Translating Tories: “Incentives to get ahead”

49 comments on “Translating Tories: “Incentives to get ahead” ”

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1. fizzleplug 1

   3 February 2010 at 1:09 pm

   Presently, the quickest way for me to pay less in (net) taxation would be to have children with my wife. Which I need to make sure she doesn’t find out, as she will want them even more than she does now!
2. Jim Nald 2

   3 February 2010 at 1:18 pm

   Cool! And will we be looking forward to incentives for housekeeping support (via State allowance)? Would be fantastic if we can also get fully/partly subsidised accounting advice to arrange our household income in the most advantageous way.
3. prism 3

   3 February 2010 at 1:20 pm

   The phrase is regularly used isn’t it – “to lift economic growth and give hard-working New Zealanders incentives to get ahead”.
   I think it is meant to go right to the suspicious heart of many middle class (but never rich!) NZs that they are bearing the weight of keeping NZ going while all the other lazy buggers fritter around, skive off, or sit around on benefits moaning in between draining beer bottles.
   As an old correspondence school advert (probably 1950s) puts it – “The successful man Does to-day what the failure Intends doing to-morrow”. There’s something in that but Key’s approach appeals to a simplistic knee-jerk reaction in many workers.
4. indiana 4

   3 February 2010 at 1:22 pm

   “We have enough incentives to “get ahead’ already. We’re hard-working already”

   Are you saying we should be content with what we have? And if we are already ahead we can stop working so hard now and relax?

   “most people will never be rich” – this reminds me of the Fat Boy Slim album cover where the kid is wearing a T-Shirt that says “I’m #1, so why try harder”
5. BLiP 5

   3 February 2010 at 1:31 pm

   Brilliant suggestion. I look forward to the series of “plain English” posts. I was tempted to contribute with an explanation of “Trickle Down” but, by now, is there really anyone who doesn’t already know that its just a Tory’s giggling expression for “Golden Shower” whereby the rich get to piss all over the workers?

   [lprent: Nah – go ahead and write a short phrase dictionary… ]
   • Jim Nald 5.1

     3 February 2010 at 1:37 pm

     hehe … that is giving me a ‘tickle down’
6. randal 6

   3 February 2010 at 1:35 pm

   “THEY” get away with it because there are enough two bob tin pot tories to vote them in.
   if there are no losers then “THEY” cant be winners.
   simple really.
   appealing to the basest motives of the wannabees and tryhards.
7. pollywog 7

   3 February 2010 at 1:35 pm

   hard working new zealanders…pffft.

   who exactly is that ?

   it aint maori cos well, they’re maori not new zealanders and besides they can always go back to the corporate warriors in their suits and ties for a tribal handout. yeah, key got those [please use a non racist term] on lock down. just keep feeding the kupapa ( thats uncle toms for those not down with teh reo) the crumbs and buy em off with jobs for the boys.

   it aint polynesians cos most of us have this identity crisis shit going on. too fucked up in being held back by honour and pride to island culture to let go of it and become new zealanders. besides we’re just too humble and ignorant to push for what we’re really worth figuring it’s better than being back home.

   economic growth for us is being able to upsize our happy meal so i wonder what the incentive will be for us to work harder ?…i know, how about food vouchers ?

   [This comment is borderline pollywog. You have points to make, but please don’t cross the line into racist language. — r0b]
   • ieuan 7.1

     3 February 2010 at 1:59 pm

     Can someone please remove this offensive comment.

     [Thanks ieuan – see note added above — r0b]
   • pollywog 7.2

     3 February 2010 at 3:51 pm

     i always find it funny that white people get offended at the ‘n’ word as if sticking up for brownie shows how enlightened they are but really, for whose benefit is the show for ? kinda condescending to be offended on someone elses behalf

     it aint no big thing its just how we talk in the hood. you know how you guys call each other righty and leftie ? well we say nigga, like in street nigga and house nigga. still, fair enough gotta be careful with the language eh ?

     like it’s ok to talk shit about the working poor and how they need to have more initiative, possibly should have stayed in school longer, learnt the white way, taken risks and be more entrepreneurial but when most of the working poor is of a differing ethnicity then you wouldn’t want to be seen as racist by legislating policies that inhibit their ability to ‘get ahead’.

     tell you what, in future i’ll subsitute niggas with muthafuckas and distiguish between white ones and black/brown ones where appropriate. but if you guys can warn others on crossing the line into sexist language like tosser or prick then that’d be fair too eh ?
     • BLiP 7.2.1

       3 February 2010 at 4:14 pm

       You ain’t no brudda
       • pollywog 7.2.1.1

         3 February 2010 at 4:39 pm

         i know we live under a white mofo instituted system and from it’s inception there has always been a cultural bias in favour of your good selves so it might come as a surprise for some that everyday polynesians (inclusive of maori) don’t understand the distinction between left and right, tax law, bank law, corporate law, how the market works and even exactly what capitalism is, except that it’s effects have disadvantaged them from day one and made us some of the fattest people on earth.

         so while you guys have your class war and all, dont mind us if we choose not to take sides cos we’re in a class of our own. it’s usually the lowest and its lessons are not taught in our languages. its a lot like translating tory speak. it all sounds the same to us no matter which side of the political fence you’re talking from.

         seems we still respond well to baubles and trinkets though or carrots and sticks.
         • pollywog 7.2.1.1.1

           3 February 2010 at 4:49 pm

           hah…stormy seas aint nuthin to us Baron.

           but i am surprised no ones shat on my grammar, spelling and punctuation…yet:)
           • felix 7.2.1.1.1.1

             3 February 2010 at 4:54 pm

             Perhaps that’s because no-one can be arsed deciphering it.
           • r0b 7.2.1.1.1.2

             3 February 2010 at 5:25 pm

             Pollywog – that’s an interesting blog you have. You have a voice.

             You’ve clearly decided to adopt a certain persona here — that’s fine, whatever. Most of us don’t shit on grammar, spelling and punctuation, most of us are here to discuss the ideas. But moderators do keep an eye on overtly offensive language. It is a difficult balance, of course you can argue it any way you like, each of us just does the best we can. (Oh – and we’re not all white or all male here either).
         • Morgan 7.2.1.1.2

           3 February 2010 at 6:18 pm

           “from it’s inception there has always been a cultural bias in favour of your good selves ” – Good point.

           “so while you guys have your class war and all, dont mind us if we choose not to take sides cos we’re in a class of our own.” –

           This is a good point. The identity politics which is so keenly espoused by the likes of Bryce Edwards and Chris Trotter, although valid in the context of Pakeha people, is simply not applicable to Maori and Polynesians, a sizeable chunk of the Labour Party vote. Maori and Polynesian identity goes far deeper than class. Maori culture is based upon bloodlinks – whakapapa. Whakapapa underpins the Maori world. For that reason Maori vote tribally. They vote for there own blood. This was perhaps best illustrated by Nania Mahuta and Parekura Horomia who, against intellectually superior candidates, won their seats. Both are in the Maori sense royalty in their electorates whilst their opponents were not so well connected i.e. there whakapapa was not as far-reaching or cheifly.
     • The Baron 7.2.2

       3 February 2010 at 4:24 pm

       Christ, you’re gonna get all kinds of hangwringing going on with that sorta talk.

       You’re in chardonnay socialist country here my friend. These people don’t actually talk Maori/Pacific Islanders, just issue decrees on what they “know” will be beneficial. Then get all riled up when someone who actually knows the situation uses “the wrong language”. Christ, how condescending.

       I predict stormy seas.
8. PT 8

   3 February 2010 at 1:43 pm

   wrong rob, learn to read. more incentives means you pay less tax and keep more what you earn. that’s what incentive is, much better than you stealing labour pricks
   • Sam 8.1

     3 February 2010 at 2:21 pm

     Can someone ban this person already? He or she cannot stay on topic and resorts to ad hominem far too much. He or she belongs in the sewer.
     • r0b 8.1.1

       3 February 2010 at 2:24 pm

       He or she was recently banned under another pseudonym, and is certainly working hard on getting themselves banned under this one.

       [lprent: I just put all known access under a auto-moderation. Too noisy and too little content. In other words looks like a troll. ]
       • kiwiteen123 8.1.1.1

         3 February 2010 at 8:10 pm

         All though In accept that PT is a troll. His/her first comment was quite interesting. Is there a reply? Lynn? r0b?
         Could you, r0b, please translate some of Phil Goff’s catchphrases at the moment. You would be doing us all a favour.
   • Mac1 8.2

     3 February 2010 at 3:00 pm

     We men of the Left don’t need to go stealing labour pricks, since we have our own and are, in the words of the old joke, “all in perfect working order.”

     Or, learn to use commas, PT, if you meant to be insulting. Better, though, not to be insulting and thus show your ignorance.
9. Deus ex Machina 9

   3 February 2010 at 1:46 pm

   How to nurses, teachers, bus-drivers and other essential workers ‘get ahead’ by working harder?
   • Draco T Bastard 9.1

     3 February 2010 at 5:52 pm

     They don’t. They’re already working as hard as they can and are going nowhere. This applies to about 70 to 80% of the population.
10. randal 10

    3 February 2010 at 1:47 pm

    pt, are you a simpleton?
    without taxes nothing would happen in this country and you know it.
    so you are just being an agent provacateur.
    do you understand anything about economics at all or are you stil jerking your knee?
    • PT 10.1

      3 February 2010 at 2:10 pm

      nothing happened in nz until cullen put up top tax rate to 39 cents just to punish hard working people, shut up randal. extra tax labour raised just got wasted buying labour votes.
      • BLiP 10.1.1

        3 February 2010 at 2:49 pm

        Still calling Blinglish a liar, eh?
      • kiwiteen123 10.1.2

        3 February 2010 at 8:12 pm

        I never thought I would say this but could someone please permanently ban PT or at least delete the abusive parts of his comments.
        • lprent 10.1.2.1

          3 February 2010 at 9:46 pm

          He has been put into purgatory – ie auto-moderation. I’ll enhance his comments in the nature of an education by example. Banning would be too easy.
          • kiwiteen123 10.1.2.1.1

            3 February 2010 at 10:09 pm

            🙂
      • Macro 10.1.3

        3 February 2010 at 9:24 pm

        “nothing happened in nz until cullen put up top tax rate to 39 cents”
        Is that when you were born PT? (and then all hell broke loose!)
        This of course would make you still a child, which from the standard of your arguments, you probably are.
11. The Voice of Reason 11

    3 February 2010 at 2:01 pm

    ‘learn to read’ P(athetic) T(roll) above.

    When you learn to write, you can start telling others to read, you illiterate tosser.
12. pollywog 12

    3 February 2010 at 2:02 pm

    “All of this is essential if everyday New Zealanders are to enjoy the incomes and living standards that give them opportunities to get ahead.”

    which excludes those of us who are nzers every other day and especially if we send our savings back to the islands anyway.
13. Clarke 13

    3 February 2010 at 2:05 pm

    Ooo, I’ve got one:

    “Labour market flexibility” == “I’d love to see wages drop”
    • Draco T Bastard 13.1

      3 February 2010 at 5:57 pm

      That’s probably the best option on that. My “Labour market flexibility’ == “labour so desperate they’ll do what they’re told, when they’re told with no questions asked and answer with “Yes, Sir” or “Yes, Master” is probably a bit long winded.
14. tc 14

    3 February 2010 at 2:51 pm

    Nice to see Bill’s doing some actual work in his own portfolio after he props up the lame ministers like Bennett/Tolley/smith etc.

    As long as Goff and co keep the message simple the MSM will be unable to spin in NACT’s way (but they’ll try) and Blinglish pathetic attempt at ‘reform’ will be seen as just that….pathetic.
15. ak 15

    3 February 2010 at 4:51 pm

    Corker post and series concept r0b.

    Yes, all the repulsive and divisive toryspeak undercurrents in this tpically putrid, anodyne ejaculation from NACT Marketing: the explicit exclusion of anyone not in the top tax bracket from the “hard working” category, and reiteration of the obscene neolib notion that monetary gain is the sole, essential incentive for human endeavour.

    Take from the poor and give to the rich

    Then blame their brothers and conjour a witch

    And rub raw salt in their pus and eyes

    Lest they pierce at last our thin disguise.
16. Onomatopoeia 16

    3 February 2010 at 5:12 pm

    It means “give more money to rich people’.

    In fairness, they still have to earn it. No-one is giving it to them.
    • Bright Red 16.1

      3 February 2010 at 5:45 pm

      *earn* is the crucial word here. It assumes that people are rewarded based on the value they create. In fact, that’s not true. Wages are determined by supply and demand, not the value of the work done. And capitalism – as suggested by the name – inherently rewards the owners of capital.
17. Onomatopoeia 17

    3 February 2010 at 5:53 pm

    Wages are determined by supply and demand, not the value of the work done.

    How else could they be valued?
    • Draco T Bastard 17.1

      3 February 2010 at 6:05 pm

      How about by study and research?
      • Onomatopoeia 17.1.1

        3 February 2010 at 8:14 pm

        How would this work? Instead of the parties to a transaction determining what it worth to them, then a bunch of “new economists” would set the value of the exchange? Sounds entirely workable.
        • Draco T Bastard 17.1.1.1

          3 February 2010 at 11:31 pm

          Instead of the parties to a transaction determining what it worth to them,

          Except that the weaker of the parties (ie, workers) doesn’t set anything. They take what they’re given.

          then a bunch of “new economists’ would set the value of the exchange? Sounds entirely workable.

          Considering that the research so far shows that bankers are massively over paid and cleaners are massively under paid in relation to their actual value I’d say a hell of a lot better than what we have now.
18. millsy 18

    3 February 2010 at 7:00 pm

    I always belive that ‘incentives to get ahead’ is double speak for kick the crutch out of the poor and working classes.
    • Onomatopoeia 18.1

      3 February 2010 at 8:15 pm

      But no-one cares what you believe because you are the Dad4Justice of the left.
19. Bill 19

    3 February 2010 at 7:20 pm

    Wrong, wrong, wrong, about the ‘give more money to rich people’ translation. That’s squeezing square pegs into round holes shit.

    give hard-working New Zealanders = anyone who considers themselves hard working…a battler in Oz speak….most people… incentives to get ahead = we (the Torys) recognise, identify with and will reward your battler attitude.

    And it’s utter bullshit but sufficient to pull the wool over many peoples eyes because people identify with the sentiments.

    The kicker is that the Torys are claiming to give these sentiments expression through the establishment whereas the reality is that they employ many mechanisms that abuse, disempower and impoverish hard working new Zealanders who are trying to get ahead.

    And, yes. They give more money to rich people. But that’s another matter again.
20. Ed 20

    3 February 2010 at 10:44 pm

    There was an interview with one of the Tax Working Group on National Radio this morning, and one of the subjects raised was the high effective marginal tax rates that apply to people people eligible for Working for Families, and the need to reduce those effective marginal rates – I think the accountant said he saw them as obscene. Perhaps National are going to remove Working for Families?
    • SPC 20.1

      3 February 2010 at 11:42 pm

      National promised no change in WFF.

      Of course if the sock puppet lies he loses his credibility and with his credibility goes this government.
21. SPC 21

    3 February 2010 at 11:41 pm

    When a father taught a son to believe in the divine right of kings he taught the subjects of the land to get a head.

    And at the moment a left wing governments human rights legislation in the UK is providing an incentive to some higher placed German to declare his own form of pilgrimage of rebellion.

    One wonders what incentive this government will provide by 2011 to remove their’s and them?

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