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Bridges copies Bill Clinton on abortion

Written By: - Date published: 10:54 am, May 28th, 2018 - 51 comments
Categories: abortion, national, Politics, Simon Bridges, us politics - Tags:

Simon Bridges has been formulating a position on abortion. And has arrived at a position that is more conservative than the position held by Bill Clinton but which borrows his phraseology (h/t Eddie Clark).

He thinks that abortion should be rare, safe and legal and repeats this three times in this interview with Suzy Ferguson. He does not agree that abortion should be taken out of the Crimes Act. He refused to answer why women should have to lie to get the right to have an abortion.

His position closely mirrors that of Bill Clinton who famously said abortions needed to be safe, legal and rare . He has altered the order of the words to make his position even more restrictive placing the emphasis on “rare” and downgrading “safe”.

It is funny that he should be more conservative than a Georgian born southern baptist. And that he does not have a position which is formed by principle and experienced but rather formulated by the borrowing of a phrase designed overseas and no doubt influenced by focus group discussions.

The Irish referendum result suggests that Bridges may be on the wrong side of this issue.

51 comments on “Bridges copies Bill Clinton on abortion ”

  1. Matthew Whitehead 1

    He’s certainly gonna piss feminists off with rare, not that he probably hasn’t lost that vote already. The only sense in which it’s sympathetic to say abortion should be rare is trying to say we shouldn’t wait to help people with access to contraceptives or family planning etc… until they’re in the position to have an abortion- which is in many ways already in practice in New Zealand, we just need to be a bit more universal about it.

    And de-emphasising safe is just silly. Safe is the whole reason our abortion law has turned into a giant workaround- because doctors realize that refusing to provide an abortion is unsafe.

    Probably he’s just trying to sound reasonable while giving himself some distance from Ardern- if he says “rare” enough times, he can then go back and say “no, your abortion law reform will increase/not decrease abortions enough for Simon Bridges,” and suddenly reproductive health is a partisan issue again.

    • bwaghorn 1.1

      It would be nice if it was rare and as you say that can only happen with abundant free contraception and real world sex ed. Making the snip for boys free and normal might help to.

      • Matthew Whitehead 1.1.1

        I’ve actually evolved on this a bit 😉 I don’t particularly care anymore if abortion is rare or not, so long as we do things to reduce statistics like unwanted pregnancies, to reduce or eliminate rape and domestic abuse, etc… Beyond that, I trust women to make the right call for themselves in their own circumstances.

        To me those are things you should want to do as a sensible person regardless of how it impacts abortions.

        • bwaghorn 1.1.1.1

          At the risk of getting told off . Surly there is a psycological cost ever time a woman aborts . So anything that stops an unwanted pregnancy is good.
          (Yes I am aware there are unavoidable reasons for abortion)

          • The Fairy Godmother 1.1.1.1.1

            The emotional cost would be far less than that of an unwanted pregnancy. Friends I know who have aborted do not regret it.

          • Matthew Whitehead 1.1.1.1.2

            Actually it really depends on the circumstances. A lot of the claims of psychological impact to abortion by the right-to-life crowd are thoroughly overblown, and especially with most early abortions being administered by a simple pill, the most traumatic part is usually having to lie and go through unnecessary consultations to get access to a basic healthcare.

            I’d suggest you go listen to what women have to say on the issue directly. Many have no regret at all as they knew their decision was the right thing for them, or their family. (and that’s the other thing you don’t hear often enough: a lot of women who need an abortion need it because they need to prioritize the kids they already have) Some do find it traumatic, but I would suggest that much of that is on the fact that they needed an abortion in the first place, which again goes back to assisting people in preventing unwanted pregnancies.

            • Baba Yaga 1.1.1.1.2.1

              “the most traumatic part is usually having to lie and go through unnecessary consultations to get access to a basic healthcare.”

              Are you seriously suggesting that having to ‘lie’ is more traumatic than having the abortion itself? Clearly you have no experience of dealing with the aftermath of abortion.

              “Women who have undergone an abortion are as much as twice as likely to abuse drugs than women who have given birth or have never been pregnant. ”

              “Studies have also shown an increased risk of breast cancer among women who have had abortions, possibly due to the sudden physiological change in the body when the termination causes a significant drop in hormones, which in turn causes the rapid growth in the number of breast tissue cells. The U.S. National Cancer Institute estimates that women who have had an induced abortion increase their risk of getting breast cancer before the age of fifty by nearly 49%. ”

              “Recently there have been numerous studies regarding the physical and emotional effects that abortion can have on women in the long term. Most of those studies have reached the same conclusions, namely that a minimum of thirty percent of women who have undergone an abortion will suffer some level of depression as a direct result. ”

              http://www.epigee.org/the-long-term-effects-of-abortion.html

              There are times when abortion is the only option, but those circumstances are rare, and are the only circumstances in which abortion is carried out.

              • Draco T Bastard

                Are you seriously suggesting that having to ‘lie’ is more traumatic than having the abortion itself?

                Wouldn’t surprise me.

                Abortion and Breast Cancer Risk

                But scientific research studies have not found a cause-and-effect relationship between abortion and breast cancer.

                “Our findings add to the body of evidence rejecting the notion that abortion increases women’s risk of experiencing adverse psychological outcomes,” wrote M. Antonia Biggs, PhD, of the Bixby Center for Global Reproductive Health at the University of California, San Francisco, and her coauthors. “Women who had an abortion demonstrated more positive outcomes initially compared with women who were denied an abortion.”

                That puts paid to your tripe.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  What about a post-natal abortion for Baba Yaga? Let’s put it to a vote.

                • mikesh

                  A 49% increase in the risk sounds like a lot, but it depends on the actual size of the risk. An increase from 1 in a 1000 to 1.5 in a 1000 (3/2000) doesn’t seem very significant, but an increase from, say, 100 to 150 per 1000 probably needs to be taken seriously.

                  However I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss an the results of an epidemiological study simply on the grounds that an actual cause and effect relationship has not been ascertained.

                  • Draco T Bastard

                    However I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss an the results of an epidemiological study simply

                    What study?
                    Baba Yaga didn’t link to one but the site did have this line:

                    If it is important that you avoid a pregnancy, remaining abstinent is the best way to do this.

                    Yeah, I think I’ll stay well away from it as a source of facts.

                    • Baba Yaga

                      You’d ignore facts because you don’t like one line? One line that happens to be a fact!

                • Baba Yaga

                  “That puts paid to your tripe.”

                  From your link:

                  “Some case-control studies, however, have found an increase in risk.”

                  Talk about shoot yourself in the foot.

              • Lara

                “Clearly you have no experience of dealing with the aftermath of abortion”

                I’m guessing you probably don’t have experience in this.

                And even if you did, not every woman experiences it in the same way.

                For many women, finding themselves pregnant when they desperately do not want to be, then having an early medical abortion (take a couple of pills, within a couple of days no longer pregnant) the biggest feeling? Relief. Relief to no longer be pregnant.

                But that’s a very unpopular view. Women are encouraged to care and support, not abort. And the common meme is that abortion is a traumatic experience, the best choice in a range of poor choices.

                Were we to acknowledge that for many women the overwhelming feeling is one of relief, it feels wrong for too many people.

                • Baba Yaga

                  “I’m guessing you probably don’t have experience in this.”
                  Then you’d be wrong.

                  “And even if you did, not every woman experiences it in the same way.”
                  Of course not. That is why we need to consider population studies. But the studies clearly show some fairly obvious and worrying post-abortion trauma that can last for a very long time.

          • esoteric pineapples 1.1.1.1.3

            I would have thought that but if you talk to women who have had abortions, for some it is difficult and for others not at all.

            Apart from that, a miscarriage is a form of accidental abortion which can also psychologically affect women but is common and 100 percent natural.

        • mickysavage 1.1.1.2

          It is amazing what reducing poverty, raising general levels of education and providing affordable health care can do.

      • Booker 1.1.2

        Also, keep in mind that no contraception is 100% effective. Even IUDs fail.

  2. Puckish Rogue 2

    I hope its the only thing of Bills hes copying

    • bwaghorn 2.1

      In his dreams l expect he would love to be like bill but at 7% he obviously has got it

      • Puckish Rogue 2.1.1

        Well I was referring more to the scandals that’ve dogged the Clintons for decades

        • McFlock 2.1.1.1

          It’s a pity that the legitimate complaints about WJC committing sexual assault got buried under a mountain of invented “scandals”.

          • Puckish Rogue 2.1.1.1.1

            One thing we can all be thankful for is that, in comparison to overseas, our political scandals are minor at best

            • McFlock 2.1.1.1.1.1

              I wouldn’t be so sure about that.

              We just don’t seem to investigate them so thoroughly, and we let pollies pay thousands of dollars back and it’s the end of it.

              • Puckish Rogue

                As long as they’re not claiming for cleaning a moat its all good also these are amusing, sort of

                https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mps-expenses-top-10-most-2266854

                • McFlock

                  Still, I wonder how many Northland swamp kauri companies there are, and the odds that the pipeline was damaged by a company connected with a cabinet minister at the time.

                  • Puckish Rogue

                    One of lifes mysteries that will never be answered I feel

                    • Baba Yaga

                      I’m still wondering if and when Metiria Turei is going to pay back the money she stole from the taxpayer.

                    • dukeofurl

                      Its likely the extra flatmates or boarders are allowed.
                      Its only counted as income when you are paying a mortgage

                      You should be asking if Judith Collins will pay back the costs of the trip to China she got taxpayers to pay for but it really was to promote her husbands business with Oravida ( remember the dinner ‘on the way to the airport’- snort!)

                      Random impertinent questions for Judith Collins

                      That was the reason for her ( forced ) resignation by Key, he lied to him and why he wouldnt let her back in cabinet.

                    • In Vino

                      Yes, Baba Yaga…
                      I cannot help but suspect that you probably legally ‘avoided’ more than she ever stole.

  3. Sanctuary 3

    “…He thinks that abortion should be rare, safe and legal…”

    Rare, safe and legal. Exactly my thoughts about National governments!

    • Matthew Whitehead 3.1

      Hah Lew made exactly this joke on Twitter. Had a good follow up about letting people still vote National after two doctor’s visits, as well. 😉

  4. dukeofurl 4

    Bill Clinton was born in Hope, Arkansas, not ‘georgian born southern baptist’

  5. dukeofurl 5

    I wonder if Bridges thinks secret recordings should be in the Crimes Act ?

  6. paul andersen 6

    abortion is one of the subjects that make the claim that the natz are the party of personal responsibility, and the party of personal freedom and less state interference, the bullshit claim that it is. if one wanted to make mischief with the natz and their support patsy, sorry, party, one would point out that liberals keep out of others bedrooms, conservatives are panting to get in. what is judith collins veiw? time to drive a stake, er, wedge, in between bridges and collins over this subject, and watch them both dance while lying( would that be plank-dancing, or in their case, plonker-dancing?)

  7. Rosemary McDonald 7

    I am assuming that all commenters on this issue are biologically female?

    If not….this is none of your business.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 7.1

      +1

      In fairness, the topic also covers Bridges’ lack of any original thought.

    • bwaghorn 7.2

      Well I hope no men voted in the Irish referendum then just in case they offended a right to life woman

    • Siobhan 7.3

      ?????, there are and will always be some men who support some women through abortions and/or offer support when the woman are declined the right to abortion. Husbands, boyfriends, brothers, Dad etc
      And if we were to return to the days of entirely illegal abortions I’m sure many husbands/partners/family went through the horror of having to support their wives/partners through that terrible situation.
      Using your logic you could just as easily say “If you’re a woman who has never/will never require abortion or been in a situation where this was a possibility” then this is none of your business.
      There can be no positive change in society without a broad conversation and consensus. Excluding whole sections of the population from the debate leaves the issue, any issue, ghettoised.

    • Cinny 7.4

      Nice one sister 🙂

      Excuse crassness, but just for a giggle….. bill clintons birth control method was to ejaculate on a blue dress and look how that turned out lololz.

    • Gabby 7.5

      How’s business?

  8. alwyn 8

    “Georgian born southern Baptist”.
    I think you are starting to get your Democratic Presidents a little bit confused.
    They were both Southern Baptists but it was Jimmy Carter who was born in Georgia.
    Bill was born in Arkansas.

    • In Vino 8.1

      I wouldn’t be surprised if new investigation unearthed the unlikely theory that he was born in Kenya, along with Obama. I am sure that Trump can do fake revelation of new investigations..

      • alwyn 8.1.1

        Something we agree on.
        Before the election I was of the opinion that Trump was incredibly dangerous and quite mad.
        Unfortunately I was unduly optimistic. He is worse.

        Got the heater going tonight have you. It was about 7 degrees in Wellington at 1 pm today. Where is that Global Warming we were promised? brrrr.

        • In Vino 8.1.1.1

          Heater on here too, but still only on ‘economy’ mode. I blame an 11º hole in the budgeted temperature allowance. Hard to find good forecasters these days.

  9. OncewasTim 9

    I listened to him on Morning report.
    You are inkrek.
    Wod he sed goan forwud was “rear, safe an legill”
    ….still troin ta figa eart what a rear borshun is, let alone one that’s legill.
    Is that almost, or “pretty legal”?
    Maybe a rear borshun has something to do with scat?

  10. Delia 10

    Can you control genetic abnormalities in the womb Simon? So how can abortion become rare. This is just one reason for abortion. We also have rape, incest, poverty, risk to mother’s health. Honestly the only people who should vote on this are not a bunch of politicians many male..but women of child bearing age.

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    ·         Crown Minerals Act will no longer actively “promote” prospecting, exploration, and mining of Crown-owned minerals ·         Will create more certainty around engagement between industry, iwi and hapū. The Government is proposing changes to modernise the Crown Minerals Act 1991 (CMA) to support more environmentally conscious management of resources, says ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago