Key on the Teina Pora compensation

Written By: - Date published: 11:24 am, June 16th, 2016 - 74 comments
Categories: accountability, human rights, john key - Tags: , , ,

Do the Nats have a decent, compassionate bone in their collective bodies?

74 comments on “Key on the Teina Pora compensation ”

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  1. gsays 1
    16 June 2016 at 11:38 am

    On a rare occasion I watched TV news.

    I was struck by the footage of teina pora.
    He was smiling in each clip.

    Wonderful ‘framing’ by the ptb.

    • AsleepWhileWalking 1.1
      16 June 2016 at 7:24 pm

      That’s the plan by the look of it. Nothing to see here… not even the man who lost a couple of irreplaceable decades.

      I think 8 million is fair.

  2. Richardrawshark 2
    16 June 2016 at 11:44 am

    Don’t hate me understand the counter argument

    What about the mongrel mob, what about his family who set him up. what about taking the blame for a crime you did not commit, usually for the promise of a patch and the 10k reward.

    what about the victim losing justice because he chose to take the blame. This was also way before his fetal alcohol syndrome was even known as a problem, what about all the others convicted over the years for lesser crimes that could claim the same defence.

    2.5 mils pretty damn good considering he walked into a polioce station and diverted police resources at a time when results were all that mattered dare I say encouraged by government?

    This is all BS. we have bigger fish to fry and I don’t want to see the opposition stooping too this beat up when we have bigger issues like a government like national.

    Teina is not saying this, everyone else is using it as a political football. give me a break.

    • BM 2.1
      16 June 2016 at 11:50 am

      Another sensible comment there, Richard.

    • marty mars 2.2
      16 June 2016 at 12:14 pm

      Bullfuckingshit Richard – injustice is injustice

      Go get your bigger fish if you want – no one is stopping you, what are you waiting for?????

    • M. Gray 2.3
      16 June 2016 at 1:08 pm

      Actually I don’t agree with you Richard when we see something is wrong, should we just ignore it or challenge it. Too many people have expressed racist and discriminative views on Teina Poras compensation. Unlike you I have grown up with this sort of bull-shert you get sick and tired of this happening so you speak out and take a stand. National need to be accountable for all their policies and actions. I listen to Adams talking this morning and she was saying for compensation they don’t follow the other compensated cases as they are all different. But the law is suppose to follow precedents but they don’t. Funny how the Government can move the goal posts when it suits them. And now we have all these nasty right wing d -heads with their outrageous nasty and entrenched racist/discriminative comments this is not acceptable in our country any longer and people like myself and others will not stand for it.

    • Rosemary McDonald 2.4
      16 June 2016 at 1:47 pm

      Another way of looking at this is that you’d have to have a significant level of fuckwittedness not to see that Teina Pora had at least a learning disability…if not actually spot that he was seriously affected by FASD/FAD.

      This was most definitely a recognised ‘disorder’ back then…the police should have seen that they were dealing with a person with ‘special needs’.

      Instead, the police exploited his disability and vulnerability.

      For a quick and easy conviction. Picking low hanging fruit.

      Again.

      Double the compensation.

      • JonL 2.4.2
        16 June 2016 at 8:13 pm

        and take it out of the police budget!

      • framu 2.4.3
        17 June 2016 at 10:16 am

        lets not forget that the police had to show pora what house the crime was commited in – he had no idea when asked to point it out

        regardless of whatever sins pora might have done at the time the police had ample chances to pull the plug – they didnt

    • Rae 2.5
      16 June 2016 at 2:23 pm

      Absolutely none of which makes it okay to imprison someone for a crime they did not commit, especially, as is pretty damned clear, they were fitted up, and none of which means that adequate redress should not be taken once they slow lumberous process of righting the wrong reaches its end.
      This is not Minority Report

    • Tim 2.6
      16 June 2016 at 8:28 pm

      Agreed richard, the opposition really shouldn’t waste their time on this

  3. Greg 3
    16 June 2016 at 11:48 am

    It would mean he doesnt have to work.

  4. shorts 4
    16 June 2016 at 11:54 am

    “Do the Nats have a decent, compassionate bone in their collective bodies?”

    No – well not unless it concerns one of their own

  5. Lanthanide 5
    16 June 2016 at 11:55 am

    There have been some who are saying he never could have earned that much money in 21 years (given his “poor prospects”), so it’s more than enough for him.

    I think there’s an alternative angle there – would any 18 year old agree to be imprisoned for 21 years, to get a payout of $2.5M at the end of it?

    I doubt it.

    • Richardrawshark 5.1
      16 June 2016 at 12:10 pm

      Depends on your prospects in life, I actually know plenty around here that would consider it. I know one who was given a house to murder someone in jail, who was already on a murder charge. At that time the house was worth about 100k, you remember the mr Asia’s associates stabbings in the mount don’t you.

      Plenty have done major time for financial assistance.

      you know the police actively or used to do a thing called TIC, taken into consideration, when they ask people they arrest for a crime to take other crimes on themselves for sentence and cooperation browny points in front of the judge?

      good way of fudging stats and making a small number of the population responsible for most of the crimes.

      time people stopped talking shit on justice.

      • Anno1701 5.1.1
        16 June 2016 at 12:45 pm

        A little bird told me Teina went down to protect an important police informant at the time

        dont know how true that is , but its certainly feasible

      • North 5.1.2
        16 June 2016 at 3:53 pm

        Time you stopped talking shit instead of talking Justice, Richardrawshark. According to your ‘argument’ a miscarriage of justice is more or less objectionable according to how high or low the victim of that miscarriage of justice sits on the social spectrum.

        Well done on your big fail. However it arises. Racism, scorn for a perceived underclass, or just plain stupid nastiness, it’s a fail. Compounded by your mindless speculation about where Teina Pora would have ended up.

        Amy Adams tells the lie that the Cabinet has implemented Justice Hansen’s report. It has not. Justice Hansen’s report recommended 2.5 adjusted for inflation. While it has discretion to implement that recommendation the cabinet has refused to do so. So hag Adams lies. And you talk the strangest shit.

        • Richardrawshark 5.1.2.1
          16 June 2016 at 4:55 pm

          Not at all north,

          My points are this.

          He was not that innocent he was an MMM prospect or hanger on. He had connections with Rewa through the gang.– take into consideration for remuneration

          He has already been awarded 2.5 million which is a shit load of money.

          We all know the police cocked up but so did he by perverting the coarse of justice etc.

          Some people act as if the police took advantage of a dumb deaf mute with 3 arms. 70’s early 80’s fetal alchohol syndrome, well known please he’s not a moron.

          The police should have known something was up when he didn’t even know the house.

          His Family should not have encouraged and even went along with the police to get him reconvicted on his appeals where are they held responsible?

          They, Teina and the mob, stuffed up an investigation, and the culture of advancement in the police force for results is not mentioned either.

          everyone including I am sorry to say Teina are at fault and 2.5 mills a load of cash, he’s sorted for life as long as he follows financial advise and isn’t used again.

          How much do you really need? 10 mill? why not 20, how about 21 whats a year in jail worth over that 21 years he may have won lotto twice.

          2.5 mil, he doesn’t want it give it too me then.

          Oh P fkn S, you know who’s moaning, his fkn lawyers straight away, you know why, it’s not about Teina is it? perhaps a little truth about the cut his lawyers are getting. Of coarse THEY want more.

          • McFlock 5.1.2.1.1
            16 June 2016 at 5:13 pm

            There’s a long history of mentally vulnerable people being coerced into false confessions by police for a “result”.

            Sometimes the cops genuinely thought they had the right person, and got a successful confession.

            Other police just figured they needed someone and the person they had was close enough – if they actually got the right guy it was a happy coincidence.

            The one person in this case who was definitely not at fault was Teina Pora: he was way out of his depth before he even fell in with the MMM crowd, let alone the police.

            • Richardrawshark 5.1.2.1.1.1
              16 June 2016 at 5:38 pm

              I’ll meet you half way then McFlock give him 5, but heck if 2.5 mil ain’t a fortune, and how can you put any value on any of it? Too even value a year lost of your life when you only get one is immeasurable against the age of the universe and the miniscule amount of time you are alive to enjoy it.

              I just think this is greedy lawyers, and vested interests. How about give him the money already stop bothering him anymore and let him live the rest of his life, or at least make the decision himself.

              • McFlock …
                16 June 2016 at 5:52 pm

                As I said somewhere else, as soon as you start quibbling over the cash, it cheapens the apology.

                It’s like putting money in a charity box, and then demanding change.

                The sum set for Arthur Allan Thomas was $100,000 for every year. That was a nice round number, and maybe half a million in today’s money if he was paid in 1980 so geninely lifechanging.

                So, really, you could simply adjust for inflation or round it up afterwards. But sticking with a thirty year old total is just cheap. Tacky.

          • Trey 5.1.2.1.2
            16 June 2016 at 6:36 pm

            Yes Richardrawshark Malcolm Rewa had Mongreal Mob connections. No it would be highly unlikely that he would have had contact with Rewa through the gang as Rewa was a patched member of Highway 61.

          • North 5.1.2.1.3
            16 June 2016 at 9:56 pm

            You’re still talking shit arsehole. The question is whether he did what they said he did and he fucking didn’t so your rave is patent racism and classism. So fuck you little John Key and little Amy Adams. You don’t have an ounce of credibility…….you or one of yours who served 21 years for horrendous crimes you/they didn’t do……would you be giving us racist, classist raving as you are now. No. A plague on you……and yours. Not that yours deserve penalty for your thick outlandishness.

            • Trey 5.1.2.1.3.1
              17 June 2016 at 6:36 am

              I totally agree that Teina was wrongfully convicted and deserves compensation.
              My point to richard was that in that Teina was mongrel mob and rewa was highway 61 it further proves that there was no way that he committed the crime.
              Teina should never have been convicted in the first place but “IF” it was just a mistake once Rewa was convicted of the rape Teina should have been automatically released as this proved his innocence.

    • North 5.2
      18 June 2016 at 1:32 pm

      Excellent point @ 5 Lanth’.

      Demonstrates the ludicrousness of the speculation that Teina was headed nowhere anyway and accordingly the miscarriage of justice he suffered is markedly less egregious than it would be for those whose prospects we speculate to be much brighter.

      To the extent that Bill Hodge of Auckland University engaged that speculation and produced an obviously misbegotten analysis suggests a classism in him which I can barely believe lives there. He must have been having an off day.

  6. Skinny 6
    16 June 2016 at 12:00 pm

    Mr Key says “there are plenty of people who think Mr Pora didn’t deserve $2.5 million.”

    Who are these people saying this? 20 years wrongfully locked up behind bars and plenty of people say Pora is deserving of nothing.

    What a deceitful liar Key is!

    • marty mars 6.1
      16 June 2016 at 12:17 pm

      Yep + 1 on that skinny

    • M. Gray 6.2
      16 June 2016 at 1:14 pm

      Compulsive liar and so is his Minister of Social development its a prerequisite for being part of the party

    • Johan 6.3
      16 June 2016 at 3:30 pm

      Mr Key doesn’t hide “being an idiot” very well;-)))

    • gsays 6.4
      16 June 2016 at 5:22 pm

      Hi skinny, dunno about you.. I would prefer my ‘leaders’ to operate with higher principles than ‘ what some people think’ or ‘I reckon’.

      • M. Gray 6.4.1
        17 June 2016 at 10:00 am

        Its interesting that people have not talked much about the culprits here and that is our Police force. Our taxes are paying for their f …ups and how many have they made and continue to make.

  8. fisiani 8
    16 June 2016 at 2:30 pm

    Key was correct “the cabinet does not have to pay compensation”
    Factually correct.
    Choosing to make a payment was a compassionate choice.

    • Rosemary McDonald 8.1
      16 June 2016 at 2:56 pm

      “Choosing to make a payment was a compassionate choice.”

      NO.

      If anything, it was a cold, cynical PR exercise.

    • Robert Guyton 8.2
      16 June 2016 at 4:10 pm

      “the cabinet does not have to pay compensation” may well be “Factually correct” but your;
      “Choosing to make a payment was a compassionate choice” is nothing more than opinion. I note, fisiani, that your opinions are given little credence here and I can see why that is.

    • Richardrawshark 8.3
      16 June 2016 at 5:02 pm

      You got your shades on Fisiani, you know the sunshine beaming out of John Keys arse is blinding don’t you?

    • Clare 8.4
      17 June 2016 at 10:57 am

      go away nasty person

  9. ankerawshark 9
    16 June 2016 at 3:02 pm

    I really object to Key’s comments “If he doesn’t like it he can give it back” or words to that effect.

    Kind of like, “like it or lump it”. A terrible thing to say to somebody wrongfully imprisoned for 20 years. Disgusting and heartless.

  10. Mark Wilson 10
    16 June 2016 at 3:29 pm

    Just because you don’t agree with someone’s point of view does not make them lacking a “decent, compassionate bone in their collective bodies” or :”disgusting and heartless.”
    The left get bogged down in a fantasy world where reality doesn’t intrude.
    The issue is that the right understand that wishing and hoping gets zero results.

    For a start Pora will not get to see all but a fraction of the money by the time his feral relatives (read what the judge said about them) and the Mongrel Mob take the money – what hope has someone with his mental abilities of keeping the money – nil!

    Why should the taxpayer fund the Mongrel Mob?

    • North 10.1
      16 June 2016 at 4:45 pm

      The damp squib PM effetely witters on with “I do worry…… ” about the little prince getting responses to his “look at me look at me…..” show-off antics. Yet in respect of Justice for Teina (and, therefore, for the nation) it’s pretty much yawn……followed by a dog whistle to racist sociopaths. Suggestion…….Teina is bloody lucky to be getting anything, more or less. Again……no parent would hold out as a role model this characterless detritus Key.

    • North 10.2
      16 June 2016 at 4:55 pm

      Ladies and Gentlemen………I give you the fetid racist and sociopath, Mark Wilson !

    • McFlock 10.3
      16 June 2016 at 5:00 pm

      isn’t it going into a trust for him? Thought I saw that on the news last night.

      So try again, marky mark

      • North 10.3.1
        16 June 2016 at 10:36 pm

        Actually, it’s not the business of fucking racists where the fucking money goes. Of course the racists (and there’re a few call themselves Lefties who’ve shown themselves to be racists on this thread) will underline their racism by questioning every fucking aspect of things……point is none of these wiseacres spent 21 years banged up and wore the stamp of “murderer……rapist”, as TOTALLY undeservedly did Teina.

        Whom EVERYONE now knows was never a murderer or a rapist. Thank you very much Super-Vanity-Cop-Steve- Rutherford now living in deservedly ignominious retirement in the Bay of Plenty or somewhere. You stole 21 years of a man’s life, arsehole. And I’m very sad to learn that it was Paul Davison QC now a High Court judge who twice ‘successfully’ prosecuted Teina. Twice sent him to jail for crimes we all now know he never committed. That’s where ‘The Law’ loses all it’s meaning.

        And thank you very much racist fucking idiots who somehow overlook the fact that he never never never fucking did it. Idiots. It’s like they think he’s ‘sort of’ guilty. No wonder that Ponce Key keeps getting re-elected in this country. With thinking like that spoofing all over. No respect. None at all. Especially for shits who call themselves Left.

    • Hanswurst 10.4
      16 June 2016 at 5:11 pm

      Just because you don’t agree with someone’s point of view does not make them lacking a “decent, compassionate bone in their collective bodies” or :”disgusting and heartless.”

      You’re absolutely right. What makes them disgusting and heartless is publicly treating an issue of ruining somebody’s life purely as a matter of accountancy, and lying by saying that the government’s hands were tied in setting the sum.

      One of the biggest problems with the Right is that they live in a fantasy world in which arguments from principle and reason are seen merely as assaults on their God-given “freedom” to have things happen as they please.

    • Halfcrown 10.5
      16 June 2016 at 5:37 pm

      “The left get bogged down in a fantasy world where reality doesn’t intrude.”

      No they don’t mate, what they like to see is a bit of justice and fair play. But I realise fair play and justice to you right wingers is treated as a fantasy, you don’t know the meaning of, because in the Ayn Randian dreamworld there are no such things as fair play or justice – Oh, yes there is, I forgot, the more money you have, the more fair play and justice you will be shown. It is survival of the fittest, fuck you Jack get out of the fucking way as there is a dollar to be made (note, made not earned) and as I have a few dollars I have an overwhelming sense of entitlement.
      Sure you are right saying it could end up in the hands of the Mongrel Mob, but hopefully his team of lawyers who appear to be very compassionate are advising him on how to safeguard his money.
      I also would not like to see my contribution to the tax take ending up in the hands of the Mongrel Mob, no more than Rio Tinto or A J Hacket, or Warners, Jackson, or private schools, or Charter Schools, etc but he well deserves compensation like lots and after he has been paid wherever it ends up is not our concern.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 10.6
      16 June 2016 at 6:30 pm

      The left get bogged down in a fantasy world where reality doesn’t intrude.

      Meanwhile, on Earth, the question of whether right wingers in general are heartless is a matter of opinion. Personally I think they’re incompetent, corrupt, greedy and dishonest, because I can measure those things against objective criteria.

      I note your utter disregard for Teina Pora’s human rights. and venture to suggest that, since you seem literate, and possibly therefore, educated, your ethics may be lower than even the Mongrel Mob’s.

      What’s your excuse for promoting your pathetic vengeance fantasies over his right to compensation?

      • Halfcrown 10.6.1
        16 June 2016 at 6:42 pm

        Nice one Anonymous

      • North 10.6.2
        16 June 2016 at 10:51 pm

        The telling point however is this……see one of ‘their’ little boys or girls in the shit…….up in court or whatever…….oh there are a thousand reasons why it’s just a terrible mistake……why this good kid really shouldn’t be proceeded against, or at least must be treated advantageously differently. Yes I see it daily and daily I see District Court judges finding reasons why this little darling shouldn’t be treated roughly like the next defendant called……the little Maori boy or the little Island boy. And oh how they the judges congratulate themselves nevertheless.

        I’m 40 years in practice now and to my discredit it’s only been in the last two or three years that I’ve recognised the foul discriminatory essence of it. Why else do we have this extraordinary over-representation of brown people in the hinaki ?

  11. Ross 11
    16 June 2016 at 5:26 pm

    Apparently National told Pora that he had to make an “immediate” decision whether to accept or decline its miserly offer. WTF?

    Anyway, Amy Adams has now said that the offer isn’t time bound. All National has to do is adjust the offer for inflation and give Pora $4.5 million. That’s what a compassionate government would do.

    Labour-Greens could of course state unequivocally that when elected it will fairly compensate Pora and won’t be so miserable as to short-change successful applicants. National were quick to pay millions to Rio Tinto but a guy who’s spent 21 years in prison for a crime he didn’t commit, meh.

    http://www.pundit.co.nz/content/why-isnt-cabinet-doing-what-it-says-it-should-for-teina-pora

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/81141316/teina-pora-may-challenge-25-million-compensation-offer-from-government

    • Colonial Viper 11.1
      16 June 2016 at 6:42 pm

      We are not asking for Government to act “compassionately” – we are asking Government to act justly.

    • North 11.2
      16 June 2016 at 11:06 pm

      Yeah, that’s what I want. In the next election campaign level up against that effete thing The Ponce Key a promise to make a further payment of at least 2.5 mill’. To sheet home that we are a nation concerned with righting injustice as best we can, as opposed to further slighting the victim of that injustice. And of course the victims of the injustice include that poor woman and her family. In that their emotions and their pain were commandeered and so disrespected as to have them understand and believe at least initially that Teina Pora took their loved one from them. An outrage which they are now wise to.

    • North 11.3
      17 June 2016 at 7:20 am

      How much did the Saudi ‘sheep farmer’ get ?

      • M. Gray 11.3.1
        17 June 2016 at 10:06 am

        21million spent on Keys flag pet project and millions on the Saudi farm bribe and NZ women can’t and won’t get more paid maternity leave and we have low birth rates so we have to rely on immigration very sad indeed.
        Family violence on the rise and no money for our Womens refuges.

  12. Ross 12
    16 June 2016 at 6:02 pm

    Let’s not forget that former Justice Minister Judith Collins had the opportunity to pardon Teina Pora but she preferred that he spend more time in prison.

    Collins of course was a big supporter of Peter Ellis and, when she was in Opposition, signed a petition requesting a Commission of Inquiry into his case. But as soon as she became a Minister, she quickly lost interest in Peter Ellis.

    She doesn’t seem to have any political will or moral courage where miscarriages of justice are concerned.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-post/comment/9020990/Govt-must-not-intrude-on-courts

    • M. Gray 12.1
      17 June 2016 at 10:09 am

      Her and her husband are too busy plundering our swamp Kauri up North and selling our water overseas

  13. dave 13
    16 June 2016 at 7:39 pm

    the is no justice with national bain and pora should walk away from any dealing with this rotten corrupt government you will only get justice from a government that has principles it tisn’t the key government.

  14. dave 14
    16 June 2016 at 7:46 pm

    key has basically said stiff shit to pora ,bain ,and rest of the wrongly convicted and the homeless god this fuckin government has to go .

  15. vto 15
    17 June 2016 at 7:18 am

    .

    key has no soul

    .

    • Mosa 15.1
      18 June 2016 at 3:11 pm

      Or decency ,morals, honesty, compassion,sincerity, self respect, courage, a concience, decency, or principles.

  16. vto 16
    17 June 2016 at 7:27 am

    Amy Adams cringing justification mincespeak two days ago, and her explanations of how the system works.. well ……..

    Adams said “The system works well with its appeal processes in that it picks up cases such as Taina’s. However, this proves the system works to avoid injustice because 99.999% of cases never get overturned.”

    ….. jeeezzuz….

    Did Adams suggest that the system only gets it wrong 0.001% of the time?????

    Does anybody believe that?????

    I would suggest that the 99.999% of the time statistic indicates that the system is NOT working, not that it IS working… That 99.999% figure indicates that there are many more people suffering injustice as that figure should be significantly lower…

    Does anybody know where else in human society and history, people and their systems get things right 99.999% of the time??? If so, I would like to hear it..

    It
    does
    not
    happen

    the 99.999% figure indicates failure not success

    never trust the crown

  17. Ross 17
    17 June 2016 at 11:34 am

    Now police are saying that Pora is in fact guilty! Breath-taking. Is it any wonder that miscarriages of justice don’t get corrected or, for those that do, can take a very long time.

    Detective Superintendent Andy Lovelock – who holds the Burdett homicide file – told Stuff’s investigative team in a phone conversation on June 3: “The police position is that Teina Pora is a co-offender with Malcolm Rewa. That hasn’t changed.”

    By then, police had a copy of the report which has declared Pora innocent.
    …
    The pursuit of Pora appears to have been relentless, with detectives seeking new evidence right up until the case went to the Privy Council in late 2014.

    Then, in February this year, on hearing one of the witnesses who assisted Pora’s case was dying “the police approached him to see if he wanted to change his evidence”, McKinnel says.

    “It was at the time when the case was in the hands of Justice Hansen. They had all the evidence pointing towards Teina’s innocence in their hands. And yet here they are approaching a man who they knew was dying – and did die soon after that – to see if he would change his evidence. That to me says everything you need to know”.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/81164960/teina-pora-police-continued-to-seek-evidence-to-get-him-at-all-costs

  18. North 18
    18 June 2016 at 8:16 am

    The Police adopted a similar ‘never say die and stuff justice’ approach in the David Dougherty miscarriage of justice. As I recall in the second round their pose was that if Dougherty wasn’t the sole offender then he was present as a criminal accomplice who did not himself physically offend. “If he didn’t do it he facilitated it…..” sort of thing. Now the same pose with Teina apparently. How do they sleep at night ? I know……reflexive resort to their essential racism and their detestation of those they perceive as a perpetually guilty underclass.

  19. Mosa 19
    18 June 2016 at 1:59 pm

    I would like to acknowledge that the victim Susan Burdett died a horrible death in what was supposed to be the safety of her own Home where she should have been safe.
    This seems to be forgotten here and the anguish for her family never goes away.

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