Open mike 09/07/2023

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, July 9th, 2023 - 52 comments
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52 comments on “Open mike 09/07/2023 ”

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  1. Ad 1
    9 July 2023 at 9:21 am

    OMG Argentina!

  2. aj 2
    9 July 2023 at 9:32 am

    Good interviews this weekend on The Nation (Kelvin Davis) and right now on Q & A with Damian O'Conner.

    The government hasn't been getting space to refute the 'Deluge of Doom' falling from Nat/ACT. Labour may have problems with a small number of ministers but many are doing their work, and doing it well.

    Kelvin Davis:

    Damian O'Conner:

    No link yet to Q&A yet

    The Nation's interview with Chief Executive Andrew Mackenzie was also interesting. He refutes claims Kainga Ora isn't delivering.

    • bwaghorn 2.1
      9 July 2023 at 11:55 am

      O'connor has got to be the most impressive level headed minister I can think of.

      He understands what's possible, he thinks a long game , if labour get the arse national better get this guy in or climate and or trade teams going forward.

    • Vivie 2.2
      9 July 2023 at 2:41 pm

      I watched each interview. The interviewees spoke clearly, calmly and informatively. Chief Executive of Kainga Ora Andrew MacKenzie came across as measured and factual. Damien O'Connor is a great advocate for NZ.

      Regarding the recent incident of protesters on the roof at the Korowai Manaaki centre, Kelvin Davis acknowledged that some staff are not trained sufficiently to work with the residents, and that there is a shortage of appropriate applicants for these roles. Concerning the implication that he is responsible for the employment of inexperienced, unqualified staff – imagine the uproar if he was involved in recruitment. He commented about the experience of the police staff who resolved this incident and advised they are working to address problems in the youth justice facilities, with improved staff employment and training. Of course he was later berated by the panel for not having instant solutions to NZ's crime problems.

      ACT's intellectually lazy solution is to have youth justice facilities managed by Corrections. As usual David Seymour is appealing to people's wilful ignorance and prejudices, while presumably being fully aware that NZ's inequitable society is a major cause of antisocial and criminal behaviour. It seems he has not been asked by media, nor has he explained whether ACT has any policies to address these inequities. As Corrections also has staff shortages, how does he expect Corrections staff to manage youth justice facilities?

      https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/493111/young-people-on-roof-of-justice-facility-highlights-major-flaws-with-system-advocate

      National's plan to address youth offending does not acknowledge the causes of this behaviour, nor include strategies to address social disparities.

      https://www.national.org.nz/combatting_youth_offending

      National and ACT have no effective solutions to address crime and are cynical in their attempts to gain support, by appealing to people's fears and resentment. Can anyone advise which policies of National and Act they support and how these policies would benefit the majority of NZers?

  3. pat 3
    9 July 2023 at 10:57 am

    Many good points and much to agree with (though not all)

    "Not a single voice on either side of the argument made the most important and obvious point: if hospital and other health care services were adequately meeting everyone’s needs in a timely way, there would be no waiting lists for surgical operations, and therefore no possibility for anyone to ‘jump the queue.’ Clearly, none of these parties have any intention of getting rid of waiting lists in health care: they were all engaged in demagogy and vote-gathering, nothing more. Their debate leads to a dead end."

    https://rdln.wordpress.com/2023/07/09/class-race-and-unequal-access-to-health-care/

    While it may be true that the political parties have missed that obvious point, plenty of commentators have….usually with the proviso that unlimited healthcare is an unrealistic expectation.

    • Belladonna 3.1
      9 July 2023 at 11:30 am

      I think that there will always be the need for a small waiting list – simply from the perspective of effectively planning hospital workloads (6 people diagnosed needing X operation this week, none last week). A short waiting list smooths out those demand fluctuations.

      However, I agree with the broader point – that none of the policies proposed appear to address the elephant in the room: the unreasonably long waiting lists, and the fact that we don't have the health infrastructure do do anything about it.

      Waiting lists (and even the ability to get on to the waiting list) have been acting as a demand reduction tool.

      It also ignores the fact that waiting years for routine surgical operations – means that people are out of the workforce, enduring long-term pain (and there are physiological consequences arising from this), and suffering side effects (again some with long term health consequences) from the placeholder drugs. Not to mention the whole quality of life issue.

      Investment on this has to come from the ground up. We need the workforce to be trained, effectively employed, valued and retained. All of which should be number one priority for the new health authority and for the government (both present and any government-in-waiting). Sadly, this does not appear to be the case.

      Although I think there is a discussion that we (as a country) have to have about what *level* of healthcare should be available to all. But, if the NZ hospital system offers the care, it should be in a timely manner, and available to all who need it.

      • pat 3.1.1
        9 July 2023 at 3:37 pm

        The hospital system is )or at least should be) the end of the chain….the issues are much broader

    • Phillip ure 3.2
      9 July 2023 at 12:43 pm

      Libya before Obama turned it into a fundamentalist hell-hole..

      Back then Libyans had free/universal/unlimited healthcare..in a very modern health system…

      Obama ended all that..

    • DS 3.3
      9 July 2023 at 12:52 pm

      There are really two big problems with the article:

      – Health results are tied to socio-economic status, and while Maori and Pasifika are disproportionately poor, most poor people in New Zealand are Pakeha.

      – Health discrepancies between Maori and non-Maori vary radically depending on the part of the country. The life expectancy gap is much, much smaller in the South Island, as opposed to places like Hawkes Bay or East Coast – and I would note that South Island Maori do not have the vaccination problems one encounters in the Upper North Island.

      • pat 3.3.1
        9 July 2023 at 1:05 pm

        There are many areas of health and the services provided unaddressed by his brief article however it isnt intended to be a comprehensive review….the points made however are worthy of consideration (imo) and may lead to further discussion of the types of points you raise.

        The aspect which drew my attention (and agreement) was the observation that inadequate provision en masse appears accepted by both sides of the argument….particularly within the political class.

    • Incognito 3.4
      9 July 2023 at 8:47 pm

      […] if hospital and other health care services were adequately meeting everyone’s needs in a timely way […] [my italics]

      Some waiting lists for elective surgery are unreasonably long but this statement is simplistic. Non-elective treatments such as radiotherapy of cancer patients must take precedent, IMO.

      To give you an idea of the complexities:

      Patients, queues and hospital beds: modelling and optimisation

      https://www.math.auckland.ac.nz/CULMS/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/Ziedins-ppt.pdf

      And this is for just one hospital unit!

      • pat 3.4.1
        11 July 2023 at 6:02 pm

        Why do you insist of committing the acts you acuse others of?

        You neglected to list the full quote…"there would be no waiting lists for surgical operations, and therefore no possibility for anyone to ‘jump the queue."

        You persist in doing your arguments a disservice….however it is of no account, the voting public wtll not be making their judgements on what either you or I write on this forum.

        • Incognito 3.4.1.1
          11 July 2023 at 8:24 pm

          Because it is a conditional statement and the conditions are not defined and they are simplistic.

          Why do you bother commenting here if ‘it is of no account’?

  4. joe90 4
    9 July 2023 at 11:52 am

    Looks like someone hit a nerve.

    .

    BEIRUT, July 8 (Reuters) – Syria’s information ministry said on Saturday it had canceled the accreditation of two local journalists working for Britain’s BBC over what it said was “false” and “politicised” coverage.

    The accreditations of an unidentified correspondent and cameraman have been revoked following “subjective and false information and reports” on Syria, the information ministry said in a statement on its website. It described other BBC reports as “politicised.”

    https://www.reuters.com/article/syria-media/syria-cancels-accreditation-for-two-bbc-journalists-ministry-idINL8N38U092

    .

    65,549 views Jun 28, 2023 #BBCNews #Syria

    New direct links between the Captagon drug trade and leading members of the Syrian Armed Forces and President Bashar al-Assad's family have been revealed. In March, Britain, the United States and the European Union imposed sanctions on a list of people – including two cousins of President Assad – suspected of involvement in the multi-billion dollar Captagon trade. But a joint investigation by BBC News Arabic and the investigative journalism network OCCRP, deep inside Syria's narco-state, has found evidence indicating the involvement of other senior Syrian officials in addition to those already included in that list. Captagon is a highly addictive amphetamine-like drug that has plagued the Middle East in recent years. Now the drug is also being found in Europe, Africa and Asia.

  5. Belladonna 5
    9 July 2023 at 11:53 am

    The dangers of writing letters in support of James Wallace – without (in most cases) knowing what he was charged with. I feel that many of these prominent Kiwis will be feeling rather mousetrapped by Wallace.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/sir-james-wallace-the-film-stars-musicians-knights-and-dames-who-wrote-letters-of-support-for-disgraced-patrons-sentencing/ZAIWWFU4JVBCRKBRVLQ5MCC5AY/

    https://archive.ph/snJ0o

    I do not believe that philanthropy should be any reason for a reduction in sentence. The fact that you may have used your wealth for the benefit of the community (in part, philanthropists also gain from this transaction) – is no reason that you should not serve a full sentence for your crimes.
    The only one that I feel the judge should have considered – is from Bob Harvey – who commented on the decline in Wallace's health over the last few years.

    Sir Bob Harvey, the former Mayor of Waitakere City and ex-president of the Labour Party, told the court in his letter he had noticed a decline in Wallace’s health and asked the judge to “take into consideration his age and wellbeing both physically and mentally”.

    • joe90 5.1
      9 July 2023 at 12:33 pm

      Name and shame the 89 enablers who minimised the offending of sexual predator James Wallace.

    • Shanreagh 5.3
      9 July 2023 at 12:51 pm

      These are really what is called character witnesses. Wallace, in asking for the letters, apparently did come clean with the actual charges he was facing.

      I am not sure that many would be as fulsome now knowing the charges he was found guilty of.

      I do not believe that philanthropy should be any reason for a reduction in sentence.

      I agree and would expand it to cover this

      I do not believe that philanthropy should be any reason for a reduction in any sentence imposed for any crime.

      Actually thinking about character letters, I am wondering what the purpose is really. To me it seems yet another aspect that white middle class people are able to tap into that is not available for many offenders in South Auckland.

      It does seem that it is a privilege granted/available to some and not all.

      Actually thinking about Wallace and Kevin Spacey and the legality of homosexual relationships/gay marriages I can’t help but wonder why the chance for stable relationships is/was not taken advantage of. Or is this pursuit and forced sexual relationhips part of the psyche and stability in a same sex relationship is not wanted? Also the same for career male on female rapists.
      Probably TMI or pondering?

      • Shanreagh 5.3.1
        9 July 2023 at 1:08 pm

        Sorry I'll write that again

        Wallace, in asking for the letters, apparently did not come clean with the actual charges he was facing.

        • joe90 5.3.1.1
          9 July 2023 at 1:25 pm

          apparently did not come clean with the actual charges he was facing.

          A family member who worked on Rannoch House; a funny old boy who likes 'em strong-jawed and slight.

          They fucking knew.

          • tWiggle 5.3.1.1.1
            9 July 2023 at 1:59 pm

            Looking for black and white where there are human shades of grey. One of the hardest things with abusers of power, whether emotional, physical or sexual, is that they can honestly offer good things – opportunities, mentorship, financial support – along with the bad.

            But the abused harvest the shame, along with the ambiguity.

            • Shanreagh 5.3.1.1.1.1
              9 July 2023 at 2:36 pm

              is that they can honestly offer good things – opportunities, mentorship, financial support – along with the bad.

              I thought that too but now I think that this thinking may be part of allowing or turning a blind eye to untoward activities. And who knowsvfcv how much of the 'good things' were just the web to entangle the unwary, naive or trusting?

              • joe90 …
                9 July 2023 at 4:00 pm

                It's pretty simple really, someone always knows.

                Abusers, whether sexual, violent, or psychological, rarely act once, against only one victim. It's absurd to think that those who know abusers well enough to vouch for their character would be unaware of the abuser's personality, proclivities, and past conduct.

                • tWiggle …
                  9 July 2023 at 5:34 pm

                  I disagree that you have to be a serial abuser to abuse power, and that someone always knows. Think about outwardly respectable abusive marriages, before widespread access to contraception and the DPB.

  6. joe90 6
    9 July 2023 at 1:55 pm

    Goodbye glyphosate. Hello AI-controlled robot that trundles around the paddock day and night identifying weeds and zapping them with laser.

    https://carbonrobotics.com/laserweeder

    • Shanreagh 6.1
      9 July 2023 at 2:31 pm

      I think I need one of these and one of those robotic lawn mowers. smiley

      https://www.husqvarna.com/nz/robotic-lawn-mowers/?

      • ianmac 6.1.1
        9 July 2023 at 3:06 pm

        Funny thing Shan is that not once does the video show that the grass is cut. That is no sign of before and after for $11,000?

      • joe90 6.1.2
        9 July 2023 at 3:44 pm

        A neighbour has one. He spent an arm and a leg on his lawn removing the kiykuya and sand, laying the best top soil and sowing a pricey seed blend.

        For the first couple of years, aside from the occasional escape across the barrier and onto the road (I picked it up and tried to take it home once and found out that they're alarmed), his robomower worked fine.

        It doesn't do too well now that the kiykuya has returned and jiggered his once glorious lawn.

        • Shanreagh 6.1.2.1
          9 July 2023 at 5:06 pm

          Oh dear my lawn is mostly glorious kukuyu!

          Perhaps I can plant it in native trees and get a Greens subsidy for helping mitigate the effects of climate change. wink

          • Phillip ure 6.1.2.1.1
            9 July 2023 at 5:43 pm

            I like kikuyu..

            It is a strong grass..

            Very pleasant underfoot..

  7. Incognito 7
    9 July 2023 at 3:25 pm

    Another example of the disingenuous populism of ACT is that they reject lowering the voting age but want to hold youth offenders to account by treating them [more harshly] as adults. At the age of 16 you can hold a firearms licence and drive car and I wonder how ACT feel about this – they seem to be quite selective in the libertarian and liberal values they do and do not support and I think some of their views are bordering on being authoritarian, at best …

    • Incognito 7.1
      9 July 2023 at 3:55 pm

      I just noticed that Glenn McConnell on Stuff makes a similar observation.

      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/132511092/teens-should-go-to-adult-court-at-17–but-not-vote-act-says

    • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.2
      9 July 2023 at 4:10 pm

      promoting libertarianism with a prominent right-wing populist faction.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ACT_New_Zealand

      Some in ACT….seem keen on putting on jackboots. And giving kickings to any of those they deem lower ….including 17 year olds (and possibly younger).

      Possibly vote chasing…? But anyway, appealing to the lowest punitive types.

      Has any of that punitive mindset ever worked ? I get, that for the good of Society..some very dangerous and extremely nasty people need to be removed from same.

      But treating 17 year old kids as adults? IMO its..as many others have said, putting them into a training area. And despite what the authoritarian types say…not for any good training. Reality is, training to be harder, more violent (dog eat dog and to survive basically ) and always…learning new crime skills,

      • Incognito 7.2.1
        9 July 2023 at 4:53 pm

        Has any of that punitive mindset ever worked ?

        Yes, it does work, which is why RW parties rely on it to win votes, every time. It’s baked & caked in the RW psyche.

    • observer 7.3
      9 July 2023 at 7:47 pm

      It's deeply cynical because we know what would happen if there's a Nat/ACT government …

      1) Seymour would say "this is our policy"

      2) National do have some lawyers and non-idiots who understand that getting derailed by years of legal challenges is not a battle worth fighting, for no gain

      3) So in negotiations, National would agree to a "review" and a year or so later, quietly dump it

      4) Seymour would say "it's still our policy", and carry on doing nothing about it

      5) In paragraph 12 of a minor news story in 2025, it will be quietly reported that it's not happening

      Of course Seymour knows this too but doesn't care. He knows his audience.

      And if anyone doubts that this is all a big con, look at previous promises from ACT. They have disappeared from view, because they were only ever a headline grab, not serious policy. Such as …

      https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/106184257/act-bill-would-see-parliament-cut-to-100-mps

      • Corey 7.3.1
        9 July 2023 at 8:10 pm

        This is absolutely what will happen, tbh it reminds me of Winston Peters 2017 promise to abolish the Maori electorates.

        Winston had no intention of ever going through with it, and neither does Seymour, it's just a policy that's gonna gain them votes.

        Act being considered populist or even libertarian is never not going to sound weird, they are simply undiluted neoliberals.

        The only reason they sound remotely populist is because the major parties are too afraid to say anything remotely popular with voters.

  8. joe90 8
    9 July 2023 at 5:07 pm

    This is huge, but you'd never know given the paltry coverage.

    • In response to high demand for the first-ever malaria vaccine, 12 countries in Africa will be allocated a total of 18 million doses of RTS,S/AS01 for the 2023–2025 period
    • Malaria Vaccine Implementation Programme countries Ghana, Kenya and Malawi will receive doses to continue vaccinations in pilot areas
    • Allocations were also made for new introductions in Benin, Burkina Faso, Burundi, Cameroon, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Liberia, Niger, Sierra Leone and Uganda

    https://www.unicef.org/press-releases/18-million-doses-first-ever-malaria-vaccine-allocated-12-african-countries-20232025

    • Phillip ure 8.1
      9 July 2023 at 5:51 pm

      It is huge/good news..

      Malaria is a real shitter…

      I caught it in new guinea..

      Ended up in the tropical diseases hospital in queensland..

      When I came out of my coma..the doctor told me he had bad news and good news..

      The bad news was that the strain I had was the worst..in the sense of what it put you through..

      (And I do have things like heroin withdrawals cold turkey to compare it to..and it was right up there with that..)

      The good news was that it was not a strain that recurred..

      No relapses on my horizon..

      With the number of people/children who now die each year…this is fantastic news..

  9. Muttonbird 9
    9 July 2023 at 7:12 pm

    Have to assume our dear friend Robert Guyton must be a little bit pleased that Environment Southland is holding polluting and animal abusing farmers to some sort of account:

    Farmers ordered to immediately stop winter grazing are “stressed” and “don’t know what to do,” an industry leader says.

    Environment Southland issued abatement notices to several farmers after it deemed rules under the National Environmental Standards for Freshwater were being broken.

    The notices told farmers to “cease and desist” winter grazing immediately.

    Not only are these vandals upset about being policed, they are also upset the bill for that policing is sent to them rather than Southland ratepayers.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/132506208/southland-farmers-stressed-after-council-orders-immediate-halt-to-winter-grazing

    • Shanreagh 9.1
      10 July 2023 at 12:18 am

      Goodness me and it is not as if the concept of looking after pastures and stock has been sprung upon them! Every year since the year dot…I'm only mildly exaggerating.

      Someone should get alongside these farmers (is that the right word for them?) and let them know of a sure fire way of not getting stressed about things and that is not to break the law.

      They could also be told about the saying about the doing the same things over and over and getting the same results…..

      Are they not putting in enough winter feed? Break feeding for too long? Should they look at better/different winter feeding regimes? Are they carrying too much stock and so have to be mean with the feed? What would be the point of stressing your animals like this?

      Why don’t they have happy cows and pasture with regen ag?

    • bwaghorn 9.2
      10 July 2023 at 6:26 am

      Will be pointing out that story to the boss, I was prepared to do our consenting this year but he told me not to wast my time on it,

      Feeling a bit stressed as due to a staff member leaving I couldn't fully adhere to best practice as I went into my crops, just not enough hours in the day, have done now though.

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