Haven’t been able to find any English Regional percentage breakdowns yet (ie North-East, West Midlands, South-West, Greater London etc – but, then, that’s probably a plus from your point of view)
Trp said something about it yesterday, and I think it’s been in the media, as a reason for Labour doing badly (I’m rolling my eyes), but it sounded like the same old beat up to me, as you point out there wasn’t a real shift.
Yep, the Undecideds certainly comprise one of the reasons being touted for the “terrible night for us pollsters” (Chief Executive of YouGov ).
Others include: (1) the “Shy Conservative” (though they arguably overlap with the Undecideds – about which, more below), (2) The suggestion that Polls were, in fact, correct but last-minute swing to the Tories, (3) That Pollsters may have been “herding” (ie skewing their polls towards an average) – some analysts are suspicious about just how closely-aligned the various polls were in the final days, (4) Claims that the Final Result was, in fact, within the margin-of-error for most polls, (5) Becoming more challenging to contact a representative sample of voters, (6) The large-ish minority of Labour supporters (28% in one Ipsos-Mori Poll) who told pollsters they preferred Cameron as PM (speculation they could comprise a whole new category of “shy Tory”), (7) Current polling methods haven’t adjusted to the new era of electoral politics (ie the much greater fluidity of the electorate in recent years).
In terms of the argument that a disproportionate number of “Don’t Knows” went Tory on Election Day,…….. a couple of weeks back, I was looking through the detailed breakdowns of a particular poll and noticed that the Undecideds – when pushed to name which Party they were leaning towards – went heavily Conservative. Tories led Labour by more than 10 points among this group. It’s true that Undecideds are somewhat less likely to get out and actually vote on the Day than respondents who name a party on initial prompting, but 10+ points would still have some impact on the final result (not necessarily “shy” but certainly “hidden” Tories).
Labour were targeting 106 marginal seats – most were Tory-held, some LibDem-held.
Have a look at what happened in the most marginal Tory seats of all.
15 Most Marginal Tory Seats of 2010 (ie with smallest 2010 majorities over Labour)
Seat……………….2010 Tory maj over Lab…….2015 % Swing……………….Status
Warwickshire North…………….54……………..CON + 2.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Thurrock……………………………..92……………..CON – 3.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Hendon………………………………106…………….CON + 6.7……LAB – 0.6………Con Hold
Cardiff North………………………194…………….CON + 4.9……LAB + 1.2………Con Hold
Sherwood…………………………..214…………….CON + 5.8……LAB – 2.9……….Con Hold
Stockton South…………………..332…………….CON + 7.8……LAB – 1.3……….Con Hold
Lancaster & Fleetwood……….333…………….CON + 3.2……LAB + 7.0………Lab Gain
Broxtowe……………………………389…………….CON + 6.2…….LAB – 1.1………Con Hold
Amber Valley………………………536…………….CON + 5.4…….LAB – 2.7………Con Hold
Wolverhampton SW……………691…………….CON + 0.5…….LAB + 4.2……..Lab Gain
Waveney…………………………….769…………….CON + 2.1…….LAB – 1.0……..Con Hold
Carlisle……………………………….853…………….CON + 5.0…….LAB + 0.5………Con Hold
Morecombe & Lunesdale……866…………….CON + 4.0…… LAB – 4.6……..Con Hold
Weaver Vale……………………….991…………….CON + 4.6…….LAB + 5.2……..Con Hold
Lincoln………………………………1058……………CON + 5.1…… LAB + 4.3……..Con Hold
Labour won only 2 of the 15 seats it should have absolutely blitzed. And in a majority of the 13 ultra-marginals it failed in – its vote share actually fell while the Tories’ % rose.
Exactly Swordfish-great analysis. My sister lives in Lincoln and will be devastated. The turnout in Lincoln was 63%-pathetic in a marginal. Shows how disillusioned the UK electorate really is.
What has been missed a bit by the analysts is that Labour polled quite well in the north of England compared with last time. That is reflected in the Lancaster vote above, in Burnley and in a number of other results.
Yeah, I was only going to include Tory seats with majorities of less than 1000, but the City of Lincoln’s my old stomping ground. First went to the UK in 1983 in my late teens and spent most of the time in Lincoln/Nottingham area (where I had/have some distant relatives). Did some scrutineering for the Lincoln Labour Party on Election Day – sat next to a very large Tory woman from the Shire* – (and watched one or two Lincoln City games (“The Red Imps”) at Sincil Bank – bottom half of the 4th Division, trend towards pin-striped football Kit in 83 for some bizarre reason, possibly growing obsession with Corporate culture / Thatcherism of more than a few Football Club Execs).
Lincoln’s always been a bellwether seat, clearly still is.
* Yeah, I know, sexist of me to mention her weight. I feel bad about it, but there you go.
Not that bad an article, really. Armstrong has at least spotted the danger for his masters:
“The other lesson to take from Wednesday night’s function – and one National would be wise to heed – is Little’s capacity to surprise, something he first did with his “cut the crap” jibe at John Key. While well imbued with core Labour values, Little is less hung-up about what means are used to reach the goals associated with those values.”
I thought it is an okay article, too – TRP. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read.
Little has an enormous job to make Labour into a workable election campaign “machine” again – and he’s going about it thoughtfully, carefully, and maybe a bit slowly for some but if you look back at his various statements you’ll see he’s positioning Labour as the Party for Work and Jobs – along with all the other social values that underpins Labour.
So quit sniping at him and let him get on with that job.
Your quotation marks around “radical ideas”, followed by that smarmy little (!), implies this is a quote from Andrew Little. It would be helpful if you provided a citation for that quote, otherwise people might think you were still deliberately twisting things no one has actually said.
You may engage however you wish, but if you don’t want people to point out that you’re implying things that aren’t true and which you can’t back up you should probably either back up your statements, use clearer punctuation, or stop making up lies to suit your political agenda.
I have taken the position of ignoring everything that p u writes on the basis that anyone who refuses to use punctuation and write in coherent sentences and paragraphs can have nothing to say of interest.
It just takes too much time out of my life to read people who write in a stream of thought, blurting manner. Give me someone who makes the effort to write clearly and thoughtfully and, even if I almost always disagree, I will take the time to take their thought on board.
Me too Hateatea, and completely agree about the value of inention in communicating. I sometimes will attempt to read one of his comments in a situation like this (where someone has responded to him in a meaningful way). Sometimes I read the first two lines or so to see if I can make any sense. If he drops vegan links in I’ll have a look because they’re usually fundamentalist and need challenging. I virtually never read the long ones, or even the whole of the short ones. Life’s too short :->
Yep, same here. Some of the subthreads is keyboard-mashing causes can be pretty funny, though.
Especially when he gets called on making shit up and then argues that someone has misinterpreted his intentionally-unorthodox punctuation, grammar, and sentence contstruction.
Double quotation marks would imply a quote. Single ones I would take to mean an implication that some policies were radical ideas rather than a quote, but as you point out it can be hard to tell with phil.
My understanding is that Little is suggesting backing of from certain policies that they’ve recevied feedback are wrong. I wouldn’t have seen Little as seeing those as radical policies, so without some back up, I’ll take it as phil’s interpretation.
It’s funny really, because Little is more likely to take Labour left, and the left calling him a right mover just playes into the right wing spinners’ agenda.
double are quotes which phil used, singles can be used imo to imply irony, sarcasm, disbelief – the exclamation mark implied to me extreme – irony, sarcasm or disbelief.
yep me too – but double around the initial quote commented on.
For me if I write, Little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical ideas’ etc then I’m saying the ideas are not so radical in my opinion although Little may have thought or even believe they are. What phil means he can explain if he wants but that’s how I read it. Whether he actually promised radical ideas or not is a fair point that Stephanie has raised and tttt {(to tell the truth) just made that up 🙂 } I don’t know if he did or not…
The specific usage of ” vs ‘ isn’t set in stone (hell I have an English degree and I don’t know the “rules” around them).
I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”. I don’t know why it’s there if pu isn’t trying to imply that Little did indeed say capital gains etc were “radical” ideas.
yep. I got called out on the use of double quotes a while back for something sarcastic I said about something Key had said and someone had a go at me because they thought I was literally making up quoting Key when I thought it was obvious I was taking the piss. I agree there are no set rules, which is why I talked about my impressions of phil’s comment. At this point, in all good conscience I can’t keep talking seriously about punctuation in this context (-;
” is often speech” ‘writing’
But since the advent of “bald neutralising” ” ” have often been used to highlight disagreement with the quoted idea – a bit like sic.
Also the POA publicity machine recently stated that it was essential to have the extended wharf other wise the new cruise ship ‘Quantum of the Seas’ would not be able to berth and New Zealand would miss out on lots of $$$$$$$ ‘cos the company would cancel the visit. ???????
What they didn’t say is that this new vessel whilst a little bigger in displacement is actually similar in size to the ‘Queen Mary II’ which has been here recently with no problems about berthing. She is just two metres shorter than the Quantum but draws 10.1m against the
Quantum’s 8.8m. The other difference is that QMII is rated at 30Knots against the Q’s 22.
TRP you are delusional if you think little has any traction with public as the polls high light labour is now seen as perennial losers globally ( UK Au Nz) No longer is any one buying core labour values beyond those areas trapped on govt handouts ( Scotland Qld etc) , the world has moved on, labours time ( 70 years ago ) has come and gone. All we are seeing now is a slow death, A left shift will simply accelerate the inevitable
we can’t all be landlords and bosses, really we still need a few people to work and get the various jobs that need doing done. You know, like Nurses, teachers, cleaners, admin staff, peeps working in Fonterra factories and the likes. If labour is dead as you say, who will look out for the workers? Surely not National? They have, over the last 7 years and previously under Shipley, shown that they do not believe workers worthy of consideration and might even consider the New Zealand Worker (resident and citizens) to be utterly replaceable by cheap, imported slave type labour from Asia and elsewhere?
What do you tell your children then, if you have any? Move overseas, cause here in NZ you are not going to have a chance to survive?
There needs to be a balance between (to parapharase Bush II) The Haves and The Have Nots or else we are going back to the dark ages where the workers were effectively owned by the Lord of the Manor.
Is that the future that you hope for Red Delusion?
Really what about a 40 hour week, overtime pay, accident compensation, retirement benefits, unemployment benefits, equal education opportunities, public health care and the likes do you not like and think we can do away with?
I’m looking forward to following the nature of work enquiry/report, as it will inform greatly as to how the country should proceed in the upcoming years.
I also look forward to the 40 hour week reducing to 35 or 30 hours for similar pay – this should be a major push from Labour to improve work-life balance (imagine a 4 day week for the same length shifts and same pay!) and also decrease unemployment as mechanisation increases.
hi sabine. i think both you and red delusion can be correct.
i was bought up in a staunch labour household, (my grandfather was an organizer all his life) and constantly told that labour were the party for the working person.
i dont think that relevance is true today.
the radical shift in the 80s to the neo liberal agenda was the final nail in the ciffin for me.
having labour move away from the workers doesnt mean we have to go without 40hour week, overtime etc
i do think the workers you listed do need representing but i feel we dont identify as strongly with our occupations as we used to do.
pollys are there to get elected or re-elected. so we will not be getting a visionary or a radical shake-up from the labour party.
you can argue that proposing raising the retirement age is an anti worker move.
also you can argue that it is a long overdue fiscally responsible move.
as to who is to represent these workers, politically, good question.
probably the mana crew, as i see the greens looking to move right and be seen as respectable enough not to scare the horses.
🙂 – I’d be calling him a lot worse, but then if we delved into it too much, we’d have to start having an in depth discussion on power relations (where Bridges is actually a 40 watt banana masquerading as something quite a few people think is worthwhile), and I’d be living in utter, absolute fear of being ‘sanctioned’.
Inplementing compulsory voting (which I am against) would be a gutsy, definitive, concrete policy statement. Not just talking about considering a policy of talking about policy. So unlikely to come out of Labour.
FYI – here is the EVIDENCE which proves the improvement in ‘transparency’ at Auckland Council, for which. in my opinion, I can claim some credit as a result of my uncompromising ‘one person rates revolt’?
Auckland Council has launched a section on its website providing information on a variety of council activities as part of a commitment to more openness and transparency.
The proactive publication of information on the More about the council webpage, which can be found via the Auckland Council Media centre helps to provide Aucklanders with better, timelier and more accurate information about how council works.
The first release of information includes Auckland Council Group staff numbers, information about annual average rates increases, debt, efficiency savings and progress updates on the NewCore project.
It also includes contracts awarded by the council with a value of $100,000 and greater from 1 July 2014 to 31 March 2015 and spends with suppliers with a value of $100,000 and more from 1 October 2014 to 31 March 2015.
All of the information in the section will be updated regularly to ensure it remains relevant and current.
Auckland Council CEO Stephen Town says the proactive publication of information aims to strengthen Aucklanders’ trust in the council.
“Central government and other local authorities already have similar initiatives, meaning Auckland Council will now be aligned with best practice across the public sector in New Zealand in making information more accessible to the public,” he says.
“In the future we will also be providing more details about how we work and what we do, including information about employee costs, travel expenses, key statistics about council activities and other useful information as and when it becomes available.”
In addition to the proactive publication of information, the council also today began publishing on its website Local Government Official Information and Meeting Act (LGOIMA) responses where the council deems the information to be in the interests of the wider public.
More about the council and LGOIMA responses are available to view now.
______________________________________________________________________________________
We will regularly publish details of awarded contracts and spend with suppliers.
These reports are for Auckland Council (excluding CCOs) and will be updated twice a year, in April and October.
Awarded contracts report
For contracts valued at $100,000 and greater awarded by the council during the period stated (including provisional spending commitments in some instances), this report lists:
a description of the goods and/or services being supplied
the general type of goods and/or services being supplied
the name of the successful supplier
the start date and end date of the contract.
Awarded Contracts Report (PDF 313KB)
Supplier spend report
This report lists the total spend per supplier (across all contracts and purchase orders) for the period stated, where the total is greater than $100,000.
Supplier spend report (PDF 265KB)
All procurement activity at Auckland Council, including tendering and awarding contracts, is subject to the Auckland Council Procurement Policy.
For reasons related to commercial sensitivity and privacy, we do not publish the details of sole traders (ie. individuals who are not contracting through a company).
Detailed information about spend and contracts may be commercially confidential.
We believe that the information we provide in the reports is accurate at the time of publication (subject to the report disclaimers). The information is subject to change if projects, priorities and timeframes are varied for awarded contracts or if financial reconciliations or adjustments are made in respect of prior payments.
And remember, Tim Barnett is the general secretary – he is neither Leader nor President – and has just ordinary member’ s voting rights on policy stuff.
It was part of Labour’s submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee.
From the Herald article:
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party, which did not set policy, and wanted the committee to investigate the idea – not necessarily recommend it.
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.
“There is widespread concern, not just Labour, with non-enrolment … there is pretty compelling evidence that there is a continuing pattern of people not enrolling.”
“And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Yeah but Australia is also the country currently introducing fascist policy that means citizens lose social security entitlements if they don’t vaccinate their children. Just to make that really clear, they’re targeting beneficiaries as a class of people. So probably not the best country to use as a comparison at this time.
Gotta say the similarity to the vaccination idea is interesting too. The irresponsibility of those parents is astonishing, of course, so I suppose something has to be done. I suspect that beneficiaries are targeted in the enrolment suggestion because they make up a large number of the non- enrolled. If I get a chance later I’ll do some digging or maybe someone else can do some research on what and why Labour are proposing it. For me, footy calls. Ciao.
If this was about irresponsible parenting, the Australian government would make vaccination mandatory across the board. You don’t vaccinate your kids then you get fined and eventually go to prison. But it’s not about that at all, it’s about buying into narratives that beneficiaries are bad parents and punishing them accordingly.
There is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids. If governments want to improve vaccination numbers they can introduce better health policy so that the people who aren’t vaccinating but probably would given the chance can access better health care. But hey, why bother addressing education and poverty issues when you can just bene bash.
So the theory of herd immunity is wrong then? Herd immunity does not work? Do say more, Mr Scientific one. How about the medical ethics framework of patient consent before any treatment? Is that wrong too?
Oh fuck off with your distractions Draco the Scientific and answer the questions.
Does herd immunity require that 100% of persons be immunised for it to work.
Secondly. Do you believe that medical treatment must ethically obtain fully informed patient consent wherever possible, or do you believe that patient consent is a violable nice to have.
Several decades following the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate rose, largely because the vaccine made adults, expectant mothers and infants more vulnerable
Early in the last century, measles killed millions of people a year. Then, bit by bit in countries of the developed world, the death rate dropped, by the 1960s by 98% or more. In the U.K., it dropped by an astounding 99.96%. And then, the measles vaccine entered the market
After the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate continued to drop into the 1970s. Many scientists credit the continued decline entirely to the vaccine. Other scientists believe the vaccine played a minor role, if that, noting that most infectious diseases similarly petered out during the 20th century, including some, like scarlet fever, for which vaccines were never developed.
The credit for the century-long decline, scientists generally agree, goes to improved nutrition and improved health care, side effects of the West’s growing affluence. In the U.S., the death rate dropped by about 98%, from about 10 per 100,000 population a century ago to one fifth of one person by 1963, the year measles vaccines made their American debut. Both before and after vaccination started, victims tended to be poor
‘If you really want to know just how ignorant Lawrence Solomon is about vaccines, all you have to do is to take a look at this:
The CDC credits the vaccine with the elimination of measles deaths, but measles deaths ended a decade before the vaccine was in widespread use across the U.S., and deaths had all but ended prior to the first child receiving a shot. While the vaccine can perhaps take modest credit for accelerating the decline in the mid-1960s, it is a stretch to claim that eradication would not have occurred without the vaccine, particularly since the 20th century also saw the die-off of diseases like scarlet fever, for which no vaccine was ever developed.
This is an incredibly intellectually dishonest antivaccine talking point, so intellectually dishonest that it shocks me that anyone with half a brain can seriously argue it. Let’s just put it this way: Anyone who pulls out this tired old dishonest trope is so intellectually bankrupt that I don’t really feel obligated to do anything other than link to a post I did a long time ago about this trope, which I derogatorily labeled the “vaccines didn’t save us” lie.
It’s amazing that in 2014 the same old long discredited antivaccine tropes have found a new mouthpiece, but they have. And that mouthpiece is Lawrence Solomon. It’s not “conservative skepticism” that is falling short. It’s Lawrence Solomon. Sadly, it’s not surprising.’
The move to an artificially created vaccine for whooping cough is behind an increase in cases of the deadly disease in the US, a new study suggests.
The findings highlight the need to do similar research in Australia where whooping cough cases have spiralled upward in the past decade, co-author Associate Professor Manoj Gambhir, from the University of Monash, says.
“These results demonstrate that the resurgence in pertussis in the U.S. can be explained by past changes in vaccination policy. However, the authors’ findings also suggest that the efficacy of the currently-used acellular vaccine, while lower than that of the whole-cell vaccine, is not much lower (around 80% protection for the first three doses of acellular vaccine versus 90% for whole-cell), and booster doses may be sufficient to curtail epidemics while novel vaccine research continues.”
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make.
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make
I believe people who accept the use of terms such as ‘doses’ and ‘booster shots’ when attempting to explain or accepting the manufactured explanation of ‘herd immunity’ are void of logical reasoning
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
Q. Do you realise you just illustrated my belief – ‘void of logical reasoning’?
Further illogical reasoning from an alleged medical ‘professional’
That you don’t / won’t /can’t recall previous conversations which you and I have been involved in where I stated openly and succinctly my position causes me greater concern for any patients you have may have treated
I have called you out on your ‘bed side manner’ previously and you have shown it once again with an irrational abusive comment
Forgetful illogical abusive and egocentric are not desirable traits of those in the medical profession
To refresh your memory – I am anti compulsion and pro informed consent
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
That you believe I am a trolll serves only to enforce my understanding of your state of mind
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
You should proof read before you post comments not that it would assist with the glaring contradictions you repeatedly make
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
A. yes I can… this site also has a very good search engine.
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
No because there are some who can read and comprehend english and accept the position I have stated previously including again to you today
What should leave no doubt is your lack of acknowledgement / appreciation of side effects adverse reactions and deaths caused by the ‘drug industry’ of which vaccination is a component sponsored by the the FDA / CDC
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
Stop projecting and start using the search engine you referred to
See if the search engine can tell you how many people in the USA alone die each year due to the ‘medical industry’ approved drugs in particular that are ‘approved’ by the FDA
Q. FDA approved drugs kill / injure [ ] people per year in the USA ?
Q. How many of your patients do you inform such easily identified statistics of before you prescribe /administer chemicals to them ?
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Summary:
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
Not only do you not understand ‘herd immunity’ which as an alleged medical professional is shameful but you do not even understand the even simpler definition of ‘trolll’
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
You either can’t read or you don’t comprehend the position I take has been stated very clearly to you on multiple occasions
Indications are you’re experiencing some sort of mental incapacity which is what I referred to earlier
Either way I hope you are no longer practicing and if you are I would suggest someone lodge a complaint to have your license removed for the public good
You should be struck off with the exhibition you put in through your comments
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Yet you chose not to link to it then use a weak attempt at transference about getting me frothing – Oh dear
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
WOW……You are disqualified as if you weren’t already
No I haven’t Draco. I’ve had conversations with pro-vaxxers on this site where I’ve made the argument that the govt should be putting effort into reaching people who would otherwise vaccinate but don’t due to poverty, inability to access, lack of awareness etc, instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes. And that argument has been supported. In fact the NZ govt has processes in place that allow people to opt out. That’s because the very small numbers (maybe 3% at a guess) who consciously choose to not vaccinate via an education process don’t matter.
But I don’t really want to go another round on this. The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes.
There’s no such thing as choosing not to vaccinate from informed consent. If you’re properly informed you choose to vaccinate. It really is that simple. Choosing not to vaccinate from ‘informed consent’ ends up with shit like this happening:
And it’s not as if Williams is unfamiliar with science. He has a science degree and he’s turning his invention, the WilliamsWarne homebrew machine, into a global success.
He’s not stupid. If anything, he was just a little bit too smart for his own good.
The Williams are the one in 10 parents who opt out when it comes to vaccination, not out of ignorance, but because they think they know everything. Williams said they believed they’d done their research but now admits they were out of their depth.
“Parents like us make the decision to not vaccinate on very little factual information about the actual consequences of the diseases.”
But it just didn’t stop me getting childhood illnesses.
My two vaccinated children, on the other hand, have rarely been ill, have had antibiotics maybe twice in their lives, if that (not like me who got so many illnesses which needed treatment with antibiotics that I developed a resistance to them, which led me to be hospitalized with penicillin-resistant quinsy at 21–you know that old fashioned disease that killed Queen Elizabeth I and which was almost wiped out through use of antibiotics).
The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
These points are actually why I’m for compulsory vaccination. It bypasses the ignorance that some people confuse for being informed, protects those that can’t be immunised and prevents political parties from attacking minority groups for political point scoring.
“Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.”
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory. And like I said, my point was about what it means to target groups of people by class. I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory.
What abstract theory are you talking about?
I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop. At which point I think I’ll just point you to this comment from OAB.
I’m not quite sure why an avowed anti-Big Pharma activist is citing Dr. Manoj Gambhir, given his close ties to the medical establishment and career-long support for vaccination programs. Under any other circumstances they’d be howling about his (wholly imagined) corruption and bias.
@ OAB The murphy troll continues to demonstrate his stupidity for all to see.
He is very unlike Weka who wishes to engage in a reasonable manner.
on the matter of pertussis vaccine it has always been one of the more problematic bacteria to get a strong and long lasting immune response to it with vaccines which is why researchers continue to try and look for improvements. It’s a hideous illness to contract in the very young and even in teens/adults can hang about for a long time.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
I agree that compulsion has negative overtones that will get some peoples backs up. Better education can certainly help but, as the anti-vaxxers have shown, even that will be taken badly by some people.
nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
Then you need to be clear about that reference to The Murphy and others.
to be clear, it was a response to TM’s citation of the Gambhir study.
Thing is, what you said came across as an Ad Hominem against Gambhir while the study itself and its findings seemed quite reasonable.
@DtB I see what you mean – I’d hoped to avoid that by putting ‘wholly imagined’ in parentheses, and the links to ‘Big Pharma’ are only defamatory if you buy into that narrative.
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
Don’t use carrots/sticks that rely on class, e.g. benefits.
Heck, carrots/sticks are a bad way to go anyway – personally I’d ban the advertising of prescription meds, and take a damned close look at the boundary between “alternative” therapies and “practising medicine without a license”, and make “doctor” a restricted title, alongside public nuisance/recklessness charges against purveyors of some of the more dishonest anti-vax propaganda.
IMO the problem isn’t the number of nutters, it’s the avenues they have for publicity and claiming equivalence with legitimate researchers.
If you look at Andrew Little’s twitter you will see this is not Labour Party policy and not something he supports. The submission is from Tim Barnett and I don’t know how it went through. If this is Tim’s idea then he is in the wrong job IMO. This is an appalling idea and reeks of beneficiary bashing.
Fine to have enrolment forms to give out at government offices, but starving people into submission is not acceptable. If you want the poor to vote then maybe you should make sure your policies address their needs.
I hope Mr Barnett will face consequences for publicly putting his foot in his party’s mouth. Need way better message discipline than that. NZ does not need another party suggesting right-wing policies. He’s welcome to resign and join another which does, if it’s important to him.
so how come this brainfart ended up in the herald, again making the labour party look like the party of brainfarts?
really,
can someone speak to the guys in the party that have any say and make it clear to them that brainfarts are not helpful, and should only be uttered in the confines of ones most private room?
If I could distill the Labour Party’s woes over the last six years into just two words, I’d probably choose ‘bewildering stupidity’. The causes are manifold and complex, but the symptom is that Labour and its leaders often do bewildering, obviously stupid things despite the fact the things they are doing are obviously stupid. Think about David Shearer holding up dead fish in Parliament as his poll ratings flat-lined, or Goff dying his hair orange the day before making a major speech, or Cunliffe railing against secret trusts while financing his leadership campaign through secret trusts . . . The list is very, very long.
Sure, this isn’t as egregious as National’s Sky City deal, or sending our troops to Iraq so we can stay ‘part of the club’. But Key, Joyce et al have reasons for the questionable stuff they do. They have agendas. It’s deliberate; calculated. They have reasons! Labour just does random bewilderingly stupid shit for no comprehensible reason. All the time. People write columns about how Labour should ‘move to the center’, or the left or whatever, but addressing the bewildering stupidity issue should be their primary goal.
I just saw that. WTF are they thinking. Demanding that people behave in certain ways because they receive some state support paves the way for more right wing “do as I say” tactics.
Receiving some form of state support doesn’t give governments the right to run anyone’s life and feeds the meme that state support identifies reckless, lazy, uncaring people who need to be told what to do. Where is the evidence that supports this ? Why don’t they target the asset rich tax dodger who is also living off their fellow taxpayer and is selfish uncaring etc etc.
Oh and this is likely to alienate women
Can’t they spell stupid
It’s not ‘tactics’. It’s the law. Enrolment is compulsory in NZ and it makes sense for the government to try and enforce that law at a point at which they interact with the wilfully non enrolled. Enrolling is easy. Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Having said that, there is clearly going to be a minority who don’t want to enrol for compelling reasons. Visa overstayers, for example.
It may be the law but when people are so disenchanted and disinterested (or dodging debt collectors or abusive spouses) that they don’t bother compulsion is only going to increase resentment. Leave the enforcement to someone else.
Maybe I should have said “leave promoting this option to another party”.
And yes it may be the law but at this point, this is policing only one sub group that doesn’t enrol ? Are they even the biggest sub group? Do we know? Why target only this one? What happens if people enrol and don’t keep it up to date? What about people who are dropped off unbeknown to them?
Why not go around the schools and demand that all 17 year olds or university students enrol before they can receive tuition. Or you have to be enrolled to get a drivers licence, WOF, CAR rego, passport, house insurance or if you have an IRD number you have to be enrolled if eligible ? Have a bank account?
All good points. I suspect that this is indeed a target group that figures highly in the non enrolled numbers. Haven’t got time now, but if I get a chance, I’ll see if I can find the full submission and work out what is intended. Might be worth a post.
I imagine this idea has been mooted out of frustration with potential Labour voters who just don’t bother to get on the roll let alone actually vote. However I don’t think its the right way to go about it. Providing an incentive to enroll is a much better idea but how do you do that? You can’t offer money because all the people who have voluntarily enrolled (the bulk of the population) would be up in arms and rightly so.
Some may say the incentive would be in good policies but that ignores the fact that Labour and the Greens have consistently produced policies that would have assisted the poor, the unemployed and those who, for one reason or another, have been left feeling disenfranchised. But the potential recipients don’t even bother to acquaint themselves of such policies.
I guess the answer is acquiring money, money and more money so you can “sell” them to a resistant public. Oh dear…
This is a prevalent kind of comfy authoritarian middle class led Labour thinking, piling requirements on to beneficiaries and the under class so that they will maybe vote for you. And if you don’t comply you get your already miserable benefit taken off you or docked. It’s fucking absurd. But this is what the Labour Party has come to.
Yep. And irrespective of the value of investigating such a policy, the timing is beyond belief. Labour need to be rebuilding trust with voters, and this just undermines that.
“Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.”
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous. I’m sure we’ve had this conversation before, and your comment seems either largely ignorant of the realities of some of the most vulnerable people in NZ, or you think the impact on them is worth the gains of the policy. Both are politically unproductive as well as being punitive.
I forgot another sub group above. Why not make people enrol when they go for some form of medical treatment. That costs the state plenty and nothing onerous about signing a form while you wait and wait.
and why shouldn’t it? Why just target those on a particular sub group of
state support. And while they are there we could target vaccination measures, contraception for any kids they have that are 16 and over. and all the other welfare indignities. if it’s good enough for one group then it’s good enough for all.
You could do that, tax all income at %100 if you aren’t enrolled to vote. Makes more sense than the take away the benefit option. At least it is somewhat equitable and not just a stick to hit the vunerable with…
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous.
You can’t see your WINZ case officer until you make an appointment. (It’s a security precaution). What do you mean you don’t have money to get the phone or internet connected to make an appointment? See your WINZ case officer to sort that out. You’ll need to make an appointment.
The comfy middle class don’t have a fucking clue on how the other half of NZ live, is the issue.
Ok, so you have an appointment. But I don’t have a car and there’s not cheap public transport and the appointment is during the day when my mate with their car is at work.
Why did you miss your appointment? My kid was sick. Why didn’t you phone? I have no credit on my phone until next pay day.
etc, etc, etc ad nauseum
The list of barriers to what trp said is huge. His ignorance or lack of care on this matter is actually pretty gobsmacking for a leftie.
And once you’ve missed a couple of appointments even for reasons out of your control you get classed as a waste of time and its pretty much all over from there.
Or I have three kids under 5, no child support because father has done a runner , live 5 miles from the nearest library (or maybe in the wilds of the provinces 50 miles) don’t have a mate with a car and there is no public transport.
It’s actually a requirement that beneficiaries have a phone nowadays. This despite the fact that many beneficiaries can’t actually afford a phone. Even topping up a prepay by the minimum of $20 can be daunting.
nope the state benefits should not depend on wether someone has the money to call for an appointment, then find the way to a Winz office (no car could be an issue, busses? cost a lot of money that no benefit caters for, somone to look after the kids – ah just fuck it).
Oh so maybe they could go to a Library and use the computer there? And down load the paperwork to fill out and stuff….? See above, no car, no transport etc etc etc etc etc etc etc
Benefits should be given to people in Need. The only factor that should count in the giving out of benefits to people should be NEED! not an enrollment to the electoral votes.
The people that I know that did not vote the last time, where White, Male, Working, MIddle Class and they could not be fucked!
The ones that I know voted, included the mother on a 0 hour contract and winz benefits. The elderly lady that paid herself a taxi to get to vote, the rumanian migrants and so on and so on.
Again the ones that did not vote, white, working, male, middleclass and a can’t be arsed or fucked attitude. Go figure.
Once again – I just have to let you all know that probably what Tim Barnett was saying is NOT Labour Party policy, nor do I ever think it will be Labour Party policy, and they would not be stating its Labour Party policy.
Whoever it was putting up that submission was merely making a suggestion to the select committee.
I think the basic point is this: a comment from the general secretary :
“” <> “”
and it is not at all clear from that Herald story as to who in the Labour Party might have made such a submission – but it is quite clear that Tim Barnett is saying this is NOT a current LP policy, but its something other countries are doing and is this something NZ should look at. A question. Not a recommendation.
Its bad enough when the MSM twists things that Labour people say – its blinkin’ lousy when supposedly leftwing posters on The Standard do it too.
i wd submit that a component of a labour party ‘ submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee’…
..is not a matter of no significance…
(or are you saying it is..?..)
and how exactly is the reporting of this fact of this submission..’twisting things”..?
..this is what the submission – by the labour party (authored by whoever..?..won’t the proud parent stand up..?..)- to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee..said..
..and the comparison with australia – used by barnett – is putting the cart before the horse/comparing apples and oranges.. – as aust has compulsory-voting..we don’t..
..and jenny – if national were proposing something like this – would you not be protesting that..?..in this forum..?
Oops – dunno what happened to it, but my post above didn’t include the Barnett quote – about it being just a question to the committee, a request to investigate it – and that it is NOT Labour policy.
This is what he said. (And incidentally, I don’t agree with him on this matter, and I bet heaps of other Labour people don’t either !)
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Why would we want to follow the policies of a country that elected someone who might be related to a 20th century family called Abbottini, neighbours of Mussolini?
you test waters to see what the reaction is going to be like and then adjust your plans accordingly – and to ensure there is no further misunderstanding from you – I do not like the idea or the ideology behind it – I hope that is sufficient for an understanding, of what i am saying, from you.
Its not a brain-fart PU – from any official Labour Party policy or statement.
It was just one person’s comment.
Can you please get that into your head. refer to my post at 12.2
I miss the good old days when Labour said good/constructive things would happen that would benefit people’s lives, and then shortly afterwards, they did. When did it get so muddled and complicated? Is there any way we could go back to that kind of politics?
Yeah yeah I know, things have “changed” and only “dinosaurs” want clear policy statements or action anymore. Hooray for TXTSPK and rumours… mumble mumble…
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.
Getting the vote out is a priority for Labour and in its submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee, written by Labour’s general secretary Tim Barnett, the party argues for the idea to be considered.”
maybe such confusion would not be coming up if the supposed leftwing party of New Zealand would finally come up with something that would exite people.
You know….like building houses for young people so they can get married and have kids. ( i know of a few couples that would love to rent a nice place to start their lifes together, alas they are not making enough to cover $ 2200 per month before any expenses or food).
You know…. like promoting long tenancies in private rentals so that families with kids could send their kids to THE ONE SCHOOL for like two years in a row, instead of having to pack up and move about ever friggin 6 month.
You know…..like upping the benefits for unemployed, single parents, the young ones etc etc etc could have a phone to phone WINZ for an appointment and eat….I know its a novelty.
I only want Labour to speak about these things…not about finding a way to punish the already punished for not being on the electoral roll….
How does Labour suppose to punish those not on the roll and not on a benefit? Like National punishes Tax Evader? With even bigger loopholes?
ffs…this is why no one is bothering to Labour and some of their die hard supporters anymore, because of some fuckwit that wants to out do Paula Bennett.
It’s not banning poor people, but banning older vehicles. Sure, that will impact on poor people most under current conditions but we should be questioning if everyone should have a car anyway as doing so costs so much. Or perhaps that should be a question of if anyone should have cars.
A government with guts would make it law that all personal cars would be electric in 10/15 years. Just have to put ruc charges on them to pay for the roads.
I’m looking at heat exchange from brick paved back yards.
Wikipedia on geothermal energy is interesting. What other countries do to use this for domestic use rather than just industrial as we do is interesting. (I don’t think Maori use, which extends back centuries is being counted here.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_heating
This is the sort of thing that progressive, thoughtful, and smart countries are doing to use technology that could be thought of as green and sustainable. The cities of Reykjavík and Akureyri pipe hot water from geothermal plants under roads and pavements to melt snow. Geothermal desalination has been demonstrated.
Geothermal systems tend to benefit from economies of scale, so space heating power is often distributed to multiple buildings, sometimes whole communities.
This technique, long practiced throughout the world in locations such as Reykjavík, Iceland,[5] Boise, Idaho,[6] and Klamath Falls, Oregon[7] is known as district heating.[8] Turkey seems to be high in this use.
Background –
” Most high temperature geothermal heat is harvested in regions close to tectonic plate boundaries where volcanic activity rises close to the surface of the Earth. In these areas, ground and groundwater can be found with temperatures higher than the target temperature of the application….
even cold ground contains heat, below 6 metres (20 ft) the undisturbed ground temperature is consistently at the Mean Annual Air Temperature[3] and it may be extracted with a heat pump.”…
“Direct geothermal heating is far more efficient than geothermal electricity generation and has less demanding temperature requirements, so it is viable over a large geographical range.
If the shallow ground is hot but dry, air or water may be circulated through earth tubes or downhole heat exchangers which act as heat exchangers with the ground.”
Looking at an old BBC History magazine I saw they were recalling an earlier September attack on New York than 2001. This was in 1920 when ‘a cart packed with explosives was detonated’ outside the headquarters of JP Morgan. The perpetrators,causing 38 deaths, were never confirmed but may have been followers of the Italian anarchist Luigi Galleani.’
The site 23 Wall Street still bears the shrapnel scars of 90 years ago.
International “free trade pacts” (NAFTA, TPP, TAFTA) are supposed to increase global GDP, thereby making us all richer and effectively expanding the size of the earth and easing conflict. But growth in the full world has become uneconomic–increasing costs faster than benefits. It now makes us poorer, not richer. These secretly negotiated agreements among the elites are designed to benefit private global corporations, often at the expense of the public good of nations. Some think that strengthening global corporations by erasing national boundaries will reduce the likelihood of war. More likely we will just shift to feudal corporate wars in a post-national global commons, with corporate fiefdoms effectively buying national governments and their armies, supplemented by already existing private mercenaries.
In fact, that latter bit is inevitable. There’s no real difference between and the feudal society that preceded it. both are about putting a few people above everyone else in wealth and power and having everyone else pay for it.
Is Labour, or rather the hierarchy (cf. membership), trying immensely hard at working, full steam ahead and on the offensive, on connecting with ‘voters’ ?
Whatever was said in that select committee meting, tinfoilhat and Kiwiri – that is NOT Labour policy, nor has anyone raised it as a possible Labour policy.
IN 1984 we were taken unawares and they hid the economic agenda behind the antinuclear credentials. If they do the same again what are they going to fob us off with to try to pretend to be a Labour party.
It’s good of you to run with The Herald‘s framing of the issue. When they say “proposed”, what exactly did Labour say?
There are advantages and potential disadvantages to the approach, but it is utilised in other countries and we submit that it is incumbent on us to examine all options to see if they are feasible in our context.
That’s the way: it’s important to confine all ideas to the ones you approve of, and a good way to do that is to pretend discussion of outliers is exactly the same as supporting them.
Nice one.
As for the merits of the proposal. I think that before penalising non-enrolled voters, we should penalise anyone who adopts a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.
+1 PU.
I can’t imagine how this appalling idea got to the submission stage. It may not be current policy, or even likely to become policy, but the idea that someone in a senior position in the Labour Party should even consider it is a good idea is beyond me. Very, very damaging.
No evidence Barnett sought coverage. Media will have been covering the committee, and the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.
Not that I agree with the proposal to look at the idea (or maybe I do – seems logical to look at things that may provide the desired outcome) but it’s not in the realms of beneficiary bashing is it?
I thought working for families was an employment-related payment?
It’s worth taking a look at the comments on this crazy website National have set up to somehow try and get populous buy-in of this change the flag diversion.
Roughly 3/5 comments disagree with the proposed change altogether. This could turn into another Northland type misfire for Key and another nail in his coffin.
Something I hadn’t considered is raised by this comment:
“…the government tell us the cost to change the flag is $26,000,000 for referendum but the cost to change every flag in every school, building, businesses, NZ Army uniforms, vehicles, NZ Police, NZ Navy the list would be endless – it’s a joke. $26 million is only the start”
The archdruid has been very provocative over his last few posts I have thought but the logic is inescapable and like all great writers with ideas he presents them with a style and content that I find complete and beautiful.
Energy needed to extract energy, again, can’t be used for any other purpose. It doesn’t contribute to the energy surplus that makes economic development possible. As the energy industry itself takes a bigger bite out of each year’s energy production, every other economic activity loses part of the fuel that makes it run. That, in turn, is the core reason why the American economy is on the ropes, America’s infrastructure is falling to bits—and Americans in Detroit and Baltimore are facing a transition to Third World conditions, without electricity or running water.
I suspect, for what it’s worth, that the shutoff notices being mailed to tens of thousands of poor families in those two cities are a good working model for the way that industrial civilization itself will wind down. It won’t be sudden; for decades to come, there will still be people who have access to what Americans today consider the ordinary necessities and comforts of everyday life; there will just be fewer of them each year. Outside that narrowing circle, the number of economic nonpersons will grow steadily, one shutoff notice at a time.
Completed reads for April: The Difference Engine, by William Gibson and Bruce Sterling Carnival of Saints, by George Herman The Snow Spider, by Jenny Nimmo Emlyn’s Moon, by Jenny Nimmo The Chestnut Soldier, by Jenny Nimmo Death Comes As the End, by Agatha Christie Lord of the Flies, by ...
On February 14, 2023 we announced our Rebuttal Update Project. This included an ask for feedback about the added "At a glance" section in the updated basic rebuttal versions. This weekly blog post series highlights this new section of one of the updated basic rebuttal versions and serves as a ...
Have a story to share about St Paul’s, but today just picturesPopular novels written at this desk by a young man who managed to bootstrap himself out of father’s imprisonment and his own young life in a workhouse Read more ...
The list of former National Party Ministers being given plum and important roles got longer this week with the appointment of former Deputy Prime Minister Paula Bennett as the chair of Pharmac. The Christopher Luxon-led Government has now made key appointments to Bill English, Simon Bridges, Steven Joyce, Roger Sowry, ...
Newsroom has a story today about National's (fortunately failed) effort to disestablish the newly-created Inspector-General of Defence. The creation of this agency was the key recommendation of the Inquiry into Operation Burnham, and a vital means of restoring credibility and social licence to an agency which had been caught lying ...
Holding On To The Present:The moment a political movement arises that attacks the whole idea of social progress, and announces its intention to wind back the hands of History’s clock, then democracy, along with its unwritten rules, is in mortal danger.IT’S A COMMONPLACE of political speeches, especially those delivered in ...
Stuck In The Middle With You:As Christopher Luxon feels the hot breath of Act’s and NZ First’s extremists on the back of his neck and, as he reckons with the damage their policies are already inflicting upon a country he’s described as “fragile”, is there not some merit in reaching out ...
The unpopular coalition government is currently rushing to repeal section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act. The clause is Oranga Tamariki's Treaty clause, and was inserted after its systematic stealing of Māori children became a public scandal and resulted in physical resistance to further abductions. The clause created clear obligations ...
Buzz from the Beehive The government’s official website – which Point of Order monitors daily – not for the first time has nothing much to say today about political happenings that are grabbing media headlines. It makes no mention of the latest 1News-Verian poll, for example. This shows National down ...
It Takes A Train To Cry:Surely, there is nothing lonelier in all this world than the long wail of a distant steam locomotive on a cold Winter’s night.AS A CHILD, I would lie awake in my grandfather’s house and listen to the traffic. The big wooden house was only a ...
Packing A Punch: The election of the present government, including in its ranks politicians dedicated to reasserting the rights of the legislature in shaping and determining the future of Māori and Pakeha in New Zealand, should have alerted the judiciary – including its anomalous appendage, the Waitangi Tribunal – that its ...
Dead Woman Walking: New Zealand’s media industry had been moving steadily towards disaster for all the years Melissa Lee had been National’s media and communications policy spokesperson, and yet, when the crisis finally broke, on her watch, she had nothing intelligent to offer. Christopher Luxon is a patient man - but he’s not ...
Chris Trotter writes – New Zealand politics is remarkably easy-going: dangerously so, one might even say. With the notable exception of John Key’s flat ruling-out of the NZ First Party in 2008, all parties capable of clearing MMP’s five-percent threshold, or winning one or more electorate seats, tend ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is ...
Luxon will no doubt put a brave face on it, but there is no escaping the pressure this latest poll will put on him and the government. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political ...
This is a re-post from The Climate Brink by Andrew Dessler In the wake of any unusual weather event, someone inevitably asks, “Did climate change cause this?” In the most literal sense, that answer is almost always no. Climate change is never the sole cause of hurricanes, heat waves, droughts, or ...
Something odd happened yesterday, and I’d love to know if there’s more to it. If there was something which preempted what happened, or if it was simply a throwaway line in response to a journalist.Yesterday David Seymour was asked at a press conference what the process would be if the ...
Hi,From time to time, I want to bring Webworm into the real world. We did it last year with the Jurassic Park event in New Zealand — which was a lot of fun!And so on Saturday May 11th, in Los Angeles, I am hosting a lil’ Webworm pop-up! I’ve been ...
Education Minister Erica Standford yesterday unveiled a fundamental reform of the way our school pupils are taught. She would not exactly say so, but she is all but dismantling the so-called “inquiry” “feel good” method of teaching, which has ruled in our classrooms since a major review of the New ...
Exactly where are we seriously going with this government and its policies? That is, apart from following what may as well be a Truss-Lite approach on the purported economic “plan“, and Victorian-era regression when it comes to social policy.Oh it’ll work this time of course, we’re basically assured, “the ...
Hey Uncle Dave, When the Poms joined the EEC, I wasn't one of those defeatists who said, Well, that’s it for the dairy job. And I was right, eh? The Chinese can’t get enough of our milk powder and eventually, the Poms came to their senses and backed up the ute ...
Polling shows that Wellington Mayor Tory Whanau has the lowest approval rating of any mayor in the country. Siting at -12 per cent, the proportion of constituents who disapprove of her performance outweighs those who give her the thumbs up. This negative rating is higher than for any other mayor ...
Buzz from the Beehive Pharmac has been given a financial transfusion and a new chair to oversee its spending in the pharmaceutical business. Associate Health Minister David Seymour described the funding for Pharmac as “its largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff”. ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Many criticisms are being made of the Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill, including by this writer. But as with everything in politics, every story has two sides, and both deserve attention. It’s important to understand what the Government is trying to achieve and its ...
TL;DR: Here’s my top 10 ‘pick ‘n’ mix of links to news, analysis and opinion articles as of 10:10am on Monday, April 29:Scoop: The children's ward at Rotorua Hospital will be missing a third of its beds as winter hits because Te Whatu Ora halted an upgrade partway through to ...
span class=”dropcap”>As hideous as David Seymour can be, it is worth keeping in mind occasionally that there are even worse political figures (and regimes) out there. Iran for instance, is about to execute the country’s leading hip hop musician Toomaj Salehi, for writing and performing raps that “corrupt” the nation’s ...
Yesterday marked 10 years since the first electric train carried passengers in Auckland so it’s a good time to look back at it and the impact it has had. A brief history The first proposals for rail electrification in Auckland came in the 1920’s alongside the plans for earlier ...
Right now, in Aotearoa-NZ, our ‘animal spirits’ are darkening towards a winter of discontent, thanks at least partly to a chorus of negative comments and actions from the Government Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on ...
You make people evil to punish the paststuck inside a sequel with a rotating castThe following photos haven’t been generated with AI, or modified in any way. They are flesh and blood, human beings. On the left is Galatea Young, a young mum, and her daughter Fiadh who has Angelman ...
April has been a quiet month at A Phuulish Fellow. I have had an exceptionally good reading month, and a decently productive writing month – for original fiction, anyway – but not much has caught my eye that suggested a blog article. It has been vaguely frustrating, to be honest. ...
A listing of 31 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, April 21, 2024 thru Sat, April 27, 2024. Story of the week Anthropogenic climate change may be the ultimate shaggy dog story— but with a twist, because here ...
Hi,I spent about a year on Webworm reporting on an abusive megachurch called Arise, and it made me want to stab my eyes out with a fork.I don’t regret that reporting in 2022 and 2023 — I am proud of it — but it made me angry.Over three main stories ...
The new Victoria University Vice-Chancellor decided to have a forum at the university about free speech and academic freedom as it is obviously a topical issue, and the Government is looking at legislating some carrots or sticks for universities to uphold their obligations under the Education and Training Act. They ...
Do you remember when Melania Trump got caught out using a speech that sounded awfully like one Michelle Obama had given? Uncannily so.Well it turns out that Abraham Lincoln is to Winston Peters as Michelle was to Melania. With the ANZAC speech Uncle Winston gave at Gallipoli having much in ...
She was born 25 years ago today in North Shore hospital. Her eyes were closed tightly shut, her mouth was silently moving. The whole theatre was all quiet intensity as they marked her a 2 on the APGAR test. A one-minute eternity later, she was an 8. The universe was ...
Skeptical Science is partnering with Gigafact to produce fact briefs — bite-sized fact checks of trending claims. This fact brief was written by Sue Bin Park in collaboration with members from our Skeptical Science team. You can submit claims you think need checking via the tipline. Is Antarctica gaining land ice? ...
Images of US students (and others) protesting and setting up tent cities on US university campuses have been broadcast world wide and clearly demonstrate the growing rifts in US society caused by US policy toward Israel and Israel’s prosecution of … Continue reading → ...
Barrie Saunders writes – Dear Paul As the new Minister of Media and Communications, you will be inundated with heaps of free advice and special pleading, all in the national interest of course. For what it’s worth here is my assessment: Traditional broadcasting free to air content through ...
Many criticisms are being made of the Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill, including by this writer. But as with everything in politics, every story has two sides, and both deserve attention. It’s important to understand what the Government is trying to achieve and its arguments for such a bold reform. ...
Peter Dunne writes – The great nineteenth British Prime Minister, William Gladstone, once observed that “the first essential for a Prime Minister is to be a good butcher.” When a later British Prime Minister, Harold Macmillan, sacked a third of his Cabinet in July 1962, in what became ...
Ele Ludemann writes – New Zealanders had the OECD’s second highest tax increase last year: New Zealanders faced the second-biggest tax raises in the developed world last year, the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) says. The intergovernmental agency said the average change in personal income tax ...
We all know something’s not right with our elections. The spread of misinformation, people being targeted with soundbites and emotional triggers that ignore the facts, even the truth, and influence their votes.The use of technology to produce deep fakes. How can you tell if something is real or not? Can ...
This video includes conclusions of the creator climate scientist Dr. Simon Clark. It is presented to our readers as an informed perspective. Please see video description for references (if any). This year you will be lied to! Simon Clark helps prebunk some misleading statements you'll hear about climate. The video includes ...
It is all very well cutting the backrooms of public agencies but it may compromise the frontlines. One of the frustrations of the Productivity Commission’s 2017 review of universities is that while it observed that their non-academic staff were increasing faster than their academic staff, it did not bother to ...
Buzz from the Beehive Two speeches delivered by Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters at Anzac Day ceremonies in Turkey are the only new posts on the government’s official website since the PM announced his Cabinet shake-up. In one of the speeches, Peters stated the obvious: we live in a troubled ...
1. Which of these would you not expect to read in The Waikato Invader?a. Luxon is here to do business, don’t you worry about thatb. Mr KPI expects results, and you better believe itc. This decisive man of action is getting me all hot and excitedd. Melissa Lee is how ...
…it has a restricted jurisdiction which must not be abused: it is not an inquisitionNOTE – this article was published before the High Court ruled that Karen Chhour does not have to appear before the Waitangi Tribunal Gary Judd writes – The High Court ...
Lindsay Mitchell writes – One of reasons Oranga Tamariki exists is to prevent child neglect. But could the organisation itself be guilty of the same?Oranga Tamariki’s statistics show a decrease in the number and age of children in care. “There are less children ...
David Farrar writes: Graeme Edgeler wrote in 2017: In the first five years after three strikes came into effect 5248 offenders received a ‘first strike’ (that is, a “stage-1 conviction” under the three strikes sentencing regime), and 68 offenders received a ‘second strike’. In the five years prior to ...
Bryce Edwards writes – Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has surprised everyone with his ruthlessness in sacking two of his ministers from their crucial portfolios. Removing ministers for poor performance after only five months in the job just doesn’t normally happen in politics. That’s refreshing and will be extremely ...
TL;DR: These are the six things that stood out to me in news and commentary on Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy in the two days to 6:06am on Thursday, April 25:Politics: PM Christopher Luxon has set up a dual standard for ministerial competence by demoting two National Cabinet ministers while leaving also-struggling ...
Hi,Today I mainly want to share some of your thoughts about the recent piece I wrote about success and failure, and the forces that seemingly guide our lives. But first, a quick bit of housekeeping: I am doing a Webworm popup in Los Angeles on Saturday May 11 at 2pm. ...
It is hard to see what Melissa Lee might have done to “save” the media. National went into the election with no public media policy and appears not to have developed one subsequently. Lee claimed that she had prepared a policy paper before the election but it had been decided ...
Open access notablesIce acceleration and rotation in the Greenland Ice Sheet interior in recent decades, Løkkegaard et al., Communications Earth & Environment:In the past two decades, mass loss from the Greenland ice sheet has accelerated, partly due to the speedup of glaciers. However, uncertainty in speed derived from satellite products ...
Buzz from the Beehive A statement from Children’s Minister Karen Chhour – yet to be posted on the Government’s official website – arrived in Point of Order’s email in-tray last night. It welcomes the High Court ruling on whether the Waitangi Tribunal can demand she appear before it. It does ...
Mr Bombastic:Ironically, the media the academic experts wanted is, in many ways, the media they got. In place of the tyrannical editors of yesteryear, advancing without fear or favour the interests of the ruling class; the New Zealand news media of today boasts a troop of enlightened journalists dedicated to ...
It's hard times try to make a livingYou wake up every morning in the unforgivingOut there somewhere in the cityThere's people living lives without mercy or pityI feel good, yeah I'm feeling fineI feel better then I have for the longest timeI think these pills have been good for meI ...
In 1974, the US Supreme Court issued its decision in United States v. Nixon, finding that the President was not a King, but was subject to the law and was required to turn over the evidence of his wrongdoing to the courts. It was a landmark decision for the rule ...
Every day now just seems to bring in more fresh meat for the grinder.In their relentlessly ideological drive to cut back on the “excessive bloat” (as they see it) of the previous Labour-led government, on the mountains of evidence accumulated in such a short period of time do not ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Megan Valére SosouMarket gardening site of the Itchèléré de Itagui agricultural cooperative in Dassa-Zoumè (Image credit: Megan Valère Sossou) For the residents of Dassa-Zoumè, a city in the West African country of Benin, choosing between drinking water and having enough ...
Buzz from the Beehive Melissa Lee – as may be discerned from the screenshot above – has not been demoted for doing something seriously wrong as Minister of ...
Morning in London Mother hugs beloved daughter outside the converted shoe factory in which she is living.Afternoon in London Travelling writer takes himself and his wrist down to A&E, just to be sure. Read more ...
Mike Grimshaw writes – The recent announcement of the University Advisory Group, chaired by Sir Peter Gluckman, makes very clear where the Government’s focus and priorities lie. The remit of the Advisory Group is that Group members will consider challenges and opportunities for improvement in the university sector including: ...
Eric Crampton writes – The Reserve Bank of New Zealand desperately wants to find reasons to have workstreams in climate change. It makes little sense. They’ve run another stress test on the banks looking to see if they could find a prudential regulation case. They couldn’t. They ...
Rob MacCullough writes – Pundits from the left and the right are arguing that National’s Fast Track Bill that is designed to speed up infrastructure decisions could end up becoming mired in a cesspool of corruption. Political commentator ...
Looking at the headlines this morning it’s hard to feel anything other than pessimistic about the future of humanity.Note that I’m not speaking about the future of mankind, but the survival of our humanity. The values that we believe in seem to be ebbing away, by the day.Perhaps every generation ...
Swabbing mixed breed baby chicks to test for avian influenzaUh oh. Bird flu – often deadly to humans – is not only being transmitted from infected birds to dairy cows, but is now travelling between dairy cows. As of last Friday, Bloomberg News reports, there were 32 American dairy herds ...
On February 14, 2023 we announced our Rebuttal Update Project. This included an ask for feedback about the added "At a glance" section in the updated basic rebuttal versions. This weekly blog post series highlights this new section of one of the updated basic rebuttal versions and serves as a ...
What is it with the mining industry? Its not enough for them to pillage the earth - they apparently can't even be bothered getting resource consent to do so: The proponent behind a major mine near the Clutha River had already been undertaking activity in the area without a ...
Photo # 1 I am a huge fan of Singapore’s approach to housing, as described here two years ago by copying and pasting from The ConversationWhat Singapore has that Australia does not is a public housing developer, the Housing Development Board, which puts new dwellings on public and reclaimed land, ...
This afternoon’s interim Waitangi Tribunal report must be taken seriously as it affects our most vulnerable children, Labour children’s spokesperson Willow-Jean Prime. ...
Te Pāti Māori are demanding the New Zealand Government support an international independent investigation into mass graves that have been uncovered at two hospitals on the Gaza strip, following weeks of assault by Israeli troops. Among the 392 bodies that have been recovered, are children and elderly civilians. Many of ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
Tonight’s court decision to overturn the summons of the Children’s Minister has enabled the Crown to continue making decisions about Māori without evidence, says Te Pāti Māori spokesperson for Children, Mariameno Kapa-Kingi. “The judicial system has this evening told the nation that this government can do whatever they want when ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
The government's decision to reintroduce Three Strikes is a destructive and ineffective piece of law-making that will only exacerbate an inherently biased and racist criminal justice system, said Te Pāti Māori Justice Spokesperson, Tākuta Ferris, today. During the time Three Strikes was in place in Aotearoa, Māori and Pasifika received ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
Te Pāti Māori is disgusted at the confirmation that hundreds are set to lose their jobs at Oranga Tamariki, and the disestablishment of the Treaty Response Unit. “This act of absolute carelessness and out of touch decision making is committing tamariki to state abuse.” Said Te Pāti Māori Oranga Tamariki ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
Te Pāti Māori co-leader Rawiri Waititi, and Mema Paremata mō Tāmaki-Makaurau, Takutai Tarsh Kemp, will travel to the Gold Coast to strengthen ties with Māori in Australia next week (15-21 April). The visit, in the lead-up to the 9th Australian National Kapa haka Festival, will be an opportunity for both ...
The Green Party has today launched a step-by-step guide to help New Zealanders make their voice heard on the Government’s democracy dodging and anti-environment fast track legislation. ...
The National Government’s proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act will mean tenants can be turfed from their homes by landlords with little notice, Labour housing spokesperson Kieran McAnulty said. ...
Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson is calling on all parties to support a common-sense change that’s great for the planet and great for consumers after her member’s bill was drawn from the ballot today. ...
The return of the historic Ō-Rākau battle site to the descendants of those who fought there moved one step closer today with the first reading of Te Pire mō Ō-Rākau, Te Pae o Maumahara / The Ō-Rākau Remembrance Bill. The Bill will entrust the 9.7-hectare battle site, five kilometres west ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has announced 25 new high-speed EV charging hubs along key routes between major urban centres and outlined the Government’s plan to supercharge New Zealand’s EV infrastructure. The hubs will each have several chargers and be capable of charging at least four – and up to 10 ...
The coalition Government will not proceed with the previous Government’s plans to regulate residential property managers, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “I have written to the Chairperson of the Social Services and Community Committee to inform him that the Government does not intend to support the Residential Property Managers Bill ...
The Government has announced an independent review into the disability support system funded by the Ministry of Disabled People – Whaikaha. Disability Issues Minister Louise Upston says the review will look at what can be done to strengthen the long-term sustainability of Disability Support Services to provide disabled people and ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith has attended the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva and outlined the Government’s plan to restore law and order. “Speaking to the United Nations Human Rights Council provided us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while responding to issues and ...
Trade Minister Todd McClay heads overseas today for high-level trade talks in the Gulf region, and a key OECD meeting in Paris. Mr McClay will travel to Riyadh to meet with counterparts from Saudi Arabia and the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC). “New Zealand’s goods and services exports to the Gulf region ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford has outlined six education priorities to deliver a world-leading education system that sets Kiwi kids up for future success. “I’m putting ambition, achievement and outcomes at the heart of our education system. I want every child to be inspired and engaged in their learning so they ...
The new NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) App is a secure ‘one stop shop’ to provide the services drivers need, Transport Minister Simeon Brown and Digitising Government Minister Judith Collins say. “The NZTA App will enable an easier way for Kiwis to pay for Vehicle Registration and Road User Charges (RUC). ...
Whānau with tamariki growing up in emergency housing motels will be prioritised for social housing starting this week, says Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka. “Giving these whānau a better opportunity to build healthy stable lives for themselves and future generations is an essential part of the Government’s goal of reducing ...
Racing Minister Winston Peters has paid tribute to an icon of the industry with the recent passing of Dave O’Sullivan (OBE). “Our sympathies are with the O’Sullivan family with the sad news of Dave O’Sullivan’s recent passing,” Mr Peters says. “His contribution to racing, initially as a jockey and then ...
Assalaamu alaikum, greetings to you all. Eid Mubarak, everyone! I want to extend my warmest wishes to you and everyone celebrating this joyous occasion. It is a pleasure to be here. I have enjoyed Eid celebrations at Parliament before, but this is my first time joining you as the Minister ...
Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced Pharmac’s largest ever budget of $6.294 billion over four years, fixing a $1.774 billion fiscal cliff. “Access to medicines is a crucial part of many Kiwis’ lives. We’ve committed to a budget allocation of $1.774 billion over four years so Kiwis are ...
Hon Paula Bennett has been appointed as member and chair of the Pharmac board, Associate Health Minister David Seymour announced today. "Pharmac is a critical part of New Zealand's health system and plays a significant role in ensuring that Kiwis have the best possible access to medicines,” says Mr Seymour. ...
Hundreds of New Zealand families affected by Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder (FASD) will benefit from a new Government focus on prevention and treatment, says Health Minister Dr Shane Reti. “We know FASD is a leading cause of preventable intellectual and neurodevelopmental disability in New Zealand,” Dr Reti says. “Every day, ...
Regional Development Minister Shane Jones today attended the official opening of Kaikohe’s new $14.7 million sports complex. “The completion of the Kaikohe Multi Sports Complex is a fantastic achievement for the Far North,” Mr Jones says. “This facility not only fulfils a long-held dream for local athletes, but also creates ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters’ engagements in Türkiye this week underlined the importance of diplomacy to meet growing global challenges. “Returning to the Gallipoli Peninsula to represent New Zealand at Anzac commemorations was a sombre reminder of the critical importance of diplomacy for de-escalating conflicts and easing tensions,” Mr Peters ...
Ambassador Millar, Burgemeester, Vandepitte, Excellencies, military representatives, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen – good morning and welcome to this sacred Anzac Day dawn service. It is an honour to be here on behalf of the Government and people of New Zealand at Buttes New British Cemetery, Polygon Wood – a deeply ...
Distinguished guests - It is an honour to return once again to this site which, as the resting place for so many of our war-dead, has become a sacred place for generations of New Zealanders. Our presence here and at the other special spaces of Gallipoli is made ...
Mai ia tawhiti pamamao, te moana nui a Kiwa, kua tae whakaiti mai matou, ki to koutou papa whenua. No koutou te tapuwae, no matou te tapuwae, kua honoa pumautia. Ko nga toa kua hinga nei, o te Waipounamu, o te Ika a Maui, he okioki tahi me o ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
Overseas models for regulating the oil and gas sector, including their decommissioning regimes, are being carefully scrutinised as a potential template for New Zealand’s own sector, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. The Coalition Government is focused on rebuilding investor confidence in New Zealand’s energy sector as it looks to strengthen ...
Emergency Management and Recovery Minister Mark Mitchell has today released the Report of the Government Inquiry into the response to the North Island Severe Weather Events. “The report shows that New Zealand’s emergency management system is not fit-for-purpose and there are some significant gaps we need to address,” Mr Mitchell ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith is today travelling to Europe where he’ll update the United Nations Human Rights Council on the Government’s work to restore law and order. “Attending the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva provides us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while ...
Associate Agriculture Minister, Mark Patterson, formally reopened the world’s largest wool processing facility today in Awatoto, Napier, following a $50 million rebuild and refurbishment project. “The reopening of this facility will significantly lift the economic opportunities available to New Zealand’s wool sector, which already accounts for 20 per cent of ...
Hon Andrew Bayly, Minister for Small Business and Manufacturing At the Southland Otago Regional Engineering Collective (SOREC) Summit, 18 April, Dunedin Ngā mihi nui, Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Ko Whanganui aho Good Afternoon and thank you for inviting me to open your summit today. I am delighted ...
The Government is delivering on its commitment to bring back the Three Strikes legislation, Associate Justice Minister Nicole McKee announced today. “Our Government is committed to restoring law and order and enforcing appropriate consequences on criminals. We are making it clear that repeat serious violent or sexual offending is not ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has today announced four new diplomatic appointments for New Zealand’s overseas missions. “Our diplomats have a vital role in maintaining and protecting New Zealand’s interests around the world,” Mr Peters says. “I am pleased to announce the appointment of these senior diplomats from the ...
New Zealand is contributing NZ$7 million to support communities affected by severe food insecurity and other urgent humanitarian needs in Ethiopia and Somalia, Foreign Minister Rt Hon Winston Peters announced today. “Over 21 million people are in need of humanitarian assistance across Ethiopia, with a further 6.9 million people ...
Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Paul Goldsmith is congratulating Mataaho Collective for winning the Golden Lion for best participant in the main exhibition at the Venice Biennale. "Congratulations to the Mataaho Collective for winning one of the world's most prestigious art prizes at the Venice Biennale. “It is good ...
The Government is reforming financial services to improve access to home loans and other lending, and strengthen customer protections, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly and Housing Minister Chris Bishop announced today. “Our coalition Government is committed to rebuilding the economy and making life simpler by cutting red tape. We are ...
“China remains a strong commercial opportunity for Kiwi exporters as Chinese businesses and consumers continue to value our high-quality safe produce,” Trade and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay says. Mr McClay has returned to New Zealand following visits to Beijing, Harbin and Shanghai where he met ministers, governors and mayors and engaged in trade and agricultural events with the New ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has completed a successful trip to Singapore, Thailand and the Philippines, deepening relationships and capitalising on opportunities. Mr Luxon was accompanied by a business delegation and says the choice of countries represents the priority the New Zealand Government places on South East Asia, and our relationships in ...
New Zealand is demonstrating its commitment to reducing global greenhouse emissions, and supporting clean energy transition in South East Asia, through a contribution of NZ$41 million (US$25 million) in climate finance to the Asian Development Bank (ADB)-led Energy Transition Mechanism (ETM). Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced ...
The Government is today releasing a list of organisations who received letters about the Fast-track applications process, says RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop. “Recently Ministers and agencies have received a series of OIA requests for a list of organisations to whom I wrote with information on applying to have a ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Wellington Barrister David Jonathan Boldt as a Judge of the High Court, and the Honourable Justice Matthew Palmer as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Boldt graduated with an LLB from Victoria University of Wellington in 1990, and also holds ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa. The summit is co-hosted ...
A stopbank upgrade project in Tairawhiti partly funded by the Government has increased flood resilience for around 7000ha of residential and horticultural land so far, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones today attended a dawn service in Gisborne to mark the end of the first stage of the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Foreign investment proposals with implications for Australia’s strategic or economic security will face tougher scrutiny, under a policy overhaul to be announced by Treasurer Jim Chalmers on Wednesday. At the same time, the government ...
A Waitangi Tribunal inquiry report has warned government that a repeal of Section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act could cause harm to children in care. ...
The Treasury has published today three new papers covering government consumption multipliers, automatic stabilisers and the impacts of global shocks on New Zealand’s economy. ...
Asia Pacific Report The Pacific state of Hawai’i’s House of Representatives has joined the state’s Senate in calling for a ceasefire in Israel’s war on Gaza, becoming the first state to pass such a resolution, reports Hawaii News Now. In March, the Senate passed a ceasefire resolution with a 24–1 ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Christopher Ferrie, A/Prof, UTS Chancellor’s Postdoctoral Research and ARC DECRA Fellow, University of Technology Sydney PsiQuantum The Australian government has announced a pledge of approximately A$940 million (US$617 million) to PsiQuantum, a quantum computing start-up company based in Silicon Valley. Half ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Hunter Bennett, Lecturer in Exercise Science, University of South Australia Cameron Prins/Shutterstock If you spend a lot of time exploring fitness content online, you might have come across the concept of heart rate zones. Heart rate zone training has become more ...
SPECIAL REPORT:By Eugene Doyle He is the most popular Palestinian leader alive today — and yet few people in the West even know his name. Absolutely no one in Gaza or the West Bank does not know him. That difference speaks volumes about who dominates the media narrative that ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Will McCallum, PhD Candidate – School of Communication and Creative Arts, Deakin University Earlier this year, Opposition Leader Peter Dutton accused Prime Minister Anthony Albanese of not supporting Operation Sovereign Borders – the military-led border security operation that has “closed Australia’s borders ...
By Melyne Baroi in Port Moresby A Papua New Guinea MP, Peter Isoaimo, who had been ousted by the National Court in an alleged bribery case, has been reinstated by the Supreme Court on appeal. A three-member Supreme Court bench found that the National Court had erred in finding that ...
Publisher Chris Holdaway reflects on the unique project of collecting the work of the late, terrific poet Schaeffer Lemalu. One of the nice things you can do as a truly independent publisher is to make the books that writers want to make, whatever they happen to be. That’s how I’ve ...
Those profiled in the stamp series served on overseas deployments from 1995 onwards, and all have been awarded theNew Zealand Operational Service Medal. ...
Last night’s dismal poll result for the coalition government shows the limits of trying to govern as an opposition, argues Joel MacManus. There’s a quote from the American political activist Barbara Deming: “Vengeance is not the point; change is. But the trouble is that in most people’s minds, the thought ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Shireen Morris, Associate Professor and Director of the Radical Centre Reform Lab at Macquarie University Law School, Macquarie University Leonid Andronov/Shutterstock Foreign interference in Australian democracy poses a growing risk to our national sovereignty. It refers to coercive, corrupt or ...
A defendant charged by the Serious Fraud Office (SFO) has pleaded guilty to four charges of obtaining by deception in relation to a mortgage fraud scheme. Sentencing has been scheduled for 14 August 2024. ...
What to say when pesky journalists ask gotcha questions like ‘can you name a single book you’ve ever read?’ and ‘did you read it, or did you just see the movie?’This week, Act Party arts spokesperson Todd Stephenson foolishly agreed to an interview with Newsroom’s Steve Braunias regarding his ...
Explainer - What will a ban on cellphones in schools achieve? Can students use them during lunch breaks? And what happens if you need to contact your child? ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jodi Rowley, Curator, Amphibian & Reptile Conservation Biology, Australian Museum, UNSW Sydney Jodi Rowley, CC BY-NC-ND In winter 2021, Australia’s frogs started dropping dead. People began posting images of dead frogs on social media. Unable to travel to investigate the deaths ...
In the year ended March 2024, 0.4 percent of home transfers were to people who didn’t hold New Zealand citizenship or a resident visa, according to figures released by Stats NZ today. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Wasay Majid, Research Assistant , University of Auckland, Waipapa Taumata Rau New Zealand’s accommodation supplement scheme is facing scrutiny, with Social Development Minister Louise Upston recently saying “there is merit in considering whether the current settings are fair and sustainable long-term”. The ...
By Koroi Hawkins, RNZ Pacific editor The first prime ministerial candidate has been announced in Solomon Islands and it is not Manasseh Sogavare. The man of the hour is Jeremiah Manele, the MP for Hograno/Kia/Havulei constituency in Isabel Province, who served as minister of foreign affairs in the last government. ...
Protesting the removal of bins by leaving piles of your dog’s shit for others to deal with doesn’t make you a hero – it’s precious and entitled behaviour. You haven’t truly lived until you’ve stood on the shoreline of Auckland’s Cheltenham beach, desperately trying to scoop increasingly liquid dog shit ...
Analysis - Christopher Luxon will be alert to the factors driving the dire polling, but won't be waving the white flag just yet, RNZ political editor Jo Moir writes. ...
Writer, teacher and academic Vincent O’Sullivan died on Sunday 28 April. Here we gather tributes from friends, colleagues, and students who remember his extraordinary contributions. I went down to the garage tonight. There was a bird shrieking out in the bush, in the dark, maybe a kākā. Miraculously, through the ...
As part of our series exploring how New Zealanders live and our relationship with money, a burnt-out corporate escapee explains how she gets by ‘working as little as possible’. Want to be part of The Cost of Being? Fill out the questionnaire here.Gender: Female Age: 31 Ethnicity: Pākehā Role: Contractor in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Timothy Schmidt, Professor of Chemistry, UNSW Sydney Albert Russ / Shutterstock The icebreaker of many a barbeque conversation is something like “what do you do for a crust?” “I teach chemistry at university,” is what we usually reply. Then silence. Our ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Asher Flynn, Associate Professor of Criminology, Monash University Shutterstock Sexual harassment is often considered to be a person-to-person act, but new research shows Australians are also experiencing and perpetrating workplace harassment in large numbers through technology. Our latest study shows one ...
A petition signed by more than 16,500 people, demanding the government take stronger action to halt the genocide of Palestinians by the State of Israel, is being presented to the House of Representatives today by Hon Phil Twyford. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Burnett, Honorary Associate Professor, ANU College of Law, Australian National University jenmartin/Shutterstock April has been a bad month for the Australian environment. The Great Barrier Reef was hit, yet again, by intense coral bleaching. And Environment Minister Tanya Plibersek delayed ...
Winston Peters might not give a ‘rat’s derriere’ about last night’s poll, but it revealed the unusual absence of a honeymoon period and little payoff for the government’s action plan approach, writes Anna Rawhiti-Connell in this excerpt from The Bulletin, The Spinoff’s morning news round-up. To receive The Bulletin in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Marco de Jong, Lecturer, Law School, Auckland University of Technology Getty Images Details released by the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet under the Official Information Act reveal New Zealand officials have been considering involvement in AUKUS from the outset. ...
The government's treatment of Māori raised eyebrows, with countries saying New Zealand needed to do more to reduce health, education and justice inequities. ...
The age of criminal responsibility was one of numerous human rights issues raised during Aotearoa New Zealand’s UPR. Other key themes were racism and discrimination, the disproportionate representation of Māori in prison, and to uphold the UN Declaration ...
In a sitdown interview ahead of his final day at Parliament this week, the former Green Party co-leader tells RNZ about his lowest point during 2017's rough election campaign. ...
Is the fringe radio station really in a financial crisis, or is it just running a hyped-up donation drive? Fringe internet radio station Reality Check Radio was launched by the anti-vaccine mandates group Voices for Freedom in March 2023. For the next year, it undertook probably the most aggressive promotional ...
Above the Fold: On Monday, the biggest Māori screen production company faced down the biggest funder of Māori content at the High Court. It was an incredibly tense moment – then, just as quickly, it resolved. Duncan Greive breaks down a strange day in the screen sector.Yesterday morning, Māori ...
It’s a ride that’s lasted almost 30 years for mother and daughter BMX riders Nancy and Toni James, and the next stop is the World Championships in Rock Hill, South Carolina. Almost 27 years ago, Nancy and her husband Gerrard took their oldest child, Daniel, to the Waitākere BMX Club. ...
When it comes to talking about the Government’s controversial fast-track consenting process, political scientist Richard Shaw refers to the famous Chinese sci-fi novel Three-Body Problem, while RNZ’s In Depth journalist Farah Hancock talks about zombie projects. Shaw is referring to the three-party coalition Government and how the proposed legislation is ...
Opinion: The debate over single gender versus co-educational schooling has long been controversial. I went to a co-ed school and was inspired by a remarkable woman who was my maths teacher, and because of her deep knowledge and passion for the subject, I knew that maths was definitely an option ...
He won everything and he earned a knighthood and he was a senior literary figure to the point that he was a living monument to himself until his death in the weekend at 86, but there was something about Vincent O’Sullivan that flew under the radar, that was independent and ...
Loading…(function(i,s,o,g,r,a,m){var ql=document.querySelectorAll('A,DIV,A[data-quiz],DIV[data-quiz]'); if(ql){if(ql.length){for(var k=0;k<ql.length;k++){ql[k].id='quiz-embed-'+k;ql[k].href="javascript:var i=document.getElementById('quiz-embed-"+k+"');try{qz.startQuiz(i)}catch(e){i.start=1;i.style.cursor='wait';i.style.opacity='0.5'};void(0);"}}};i['QP']=r;i[r]=i[r]||function(){(i[r].q=i[r].q||[]).push(arguments)},i[r].l=1*new Date();a=s.createElement(o),m=s.getElementsByTagName(o)[0];a.async=1;a.src=g;m.parentNode.insertBefore(a,m)})(window,document,'script','https://take.quiz-maker.com/3012/CDN/quiz-embed-v1.js','qp'); Got a good quiz question?Send Newsroom your questions. The post Newsroom daily quiz, Tuesday 30 April appeared first on Newsroom. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rick Sarre, Emeritus Professor of Law and Criminal Justice, University of South Australia The rate of women killed by their partners in Australia grew by 28% from 2021–22 to 2022–23, according to new statistics released today by the Australian Institute of Criminology ...
Ministry of Disabled People employees were promised a permanent role, but were told to start packing three weeks before their fixed term contract finished, says a former employee. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Andrew Blakers, Professor of Engineering, Australian National University Clean Energy Council / Neoen As Australia’s rapid renewable energy rollout continues, so too does debate over land use. Nationals Leader David Littleproud, for example, claimed regional areas had reached “saturation point” and ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Brendan C. Walsh, Sessional Academic, The University of Queensland Arrest for witchcraft (1866) by John PettieNGV, CC BY-NC In recent decades, governments the world over have increasingly taken action to address the dark history of witch-hunting. In western Europe, memorials to ...
By Mark Rabago, RNZ Pacific Commonwealth of the Northern Marianas correspondent The US Department of Justice is being urged to condemn and cease its reliance on the “Insular Cases” — a series of US Supreme Court opinions on US territories, which have been labelled racist. Senate Judiciary Committee chair Dick ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kara Dadswell, Senior Lecturer in Psychology, Victoria University Ask your son or daughter, niece, or nephew to draw you a picture of a sport coach. They will most probably draw a man. Why? Our latest research published in the Psychology of Sport ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicole Rinehart, Professor, Child and Adolescent Psychology, Director, Krongold Clinic (Research), Monash University Shutterstock/Brian A. Jackson “Charlie” is an eight-year-old child with autism. Her parents are worried because she often responds to requests with insults, aggression and refusal. Simple demands, such ...
UK Results
UK
LAB 30.4……CON 36.9……..LD 7.9……….UKIP 12.6…….SNP 4.7……..GRN 3.8
LAB + 1.5……CON + 0.8……LD – 15.2……UKIP + 9.5……SNP + 3.1……GRN + 2.8
England
LAB 31.6…….CON 41.0…….LD 8.2……….UKIP 14.1……….GRN 4.2
LAB + 3.6……CON + 1.4……LD – 16.0……UKIP + 10.7……GRN + 3.2
Scotland
LAB 24.3……..CON 14.9……..LD 7.5……….UKIP 1.6………SNP 50.0………GRN 1.3
LAB – 17.7……CON – 1.8……LD – 11.3……UKIP + 0.9……SNP + 30.0……GRN + 0.7
Wales
LAB 36.9…….CON 27.2…….LD 6.5……….UKIP 13.6………PC 12.1……..GRN 2.6
LAB + 0.6……CON + 1.1……LD – 13.6……UKIP + 11.2……PC + 0.8……GRN + 2.1
Haven’t been able to find any English Regional percentage breakdowns yet (ie North-East, West Midlands, South-West, Greater London etc – but, then, that’s probably a plus from your point of view)
Be pretty cool if the National Party was getting 36.9% of the vote. No wonder the Conservatives fight proportionality, tooth and nail.
So does UK Labour. They are very comfy in a two party system.
Does that mean Labour’s vote increased from the last election?
Certainly does (though it’s cold comfort).
Labour’s share of the vote up 1.5 percentage points and raw number of votes up from 8.6 million (2010) to 9.3 million (2015).
Doesn’t it put paid to the idea that moving left was wrong?
Possibly
Unless it’s presented by the LP
UK Labour “moved left”? Must’ve blinked and missed it.
Trp said something about it yesterday, and I think it’s been in the media, as a reason for Labour doing badly (I’m rolling my eyes), but it sounded like the same old beat up to me, as you point out there wasn’t a real shift.
the reason the polls were so ‘out’..is because of the achilles-heel of pollsters..
..how they just ignore those who actually decide any election..
..the ‘undecideds’..
..all of which makes polling perhaps the most unscientific of practices..
..and as so many recent examples have shown/proven..
..both wildly inaccurate and irrelevant as far as any clear prediction of outcomes is concerned..
..the best they can hope for is the broadest of brush-strokes..
Yep, the Undecideds certainly comprise one of the reasons being touted for the “terrible night for us pollsters” (Chief Executive of YouGov ).
Others include: (1) the “Shy Conservative” (though they arguably overlap with the Undecideds – about which, more below), (2) The suggestion that Polls were, in fact, correct but last-minute swing to the Tories, (3) That Pollsters may have been “herding” (ie skewing their polls towards an average) – some analysts are suspicious about just how closely-aligned the various polls were in the final days, (4) Claims that the Final Result was, in fact, within the margin-of-error for most polls, (5) Becoming more challenging to contact a representative sample of voters, (6) The large-ish minority of Labour supporters (28% in one Ipsos-Mori Poll) who told pollsters they preferred Cameron as PM (speculation they could comprise a whole new category of “shy Tory”), (7) Current polling methods haven’t adjusted to the new era of electoral politics (ie the much greater fluidity of the electorate in recent years).
In terms of the argument that a disproportionate number of “Don’t Knows” went Tory on Election Day,…….. a couple of weeks back, I was looking through the detailed breakdowns of a particular poll and noticed that the Undecideds – when pushed to name which Party they were leaning towards – went heavily Conservative. Tories led Labour by more than 10 points among this group. It’s true that Undecideds are somewhat less likely to get out and actually vote on the Day than respondents who name a party on initial prompting, but 10+ points would still have some impact on the final result (not necessarily “shy” but certainly “hidden” Tories).
Tactical voting is another potential – not so much a last-minute swing to the tories, but a redistribution of votes on the right to make them count.
This nicely illustrates UK Labour’s woes…
Labour were targeting 106 marginal seats – most were Tory-held, some LibDem-held.
Have a look at what happened in the most marginal Tory seats of all.
15 Most Marginal Tory Seats of 2010 (ie with smallest 2010 majorities over Labour)
Seat……………….2010 Tory maj over Lab…….2015 % Swing……………….Status
Warwickshire North…………….54……………..CON + 2.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Thurrock……………………………..92……………..CON – 3.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Hendon………………………………106…………….CON + 6.7……LAB – 0.6………Con Hold
Cardiff North………………………194…………….CON + 4.9……LAB + 1.2………Con Hold
Sherwood…………………………..214…………….CON + 5.8……LAB – 2.9……….Con Hold
Stockton South…………………..332…………….CON + 7.8……LAB – 1.3……….Con Hold
Lancaster & Fleetwood……….333…………….CON + 3.2……LAB + 7.0………Lab Gain
Broxtowe……………………………389…………….CON + 6.2…….LAB – 1.1………Con Hold
Amber Valley………………………536…………….CON + 5.4…….LAB – 2.7………Con Hold
Wolverhampton SW……………691…………….CON + 0.5…….LAB + 4.2……..Lab Gain
Waveney…………………………….769…………….CON + 2.1…….LAB – 1.0……..Con Hold
Carlisle……………………………….853…………….CON + 5.0…….LAB + 0.5………Con Hold
Morecombe & Lunesdale……866…………….CON + 4.0…… LAB – 4.6……..Con Hold
Weaver Vale……………………….991…………….CON + 4.6…….LAB + 5.2……..Con Hold
Lincoln………………………………1058……………CON + 5.1…… LAB + 4.3……..Con Hold
Labour won only 2 of the 15 seats it should have absolutely blitzed. And in a majority of the 13 ultra-marginals it failed in – its vote share actually fell while the Tories’ % rose.
Exactly Swordfish-great analysis. My sister lives in Lincoln and will be devastated. The turnout in Lincoln was 63%-pathetic in a marginal. Shows how disillusioned the UK electorate really is.
What has been missed a bit by the analysts is that Labour polled quite well in the north of England compared with last time. That is reflected in the Lancaster vote above, in Burnley and in a number of other results.
Yeah, I was only going to include Tory seats with majorities of less than 1000, but the City of Lincoln’s my old stomping ground. First went to the UK in 1983 in my late teens and spent most of the time in Lincoln/Nottingham area (where I had/have some distant relatives). Did some scrutineering for the Lincoln Labour Party on Election Day – sat next to a very large Tory woman from the Shire* – (and watched one or two Lincoln City games (“The Red Imps”) at Sincil Bank – bottom half of the 4th Division, trend towards pin-striped football Kit in 83 for some bizarre reason, possibly growing obsession with Corporate culture / Thatcherism of more than a few Football Club Execs).
Lincoln’s always been a bellwether seat, clearly still is.
* Yeah, I know, sexist of me to mention her weight. I feel bad about it, but there you go.
john armstrong has done a column enthusing over little dragging labour to the right/tory-lite..
(i’m not gonna link to it..)
Not that bad an article, really. Armstrong has at least spotted the danger for his masters:
“The other lesson to take from Wednesday night’s function – and one National would be wise to heed – is Little’s capacity to surprise, something he first did with his “cut the crap” jibe at John Key. While well imbued with core Labour values, Little is less hung-up about what means are used to reach the goals associated with those values.”
I thought it is an okay article, too – TRP. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read.
Little has an enormous job to make Labour into a workable election campaign “machine” again – and he’s going about it thoughtfully, carefully, and maybe a bit slowly for some but if you look back at his various statements you’ll see he’s positioning Labour as the Party for Work and Jobs – along with all the other social values that underpins Labour.
So quit sniping at him and let him get on with that job.
“.. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read…”
really..?
so little isn’t moving labour right..?
little is not endorsed as labour leader by rightwing-trouts..?
little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical-ideas’ (!) of the 2014-campaign..?
am i imagining all that..?
Your quotation marks around “radical ideas”, followed by that smarmy little (!), implies this is a quote from Andrew Little. It would be helpful if you provided a citation for that quote, otherwise people might think you were still deliberately twisting things no one has actually said.
i disagree with yr interpretation of the use of the marks..
and if you don’t mind – i wd rather not engage with you..(for already stated previously reasons..)
You may engage however you wish, but if you don’t want people to point out that you’re implying things that aren’t true and which you can’t back up you should probably either back up your statements, use clearer punctuation, or stop making up lies to suit your political agenda.
Political Agendas
The irony
🙄
I have taken the position of ignoring everything that p u writes on the basis that anyone who refuses to use punctuation and write in coherent sentences and paragraphs can have nothing to say of interest.
It just takes too much time out of my life to read people who write in a stream of thought, blurting manner. Give me someone who makes the effort to write clearly and thoughtfully and, even if I almost always disagree, I will take the time to take their thought on board.
yawn..!..
Me too Hateatea, and completely agree about the value of inention in communicating. I sometimes will attempt to read one of his comments in a situation like this (where someone has responded to him in a meaningful way). Sometimes I read the first two lines or so to see if I can make any sense. If he drops vegan links in I’ll have a look because they’re usually fundamentalist and need challenging. I virtually never read the long ones, or even the whole of the short ones. Life’s too short :->
double-yawn…!
Yep, same here. Some of the subthreads is keyboard-mashing causes can be pretty funny, though.
Especially when he gets called on making shit up and then argues that someone has misinterpreted his intentionally-unorthodox punctuation, grammar, and sentence contstruction.
Double quotation marks would imply a quote. Single ones I would take to mean an implication that some policies were radical ideas rather than a quote, but as you point out it can be hard to tell with phil.
My understanding is that Little is suggesting backing of from certain policies that they’ve recevied feedback are wrong. I wouldn’t have seen Little as seeing those as radical policies, so without some back up, I’ll take it as phil’s interpretation.
It’s funny really, because Little is more likely to take Labour left, and the left calling him a right mover just playes into the right wing spinners’ agenda.
double are quotes which phil used, singles can be used imo to imply irony, sarcasm, disbelief – the exclamation mark implied to me extreme – irony, sarcasm or disbelief.
I’m seeing single quotes around radical ideas
yep me too – but double around the initial quote commented on.
For me if I write, Little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical ideas’ etc then I’m saying the ideas are not so radical in my opinion although Little may have thought or even believe they are. What phil means he can explain if he wants but that’s how I read it. Whether he actually promised radical ideas or not is a fair point that Stephanie has raised and tttt {(to tell the truth) just made that up 🙂 } I don’t know if he did or not…
the clarity is murky
yep to that too, that’s pretty much how I took it.
The specific usage of ” vs ‘ isn’t set in stone (hell I have an English degree and I don’t know the “rules” around them).
I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”. I don’t know why it’s there if pu isn’t trying to imply that Little did indeed say capital gains etc were “radical” ideas.
yep. I got called out on the use of double quotes a while back for something sarcastic I said about something Key had said and someone had a go at me because they thought I was literally making up quoting Key when I thought it was obvious I was taking the piss. I agree there are no set rules, which is why I talked about my impressions of phil’s comment. At this point, in all good conscience I can’t keep talking seriously about punctuation in this context (-;
“I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”.”
It’s one interpretation. I read it as ironically expressing “shock horror” at the very notion of radical ideas in general.
Who really knows though. As far as I can tell, phil is the owner-operator of a punctuation system entirely of his own devising.
(And that’s not a slight on phil btw. It’s all punc rock to me.)
u get the chocolate fish..felix..
.’b’ is the correct answer…
…the owner-operator of a punctuation system entirely of his own devising.
Splitter!
is it a batchelors’ degree..?
from memory you learn that stuff at masters’ level..
@ oan..
“.. Splitter
A temporary fold at the tip/end of a penis usually caused by sitting in a uncomfortable position Ex. Crossed legs or wearing tight pants.
Resulting in a split stream while taking a piss..”
never had that happen..
..whoar..!
..oh..!..hang on..maybe…
” is often speech” ‘writing’
But since the advent of “bald neutralising” ” ” have often been used to highlight disagreement with the quoted idea – a bit like sic.
Stove on ” ”
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=f1BxO9yu1NIC&pg=PA34&lpg=PA34&dq=stove+bald+neutralising&source=bl&ots=T7S3At5K1W&sig=ea-ci-iQ1oY_YRhQtusOZHw-Dy0&hl=en&sa=X&ei=irZNVcnxKuHHmAXy3ID4Dg&ved=0CBwQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=stove%20bald%20neutralising&f=false
Absolutely, a big “Aye” Jenny
Armstrong is right about Phil Twyford performing well.
rightwinger roughan has a (partial)-solution to/for the ak property-bubble..
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11445580
and can i ask why labour don’t/didn’t have roughans’ idea as policy..?
..did they not think of it..?
..or did they shy away because it would financially effect/hurt all those property-owning/’investor’ labour mp’s..?
..if neither of those…
..why the f. not have this as policy..?..(in the 2014 election..and now..)
For real Kiwi’s especially Aucklanders who are interested in the Ports of Auckland battle between the Council & the POA there is an excellent article in today’s Herald here.:-
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445757
Also the POA publicity machine recently stated that it was essential to have the extended wharf other wise the new cruise ship ‘Quantum of the Seas’ would not be able to berth and New Zealand would miss out on lots of $$$$$$$ ‘cos the company would cancel the visit. ???????
What they didn’t say is that this new vessel whilst a little bigger in displacement is actually similar in size to the ‘Queen Mary II’ which has been here recently with no problems about berthing. She is just two metres shorter than the Quantum but draws 10.1m against the
Quantum’s 8.8m. The other difference is that QMII is rated at 30Knots against the Q’s 22.
Go figure. If Bullshit was a brass band etc.
TRP you are delusional if you think little has any traction with public as the polls high light labour is now seen as perennial losers globally ( UK Au Nz) No longer is any one buying core labour values beyond those areas trapped on govt handouts ( Scotland Qld etc) , the world has moved on, labours time ( 70 years ago ) has come and gone. All we are seeing now is a slow death, A left shift will simply accelerate the inevitable
so, really what would your alternative be?
we can’t all be landlords and bosses, really we still need a few people to work and get the various jobs that need doing done. You know, like Nurses, teachers, cleaners, admin staff, peeps working in Fonterra factories and the likes. If labour is dead as you say, who will look out for the workers? Surely not National? They have, over the last 7 years and previously under Shipley, shown that they do not believe workers worthy of consideration and might even consider the New Zealand Worker (resident and citizens) to be utterly replaceable by cheap, imported slave type labour from Asia and elsewhere?
What do you tell your children then, if you have any? Move overseas, cause here in NZ you are not going to have a chance to survive?
There needs to be a balance between (to parapharase Bush II) The Haves and The Have Nots or else we are going back to the dark ages where the workers were effectively owned by the Lord of the Manor.
Is that the future that you hope for Red Delusion?
Really what about a 40 hour week, overtime pay, accident compensation, retirement benefits, unemployment benefits, equal education opportunities, public health care and the likes do you not like and think we can do away with?
I’m looking forward to following the nature of work enquiry/report, as it will inform greatly as to how the country should proceed in the upcoming years.
I also look forward to the 40 hour week reducing to 35 or 30 hours for similar pay – this should be a major push from Labour to improve work-life balance (imagine a 4 day week for the same length shifts and same pay!) and also decrease unemployment as mechanisation increases.
The 32 hour week should have happened back in the 1980s. Instead we had the First Act Government attacking working hours and wages.
+ 1 yep – fuck with computers we were promised 25 hours weeks or even less – we’ve been sucked in severely
hi sabine. i think both you and red delusion can be correct.
i was bought up in a staunch labour household, (my grandfather was an organizer all his life) and constantly told that labour were the party for the working person.
i dont think that relevance is true today.
the radical shift in the 80s to the neo liberal agenda was the final nail in the ciffin for me.
having labour move away from the workers doesnt mean we have to go without 40hour week, overtime etc
i do think the workers you listed do need representing but i feel we dont identify as strongly with our occupations as we used to do.
pollys are there to get elected or re-elected. so we will not be getting a visionary or a radical shake-up from the labour party.
you can argue that proposing raising the retirement age is an anti worker move.
also you can argue that it is a long overdue fiscally responsible move.
as to who is to represent these workers, politically, good question.
probably the mana crew, as i see the greens looking to move right and be seen as respectable enough not to scare the horses.
is simon bridges over-exuberant in his use of hair-oil..?
and does that have an environmental-impact..?
..and is that why he is so ‘oily’..?..in so so many ways..?
He’s trying for that Superman hairdo, where the hair never moves. But he’s looking more like Hosking’s misbarbered look.
spiv is as spiv does..
shouldn’t you be apologising for being sexist with that comment @PU ?
for calling bridges an oily-spiv..?
i don’t think so…
🙂 – I’d be calling him a lot worse, but then if we delved into it too much, we’d have to start having an in depth discussion on power relations (where Bridges is actually a 40 watt banana masquerading as something quite a few people think is worthwhile), and I’d be living in utter, absolute fear of being ‘sanctioned’.
in labours casting around for the reasons why they lost in 2014..
..i hope they don’t discount how toxic to so many of their erstwhile voters/supporters was their policy to raise the superannuation-age…
..and that heaping too much blame on the capital gains tax ‘rejection’..
..is pointing the bone at the wrong target..
And now they want to alienate the few voters that they have left, with this bullshit stunt.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11445759
Looks like LabourNZ will go the same way as LabourUK as just another also ran.
They’d be better off saying that they will be introducing compulsory voting. At least then people would be more willing to accept the penalties.
Inplementing compulsory voting (which I am against) would be a gutsy, definitive, concrete policy statement. Not just talking about considering a policy of talking about policy. So unlikely to come out of Labour.
FYI – here is the EVIDENCE which proves the improvement in ‘transparency’ at Auckland Council, for which. in my opinion, I can claim some credit as a result of my uncompromising ‘one person rates revolt’?
http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/newseventsculture/OurAuckland/mediareleases/Pages/councilmovestoimprovetransparency.aspx
Council moves to improve transparency
8/05/2015
Auckland Council has launched a section on its website providing information on a variety of council activities as part of a commitment to more openness and transparency.
The proactive publication of information on the More about the council webpage, which can be found via the Auckland Council Media centre helps to provide Aucklanders with better, timelier and more accurate information about how council works.
The first release of information includes Auckland Council Group staff numbers, information about annual average rates increases, debt, efficiency savings and progress updates on the NewCore project.
It also includes contracts awarded by the council with a value of $100,000 and greater from 1 July 2014 to 31 March 2015 and spends with suppliers with a value of $100,000 and more from 1 October 2014 to 31 March 2015.
All of the information in the section will be updated regularly to ensure it remains relevant and current.
Auckland Council CEO Stephen Town says the proactive publication of information aims to strengthen Aucklanders’ trust in the council.
“Central government and other local authorities already have similar initiatives, meaning Auckland Council will now be aligned with best practice across the public sector in New Zealand in making information more accessible to the public,” he says.
“In the future we will also be providing more details about how we work and what we do, including information about employee costs, travel expenses, key statistics about council activities and other useful information as and when it becomes available.”
In addition to the proactive publication of information, the council also today began publishing on its website Local Government Official Information and Meeting Act (LGOIMA) responses where the council deems the information to be in the interests of the wider public.
More about the council and LGOIMA responses are available to view now.
______________________________________________________________________________________
http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/newseventsculture/mediacentre/Pages/moreaboutthecouncil.aspx#awarded
Awarded contracts and supplier spend
We will regularly publish details of awarded contracts and spend with suppliers.
These reports are for Auckland Council (excluding CCOs) and will be updated twice a year, in April and October.
Awarded contracts report
For contracts valued at $100,000 and greater awarded by the council during the period stated (including provisional spending commitments in some instances), this report lists:
a description of the goods and/or services being supplied
the general type of goods and/or services being supplied
the name of the successful supplier
the start date and end date of the contract.
Awarded Contracts Report (PDF 313KB)
Supplier spend report
This report lists the total spend per supplier (across all contracts and purchase orders) for the period stated, where the total is greater than $100,000.
Supplier spend report (PDF 265KB)
All procurement activity at Auckland Council, including tendering and awarding contracts, is subject to the Auckland Council Procurement Policy.
For reasons related to commercial sensitivity and privacy, we do not publish the details of sole traders (ie. individuals who are not contracting through a company).
Detailed information about spend and contracts may be commercially confidential.
We believe that the information we provide in the reports is accurate at the time of publication (subject to the report disclaimers). The information is subject to change if projects, priorities and timeframes are varied for awarded contracts or if financial reconciliations or adjustments are made in respect of prior payments.
______________________________________________________________________________________
This, in my opinion, is a VERY belated start, for which I should not have had to put my freehold home ‘on the line’.
Penny Bright
http://www.pennybright4mayor.org.nz
is this a ‘brain-fart’..?..or not..?
‘Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families – from people who are not enrolled to vote.’
(this is an idea proposed by tim barnett..)
more from barnett:..
‘Asked if withheld state support could include benefits – Mr Barnett said there could be more of an issue with targeting such a defined group.’
..is this what passes for ‘new ideas’ in labour..?
Where did you find this, Phillip Ure ?
And remember, Tim Barnett is the general secretary – he is neither Leader nor President – and has just ordinary member’ s voting rights on policy stuff.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
It was part of Labour’s submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee.
From the Herald article:
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party, which did not set policy, and wanted the committee to investigate the idea – not necessarily recommend it.
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.
“There is widespread concern, not just Labour, with non-enrolment … there is pretty compelling evidence that there is a continuing pattern of people not enrolling.”
“And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Yeah but Australia is also the country currently introducing fascist policy that means citizens lose social security entitlements if they don’t vaccinate their children. Just to make that really clear, they’re targeting beneficiaries as a class of people. So probably not the best country to use as a comparison at this time.
Gotta say the similarity to the vaccination idea is interesting too. The irresponsibility of those parents is astonishing, of course, so I suppose something has to be done. I suspect that beneficiaries are targeted in the enrolment suggestion because they make up a large number of the non- enrolled. If I get a chance later I’ll do some digging or maybe someone else can do some research on what and why Labour are proposing it. For me, footy calls. Ciao.
If this was about irresponsible parenting, the Australian government would make vaccination mandatory across the board. You don’t vaccinate your kids then you get fined and eventually go to prison. But it’s not about that at all, it’s about buying into narratives that beneficiaries are bad parents and punishing them accordingly.
There is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids. If governments want to improve vaccination numbers they can introduce better health policy so that the people who aren’t vaccinating but probably would given the chance can access better health care. But hey, why bother addressing education and poverty issues when you can just bene bash.
<blockquoteThere is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids.
You’ve been proven wrong on that several times already.
So the theory of herd immunity is wrong then? Herd immunity does not work? Do say more, Mr Scientific one. How about the medical ethics framework of patient consent before any treatment? Is that wrong too?
I didn’t say that did I?
How about the ethics of inflicting others with disease which could easily have been avoided?
Oh fuck off with your distractions Draco the Scientific and answer the questions.
Does herd immunity require that 100% of persons be immunised for it to work.
Secondly. Do you believe that medical treatment must ethically obtain fully informed patient consent wherever possible, or do you believe that patient consent is a violable nice to have.
Why should I answer questions when you’re twisting my words?
Herd immunity breaks down when it dips below a certain level. This is evidenced in practice in the U.S. recently re: outbreaks of measles.
Any way, you’re completely shit at science CV so not surprised at your confusion.
http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/lawrence-solomon-the-untold-story-of-measles
Several decades following the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate rose, largely because the vaccine made adults, expectant mothers and infants more vulnerable
Early in the last century, measles killed millions of people a year. Then, bit by bit in countries of the developed world, the death rate dropped, by the 1960s by 98% or more. In the U.K., it dropped by an astounding 99.96%. And then, the measles vaccine entered the market
After the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate continued to drop into the 1970s. Many scientists credit the continued decline entirely to the vaccine. Other scientists believe the vaccine played a minor role, if that, noting that most infectious diseases similarly petered out during the 20th century, including some, like scarlet fever, for which vaccines were never developed.
The credit for the century-long decline, scientists generally agree, goes to improved nutrition and improved health care, side effects of the West’s growing affluence. In the U.S., the death rate dropped by about 98%, from about 10 per 100,000 population a century ago to one fifth of one person by 1963, the year measles vaccines made their American debut. Both before and after vaccination started, victims tended to be poor
‘If you really want to know just how ignorant Lawrence Solomon is about vaccines, all you have to do is to take a look at this:
The CDC credits the vaccine with the elimination of measles deaths, but measles deaths ended a decade before the vaccine was in widespread use across the U.S., and deaths had all but ended prior to the first child receiving a shot. While the vaccine can perhaps take modest credit for accelerating the decline in the mid-1960s, it is a stretch to claim that eradication would not have occurred without the vaccine, particularly since the 20th century also saw the die-off of diseases like scarlet fever, for which no vaccine was ever developed.
This is an incredibly intellectually dishonest antivaccine talking point, so intellectually dishonest that it shocks me that anyone with half a brain can seriously argue it. Let’s just put it this way: Anyone who pulls out this tired old dishonest trope is so intellectually bankrupt that I don’t really feel obligated to do anything other than link to a post I did a long time ago about this trope, which I derogatorily labeled the “vaccines didn’t save us” lie.
It’s amazing that in 2014 the same old long discredited antivaccine tropes have found a new mouthpiece, but they have. And that mouthpiece is Lawrence Solomon. It’s not “conservative skepticism” that is falling short. It’s Lawrence Solomon. Sadly, it’s not surprising.’
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/07/07/a-conservative-failure-of-skepticism-over-vaccines/
Doc you have too much riding on your methods and practices and so you stick to your guns because that is all you have…
Q. Care to contest the graph ?
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2015/04/24/4222316.htm
The move to an artificially created vaccine for whooping cough is behind an increase in cases of the deadly disease in the US, a new study suggests.
The findings highlight the need to do similar research in Australia where whooping cough cases have spiralled upward in the past decade, co-author Associate Professor Manoj Gambhir, from the University of Monash, says.
According to the authors of the study
“These results demonstrate that the resurgence in pertussis in the U.S. can be explained by past changes in vaccination policy. However, the authors’ findings also suggest that the efficacy of the currently-used acellular vaccine, while lower than that of the whole-cell vaccine, is not much lower (around 80% protection for the first three doses of acellular vaccine versus 90% for whole-cell), and booster doses may be sufficient to curtail epidemics while novel vaccine research continues.”
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make.
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make
I believe people who accept the use of terms such as ‘doses’ and ‘booster shots’ when attempting to explain or accepting the manufactured explanation of ‘herd immunity’ are void of logical reasoning
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
Q. Do you realise you just illustrated my belief – ‘void of logical reasoning’?
Q Do you realise you’re an ill informed anti vax troll
…ill-informed anti vax tr*ll who cites Big Pharma funded research and appeals to the authority of Big Pharma funded scientists.
Like a clown, only boring and lame.
Further illogical reasoning from an alleged medical ‘professional’
That you don’t / won’t /can’t recall previous conversations which you and I have been involved in where I stated openly and succinctly my position causes me greater concern for any patients you have may have treated
I have called you out on your ‘bed side manner’ previously and you have shown it once again with an irrational abusive comment
Forgetful illogical abusive and egocentric are not desirable traits of those in the medical profession
To refresh your memory – I am anti compulsion and pro informed consent
@ The murphy troll
1. I am pro informed consent also.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
@ The murphy troll
That you believe I am a trolll serves only to enforce my understanding of your state of mind
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
You should proof read before you post comments not that it would assist with the glaring contradictions you repeatedly make
@ The Murphy Troll
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
A. Yes
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
A. yes I can… this site also has a very good search engine.
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
No because there are some who can read and comprehend english and accept the position I have stated previously including again to you today
What should leave no doubt is your lack of acknowledgement / appreciation of side effects adverse reactions and deaths caused by the ‘drug industry’ of which vaccination is a component sponsored by the the FDA / CDC
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
Stop projecting and start using the search engine you referred to
See if the search engine can tell you how many people in the USA alone die each year due to the ‘medical industry’ approved drugs in particular that are ‘approved’ by the FDA
Q. FDA approved drugs kill / injure [ ] people per year in the USA ?
Q. How many of your patients do you inform such easily identified statistics of before you prescribe /administer chemicals to them ?
Credentials indeed
@ The murphy troll
Oh no the chemicals the chemicals !!
Just a little something to get the murphey troll frothing…
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11447327
No doubt it is all a plot by the FDA and CDC ..
Oh no the chemicals the chemicals !!
You claim to be a medical professional yet post and comment like an illiterate
Q. What is the pupose of the link ?
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
You appear to still have no idea of what ‘herd immunity’ is or how it is achieved
Hint: You wont find it through vaccination
Hint2: Doses / Boosters
Summary:
A non event article which provides no useful information and appears to serve no purpose whatsoever
Bravo
@The murphey troll
Q. What is the pupose of the link ?
A: To get you frothing
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Summary:
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
A: To get you frothing
Not only do you not understand ‘herd immunity’ which as an alleged medical professional is shameful but you do not even understand the even simpler definition of ‘trolll’
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
You either can’t read or you don’t comprehend the position I take has been stated very clearly to you on multiple occasions
Indications are you’re experiencing some sort of mental incapacity which is what I referred to earlier
Either way I hope you are no longer practicing and if you are I would suggest someone lodge a complaint to have your license removed for the public good
You should be struck off with the exhibition you put in through your comments
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Yet you chose not to link to it then use a weak attempt at transference about getting me frothing – Oh dear
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
WOW……You are disqualified as if you weren’t already
@ The MT
😆 and 🙄
No I haven’t Draco. I’ve had conversations with pro-vaxxers on this site where I’ve made the argument that the govt should be putting effort into reaching people who would otherwise vaccinate but don’t due to poverty, inability to access, lack of awareness etc, instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes. And that argument has been supported. In fact the NZ govt has processes in place that allow people to opt out. That’s because the very small numbers (maybe 3% at a guess) who consciously choose to not vaccinate via an education process don’t matter.
But I don’t really want to go another round on this. The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
There’s no such thing as choosing not to vaccinate from informed consent. If you’re properly informed you choose to vaccinate. It really is that simple. Choosing not to vaccinate from ‘informed consent’ ends up with shit like this happening:
and this:
These points are actually why I’m for compulsory vaccination. It bypasses the ignorance that some people confuse for being informed, protects those that can’t be immunised and prevents political parties from attacking minority groups for political point scoring.
“Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.”
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory. And like I said, my point was about what it means to target groups of people by class. I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
What abstract theory are you talking about?
And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop. At which point I think I’ll just point you to this comment from OAB.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
Go do some more reading
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2015/04/24/4222316.htm
I’m not quite sure why an avowed anti-Big Pharma activist is citing Dr. Manoj Gambhir, given his close ties to the medical establishment and career-long support for vaccination programs. Under any other circumstances they’d be howling about his (wholly imagined) corruption and bias.
It smacks of desperation. Probably dishonesty, too.
“And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop”
Yep, and I call that facism.
@ OAB The murphy troll continues to demonstrate his stupidity for all to see.
He is very unlike Weka who wishes to engage in a reasonable manner.
on the matter of pertussis vaccine it has always been one of the more problematic bacteria to get a strong and long lasting immune response to it with vaccines which is why researchers continue to try and look for improvements. It’s a hideous illness to contract in the very young and even in teens/adults can hang about for a long time.
Most of us are probably due for a booster.
http://www.australianprescriber.com/magazine/32/2/36/8
@The Murphey
You should probably read that article yourself as it has nothing to do with what I said.
@OAB
That seems to be an Ad Hominem rather than an argument.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
@Draco – nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
@Draco – nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
Your interpretation is incorrect as well as senseless
If you applied even simplistic reasoning you should be able to work out why
@Draco – to be clear, it was a response to TM’s citation of the Gambhir study.
The Murphey, 7th March: the fraudulent and corrupt practices of the pharmaceutical and vaccine industry
The Murphey, 10th May: *cites a Big Pharma funded study conducted by Big Pharma employees*
QED.
The Murphey, 7th March: the fraudulent and corrupt practices of the pharmaceutical and vaccine industry
The Murphey, 10th May: *cites a Big Pharma funded study conducted by Big Pharma employees*
Comprehension is as weak as your interpretations and logic are
Q. What is it you are seeking to prove / disprove exactly ?
😆
Proof is what Mathematicians do. I’m just calling attention to your tactics.
I’m just calling attention to your tactics
Q. What is it you are seeking to achieve in doing so ?
@OAB
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
I agree that compulsion has negative overtones that will get some peoples backs up. Better education can certainly help but, as the anti-vaxxers have shown, even that will be taken badly by some people.
Then you need to be clear about that reference to The Murphy and others.
Thing is, what you said came across as an Ad Hominem against Gambhir while the study itself and its findings seemed quite reasonable.
@DtB I see what you mean – I’d hoped to avoid that by putting ‘wholly imagined’ in parentheses, and the links to ‘Big Pharma’ are only defamatory if you buy into that narrative.
Still, it was unclear.
Don’t use carrots/sticks that rely on class, e.g. benefits.
Heck, carrots/sticks are a bad way to go anyway – personally I’d ban the advertising of prescription meds, and take a damned close look at the boundary between “alternative” therapies and “practising medicine without a license”, and make “doctor” a restricted title, alongside public nuisance/recklessness charges against purveyors of some of the more dishonest anti-vax propaganda.
IMO the problem isn’t the number of nutters, it’s the avenues they have for publicity and claiming equivalence with legitimate researchers.
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party ..
Can clarification be sought as to who exactly comprised this collective group of people called “the party” who had put together the submission?
I will ask friends and workmates who are NZLP members as to whether they are indeed “the party” who were *party* to that submission.
If you look at Andrew Little’s twitter you will see this is not Labour Party policy and not something he supports. The submission is from Tim Barnett and I don’t know how it went through. If this is Tim’s idea then he is in the wrong job IMO. This is an appalling idea and reeks of beneficiary bashing.
Fine to have enrolment forms to give out at government offices, but starving people into submission is not acceptable. If you want the poor to vote then maybe you should make sure your policies address their needs.
I hope Mr Barnett will face consequences for publicly putting his foot in his party’s mouth. Need way better message discipline than that. NZ does not need another party suggesting right-wing policies. He’s welcome to resign and join another which does, if it’s important to him.
Tim is way brighter than to propose this off his own back. I suspect this is someone else’s brainfart. And a brainfart it is …
Interesting. Hope that person is visibly disciplined then. You guys really cannot afford any more of this.
so how come this brainfart ended up in the herald, again making the labour party look like the party of brainfarts?
really,
can someone speak to the guys in the party that have any say and make it clear to them that brainfarts are not helpful, and should only be uttered in the confines of ones most private room?
please
thanka
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party
Dim-post, some time ago, still on the money:
I just saw that. WTF are they thinking. Demanding that people behave in certain ways because they receive some state support paves the way for more right wing “do as I say” tactics.
Receiving some form of state support doesn’t give governments the right to run anyone’s life and feeds the meme that state support identifies reckless, lazy, uncaring people who need to be told what to do. Where is the evidence that supports this ? Why don’t they target the asset rich tax dodger who is also living off their fellow taxpayer and is selfish uncaring etc etc.
Oh and this is likely to alienate women
Can’t they spell stupid
It’s not ‘tactics’. It’s the law. Enrolment is compulsory in NZ and it makes sense for the government to try and enforce that law at a point at which they interact with the wilfully non enrolled. Enrolling is easy. Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Having said that, there is clearly going to be a minority who don’t want to enrol for compelling reasons. Visa overstayers, for example.
i actually see that proposal as a potent-example of the authoritarian-left running out of control…
..a w.t.f..!
It may be the law but when people are so disenchanted and disinterested (or dodging debt collectors or abusive spouses) that they don’t bother compulsion is only going to increase resentment. Leave the enforcement to someone else.
Who is ‘someone else’? Both enrolment and benefits are administered by the government. So who else do you have in mind? Contractors?
Maybe I should have said “leave promoting this option to another party”.
And yes it may be the law but at this point, this is policing only one sub group that doesn’t enrol ? Are they even the biggest sub group? Do we know? Why target only this one? What happens if people enrol and don’t keep it up to date? What about people who are dropped off unbeknown to them?
Why not go around the schools and demand that all 17 year olds or university students enrol before they can receive tuition. Or you have to be enrolled to get a drivers licence, WOF, CAR rego, passport, house insurance or if you have an IRD number you have to be enrolled if eligible ? Have a bank account?
All good points. I suspect that this is indeed a target group that figures highly in the non enrolled numbers. Haven’t got time now, but if I get a chance, I’ll see if I can find the full submission and work out what is intended. Might be worth a post.
Thanks TRP – if it’s a goal then a broadbrush rather than specific targeting has to be better.
I imagine this idea has been mooted out of frustration with potential Labour voters who just don’t bother to get on the roll let alone actually vote. However I don’t think its the right way to go about it. Providing an incentive to enroll is a much better idea but how do you do that? You can’t offer money because all the people who have voluntarily enrolled (the bulk of the population) would be up in arms and rightly so.
Some may say the incentive would be in good policies but that ignores the fact that Labour and the Greens have consistently produced policies that would have assisted the poor, the unemployed and those who, for one reason or another, have been left feeling disenfranchised. But the potential recipients don’t even bother to acquaint themselves of such policies.
I guess the answer is acquiring money, money and more money so you can “sell” them to a resistant public. Oh dear…
Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Q. Onerous for whom ?
This is a prevalent kind of comfy authoritarian middle class led Labour thinking, piling requirements on to beneficiaries and the under class so that they will maybe vote for you. And if you don’t comply you get your already miserable benefit taken off you or docked. It’s fucking absurd. But this is what the Labour Party has come to.
Yep. And irrespective of the value of investigating such a policy, the timing is beyond belief. Labour need to be rebuilding trust with voters, and this just undermines that.
Not particularly onerous for ‘The State’ ….
To force people to comply ….
To the demands of ‘The State’ ….
Whatever the demands consist of….
It is ‘The Law’ …..
You want more people voting you give thrm decent people and policies to vote for.
It isnt rocket science.
Seems to have eluded some thus far
Beneficiaries don’t even vote for Labour anymore so it’s obviously not a ploy to get more votes from us. Just add it to the bashing list.
“Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.”
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous. I’m sure we’ve had this conversation before, and your comment seems either largely ignorant of the realities of some of the most vulnerable people in NZ, or you think the impact on them is worth the gains of the policy. Both are politically unproductive as well as being punitive.
I forgot another sub group above. Why not make people enrol when they go for some form of medical treatment. That costs the state plenty and nothing onerous about signing a form while you wait and wait.
If it is a requirement which applies equally to unenrolled millionaires, then I’m all for it.
and why shouldn’t it? Why just target those on a particular sub group of
state support. And while they are there we could target vaccination measures, contraception for any kids they have that are 16 and over. and all the other welfare indignities. if it’s good enough for one group then it’s good enough for all.
One nation you know..
You could do that, tax all income at %100 if you aren’t enrolled to vote. Makes more sense than the take away the benefit option. At least it is somewhat equitable and not just a stick to hit the vunerable with…
You can’t see your WINZ case officer until you make an appointment. (It’s a security precaution). What do you mean you don’t have money to get the phone or internet connected to make an appointment? See your WINZ case officer to sort that out. You’ll need to make an appointment.
The comfy middle class don’t have a fucking clue on how the other half of NZ live, is the issue.
Exactly – those on a benefit frequently don’t have the resouces to even contact the state
+1000 CV
Ok, so you have an appointment. But I don’t have a car and there’s not cheap public transport and the appointment is during the day when my mate with their car is at work.
Why did you miss your appointment? My kid was sick. Why didn’t you phone? I have no credit on my phone until next pay day.
etc, etc, etc ad nauseum
The list of barriers to what trp said is huge. His ignorance or lack of care on this matter is actually pretty gobsmacking for a leftie.
And once you’ve missed a couple of appointments even for reasons out of your control you get classed as a waste of time and its pretty much all over from there.
Or I have three kids under 5, no child support because father has done a runner , live 5 miles from the nearest library (or maybe in the wilds of the provinces 50 miles) don’t have a mate with a car and there is no public transport.
” You can fill out the ‘forms’ online”
“I don’t have the money for a computer let alone the internet”
“You can use the internet for free at the local library”
“I don’t have money for transport”
“Do you live close enough to walk”
“I am on an ‘invalid’ benefit”
” We will continue to send the paper forms by post”
Catch 22
It’s actually a requirement that beneficiaries have a phone nowadays. This despite the fact that many beneficiaries can’t actually afford a phone. Even topping up a prepay by the minimum of $20 can be daunting.
nope the state benefits should not depend on wether someone has the money to call for an appointment, then find the way to a Winz office (no car could be an issue, busses? cost a lot of money that no benefit caters for, somone to look after the kids – ah just fuck it).
Oh so maybe they could go to a Library and use the computer there? And down load the paperwork to fill out and stuff….? See above, no car, no transport etc etc etc etc etc etc etc
Benefits should be given to people in Need. The only factor that should count in the giving out of benefits to people should be NEED! not an enrollment to the electoral votes.
The people that I know that did not vote the last time, where White, Male, Working, MIddle Class and they could not be fucked!
The ones that I know voted, included the mother on a 0 hour contract and winz benefits. The elderly lady that paid herself a taxi to get to vote, the rumanian migrants and so on and so on.
Again the ones that did not vote, white, working, male, middleclass and a can’t be arsed or fucked attitude. Go figure.
hi trp, can you or anyone else enlighten me as to why enrollment is compulsory?
cheers.
Once again – I just have to let you all know that probably what Tim Barnett was saying is NOT Labour Party policy, nor do I ever think it will be Labour Party policy, and they would not be stating its Labour Party policy.
Whoever it was putting up that submission was merely making a suggestion to the select committee.
I think the basic point is this: a comment from the general secretary :
“” <> “”
and it is not at all clear from that Herald story as to who in the Labour Party might have made such a submission – but it is quite clear that Tim Barnett is saying this is NOT a current LP policy, but its something other countries are doing and is this something NZ should look at. A question. Not a recommendation.
Its bad enough when the MSM twists things that Labour people say – its blinkin’ lousy when supposedly leftwing posters on The Standard do it too.
i wd submit that a component of a labour party ‘ submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee’…
..is not a matter of no significance…
(or are you saying it is..?..)
and how exactly is the reporting of this fact of this submission..’twisting things”..?
..this is what the submission – by the labour party (authored by whoever..?..won’t the proud parent stand up..?..)- to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee..said..
..and the comparison with australia – used by barnett – is putting the cart before the horse/comparing apples and oranges.. – as aust has compulsory-voting..we don’t..
..and jenny – if national were proposing something like this – would you not be protesting that..?..in this forum..?
Oops – dunno what happened to it, but my post above didn’t include the Barnett quote – about it being just a question to the committee, a request to investigate it – and that it is NOT Labour policy.
This is what he said. (And incidentally, I don’t agree with him on this matter, and I bet heaps of other Labour people don’t either !)
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Why would we want to follow the policies of a country that elected someone who might be related to a 20th century family called Abbottini, neighbours of Mussolini?
this is now the lead-story on the herald online..
..isn’t that great publicity for labour..?..(these things stick in peoples’ minds..)
and i think my original question:..’is this a brain-fart’?..
has been answered..in the affirmative..
not a brain fart but a testing of the waters
why “test” polluted “waters”..?
please..!..tell me what you think is possibly ‘good’ about this idea..?
..tell me how it is not just a total authoritarian brain-fart..
did I say anything was good about it?
you test waters to see what the reaction is going to be like and then adjust your plans accordingly – and to ensure there is no further misunderstanding from you – I do not like the idea or the ideology behind it – I hope that is sufficient for an understanding, of what i am saying, from you.
Its not a brain-fart PU – from any official Labour Party policy or statement.
It was just one person’s comment.
Can you please get that into your head. refer to my post at 12.2
it wasn’t “just a comment”..j.k..
..it was a labour party submission to a select committee..
..there is a difference..eh..?
I miss the good old days when Labour said good/constructive things would happen that would benefit people’s lives, and then shortly afterwards, they did. When did it get so muddled and complicated? Is there any way we could go back to that kind of politics?
Yeah yeah I know, things have “changed” and only “dinosaurs” want clear policy statements or action anymore. Hooray for TXTSPK and rumours… mumble mumble…
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.
Getting the vote out is a priority for Labour and in its submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee, written by Labour’s general secretary Tim Barnett, the party argues for the idea to be considered.”
http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
It makes it pretty clear who made the submission…if the Herald got it wrong….sue them.
If this is even remotely a Labour policy…well…ffs…has Labour gone all “club them and drag em by the hair” on us?
For some people…not voting is a concious action.
A declaration that there are none worth voting for.
Perhaps….non voting and non enrollment should be seen as a criticism of the whole godamn political circus.
Those who would rule should do better.
maybe such confusion would not be coming up if the supposed leftwing party of New Zealand would finally come up with something that would exite people.
You know….like building houses for young people so they can get married and have kids. ( i know of a few couples that would love to rent a nice place to start their lifes together, alas they are not making enough to cover $ 2200 per month before any expenses or food).
You know…. like promoting long tenancies in private rentals so that families with kids could send their kids to THE ONE SCHOOL for like two years in a row, instead of having to pack up and move about ever friggin 6 month.
You know…..like upping the benefits for unemployed, single parents, the young ones etc etc etc could have a phone to phone WINZ for an appointment and eat….I know its a novelty.
I only want Labour to speak about these things…not about finding a way to punish the already punished for not being on the electoral roll….
How does Labour suppose to punish those not on the roll and not on a benefit? Like National punishes Tax Evader? With even bigger loopholes?
ffs…this is why no one is bothering to Labour and some of their die hard supporters anymore, because of some fuckwit that wants to out do Paula Bennett.
http://ecosalon.com/25-percent-of-cars-cause-90-percent-of-air-pollution-study-finds/
It’s poor people driving which causes the problems. Ban them from the roads.
I’d also like to see rich people who drive Hummers and Porsche cayenne’s banned.
#buildroadsboosteconomy
If roads weren’t so rough, the older engines wouldn’t work so hard. Resurface all roads to be glass smooth.
I hadn’t really considered that until I started riding my bike. On that I can feel the rough roads slowing me down, making it harder.
It’s not banning poor people, but banning older vehicles. Sure, that will impact on poor people most under current conditions but we should be questioning if everyone should have a car anyway as doing so costs so much. Or perhaps that should be a question of if anyone should have cars.
A government with guts would make it law that all personal cars would be electric in 10/15 years. Just have to put ruc charges on them to pay for the roads.
Need to go to RUCs on all vehicles anyway so as to kill the subsidies that trucks get from cars.
I’m looking at heat exchange from brick paved back yards.
Wikipedia on geothermal energy is interesting. What other countries do to use this for domestic use rather than just industrial as we do is interesting. (I don’t think Maori use, which extends back centuries is being counted here.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_heating
This is the sort of thing that progressive, thoughtful, and smart countries are doing to use technology that could be thought of as green and sustainable.
The cities of Reykjavík and Akureyri pipe hot water from geothermal plants under roads and pavements to melt snow. Geothermal desalination has been demonstrated.
Geothermal systems tend to benefit from economies of scale, so space heating power is often distributed to multiple buildings, sometimes whole communities.
This technique, long practiced throughout the world in locations such as Reykjavík, Iceland,[5] Boise, Idaho,[6] and Klamath Falls, Oregon[7] is known as district heating.[8] Turkey seems to be high in this use.
Background –
” Most high temperature geothermal heat is harvested in regions close to tectonic plate boundaries where volcanic activity rises close to the surface of the Earth. In these areas, ground and groundwater can be found with temperatures higher than the target temperature of the application….
even cold ground contains heat, below 6 metres (20 ft) the undisturbed ground temperature is consistently at the Mean Annual Air Temperature[3] and it may be extracted with a heat pump.”…
“Direct geothermal heating is far more efficient than geothermal electricity generation and has less demanding temperature requirements, so it is viable over a large geographical range.
If the shallow ground is hot but dry, air or water may be circulated through earth tubes or downhole heat exchangers which act as heat exchangers with the ground.”
Buggered if I can find it but I recall reading about a project in either Germany or The Netherlands using roads to heat houses.
Found this though.
http://www.icax.co.uk/asphalt_solar_collector.html
Try this link – there’s loads of info in the WWW on this topic: http://www.solaroad.nl/en/faq/
@ swordfish (above) went to sincil bank in February-saw the imps lose to chester 1-0.
Looking at an old BBC History magazine I saw they were recalling an earlier September attack on New York than 2001. This was in 1920 when ‘a cart packed with explosives was detonated’ outside the headquarters of JP Morgan. The perpetrators,causing 38 deaths, were never confirmed but may have been followers of the Italian anarchist Luigi Galleani.’
The site 23 Wall Street still bears the shrapnel scars of 90 years ago.
War and Peace and the Steady-State Economy
In fact, that latter bit is inevitable. There’s no real difference between and the feudal society that preceded it. both are about putting a few people above everyone else in wealth and power and having everyone else pay for it.
Shakes head in disbelief….
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.”
Yup. And is being discussed above at 12 and 13.
Is Labour, or rather the hierarchy (cf. membership), trying immensely hard at working, full steam ahead and on the offensive, on connecting with ‘voters’ ?
Whatever was said in that select committee meting, tinfoilhat and Kiwiri – that is NOT Labour policy, nor has anyone raised it as a possible Labour policy.
Forget about the UK. Worry about us.
Labour is going 1984 again.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
As if National is not punishing beneficiaries enough already.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11445665
It predates the internet (so hard to find links), but i remember Roger Douglas doing pretty much exactly the same thing.
IN 1984 we were taken unawares and they hid the economic agenda behind the antinuclear credentials. If they do the same again what are they going to fob us off with to try to pretend to be a Labour party.
It’s good of you to run with The Herald‘s framing of the issue. When they say “proposed”, what exactly did Labour say?
So, not “proposed” then.
come on oan..!..don’t give us the raw prawn..
..it was indeed ‘proposed’..in a labour party submission to the electoral reform select committee..
..and we have the party secretary seemingly pimping it to the media..
..so it was ‘proposed’..with bells on…eh..?
Yes, Phil, people who want to spin it in a negative light (something you and The Herald have in common) will spin it in a negative light.
As Chomsky says, the key is to severely limit the areas that can be discussed, and allow robust discussion withing those narrow constraints.
Bravo.
please do enlighten us with the ‘positive’ aspects of this pile of steaming shit of an idea..
..i am not the only one seeming to be unable to see them..
..do bring us up to speed..
..and nothing is being ‘spun’..
..this is a proposal in a labour party submission to a parliamentary select committee..
..what are you finding so difficult to understand about that..?
..i am not spinning it..i am seriously slagging it..
..for the piece of shite idea it is..
..and i am gobsmacked that it got that far through the labour party internal processes..without someone ring alarm bells..
..so many bloody questions raised with just that..
..it only took me a nano-second to smell the rot..
..who/which grouping within labour think this is a ‘goer’..?
..and pushed it through..?
..are there no internal checks and balances within labour..?
That’s the way: it’s important to confine all ideas to the ones you approve of, and a good way to do that is to pretend discussion of outliers is exactly the same as supporting them.
Nice one.
As for the merits of the proposal. I think that before penalising non-enrolled voters, we should penalise anyone who adopts a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.
“…a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.”
The expression “political suicide” comes to mind.
Godallmighty….this is so depressing…
+1 PU.
I can’t imagine how this appalling idea got to the submission stage. It may not be current policy, or even likely to become policy, but the idea that someone in a senior position in the Labour Party should even consider it is a good idea is beyond me. Very, very damaging.
it will be used in parliament as a routine by the right..against labour..
No evidence Barnett sought coverage. Media will have been covering the committee, and the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.
“…the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.”
You’d think, wouldn’t you?
Maybe someone in the Labour Party is really smart…or thinks he/she is?
There seem more than a few in there who are not as smart as they believe. I wish they would get out of the way.
Not that I agree with the proposal to look at the idea (or maybe I do – seems logical to look at things that may provide the desired outcome) but it’s not in the realms of beneficiary bashing is it?
I thought working for families was an employment-related payment?
i just saw this tweet..
“..Sam Lotu-Iiga quoted Nelson Mandela as he opened a private prison run by a company with a terrible human rights record & I wish I was joking..”
It’s worth taking a look at the comments on this crazy website National have set up to somehow try and get populous buy-in of this change the flag diversion.
http://www.standfor.co.nz/#entries
Roughly 3/5 comments disagree with the proposed change altogether. This could turn into another Northland type misfire for Key and another nail in his coffin.
Something I hadn’t considered is raised by this comment:
“…the government tell us the cost to change the flag is $26,000,000 for referendum but the cost to change every flag in every school, building, businesses, NZ Army uniforms, vehicles, NZ Police, NZ Navy the list would be endless – it’s a joke. $26 million is only the start”
good point sage..!
..chrs 4 the heads-up…
The archdruid has been very provocative over his last few posts I have thought but the logic is inescapable and like all great writers with ideas he presents them with a style and content that I find complete and beautiful.
http://thearchdruidreport.blogspot.co.nz/2015/05/the-whisper-of-shutoff-valve.html
There’s pictures on John Key’s facebook page of him handling a puppy and showing it to Prince Harry https://www.facebook.com/pmjohnkey
Kinda weird.. is it that hair/fur thing again..