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Daily Review 13/07/2017

Written By: - Date published: 5:30 pm, July 13th, 2017 - 58 comments
Categories: uncategorized - Tags:

Daily review is also your post.

This provides Standardistas the opportunity to review events of the day.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Don’t forget to be kind to each other …

58 comments on “Daily Review 13/07/2017 ”

  1. Ed 2

    George Monbiot explains

    • ianmac 2.1

      So removing “red tape” is for the good of society. Why thankyou dear old Nick Smith. We didn’t need those protected areas anyway.

  2. billmurray 3

    The latest comment from an unknown in the Green party that they would/ could cause another general election over a coalition with Winnie’s party is a white anting of Labour once again.
    The MoU is a dogs breakfast’
    The MoU is in tatters.
    Labour should publicly get out of this disaster to save themselves.
    Please.

    • weka 3.1

      You’re making shit up about the MoU again bill.

      Shaw did an interview on RNZ this morning, where he categorically said the Greens were committed to stable govt and wouldn’t force a new election. I’m not even convinced that Coates said that the Greens would do this as intentional strategy.

      But there are some things to consider here. The Greens have to take any coalition deal back to the members.

      How would it be possible for the Greens to force a new election? If NZF/L were to go into a coalition that the Greens felt they couldn’t in good conscience support on Confidence and Supply, what is to stop a L/G/NZF govt, or a Nact/NZF one? Would be interested to see where you feel the Greens have the power to prevent the latter or motivation to prevent the former.

      If on the other hand, NZF refuses to deal with L/G, how is that the Greens’ fault?

      • billmurray 3.1.1

        Weka,
        I am not making shit up,
        FACT. Green MP Barry Coates did say the Party would refuse to support a Lab/ NZ First government.
        James Shaw has since talked in circles trying to downplay Coates statement.
        Meteria’s recent attack on NZ First over racism shows that Coates is not alone in his sentiments.
        There is strong resentment in the Greens to NZ Fiirst being a coalition partner.

        • bearded git 3.1.1.1

          he didn’t talk in circles…he said coates was wrong several times.

          • billmurray 3.1.1.1.1

            Bearded git,
            They are both MP’s of the Green party talking against each other.
            That’s a statement from Barry Coates.
            That’s circles from James Shaw.

        • weka 3.1.1.2

          “I am not making shit up,”

          So do you believe that the GP would force a new election?

          “FACT. Green MP Barry Coates did say the Party would refuse to support a Lab/ NZ First government.”

          Here’s what he said,

          “However, if we were not part of the coalition, we would not accept a Labour-New Zealand First government and certainly not a National-New Zealand First government.”

          If that means for instance that they won’t support NZF/L on C and S, what is the problem with that? Are you suggesting that the Greens have to commit pre-election to supporting a L/NZF govt on C and S? That would be a remarkable requirement of a political party.

          As for the rest of it, the Greens came out on Sunday with a strong position for the election. Their preferred coalition partner is Labour, they will work with NZF if they have to, and they’re asking progressives to give their party vote to the Greens because its the only way to get a truly progressive govt.

          • billmurray 3.1.1.2.1

            weka,
            The way I sincerely see it, is that Barry Coates statement is another white anting of Labours need to have NZF in a coalition for them to form a government.
            The Greens do not want to be in a government coalition which includes NZF.
            Despite what you and James Shaw say I believe, because of Barry Coates statement that attempts at a such coalition would never bear finality.
            In my view the LP are again being white anted by a anarchist MoU partner.
            Labour are being shafted because they are weak in the polls.
            IMO the Greens are destroying Labour.

            • weka 3.1.1.2.1.1

              You’re certainly free to believe whatever you want (not sure why you are using the term white anting though). And if you believe that the Greens are lairs, then there’s nothing I can say to change that. But I will continue to pull you up when you misrepresent things that are on record.

              My own belief is that the Greens want a strong L/G government that is as progressive as possible. Obviously Peters would undermine that, so fair enough they stand up in election year and say vote for Greens if you want a truly progressive govt, because you won’t get that from NZF/L alone.

              • billmurray

                weka,
                I use the term white anting because the Greens are white anting Labour.
                Labour needs to speak up against these sideways attacks against them.

                • weka

                  Yes, but it doesn’t make sense. White-anting is subverting from within. The Greens aren’t within Labour, how can they subvert them from within?

                  • billmurray

                    weka,
                    The MoU that’s why.

                    • Sacha

                      white-anting is an Australian term. take it back there

                    • weka

                      So two separate parties have a written agreement around some things they both value. Care to say which of those things the Greens are undermining? Try and be specific.

                  • weka

                    @Sacha, the only time I’ve heard it used in NZ was in reference to pre-Little Labour 😉

                    • billmurray

                      Sacha, weka,
                      sorry but ‘whiting anting’ is an accepted political term across the political world.
                      Just like ‘scabbing’ is also accepted word across the world.

                    • weka

                      You’ll be answering my questions above about how it applies to the MoU then.

                      Daily Review 13/07/2017

                    • james

                      By a labour MP by chance?

                      I remember Claire Curran talking about the Greens White-anting Labour.

            • Psycho Milt 3.1.1.2.1.2

              …another white anting of Labours need to have NZF in a coalition for them to form a government.

              Let there be no white-anting. Instead, let’s all pay some attention to some relevant facts:

              1. A Labour/NZF government isn’t a serious possibility following this election, unless one of them gets a sudden huge increase in support.

              2. NZF’s parochial conservatism is a better fit with National than with Labour.

              3. Anyone serious about wanting a change of government at this election needs to vote Labour or Green, because a vote for NZ First is in all likelihood a vote for a National-led government.

              Given those facts, if Coates had said Winston could go fuck himself it would have sounded reasonable to me.

              • billmurray

                Psycho Milt,
                I believe that’s Coates said most forcefully, Winnie to go and fuck yourself.
                Not MoU manners.

                • The Green Party doesn’t have an MoU with NZ First. For good reason, given that NZF is likely to ensure we retain a National-led government come September. That’s for the people planning to vote NZF to have on their conscience, not the Greens.

              • bearded git

                i still think boring lying double dipping bill can’t get 40 percent for the nats, and bugger the polls.

                So nats 39 lab 32 green 13 nzf 13 is entirely possible

        • JanM 3.1.1.3

          At least spell her name correctly!

    • Bill 3.2

      Barry Coates isn’t an unknown and he didn’t say any such thing. He said it would not be acceptable for NZ Labour to leave the Green Party out of any governing coalition.

      That’s a perfectly reasonable position to hold.

      But then in comes Trotter to write a (being kind here) mischievous blog post, and close behind him, the msm rush forth with shovels to scoop up and spread shit.

      And the general spread is ‘salted’ with how Winston’s a nice guy and how dare you bring up his being overly keen on the racist/xenophobic sound bites and leave him alone and anyway Green is bad and daft and stupid and a threat to the electoral process.

      Job done.

      • Ad 3.2.1

        Trotter is a pain in the ass.

        If Labour form a government without the Greens, after signing an MOU to go into it with them, there will be plenty of Labour membership cards burnt. It would be a total betrayal of both Labour and the Greens and would show Labour unsuited to an MMP environment.

        I sincerely hope the Labour leadership get that.

        • weka 3.2.1.1

          The hurdle here is to shift the narrative over the next two months that Peters has a right to be kingmaker and everyone else falls in behind. If a L/G/NZF coalition is necessary and fails, it won’t be the Greens fucking that up.

          • billmurray 3.2.1.1.1

            weka,
            I disagree
            the Greens are trying to fuck it up now.

            • Ad 3.2.1.1.1.1

              Standard electoral argy-bargy. Damn boring election otherwise.

            • weka 3.2.1.1.1.2

              “the Greens are trying to fuck it up now.”

              If by fuck up you mean they’re trying to lessen the chance or power of NZF in a Labour-led govt by getting more people to vote Green, then of course. If you are progressive then NZF is not a good thing. What is wrong with the Greens’ position?

              • billmurray

                Weka,
                they are trying to fuck a workable political coalition against Labour.
                Let me remind you of the MoU and the obligation of political togetherness.

                • weka

                  “they are trying to fuck a workable political coalition against Labour.”

                  That doesn’t even make sense.

                  I’m still waiting for you to be specific which parts of the MoU they are fucking up.

                  • billmurray

                    weka;
                    If you do not know now, then you should ask the L/P leadership.
                    Expect @451$!!!!.GrGrGrGr. Reply.

            • Psycho Milt 3.2.1.1.1.3

              the Greens are trying to fuck it up now.

              Can you point to where NZF have said they’re happy to support a Lab/Green government? If you can’t, what’s your problem with the Green Party being unwilling to support a Lab/NZF government? And if you can’t, by your logic doesn’t that mean NZF is trying to fuck it up now?

              • weka

                Apparently it’s alright when Peters does it.

                • Jenny Kirk

                  Weka – Andrew Little has clarified just where he stands on this little spat between the Greens and NZ First. Just a couple of hours ago. I think he’s capable of pulling both these Parties together for the common good of us all. He’s done it before (pulling difficult/problematic people together), and he can do it again. See the link below.

                  “We can form a good government and I want the Green Party to be part of that and the New Zealand First party to be part of that,” he told Newshub.
                  “We have a lot of common ground with the Green Party, we have a lot of common ground with New Zealand First. I think our three parties offer New Zealand the best chance of fixing the problems we know New Zealanders want us to fix.”
                  “I’m totally confident that I am capable of putting together if the numbers fall our way a government that will have a good solid programme of change involving up to three parties,” he said.

                  http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/07/i-want-greens-and-nz-first-in-my-govt-andrew-little.html

                  • weka

                    Thanks Jenny, appreciate that. I also think Little will be good in post-election coalition building.

      • james 3.2.2

        So What did he say:

        Asked by Newshub if this meant forcing the country back to the polls for another election, Mr Coates responded: “It could do.”

        Mr Coates also said Green MPs had discussed refusing to support a Labour-NZ First combination as a caucus in the past fortnight.

        Pretty clear that they are discussing refusing to support a labour NZF government and that they could potentially sent NZ back to the polls.

        Pretty clear cut.

        So – is he a liar about the discussions ?

        • Robert Guyton 3.2.2.1

          Pretty clear cut to a one-dimensional thinker.
          All the discussion since your first breathless post has meant nothing to you, this latest comment from you reveals; all the subtleties were lost on you, all the other ways to look at the situation flew by like unnoticed birds and here you are, back at square one, beating the same tinny little drum, ’cause it’s music to your ears, James.
          Please at least make an effort, James. As many have said here, we yearn for a troll of substance. I never thought I’d say this, but Bring Back Pucky!

  3. Cinny 4

    Game of Thrones… episode 100 .. The Story So Far… yeah rock on, far out I love the internet.

  4. tc 5

    Chilly pic, can only imagine being in the north island.

  5. Ad 6

    The snow is perfect timing for Labour’s home heating subsidy.

  6. Child poverty and bad parenting a ‘middle class New Zealand myth’ – researchers

    Next time you think there’s a link between child poverty and parenting, think again.

    There is no evidence for a link, experts say, but it’s not uncommon to hear people discuss society’s ills in a parenting context.

    Police minister Judith Collins first provoked howls of disagreement from children’s advocates, then she said her comments about a “poverty of parental responsibility” were taken out of context.

    And the dehumanising RWNJs are proved wrong yet again by the, you know, facts.

    • Cinny 7.1

      it’s easier to blame parents rather than doing something about the social and economic setting.

      “Forty per cent of children in poverty are in households in paid work. Are we saying there’s a large chunk of parents who are working who are inadequate? That’s hard to sustain. This is not about behaviour. It’s about access to resources, the way we distribute opportunity.

      That’s it in a nutshell, access to resources and distribution of opportunity.

      Everyone having affordable living costs,
      power/housing/food/medical/transport/water

      Everyone having access to education, free tertiary education, the same opportunities for all.

      NZ 1st, Labour, Greens have so much in common, so much.

      Thanks for the link Draco.

  7. Cinny 9

    Listening to the political panel on radiolive it’s really interesting, Rodney Hide and Chris Trotter.

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