Wollaston and Chadwick went on to do stints are regional city mayors (Nelson and Rotorua, respectively), and that well-know environmentalist Dr Nick Smith is now Mayor of Nelson.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_of_Conservation_(New_Zealand)
Sounds like a pit-stop on an accelerated career pathway! Goff is now the High Commissioner in London.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/former-auckland-mayor-phil-goff-confirmed-as-top-diplomat-in-london/2AN3KI2COHOUCJS4LNYYUEZAVU/
Could be! Former Minister of Conservation Tim Groser skipped the perks and burdens of local Government and went straight to the post of New Zealand's ambassador to the United States of America.
There's also Joe Walding (High Commissioner to the UK), Russell Marshall (High Commissioner to the United Kingdom and Nigeria, and Ambassador to Ireland) and, more recently, Trevor Mallard (Ambassador to Ireland), who was Minister for the Environment towards the end of the 5th Labour Government.
Hopefully some of them had more than just an eye to their career pathways while they were doing their Ministerial duties, although you do have to wonder sometimes.
I'm certainly one who believes that all politicians should be mandatorialy (goodness, is that even a word) retired after a certain number of terms in office (combining local, national and official postings).
I don't think that political re-treads (from any party) do a good job representing our country overseas. Certainly not a better one than the people actually trained and educated to be ambassadors.
Well if you think that all the misinformation about Tuhoe that has been spouted today and over the weekend is theoretical ……
8000 people mislead by MSM 'shock horror' have signed some sort of petition in the belief that Tuhoe are doing something or not doing something on their land. So that is 8000 X 9 (the comms calc about complaints and how they spread to others) I would say that is far from theoretical.
I have not made a false equivalence. One possum destroys, we know that. Tuhoe knows that and has trapping etc programmes.
Just who will be working to ensure that the damage to the reputation of Tuhoe is mended after this onslaught. Will you be? Or do you still think the crown owned/ns the land, it is like a NP and Tuhoe have only a minor role.
You have shown that you are not able to understand my point and that is a pity. I agree that species are endangered, I said so in reply. I also feel that reputational damage is hard to overcome even if you are actually in the right, as Tuhoe is.
And, equally clearly, you have shown that you are …. unwilling … to consider the points that I and others have raised.
8,000 local people protesting – Tuhoe kaumatua among them – but hey, it's all bullshit from MSM (/sarc/). Your blinkers have narrowed your vision to the point that you're unable to see the cliff you're rushing towards.
Happy to consider them if you can get basic facts correct.
Sadly lacking so far and when I tried to broaden the idea that misinformed people can damage reputations you did not get the analogy and we had some fruitless debate. You still don't understand reputational damage do you?
You are now saying that 8000 misinformed people are worth more than the reputation of a group doing its best following the settling of a bad Treaty claim.
I have linked to this before. The ref to ‘Waimana’ are to those grumpy with the Tuhoe Board.
Mentioned were DOC, Labour, TUT, Huts, even Trump, e ahu pēhea ana koutou? What is your plan?
Waimana taking misinformed pākeha for a ride on their issues and pākeha taking Waimana for a ride with their anxieties.
[image resized]
You are quoting from what looks like an email from the Tuhoe iwi entity. This entity has been at odds before with its Kaumatua council, and the email you quote from reads more like a propaganda piece.
I've already linked to this article that details DoC attempts to progress remediation work on the huts, and Tuhoe leadership being a handbrake on that work.
"He (Kruger) also claimed there had been a decade of under-investment by DOC prior to the settlement – “we haven't really inherited assets, we’ve inherited liabilities” – and the $2m DOC provided each year for Te Urewera’s upkeep was “overly miserly”. But the documents show that money was not the impediment to repairing the dilapidated structures – DOC was offering to pay for everything. Rather, the problem was getting Tūhoe to approve a maintenance plan."
Also:
"In another report, English explained that DOC had provided a maintenance funding agreement to the TUT chief executive (Luke), “with the expectation that she would review it, and we would then proceed to signature. There has been no response. DOC has subsequently sent a reminder about progressing the agreement, but had no response. “Our understanding is that TUB believe that discussion about annual funding is one that should take place with the Minister [of Conservation]. There is no legislative authority for such decision making by [the Minister].”
I don’t know who’s calling the shots here, but this entire arrangement seems to be headed off the rails.
Mod note
Always good to have a link to the real oil. But don't let any source of reality or another point of view put you off your quoting storm from an unknown MSM source.
https://mailchi.mp/ngaituhoe/te-manu-whititua-issue-n3-1515866?e=f96a1d00b6
Michievous people have conflated huts with access. Hopefully you were not one of them.
Farmers are revolting!
"“They can’t prosecute us all.”
She asked the hundreds of people at the meeting to stand with her in boycotting the consents and almost all did."
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/130286957/fed-farmers-call-for-alternative-farming-emissions-proposal
So he a $150,000 Emitter ! He must be one of the high falutin', pollutin', AND revoltin'
Urrgh
Or as Stuart Gray said a member of the pollutocrat tribe of the Nats.
These same farmers will be asking for taxpayer assistance if flooding that is amplified by climate change devastates their properties. The obvious problem is that reducing emissions won't reduce the effects of climate change in the short-medium term, because so much change is already baked in by past emissions.
And that is essentially a fiscal problem: farmers will be paying to reduce emissions (or passing those costs to the public), while simultaneously taxpayers will be paying to mitigate or repair the effects of climate change. The ledger does not balance out here – there is only cost. Public finances will be overwhelmed and living standards will fall at the same time. Hard to avoid the conclusion that we are now on the leading edge of utter chaos.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/130273077/12-things-the-national-party-says-it-will-repeal-reverse-and-scrap
Geez, Natz policy.
Be nice to see some positive policies.
Not going to happen from a party that couldn't produce them whilst in power. It's now a vehicle for dissent, negativity, dirty politics and privilege.
All feed and watered by our owned media with these faux culture wars.
An article on Stuff this morning listing 11 things that National will repeal/reverse/scrap if they win the election next year. But naturally nothing about what they will do instead to fix the institutional problems of our country.
But we can guess. It will probably start with tax cuts for the rich, new multi-billion roads and fly-overs for Ford Ranger owning rural townies, building new prisons and cuts to public services.
The difference between National and Labour is that Labour valiantly keeps trying to make a rotten system better, but can't do it because it is too far gone, our public service is too small and too protective of its own privilege to do it anyway, and Labour lacks the balls, the money and the people to clean it out completely and start again from scratch. On the other hand National just gives up trying straight away and tries to fool us into thinking that doing nothing is actually doing something.
[What Stuff article? Provide direct links to quoted text, thanks – Incognito]
Mod note
Absolutely right, Mike.
Over the life of this country (at least since 1840), all the positive legislation that makes life better for ordinary kiwis has come from the left of the political spectrum.
Natz have largely just maintained the status quo.
But that approach will simply not work in the face of the existential crisis of climate change. Frankly, the market has no f*cking idea how to get us out of the environmental mess they have created.
We need interventionist governments prepared to do things: like three waters, fair pay agreements, rebuilding the health system, housing etc.
The rich don't use public hospitals or state school; all they need is roads to get to airports for their overseas holidays. Hence the Natz focus on roads.
This country can't afford another Natz/Act government.
Sorry I can't seem to post links. I will try to find out how.
Noted and let us know if you need help with that.
Everytime I try to post a link I get a message saying it isn't supported. It is an IMAC and contrary to Apple's claims they don't make things easier.
Thanks. I’ve left a note in the back-end and hopefully someone will be able to help you with this.
Mike, what operating system are you using? What browser? Are they both up to date? Can you please post the exact text of the message, and if it’s from the browser or the os?
Any legislation to make day to day life a bit better for the "average" person does not and will not come from a National government. Paid parental leave they voted against and Labour has since its introduction steadily increased the payments. Sick leave, annual leave, KiwiSaver …… As long as the better off get a generous tax cut is first and foremost on their policy wish list.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/pms-office-attack-staff-evacuated-after-sword-used-to-damage-jacinda-arderns-auckland-office/ZUJBADSS3Y7IQ4DLA5DCM552IE/
Just in.
My first reaction:
Blame the Hoskings and HdPAs.
Blame the tabloid media in general.
Blame the Nats and their constant barrage of false and misinformation.
Blame ACT and their constant barrage of false and misinformation.
Could be coincidental but did the culprit wait until Ardern was in Antarctica?
Edit: the article has now been edited. The original reported a man was seen approaching the office… he smashed a window and threw something inside. Fire trucks arrived to put out a fire. There was no staff there at the time.
The last "domestic terrorist" that smashed in the frontage of the Prime Minister's office in Mt Albert electorate did not do it when the PM was there either Helen Clark's office in Sandringham Rd had an axe put through the window one morning. It was very upsetting for the staff – I was upstairs doing some Labour Party work that morning so all we heard was the crash, but the office was closed for the day while the Police did the forensic stuff.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/man-admits-to-putting-axe-through-prime-ministers-window/27HOEJFHOWJYNMQH6IEOKKVBJY/
An up to date version from Stuff:
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300721972/samurai-sword-at-scene-of-prime-minister-jacinda-arderns-smashed-auckland-electoral-office
Yes, Visubversa, no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert.
Victims of the venomous Right. There have been quite a few of us over the years who were thus targeted. I was a nobody when it happened to me 30 years ago, so the police weren’t interested.
Oh, come on, Anne!
It certainly hasn't only happened to Labour PMs or to women PMs
John Key's electorate office was firebombed
https://www.odt.co.nz/news/politics/key-has-no-idea-why-office-was-attacked
Was he a victim of the venomous Left?
You know I did not say they only happen to Labour MP's and women PMs.
You know I was replying in the context of visibversa's comment @ 7.1
So why try to start a flame war?
I was similarly targeted by a woman who was planted in the Mt.Albert Labour Party 35 plus years ago. I know who put her there and why… but am not revealing the context or the identities here so don't bother to ask.
You said: "no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
When, actually, yes it is a coincidence.
I've provided one example of an attack on the office of a male PM – there are plenty of others.
Attacks on the electorate offices (and even MPs themselves – cf James Shaw) – are an occupational hazard in NZ (and in other countries as well).
I don't support it – or minimize it – but I acknowledge that it happens to many – right or left. Perhaps you could do the same.
Calling you on misinformation is not starting a flame war.
Oh yes it is starting a flame war when you know I was referring to a specific situation as was indeed Visubversa before me. Maybe I didn't choose my words ponderously enough for Madam but most people here don't mess around with silly semantics just to prove to the world they are always right and the target of the hour is wrong.
And to suggest I'm spouting misinformation on the subject only serves to further the suspicion by quite a few on this site that you are a person who thinks she has to be top dog in all things. 🙄
I'm not suggesting. You were spouting misinformation – as you have done in the past – and no doubt will do in the future.
Have you acknowledged, yet – I don't seem to see it in the responses – that actually attacks on electorate offices and individual politicans happen to members of all political parties – and males are affected as well as females.
Misinformation is not my game and never has been. You do yourself a disservice with your silly 'misinterpretations'.
I find your understanding on some technical matters pertaining to topics discussed here both useful and interesting. Then you go and spoil it.
"I've yet to acknowledge that attacks on electorate offices happen to all political parties?" (paraphrase)
We were talking about one specific office that was attacked yesterday. To suggest that I or anyone else is denying they happen to other political parties because we didn't mention them in dispatches is bordering on the idiotic.
I've been around the political traps on and off for 50 years and believe me I know a thing or two – as do others on this site. You might do well to ponder the fact our experiences are worthy of respect… even if you do imagine you know better.
Can you detect the strong whiff of misogyny in the venom directed against our PM? If not then please see your GP.
Haven't 'times' changed – 'funny' that.
Some people eh? Wonder what might still be going through their 'minds'.
Meanwhile, the MP who has actually been personally physically attacked – is James Shaw. A bloke.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/03/james-shaw-attacked.html
I can't think of another MP who has physically attacked – rather than jostled in a crowd, etc. Although there have been some things thrown at right-wing pollies – which is pretty borderline, in my estimation.
[Edit – I’ve just found this link to a series of physical attacks on politicians over the years – all were blokes – (in my defence, many are from well before I had any active interest in politics)]
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/beaten-bloodied-and-bruised-the-mps-attacked-over-the-years/5KA355JWECKJZJRI7UDYD66I5Y/
If you want to argue that MPs are increasingly at risk from both physical and virtual attacks, I'll certainly agree with you. And there is research to back it up.
https://www.otago.ac.nz/news/news/otago104620.pdf
But to claim that only women are affected is simply not true.
Another extraordinary claim – tell me who made it and I will ‘have words’.
Oh, come on, Belladonna!
You’ve offered no good reason for me to revise my reply to your comment @7.2.1, simply because you've subsequently introduced physical assaults into the mix. If for some reason you bring yourself to acknowledge the objective truth of the misogynistic component in the venom directed at our PM then that’s disappointing, but tbh I’m not surprised.
Try reading Anne's initial comment
"no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
Yes, it is a coincidence. There are plenty of other instances of non-Labour and non-female (if one is still allowed to use that divisive term) pollies offices being attacked (including PMs)
To claim this is "no coincidence" is to state (with no evidence) that this level of violence is only directed at Labour women PMs. Which is a lie.
Jacinda has a level of vitriol addressed to and about her. As did Key.
Popular politicians also have the converse of that popularity – it's only the mediocre ones who seem to attract little hatred (people go 'meh' rather than froth at the mouth.)
If it is misogynistic in relation to Ardern is is equally misandric (if that is the word) in relation to Key?
I will absolutely agree that online abuse of female politicians outweighs that directed at their male counterparts.
I don't see any evidence, however that physical assaults (on person or property) are greater for women than for men. In fact, the evidence I've linked to seems to show the reverse.
If you have evidence to show that I'm wrong, then I'm certainly open to changing my opinion.
And the initial comment was about the attack on Ardern's electorate office (not about any threats made to her). You are the one who initially widened the scope of the thread.
It's kind of frightening you have so far failed to condemn the samurai sword attack on the PM's electorate office.
Apologies if you have, but I don't want to wade through all your comments today. Far too draining and depressing.
You (and others from the right) seem to me to be spending a lot of time minimising this incident…
Quote from up the thread
If that's not sufficient for you, then I unreservedly condemn the attack on the PM's electorate office. While acknowledging that it will almost certainly have been carried out by someone mentally unbalanced.
I read Anne's initial comments @7 and @7.2 about the recent attack on the PM's office, and the earlier attack on PM Clark's office that Visubversa wrote about @7.1.
In your first 'contribution', your reply (to Anne) @7.2.1, you wrote:
Which is an indisputable statement, but also a tad odd – given that no one had suggested otherwise. Anne (@7.2.1.1) made this crystal clear for you:
You then had the gall (@7.2.1.1.1 and @7:56 pm) to write that you were "calling" Anne "on [spouting] misinformation", when it was you, and only you, who had deliberately misrepresented what Anne had written. That's self-serving bad faith behaviour – plain as day.
You bad faith commenting continued when you offered this:
Once again, you, and only you, had made such a claim in this thread – it would be absurd to suggest otherwise. Readers can make up their own minds about why you would write such an absurdity – I know I have.
I stand by my reply to your comment @7.2.1 – that you subsequently introduced the spurious matter of the physical assault on Shaw into the mix is further evidence that you are not commenting in good faith – rather you are minimising and diverting.
Imho our PM has shown considerable fortitude in the face of a veritable torrent of abuse and threats, including death threats – it can't be easy.
To our PM – hang in there – Kia kaha, and be kind
Thanks Drowsy M Kram.
Belledonna's presence on this site appears – in part – to try and undermine this government. Its an age old trick to do it by way of attempting to score points off and ridiculing individuals who stand behind or support them.
It is the same ploy used by the right-wing dirty political brigade when they attempted to destroy Clarke Gayford's reputation by way of spreading false stories about him. Take for example the "nanny": meme. It's Jacinda Ardern they are aiming to hurt by despoiling the reputations of those around her. They did the same to Helen Clark.
Helen rose above them and so will Jacinda.
No worries Anne – when reading a 'Belladonna' comment, I often think 'With respectful centrists like that, who needs NAct supporters.'
Sorry, that should read:
"But to claim that only women are affected is simply not true."
Bullshit. No-one is claiming only women parliamentarians get attacked.
You are the one indulging in cute misinformation.
Sigh. Try reading your own comment:
"no coincidence they were women Prime Ministers representing the Labour held seat of Mt. Albert."
Yes, it is a coincidence. Or, alternatively, your framing. There are plenty of other instances of non-Labour and non-female (if one is still allowed to use that divisive term) pollies offices being attacked (including PMs)
To claim this is "no coincidence" is to state (with no evidence) that this level of violence is only directed at Labour women PMs. Which is a lie.
"Staff evacuated after sword attack" in the headline and yet when you read the article "No injuries have been reported and the building was unoccupied at the time," police said.
So how do you evacuate an empty building.
Not good but the standard of reporting is terrible..
From the Stuff report at 7.2 above:
Deb Fong, who owns a yoga studio next-door to the electoral office, said she could smell smoke in her studio.
An office is not the same as a building.
The report quotes the police statement.
I think you will finds the police told them they couldn't occupy the office until they had finished their forensic examination. That could take several hours.
At the time the article was put together, the reporter wouldn't know the exact turn of events so just labelled it an evacuation.
Whatever, the psychological effect on the staff will be enormous because of a large sword left behind on the ground. I'm picking that was a deliberate act to threaten the staff and the PM.'
In the Helen Clark case it was an axe.
A typical example of the level of vitriol thrown at the Prime Minister. She is being criticised for taking her partner with her to Antarctica. A swag of former prime ministers have visited Anrtactica over the years and it looks like they all took their spouses/partners with them. Jesus.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/pm-jacinda-ardern-on-antarctica-climate-change-research-and-why-she-brought-partner-clarke-gayford/EHKU7F2Y75E2DO74VWHPOSOGAA/
" The original reported a man was seen approaching the office… he smashed a window and threw something inside". Why do we men always get the blame for this sort of madness?
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300721972/woman-arrested-after-prime-minister-jacinda-arderns-auckland-electoral-office-damaged
"We" don't.
The reports said it was a man, including eye-witness comments. Later the reports changed.
Good to see that 2.75m given to the mob being put to good use by the Mongrel Mob. Did anyone actually believe the PR lady that they were no longer in to drugs? (she is awfully quiet now).
But at least all the gang members now vote Labour.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/crime/130267411/antidrug-mongrel-mobs-man-was-meth-kingpin
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/446739/ardern-backs-2-point-75m-support-for-mongrel-mob-meth-addiction-programme
The recipients were a group called Hard2Reach, fronted by Harry Tam and anthropologist and public health researcher Angie Wilkinson.
Do you have evidence that either is involved in the drug trade?
No I obviously don't personally have any evidence, but the police do as Mark Griffiths will be off to jail now. Actually if he gets the good judge probably home D.
So why the inference that Harry Tam and anthropologist and public health researcher Angie Wilkinson are connected to Griffiths' offending?
/equally bad take
I'm told the drugs were imported via printer cartridges. Well be needing to implement sanctions against the US administration and their cartel of printer suppliers now.
/equally bad take finished
New Zealand's male violence towards women is further demonstrated by the deranged, cowardly attack on the PM's electorate office. There are too many men who cannot seem to accept and adapt to women's involvement in politics, government, local government, business, senior roles in any field. As soon as they rise to the top these pathetic men want to drag them down in one way or another. Anger, jealousy, "pretty communist" "Cindy", "girl in a skirt" that sort of nonsense never gets hurled at Chris Luxon. Time some people grew up.
police have arrested a 57 year old Woman .
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300721972/woman-arrested-after-prime-minister-jacinda-arderns-auckland-electoral-office-damaged
Define woman. So unless there is a picture or a comment to precise that it was an adult human female – who may or may not identify as a 'woman' you actually have no idea who really committed the crime, i mean anyone who feels like a women can self identify as a woman, one can even change daily their gender expression and no alterations to bodies or faces need to be made in order to self identify as a woman. And i would like to point out that the person was not described as a 'cis' woman either. So really might just not 'sex' the criminal until more information is available.
In saying that, knife attacks, attacks on people with screwdrivers, ramraids, bashings etc is all up and i would assume this is do to mental health issues in many cases. And sometimes these mental health issues need more then just access to a 0800 number.
So give the criminal a few month of Home D, say 9 month? That seems to be a good punishment for crimes against 'human females" of all ages and their offices.
The change in sex reported is noted.
It'll be worth seeing why that happened.
coincidentally Fond of Beetles has this thread up this morning.
https://twitter.com/FondOfBeetles/status/1585706618930532360
Correct, a woman has been arrested.
However, it was widely reported to be a man immediately after the attack.
Most of those reports have since been updated and corrected, and unfortunately most NZ media do not bother to follow best practice overseas of notifying readers of corrections. The requirement for links on The Standard is entirely reasonable, but the linked content often changes, and only screenshots (or our own memories) can confirm original reporting.
"New Zealand's male violence towards women is further demonstrated by the deranged, cowardly attack on the PM's electorate office"
What made you jump to the conclusion that it would be a man attacking the PM's office?
They have arrested a woman. When Jacinda was abused up north a while ago that was a woman too.
For the 3rd time – it was reported in the media as being a man. The story at 10 am was not the story at 1l am or 1 pm.
Perhaps you could read the comments before "jumping to a conclusion".
Derangement is not peculiar to men.
There were plenty of women involved in despoiling the centre of Wellington in February.
The difference is that deranged men have an additional bone of contention – Jacinda being a woman means that she is "not one of us" and thus more contemptible.
More war crimes. So the question that has to be asked, is our government not acting because they are not white?
What would you like our government to do?
Rescind the free trade agreement for starters.
Provide humanitarian aid to the civilians families being killed.
Cut off the military from arms and weapons – with us pulling out of all free trade agreements with those who supply them.
This is not enough – more than we would of got from the nat's, sure. But not enough.
//
BANGKOK (AP) — New Zealand said Thursday it will not deal with Myanmar under a major 15-nation trade agreement, the world’s largest that took effect this year, citing the deadly violence and democratic setbacks in the Southeast Asian country after the military seized power last year.
https://apnews.com/article/business-asia-new-zealand-myanmar-global-trade-b54b9f97ddeb4287762ea2797e44de8d
New Zealand has joined a boycott of an upcoming counter-terrorism meeting being co-chaired by the Russian and Myanmar militaries, in a move welcomed by activists.
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/nz-to-boycott-counter-terrorism-meeting-over-russia-myanmar-roles
Your links are months old, and they did not work.
As my main link shows, they have not worked for months.
Shut the door to this militarism
Cut off the arms.
How TF would you know?
How. Regime change?
/
Perhaps you could have a word with the junta's suppliers, China, Russia, Belarus, Iran and Serbia.
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Meanwhile, the EU and US have banned the supply of arms and any dual use goods, restricted export of comms and monitoring systems that could be used for internal suppression and suspended all and training and cooperation. And sanctions on dozens of individuals and organisations include asset freezes and bans on listed people from entering or transiting through US and EU territory.
I sure hope the Fonterra sales team is flogging our milk powder outside China.