Open Mike 20/07/2018

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1. Ad 1

   20 July 2018 at 6:58 am

   Here’s the text of the new Israeli “Jewish Nation State Law”, covered in RNZ this morning.

   https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Read-the-full-Jewish-Nation-State-Law-562923

   I would actually donate to get Netanyahu out.
   • Cinny 1.1

     20 July 2018 at 8:21 am

     Cheers for the link Ad, have been following via Al Jaz.

     We’ve boycotted HP products at our house for years now, our way of donating to get bibi out of power. 🙂

     The more people that boycott HP….. snowballs… check this out 🙂

     
     Hewlett Packard (HP) Faces $120 Million in Potential Losses Due to its Complicity in Israel’s Violations of Palestinian Human Rights
     June 12, 2018

     Four million-strong Indian student federation joins the BDS movement & pledges to boycott HP
2. AsleepWhileWalking 2

   20 July 2018 at 8:08 am

   https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2018/07/exclusive-housing-crisis-stalls-govt-s-plan-to-double-refugee-quota.html

   Finally someone talking sense.
   • DH 2.1

     20 July 2018 at 8:58 am

     He is talking sense, it’s a pity no-one is talking the same sense on immigration.

     I’ve been wondering for a while how many state houses have been used for housing refugees and what percentage have stayed long term. I’d expect refugee families at least to be given a state house, they have no job or income to pay market rents.

     For every state house used to home refugees the Crown should have been building one more just to maintain the housing stock levels for domestic demand.
   • cd 2.2

     20 July 2018 at 9:05 am

     Why not re-open resettlement in Christchurch when we have no shortage of houses here?
   • marty mars 2.3

     20 July 2018 at 9:23 am

     It seems like more neolibs me me mentality. Not enough houses is utter bullshit – how about setting that people can only have 3 max houses – oh no that will stop the profiteering. Meanwhile PEOPLE who are refugees are put on hold. I’m ashamed of this backtrack and those that want to put the boot into helpless people. SHAME. SHAME. SHAME!
     • McFlock 2.3.1

       20 July 2018 at 1:03 pm

       Well, he said “predominantly” housing. Everything else is newshrub projection.

       But if that’s politician code for “I think so but I won’t be caught out if I equivocate a little bit”, +1 your comment 🙂
3. Cinny 3

   20 July 2018 at 8:11 am

   That was amusing. mark richardson had a little tanty on the telly because James Shaw told him Greens would never work with national.
   • Sanctuary 3.1

     20 July 2018 at 8:48 am

     Entitled middle class male throws a tanty when he can’t see a way to power?

     Colour me surprised!

     Mark Richardson has got quite bitter since Jacinda wagged her finger at him and stylishly humiliated his machismo.
     • AB 3.1.1

       20 July 2018 at 9:50 am

       There’s that.
       But also among Nat voters there’s a genuine perplexity as to why the Greens think this way. Most of the Nats I know consider themselves ‘environmentalists’ – which basically means that they are keen to preserve nice places for well-off people and tourists to use as playgrounds. And that it’s OK to compromise non-scenic stuff like lowland rivers to keep the economy growing because nobody (or nobody like them) really goes there or cares.
       It’s quite old-fashioned, how most of us thought actually when we mobilised 50 years ago to save Manapouri.

       Notions of the sustainability of all human activity – and the economic relations between people that might be needed to guarantee that sustainability – don’t really figure.
       • DH 3.1.1.1

         20 July 2018 at 11:19 am

         This might give you a chuckle AB;

         https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/105550076/exclusive-marlborough-sounds-holiday-jetty-must-be-open-to-everyone

         The guy is getting an absolute hammering in the comments section, it’s quite pleasing to see how many people understood what it was really about.
       • lprent 3.1.1.2

         20 July 2018 at 12:26 pm

         They are called ‘conservatives’ for a reason.

         In this case between the words ‘conservation’ (aka the late 19th century and early 20th idea about national parks to provide juice places to do.paintings jn) and that of ‘enviromentalism’ which looks forward to potential problems.

         Hell I think that many of the right wing greenies hark back to the ideas of the royal and state reserves. Places to allow the growth of trees for the navy.
     • Puckish Rogue 3.1.2

       20 July 2018 at 11:14 am

       Well when you consider the kermadecs sanctuary, water bottling, cameras on boats and mining with a dolphin sanctuary then yeah it does make sense to question why the Greens wouldn’t consider a deal with National
       • Draco T Bastard 3.1.2.1

         20 July 2018 at 12:05 pm

         Greens won’t deal with National because National has a) a tendency to lie, b) a tendency to pass law that only benefits the rich, and c) passes law that damages the environment (ETS undermining for a prime example).

         And National are then surprised that people with an actual set of ethics won’t deal with them.
         • Puckish Rogue 3.1.2.1.1

           20 July 2018 at 12:18 pm

           Good thing that neither Labour or NZFirst lie, pass laws that benefit the rich or pass laws that damage the environment then isn’t it

           You could argue that the Greens could have gotten a much better deal with National given that National had no other options
           • Stuart Munro 3.1.2.1.1.1

             20 July 2018 at 12:32 pm

             Except that National would lie so much any deal would be meaningless.
             • Puckish Rogue …

               20 July 2018 at 12:35 pm

               In which case the Greens could claim bad faith from National and there’d be another election and the general population would not look favourably on National
               • Stuart Munro …

                 20 July 2018 at 12:42 pm

                 Small parties die if they’re that stupid.

                 It’s taken Winston twenty years to recover from supporting Bolger and thus providing a path to power for the execrable Shipley junta.

                 Case in point the Maori Party. Their supporters didn’t blame the Gnats – they deserted the folk who had failed them.
           • Draco T Bastard 3.1.2.1.1.2

             20 July 2018 at 12:41 pm

             I’ve never seen Labour purposefully lie. Make mistakes – sure. NZFirst, well, they are populists.

             The Greens will never get a good deal from National because of National’s lack of ethics.
             • Bewildered …

               20 July 2018 at 5:07 pm

               Great you have forgiven Roger Douglas then DTB
4. Sanctuary 4

   20 July 2018 at 8:34 am

   The Guardian really is a bit of cock over Brexit, it’s determination to be fanatically pro remain, anti-Corbyn and the voice of pink neoliberals everywhere means it is publishing increasing hilarious and hysterical anti-Brexit stories, like this one –

   https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/18/dairy-products-may-become-luxuries-after-uk-leaves-eu

   and this one from last year –

   https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jul/17/uk-sleepwalking-into-food-insecurity-after-brexit-academics-say

   without the faintest understanding that prior to the UK’s entry to the common market and Common Agricultural Policy the UK had a major competitive edge over Europe with cheap food prices from deals for efficiently produced food with countries in their old empire like NZ. I am pretty sure NZ, Australia and Canada can replace European dairy products with a product of the same or better quality and at better price. And the idea that buying food produced in NZ is somehow going to lower standards of food safety would strike anyone who compares the food quality in both countries as ridiculous.

   Someone needs to grab the Guardian by the shoulders and slap it.

   From New Zealand’s point of view we should see Brexit as a massive opportunity to get back unfettered access to a market of 65 million rich consumers who like dairy and meat. The biggest advantage of diversifying our export markets to somewhere like the UK is we will no longer be reliant on those authoritarian butchers in Beijing who run China, and we can tell the Chinese to fuck off with impunity.

   Sp from our point of view, all I can say is long live a hard Brexit!!!
   • Dennis Frank 4.1

     20 July 2018 at 10:45 am

     I agree with all that. Brexit wouldn’t have happened if the Eurocrats hadn’t gone empire-building, but instead hewed to the common-interest basis of the union design that was floated as the rationale at the time. When the reality got sufficiently divergent from the dream, the Brits woke up.

     Whether the economics of trade between us & Britain gets back on a semblance of the colonial track post-Brexit is an interesting question. A soft Brexit seemed feasible, given that politics is the art of compromise, so it might hinge on how the cost of sending our stuff over there weighs up against any Euro tarriffs that kick in. People think market forces prevail over politicians, but history renders a mixed verdict.

     Totally with you re independence from China. Free Tibet!!
   • Augustus 4.2

     20 July 2018 at 11:31 am

     You may be right about food quality in terms of what reaches the table, but if you consider environmental impact of getting milk products from New Zealand to Britain, not so much. Firstly, you add some 20,000 “carbon-km” to everything. And even worse, your “efficiently produced” food is efficient because it doesn’t account for environmental cost to our rivers and lowlands. I’ve traveled through much of western Europe and nowhere have I seen rivers in the state they are in here, with dairy cows standing in them. Or fertiliser flung 100 m into the air from a truck.
     Just this morning I’ve observed the dairy farmer down the road burn his plastic silage wrappers, huge cloud of black smoke all over the valley. And guess what? It’s not actually illegal to do so.
     So no, the absolute last thing we need here is more dairy exports.
     • Draco T Bastard 4.2.1

       20 July 2018 at 12:09 pm

       +111

       Our farming isn’t efficient – it’s massively polluting with the costs not being appropriately applied as needed in a market economy.
5. Robert Guyton 5

   20 July 2018 at 9:05 am

   “Elephants don’t step on jungle crickets” (The Southland Times)
   Winston Peters’ spokesperson when asked why he wouldn’t bother responding to the grizzles of Southland National Party MPs.
   • Puckish Rogue 5.1

     20 July 2018 at 9:09 am

     They are scared of mice though:

     https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oA77tVNKtc
     • Robert Guyton 5.1.1

       20 July 2018 at 9:29 am

       Winston’s not scared of anything, it seems.
       • Puckish Rogue 5.1.1.1

         20 July 2018 at 9:31 am

         I’d suggest that the one thing Winston is scared of is being considered irrelevant
         • Robert Guyton 5.1.1.1.1

           20 July 2018 at 9:36 am

           Given that he’s now Acting Prime Minister, I think he’s dealt with his fears pretty well!
           • Puckish Rogue 5.1.1.1.1.1

             20 July 2018 at 9:41 am

             That he has, temporarily, but eventually he’ll become irrelevant and then what does he do?

             Like how for some wealthy people they’ll never have enough money so they’re never truly happy I think that’s where Winston is, he’ll never be truly happy because he’ll never be able to hold onto long enough what he really wants

             Or not
             • Robert Guyton …

               20 July 2018 at 9:54 am

               We’ll all become irrelevant, Pucky, if we’re not already. Everything in life is temporary; are you struggling with the impermanence of life? You sound as though the issue is live with you.
               • Puckish Rogue …

                 20 July 2018 at 10:09 am

                 I’ve come to terms with the fact that, ultimately, I am essentially completely irrelevant in the scheme of things

                 Once I’m gone it’ll probably only be two or three generations before anyone knows I was ever lived have passed away and even those generations will only comprise of a handful of people

                 I’m also all good with that
                 • mac1 …

                   20 July 2018 at 10:48 am

                   Puckish Rogue, like Shakespeare you too can achieve fame beyond the generations that knew you. Keep writing those paeans of praise, those anthems of unspoken but articulate unrequited love, those poems plighting your troth to Judith, the Fair Lady. In art is immortality!
                   • Puckish Rogue …

                     20 July 2018 at 10:59 am

                     Oh don’t worry about that as I’m working on my magnum opus, its going to take awhile I feel but when the time is right I’ll sure it’ll come right

                     Heres what I’ve got so far…”Nah nah nah nah nah nah, nah nah nah”
   • ScottGN 5.2

     20 July 2018 at 9:52 am

     Hi Robert. This is a curve ball question but…the last few years I’ve been getting Pink Fir Apple seed potatoes from the excellent Diacks in Invercargill. They don’t have any this year as it seems it was a poor season last year? They mentioned you as a possible source?? Cheers
     • Robert Guyton 5.2.1

       20 July 2018 at 10:28 am

       Hi Scott – our own supply of Pink Fir is low also. You could call the Environment Centre and ask if they have a few in their seed collection, but it’ll be only for multiplication (032348717) office@sces.org.nz
       • ScottGN 5.2.1.1

         20 July 2018 at 10:34 am

         Cheers Robert, thank you. I’ll give them a call. I might have to go with La Ratte instead this year, they’re just a bit miserly on the yield front compared to the bumper crops you get from the PFA!
6. SaveNZ 6

   20 July 2018 at 9:18 am

   Fake employee’s … now you have to pay big bucks to be a ‘non employee’…

   “who buy their vans, pay to have their vans decorated in company colours, pay for their uniforms, scanners and other equipment, and drive for courier companies like Freightways and PBT. ”

   “The drivers are not considered employees, but they cannot drive for other companies, so do not get the protections even the lowest-paid employee enjoys. ”

   https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018654352/nz-post-defends-conditions-for-contract-courier-drivers
   • SaveNZ 6.1

     20 July 2018 at 9:54 am

     Scary stuff – new words to explain how someone who has to pay for and use a company uniform and branding but is not an employee… aka “dependent contractors” Shouldn’t we keep it simple and if they are ‘dependant” and are branded as an employee, they are an employee????

     No wonder the rise in inequality and the top 1% making more and more profits at the expense of those at the bottom and middle (who have to pay taxes to subsidise these immoral employment practises via hardship grants, accomodation supplements and WFF effectively giving over $5000+ a year top ups to minimum wage employers instead of to schools and hospitals and welfare to those who actually need it…

     “And we hear from Workplace Relations minister Iain Lees Galloway, who says the government “needs to find a new set of protocols that apply to these dependent contractors”.”

     Rogernomics 2.0

     http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018654368/we-need-new-protocol-for-dependent-contractors-minister
     • gsays 6.1.1

       20 July 2018 at 2:39 pm

       I have been listening to Campbelltown RNZ @5pm covering this courier/employment story.
       The spokesman from NZ Post was fairly straight with his answers. He ended up painting a grim picture.

       This issue has the potential to grow and help a lot of members in the precariat. Especially with a sympathetic sounding minister in Ian Lees Galloway.
7. SaveNZ 7

   20 July 2018 at 9:24 am

   Possibly ‘jobs’ like these leading to so many people needing hardship assistance top ups…

   “Meanwhile, the figures also show that Work and Income was handing out more hardship assistance grants.

   They increased by more than 50,000 to 321,000 at the end of the June quarter.

   Demand for food assistance has been one of the biggest contributors to the growth in hardship assistance, the ministry said.”

   http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/362193/benefit-sanctions-drop-20-percent-hardship-grants-up
8. marty mars 8

   20 July 2018 at 9:31 am

   Ugly – I think Clark should pull her head in – you have no extra rights just cos of your previous jobs.

   https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12092202
   • Puckish Rogue 8.1

     20 July 2018 at 9:35 am

     It is interesting isn’t it when a former PM wades into situations, like she has every right to but she also wields a lot of influence
     • SaveNZ 8.1.1

       20 July 2018 at 9:56 am

       Called Freedom of Speech.
       • Puckish Rogue 8.1.1.1

         20 July 2018 at 10:31 am

         Thats a topic thats had plenty of airing as of late
   • Carolyn_Nth 8.2

     20 July 2018 at 10:25 am

     Clark is using her previous PM profile, but her opposition to some recent Eden Park moves is because she lives very near the park.

     This article from July 2018 says:

     Public opinion is running six to one in favour of Eden Park’s first-ever proposed concert, as the submission process prepares to close.
     …
     The highest-profile opponent so far is former Prime Minister Helen Clark who lives three blocks away from the stadium.

     She said the trust was using Sir Ray Avery’s charity event as a “Trojan Horse” to help its prospects of being allowed to stage future concerts.

     I live further from Eden Park but in hearing distance, and am not keen on big concerts being stage there. I hear cheers and fireworks from EP quite loudly. I can live with those as they are momentary noises.

     But I can also hear big concerts from Western Springs which is further away. The loudest go on for an hour or two and can drown out anything I am trying to listen to in my flat. Must be unbearable for people living closer.
     • lprent 8.2.1

       20 July 2018 at 12:41 pm

       Yeah. You notice that while they say support is running for it, they don’t divide that into people who have to live with it and those who don’t. After having lived near it for most of my life, Eden Park is just a collosal pain in the arse.

       Western Springs was bad enough for concerts.

       I could frequently hear that when I lived closer.

       These days we get crazy car parking and even worse driving from the big games at Eden Park – and I live up by the end of K Rd kilometers away. Not to mention the drunk fans walking to their cars or the local bars on Ponsonbh or K Rds.

       Basically Eden Park needs to be shut down rather than being expanded. At heb very least they should be required to.provide their own damn multi-story parking buildings. And any license they get should have a short review period so they can be shut down whe yheh fuck up.
   • Draco T Bastard 8.3

     20 July 2018 at 12:22 pm

     So, he engaged in bribery, fraud and general dishonesty as found by the Australian courts.

     Shouldn’t we be sending him back to Australia because he doesn’t meet the Good Character test?

     Clark is right on this.
     • Herodotus 8.3.1

       20 July 2018 at 4:17 pm

       But from my reading he has never been convicted. So he is not guilty of breaking the law, perhaps bad/immoral behaviour but there are most /if not all (bar JC) that are at fault there 😇 it was there something reported that I have missed. Even our current speaker of the house has been found fowl of the law a few times .
9. joe90 9

   20 July 2018 at 9:41 am

   Down the rabbit hole….

   Umm, guys…Robert Mueller just submitted his list of evidence for the Paul Manafort trial and look whose name is all over the first 30 items.Tad Devine. Bernie Sanders' Chief Strategist. pic.twitter.com/EmFMp7dTVB— The Hoarse Whisperer (@HoarseWisperer) July 19, 2018

   https://twitter.com/HoarseWisperer/status/1019970082812940289
   • adam 9.1

     20 July 2018 at 10:16 am

     So the Red scear is alive and well.

     Who would have thought it ah, that the investigation into trump would have ended up attacking socialists and progressives.
     • Bill 9.1.1

       20 July 2018 at 12:03 pm

       Hop skipped and jumped from that twitter thread and landed here…

       Know how I’ve gone on before about mainstream elevating prats like Le Penn or who-ever to scare the horses back to the centre?

       Seems the Democrats deliberately sought to elevate Trump, Cruz or Carson as (what they called) “Pied Piper” candidates with the aim of shoving the Republican Party to the right. Apparently, that would make them unelectable.

       From Salon...(email from Clinton Campaign to the DNC that’s reproduced in the article through the link)
       At the time, there were more than a dozen Republican presidential candidates. The “variety of candidates is a positive here,” the Clinton campaign said.

       “Many of the lesser known can serve as a cudgel to move the more established candidates further to the right,” the memo noted.

       “In this scenario, we don’t want to marginalize the more extreme candidates, but make them more ‘Pied Piper’ candidates who actually represent the mainstream of the Republican Party,” the Clinton campaign wrote.

       As examples of these “pied piper” candidates, the memo named Donald Trump — as well as Sen. Ted Cruz and Ben Carson).

       “We need to be elevating the Pied Piper candidates so that they are leaders of the pack and tell the press to them seriously,” the Clinton campaign concluded.
   • Bill 9.2

     20 July 2018 at 12:51 pm

     Apparently, Tad Devine was/is “one of the Democratic Party’s leading consultants and a former high-level campaign aide to Al Gore, John Kerry, and Michael Dukakis.”

     https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2014/11/11/tad-devine-signs-on-to-work-with-bernie-sanders-on-potential-2016-run/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.2841eb75d409
     • joe90 9.2.1

       20 July 2018 at 1:58 pm

       No matter who’s running, or their convictions one way or the other, US politics is a thoroughly corrupt in game, mired in money.

       A percentage of every advertisement purchased was paid to Old Towne Media and Devine Mulvey Longabough for brokering the media contracts. The latter was run by Sanders’ senior strategist, Tad Devine, who also received a cut for deals brokered through Old Towne. Devine’s cut totaled at least $10 million by the end of May 2016, according to an investigative report by Slate—in addition to over $5 million paid to his firm. (This would be over half a million average donations to the Sanders campaign.)

       http://observer.com/2016/08/this-political-consultant-made-millions-off-of-sanders-campaign/
       • marty mars 9.2.1.1

         20 July 2018 at 2:15 pm

         Yep imo there is no ‘clean’ in politics – just less or more clean in relation to some other politician.
         • Morrissey 9.2.1.1.1

           20 July 2018 at 2:30 pm

           And how “clean” is Barack Obama, in your learned opinion? You seemed upset recently when you were reminded of his actual record.
           • marty mars 9.2.1.1.1.1

             20 July 2018 at 2:42 pm

             As clean as an all black legend son and don’t you forget it.

             You’re sounding ott morrie – it was only 4 comments back you were apologising to me for getting it wrong – take a hike numbnuts.
         • Andre 9.2.1.1.2

           20 July 2018 at 2:36 pm

           Every now and then I muse about what kind of reaction the purity politics preachers would have if any of their heroes ever actually got elected – and then found that either they have to spend most of their time making the same shitty compromises the regular pollies they’re so contemptuous of spend most of their time making or end up achieving precisely nothing.
           • Morrissey 9.2.1.1.2.1

             20 July 2018 at 2:48 pm

             I don’t expect politicians, or anyone else for that matter, to be “pure.” Of course compromise is the life blood of politics.

             What I’m talking about is the commission of massive crimes, such as destroying whole countries, and overseeing horrifying terror campaigns such as the drone assassination programme. Opposing such crimes is not demanding some impossible standard of purity, it’s opposing crime.
             • Andre …

               20 July 2018 at 2:56 pm

               Gotta admit, I didn’t have you in mind as one of the purity politics preachers. You’re just filed under “stupid wanker”.
               • Morrissey …

                 20 July 2018 at 3:01 pm

                 That’s a clever answer. Nothing less is expected from you, my challenged friend.
10. SaveNZ 10

    20 July 2018 at 9:46 am

    “EU antitrust regulators hit Google with a record €4.34 billion ($NZ7.4 billion) fine and ordered it to stop using its Android mobile operating system to block rivals.”

    “Vestager also ordered Google to halt anti-competitive practices with smartphone makers and telecoms providers within 90 days or face additional penalties of up to 5 percent of parent Alphabet’s average daily worldwide turnover.

    The illegal behavior dating back to 2011 includes forcing manufacturers to pre-install Google Search and its Chrome browser together with its Play Store of apps on their devices, paying them to pre-install only Google Search and blocking them from using rival Android systems.

    “Google has used Android as a vehicle to cement the dominance of its search engine. These practices have denied rivals the chance to innovate and compete on the merits,” Ms Vestager said.”

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/business/362137/google-hit-with-record-7-billion-eu-antitrust-fine
11. Anne 11

    20 July 2018 at 9:54 am

    Oh look, Southern and Molyneaux have been granted a visa to enter NZ and spread their venal, hate-filled views. So much for the howling of rage, gnashing of teeth and puerile legal threats/actions from the newly formed Free Speech Coalition – or whatever they call themselves.

    In the name of democracy we allow them to speak – yes. But we don’t have to provide them with forums which were paid for by ratepayers and taxpayers. If they come, I hope other mayors (and their councillors) will follow Phil Goff’s courageous example and refuse them their venues. Let them go private.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12092243
    • SaveNZ 11.1

      20 July 2018 at 10:01 am

      All the outrage drives up the sales. If nobody has done a thing in particular Goff, it would have been better and they would have got no publicity, nobody would have gone and they could have had police stand by if they do actually “incite a riot” and charge them.

      No doubt now, the whole event will be filled with Journo’s reporting their every word and making more publicity for them as well as the legal action which I’m guessing the ratepayers have to pay for…. The councils should stick to providing services for ratepayers and their personal views (and the actions resulting from that) they can fund themselves including the million dollar stadium report, so secret it needed to be kept from the councillors.
      • BM 11.1.1

        20 July 2018 at 10:06 am

        Never heard of these people before Goff put on his dictator hat.
        • Robert Guyton 11.1.1.1

          20 July 2018 at 10:45 am

          Then you should thank Phil Goff, BM, for introducing you to your new bff’s.
        • marty mars 11.1.1.2

          20 July 2018 at 11:12 am

          First they come for the council owned venues, then slightly smaller council owned venues, then your bathroom… the horror, the horror…
      • Anne 11.1.2

        20 July 2018 at 10:11 am

        Southern has been hit with a $A68,000 ($NZ74,000) bill by Victorian police for protecting her Melbourne event…

        …She told Sky News Australia’s Andrew Bolt last night that the police were participants in protests against her because the bill for protection would encourage protests at other events and shut them down.

        Go Victorian police!
        • adam 11.1.2.1

          20 July 2018 at 10:19 am

          Love the conspiracy theory response from Southern. So funny, but oh so predictable.
      • Puckish Rogue 11.1.3

        20 July 2018 at 10:13 am

        Yep this, Goff and the media played completely into their plans, in fact I’d suggest that LS & SM couldn’t have planned this better
        • Carolyn_Nth 11.1.3.1

          20 July 2018 at 10:41 am

          Thre’s a lot of anti-Goff attitudes in attacking Goff’s statements.

          Of course the Canadian couple and their ilk plan to stir up controversy by being provocative in order to attract mainstream media attention.

          I think the time is right for a concerted campaign in support of Auckland’s diversity – carnivals and entertainment at the grass roots.
          • Puckish Rogue 11.1.3.1.1

            20 July 2018 at 11:10 am

            As long as its within the bounds of law (and free speech 😉 ) then thats all good with me
        • marty mars 11.1.3.2

          20 July 2018 at 10:42 am

          What a load of rubbish – are you really that gullible? The splutters and dribbling from their supporters puts paid to that outlandish spin from you puck.
        • Robert Guyton 11.1.3.3

          20 July 2018 at 10:43 am

          Goff has done good service to the people of New Zealand. The wider these views are spread, the greater the derision of those views will be. The tiny audience that would have turned out had Goff’s people not put the kibosh on the venue would have been “the converted” anyway and no-one with an open mind would have had the chance to hear just how awful these two (probably) are 🙂
          • Puckish Rogue 11.1.3.3.1

            20 July 2018 at 10:49 am

            Had Goff not said, or claimed, anything then yeah it probably would have been a small turnout, now it may well be an even bigger turnout thanks to all the free publicity
            • Robert Guyton 11.1.3.3.1.1

              20 July 2018 at 10:58 am

              Yep and sunlight is the best disinfectant. Goff’s done the country a great favour and now many more of us can (perhaps) hear this dribble first hand.
              • marty mars …

                20 July 2018 at 11:01 am

                The righties should be giving Goff a medal – funny how lefties defend him and righties benefit???
              • Puckish Rogue …

                20 July 2018 at 11:05 am

                Thats open-minded of you, I’m basically not really interested in what either of them have to say but I support their right to say it and not have some arbitrary decision made by Goff…or not made by Goff depending on what day it is
                • Robert Guyton …

                  20 July 2018 at 11:20 am

                  Pucky – you’re banging on and on about Goff – it’s not entertaining and makes you look…petty.
                  • Puckish Rogue …

                    20 July 2018 at 11:28 am

                    Well Goff overstepped his boundary, or maybe he didn’t, on this one and at least its got people talking
              • SaveNZ …

                20 July 2018 at 11:43 am

                No sunlight in the redacted billion dollar stadium report that ratepayers and other councillors don’t get to read in full. Plenty of sunlight and publicity for white supremacists. Not sure Goff’s getting his role right.
        • David Mac 11.1.3.4

          20 July 2018 at 11:18 am

          Yep, the most cost effective publicity a circus could hope for is to leave an elephant cage unlatched as they enter town.
          • Puckish Rogue 11.1.3.4.1

            20 July 2018 at 11:23 am

            I was going to post a youtube clip of a Hyena sticking its head up a dead elephants butt to make the point of what I consider the medias involvement in this, and in general, to be (hint its not the elephant) but then I thought it might have got removed
            • marty mars 11.1.3.4.1.1

              20 July 2018 at 11:33 am

              Too much information – what you do and search for is your business as long as living entities don’t get hurt for your pleasure.
              • Puckish Rogue …

                20 July 2018 at 12:02 pm

                Don’t worry, the elephant was very dead
                • marty mars …

                  20 July 2018 at 12:12 pm

                  I don’t wanna know your search criteria or whether it was bookmarked – what happens in your workspace stays in your workspace – unless the courts are involved of course.
                  • Puckish Rogue …

                    20 July 2018 at 12:21 pm

                    🙂
          • Robert Guyton 11.1.3.4.2

            20 July 2018 at 11:32 am

            “or maybe he didn’t”
            Indeed.
            • Puckish Rogue 11.1.3.4.2.1

              20 July 2018 at 12:26 pm

              Well its hard to say, theres this 10.07.18:

              https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/361479/phil-goff-defends-blocking-far-right-speakers-who-spout-racist-nonsense

              ‘He said he made the decision himself in line with council policy which sets out that Auckland is an inclusive society.’

              “I’m not going to aid and abet people who spout racist nonsense by providing them with a venue.”

              Theres this at 20.07.18:

              https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2018/07/group-urges-govt-to-refuse-entry-to-alt-right-speakers.html

              ‘Auckland Live, which runs the Bruce Mason Centre where the event was scheduled to take place, said the event was cancelled due to “security concerns” around the “health and safety” of the presenters, staff and patrons of the event.’

              So was it Phil Goff or not, who can say…
          • Robert Guyton 11.1.3.4.3

            20 July 2018 at 11:33 am

            Although in this instance, David Mac, we’re talking clowns, not elephants.
            • David Mac 11.1.3.4.3.1

              20 July 2018 at 3:25 pm

              I think the clowns are the ones handing out ‘Allah is gay’ flyers in Trafalgar Square. (Personally, I’d be insisting on a stab proof vest.) The elephant is all the rumble in the jungle.

              I think they’re clowns because spitting in a face is not a good way to induce anyone to behave as we’d like. ‘Allah is Gay’ claims take us no closer to a softening of Islam outlooks around issues like homosexuality. Satire takes a back-seat when somebody else’s saliva is dripping off our chin.

              I’m disappointed Goff has appointed himself gatekeeper at our hall. It’s no more his than it is Cam Stater’s. Let the clowns hand out their brochures. They’re fish out of water in our country and their elephant stomping through town nothing more than annoying noise.
    • Dennis Frank 11.2

      20 July 2018 at 10:53 am

      Lees-Galloway: “Neither had been convicted of a crime, nor banned from the United Kingdom or Australia as had been reported”. Can’t even trust journalists to get basic facts right now…
    • Draco T Bastard 11.3

      20 July 2018 at 12:32 pm

      Neither had been convicted of a crime, nor banned from the United Kingdom or Australia as had been reported, he said.

      Now that’s interesting.

      How did thus get reported around the world that Southern had been banned from the UK?

      Someone must have been lying.
      • McFlock 11.3.1

        20 July 2018 at 1:48 pm

        Well, apparently she was the one making the claim she’d been banned. That link is to the source article for the appropriate claim in Wikipedia.

        Apparently, in March she was detained at the border and refused entry into Britain.

        Whether that counts as “excluded” and violates the visa good character requirements (h/t Ovid) is the problem – apparently INZ now feel that being denied entry doesn’t constitute actual “exclusion”.
        • Draco T Bastard 11.3.1.1

          20 July 2018 at 2:31 pm

          Apparently, in March she was detained at the border and refused entry into Britain.

          But we just have her word which conflicts with what INZ have said and I’m sure that they’d do their job of contacting their corresponding department in the UK and simply asking them.

          Someone must be lying and I don’t think that it’s two government departments of two different nations.
          • McFlock 11.3.1.1.1

            20 July 2018 at 2:49 pm

            google does have some articles where the Home Office I think said she was turned away, but she definitely monetised any rejection lol

            But the main point is if she went in and was just turned away but not “banned”, she might not fail the character tests in the immigration act.
12. marty mars 12

    20 July 2018 at 10:51 am

    Melania is awesome.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/world/news/article.cfm?c_id=2&objectid=12091827
    • Morrissey 12.1

      20 July 2018 at 12:13 pm

      No she’s not. To parse her eye widening faux-innocent look as a “horrified” reaction is nothing more than wishful thinking on your part and especially by the fool who wrote that Herald headline.

      Of course, such a “horrified reaction” would be far more appropriate when she met Barack Obama, who for eight bloody years oversaw the massive, illegal programme of extra-judicial drone murders in Yemen, Pakistan, Iraq and Afghanistan.

      And remember that she’s married to Donald Trump. How shocked would she be by ANYTHING?
      • marty mars 12.1.1

        20 July 2018 at 12:29 pm

        Oh shut it you wanker.
        • Morrissey 12.1.1.1

          20 July 2018 at 1:28 pm

          Translation: “I got nuthin’.”
          • marty mars 12.1.1.1.1

            20 July 2018 at 2:58 pm

            Lol classic – it doesn’t need a translation you knob.
            • Morrissey 12.1.1.1.1.1

              20 July 2018 at 3:02 pm

              It kind of does….
              • McFlock …

                20 July 2018 at 4:27 pm

                seems pretty self-explanatory. Which bit did you feel was prone to misunderstanding?
                • Morrissey …

                  20 July 2018 at 5:46 pm

                  Oh I’m sure everyone realizes poor old marty is at the end of his tether, and incapable of a coherent response. I was, rather meanly perhaps, reminding him how just how useless his answer was.

                  Sorry, I should leave the poor fellow alone, I know.
                  • marty mars …

                    20 July 2018 at 6:43 pm

                    Ground control to major tom. Take your protein pill and put your helmet on….

                    Morrie your limp responses show where your problem is my friend – read more widely and really think m9re before writing – that will help you improve. You’re well below your usual (to be fair quite low) standards. Cliches and foolhardiary won’t cut it with these whippersnappers – just buck up will you.
                  • patricia bremner …

                    20 July 2018 at 10:17 pm

                    Morrissey, your’e predictable in your trolling of Marty.
                    Bloody boorish of you .
                    • Morrissey …

                      21 July 2018 at 8:33 am

                      Patricia, look at the post that instigated this little contre-temps: it’s an unbelievably naive declaration of support for, of all people, Melania Trump (“Melania is awesome”). Even worse than that, he’s declaring his support for her on the basis of a wild claim that she was “horrified” by Putin.

                      I reminded our bewildered friend that if Saint Melania was going to be horrified, then surely she would have been horrified by her own husband, and by Barack Obama.

                      His incoherent response is disappointing; the fact that I pointed that out is not “trolling”, it’s an attempt to get him to engage in debate. So far he has shown little sign of any ability to do so, sadly.
                    • Robert Guyton …

                      21 July 2018 at 9:09 am

                      I think she’d been holding her breath.
    • Gabby 12.2

      20 July 2018 at 4:50 pm

      Is that a hurled link marty?
13. Dennis Frank 13

    20 July 2018 at 11:00 am

    It’s a recycled complex meme, posing as original: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_Derangement_Syndrome
    • Robert Guyton 13.1

      20 July 2018 at 11:21 am

      Wasn’t the “derangement syndrome” meme tested here by Key’s “dags” Farrar and Slater?
      edit – oops! No, I see it was older than that. Farrar and Slater aren’t original thinkers…my bad.
14. indiana 14

    20 July 2018 at 11:25 am

    Will there be a big a protest about this as there was when the idea was initially proposed by the former government? Mining in land reserved for conservation under consideration again…

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=12091952
    • Robert Guyton 14.1

      20 July 2018 at 11:35 am

      “Just as the oil and gas reforms in Taranaki left intact people’s existing use rights, I am imagining any future changes to the mineral regime will not have an adverse impact on people’s existing use rights.”
      Is that to complex for you understand, Indiana?
15. esoteric pineapples 15

    20 July 2018 at 12:44 pm

    “Turns out the people who are always influencing the US president and government are Israel”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hJx9nTCFxrs
    • Morrissey 15.1

      20 July 2018 at 1:37 pm

      Israel doesn’t control the U.S. any more than another apartheid regime, the South African one, did. And the blood-soaked Philippines regime does not control the United States, and neither does Saudi Arabia.

      The United States supports Israel and other pariah regimes for various reasons, but it could stop doing so immediately if it chose. The U.S. eventually stopped its support for apartheid South Africa, for Saddam’s Iraq, and for the Suharto regime in Indonesia. It will eventually abandon Israel too, but not while this imbecile is in the White House.
    • Gabby 15.2

      20 July 2018 at 4:44 pm

      Nuttyyahoo claims all sorts of bollix piney.
16. marty mars 16

    20 July 2018 at 1:17 pm

    I support this protest – this cycleway is rubbish – dont desecrate urupā or mahinga kai areas or the surf break – thanks.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/te-manu-korihi/362149/kaikoura-cycleway-plan-upsets-local-iwi-there-has-been-no-consultation
17. Dennis Frank 17

    20 July 2018 at 2:27 pm

    If you’ve been wondering why the left are so averse to getting a hate-speech law enacted here, this may give you a couple of clues: http://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/2018/07/zionist-inspired-definition-of.html
18. Morrissey 18

    20 July 2018 at 2:55 pm

    “There has never been a just war that was started over a kite”

    Israel, Land of Miracles
    by Gideon Levy, Haaretz, July 19, 2018

    The days of kites abound with miracles here. The fact that more Israelis were scratched while shaving in recent months than from kite fires is attributed entirely to miracles….

    http://normanfinkelstein.com/2018/07/19/there-has-never-been-a-just-war-that-was-started-over-a-kite/
    • Ad 18.1

      20 July 2018 at 5:09 pm

      There are plenty of really petty reasons Mr Finkelstein might want to acquaint himself with for humans starting wars:

      https://www.grunge.com/23589/wars-started-ridiculously-petty-reasons/

      If the Palestinians thought torching fields and crops was going to end well, they might want to wonder why El Salvador and Honduras went to war for several days during the quarterfinal stages of the 1969 football world cup. Of course there were more rational reasons inside it, but there are plenty of petty people who will step you out for fuck-all good reason.
19. logie97 19

    20 July 2018 at 5:47 pm

    Anyone have the ear of those over at Pundit. https://www.pundit.co.nz ?

    Their Poll of Polls was last updated in 30th May 2017.
    Been many polls since then including the most important one that changed the government. Emails to the authors don’t appear to get a change.
20. eco maori 20

    21 July 2018 at 10:29 am

    Newshub Nation I disagree with one of your panel batteries in electric cars are more than capable to provide the power to get people around in Aotearoa . One just has to plan more have a charge options when you get to work and charge it when you get home a 3 pronged plug like the one on all the appliances we use not so hard to put those in car parks ka kite ano
21. Eco Maori 21

    21 July 2018 at 11:47 am

    And as for electricity generation and supply for transportation well that’s not really a problem in Atoearoa just have to build more geothermal power plants windpower plants solar power plants we could direct our hydo plants to keep enough water storage to be back up power when other renewable energy plants are not generating so what she/act said on Nation is nonsense.
    We also could have hydrogen for transport energy as well. It the usual story don’t have all your eggs in one kite so we should go for all the alternative energy sources that stack up economically and environmentally. Ka kite ano
22. eco maori 22

    21 July 2018 at 5:30 pm

    The sandflys are still playing marbles and spinning out my private personal information to anyone who will believe there lies . Get this strait New Zealand is a raciest society how much time the media reports on negative Maori associated story’s verses the positive storys will be 100 to 01 . When there are negative story’s about other cultures they give the story the kid glove treatment you know what I had already seen there problem in there people sticking out a mile just buy observing the news on that culture . Look at how the army is treating these two Maori men not very Honorable they are treating them like second class people .
    There was a sports star who is Maori was asked if he had a job on air well what do you call that no respect Eco Maori says .I watch the move Waru that’s a eye opener you see people will say things in front of maori wahine that they won’t say in front of tane .
    The link to the story is below Ka kite ano.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/105626884/emotional-ron-mark-has-misgivings-about-defence-force-treatment-of-injured-nepata-brothers P.S link to Waru

    https://www2.1movies.se/search_all/waru

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