Where are the resignations?

Written By: - Date published: 10:12 am, September 30th, 2012 - 87 comments
Categories: bill english, corruption, Gerry Brownlee, Hekia parata, john banks, john key, police - Tags: ,

John Key refuses to accept any responsibility for what his spies get up to. The only point of democratic responsibility for our spies doesn’t monitor them and won’t take the blame for failing to do so. He won’t fire a corrupt, lying minister, either. The rot is spreading to the public service. There has been not one resignation, not a single one, due to the Dotcom debacle.

In other countries, and in New Zealand not too long ago, managers tender their resignations when things go dramatically wrong in their area of responsibility. Ministers go at the drop of a hat and whole governments resign over behaviour that National seems to regard as situation normal. Parata would have gone over her disgraceful behaviour in colour-coding principals as if it was some fun game, when really it was a way of segregating those whose schools she is closing. Brownlee would have gone over his fuckwit outburst that he was “sick and tired” of Cantabrians “carping and moaning”. English would have gone for signing the Ministerial Warrant to suppress the GCSB’s illegal actions and for failing (if we believe the Government’s story) to tell his boss.

Corrupt John Banks would have been gone by lunchtime in the European countries that set the standard for accountability – even if it jeopardised the government. Any government that refused to act would be diagnosed as a cancer threatening their democracy by the media, and a relentless campaign to excise it would follow. The only similar campaign we’ve had is when the Herald didn’t want to lose advertising dollars due to the EFA, so declared that democracy was under attack.

Here, a senior Police Officer lies in Court and he doesn’t resign, his bosses start lying to protect him. Detective Inspector Grant Wormald headed the OFCANZ investigation into Kim Dotcom. He was asked in Court who else had helped:

Dotcom’s lawyer asked: “So apart from the surveillance which [the police surveillance team] might have been going to undertake on your behalf was there any other surveillance being undertaken here in New Zealand to your knowledge?”

Wormald replies: “No there wasn’t.”

Of course, that’s a lie. GCSB was illegally involved (and the fact that Wormald knew to lie and the GCSB then moved to cover up their actions with the Ministerial Certificate indicates they knew their involvement was illegal). Wormald’s bosses are trying to protect him by claiming the question was actually only about physical surveillance, not GCSB’s electronic surveillance. The transcript makes a lie of that claim. I suspect Wormald’s bosses are trying to cover for him because they had agreed with him earlier that he would lie.

I don’t care how good an individual is, it’s not worth the cost of lying and willful blindness to protect them because it creates a culture official law-breaking and unethical behaviour. The only way to excise this cancer is from the top down.

87 comments on “Where are the resignations? ”

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  1. Kotahi Tāne Huna 1
    30 September 2012 at 10:22 am

    In any normal circumstance this would be true, but for the Hollow Men, whose entire political strategy is to lie about their intentions, why would dishonesty suddenly, now, become a problem?

    • blue leopard 1.1
      30 September 2012 at 10:40 am

      Yeah…was kinda joking about this last evening with someone…

      Its just so much more disrespectful to the public that the lying is being conducted so blatantly. I mean, they could at least lie discreetly……

      [Content Alert: Contains Excessively Ironic Humour]

  2. ianmac 2
    30 September 2012 at 10:25 am

    “Don’t you know James? Its a dimanic world. Why my Planet Key might be invaded by aliens tomorrow or the next day and we need a strong team, lead by me, to protect all you plebs from rape and pillage. Trust me. I know what I’m doing,” said Mr Key to an anxious James Henderson.

    “Yeah. Right!” muttered James as the handcuffs snapped around his wrists.

    • captain hook 2.1
      30 September 2012 at 10:42 am

      the fact of the matter is that the government and the boorockaseehave been totally infantilised and furthermore only their own truths count.
      hey thats post modernism for ya.
      and when is len brown going to fire the POAL management team.
      They need getting rid of too.

      • Te Reo Putake 2.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 11:17 am

        Moron watch; a public service for Standard readers.
         
        No1: Captain Hook. This anally retentive and compulsive troll asks the same question every day, despite knowing that the question makes no sense.

  3. blue leopard 3
    30 September 2012 at 10:57 am

    @ James Henderson

    Thank you for writing such a profoundly sane post. I thoroughly agree with the sentiments expressed.

    I am still reeling that our ombudsman Dame Beverley Wakem’s warning re “highly dangerous” moves by the Government to keep information secret by drafting laws to avoid the Official Information Act.” wasn’t reported on our TV News.”

    What is going on here?

    Is NZ taking a nose-dive in respectful regard for the process of democracy?

    Not asking a rhetorical question here, seriously: Has it been this bad for a while and I haven’t been aware of it; or has it got particularly bad in this respect over the last year or two?

    It appears that sensationalizing murders, murder trials, criminal activities is A.O.K for our TV media, yet when there is a warning made by our ombudsman of a truly sensational nature which brings a serious case for the Government to answer to there is not a word?

    I conclude that ratings suddenly don’t appear to factor into the News producers decision-making at all when there are truly news worthy event to report.

    • BloodyOrphan 3.1
      30 September 2012 at 11:40 am

      The last two years they’ve been absolutely blatant, they have always been like that.
      The systems that kept them in check where dismantled two years ago, by Key himself.

      The Media, John Banks,John Key,Gerry,Bill….. Honourable?

      Biggest joke I’ve heard in my lifetime.

      We should have a proccess too remove them from parliament when it’s proven they are not honourable people. For the countries sake.

      • blue leopard 3.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 12:11 pm

        @BloodyOrphan
        What systems are you referring to that were dismantled?

        I know they have been like rats in a pantry with regard to our legislation, yet can’t put my finger on particular examples apart from the resource management act; which sadly no-one will notice or care (perhaps will even support) until something dreadful comes into their neighbourhood that they don’t want a part of and they will find that their voice-democratic right to speak out-has a whole lot less power than it did…

        • BloodyOrphan 3.1.1.1
          30 September 2012 at 12:24 pm

          There has always been an issue with Instigating / writing law in NZ.

          A couple of years (My Memory Aint great) back, they instigated a raft of changes that allows them (The Gnats in this case) to actually write Law.

          The end result of this is organisations like the GCSB, which is a new department intentionally created too be separate from other Intelligence agencies.

          The end result of those changes is the Laws and Legislations are now written by unqualified people trying to progress their own political agendas.

          The Dotcom fiasco truly highlights this.

          They wont change Laws under a spotlight, but the second the spotlight moves away, watch out.

          The second they passed those bills, they started 3 strikes, Education cuts, Car crushing, curfew on queen st…. and they’re just of the to pof my head.

          The speed the were implemented @ led to absolute fiasco in the field, and none of those “Laws” were thought thrpough by professionals.

          I’m guessing they added a couple that allows for all the “Off the Records” we’ve seen, remember when they were harping on about parliamentary priviledge ?

          • Colonial Viper 3.1.1.1.1
            30 September 2012 at 12:28 pm

            Sounds about right. Apparently there is hardly any ability left to double check that new draft legislation won’t end up causing a total mess due to conflicts with existing legislation and operating methods.

            Shambolic and third world.

            • BloodyOrphan 3.1.1.1.1.1
              30 September 2012 at 12:32 pm

              It’s almost like there’s w’craft involved, I can’t seem to get any one to take this one seriously.
              Bless Ya M8!
              The smile on Keys’ face was a “Gloating” one.

            • blue leopard 3.1.1.1.1.2
              30 September 2012 at 1:47 pm

              @ CV ditto

              and thanks @ BloodyOrphan

              I recall a number of times lawyers getting vocal about what has been going on and calling this term and last term’s Government to account; I recall one example being about the retrospective legislation that was being rushed through. All I have mainly, though is vague recollections of this occurring on numerous occasions since this Circus has been in town …er…Government has been in power.

              Guess I am going to have to do some research.

            • Draco T Bastard 3.1.1.1.1.3
              30 September 2012 at 5:03 pm

              What is actually the problem is that, after centuries of legislation (NZ imported all of Britain’s legislation to start with) is that it’s now far too complex for anyone to know what connects with what and thus throwing in new legislation is likely to have unintended consequences. The only solution that would work to rationalise our law is to rewrite the whole damn lot from the ground up.

          • Draco T Bastard 3.1.1.1.2
            30 September 2012 at 5:00 pm

            The end result of this is organisations like the GCSB, which is a new department intentionally created too be separate from other Intelligence agencies.

            GCSB

            The Government Communications Security Bureau was created in 1977 on the instructions of Robert Muldoon, the Prime Minister.

            Stating absolute bollocks does tend to undermine everything else you say.

  4. mac1 4
    30 September 2012 at 10:57 am

    I think that the choice of the wording in the title- ‘resignation’ -actually and unintentionally perhaps points us to motivation as to why our politicians and civil servants act, or do not act, as they do.

    That is, the resignation of the public to accepting this kind of behaviour; the resignation of former political activists to a belief that things cannot be changed; resignation that the control of the media by owners and their vested interest mates means that meaningful political reporting, investigation or holding to account is by and large minimal; resignation and disillusion with the political process where parties and party leaders are seen to be under-performing, self-serving and ineffectual; resignation that results in people believing and acting on that aphorism that only serves the status quo “Don’t vote- it only encourages them.”

    I was talking this morning to a musician/song writer about the lack of songs that describe social conditions- protest songs as we knew them. They seem to have been largely supplanted by introspective song-writing. The poets of the Baxter style sallying into the mores of the time are not heard. The diversion of popular culture into star-studded wanna-be circuses, sport, game shows, computer games and social sites, shopping and celebrity fawning pap is a growing expression of bread and circuses, only benefitting our modern emperors.

    This kind of moral/morale resignation results in the lack of resignation by the blameworthy in a self-fulfilling, self perpetuating spiral of cause and effect. Resignation. Loss of hope. Loss of faith. Ultimately, a loss of charity as society becomes more introverted, alienated, less communal, less neighbourly.

    Bah! Humbug! The Ebenezer Scrooges of our time multiply and get their way.

    • blue leopard 4.1
      30 September 2012 at 11:07 am

      @mac1

      +1 I think your comments are very onto it. You omitted to mention the latest type of circus being created: The Government.

      • mac1 4.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 11:26 am

        Thanks, blue. My reaction to that is the government is circus clown, ringmaster and Barnum all at the same time. Some of the public watch the show with amusement. Some watch and accept the show uncritically. The media never crits the performance. The musicians still get paid. Mr Barnum gets rich at the turnstile, though some can’t afford to get inside the tent. The ringmaster is not actually in control but still the lackey of the owners who surely don’t live in tents and caravans. And a few feel sorry for the elephant and the lion.

    • Dr Terry 4.2
      30 September 2012 at 3:50 pm

      macl – nice piece of writing, thanks!

    • Jokerman 4.3
      1 October 2012 at 11:28 am

      well written 🙂

  5. Nick K 5
    30 September 2012 at 11:28 am

    “Corrupt John Banks…..” – if you put it in bold with CAPS someone might take notice.

    *Yawn*

    • Pascal's bookie 5.1
      30 September 2012 at 1:18 pm

      Good one Nick.

      It’s touching, but futile I’m afraid. ACT is an ex-party. It’s just pining for the fjords till the next election, or till Key is forced to apply the coup de grace. The latter would be far more dignified, I would think, than this Baghdad Bob performance.

      We’ve got sworn statements alleging Banks asked for donations from DotCom, in order to be elected so that he could ‘help’.

      We’ve got sworn statements that Banks knew the donations were given. We’ve got sworn statements that he refused to help Dotcom because of the donations he claims were anonymous.

      We know Banks doesn’t want his own sworn statements to be made public, and that his escape from prosecution is based on his not bothering to read what he signed, not caring if it was true or not.

      If you can explain the his reticence about releasing his sworn police statement, I’d be all ears, because on the face of it, the only reason I can think of is that Banks sworn statement contradicts his non-sworn public statements.

      Nothing to hide, nothing to fear.

      lol.
      .
      hey but at least Roger Douglas was ion the tv saying all this is stuff is fine. John Banks is the most consistent leader ACT has had for a long time in terms of sticking by its principles. (see above for egs of Banks principled performance)

      Isn’t there a shindig in Ak this weekend to try and find a replacement vehicle for ACT type policy, based around the Libertarianz?

      Pretty hard to imagine why that paerticular Hail Mary pass would be thrown if anyone at all, (aside from yourself perhaps), thought there was any life left in the former political vehicle known as ACT.

  6. muzza 6
    30 September 2012 at 11:28 am

    “We” get what “We” ask for – The representatives are the sympton of the laziness and apathy which is causing the breaking down of the systems needed to support “societal needs”

    “We” will have to take back the control via forced accountability, and how do “We” achieve that.

    1: A political entity started for the people, representing NZ, and anything which seeks to harm us – With 3-6 core “concepts” which will appeal to the majority of this country who can vote. – If I were an MP, I would spill my guts on every, and anything which was a threat to our democracy, regardless of where it eminates from. I would report from on parliamentary goings-on, the rorts, rip offs and insider cronyisms etc – Why is this not happening from any of the current lot?

    2: Take those few core “concepts”, and if you have the right ones, then getting thousands of people onto the streets around the country should be very easy. Look at how much ammo there is currently. People are being attacked all over the place right now…Stand up for the vulnerable, watch what happens.

    3: Do it a local level too, get stuck into the wards at local election time – Stop Paying your rates, sure some might get pinged, but if you want them to listen, one way is to cut off the revenue streams. Stop paying GST too, you are an unpaid tax collector for the govt. Yes you might get pinged, but they respond to the money being cut off, and they can’t get everybody! – Organise and co-ordinate!

    4: Cantabs, and Kaipra – Take back your councils – Just get together go in there, and take it back, no demands, no threats, just take it over, and force the re-instatement of local demoracy, then have your “real people” stand in elections, and watch the results.

    5: Forget about the current “left parties” – they won’t be solving anything!

    The time is right, its now, its gotta happen, because at this rate, NACT will win a 3rd term. Unless the economy tanks, or Cunliffe takes over, they are going to keep control!

    • blue leopard 6.1
      30 September 2012 at 12:01 pm

      @muzza

      I agree with your point and have been known to convey the sentiments in your first sentence myself, yet there is a bit of a vicious circle going on here with regard to information.

      Our sources of information are not accurately nor fairly reporting events.
      People are busy and less inclined to read a tome about politics on their time off. (Yet they may pick up a paper…yikes!)
      People who aren’t busy; retired or unemployed, who do have time to get more informed are marginalized when they speak out, particularly the unemployed.
      For large numbers of people to be informed, we need a good, accessible information source. Internet is good, however, I believe we need the disinformation being disseminated on TV to be countered on TV and same with newspapers.

      The vicious circle being: Politicians are reflecting our laziness and apathy, yet our laziness and apathy are being caused by lack of accurate information and the lack of information is getting worse due to the power money interest hold on politicians and our politicians are getting worse because our information sources are getting worse because there is getting money interest is getting more of a hold…..and so we are voting for less sound reasons….

      So saying, I guess if a group such as you mention was set up, that could be a way of disseminating information; just have to find a way to pay the full time researchers!

      • BloodyOrphan 6.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 12:05 pm

        God Bless The Standard and all her Crew M8! 🙂

      • Colonial Viper 6.1.2
        30 September 2012 at 12:31 pm

        I believe we need the disinformation being disseminated on TV to be countered on TV and same with newspapers.

        Print and radio is definitely the way to go.

        Forget TV for now. In addition to being damn expensive, that medium just turns peoples’ brains to mush.

        • blue leopard 6.1.2.1
          30 September 2012 at 1:54 pm

          “Forget TV for now”

          NOOOooooo!

          We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, …we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, …we shall fight them through the televised media; we shall never surrender.

          Winston Churchill [with some changes]

    • marty mars 6.2
      30 September 2012 at 2:29 pm

      Muzza you say, “5: Forget about the current “left parties” – they won’t be solving anything!”

      Some of us who have been fighting injustice and inequality a long time believe that the Mana Party is a vehicle to achieve people power. Have you read any of the policy?Have you listened to any of Hone’s speeches? On what basis are you dismissing this Mana Movement?

      • Populuxe1 6.2.1
        1 October 2012 at 1:23 am

        I think the “Mana movement” is a bit of a romantic myth, more like a marriage of convenience – tino rangatiratanga as a movement has goals incompatible with the basic notion of Socialism – ie State ownership of the means of production – which in our case includes the land, water etc – and the equality of citizens without reference to race, gender, birth etc. Like a comet it has swept up a lot of fringe debris not even as coherent as it’s two main parts.

        Also much Mana economic and foreign policy is desperately idealistic and probably suicidal.

        • fatty 6.2.1.1
          1 October 2012 at 1:33 am

          “tino rangatiratanga as a movement has goals incompatible with the basic notion of Socialism”

          What’s socialism got to do with Mana? They are not socialist

          • Colonial Viper 6.2.1.1.1
            1 October 2012 at 1:37 am

            From their website, they seem to be on the left wing end of NZ social democracy at least:

            We stand for the right to fulfilling work with a decent living wage.

            We stand for full employment so that everyone can give back to their communities in a meaningful way and with dignity.

            We stand for a tax system that abolishes GST and levies financial transactions, taking away the heavy tax burden that falls on the poor and middle income earners.

            We stand for every family’s right to secure, healthy housing.

            We stand for every child’s right to a free, high quality education that prepares them for their world.

            We will support students’ right to enter the workforce free of the burden of student debt.

            In short, we will fight to bring the voice of the poor, the powerless and the dispossessed into Parliament. And we will fight to give Te Tiriti o Waitangi the mana and life that was envisaged by those tūpuna who signed it in 1840.

            • fatty 6.2.1.1.1.1
              1 October 2012 at 2:01 am

              Yes, just a more regulated capitalism.
              E.g. “Close corporate tax loopholes to make sure that all businesses, especially transnational companies, pay their full share of tax.”

        • Colonial Viper 6.2.1.2
          1 October 2012 at 1:33 am

          Mana has a perilous road ahead as any single MP party does. The rest of your analysis is a bit beside the point, especially as its all going to come down to whether or not Harawira can build a capable nation wide team around him. In the end, that’s the big ask, despite the fact that we know he can get time in front of the media, and perform, no problem.

  7. Adrian 7
    30 September 2012 at 11:40 am

    Let’s not be too hasty in deploring the lack of resignations, it is all having a far greater effect than we realise. People whom I would never suspect of being critical of this government are shaking their heads in disbelief and disappointment and openly critising them. It is working.

    • blue leopard 7.1
      30 September 2012 at 11:45 am

      Yeah this is a very good point…so LONG as people do eventually stand up to this corruption of democracy and the damage that is being done is rectified. (Such as to our legislation)

      • Jim Nald 7.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 2:43 pm

        In this small country, we are all only about two degrees separated. John Key needs to remember that he can tell different things to different people, but only for so long and only in certain selected circles that do not or cannot join up the whole story.

        I “understand” that people involved on the inside are less than happy with different versions being told. He can make up shit and dump on them because the nature of their jobs does not usually allow them to go public.

        • blue leopard 7.1.1.1
          30 September 2012 at 2:55 pm

          Gee, I hope they do.

          Perhaps they could consider it treasonous to their fellow countrymen not to and therefore feel less compunction about going against any not-speaking-to-the-media style clauses? 😀

          (I have been pondering about such agreements expected of public servants; it means all the people who work for Government are unable to inform the wider community in the event something isn’t right in the department they work in doesn’t it? Seems like this could cause problems with “righting” any situation that has gotten out of hand)

  8. Redlogix 8
    30 September 2012 at 11:53 am

    Reading this Herald article makes it clear that the GCSB had four CEO’s, critical staff shortages, an office move and funding cuts to cope with in the period in question.

    This is exactly the environment that sets organisations up for failure; and the responsibility for this lies wholly with the Minister responsible.

    In other words this is resignation time.

    • Colonial Viper 8.2
      30 September 2012 at 12:03 pm

      Shocking and surely deliberate running down of a NZ public institution tasked with defending our nation from adverse foreign activity.

      Not good at all.

    • Anne 8.3
      30 September 2012 at 1:32 pm

      Reading this Herald article makes it clear that the GCSB had four CEO’s, critical staff shortages, an office move and funding cuts to cope with in the period in question.

      That being the case, then our intelligence agencies aren’t going to be too enthused about Mr Key’s public utterances, and that might come back to bite him on the bum.

      Anyone else hear Geoffrey Palmer on Q&A this morning? Has he not caught up with the fact we now live in the 21st century?

      • BloodyOrphan 8.3.1
        30 September 2012 at 1:34 pm

        Give Geoff a break, civilised is civilised it’s timeless.

      • alwyn 8.3.2
        30 September 2012 at 2:29 pm

        The BBC published a couple of books with the contents, slightly modified, of the scripts of “Yes Minister” and “Yes Prime Minister”.
        In the introduction they said “We were most grateful to have had a few conversations with Sir Humphrey himself before the advancing years, without in any way impairing his verbal fluency, disengaged the operation of his mind from the content of his speech”.
        With Sir Geoffrey it is now to late for any sensible conversation. He is in the latter part of Sir Humphreys situation You ask whether he has caught up with it being the 21st century? Sadly no. I suspect he still thinks it is 1989.

    • Dr Terry 8.4
      30 September 2012 at 3:57 pm

      Redlogix – exactly, Key sets up important concerns to fail, then blames them for failing.

    • Huginn 8.5
      30 September 2012 at 5:36 pm

      Agreed. Key lost control of his department. The Director’s Annual Report signalled clearly that the GCSB was in trouble.

      Did he read the report?

      • Anne 8.5.1
        30 September 2012 at 6:46 pm

        Did he read the report?

        He doesn’t read reports. He said so…

        Yeah, I’m sure that’s what you’re saying Huginn.

  9. captain hook 9
    30 September 2012 at 12:10 pm

    first of all they have to resign themselves that the whole world now knows they are a pack of fucking drongos.
    the whole bloody lot.
    sort of like clowns but not funny!

    • blue leopard 9.1
      30 September 2012 at 12:16 pm

      “sort of like clowns but not funny!”
      ..actually its getting so bad that I have to admit I am getting a few laughs out of the whole thing…It is SO bad…such a fiasco…even your comment; you have to admit thats quite amusing: unfunny clowns…!!…

      sigh…warped sense of humour I guess…

  10. xtasy 10
    30 September 2012 at 1:21 pm

    Why even bother to ask the question?

    NZ is – and has always been – run by a kind of “old boys and girls network”, who make sure that the top core jobs go around like playing musical chairs, who appoint diplomats who joined “the club” as former politicians, who hand pick the CEOs of state owned enterprises, of government departments and agencies, who sit on the boards and so forth.

    When something like this goes wrong, they display the natural human behaviour of clinging to your chairs, of ensuring you stick together with long known, loyal mates, they cover up what they can, hence we have this situation.

    The fact is, the top head is on the block now, yes, John the beloved “Key-stone” leader of the government. If only a bit more digging would be done by the largely useless mainstream media, if only Dotcom would have the information he seeks, the whole truth may finally come out and throw this government into disarray and forced to declare and early election they will NOT win!

    How quiet has it also become at ACC. There is another example, where people sit on a board that should not be there, as they have conflicts of interest. Dr Des Gorman comes to mind, as former, frequend “advisor” to ACC with some peculiar decisions that were even covered by the media. And how many jobs has Rebstock got?

    What about WINZ, other departments, agencies and ministries. The ranks are closing, the media is not getting much in the way of press releases and the Official Information Act and Privacy Act are apparently going to be amended, to keep more secrets. Is this transparency, accountability, or not rather stuff that to some degree is what one expects of an undemocratic regime?

    Nothing new about the police not fronting up and so. The IPCA also has too little muscle. Where is the supposedly investigative journo brigade? On a weekend outing at the bach, I suppose?

    • Draco T Bastard 10.1
      30 September 2012 at 5:36 pm

      NZ is – and has always been – run by a kind of “old boys and girls network”, who make sure that the top core jobs go around like playing musical chairs, who appoint diplomats who joined “the club” as former politicians, who hand pick the CEOs of state owned enterprises, of government departments and agencies, who sit on the boards and so forth.

      There is a solution for this. Make it so that people are promoted only within the ministry through democratic process. So that the government no longer has a say as to who gets the job.

      • Populuxe1 10.1.1
        1 October 2012 at 1:27 am

        Because then you would end up with ministries and SOEs run by the popular rather than the able. History has shown this to be largely a mistake.

        • fatty 10.1.1.1
          1 October 2012 at 1:36 am

          “Because then you would end up with ministries and SOEs run by the popular rather than the able. History has shown this to be largely a mistake.”

          Last week has shown that to be a mistake

          • Colonial Viper 10.1.1.1.1
            1 October 2012 at 1:43 am

            Last week has nothing to do with Draco’s ideas for workplace democracy.

            Because then you would end up with ministries and SOEs run by the popular rather than the able. History has shown this to be largely a mistake.

            Not sure what you are trying to refer to here. NZ Government Ministries and SOEs have never been run under the system of work place democracy suggested by Draco.

            • fatty 10.1.1.1.1.1
              1 October 2012 at 1:55 am

              sorry, that was unclear…it was in response to Populuxe1’s claim that ministries would end up being run by the popular, rather than the able.
              I was thinking of social development and education – definitely not able, popular is debatable

  11. Treetop 11
    30 September 2012 at 1:44 pm

    Key is doing his bit as Tourism Minister these days, promoting NZ internationally.

    Could you imagine Larry King interviewing Key?

    You are known as being hillbillies, corrupt or incompetent or both…

    • tc 11.1
      30 September 2012 at 2:50 pm

      Treetop I agree but the fact kings not around and has been substituted for piers ‘phone hacking’ Morgan sums up the state of play.

      The NACT did a stellar job of closing down the only free view outlet of critique being stratos. Beatson and bomber had different ways of getting under the hollow skin, can’t have that now.

      • Treetop 11.1.1
        30 September 2012 at 9:15 pm

        Piers could only work in the US and he would not interview Key, to close for comfort me thinks.

  12. irascible 12
    30 September 2012 at 7:15 pm

    On Planet Key there are golf courses, no toilets and no requirement for him or his ministers to take responsibility for anything as in Nivarna ignorance is something you can bank on.

    Under this govt the sense of loss of control and drift has become more and more pronounced as KeY’s political nudity gets greater exposure.

  13. Penny Bright 13
    30 September 2012 at 9:21 pm

    MORE DEFENCE OF THE INDEFENSIBLE?

    Where is the accountability to the RULE OF LAW by those who have the duty to ENFORCE THE LAW?

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/7748117/Police-stand-firm-behind-besieged-senior-officer

    Penny Bright

    ‘Anti-corruption campaigner’

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com

    • fatty 13.1
      1 October 2012 at 1:31 am

      nice link…this is shocking

    • BLiP 13.2
      1 October 2012 at 2:44 am

      .

      Thank you, Penny. Love your work.

      Did you see what the reader poll on Stuff was, the one right next to this story of corruption:

      Do you snore?

      _ Yes

      _ Yes – and it annoys my partner

      _ Not that I’m aware of

      _ No – but my partner does!

      RIP: The Fourth Estate.

  14. North 14
    1 October 2012 at 1:18 am

    Go Penny…….you called it correctly from the very start…….and got lots of shit for it.

    A la George Galloway……..you were right……..the tossers were wrong.

    Corruption it is.

    Go you !

  15. captain hook 15
    1 October 2012 at 9:39 am

    Moron alert.
    very sorry if some people see it as a joke but even more sorry that the same people think that everything done in the past is set in stone.
    when ‘is’ Len Brown going to fire the POAL management.
    if he cant then he should be introducing enabling legislation that allows him to evict these parasites.

    • Te Reo Putake 15.1
      1 October 2012 at 9:47 am

      Hooky, Brown is the mayor of Auckland. The legislation that created the super city does not allow him to sack the board of POAL. He is not an MP, so he has no ability to introduce enabling legislation that would change that situation.
       
      Time for you to move on, or at least learn how to use google.

  16. captain hook 16
    1 October 2012 at 10:49 am

    poohtacky you are a coward.
    this is the same excuse that let boy wussers take over when local traffic departments were canned.
    now you want to give the peoples property to a gang of accountants without putting up a fight.
    whose side are you on?

    • Te Reo Putake 16.1
      1 October 2012 at 11:04 am

      Ok, I guess we’ll have to stick with you being a moron. That possibly also explains why you can’t figure out how to use the reply button.

  17. captain hook 17
    1 October 2012 at 11:10 am

    well that just makes it easy for you.
    just do nothing and rely on technicalities.
    so what is it you want to achieve here anyway?

    • Te Reo Putake 17.1
      1 October 2012 at 11:12 am

      “so what is it you want to achieve here anyway?” (sic).
       
      To stop you trolling.

  18. captain hook 18
    1 October 2012 at 12:40 pm

    well who the fuck are you?

  19. captain hook 19
    1 October 2012 at 1:35 pm

    keep bleating poohtacky.
    its the post modern way of thinking you are doing something when you really aren’t.
    Len Brown is the Mayor of Auckland and holds the POAL in trust for everybody and not just the gang of accountants at present in control.
    politics is about change and not dickylicking poohboy.
    so try and frame an argument instead of trying on f*ckb**k style bleating.

    • Te Reo Putake 19.1
      1 October 2012 at 1:52 pm

      What I like about you, Hooky, is your complete lack of self regard. Most people who got something as badly wrong as you would have acknowleged the mistake and moved on. You, on the other hand, just go into abuse mode, making yourself look even more foolish. 
       
      I appreciate you’ll find this intellectually challenging, but my pointing out the facts about the board structure and lack of accountibilty at POAL does not make me an advocate for the rules that stop Mayor Brown from sacking them.

  20. tracey 20
    1 October 2012 at 2:57 pm

    In 2008 key cldnt sht up about what he thought clark should do about her ministers. I recall him telling paul henry he would always answer questions even ones that hadnt been asked. Tht footage must be accessible and cld have made key look very small over the banks thing.

  21. BloddyOrphan 21
    1 October 2012 at 3:24 pm

    This country needs some good ol’ Poltical Comedy, they could drag out all sorts of old footage.

  22. captain hook 22
    1 October 2012 at 3:48 pm

    I dont care about you at all poohtacky.
    what I care about is the welfare of the workers and the theft of community property by slimy accountants.
    the point is if you can understand it is that if the legislation enables the sell off of community property then the laws must be changed.
    this can only be achieved by agitation.
    sitting on your ass and crying chicken licken indicates a complete lack of principle not to mention courage and determination to make the world a better place by hiding behind the rules made by the grabbers.
    so what is important is your behaviour and so far you are proving to be a weak namby pamby m.o.r. lickspittle jellyfish.

  23. LongJohnSilver 23
    1 October 2012 at 5:08 pm

    You guys are hilarious.

    Can I sell you a concept for an indigenous sitcom ?

    LJS

  24. captain hook 24
    1 October 2012 at 7:14 pm

    sell it to kweewee.
    maybe he can pitch it to Warner Brothers this week.
    this frigging country is alredy infantilised by alien masterchef and numerous other pieces of absolute codswallop so a reality spying programme would go gangbusters!
    or the “real” west coast choppers where the losers lose a piece of their anatomy or a frontal lobotomy?