Teapot tattle

Written By: - Date published: 2:25 pm, January 26th, 2012 - 122 comments
Categories: act, don brash, election 2011, john banks, john key, leadership, national, parody - Tags: ,

The Teapot Tapes have leaked on to the internet. From The Jackal and many other sources.

2Johns2Cups by goldenturkey

Please seed it: http://tinyurl.com/goldenturkey

I’d have to say after listening to it that I’d prefer that John Banks kept his brown-nosing somewhere well away from me. I’d be worried about contagion. And John Key sounds like a boring old fart with tendency to waffle while spinning stories….

Chris Ford accurately pins down my thoughts on the remaining political impact of these tapes.

In a week when internet freedom has been very much in the news, I have to say that those who finally leaked the tape should be applauded for their actions. John Key’s futile legal attempts to keep the tape’s contents hushed up have failed abysmally.  Key realises that we are living in an online age when witheld information can be leaked online at anytime. The PM laid his complaint with Police soon after the tape’s existence became known so as to prevent its release during the campaign.

Therefore, Key’s stalling tactic succeeded but he was probably hoping that any leak would come after Parliament resumed in early February. But now, the tape’s release will overshadow the first sitting day of Parliament on February 7. That’s the day John Key is obliged by Standing Orders to make his Prime Ministerial Statement to the House. Key would have wanted the day to be used for a bit of celebratory trumpet blowing in the media following his and National’s re-election. Now Winston Peters and David Shearer will ensure that it won’t be.

Update: There is a accessible version at Scoop.

122 comments on “Teapot tattle”

  1. Carol 1

    Partial repost of something I just posted in Open Mike:

    Tim Selwyn’s take on the tape has a couple of extra details, and the dodgiest stuff may have been said in a whisper, after Banks says he didn’t know, following the 15% snap election comment:

    http://www.tumeke.blogspot.com/2012/01/teapot-tape-now-online.html


    JB: He’s a strange fellow the other fellow, isn’t he
    JK: Mmm, yeah, oh yeah. Yeah, no, we’ve been down that road. The reason why when they rang me in the UK I never ever thought that […] 15% a snap election.
    JB: No, no, I didn’t know, I didn’t know.

    That odd fellow they refer to is Don Brash. What the hell 15% and snap elections have to do with anything and why Banks is claiming profusely that he didn’t know is odd.

    A lot of the rest is about polling, and what Key is going to say to the media about the te drinking encounter.

    It also include s the hypocritical smearing of Labour as the “nasty party” for negative campaigning (ie in reference to Goff calling Key a liar, and some mail drops in Epsom about Banks.

    • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 1.1

      smearing of Labour as the “nasty party”

      But, given his audience was only Banks, it demonstrates that this is something he genuinely believes.

    • Carol 1.2

      I agree with Tim Selwyn in that what is not said, or cannot be heard on the tape that is the most interesting.

      ie, the resort to whispering when discussing Brash as an odd fellow and the phone call to Key in the UK. And this bit quoted and commented on by Selwyn:

      2:45
      JB: “Someone said that you’d be working with… ah, ah…”


      Now there is no name mentioned but they both know who they mean. There’s a lot of nod, nod, wink, wink with that – are they talking about a journo, a consultant?

      So apart from the mystery over these 2 points, doesn’t this indicate that JB and JK thought there was a possibility that their conversation might be a little too public to discuss these 2 points in audible voices and with names mentioned?

      • Anne 1.2.1

        the phone call to Key in the UK. And this bit quoted and commented on by Selwyn:

        2:45
        JB: “Someone said that you’d be working with… ah, ah…”

        Could the someone be a certain Lord A?

        • Carol 1.2.1.1

          As they are talking about the way they present themselves to voters at that point, I think it’s likely to be a media trainer or consultant.

    • Carol 1.3

      Phone call must have been in April 2011 when JK was in London for ANZAC Day – a brief mention of Brash becoming leader of the ACT party in the last minute of the vid:

      So is the reference to a snap election to do with that change of leadership of ACT.

      (PS: is JK a small man or is the woman reporter just very tall?…. and so much smoozing and name dropping… too sugary compared with the tea tape John).
      And Brash taking leadership is referred to here in the end of April 2011:

      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/4934835/ACT-leadership-coup-Brash-highly-unlikely-to-get-top-Govt-post

      Key congratulated Brash from the Eurostar train as he returned from London last night.

      He will meet with Brash early next week.

      Brash “unequivocally” assured him the confidence and supply agreement with National would remain stable until the election.

      But Key would not speculate on an agreement post-election.

      He said he would “try and be constructive” and won’t rule Brash out of an executive post. But it was “highly unlikely” he would be offered the top jobs.

      He could see no need to hold the election than the already declared November 26th date.

  2. Anne 2

    It also include s the hypocritical smearing of Labour as the “nasty party” for negative campaigning (ie in reference to Goff calling Key a liar, and some mail drops in Epsom about Banks.

    What’s more, the mail drop wasn’t associated with the Labour Party anyway.

    And don’t forget the nasty attempt by John Key to slander Phil Goff with a ‘slit throat’ gesture in the debating chamber after the sad spectacle of a distraught individual trying to leap from the balcony.

  3. billE 3

    It’s strange to hear journalists being hussled away like naughty children. So many things wrong with the tone of the politics they talk, very nasty ironically. And then to tell themselves they don’t “play the man”. Banks especially. They are having a great time by the sounds of it in the disneyland cloud of the top ranks of the govmint.

  4. Ed 4

    A transcript would be good . . .

  5. Carol 5

    And Key surely is a joker when he says, instead of being “nasty” he prefers to go out there and say what he/National have done (that would be undermine democracy, misdirect, misinform, abuse urgency, carry out activities without transparency?), and promote their policies (like he did, in detail, during the election campaign?)…..

  6. Bazar 6

    By the sounds of it, there was sweet fuck all on the tape.

    So the lefties made a mountain out of teacup.

    I’m just waiting for the court to decide that it was a private conversation that shouldn’t have ever been released or taped.
    And hoping someone gets charged with this.

    • Carol 6.1

      Ah, excuse me? It was Key, The Herald on Sunday and TV3 that made an issue of it. If they’d published in the first place and Key hadn’t started criminal proceedings, people wouldn’t have wondered if there is something to hide?

      • Bazar 6.1.1

        So you’re suggesting that the lefties were completely netural on this matter, and were not in any way making demands about, or adding fuel to the fire over the contents of the tape?
        Does that include Winston Peters in your definition of leftie?

        This site was all about how the public deserved to know what was on the tapes, and what evils had been caught on it, and how in the interests of the public, our PM had no rights to privacy.

        We now know that it was a harmless tape.
        The only matter left is for the court to decide that it was a private conversation and to punish the offending individuals.

        • McFlock 6.1.1.1

          “Weren’t upset that Key and his advisors royally fucked up the PR on this issue, and were happy to egg them on” != “Constructing a mountain out of a teacup”.
           
          The Chief architect, structural engineers, and machine operators were all in National.

        • mickysavage 6.1.1.2

          Don’t you remember Bazar, Goff asked for a break from all of the attention given to the teapot tape a couple of days after it broke.  It was obliterating the campaign.  People forgot about slightly more important things like what to do with child poverty.

          Your last sentence is kind of weird.  You are saying the Court should make a decision but then punish the offending individuals.  What happens if the Court says it was a public area with no expectation of privacy which is extraordinarily likely.  

          What then? 

          • Draco T Bastard 6.1.1.2.1

            You are saying the Court should make a decision but then punish the offending individuals.

            I’m all for it. Charge JK and NAct a few thousand dollars for wasting police time.

            • aerobubble 6.1.1.2.1.1

              The point was it was a distraction. The value to the rightwing was once it became an issue then the National spin central loved the idea of keeping it on prime time. Why? Because Key’s re-election was a non-election, it was about taking the obviously (in heinsight) talking up of brand Key to the bank (polling day). And so anything that played into shutting down the election was good for national.

              yet the problem for National is now they have no public consent because they did not discuss charter schools, because most hate the idea of asset sales, and worse for National the voters that stayed away (Labour) overwhemingly support the welfare saftety net (especially in a few years when China has slowed and Europe has another round of fiscal stupidity).

              So what is National to do? sell assets, hammer those who stayed at home on eleciton night, or theme its second term around ACT charter schools (and other pro-Destiny) policy. HA.

              National, like our boomer leadership, have been coddled and smothered by their own coddling and smothering, and now they can’t see that shitting in the well might actually harm the taste of the water they draw later.

              If Key had not be so desperate t take his high polling to the bank (weakness called fear), he might have actually gone out to have policies that worked for NZ. Ooops,
              like when have National ever had that…

          • Bazar 6.1.1.2.2

            So because Goff, after days of having the teapot stirred, decided he wanted to move on.
            Thats fine, thats Goff who moved on. Goff’s decision didn’t stop all those other lefties that still haven’t gotten over it.

            I only need to see that Zetetic has posted another story, on this site no less, about the teapot contents to see its still being stirred by the left.

            “What happens if the Court says it was a public area with no expectation of privacy which is extraordinarily likely.”

            Then i’ll be proven wrong.
            If someone wants to ask me if i was wrong about it, i’ll say as much.

            Now i’ll ask something, will those who defended the right of the nation to violate the privacy of JK’s and JB’s chat, apologise for their mistake?

            In the result of such a decision, i’m expecting to read on this site, about how corrupt our high courts are, how we need to egg on the 99% movement for this very reason, and how JK is both somehow the puppet master and master puppet.
            It’d do my cynicism wonders to be proven wrong.

        • Draco T Bastard 6.1.1.3

          This site was all about how the public deserved to know what was on the tapes, and what evils had been caught on it, and how in the interests of the public, our PM had no rights to privacy.

          Yes, and? When two politicians talk about the government that they’re planning to put together then the public does have a right to know. Politicians aren’t private citizens but public servants.

          We now know that it was a harmless tape.

          So why did JK go to such lengths to hide it?

    • Ngu Wa 6.2

      Why?? Nothing to charge them for! Just Key being his usual waffling, nasty self & Banks doing his normal kowtowing to keep in favour!

    • Colonial Viper 6.3

      So the lefties made a mountain out of teacup.

      Actually it was John Key who made it into a police matter.

      • Blue 6.3.1

        Nonsense, it was the cameraman that made it a criminal matter, by his actions. And it was the hysterical left and the hysterical not so left (Labour) ‘demanding’ to know the contents, and numb-nuts Winston, seeing yet anther conspiracy, escalating it. What a fiasco. The issue was about privacy and a criminal act, nothing more. You must be disappointed it turned out to be fuck all, as the participants said at the time.

        • McFlock 6.3.1.1

          Nonsense, it was the cameraman that made it a criminal matter, by his actions.

          Allegedly. As alleged by someone with a vested interest in not having the tape come out before the election. 
           
          Due process is a funny thing.
           
          Although I’m not sure what I would have done in the cameraman’s shoes upon discovering the recording. Kicking it to the editors probably seemed like the easiest resolution to deciding whether it was newsworthy or in the public interest.

          The fact they were chatting in a cafe, albeit with no media, is a bit of a giveaway about “privacy”, as far as I can tell. Maybe I’m a paranoid prick, but I wouldn’t have a private conversation in a cafe. Informal, yes of course, but I wouldn’t have a doctor’s consultation there, nor do confession with a priest. Cafes are for banal inoffensive tripe where the worst “revelation” would be Key saying “I of course have great admiration for our older citizens, and the experience and common sense that they have – but I am greatly reassured by the popularity you have with younger Epsom activists”. Whether it were true or not.”
            

          • Draco T Bastard 6.3.1.1.1

            Although I’m not sure what I would have done in the cameraman’s shoes upon discovering the recording.

            I know exactly what I would have done – Transcribed it, put it up on my blog as a torrent, made sure the advertising was in place, then tell everybody it was there. I certainly wouldn’t have gone to the MSM with it.

            • aerobubble 6.3.1.1.1.1

              Exactly. Camermen need to get background recordings, and naturally record everything just in case they miss the necessary background noise that they need to make such high quality recordings for TV, that make Key look so good. so exactly, it was accidental recording that Key would have known was the standrad practice, as journals would be putting these back ground microphones on his table all the time. So it was willful negligence on the PM part, and his minders, not to have removed the bag sitting on the table.

              But there is a good reason for not recording the PM, he could be discussing some national security issue – not likely with banks – but… …so the press must be screening National security issues mistakenly picked up, and personal details, etc, etc all the time.

              So now we find out that Key benefited by having the story blanket the main news for days before the election. Once his mistake, his minors mistake, and the camermans normal operating proceedure and the press own ability to censor important conversations if needs be, Key won the election on the back of his campaign strategy of shuting down any real election discussion. Minsters were not be be seen, it was all bland brand Key down to the wire, with a twist of scandel.

        • Georgecom 6.3.1.2

          No, it as Key who made it into a criminal matter by making a complaint to the police.

          It was the hysterical reaction of Key and his supporters that turned what was a 5 minute story into one which lost him an outright majority.

          • You_Fool 6.3.1.2.1

            And put Winston in Parliament along with some tag-a-longs. It is highly doubtful that without the tea-storm that Winston would of made the arbitrary magic number

  7. Tigger 7

    Worst first date ever. That Banks guy clearly wants to give it all up but the Key guy is obviously just leading him on. Hope they didn’t get into bed together because Key will just screw Banks and run.

  8. felix 8

    Nastiness @ 4:08 “He polled four last time, he’ll poll three this time, a lot of his constituents will have died”.

  9. beachbum 9

    If this is all people can rely on to discredit Key then they are seriously clutching at straws.

    • Ngu Wa 9.1

      Don’t have to have anything to discredit Key…If you really listen to what he says and how often he changes his mind, you would see that he does a good job of discrediting himself.

      • beachbum 9.1.1

        Thats funny – thats what the right say about Shearer when he is interviewed.

        Not sure who is the lowest common denominator, then add someone like Winston to the mix and then I start to understand why (was it?) 1 million voters stayed at home on election day…

        • Ngu Wa 9.1.1.1

          Sad that Key is not someone I would ever trust, but I don’t know enough about Shearer to pass the same judgement on him…… But I gather from your reply, that you think I am a Labour supporter. Shock, shock! You are very wrong there, too. Doesn’t say much about your powers of discernment. I guess a sickly smile might be all you need to dupe you.

  10. slightlyrighty 10

    Given the content of the conversation, I tend to believe Key when he say’s it’s not about the tape, it’s about how it was obtained.

    • Lanthanide 10.1

      I expect any court hearing to find in favour of the journalist. It really is quite clear what constitutes a private conversation – one where the participants could “reasonably expect” it to be private.

      Having a conversation in the middle of a busy cafe with 30 people from the media (that they invited) less than a metre away through the glass, and crucially directly behind John Key standing in a doorway not obstructed by anything, cannot be said to be a “reasonable expectation” of privacy.

      • beachbum 10.1.1

        “Reasonable expectation” of privacy is an interesting term. After asking the media to go outside, maybe they had a reasonable expectation of privacy…

        Glass is reasonably efficient at blocking out a converstaion from the distance in the photo’s. A recorder hidden in a bag of course is a different matter.

        But hey – its just my opinion and I am no lawyer

        • Colonial Viper 10.1.1.1

          Ahem. Privacy? The dozen or two dozen other diners in the cafe, some seated only a couple of metres away, might have suggested that it wasn’t going to be a private conversation.

        • Vicky32 10.1.1.2

          But hey – its just my opinion and I am no lawyer

          (And no grammarian, either. Plurals don’t take apostrophes, not even when the word ends in a vowel.)

        • Lanthanide 10.1.1.3

          You missed this part of my comment:

          “crucially directly behind John Key standing in a doorway not obstructed by anything”

  11. billE 11

    I think journalists are too cosy with the political folk because of paycheck shrinkage, I am one. But from my non-journalistic private sector background the way they talk about our press is very partonising, let alone straight in front of them. There’s a high “above journalism” insult to their tone ,media as a lion to be tamed, hence almost certainly their publication .

    Subject Nasty and N.Z Politics 101 :

    Politics from the right has been nasty since Muldoon was a young man on the benches. To have two major right wingers wank each other off publicly about how virtuous they are, given their and their parties track and tact record is a bit fucking scary. But that’s how a man justifys 40 million bucks from doing rich folks banking. Hey I’m smoking drugs, watching porn and thinking of my next robbery. Like Kim Dotcom.

  12. randal 12

    diddums.
    its not tiddlywinks.

  13. Jackal 13

    Here’s the first couple of minutes:

    John Banks: JB. John Key: JK. Security Guard: SG. Photographer: PG. Background: BG.

    JB: Um and Um!

    SG: I think we’ve had enough now come along now guys.

    JB: This is great territory for you.

    JK: Yeah! No! It’s a great spot and um! And we’ve done well.

    SG: Come on guys let’s move on shall we catch up… undecipherable.

    JB: Hopefully you’ll get 70 per cent of the party vote here.

    JK: Yeah! Feels like it.

    JB: Feels very good here in Epsom.

    JK: Feels good across the country actually. Most of our election polls are looking really really good… undecipherable

    JK: So I’m brits expecting. Em

    BG: Hey guys are you good?

    JK: Theoretically past the north have been played

    JK: Theoretically the undecipherable could have been a bit more played

    BG: That’s one for Chris. We’re undecipherable at your routine.

    JK: But undecipherable.

    JK: And um! He he um! He, he he bloody worked hard last time.

    JK: He knocked on a lot of doors for a year… so I would be surprised, I mean she’s quit good but um you know.

    PG: John John!

    PG: Thank you very much.

    JK: Thank you.

    JK: Nice photo of undecipherable.

    JB: This is a very good meeting.

    JK: Yeah! Yeah! Wherever I go now there are really big numbers, yeah! Waiting, waiting to trip out.

    JB: I mean ah… there’s thirty here today.

    JK: Yeah!

    JB: and that is very good and important.

    JK: Yeah! The ,ah! Apparently the undecipherable is out this afternoon to, and that’s very good as well, TV3 undecipherable good working for us… it’s all, pretty solid.

    JK: I’d say… my, the herald would be slightly below but, you know, marginal.

    JK: I think in the end, it’s going to ease down more or less. You know.

    JK: We’ll we’ll get to 50, 49 50, anything around there will be good.

    JB: Yeah!

    JK: undecipherable

    JK: Yeah! I thought so.

    JB: Um!

    JK: You know what campaigns are like.

    JB: Oh!

    JK: It’s ah, when you’re were we are, the risk is on the down side. Undecipherable

    JB: The um the left have been very very nasty!

    1:54

    Will transcribe the rest later.

    • tsmithfield 13.1

      Shit. If the rest is like that its gonna bring the government down!!

      • Colonial Viper 13.1.1

        Nah mate, its only going to knock another brick from the wall.

      • Jackal 13.1.2

        Well if anything it confirms that Key and Banks can’t formulate a sentence properly. The bit about TV3 doing some good work for National is a bit interesting… maybe that’s why they refused to broadcast the tape.

        • insider 13.1.2.1

          They were talking about polls by the looks.

          I reckon you should replace the ‘ indecipherable’ with ‘bleep!’. That will make it much much more interesting, more like a guy Ritchie movie

          JK: Yeah! The ,ah! Apparently the BLEEP! is out this afternoon to, and that’s very good as well, TV3 BLEEP! good working for us… it’s all, pretty solid.

      • Anne 13.1.3

        It shows them up for what they are: a couple of ignorant, semi literate bumpkins.

    • The Voice of Reason 13.2

      Good work, Jackal! This line is quite telling:
       
      “Hopefully you’ll get 70 per cent of the party vote here.”
       
      That’s not the line Key was pushing in public! I do wonder if Key’s worry about the tape was that he genuinely didn’t remember what he said and he was afraid that he’d dissed Nat voters along with Winnie’s lot. Either way, he cost ACT 3 seats and gifted Winston an unlikely political comeback.
       

    • Carol 13.3

      Thanks,

      Some additions and corrections…
      K: Feels good across the country actually. Most of our election polls are looking really really good…

      JK: So I’m a bit suspect that. Em

      BG: Hey guys are you good?

      JK: Theoretically Palmerston North should have been played

      JK: Theoretically Rumataka could be a bit more played
      BG: That’s one for Chris. We’re undecipherable at your routine.

      JK: But undecipherable Palmerston North, because Mike.

      JK: And Pete (?) um! He he um! He, he he bloody worked hard last time.

      JK: He knocked on a lot of doors for a year… so I would be surprised, I mean she’s quite good but um you know.

      PG: John John!

      PG: Thank you very much.

      […]
      JK: Yeah! The ,ah! Apparently the latest Roy Morgan is out this afternoon to, and that’s very good as well, TV3’s very good working for us… it’s all, pretty solid.

      • Carol 13.3.1

        and some more:

        JK: Most photographed cup of tea in the world.

        JB: This is a very good media contingent I gotta tell you.

        JK: Yeah! Yeah! Wherever I go now there are really big numbers, yeah! Waiting, waiting to trip out.

        JB: I mean ah… there’s thirty here today.

        JK: Yeah!

        JB: and that is very very good and important.

        JK: Yeah! The ,ah! Apparently Roy Morgan that is out this afternoon to, and that’s very good as well, TV3 is very good and working for us… it’s all, pretty solid.

        JK: I’d say… my, the herald would be slightly below but, you know, marginal.

        JK: I think in the end, it’s going to ease down, it’d be my guess. You know.

        JK: We’ll we’ll get to 50, 49 50, anything around there will be good enough.

        JB: Yeah!

        JK: but when where we are

        JK: Yeah! I thought so.

        JB: Um!

        JK: You know what campaigns are like.

        JB: Oh!

        JK: It’s ah, when you’re were we are, the risk is on the down side. Undecipherable

        JB: The um the left have been very very nasty!

        1:54

        • Colonial Viper 13.3.1.1

          I bet that Iain Lees-Galloway would love to know what these boys were scheming about re: Palmerston North being played.

          • The Voice of Reason 13.3.1.1.1

            I think it’s “in play” rather than ‘being played’, CV. The Nats wanted Palmy bad. It was, at the time, Labour’s only provincial seat and Key visited regularly during the campaign. But as the PM pointed out, Iain is a bloody hard worker and the seat’s his for keeps now.

            • Colonial Viper 13.3.1.1.1.1

              Yep, kudos to Iain, I’ve only met him once or twice but I know him as a very solid, well respected local MP.

        • Jackal 13.3.1.2

          Thanks Carol. I thought it was Rumataka… “Playing” different electorates seems a rather dodgy way to put it.

      • The Voice of Reason 13.3.2

        “But undecipherable Palmerston North, because Mike.
        JK: And Pete (?) um! He he um! He, he he bloody worked hard last time.
        JK: He knocked on a lot of doors for a year… so I would be surprised, I mean she’s quite good but um you know.”
         
        It’s “But we’re a bit suspect in Palmerston North … (then he can’t remember Iain Lees Galloway’s name, and I think Key says ‘lees’ not ‘pete’.”
         
        He was wrong about his candidate in Palmy. Bloody hopeless, as it turns out.

      • Carol 13.3.3

        Palmerston North won by Ian Lees Galway for Labour in 2011. Rimutaka won by Chris Hipkins for Labour in 2011 and 2008.

  14. just saying 14

    I’m assuming that the newspapers got the tape “clarified” in what ever ways it is possible, to minimise the background noise and optimise the sound quality of the actual converation. I assume the transcription the media have, has more informationa than this raw copy has provided so far.

  15. Blue 15

    Banks: Yeah, so it’s been great. Um, and um…this is great territory for you.
    Key: Yeah. No. It’s a great spot and um I mean, we’ve done well to follow that up from…
    Banks: I’m sure you’ll get 70% of the party vote here.
    Key: Yeah, it feels like that, yeah.
    Banks: Feels very good.
    Key: Across the country actually we’ve got some…most of our electoral polling is looking really really good so…I’m a bit suspective – I think theoretically Palmerston North could be in play, theoretically Rimutaka could be in play, but I’m suspect in Palmerston North because my [] last time and um, he um, he…he…he bloody worked hard last time, for myself I don’t…he knocked on a lot of doors for a year, so I’d be surprised…I mean, she’s quite good but I’d be a little bit surprised –
    [Tea cups set down. Media snap photos and are shooed away]
    Key: The most photographed cup of tea in the world.
    Banks: This is a very good media contingent.
    Key: Yeah, it’s huge ay?
    Banks: I’ve got to tell you…
    Key: Wherever I go though there’s more big numbers normally, yeah, waiting, waiting to trip me up. [To the wait staff] Thank you!
    Banks: I mean, uh…
    Key: [To wait staff] Cheers. Thanks very much.
    Banks: There’s 30 here today.
    Key: Yeah.
    Banks: That’s very very good.
    Key: Apparently Roy Morgan’s out this afternoon is very good too and TV3’s very good at the weekend for us, but it’s all pretty solid. I’d say the Herald will be slightly low, but you know, margin. I mean, in the end it’s going to ease down, would be my guess, go…we’ll get to 50, 49, anything around there will be good enough.
    Banks: Yeah. It will be good…
    Key: Yeah, I expect so…well, you know what campaigns are like. When you’re where we are, the risk is in the downside…
    Banks: The election has been very, very nasty.
    Key: Yeah, yeah. I don’t…I don’t think that’s a strategy that works very well. I reckon you’re much better just to get out there and promote what you’re doing, promote your policies and…
    Banks: You have got no idea how vicious they’ve been, you know, especially at public meetings, but um, we can handle that and I’m not buying into it.
    Key: No.
    Banks: I’ve been around too long, I’m not…
    Key: I feel the same and…
    Banks: I don’t play the…
    Key: No, no, I don’t reckon it works. When you look at Roughan last week in the paper saying ‘the moment he called him a liar I knew it was all over’ http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10763955 and I mean, it’s so, you know, there are so many things where you go ‘I could spend my life on this stuff’ but you know, I can’t be bothered and I’m not going to do it. And I just don’t think it’s going to take me anywhere. I mean, I was, I’m there to make a difference, I’m just going to keep on working on it each year, and I’m actually proud of the record we’ve got and that’s what we’re going to be.
    Banks: Yeah. Someone’s told me you’re gonna be, you’re going to be working with uh…
    Key: Yeah, yeah. It’s good. Yeah, no that’s right…I reckon you guys are…yeah yeah…unfortunately that’s always the case.
    Banks: I didn’t know.
    Key: No, no, no [chuckles softly]…um…but you…you guys will track at some point. Bit of luck…so what I’m going to do when I go out is I’m gonna say, look we’ve worked with Act for the last three years, provided strong and stable government, blah blah, and then I’m just going to run them through and say look, in 2005 and 2008, the voters of Epsom gave their party vote to National then voted tactically and if they do so in 2011 I wouldn’t be at all unhappy about that, we’re likely positioned to provide strong and stable government again blah blah blah. And they’ll ask about how I’m going to vote for the National candidate, and that’s because I am the leader of the National Party here’s my job, and then if they go on to the ministerial warrants, let’s just say we’ll go through it another day.
    Banks: And, you might, you might be inclined to say ‘I know John quite well.’
    Key: Yeah. That’s right, yep.
    Banks: And we’ve had a good working relationship, and we did a lot of stuff together.
    Key: Yep. Worked well.
    Banks: We’ve achieved a lot.
    Key: Yep. We’re on the same page.
    Banks: Do you think Winston will be back this time?
    Key: [dismissive laugh] No, not at all no chance.
    Banks: [mumble]
    Key: [amused] Yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s , but no, no, not a show. He, look, he’s at 2.5 I think on the TV3 poll, we have him about 2.5, 3. Look, he polled 4 last time, he’ll poll 3 this time, a lot of his constituents have all died. He won’t poll, I don’t think he’ll poll much above 3 this time.
    Key: How are you enjoying it? Is it just bloody hard going?
    Banks: Oh, it’s hard going, I mean it’s really hard, I mean, I’m at it 14 hours a day. Bus stops this morning, on buses, in the trains, on the trains, railway stations, taxi stands, pushing it hard, and ah, but it’s quite small, the response here is amazing. Our polling this week shows the gap between Paul and I is closing anyway, albeit there’s some distance, but a couple of key media have him well out in front…
    Key: Look at the end of the day, there will always be [] both [], but you shouldn’t be worried about the [] help with the Maori Party that will be a very different set of circumstances, and um…
    Banks: Makes your time here very…
    Key: Mmm, mmm, yeah, I’m not worried.
    Banks: I think the Labour Party have um have given up on Epsom.
    Key: Oh, yeah.
    Banks: He’s a horrible fellow, that candidate. Nasty, nasty.
    Key: He is, ooh, nasty. They’re a nasty party in a lot of ways.
    Banks: Yeah, well, you know they’ve been putting stuff in letterboxes about me. Shocking stuff.
    Key: Yes, that’s nasty. That’s what they do, they play the person the whole time. We never do that stuff.
    Banks: And John, I think the important thing is the [] politics, the policies, [] I’ve learned that the long term experience is never any value with them…
    Key: No, it doesn’t help you, does it?
    Banks: People…people…
    Key: I mean, longer term I reckon Act’s gotta…the reason I didn’t text you is because it’s better if I don’t because it puts you under pressure to say he has or he hasn’t you know?
    Banks: No, no I haven’t heard from the Prime Minister.
    Key: No, no, it’s easier to say…
    Banks: I don’t expect you to [] on me…what’s that number of yours? I’ve got two numbers for you.
    Key: Oh, the proper one is [number omitted from transcript]
    Banks: [repeats number]. I haven’t talked to you…they want us to know I haven’t heard from the Prime Minister. I think it’s important during the campaign we stay at arm’s length. He’s got his party, and…
    Key: Definitely.
    Banks: I think that after the election with Catherine…
    Key: Yeah, she’s good.
    Banks: Don Nicolson, and Steve Whittington, the four of us, we can completely restructure and rebuild this party.
    Key: That’s right. And she’s good actually. She’s…I reckon she’ll have quite a bit of female appeal.
    Banks: Yeah.
    Key: Yeah, that’s where you’ll…
    Banks: He’s a strange fellow, the other fellow isn’t he?
    Key: Mmmm! Oh, yeah! Yeah, no, no, we’ve been down that road! That is why when they rang me in the UK I never ever thought of this, you know, 15 percent we’d have a snap election…
    [quiet mumbling]
    Banks: I didn’t know. I didn’t know.
    Key: Well, you learn everyday. So, you want to do the standup? Is that yours? Is that yours? Is that yours?
    Banks: No.
    Key: Hey, that’s a recording device.

    • Carol 15.1

      Great. Thanks.
      Key: Yes, that’s nasty. That’s what they do, they play the person the whole time. We never do that stuff.

      ha ha ha ha ha…………

      • tsmithfield 15.1.1

        Ummm… you might want to reconsider your mirth in the context of some of Labour’s marketing strategies from this and previous election. Hint: Simpering woman “we don’t trust you Mr Key”.

        I don’t recall any of Nationals marketing from this or the previous election that targeted individuals. They were very much focused on promoting themselves rather than dissing the opposition. Then again, you could find some examples to prove me wrong.

        • Colonial Viper 15.1.1.1

          One thing the recording shows is how Angelic the born-to-rule Right Wing view themselves.

          • Redbaron77 15.1.1.1.1

            Almost to the point of delusion. In contrast they are perfectly at ease “putting the boot in” towards anyone or any group that stands in their way.

            • Carol 15.1.1.1.1.1

              +1

              “Phil in”, Darren Hughes, Chris Carter, the whole “commyunist lesbian dictator” discourse around Helen Clark fanned by Wishart’s writing and DF’s billboards. etc, etc

            • millsy 15.1.1.1.1.2

              National has targeted low paid workers, teachers, trade unionists, those on a benefit, single mothers, etc and so on with their nastiness.

              John Banks is on record that he thinks that animals are more important than children in poverty.

              The right are really really really nasty in the past few years, look at the POA dispute, with the abuse towards the wharfies being easily compared with the brownshirts abuse of the Jews in 1930’s Germany..

              First they came for the unemployed, and I didnt speak up because I wasant unemployed
              Then they came for the DPB mothers, and I didnt speak up because I wasant a DPB mother
              Then they came for the public servants, and I didnt speak up because I wasant a public servant
              Then they came for the teachers, and I didnt speak up because I wasant a teacher
              Then they came for the state housing tenants, and I didnt speak up because I didnt live in a state house
              Then they came for the actors, and I didnt speak up because I wasant an actor
              Then they came for the wharfies, and I didnt speak up because I wasant a wharfie
              And when they came for me, there was no one left to speak up for me…….

              – with apologies to the good Pastor.

    • Wow, thanks for that!

    • Jackal 15.3

      Thanks Blue… I was a bit pressed for time hence the bad transcription. I’m also not fluent in gobbledygook, which is what Banks and Key were speaking. You should send National an invoice for your work.

    • Dun Brush aka jaymam 15.4

      Surely Don Brash was number 1 on the ACT party list? So why is Banks talking about “the four of us” not including Brash? Was Banks intending, before the election, to roll Brash immediately? That would be enough for Key to not want the tapes released before the election.

      “Banks: I think that after the election with Catherine[…] Don Nicolson, and Steve Whittington, the four of us, we can completely restructure and rebuild this party.”

  16. tsmithfield 16

    Whatever Ambrose got paid for that was too much.

  17. Mark 17

    This is hilarious, you Lefties with your conspiracy theories, now you end up in bed (Opposition) with your great mate Winston, you will be able to give each other tips on how to take back handers and milk the state.  Someone could make a comedy about Wussel, The Crooked Pensioner from St Mary’s Bay and whoever it is that leads Labour (is it still H2?) having a little meeting about rorting the taxpayers. We could play it 4 days before the next election.

    • The Voice of Reason 17.1

      I think you’ll find it’s currently the right that are obsessed with conspiracies, Mark. But your comment makes no contextual sense anyway, because I don’t see anyone here putting up conspiracy theories. However, I like your comedy idea. Perhaps you could pitch it to NZ On Air and get it made. Don’t forget to include a role for a leading politician who gets an hour’s free advertising just before an election on a radio station whose owners he personally bailed out with a cheap loan. Pip Pip!

      • Mark 17.1.1

        “Personally bailed out”
        Oh, are we allowed to discuss the LAX incident now -where a certain Corrupt  Minister in return for large amounts of taxpayer money given by a certain Corrupt PM  to payback certain favours from a four legged industry arranged Diplomatic Immunity for the Wife of said Corrupt PM engaging in in a bit of four legged sport with (what is the word for a male foal?).
        Excuse the grammar, but everyone knows what I refer to. 

        • The Voice of Reason 17.1.1.1

          You know none of that made sense, right? Shouldn’t you just shuffle off back to Whale’s home for the bewildered? And try not to drag your knuckles on the way, I heard he faints at the sight of blood.

          • Mark 17.1.1.1.1

            Whale? That’s like preaching to the converted, or masturbating into a condom, or supporting MUNZ, or believing the left care about the poor.. where is the sense in that?
            It is far more rewarding (unfortunately not very challenging) poking holes in lefty dogma over here. 

            [lprent: You are starting to look like a rather incoherent troll trapped in 2007 from your comments today. They appear to be meaningless phrases strung together wih little understanding. I’d suggest that you need to read the policy, some comments, and adjust your behavior before I or another moderator gets bored with the nostalgia for a bygone era of blogging. ]

            • Colonial Viper 17.1.1.1.1.1

              Its not very challenging because you are a gnat trying to screw the pooch.

            • Mark 17.1.1.1.1.2

              Okay, don’t bother, I retire.. back in the good old days the left would at least be able to maintain a rational and intelligent debate, now unfortunately it is just tired and disproved 2nd hand ideology. Good luck all with the quest to improve society. 

              [lprent: rational and intelligent aren’t the words I would associate with your comments. Hidebound, myth ridden and outright ignorant are. But you have made a wise decision. I don’t think that you are up to the standard yet. Test yourself on the baby talk blogs like the sewer and try here again in a few years when you get tired of talking to reflections of yourself. ]

        • adriank 17.1.1.2

          Wait… are you saying Steve Joyce arranged for Bronagh to f**k a horse???

  18. Jester 18

    I just love that on your complete home page there is 29 references to John Key and 0 references to David Shearer.

    Sorry you lot but this is a major fail!

    Always….Always…..always remember, that you can’t sell a secret!

    [lprent: don’t be more of a fuckwit than you usually are. We aren’t brown-nosing Tories with a sycophantic Key fetish. Our authors seldom mention the leaders on the left or even the parties. Never have, and probably never will except when they are having leadership changes.

    Resume trolling and I will resume banning you. How many times have we done it thus far? I guess you may be too stupid to learn? ]

    • The Voice of Reason 18.1

      Because this a Labour Party site, right? Moron.

    • Jester 18.2

      Didn’t even notice that I had been banned, Suspended, or even castigated for any previous comments. Are you sure you have the correct person?

      But feel free to ban me now if you like.

      Here I’ll assist you with it…….what type of fucking gay name for a bloke is Lyn anyway. You poor cunt. I feel for you.

  19. tsmithfield 19

    Yep.

    Labour’s strategy in the last two elections has been to attack John Key. Each time it has been an epic fail. On this site at least, the strategy continues.

    As the saying goes “if you keep on doing what you’ve always done, you’ll keep on getting what you’ve always got.” It will be interesting to see if the strategy changes for the next election.

    • Colonial Viper 19.1

      Labour’s strategy in the last two elections has been to attack John Key. Each time it has been an epic fail. On this site at least, the strategy continues.

      National’s coalition majority was reduced by 4 seats on Nov 26.

    • McFlock 19.2

      Does that count as an assumption that this site is public advertising extension of the Labour party?

    • felix 19.3

      “Labour’s strategy in the last two elections has been to attack John Key. Each time it has been an epic fail. On this site at least, the strategy continues.”

      You’re right t, everyone should just leave Key alone.

  20. tsmithfield 20

    You have a very strange way of measuring success. But it is fairly typical of the way the left has been focusing its attention in the wrong direction. The Labour vote collapsed. There is no way that can be called “success” regardless how many seats the government got.

    • felix 20.1

      “But it is fairly typical of the way the left has been focusing its attention in the wrong direction. The Labour vote collapsed. There is no way that can be called “success” regardless how many seats the government got.”

      Would you like to rephrase that?

      You start out talking about “the left” but then you jump to talking about “Labour” as if the two were synonymous.

      See if you don’t rephrase it, people might think you were deliberately trying to ignore the fact that the Green Party won a record no of seats.

      Just, you know, cos you were talking about “the left” and all…

      • tsmithfield 20.1.1

        “Would you like to rephrase that?”

        Not at all.

        I said the left focussed their attention in the wrong direction. I said Labour were unsuccessful.

        Some members of the Green party also engaged in some fairly grubby sort of behaviour e.g. vandalism of National hoardings. To that extent, the Greens, the other main component of the left had its attention focussed in the wrong direction as well, because their source of success was disaffected Labour voters. In the case of the Greens they were successful despite the distraction because of the disaffected Labour voters had to go somewhere.

        • felix 20.1.1.1

          And yet they got more votes than ever before.

          Was it more than any third party ever has under MMP? Not sure, but a record Green Party turnout nonetheless.

          A historically significant election for the Green Party.

          I note that you decline to rephrase your error. This can only mean that either you haven’t actually managed to decouple “Labour” and “the left” in your brain, or you know it was an error but you’re spinning shit.

          Gee I wonder which.

          • The Voice of Reason 20.1.1.1.1

            Yep, best ever result for a 3rd party, shading Winston in 2002 (10%, 13 seats).

      • Colonial Viper 20.1.2

        Some members of the Green party also engaged in some fairly grubby sort of behaviour e.g. vandalism of National hoardings.

        Oh look you sensitive soul, rubbing is racing OK? Don’t get on to the track if you can’t keep up.

        • tsmithfield 20.1.2.1

          Doesn’t bother me at all. Just that if the Greens had focussed their efforts more fully on their source of votes i.e. disaffected labour supporters they might have got even more of the vote and NZ First would have probably got less.

          • Colonial Viper 20.1.2.1.1

            I’m not a big fan of the Greens, but they did very well. Both them and NZ1 were the only true winners on the night IMO. The Conservatives had a credible showing too – shows the influence money in a campaign can have.

          • felix 20.1.2.1.2

            To put your bullshit into context, in 2008 the Greens won 157,000 odd votes.

            In 2011 it was 247,000. That’s a phenomenal increase.

            Makes Labour’s slight decrease & National’s slight increase look like margin of error stuff.

    • Colonial Viper 20.2

      The Labour vote collapsed.

      It was a fraction of one percent below the 1996 result. Big deal.

      Still way more than English’s pathetic not-quite-21% effort though.

  21. Mr. X 21

    Welll…Obviously the whole thing was a set up from the beginning. Controlled by the pm. You will notice that Jk never really says anything of a controversial nature. Nothing that would even slightly damage him. And when Jb heads off in the direction of slander and gossip Jk quickly diverts the conversation to matters of a more banal nature. Jb tries several times to go down the road of personalities but is trackstopped each time. Jk was obviously totally aware of the tape recorder from the get go, whilst the patsy Jb was a pawn in the whole charade and oblivious. Jk only “notices” the black bag when he finishes the meet and wants to stand up. The Jb thought the bag belonged to the Jk, i mean he is thinking “it’s not mine must be his.”

  22. tsmithfield 22

    I didn’t say the Greens weren’t successful. But maybe they could have had 50000 more votes if they had put effort wasted on National towards the easy pickings from Labour. The misguided efforts of some members against National may have actually had the effect of turning off some Labour supporters who might have been thinking about voting Greens.

    That’s why I made the clear distinction between the misguided focus on the left and the unsuccessful outcome for Labour.

    • felix 22.1

      And yet your advice to the Greens is that they should’ve crashed Labour’s vote more. You fucking moron.

  23. Dun Brush aka jaymam 23

    Both Kiwiblog and Whaleoil have picked on something minor, as if there was nothing else important in the tape.

    DPF: “Yes the awful secret was that John Key said he doesn’t like nasty politics, and thinks it doesn’t work for Labour.”

    Slater: “This is the secret that John Banks wanted no one to know. He thought Don Brash was a “strange fella”.”

    I note that they carefully avoid mentioning Banks intention to roll Brash, here:
    “Banks: I think that after the election with Catherine[…] Don Nicolson, and Steve Whittington, the four of us, we can completely restructure and rebuild this party.”

    and avoid mentioning Key’s wrong contention that “a lot of [Winston’s] constituents have all died”

    and Banks lying here:
    “Banks: No, no I haven’t heard from the Prime Minister.” while swapping phone numbers with the Prime Minister

  24. felix 24

    “I note that they carefully avoid mentioning Banks intention to roll Brash”

    And of course their line will be “but everyone already knew about that, it was no secret”.

    Which is true insofar as we all knew, and they denied it! That’s Banks caught in a massive and repeated lie to the public right there and the whole political establishment including the media are going to brush it off as business as usual.

    It’s not good enough. Banks need to be raked over the coals for this.

    • Campbell Larsen 24.1

      It is enough of a loss that our politics is defined by these banal moments, mourn instead for that lack of honesty or integrity, mourn for the replacenment of actuality with expedience.

      Banks and Key are pawns in this game. We have no choice but to play – but we must be more careful, because people are not expendable.

  25. bobo 25

    Banks: Oh, it’s hard going, I mean it’s really hard, I mean, I’m at it 14 hours a day. Bus stops this morning, on buses, in the trains, on the trains, railway stations, taxi stands, pushing it hard, and ah, but it’s quite small, the response here is amazing.

    Banks sounds like hes been soliciting for sex..

  26. james 111 26

    Ha Ha Ha
    What a joke nothing in it just show how the left and winnie the fake blew everything out of proportion prior to the Election. Really quite a deflated ballon for the Labour Party

    • Tangled up in blue 26.1

      Have you considered that maybe Nationals poor handling of the situation contributed to the media circus which (arguably) ultimately resulted in NZF having 8 seats in parliament?

  27. happynz 27

    JK: TV3 is very good and working for us…

    No shit.

  28. Fortran 28

    To get back into Government Labour must adopt a “positive” stance, and close up towards the Greens, because without the Greens there will not be a majority being necessary to form the Government. Stop the negativity. Think and formulate the positives for the future of our country.
    What are we going to do to get the country out of the rut ? – not just increase taxes etc – that’s negative.

    • Colonial Viper 28.1

      Increasing taxes is not a negative.

      Funding spending and tax cuts for the rich via foreign debt is negative.

      By the way optimism is going to fuck us. In the energy depleting world, realism is what is required.

      Of course, the well off middle classes will keep voting for any political party which lies to it and says that the current comfortable status quo can be continued and improved upon via economic growth.

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    We reprint below an article from the excellent website the Economics of Imperialism by Tony Norfield This is an update of the statistics for my Index of Power, using data for 2018-19 and discussing what a country’s ranking reflects. The major change is that China’s rank has shifted up and ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    4 days ago
  • Climate Change: A history lesson
    Why is New Zealand climate change policy so crap? The Herald this morning has a long article on the twists and turns of climate change policy in New Zealand [paywalled / depaywall script], which shows where we've been. The short version is that the government first began worrying about this ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • What the All Blacks Mean to Us
    The All Blacks have been, for more than a century, arguably the most successful International sports team in the world. But they are more than that; even for those Kiwis who are immune to the charms of rugby (and there are more than a few), the All Blacks are ambassadors ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    4 days ago
  • No one is born into the wrong body
    A short and incredibly powerful speech from a young lesbian woman. No one is born in the wrong body. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    5 days ago
  • Contempt
    Back in June, the UK Court of Appeal ruled that that country's continued arms sales to Saudi Arabia were unlawful. So you'd expect that the UK government stopped approving them, right?Of course not:The government has apologised for breaching a court ruling against the sale of weapons to Saudi Arabia that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Covering up the cover-up
    Yesterday NZDF officials were put on the stand about the lies they had told over Operation Burnham, making implausible claims that it was all a big mistake. But along the way, we learned they had already been put on the spot about it by a previous Defence Minister, who had ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Not as important as they think they are
    Farmers have been whining a lot lately, about the methane targets in the Zero Carbon Bill, about Canterbury's proposed nitrogen limits, and about the government's new proposals to stop them from shitting in our lakes and rivers. These policies are "throwing farmers under the tractor", they will force farmers off ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago
  • Behind Every Good Woman Should Stand – Another Good Woman.
    Alone, Alone, All, All, Alone: To argue that the Prime Minister is the victim of her advisers’ failure to keep her informed may offer Jacinda some measure of exoneration – but only at the cost of casting her as a hopeless political ingénue. A star-dusted muppet, whose only purpose is to ...
    5 days ago
  • Poor quality, poorly educated kiddie ‘Journalists’ spreading fake news
    In times of hysteria about the “World coming to an end” and “rising sea levels” so-called ‘Journalists’ who can barely spell words longer than four letters are having a ball! Though the majority of the Public have worked out that manmade climate change is nothing short of pseudo-science, and the ...
    An average kiwiBy admin@averagekiwi.com
    5 days ago
  • Chris Trotter on the BFD
    I don't want to give pblicity to certain parts of the internet that are better left to fester in their own irrelevance (I know, a bit like this place) but the listing of Chris Trotter as a 'author' on Cameron Slater's spinoff website, the BFD requires some explanation.Now, I don't ...
    6 days ago
  • Sex is not a spectrum
    The text below is a Twitter thread by Heather Heying that explains the essence of sexual reproduction and it long evolutionary history. She is an evolutionary biologist and a “professor-in-exile” after she and her husband, Bret Weinstein, stood up to supporters of an enforced “Day of Absence” for white staff and teachers ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    6 days ago
  • Climate Change: Trees, aviation, and offsets
    With crunch time for new Zealand climate policy approaching, most of the New Zealand media have got on board with a global reporting effort to cover the issue. There's one strand of stories today about polling and what it shows about changing public attitudes to the crisis, but the strand ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago
  • Pissing-Off The Israelis Is A High-Risk Strategy.
    Dangerous Foes: For those readers of Bowalley Road who feel disposed to dismiss any prospect of an Israeli destabilisation of New Zealand politics, the example of the United Kingdom repays close attention. Ever since the election of Jeremy Corbyn as leader of the British Labour Party, the Israelis have sanctioned, funded and ...
    6 days ago
  • Something to go to in Wellington
    Make It 16, the youth-led campaign to lower New Zealand's voting age, is holding an official campaign launch at Parliament this Friday from 16:30. If you'd like to attend, you can register using EventBrite here. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago
  • A founding member responds to Peace Action Wellington
    by Don Franks It was a lovely sunny Wellington afternoon with blue skies above  the beaches.  In Courtenay Place, political activists packed out a stuffy upstairs room for an important meeting. The assembled pacifists, anarchists, communists and independent young radicals of Peace Action Wellington felt the need for a mission ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    6 days ago
  • “Mistakes and errors”
    Current and former NZDF top brass are being publicly grilled this week by the hit and run inquiry over their public responses to allegations of civilian casualties. Previously, they've claimed there were no casualties, a position which led them to lie to Ministers and to the public. Now, they're saying ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago
  • “Homosexuality is same-sex attraction and relationships, not heterosexuals with delusions of gende...
    by Rafael D. Quiles (gender-critical gay man from Puerto Rico) The writing on the wall is right in people’s faces and people just don’t see it or don’t want to. What could actually possess a heterosexual male to want to feminize himself and claim that he is a lesbian? Because ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    7 days ago
  • Trump: “Where’s my favourite dictator?”
    From the Wall Street Journal:Inside a room of the ornately decorated Hotel du Palais during last month’s Group of Seven summit in Biarritz, France, President Trump awaited a meeting with Egyptian President Abdel Fattah Al Sisi. Mr. Trump looked over a gathering of American and Egyptian officials and called out in ...
    7 days ago
  • Magdalen Burns, 1983-2019, fighter for women’s liberation
    by the Redline blog collective At Redline we are very saddened to hear of the death of Magdalen Burns who passed away on the morning of Friday, September 13 (British time). Magdalen was a great fighter for the rights of women in general and lesbian women in particular, a defender ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Parliament and the Executive
    The Brexit issue has certainly brought with it a series of apparently difficult constitutional issues, many of them concerning the respective roles of the executive and parliament. Most of them arise because of the unwillingness of MPs, despite their professions to the contrary, to be bound by a constitutional rarity ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • The Abigail Article; Martyn Bradbury’s Article, and My Response
    . . This blogpost is different to my usual format of reporting on issues… Since July 1011, I have blogged on a variety of political issues; near always political and/or environmental; mostly highly critical of the previous National Government. Other issues included Israeli occupation of Palestinian lands and repression of ...
    Frankly SpeakingBy Frank Macskasy
    1 week ago
  • Police will have to wear silly Buckingham Palace hats from now on, says Police Minister
    Those close to the Police Minister believe the initiative may be the result of Nash “seeing a great deal” on AliExpress. In a move that comes seemingly out of nowhere, Police Minister Stuart Nash announced this afternoon that he expects all frontline staff to don bearskin hats, famously worn by ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • A sensible crackdown
    The government has released its Arms Legislation Bill, containing the second tranche of changes to gun laws following the March 15 massacre. And it all looks quite sensible: a national gun register, higher penalties for illegal possession and dealing, tighter restrictions on arms dealers and shooting clubs, and a shorter ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • California bans private prisons
    Private prisons are a stain on humanity. Prison operators explicitly profit from human misery, then lobby for longer prisons terms so they can keep on profiting. And in the US, prison companies run not only local and state prisons, but also Donald Trump's immigration concentration camps. Faced with this moral ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Why PPPs are a bad idea
    When National was in power, they were very keen on Public-Private Partnerships (PPPs) - basicly, using private companies to finance public infrastructure as a way of hiding debt from the public. They were keen on using them for everything - roads, schools, hospitals. But as the UK shows, that "service" ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • A Movement That No Longer Moves.
    Moving And Shaking: There was a time when people spoke matter-of-factly about the “labour movement” – a political phenomenon understood to embrace much more than the Labour Party. Included within the term’s definition was the whole trade union movement – many of whose members looked upon the Labour Party as ...
    1 week ago
  • NZ ‘left’ politically embracing extreme postmodernism
    by Philip Ferguson Much of the left, even people who formally identify as marxists, have collapsed politically in the face of postmodern gender theory of the sort pioneered by American philosopher Judith Butler. For Butler even biological sex is socially constructed. “If the immutable character of sex is contested, perhaps ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • The obvious question
    The media is reporting that the (alleged) Labour party sexual assaulter has resigned from their job at Parliament, which means hopefully he won't be turning up there making people feel unsafe in future. Good. But as with everything about this scandal, it just raises other questions. Most significantly: why the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • The moment I found out that you found out, I acted swiftly
    By Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern I am every bit as angry as you are. I am every bit as disappointed as you must be. The people with power, oversight and the ability to do something about these processes within the Labour Party should be ashamed. Whoever those people are, I ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • This is why people hate property developers
    Property developers think there is an "oversupply" of houses in Auckland:High turnover rates and falling prices may be a sign that there are too many new houses going in to some parts of Auckland, commentators say. [...] Property developer David Whitburn said there was a "bit of an oversupply" in ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Australia to Pacific: “Fuck you, you can all drown”
    World leaders are meeting in New York in two weeks for the 2019 Climate Action Summit, where they are expected to announce new and more ambitious targets to stop the world from burning. But the Australian Prime Minister won't be there, despite being in the USA at the time:Scott Morrison ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Implausible ignorance
    Labour Party president Nigel Haworth resigned yesterday over the party's sexual assault scandal. But while that's good news, its unlikely to take away the stench of a coverup. Because according to Paula Bennett in Parliament yesterday, pretty much everyone in the Prime Minister's office was involved as well:I have been ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Labour’s Fatal Flaw.
     Two-Faced? Labour insiders' commitment to the neoliberal status quo puts them at odds with their party’s membership; its trade union affiliates; and a majority of Labour voters, but this only serves to strengthen the perception they have of themselves as a special elite. Among the lesser breeds, they’ll talk up a ...
    1 week ago
  • Ten reasons the Tories do NOT want an election
    There has been a lot of talk about Boris Johnson wanting an election, and he has blustered with great gusto about 'chicken' Jeremy Corbyn refusing one, but I think there are many reasons why he is secretly glad he has been refused the opportunity:The Tories are an utter rabble,tearing themselves ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Prorogation Illegal, rule Scottish judges
    Scottish appeal court judges have declared that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament in the run-up to the October Brexit deadline is unlawful. The three judges, chaired by Lord Carloway, Scotland’s most senior judge, overturned an earlier ruling that the courts did not have the powers to interfere in the prime ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Let me explain what I meant by Everyday New Zealanders
    By Simon Bridges. The following is a press release from the office of Simon Bridges, leader of The National Party. Key ora, New Zealand. Happy Maori Language Week. Look, I’m writing to you today because I want to clear something up. There’s been a lot of kerfuffle around some things ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Yes, the SIS is subject to the Public Records Act
    I understand there's some stuff going round about how the SIS "was removed from the list of public offices covered by the Public Records Act in 2017". The context of course being their records derived from US torture, which will be disposed of or sealed. The good news is that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • An evidence-based discussion of the Canadian fluoride/IQ study
    Dr. Christopher Labos and Jonathan Jarry discuss the recent Canadian fluoride/IQ research. They provide an expert analysis of the paper and its problems. Click on image to go to podcast. The critical debate about the recent ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Climate Change: Australia in denial
    Australia is burning down again, and meanwhile its natural disaster minister is denying climate change:Australia’s minister responsible for drought and natural disasters, David Littleproud, has said that he doesn’t “know if climate change is manmade”. Clarifying earlier comments that the question is “irrelevant” when considering the Coalition government’s response to ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Philippines activist speaking on the Duterte tyranny
    Auckland Philippines Solidarity is excited to host Professor Judy Taguiwalo for a speaking tour of NZ in September. She is a well-known activist in the Philippines and was a political prisoner under the Marcos dictatorship. Professor Taguiwalo briefly served as a Cabinet member under President Duterte but was forced from ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 weeks ago
  • Disgust
    I have no special insights to offer on the Labour sexual assault coverup. All I have is disgust. Disgust that an organisation could fail its people so badly. Disgust that they punished the victims rather than the perpetrator. Disgust that its party hacks are apparently blaming the victims for demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 weeks ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    2 weeks ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    2 weeks ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    2 weeks ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    2 weeks ago

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