The US election daily discussion post

Written By: - Date published: 5:55 am, October 19th, 2016 - 158 comments
Categories: us politics, you couldn't make this shit up - Tags: , ,

This week we are trialling something new. In order to free up Open Mike and Daily Review for other conversations we are asking that all discussion, posting of links etc on the US election goes in the daily dedicated thread rather than OM or DR.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

There will continue to be author-written posts on the US election as well, usual rules apply there too.

158 comments on “The US election daily discussion post”

  1. Colonial Viper 1

    “The key is initiating the conflict by having leading conversations with people who are naturally psychotic”

    – Scott Foval, National Field Director, Americans United for Change. Caught on videotape. This is an organisation with direct campaign and personal contacts with the senior hierarchy of the DNC.

    Remember when all the lefty liberal media and gullible commentariat was bitching hard about how Trump supporters are violent, how they attacked anti-Trump protestors at rallies, how Trump incited hatred and violence at his own events leading to chaos, and how a major Trump rally in Chicago was even shut down due to violence?

    DNC connected operatives and organisations have now taken credit for all of the above, on video tape.

    The Democrats sent, and paid for, “agitators” to go to Trump rallies to try and cause violence to shut them down.

    A massive Alex Jones/Infowars reveal on how utterly rigged the game Hillary’s team is playing.

    More from Foval:

    “We have to have people prepared to go wherever these events are, which means we have to have a central kind of agitator training”

    And how is this done?

    There’s a script. There’s a script of engagement. Sometimes the crazies bite and sometimes the crazies don’t bite.

    Cynical, corrupt, and all to feed the passive, pro-Clinton media machine who will lap incidents at Trump rallies up without questions, and portray Trump and his supporters in the media as inciting hate and violence.

    And last but not least in a string of obscenely revealing lines, Foval again:

    No, I’m saying that we have mentally ill people that we pay to do this shit, make no mistake. Over the last twenty years I’ve paid off some homeless guys to do some crazy stuff, and I’ve also taken them for dinner,..

    • Ad 1.1

      And still 18 more days of it.

      It’s like the Republicans are a wasp trapped in a big strawberry jam sandwich.

    • The Lone Haranguer 1.2

      Its very enlightening, but it wont change the outcome of the election.

      I note that the NZ Herald reported the story in its online website, but that Stuff has completely ignored it (as have most of the MSM in the USA altho its actually a huge story that the voters should know about).

      As a person whose personal choice for the US President was only between Sanders and Trump (tho favouring Trump) – simply because they were outsiders who might bring genuine reforms, and because I despise the Clinton “business as usual for those in power, and with the biggest contributors winning favour” model.

      So I actually owe many of you an apology. Over the past two elections, you on the left have bleated on about how your sides story cant get a decent (or even half decent) write up in the MSM.

      Im now feeling your pain.

      Im bleating about the unfairness of the US election reporting, both in the USA where its really important as they get to vote, and here where Stuff are showing a complete bias against Trump.

      I wish you all a great day

      • Colonial Viper 1.2.1

        Its very enlightening, but it wont change the outcome of the election.

        Can’t disagree with you too much here. Trump’s back is up against a wall at this point.

        Someone analysed that media coverage of sexual allegations against Trump has received 23x more airtime in the US than the wikileaks email dumps against Hillary Clinton.

        In Florida, Clinton ads are outspending Trump ads 50:1.

        RCP’s no toss up electoral map has Clinton utterly smashing Trump by over 100 electoral votes, 322 to 216.

        • The Lone Haranguer 1.2.1.1

          • Colonial Viper 1.2.1.1.1

            No one not even the butcher likes to see how the sausages are made, but this is how it is done.

        • To be fair Trump also received a lot more coverage before the allegations and essentially was getting a ton of free time from the media ever since the primaries, so it’s a little weird to turn around and complain now that free media is no longer working in his favour.

          Clinton’s outspending Trump on ads partially because his campaign is basically broke, and he’s had to pull out of states that are critical to his chance of winning the Presidency. (and also partially because she’s essentially bought and paid for by Wall St)

          • The Lone Haranguer 1.2.1.2.1

            One could be incredibly cynical, and say that in the Republican primaries, the MSM gave Trump wall to wall exposure as they wanted a Trump victory as he would ensure a Clinton victory in the Presidential election and it would be business as usual.

            My disappointment is that this is probably the best chance in a generation to change the political process in the USA.

            Bernie got knifed from within (The DNC) so then he couldnt make change happen, meanwhile the GOP is doing its best to ensure that Trump cant win.

            Looks like its all business as usual

            • Matthew Whitehead 1.2.1.2.1.1

              Yeah, although there’s possibly another chance in terms of primarying Clinton, as she’s likely to be incredibly unpopular after a term actually governing given her existing unfavourables.

              • Andre

                An unusual thing about Hillary is she tends to have very high favourable ratings at the end of her stint in the spotlight. As First Lady, New York Senator, and Sec of State she finished up with favourables in the 60s.

          • Colonial Viper 1.2.1.2.2

            Sure, at the end of Sept the Trump campaign had only half the cash on hand compared to Clinton (approx $75M vs approx $150M for Clinton) so he is at a big disadvantage to the much larger corporate sponsored Hillary campaign.

            Still I think it’s a stretch to describe his campaign as “basically broke.”

      • The New Student 1.2.2

        MSM won’t touch anything from James O’Keefe, he’s too shady

    • Chooky 1.3

      that is a very revealing insight into how the Democrats are operating…and it is getting wide international circulation…it was actually first pointed out to me by a 21 year old who incidentally does not come to this site

    • Sanctuary 1.4

      OMFG, CV falls for a conspiracy theory nutjob press release….

      to quote Russell Brown:

      “…Why haven’t most media reported it? because it’s based on yet another ambush video from James O’Keefe, who has a long history of dishonest editing and misrepresentation.

      So it’s impossible to tell how how much of what is depicted is actually true – in this case, how much of it is simply getting supporters to front up at Trump rallies, whether it’s really endorsed by the campaign, etc – as journalists have learned to their cost in the past…”

      http://heavy.com/news/2016/10/democrats-incite-start-violence-at-trump-rallies-video-violent-protests-agitator-dnc-democracy-partners-scott-foval-james-okeefe-veritas-hoax-truth/

      The Publicaddress thread is entitled “Trump’s dummkopfs”.

      Dummies here indeed, although the idiots at the Herald, who picked this story up from an obviously fake news site ABCNEWS.com.co, deserve a mention in the “big dummies” column as well.

      • Colonial Viper 1.4.1

        “…Why haven’t most media reported it? because it’s based on yet another ambush video from James O’Keefe, who has a long history of dishonest editing and misrepresentation.

        You read the full sentence/multi-sentence quotes from Democratic operative Foval, caught on video. You got an innocent explanation for what he said?

        Great, let’s hear it. Why don’t you start with his quote about how he paid off some homeless people to do crazy shit.

        • McFlock 1.4.1.1

          oh my god I can’t believe I sat through that shit.

          Basically, there seemed to be a couple of distinct conversations the interviewees were asked about: operating an election campaign in an environment of superpacs (thanks, koch bros), and the fact that one of the best tactics against trump supporters is encouraging them to be themselves. All that intermediary crap was a direct result of Citizens United, and thank god we have better electoral financing controls in NZ.

          Who knows what the “crazy shit” was – handing out planned parenthood leaflets along the line? What do you think it was?

          A “dirty trick” would be to have folks pretend to be trump supporters and then say to the media that sexual assault is fine, or that clinton supporters should be beaten up. Why is it a dirty trick to let trump supporters just be themselves when a clinton supporter turns up?

          • Colonial Viper 1.4.1.1.1

            and the fact that one of the best tactics against trump supporters is encouraging them to be themselves.

            Indeed, in the USA its been a prime way for the FBI to set up and prosecute intellectually disabled and poorly educated Muslim men as terrorists.

            • TheExtremist 1.4.1.1.1.1

              Which Trump has promised to throw into his newly expanded Gitmo facility

            • McFlock 1.4.1.1.1.2

              Actually, yeah, I reckon some of those cases come disturbingly close to entrapment.

              But then nobody other than trump supporters actively encourage trump supporters to hit protestors. well, other than trump himself, but never mind that….

  2. The post election situation if trump loses may be fraught – his supporters do include some pretty dicey characters who, fired up with the weeks of ‘rigged election’ lines, may think it is time to take their country back. This seems a higher likelihood as some of the supporters of trump have a visceral, pathological hatred and irrationality towards clinton. (please note I don’t support or endorse clinton.

    Obama has it right here – stop whining trump

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/americas/85492597/obama-to-trump-theres-no-evidence-us-election-is-being-rigged-so-stop-whining

    • It’s so bad that the Senate is extremely likely to go Democratic, and it’s actually in the cards (although not yet anywhere near likely) that the House will flip, despite ridiculous gerrymandering by the Republicans in the last census year.

  3. Ad 4

    Vogue and Anna Wintour have endorsed Hillary.

    First endorsement ever.
    It’s all over.😇

  4. AmaKiwi 5

    When facts don’t matter, how can democracy survive?

    • joe90 6.1

      Well…… – I just start kissing them. It’s like a magnet. Just kiss. I don’t even wait…….

    • weka 6.2

      Anything Trump does now that involves another person’s body is going to be suspect and many will see it as creepy. That he cannot see or probably imagine why it would be inappropriate for him to be kissing a girl given all the allegations against him including one of child rape, just reinforces that the man is a fucking disaster of a human being.

      Having said that, I think that article is going over the top and egging things on. Looking at one of her first links, where she claims to have ‘proof’ that people don’t like being touched by Trump and presents a series of photos, I am again unconvinced. I have no trouble at all believing that many people don’t like being touched by Trump, but her article on that isn’t even close to ‘proof’ (whatever that would be), but is instead a whole bunch of opportunistic interpretations to suit an agenda. I hate that shit in CV, and I don’t think it’s useful in people trying to deal with rape culture either.

      The video of him kissing the girl shows his creepy behaviour, but I don’t think the girl was particularly creeped out by him, or at least it’s not particularly visible if she is. The writer is trying to say that x action by the child means y, but I think that’s really stretching it.

      I don’t know what her agenda is (haven’t looked closely enough at her work), but I think we should be prepared for the particular American crazy that will happen when genuine or useful addressing of rape culture gets mixed up with the pop media, gladiator culture and Oprah-fication of the issues.

  5. Curious George 7

    Rigging the Election – Video II: Mass Voter Fraud

    • Colonial Viper 7.1

      I am told by lefties that only Republicans would do this kind of dirty underhanded shite for money

      • Ad 7.1.1

        LBJ was far better at the dark arts of Texas.

        • Colonial Viper 7.1.1.1

          True, but even a guy like LBJ needed operators on the ground to do the actual electoral dirty work.

          • Ad 7.1.1.1.1

            And he had real naaaasty ones.
            Shoulda stood again, against Nixon.

            Can’t wait for the Republican party leadership to really cry foul. Remind them of Florida’s hanging chads.

      • TheExtremist 7.1.2

        Gawd CV, do you actually think the election is going to be rigged?

        • Colonial Viper 7.1.2.1

          No, there are no voting machines at the bottom of the Great Lakes, that never happens in the USA

          • TheExtremist 7.1.2.1.1

            So if Trump loses you think it is because it is rigged rather than because he lost fair and square?

        • Liberal Realist 7.1.2.2

          Gawd CV, do you actually think the election is going to be rigged?

          TheExtremist, do you actually think the US election won’t be rigged?

          Do you really honestly think that the US ruling class will leave it to ‘the people’ to decide who wins? I certainly don’t. It should be obvious to anyone that the powers that be do not want a Trump presidency, so if deemed necessary, everything that can be done to avoid one, will be done.

          Electronic voting machines, to my knowledge, are controlled by one of four private companies in the US; Diebold, ESS, Sequoia, and SAIC. How easily do you think these voting machines can be programmed to ensure a certain outcome? Is programming verified? How easy is it to update firmware/software?

          Paper ballots can at least be verified, the same can’t be said for electronic ballots w/o audit trails.

    • The New Student 7.2

      A kinda poor piece really. All context conveniently removed, so the responses from the targets make little sense. It’s not something I would consider credible. Particularly so when one considers the credibility of Project Veritas themselves. Need something more factual, reliable and robust.

  6. joe90 8

    Trump has the swinger vote locked up.

  7. Colonial Viper 9

    On election day Trump must win Ohio, Florida and North Carolina to have any real chance of making it to 270. If he doesn’t win all three, a Clinton Presidency is the likely outcome.

    BUT if Trump wins tiny New Hampshire and Maine early on, he will sweep the nation.

    • Ad 9.1

      Republicans should follow Ryans advice and defend the Senate with everything they’ve got.

    • joe90 9.2

      About those blackberries…….

      I can tell you professionally that, no, smashing blackberries with a hammer is NOT protocol, ever. lol@fawfulfan @Deathc0de— #MakeDCListen™ (@RickCanton) October 18, 2016

      Oops, yes it is. https://t.co/wgzGpmvZZD @RickCanton @Deathc0de— Matthew Chapman (@fawfulfan) October 18, 2016

      If for some reason you do not wish to use a service, it is possible for you to destroy your hard drive by drilling nails or holes into the device yourself or even smashing it with a hammer.

      https://www.us-cert.gov/sites/default/files/publications/DisposeDevicesSafely.pdf

      • Colonial Viper 9.2.1

        Wow. Talk about making excuses for the destruction of evidence of interest to a Federal or Congressional investigation, and or materials/information required to be kept as public records.

        Management of Department of State Records

        As mandated by the Federal Records Act and reflected in 5 FAM 400, the Department must create and preserve records containing adequate and proper documentation of the organization, functions, policies, decisions, procedures, and essential transactions or operations of the Department and U.S. Embassies, Consulates, and Missions abroad.

        Department of State records are organized into three basic file series:

        Central Foreign Policy file – contains all telegrams sent or received by the Department of State and selected internal memoranda, written correspondence, diplomatic notes, congressional requests, memorandums of conversations and documents from other agencies.

        Post files – the records of U.S. Embassies, Consulates and other diplomatic missions abroad.

        Lot files – collections of records generated by offices in the Department of State.

        Deleting tens of thousands of work emails some of which contained sensitive or secret information, and smashing mobile devices to destroy evidence and impede investigations, risks contravening these requirements.

        https://foia.state.gov/Learn/RecordsManagement.aspx

  8. Chooky 10

    …Given recent Posts and discussions on this site which are primarily attacking Trump over his use of misogynist language

    (eg this is a typical statement: “Like a great many women and a fair amount of men too, I’m disgusted (but not surprised) with the misogyny expressed by Trump.”)

    This study is very interesting:

    ‘Women more likely to use misogynistic terms online, report finds’

    https://www.rt.com/uk/363048-women-online-misogyny-report/

    “Women in the UK and US are more likely to use misogynist language on social media than men, according to the results of a four-year study.
    The research was carried out by the social media research firm Brandwatch and looked at 19 million tweets over a four-year period to assess the levels of anti-woman sentiment expressed online.

    The study found that over that period there were 3 million posts which contained terms abusive to women – with women most likely to have posted them…

    The report was carried out for anti-bullying charity Ditch The Label, and found that words like “bitch,” “cow” and “slut” had passed into common usage by women online…

    [You intend to post this same comment day after day to this thread Chooky? Bad idea. Very bad idea. I’m letting it through this time essentially to point out the very simple fact that how a word is used makes a world of difference to the impact it has. Y’know, like whether it’s used to attack someone directly or whether it’s an unflattering descriptor. eg – “She’s a cow” & “I’m going to get you, you cow”. As such, your wavy armed reference to a study on post content means….nothing very much at all. Not re-posting the same comment tomorrow would be a very good idea. Trust me.] – Bill

  9. Ovid 12

    I took the test on ISideWith – if I could vote in the US my results say I am in 99% agreement with Hillary Clinton on policy issues. Followed closely by 96% for Jill Stein.

    It’s an interesting exercise.

    • Andre 12.1

      99% with Clinton? Just outed yourself as a Deep State agent of the lizard-people, then.

      But seriously, when you get down to looking at the actual platform statements it’s surprising how much Sanders’ influence pushed the Dems towards the Greens. My results (a while ago) were 99% with Stein and 94% with Clinton.

    • Colonial Viper 12.2

      my results say I am in 99% agreement with Hillary Clinton on policy issues.

      What’s Clinton’s position on the mass electronic surveillance of your email and internet use? Are you in agreeance with it?

      How about Clinton’s position on containing China in the South China Sea and containing Russia in the Middle East? Are you in agreeance with it?

      • Ovid 12.2.1

        What’s Clinton’s position on the mass electronic surveillance of your email and internet use? Are you in agreeance with it?

        It’s a modern reality. I don’t like it, but I don’t see it changing under either of the two major candidates.

        How about Clinton’s position on containing China in the South China Sea.

        Yes. Absolutely. New Zealand has a direct interest in the security of our allies in Malaysia, Brunei and Singapore.

        Containing Russia in the Middle East? Are you in agreeance with it?

        It’s complicated and I haven’t formed an opinion. But I do have a bad opinion of Putin after Ukraine and Georgia. That doesn’t mean I know what the best outcome is for the Middle East.

        • Colonial Viper 12.2.1.1

          IMO the incidents in Ukraine and Georgia were instigated and supported by the west in order to destabilise the borders around Russia.

          Russia eventually reacted very strongly and could have taken the capitals of both countries within 48 hours but Putin has no stomach for expanding a struggling Russia into economic basket cases.

          Yes. Absolutely. New Zealand has a direct interest in the security of our allies in Malaysia, Brunei and Singapore.

          Sure. But look at the Philippines. They have decided – much to the annoyance of the US – that a closer relationship with China and negotiated settlements is the way to go. Not escalating militarisation of the region.

          It’s a modern reality. I don’t like it, but I don’t see it changing under either of the two major candidates.

          Agree. That’s the reality created by our allies in the USA.

          • TheExtremist 12.2.1.1.1

            Don’t tell me you are also a supporter of the fucking psychopath in the Philippines also?

            • Colonial Viper 12.2.1.1.1.1

              Time for another US coup in the Philippines already?

              • TheExtremist

                Do you support Rodrigo Duterte? It’s a yes no question

                • Colonial Viper

                  Do you support regime change in the Philippines? It’s a yes no question.

                  • TheExtremist

                    Please, before posing another question – address the one presented to you.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      If Duterte was democratically and constitutionally elected, then I believe that he has the right to lead the sovereign nation of the Philippines as empowered and enabled by their constitution.

                      Your turn.

                    • TheExtremist

                      No I don’t think any power should intervene. Do you support his policies?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Let me have a look at the PDP-Laban election manifesto, and I’ll get back to you.

                      I do support his efforts to talk more with Beijing and lead a massive business delegation to China instead of simply helping the US keep ramping militarisation of the South China Sea.

                    • TheExtremist

                      Over 3000 people are dead and he has compared himself to Hitler. So you have to think about whether you support that?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I think drug dealers in the Philippines should be tried according to their legal system and if found guilty then their penalty applied.

                      Ordinary drug users and addicts require intensive healthcare and counselling, not vigilante killing by authorities.

                      3,000 sounds like a large number but Chicago’s per capita homicide rate so far this year is way way higher.

                      Mind you I caught a youtube piece on how coffin makers in Manila were working over time because of these killings. Very nasty.

                    • McFlock

                      Most people would think that extrajudicial murder as an election platform would be amongst the most notable of policies – CV overlooks it if trade delegations are sent to China.

                      3000 extra murders is a third of the 2014 total.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      3000 additional murders is, per capita, one quarter or one fifth of Chicago’s 2016 homicide rate.

                      Most people would think that extrajudicial murder as an election platform would be amongst the most notable of policies – CV overlooks it if trade delegations are sent to China.

                      De-escalating military tensions in the South China Sea is more important to saving the lives of millions.

                    • McFlock

                      “De-escalation” in the face of territorial expansion is also known as “appeasement”.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I’m sorry McFlock, has China expanded into some US territory that I haven’t heard about?

                      Re: the South China Sea. do you think Duterte leading a massive economic delegation to China is, in essence, a spineless appeasement initiative hoping to placate China?

                    • McFlock

                      Who said US territory? Spurious claims on artificial islands interfering with international sea and air lanes is enough.

                      An no, I think it’s a blowhard selling out his country’s national interests by sucking up to the local heavies.

                  • Peter Swift

                    “Do you support regime change in the Philippines? It’s a yes no question.”

                    Yep, change away. This Duterte bloke is one fucked up psycho monkey drunk on the power.
                    Not yet as bad body count wise as Assad the barrel bomber, the Putin protected chlorine killer of children and aid convoy butcher, but give him time.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      It wouldn’t be the first time the US installed a puppet murderer into Manila.

                    • Peter Swift

                      But the first time you appeased one for political expediency, in public, for all to see.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Hey Peter Swift, will the US be able to find President Marcos v2.0 to install in Manila?

                    • Peter Swift

                      I’m not responsible for the USA’s historic foreign policy, so please do deflect for your life, bro. You’re the one still sticking up for credibility busting gangster dictators and murderous mentals, not me.

                      You can get all the +100’s you like, but with that line of thought, you’ll never get what you really need.
                      You changed, man. And not in a good way.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      No seriously Peter Swift. Since you are the one who wants an unconstitutional coup d’etat in the Philippines, my question to you is: do you think the US will be able to find a new President Marcos v2.0 to install in Manila?

                      Or do you think that the US should simply co-opt a corrupt Filipino military general to take over the Philippines government? Maybe it would be simpler and more effective for the US to do away with the pretense of democracy altogether?

                    • McFlock

                      Are you seriously defending on the basis of constitutional legality a regime built on extrajudicial murder ?

                      Cake: have and eat.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      The sovereing Filipino Government (not “REGIME” as bloody minded western colonial powers like to use) is legitimate and built on a constitutional democracy.

                      Extrajudicial murder?

                      You do realise that Filipino military and para military units have closely trained with the US for years.

                      It’s probably where they picked up all these skills in “extrajudicial murder.”

                      At least Duterte hasn’t started using US style extrajudicial drone strikes yet. Maybe that’s to come?

                      After all, they say that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

                      Further context: Chicago has a homicide rate which is four or five times greater than these extrajudicial killings.

                    • Peter Swift

                      Despite what you might want to believe to be true, you don’t have a monopoly on setting the agenda or promoting options, therefore, with that in mind, I reject your choices as I’d prefer the people realise their elected leader is a violent, psychopathic ass and deal to him accordingly.

                      But interesting how you write about sovereignty, even though you criticise former soviet states for wanting closer ties with Nato and the EU, wanting to deny their right to self determination and security.

                      Cake and eat it, perhaps. Hypocrisy, a sure thing.

                    • McFlock

                      The sovereing Filipino Government (not “REGIME” as bloody minded western colonial powers like to use) is legitimate and built on a constitutional democracy.

                      The same constitution that protects citizens from being summarily murdered by police by explicitly stipulating a right to due process.

                      Flail around as much as you want about cherry-picked murder rate comparisons, or whatever. If Duterte chooses to ignore the constitution that protects the lives of citizens, the constitution does not legitimise his government.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Yes McFlock, time for the US to set up justification for a “humanitarian intervention” in the Philippines for the good of all Filipinos. It is the west’s “responsibility to protect” innocents, with massive military might or coups, if necessary.

                      BTW

                      Filipino police drive van over anti-US protestors in front of US Embassy:

                    • TheExtremist

                      “It’s probably where they picked up all these skills in “extrajudicial murder.”

                      The majority of the murders have been carried out by civilians and police. Not “ilipino military and para military units”
                      Because the government gave carte blanche to anyone and everyone to kill anyone else based upon suspicion of drug use.

                    • McFlock

                      No CV.
                      But it’s time for you to stop bleating that duterte has constitutional legitimacy, because he rejects that very constitution.

                      You’re defending him with something for which he has nothing but contempt, simply because he sent a trade delegation to China. You were better off with your argument about how Duterte might be a psycho, but only he can prevent nuclear war.

            • RedLogix 12.2.1.1.1.2

              It’s another really interesting question TE. No question he is by our standards a fucking psychopath. But then again the Filipino’s seem to want their own standards that make sense in their own situation.

              A few months back I got to talking with a relatively educated Filipino whose home town is Davao City. He completely supported Duterte because “he cleaned up my town and made it safe again. Before it was hell, now we can live again”.

              http://edition.cnn.com/2016/10/18/asia/philippines-duterte-supporters/index.html

              • Colonial Viper

                Putin did similar in Dagestan and Chechnya. The West would have greatly preferred the Russian Federation to implode, splinter and be Balkanized.

              • Colonial Viper

                Also reminds me when the Palestinians voted Hamas in. Well, the west’s respect for democracy went out the window faster than you could blink.

                Evil sonsabitches are permitted to wage tyranny over entire nations…but only if they are the western empire’s approved evil sonsabitches.

                • Stuart Munro

                  Putin only got to do over Chechnya because Bush was making his own mischief in Iraq and Afghanistan. Do you condemn Bush? If so, you should not hurry to excuse Putin.

            • Draco T Bastard 12.2.1.1.1.3

              It’s not up to you or me – it’s up to the Filipinos. It’s up to them to choose how to deal with criminals in their nation. Yes, they’re probably getting it wrong, a lot of those being killed probably aren’t even criminals but that is their lesson to learn and we can’t go round forcing our beliefs on them.

              Now, if Duterte was a NZ supported dictator we’d have a say in it and that say should be to remove him.

              If he was a US supported dictator we still shouldn’t support him, we should be making a huge noise to get the US to remove him and we should be putting in place embargoes on trading with the US.

  10. Curious George 13

    https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/15419

    “It goes on to say that its own IC IG review of the 55,000 pages
    > determined that at least 4 of these emails should have been classified
    > “secret” on account of them containing IC information subject to such
    > classification and that a thumb drive containing these emails is presently
    > in the possession of David Kendall (that would be me) at Williams &
    > Connolly. The matter has been referred to counterintelligence officials at
    > State and the IC (National Counterterrorism & Security Center) and the FBI.

    dkendall@wc.com | http://www.wc.com/dkendall

    Stay Classy 🙂

  11. joe90 14

    heh

    Trump wraps up rally in CO: "Nov. 8. Go out and vote Nov. 8."No mention of the state's all-mail voting system as ballots drop this week.— Adam Wollner (@AdamWollner) October 18, 2016

    Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump urged his supporters to go out and vote… on the wrong election date. See @rtenews pic.twitter.com/Xn5Z9sipve— RTÉ (@rte) October 12, 2016

  12. Sanctuary 15

    Has anyone seen Trevor Loudon and CV in the same room together?

    You might say, but Loudon is paranoid delusional old white guy living in America, whereas CV is a paranoid delusional Asian living in Dunedin.

    Well, ever heard of shape shifting lizard people with transporter technology?

    Just sayin’.

  13. Andre 16

    Honest celeb gets asked to do a “get out and vote” video.

  14. Andre 17

    Seems Ecuador isn’t happy about being party to meddling in the US election.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/ecuador-assange-internet-election_us_5806a481e4b0dd54ce362c5d?section=&

    • weka 17.1

      Presumably he can still use a cell phone or other device to connect?

      • Andre 17.1.1

        You’d think so. But that wouldn’t be using Ecuador’s physical infrastructure. And it might stretch Ecuador’s welcome a bit too far.

        • weka 17.1.1.1

          “But that wouldn’t be using Ecuador’s physical infrastructure.”

          Yes, that is what I meant. Apart from the symbolic nature of what Ecuador has done, and the addition cost of cell phone data, would there be any reason for him not to have internet access?

          “And it might stretch Ecuador’s welcome a bit too far.”

          How so?

          • Andre 17.1.1.1.1

            Ecuador is already taking some damage to its international relations with western countries by hosting Assange. If Ecuador feels its interests are being further damaged by Assange’s activities while he is their guest, then it may be a reasonable interpretation that Ecuador cutting the internet is also a message to Assange to back off. If Assange then chooses to ignore that, then Ecuador may decide continuing to host him is more trouble than it’s worth.

            • weka 17.1.1.1.1.1

              Makes sense. Back off in terms of Wikileaks?

              • Andre

                That seems the obvious conclusion. Or maybe it’s no more than just Ecuador wanting to remove themselves from the traceable communication chain.

            • Colonial Viper 17.1.1.1.1.2

              Ecuador is already taking some damage to its international relations with western countries by hosting Assange.

              Time for another western sponsored coup d’etat against Correa in Ecuador yet?

              With western friends like these, who needs enemies?

          • Andre 17.1.1.1.2

            Another view on whether Ecuador may see Assange as the house-guest that hung around too long.

            http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/10/18/is_julian_assange_wearing_out_his_welcome_at_the_ecuadorean_embassy.html

      • McFlock 17.1.2

        well he’s still on twitter, apparently, so I guess so.

  15. Curious George 18

    “I’m excited to be at the debate. Trump can make America great again,” Malik

  16. Chooky 20

    So Hillary’s friends tried to bribe the FBI?!!!! (wow)

    ….and under Hillary’s watch/supervision $300 billion dollars in weapons was sold to countries with human rights abuses, especially abuses to women?!!!! (wow)

    ….and (here is the clincher)

    …these countries gave money to the Clinton Foundation in return ?!!!!! (wow)

    ‘ ‘House committee demands criminal investigation of State Dept. undersecretary over FBI ‘quid pro quo’ ‘

    https://www.rt.com/usa/363242-state-kennedy-fbi-doj-investigation/

    “The demand to have Undersecretary Patrick Kennedy investigated for allegedly offering bribes to the FBI has intensified. The House Judiciary Committee is calling on the Department of Justice to examine the allegations for criminal wrongdoing.

    House Judiciary Committee Chairman Bob Goodlatte (R-Virginia) called upon Attorney General Loretta Lynch to investigate allegations that Undersecretary of State Patrick Kennedy made quid pro quo offers to the FBI during its investigation into Hillary Clinton’s use of a private email server…

    ( the definition of corruption and warmongering…and hypocrisy)

    Trump is an innocent babe choir boy

  17. miravox 21

    The Russians and Wikileaks are making the press hurt itself, and damage democracy in the process, according to Zack Beauchamp and no-one knows what to do about it.

    http://www.vox.com/world/2016/10/17/13245200/russia-wikileaks-american-press-democracy

    It’s not enough for WikiLeaks to publish hacked emails. Very few ordinary people actually go through raw data dumps. You need media outlets with wide readerships to disseminate the hacked information and to put politically damaging quotes from and about Clinton into newspaper articles and television broadcasts that reach tens of millions of people. If Russia succeeds in disrupting the US election, then it will have only done so because it had the press as its partner.

    “It’s not just getting the information; it’s getting it distributed and disseminated widely,” Nicholas Weaver, a senior researcher at UC Berkeley’s International Computer Science Institute, explains. “One thing I think is important is for press institutions to recognize when they’re being used.”

    This isn’t happening because the American press is pro-Russian. Far from it. Russia is instead playing on the press’s incentives, making it so that the US press has little choice but to go along with its plan.

    • Colonial Viper 21.1

      Yeah, well fuck the western corporate press. Like The Guardian who hung Poitras and Appelbaum out to dry when the heat came on from MI6, and the Washington Post who happily collected a Pulitzer based on the Snowden material, then afterwards published an editorial saying that their source, Snowden should be prosecuted and jailed.

      Here in NZ this same corporate press keeps giving free passes to John Key and the National Govt to keep smashing away at NZ’s independence and economic sovereignty while enriching their own rich mates.

      What fuckwits.

  18. Curious George 23

    what you could do is in youtube type in Haitians for Clinton, or Haitians and Hillary, or whatever combo you like,
    maybe even her brothers gold mine….. I leave it up to you, you decide, have fun.

    Correct the record doing a sloppy job, forgot to infest all social media.

  19. Curious George 24

    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=haitians+for+hillary

    Happy to McFlock, point demonstrated, will you accept it or ignore it?

    you could also read Chelsea Clinton’s report I posted above and watch the video in same post…
    I can’t force you to, hence my suggestion you learn for yourself as you seem to reject out of course anything posted by others with a differing view, so I leave it up to you.

    stay classy.

    • McFlock 24.1

      No, you still haven’t made a point.

      But then you haven’t yet mastered the reply button, so one can’t expect miracles…

  20. Curious George 25

    Willful ignorance was the point, and as I said, I leave it up to you, thank you for proving my point.

    And as to the reply button, it is not conducive to conducting open and inclusive debates.
    I see it as compartmentalizing conversations and restricting transparency, allowing bullies to degrade themselves by engaging in dishonesty and abusive behavior.

    A behind closed doors mechanism, to allow children to act out without being called out.

    • McFlock 25.1

      You do realise the reply button just indents the comment and keeps it in the thread? Everyone can still read it.

      So the point of a report on the disorganisation of aid efforts in Haiti and a video of a guy who apparently believes that the Clinton Foundation received “billions” ringfenced for Haitian earthquake relief were intended to make a point about “willful ignorance”?

  21. Clinton from her convention speech in July

    “… I can’t put it any better than Jackie Kennedy did after the Cuban Missile Crisis. She said that what worried President Kennedy during that very dangerous time was that a war might be started – not by big men with self-control and restraint, but by little men – the ones moved by fear and pride.”

    http://www.vox.com/2016/7/28/12319846/hillary-clinton-dnc-speech-trump-nukes

    Still true that one and trump is a very very little man…

    • joe90 26.1

      I recall my mum being in tears during the Cuban crisis, talking since – as a young mother with four under 8 she really did think it was all on and she and her children were gone burger.

      • Colonial Viper 26.1.1

        Hillary Clinton was a key player in the destabilisation and destruction of both Libya and Syria, and an architect of the American military “pivot to Asia” which is rapidly increasing military tensions in the South China Sea.

        • McFlock 26.1.1.1

          and trump wants to dismantle the nuclear nonproliferation treaty.

          • Colonial Viper 26.1.1.1.1

            Oh, he’ll reconsider that when General Flynn asks him to.

            Meanwhile, Obama unilaterally abrogated the terms of US/Russia plutonium disposition agreement, placed nuclear capable missile systems a couple of hundred km from the Russian border, while developing a new generation of more usable advanced nuclear warheads.

            • McFlock 26.1.1.1.1.1

              lol at that “nuclear capable” bullshit again, especially given recent russian ballistic missile deployments. And reconditioning your mod12 bullshit again? Poetical, that..

              But what is really fucking pathetic is that when faced with the oompah-loompah policies that not even you, our most fervent trumpeter, can defend, you just say that he didn’t really mean that one.

              What other policies will he “reconsider”? The Wall? The religious database? Expanding the drone programme and gitmo? Getting nato nations to boost their defense spending? Locking up his political opponents?

              You’re a bad joke defending a bad dream.

              • Colonial Viper

                Well, Trump is not going to be able to physically build that wall, and Mexico does not have the money to pay for it, so that’s a policy he will not be able to keep.

                lol at that “nuclear capable” bullshit again

                ???

                Putin has all the specifications of the ABM systems and under questioning he told the international press that Russia knows exactly what upgrades will be happening to those systems and in what years, and that Russia will take steps to counter those developments.

                I would say that stationing Iskander missile systems in Kaliningrad is just part of that programme.

                • McFlock

                  lol

                  so an anti-ballistic missile system is actually a ballistic missile system, and a ballistic missile system is also an anti-anti-ballistic missile system.

                  You don’t believe trump, but you believe putin when he says he knows all about US defense technology.

                  Three women accuse bill clinton of sexual misconduct, so you believe he’s a dangerous predator, but when a dozen women and his own words accuse trump of sexual misconduct, you don’t believe it.

                  lol

                  • Colonial Viper

                    Uh, what?

                    • McFlock

                      can’t keep up with your own bullshit?

                      What type of missile is iskander? What is the ABM (the clue is in the acronym)? Which one would a normal person say counters the other?

                      How would you divvy up the “anti”s if someone wanted to put the countering arse about face?

                      I saw a nuclear-capable horse on the way home. A scurrilous provocation, in your school of geopolitics.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      What type of missile is iskander? What is the ABM (the clue is in the acronym)? Which one would a normal person say counters the other?

                      The same missiles used in the ABM system, but with different software, has already demonstrated an effective anti-satellite capability.

                      Tell me McFlock, where is that in the acronym “ABM”?

                      For a smart person, you’re really thick some days.

                      What type of missile is iskander?

                      Wikipedia says it is a short range missile with, depending on the model, nuclear tipped options and hypersonic warhead maneuvering capabilities.

                      My understanding is that US ABM systems cannot intercept these warheads once they reach hypersonic speeds.

                    • McFlock

                      lol, you get your understanding of US weapons systems from putin.

                      Being “nuclear capable” requires more than a software patch, even if your assertions were correct (big if, and frankly you’de be talking about a leo satellite well within the trajectory of a ballistic missile, not something geostationary).

  22. joe90 27

    This is going to be fun.

    Michael Moore has announced the surprise release of a Donald Trump documentary.
    What would the Trump TV network actually look like?
    Read more

    The Oscar-winning film-maker will bring Michael Moore in Trumpland to the big screen with an initial New York screening where tickets will be free. The film will then be officially released on 19 October.

    The official description reads as follows: “See the film Ohio Republicans tried to shut down. Oscar-winner Michael Moore dives right into hostile territory with his daring and hilarious one-man show, deep in the heart of TrumpLand in the weeks before the 2016 election.”

    https://www.theguardian.com/film/2016/oct/18/michael-moore-surprise-donald-trump-documentary?

    • weka 27.1

      I don’t get it. Is it a film of a one man show he performs in theatres? Or is is just a film of him doing a one man show? Which was the one stopped in Ohio?

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