Vote!

Written By: - Date published: 6:30 am, September 10th, 2013 - 164 comments
Categories: democratic participation - Tags:

The last candidates’ meeting is tonight in Christchurch and that means there’s less than a week to get your vote in.

For those of you who are e-voting (as a good many Standardistas will) the vote is open until the last minute – although leaving it to the last minute is probably not the best plan – but for Labour brethren who are postal voting and who live in some of our more remote areas the time available to have your say is fast closing.

And it is vital you do vote. Getting a say in the leadership has been a long time coming and it has been hard won. And with thousands of members turning out to the meetings it looks like this right is well appreciated. But it all counts for nothing if you don’t close the deal.

It’a a great time to be a Labour member. Make sure you use your vote!

164 comments on “Vote! ”

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  1. Ad 1
    10 September 2013 at 6:54 am

    I voted!

    TRP may well be right that Cunliffe only wins on the second round of voting, but that’ll do me.

  2. Red Blooded 2
    10 September 2013 at 7:22 am

    Happily popped my vote in the post yesterday. Great to feel like one tiny voice will join in with others to have such a major impact on the party. May the best candidate win.

  3. amirite 3
    10 September 2013 at 7:26 am

    LP members, please vote (or kick) the fuckers in the caucus out.
    Signed,
    Labour Party voter

    • fender 3.1
      10 September 2013 at 8:56 am

      Some in the caucus are in their own little world imo, maybe they think they are voting in a new PM without the assistance of the voting public. When I hear the likes of Ruth Dyson on the radio this morning saying she is voting for someone the public want the least I can’t help but think we may end up facing another three long years of ShonKey dictatorship.

      • Hami Shearlie 3.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 9:04 am

        All the people who are publicly supporting Grant Robertson are the old deadwood types – Why on EARTH should anybody listen to them?? They only care about their jobs and salaries – they don’t give two hoots for the members of the Party or the wider public who are HURTING!!

  4. Sanctuary 4
    10 September 2013 at 7:29 am

    *sigh* still no sign of my ballot papers.

    • IrishBill 4.1
      10 September 2013 at 7:33 am

      Ring labour HQ asap to double-check you’ve been sent them. I don’t know if there’s a special vote process if papers are lost/too late arriving but I’m sure they’ll be able to do something.

    • Rod 4.2
      10 September 2013 at 7:35 am

      Likewise. Despite Head Office assuring me I meet criteria for voting..and assuring me e-ballot would be sent. Where is it??

      • miravox 4.2.1
        10 September 2013 at 8:03 am

        Just a thought – could there be a problem with the spam filter on some email addresses, so the email either goes into the trash folder or is deleted?

      • the sprout 4.2.2
        10 September 2013 at 9:12 am

        Have contacted Head Office several times, still waiting

      • chris 4.2.3
        10 September 2013 at 10:22 am

        if xtra is your email provider it could be lost in space. They have been having troubles since Friday last week.

    • Clement Pinto 4.3
      10 September 2013 at 7:33 pm

      I gave them a call on Friday and gave my details. Within an hour they sent me an email to say my membership details were verified and my ballot papers would be posted. This morning I queried if they had posted it yet. The email reply said, they were posted yesterday and should arrive today or tomorrow. Looking forward to my post tomorrow.

      P.S : Do they send e ballot details too when they send the ballot papers by post?

    • Neoleftie 4.4
      10 September 2013 at 9:17 pm

      I got a prompt reply from labour hq, and stated that’d my voting papers were dispatched and would reach me by Thursday…now who to vote for….hmmm.

  5. the sprout 5
    10 September 2013 at 7:30 am

    Still waiting for my papers.
    Anyone read Trotter’s article in the Daily Blog on vote rigging?

    • IrishBill 5.1
      10 September 2013 at 7:34 am

      I thought it was silly.

      • lurgee 5.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 9:07 pm

        Very silly. At least he didn’t inflict any of his awful religious allegories and Eastertide twaddle on us. Though if Cunliffe does lose, I think it might provoke an outburst along the lines of “Sold thirty pieces of silver. Who is the Iscariot in the Labour Caucus?” with the moustache at full dudgeon.

    • Jenny Kirk 5.2
      10 September 2013 at 7:36 am

      To those still waiting for your papers – get onto Labour HO straightaway. My understanding is that all papers have been sent out.
      As to the Trotter scenario on vote rigging – I’ve been told its impossible. So don’t worry about that!

      • IrishBill 5.2.1
        10 September 2013 at 7:46 am

        It pisses me off because it undermines confidence in the (extremely sound) democratic process party members have fought for. On Labour party matters I put Trotter’s commentary in the same box as all the other non-member analysis – best ignored. This is about Labour members and about showing New Zealanders that we’re a strong democratic party – the tea-leaf reading of pundits outside of the process doesn’t come into it.

        • Tim 5.2.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 8:56 am

          Totally agree – and I commented at TDB. Can you imagine the response should anyone be caught trying it on anyway!

        • Richard McGrath 5.2.1.2
          10 September 2013 at 8:21 pm

          It looks like Labour Head Office couldn’t organise a piss-up in a brewery, to use the old cliche.

          • mickysavage 5.2.1.2.1
            10 September 2013 at 8:39 pm

            Can’t the right wing send us better trolls than Richard?

            • Richard McGrath 5.2.1.2.1.1
              10 September 2013 at 9:41 pm

              That’s hilarious, I wasn’t ‘sent’ by anyone. But I was surprised at the ineptitude of a party that supposedly prides itself on the democratic process. And by the look of it, a lot of Labour Party members are also surprised – and dismayed.

          • mickysavage 5.2.1.2.2
            10 September 2013 at 8:44 pm

            How embarrassing is this? I got caught up in the comment filter because I used the word describing creatures who live under bridges …

    • miravox 5.3
      10 September 2013 at 7:36 am

      “Anyone read Trotter’s article in the Daily Blog on vote rigging?”

      It seems to me he’s stirring – poses the question and then answers himself with why it’s unlikely. It was discussed yesterday as well, where CV also states here the process is contracted out to Electionz.

  6. Boadicea 6
    10 September 2013 at 8:04 am

    I just heard Gower on 3 News ridicule Cunliffe’s reference to Seddon bring a relation. Had Cunliffe’s press people not documented this in their press packs? Does Cunliffe have press handlers on the road with him?

    • Tracey 6.1
      10 September 2013 at 8:59 am

      That says far more about Gower than Cunliffe or his team.

    • Colonial Viper 6.2
      10 September 2013 at 10:18 am

      Not included in press packs to ensure that there were no leaks before the Blackball meeting.

      • js 6.2.1
        10 September 2013 at 11:59 am

        David Cunliffe proudly mentioned his Richard Seddon link at Saturday night’s meeting so hardly a secret by the time of last night’s Blackball meeting

  7. LynWiper 7
    10 September 2013 at 8:06 am

    My voting papers finally arrived yesterday, and I’m a South Auckland Rural Delivery address. I was also getting very concerned as I thought the delay might be due to the fact I’d only just rejoined. I e-voted, which I would encourage, as it was so very easy to do. Exciting times!

  8. Ron 8
    10 September 2013 at 9:12 am

    I would encourage all who have not received ballot papers to ring HQ don’t rely on email.

  9. the sprout 9
    10 September 2013 at 9:13 am

    Have contacted Head Office several times, still waiting

    • Colonial Viper 9.1
      10 September 2013 at 10:11 am

      They got back to me pretty quick – a day or two after I emailed a quiz into them; I think they’re just swamped at the minute.

      • Virginia Linton 9.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 10:48 am

        A bit concerning they can’t cope with a bit of swamp at such a crucial time.

        • Comrade Coba 9.1.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 12:09 pm

          Just a friendly reminder that the LP is under funded, under staffed, overworked & rely heavily on volunteers like us rank & file. Please pitch (in) rather than bitch. This is the only way to defeat Nact in 2014. I’ve asked my partner to work for 12 months on the campaign, it means down to one income & cutting our cloth, but hey it’s all worth it if we overthrow the current regime.

          Meanwhile over at the newly purchased 2.4 million dollar National Party HQ, the new renovations are being carried out. The teams of highly paid PR contractors & party pleb’s beaver away in a relaxed style.

        • Stephen 9.1.1.2
          10 September 2013 at 12:37 pm

          There’s a national conference in November and a by-election coming soon, and both those things need a lot of extra organising. They weren’t exactly slacking off before this happened.

          • Virginia Linton 9.1.1.2.1
            10 September 2013 at 2:16 pm

            Extra donation in the post!

            • Anne 9.1.1.2.1.1
              10 September 2013 at 2:32 pm

              Well, it’s going to depend on the caucus. If they decide it doesn’t suit them to have a strong leader with oodles of knowledge and experience and choose yet again to thumb their noses at the membership, then I think you will find there will be few foot-sloggers and little by way of extra donations.

              • Hami Shearlie …
                10 September 2013 at 4:03 pm

                Well I know of two very faithful foot-sloggers who have mentioned voting green if Cunliffe is not elected Leader – Who wants a leader with absolutely zero charisma, who tells big porkies on nationwide tv and is unlikely to inspire anyone, or a leader with a type of charisma which will have us all cringing if he goes anywhere overseas?

            • Comrade Coba 9.1.1.2.1.2
              10 September 2013 at 3:47 pm

              Nice one VL every dollar helps 🙂

              • Clement Pinto …
                10 September 2013 at 9:27 pm

                Dollar a day….or….every other day….or…..even every now and then from all Labour supporters would be so good for the party.

  10. Linz 10
    10 September 2013 at 9:32 am

    We’ve voted! Yay! I do love democracy. We should never take it for granted.

    • miravox 10.1
      10 September 2013 at 9:37 am

      Agree, Linz.

      This is what I joined up for. Congrats all the Labour delegates and whoever else who made it possible for members to have a say in who leads the party. (Although I’m still not sold on the transferable voting system)

  11. Sable 11
    10 September 2013 at 9:35 am

    No doubt its Cunliffe who will be victorious. The question remains what this means for Labour and for partners such as the Greens. I hope for the best but suspect the worst.

  12. Wayne (a different one) 12
    10 September 2013 at 10:03 am

    The next 12 months are going to be great entertainment as the Labour Party self-destructs in full public view.

    This will be the most un-unified Labour Caucus ever – with much blood letting to come, can’t wait for the show to begin.

    Cunliffe is a two faced liar, full of his own shit and egotistical arrogance, who purports to support the underdog, while the “Rich Prick” lives in absolute affluance in the wealthist suburb in New Zealand – the majority of the caucus despise him.

    Robertson’s a gay, who will not connect with “Waitakere Man” – so whilst he has Caucus’s backing, he wont get the support of the unions or the general public.

    And Jones – well least said, we’ll leave that in the Hotel Room.

    So Cunliffe is your man – good luck.

    Meanwhile, National continue to laugh all the way to their next election victory.

    • Ad 12.1
      10 September 2013 at 10:18 am

      Key isn’t laughing. The only name on Key’s lips this morning was Cunliffe.
      You don’t need to understand why – the rest of us do.

    • fender 12.2
      10 September 2013 at 10:40 am

      Well it’s rather surprising that the richest prick of them all should become PM at all considering that (a dipshit one) argument.

      • Virginia Linton 12.2.1
        10 September 2013 at 11:00 am

        What’s wrong with being rich if you’ve worked hard … I’d say that’s a plus for Cunliffe and his wife. Grant being gay is a red herring. Many people couldn’t give a hoot. If he wins good luck to him. If he doesn’t I hope he and his followers shut the hell up and work for the good of the party and New Zealanders. If they don’t, they have to go or be demoted just as David unfairly was. If David is the leader and screws up they’ll have the last laugh. But I hope he gets his chance as Grant was part of the problem during the Shearer leadership (puppet stringed by Grant and colleagues) and doesn’t in my view deserve to be deputy on that basis alone. Let him spend some time on the back benches and reflect on how he got there. He has some building to do with the membership before he can count on the kind of support David is getting. And why has Shane seemingly gazumped Grant in the popularity stakes? Grant should reflect on that too; doubt much of it is due to his being gay. The difficulty is that some of the long-established MPs who have harmed the party and ignored the membership have considerable experience and skills. They can’t have senior roles in a new lineup on that basis alone but if they put a line in the sand and roll up their sleeves should Cunliffe be the leader, Labour as Opposition would be formidable and has a great crack at winning in 2014.

        • Rob 12.2.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 3:06 pm

          Virginia

          “What’s wrong with being rich if you’ve worked hard “….. my god you dare write that on The Standard, are you on drugs. Could I have some.

          • framu 12.2.1.1.1
            10 September 2013 at 3:12 pm

            good one rob – because you know that its all about the amount of money one earns – not the way its earned and how you treat others who earn less is what gets lefties riled up isnt it

            any other stupid shit you want to make up today?

            • Rob 12.2.1.1.1.1
              10 September 2013 at 3:34 pm

              Wow, so only “lefties” are concerned about the way money is ‘earnt’ and how people are being treated, really , and you say I am making shit up. pffffft

          • Clement Pinto 12.2.1.1.2
            10 September 2013 at 9:50 pm

            Being rich is not the problem. The problem is being rich AND being a government beneficiary with huge tax breaks, dodging taxes, getting subsidies, exploiting workers, being a sub civilised dishonest human.
            They need to be just and realise that their wealth HAS come from society and from those less wealthy. They have to learn to welcome higher tax rates for higher incomes to give some small fair share back to society. Even Warren Buffet says the wealthy should be taxed more.
            The wealthy need to realise the inequity and unfairness in the ever increasing wage, income and wealth gap and disparity between the top and bottom in society due to the uncontrolled exploitative nature of the free market and capitalist philosophy. They need to find ways to reduce this income gap in society.
            There is another point the wealthy need to consider by looking at what happened in China, Russia, France, India, Cuba etc when the masses rose up and revolted against exploitation. In this electronic age, such ‘revolutions’ can easily start any time anywhere when one least expects it. It is in their own interest for the wealthy to change their selfish uncontrolled capitalist greed and embrace socialist ideas in their philosophy.

    • Boadicea 12.3
      10 September 2013 at 10:40 am

      Mr King, you are a bitter person. The issues that torment you are inside you. Get help.

    • Crunchtime 12.4
      10 September 2013 at 11:55 am

      Wayne,

      If I would call John Key a two-faced liar, full of his own excrement and egotistical arrogance, would you object?

      Because I suggest it’s far more accurate description of Key than it is of Cunliffe.

    • Delia 12.5
      10 September 2013 at 1:49 pm

      You got a problem with that Wayne, does it mess with your perception that all Labour supporters are low income or on benefits, well though, many of us are’nt.

      • Wayne (a different one) 12.5.1
        10 September 2013 at 2:26 pm

        Not at all Delia – its just ironic given all we hear from Labour supporters – “is that rich prick Key only thinks of looking after his own wealth and those of all the other rich pricks in business.”

        Somewhat of a contradiction when your consider Cunliffe’s undoubted wealth and living style.

        Not wealth generated at his own hands, but those of his wife (Cunliffes own words).

        He is recognised as a “lazy prick” by many inside parliament – including some inside the Labour Caucus, as I’m lead to believe.

        • Crunchtime 12.5.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 2:56 pm

          The difference being that Cunliffe hasn’t come from a currency trading background and worked for a company who helped bring about the very GFC he professed to rescue us from. Cunliffe also talks of social justice and a fair go and jobs for all, something John Key never did. Key just waffled about “time for change”, and did his best to paint Labour in a bad light… oh wait, he’s still doing that.

          • Rob 12.5.1.1.1
            10 September 2013 at 3:16 pm

            Really Crunchtime , you should do some research on Mckinsey & Company consulting. He worked there for a while didnt he?

            Probably responsible for more corporate restructuring, lay offs , redundancies and worker hardship than any Govt sponsored austerity programme. The ultimate asset downsizers, union busters and off shoring specialists.

            Not the best background for a potential Labour NZ leader I would have thought, but you guys will let that one go through to the keeper.

            • Crunchtime 12.5.1.1.1.1
              10 September 2013 at 3:35 pm

              Interesting. I see no mention of “McKinsey and Company consulting” in Cunliffe’s work history.

              http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Cunliffe_(politician)

              “As a teenager he won a scholarship to study the International Baccalaureate at the United World College of the Atlantic in Wales. David Cunliffe studied politics at the University of Otago, where he was a member of the Otago University Debating Society, and gained a BA with first-class honours. He worked as a diplomat from 1987 to 1994 and gained a Diploma in Social Sciences (Distinction) in economics from Massey University in 1993. He was a Fulbright Scholar and Kennedy Memorial Fellow at Harvard University’s John F. Kennedy School of Government and Harvard Business School in 1994 and 1995, earning a Master of Public Administration. He worked as a business consultant with Boston Consulting Group in Auckland from 1995 to 1999.”

              Boston Consulting Group is the same sort of thing as McKinsey, so I guess you mixed up the two organisations… unless you know more than wikipedia.

              The two of them along with Bain are the big three in business consulting. They do downsizing and offshoring to maximise the profits and productivity of the companies they work with. I imagine Cunliffe in his early 30s would have learned a lot from the 4 years he was there before he got the hell out and became a politician instead.

              He could have stuck around, and made well off, although not as well off as Key did with currency trading for more than a decade. But instead he bailed and decided to try to make the world a better place one way or another. I admire him for that.

              • Rob …
                10 September 2013 at 3:41 pm

                Sorry I did mean Boston, apologies. However I would also re-iterate that they a run pretty similar focus. In fact Boston is famous for the BCG matrix that invented the term “cash cow” and defined strategies for exiting dog type product & industry strategies. I do think this is a strange background for a proudly left leader, but thne so is saying all this and living in the most highest price suburb in Auckland.

                • Saarbo …
                  10 September 2013 at 7:38 pm

                  Ignorant Rob, Mckinsey tended to be all about cutting costs, mainly labour while BCG worked on adding value through improving capacity utilisation (tended to add Labour). Worked with both, BCG = Awesome, McKinsey = Arseholes.

                  Get your facts right because there is quite a big difference in how the two organisations operate.

                  • Rob …
                    11 September 2013 at 10:39 am

                    “Ignorant” , man you are good at flinging the abuse at people and your pompous approach is grating.

                    I too have worked with both , like many others in the corp world, they are big enterprises. I worked with McKinsey in NZ on a large re-engineering project and yes they were terrible and worked BCG in the states on a major manufacturing re-alignment and they were also terrible.

                    My facts are quite correct. Both consultancies have been involved in many restructures, many lay offs and much manufacturing off shoring, if you think that BCG hasn’t then you are the one with ignorant and naive view.

          • Grantoc 12.5.1.1.2
            10 September 2013 at 10:53 pm

            Yeah but Cunliffe worked for the Boston Consulting Group, a US based private sector global management consulting firm. The investment banks who created the GFC were/are major clients of BCG (including probably the one John Key worked for – Merryl Lynch I think).

            Cunliffe and Key may have even met in that world in days gone by as like minded colleagues.

            Actually some of Cunliffe’s arrogance may stem from this experience too – because consultants at BCG and McKinsey, another like minded management consultancy, were known for their ego’s and their arrogance and for being mightily overpaid. .

        • framu 12.5.1.2
          10 September 2013 at 3:19 pm

          you did notice that your description of cunliffe and the description you say labour supporters give to key dont actually match up?

          “He is recognised as a “lazy prick” by many inside parliament – including some inside the Labour Caucus, as I’m lead to believe.”

          so possible, maybe, cant prove it, but a few i think in labour think this? So according to your own statement, most of the group who think cunliffe is lazy arent even in the labour party. Whoop dee do!

          that must explain why key keeps trying to scare us off cunliffe then – he feels threatened by his laziness

          • McFlock 12.5.1.2.1
            10 September 2013 at 3:36 pm

            lol
            I have a few reservations about Cunliffe, but laziness isn’t one of them by any means.

            Next, Tolley will accuse someone of incompetence.

          • Colonial Viper 12.5.1.2.2
            10 September 2013 at 3:36 pm

            Cunliffe is “lazy” compared to who? Grant Robertson and Shane Jones? LOL the Righties are desperate as!!!

    • Richard McGrath 12.6
      10 September 2013 at 8:27 pm

      Cunliffe will really be able to relate to the common man… from his $2.5M home in Herne Bay, where he doesn’t have to mix with the dirt-poor proles.

  13. Demelza 13
    10 September 2013 at 10:22 am

    I voted last week, but my husband only got his papers yesterday, online voting is great, it’s interesting that they are saying that people’s minds are still not made up, most people I have talked to have known before going to the meeting exactly who they are voting for and have voted as soon as they have their papers, it’s caucus who are possibly holding out.

  14. Crunchtime 14
    10 September 2013 at 12:03 pm

    Anyone seen the Daily Blog’s post yesterday about the election being fixed?

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/09/09/is-someone-planning-to-fix-labours-leadership-election/

    • Rich 14.1
      10 September 2013 at 12:26 pm

      I don’t think Electionz would risk their whole reputation by conniving in rigging an election. Especially for the Labour party, where what happened would never, ever leak.

      • Crunchtime 14.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 12:35 pm

        Yeah… Just realised the author is Chris Trotter. Someone who paints himself as a poster-child of the Left… but forever paints it in a bad light. He’s the worst advocate for the Left and for Labour in particular I can imagine.

        I’m only going on the many articles I’ve read and opinions on natrad I’ve heard, but to me he seems very self-absorbed and self-congratulatory, and it appears journalism isn’t actually his primary interest.

        • Rhinocrates 14.1.1.1
          11 September 2013 at 1:33 am

          As I feel about many commentators: Great diagnosis, dubious prognosis, lethal prescription.

    • js 14.2
      10 September 2013 at 12:36 pm

      It is a bit concerning that many David Cunliffe supporters appear unwilling to accept any outcome except their man winning. If he doesn’t win then that must be a conspriracy or vote rigging. Meanwhile the three candidates seem pretty genuine that they will back the candidate this new democratic process throws up – so perhaps the members should too. (Although personally I would rather Shane Jones didn’t win)

      • Crunchtime 14.2.1
        10 September 2013 at 2:39 pm

        Grant Robertson is a representative of the ABC lobby, he has the backing of them, the old guard who continue to back neoliberal policy, Nat-lite, that has scared so many people away from the polls altogether.

        Shane Jones is even worse, he’s a pale blue misogynist with too many skeletons in his closet.

        Both of these candidates are representing the right wing of the party. Robertson makes the right noises about being for workers rights, Jones doesn’t even bother.

        The membership has been backing Cunliffe from the start and I wouldn’t be surprised if they weren’t too happy with anyone else. I wouldn’t blame them either.

        • Bunji 14.2.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 4:25 pm

          Grant Robertson does not represent the “right” of the party, no matter who votes for him.

          I think in Grant and David we have 2 highly intelligent, incredibly hard-working, passionate advocates for the left, with a real commitment to making life better for all NZers, not just the elite. One may be wittier and more affable, the other may have more economic cred, but I’ll be proud to have either of them as my party leader.

          Shane Jones has shown himself to be an excellent showman who can get some voters interested in Labour who aren’t currently.

          There is a diversity of opinion among members, unions and caucus. We have set up an excellent democratic process so all get to have their say – those who have to work with the leader on a day-to-day basis and those who do the ground-work to get them elected.

          I think it’s important that we respect that different people have validly held different viewpoints as to who is best to beat John Key and be the better Labour PM after 2014. That spectrum of viewpoints is both in caucus and among members, albeit in different measure.

          Some of the sledging and making unfounded accusations against rivals to their preferred candidate on here makes for some unpleasant reading – and not all of it is from trolls (be they right or left leaning). Whoever wins on Sunday, the process must be respected.

          I strongly suspect it will be Cunliffe, but if it isn’t, it won’t be because caucus “stole the vote” or any rigging or deals – it’ll be that he failed to convince enough Labour people that he should be leader.

          Whoever does win, we need everyone to unify behind that leader, or like Australia, we’ll see a crippled Labour party beaten, and a Tory reign…

        • Chooky 14.2.1.2
          10 September 2013 at 6:44 pm

          +1 Crunchtime

      • QoT 14.2.2
        10 September 2013 at 6:50 pm

        Whereas the Grant Robertson supporters have totally been keeping this fight clean. Remind me which team just lost a member due to comments made WEEKS ago which acknowledged, but did not agree with, the very thing Robertson’s team have been screaming blue murder about for the whole campaign?

    • GregJ 14.3
      10 September 2013 at 6:27 pm

      I think Trotter wrote it after a few beers at said Pub! 😈

      It was rambling, not terribly logical or consistent, ill informed and frankly just a bit pointless. I generally like reading what Chris has to say (whether I agree with him or not) but I don’t think this piece will make it into any compilations of his writing. 😕

    • js 15.1
      10 September 2013 at 1:13 pm

      That is offensive and puerile on so many levels. Reminds me of the nastiness directed by the angry white male extreme right at Helen Clark.

      • fender 15.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 1:16 pm

        “That is offensive and puerile on so many levels”

        Feel free to expand on that js.

      • the pigman 15.1.2
        10 September 2013 at 6:52 pm

        +1 js, and you don’t need to explain just because fender is being obtuse…

        Proudly gave DC my first preference, doesn’t mean I think misrepresenting what GR is is in any way cool. And that would be true of 99.9% of DC-voters, I’d imagine.

    • fender 15.2
      10 September 2013 at 1:14 pm

      Lol, “cool” picture of a duck and a lapdog.

      Good to see there’s at least one gay person who can have a preference not dependant on the sexuality of a candidate.

      “Good on ya Steve Gray!”
      +1

  16. James Thrace 16
    10 September 2013 at 1:41 pm

    My problem is that all the gays seem to be sticking together in the party for robertson on nothing more than ‘hes one of us’ The amount of assumptions people make that simply because as a gay member of rainbow labour I’m going to roll over and vote for the faghot is wide off the mark. I just nod and smile and publicly voice support for teh gay one, while knifing him in the back with a 1 for Cunliffe. Of course robertson knows all about the twisting knife and how to wield it.

    It appears that the best candidate to win the 2014 election is drowned out by the love in that at last, a gay PM will take the cake – and eat it all too.

    People forget that just because the house overwhelmingly supported queers getting hitched doesn’t mean the wider section of society supports it too.

    As far as I concerned, grant being gay isn’t a red herring, but a very valuable indication of whether NZ as a whole is actually ready for a gay PM who doesn’t know the pain of childbirth, abortion, or even raising a nuclear family with 2.4 kids because like it as not, thats where the majority of voters reside.

    • Crunchtime 16.1
      10 September 2013 at 2:46 pm

      It IS a red herring. Sorry. Grant just isn’t the most able candidate. He is a very capable politician who may well be ready for the leadership in 6-9 years, but Cunliffe is the strongest personality of the bunch who has the best direction. That’s why he’s the most popular. Simple as that.

      • gobsmacked 16.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 4:57 pm

        Crunchtime is right.

        First, “teh gayz” are not voting en bloc for Grant. Just read the comments on this blog for daily evidence of that.

        Second – let’s cut to the chase – suppose Grant was straight, and David C was gay? Ask yourselves who you’d want as leader? Changed your mind? Not me. Not many of us, I reckon.

        Cunliffe is the best available candidate, in this contest. And to hell with TV3 Jonolism.

        • Colonial Viper 16.1.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 6:29 pm

          Correct. Louisa Wall and Charles Chauvel were both for Cunliffe, for example. Btw voted today. I’m backing David 🙂

    • karol 16.2
      10 September 2013 at 5:01 pm

      BS, James.

      I am lesbian and have over the last couple of years, always favoured Cunliffe for leader.

      It’s not about sexuality. It’s about the fact of who is most capable to lead, and, for me, who is least likely to continue following the neoliberal way.

      Robertson lacks ministerial experience, speaks well, but has been too aligned with the old guard neoliberals over the last couple of years.

      He is yet to prove to my satisfaction that he is capable of leading the Labour caucus, and to be PM.

      Robertson does very good speeches, and is clearly pretty smart. But that is not enough.

    • Rhinocrates 16.3
      11 September 2013 at 1:29 am

      all the gays… where the majority of voters reside

      So “gays” are the Borg? Well, I’m white (pale blue actually, as Billy Connelly said – it takes weeks of tanning to turn us Scots white), straight, cisgendered male blah blah blah. I won’t vote for my clone, but for the most capable.

      The more precisely one defines any individual, the smaller the group becomes, so David Cunliffe matches matches me on a number of points, but he has a different hair colour (and more of it).

      You call sexuality a red herring, but your post shows an overwhelming concern with it, and as is often the case, you shift your bigotry to “the public”, “the majority” and so forth in a weak attempt to divert attention from your bigotry.

      I’ve never known the pain of childbirth and never will. Presumably, that would make me entirely unsuited to comment on, say, literature, commerce, diplomacy… which is what you’re saying.

      I personally do not support Robertson at all, and that’s because I think that he’s a self-interested party apparatchik and that’s all.

      You should stop hiding behind your disguise of “the public” and say straight out (pun intended) that you hate gays.

  17. js 17
    10 September 2013 at 1:46 pm

    With such narrowminded, smug and bigoted attitudes as displayed in the above comments I certainly wouldn’t want to be on the same side as any of you Whale Oil wannabees.

    • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 18.1
      10 September 2013 at 3:07 pm

      Jenny?

      • chris 18.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 3:13 pm

        yes, unfortunately. I have seen some vindictive bitches in my time but Clare Curran takes the cake. Dog awful woman…

        • Rob 18.1.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 3:17 pm

          Lol, Ruddliffe

        • Anne 18.1.1.2
          10 September 2013 at 4:08 pm

          The accusation she actually leveled at others was the very accusation that should be leveled at herself. She’s the one who brought the sexuality of a candidate into public focus – not those to whom she is pointing the finger.

          Clare Curran is not worth a 1000 Jennie Michies. I hope Cunluffe wins and tosses her on the bottom rung of the caucus ladder and leaves her there to sulk and whine until she’s gone in 2014.

          This is the 4th or 5th time she’s done it. Remember her allegation of a few years back? The Greens were “white-anting” Labour she said. Can’t remember the details but they were just doing their job.

          • Anne 18.1.1.2.1
            10 September 2013 at 4:25 pm

            Clare Curran is not worth a 1000 Jennie Michies.

            Oops I think I’ve got that the wrong way around. 🙁 you know what I mean – must go…

            • karol 18.1.1.2.1.1
              10 September 2013 at 5:05 pm

              So sorry to read that about Jennie Michie.

              It looks like some in the old guard are not going to let go of their position in the Labour caucus quietly.

              I have no gone from hope to despondency again, and wonder how long it’s going to take to get parliamentary Labour back on track.

              Why is the old guard not listening to the people?

              • Bill …
                10 September 2013 at 5:54 pm

                Been thinking about this…and got to wondering what the acting leader of the opposition is going to do about Clare Curran using twitter for tosh and causing Jennie her position as well as introducing scurrilous disruptions and distractions into the leadership contest when she should have followed set procedure and protocol to air any grievance she might have been feeling?

                I’m guessing the answer could be a fair indicator of what to expect should the chips fall a particular way. Credit to David Cunliffe for being quick off the mark and heading off any need to deal with bullshit distractions. And Jennie, if your reading this, my heart goes out to you.

          • the pigman 18.1.1.2.2
            10 September 2013 at 6:55 pm

            I got what you meant Anne 😉

            Yeah, that white-anting article was on Red Alert around early-mid 2011 if I recall, drove a lot of people away.

            I think people need to actually go and have a look at Clare Curran’s twitter feed to see how absurd it is – she launches a broadside at other DC-associated people, too.

            Just a witch, and unworthy of the ICT portfolio, so I hope there is a fine Green alternative.

      • Anne 18.1.2
        10 September 2013 at 4:14 pm

        @ Gormless…..

        Not Jenny of climate change fame. Jenny Michie. Two different people.

  19. Richard Down South 19
    10 September 2013 at 3:31 pm

    Voted… Cunliffe was my choice, and ill proudly say so

  20. hush minx 20
    10 September 2013 at 4:51 pm

    I think a number of us are shocked that Jen has been asked to step down, for something that happened before the campaign even started, and where she was quite right to suggest the issue is of concern to some (but not her). What action is Grant taking to pull Clare into line given she complained via twitter rather than using the process the candidates signed up to in terms of code of conduct. Perhaps it’s because he knows Jen hasn’t breached the code but he wanted to stir up trouble anyway?

    • gobsmacked 20.1
      10 September 2013 at 5:07 pm

      Of course Jenny Michie has done nothing wrong. Presumably DC just wanted to kill the story, though it’s probably gonna do the opposite.

      Just 4 days to go. Eyes on the prize. File away Clare’s comments in that bulging file marked “Curran: Unfit to Govern”, and the leader can deal with her later. Not now.

      • BM 20.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 5:46 pm

        Yep not very clever by Cunliffe.

        Cunliffe doesn’t seem to be very aware of how his actions and behavior are perceived.
        Sort of leader who will lead you to certain death.

        For example

        • Tony Moder 20.1.1.1
          10 September 2013 at 6:26 pm

          That old video BM no one cares.

          • amirite 20.1.1.1.1
            10 September 2013 at 7:30 pm

            I found a great one of John Key @ Porirua markets:

          • BM 20.1.1.1.2
            10 September 2013 at 7:32 pm

            Yes it is old.
            But, anyway
            Did David really think jumping on the back of a truck and putting on a really bad bro voice was a good idea.?
            Did he not think our darker skinned brothers may have been offended.?
            Not very political astute, does rather open you up for attack

            or

            where he lived was due to his wife lactating, really? wtf, obviously he’d thought about this question and in his mind he considered that a good answer?
            Doesn’t say a lot about his judgement

            or

            the whole debacle surrounding last years conference which lead to his colleagues publicly eviscerating him.

            I get the feeling with David, in his own mind he is so awesome and destined for greatness he doesn’t need to listen to others, he’s got all the answers, hence the reason he’s completely oblivious to way he comes across to other people, someone this great can never be wrong.

            In the game of politics where popularity and knowing how to schmooze is so important, Cunliffe get an F-

            • Pascal's bookie 20.1.1.1.2.1
              10 September 2013 at 7:41 pm

              “Did he not think our darker skinned brothers may have been offended.?”

              The only people I’ve seen complaining about it also tend to steal enough memes from kiwiblog comments and whaleoil that I have doubts about their sincerity, to be honest.

            • Murray Olsen 20.1.1.1.2.2
              10 September 2013 at 8:28 pm

              Every WhaleSpew reader would have been highly offended. Diddums.

            • Saarbo 20.1.1.1.2.3
              10 September 2013 at 8:44 pm

              BM, go to Waitite Rugby Club in Te Kuiti (Cunliffe went to school in Te Kuiti) and you will find dozens of pakeha speaking with a maori accent…its common in the smaller towns where all mix together. Just get over it.

              “Did he not think our darker skinned brothers may have been offended.?”

              Whats this about??? Only pakeha are going to read this on the standard??? Clearly being a rwnj is only the start of your problems, racist wanker.

              • BM …
                10 September 2013 at 9:16 pm

                Being Tangata whenua I found the rich white fella from Herne bay offensive.

                • felix …
                  10 September 2013 at 9:19 pm

                  Yawn. Whatevs.

                • karol …
                  10 September 2013 at 9:23 pm

                  Gee. You must really be offended by the VERY rich white fella from Hawaii.

                • Saarbo …
                  10 September 2013 at 9:54 pm

                  Get out of the city BM, problem with you is you only mix with your own. Get out to small town provincial New Zealand and you will see (hear) why you shouldn’t have been.

                  At the Hamilton husting David Cunliffe spoke beautiful te reo maori also.

      • karol 20.1.2
        10 September 2013 at 6:16 pm

        Did Jones just make a veiled reference to Curran’s monthly cycle?

        Edit: On 3 News tonight, Jones said:

        “Either the moon in Dunedin was in the wrong phase or she’s casting around for a new job,” says Mr Robertson.

        So Jones gets away with any kind of prejudice (re women, gays, etc) and Jenny Michie gets stood down for answering a question.

      • Neoleftie 20.1.3
        10 September 2013 at 6:54 pm

        That I agree with…but also that cunliffe is about discipline and disire to create real meaningful expectation of the front members of the party.
        Poor Jenny but bad call from Clare too.

    • lurgee 20.2
      10 September 2013 at 9:13 pm

      And this from a man who wants to lead the Party of the Workers? Did he hire her on a 90 Day Trial or something? For shame!

  21. James Thrace 21
    10 September 2013 at 5:48 pm

    Er, if you read, im saying I dont support robertson, him being gay isnt as much of a red herring as its promoted to be as simple truth is he won’t resonate with the majority. Cunliffe is the only one with the goods but its annoying that so many tribal members support him solely because hes one of the gays and hey, good to have a pink leader.

  22. Tony Moder 22
    10 September 2013 at 5:58 pm

    Yep whats done D.C .is done now its make every action from here in count and get rid of that old guard in caucus and the person of the three that is relying on them as his backstop because nobody else actually wants him as the leader.

  23. Peter Revell 23
    10 September 2013 at 6:07 pm

    this issue galvanized me to vote, two strong people who speak their mind and act on principle, Go Jenny and David

  24. karol 24
    10 September 2013 at 7:13 pm

    Why is Robertson talking rent controls for Christchurch only? Why not throughout the country?

    Cost of renting in Auckland is unacceptable.

    • big bruv 24.1
      10 September 2013 at 8:15 pm

      Karol

      “Why not throughout the country?”

      Lol…would you make it compulsory to belong to a parasitic union as well?

      • karol 24.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 8:52 pm

        Tell that to the people who can’t afford the going rents.

      • QoT 24.1.2
        10 September 2013 at 10:46 pm

        What’s a parasitic union? Is it like the parasitic 1% who cream money off society and threaten to take their toys home if we tax them fairly?

        • felix 24.1.2.1
          10 September 2013 at 11:48 pm

          Damn parasitic unions, if they weren’t making me pay above minimum wages and provide semi-decent conditions I’d be able to afford to buy slaves.

    • Saarbo 24.2
      10 September 2013 at 8:50 pm

      Yes agree karol, rent controls are a great idea in Auckland also. There needs to a be a driver to reduce the attractiveness of investment housing, CGT will go some way but other initiatives need to be looked at.

    • Neoleftie 24.3
      10 September 2013 at 9:12 pm

      Well talking to grant on twitter it was “ESP in Chch ” also that it would combine with kiwi build and state house rebuild, implies more market intervention,.
      The left block within labour might have found its voice, it’s only been thirty years, go cunliffe and Robertson.

  25. Clement Pinto 25
    10 September 2013 at 7:27 pm

    I think Clare Curran has done a great disservice to the Labour party and its image. A very stupid thing to do. She needs to be quietly sent packing at the next candidate selection time.

    • chris 25.1
      10 September 2013 at 8:50 pm

      If Robertson is serious about uniting the factions within the Labour Party he would have chastised Curran.

      No leadership skills and even less mana…

      • Saarbo 25.1.1
        10 September 2013 at 8:56 pm

        That is a fair point. Curran’s behaviour is really unfortunate and completely against the spirit of how the 3 candidates are running the competition…he needs to do something.

      • Neoleftie 25.1.2
        10 September 2013 at 9:14 pm

        She means well in a silly naive amateur way…Robertson is all behind the scenes person I think.

        • chris 25.1.2.1
          10 September 2013 at 9:44 pm

          There is nothing “well meaning” or “naĂŻve” in Curran’s tweet. Definitely amateurish and petty.

        • miravox 25.1.2.2
          10 September 2013 at 9:53 pm

          “Robertson is all behind the scenes person I think”

          Yes. Walks in as part of the team when it goes well for those who make the play, and then walks in as the one not involved when the play turns to custard. Make me wonder what Robertson really thinks about anything.

      • Hami Shearlie 25.1.3
        11 September 2013 at 9:45 am

        +1000

  26. big bruv 26
    10 September 2013 at 8:11 pm

    Not sure why so many of the hard lefties here think that the Nats’ are running scared of Cunliffe.

    I desperately hope he wins the Labour party leadership, if two thirds of the Labour caucus have worked out that the man is odious then I don’t think it will take the public long to work that out for themselves.

    Please let it be Cunliffe, he and only he can assure the Nat’s of at least one more term.

  27. amirite 27
    11 September 2013 at 8:02 am

    It was great to see a good, interesting, civilised campaign for the Party leadership. The only tarnish was coming from a few party unfaithful and the media, desperate to find some shit to stir. It says more about them, than the candidates themselves.

    I doubt the Nats would’ve ever been able to pull a campaign like that, not in a million years. They simply don’t get the meaning of the word ‘democracy’.

    I hope we’ll see the last of Key in 2014.

    Signed,
    a life-long Labour voter (not a Party member).

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