Mueller v Russia
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8:21 am, February 19th, 2018 - 324 comments
Categories: Abuse of power, Donald Trump, International, Politics, us politics, you couldn't make this shit up -
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I get the feeling the Robert Mueller investigation is reaching a critical stage.
Last week there was news that Rick Gates, former business partner of George Papadopoulos had changed tack and was cooperating fully with the Mueller investigation. From Salon:
Rick Gates, a former top aide to Donald Trump, looks close to making a plea deal with special counsel Robert Mueller and his investigators.
The former deputy to Paul Manafort, campaign manager for Trump, is in the process of finalizing the plea deal after roughly one month of negotiations, according to CNN. Once Gates has an official plea deal, he will be the third person known to be cooperating with Mueller’s investigation into alleged Russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election. Gates’ plea deal could also increase pressure on Manafort, who also used to be Gates’ business partner. Like Gates, Manafort pleaded not guilty on October 30 for alleged financial crimes that did not involve his work on the Trump campaign.
A crucial component in working out any plea deal is the value of what a defendant can offer investigators. Although it’s unclear how Gates could help the Mueller investigation in proving collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russian government, the contents of his plea deal will depend on whether he says anything of value — and, more importantly, whether what he says can be verified by Mueller’s investigators.
One important step has already been taken in the Gates case: He has had his so-called “Queen for a Day” interview, wherein a defendant answers all questions from a prosecutors’ team.
Then there was news that Steve Bannon was also spending large amounts of time with Mueller. From CNN:
Steve Bannon, President Donald Trump‘s former chief strategist, has met with the special counsel overseeing the Russia probe multiple times this week, NBC News reported Thursday, citing sources.
Bannon met with Robert Mueller for about 20 hours, according to the NBC report, which cited two sources familiar with the proceedings.
Bannon, who also ran Trump’s campaign during the final stretch of the 2016 presidential race, left the White House in August. He returned to his position heading up the right-wing online news outlet Breitbart afterward, but he departed the organization after his quotes in an explosive tell-all book went public earlier this year.
And then a couple of days ago news broke of Mueller laying an indictment against thirteen Russians and three Russian corporations essentially alleging wide spread illegal involvement in the 2016 American Election. From the Guardian:
Thirteen Russians have been criminally charged for interfering in the 2016 US election to help Donald Trump, the office of Robert Mueller, the special counsel, announced on Friday.
Mueller’s office said 13 Russians and three Russian entities, including the notorious state-backed “troll farm” the Internet Research Agency, had been indicted by a federal grand jury in Washington DC.
A 37-page indictment alleged that the Russians’ operations “included supporting the presidential campaign of then-candidate Donald J Trump … and disparaging Hillary Clinton,” his Democratic opponent.
Mueller alleged that Russian operatives “communicated with unwitting individuals associated with the Trump campaign”, but the indictment did not address the question of whether anyone else in Trump’s team had knowingly colluded.
Rod Rosenstein, the deputy attorney general, said at a press conference in Washington: “There is no allegation in this indictment that any American had any knowledge.” Rosenstein added that the charges did not mean the Russian activity had an effect on the outcome of the election.
Trump and the White House seized on Rosenstein’s remarks to falsely claim that the indictment proved there had been no collusion and that the election result had definitely not been impacted.
The details of the allegations are interesting. Again from the Guardian:
The charges state that from as far back as 2014, the defendants conspired together to defraud the US by “impairing, obstructing, and defeating the lawful functions of government” through interference with the American political and electoral processes.
One defendant, Yevgeniy Prigozhin, is accused of using companies he controlled – including Concord Management and Consulting, and Concord Catering – to finance the operations against the US. The operation at one stage had a monthly budget of $1.25m, according to Mueller, which paid for operatives’ salaries and bonuses.
Events were organised by Russians posing as Trump supporters and as groups opposed to Trump such as Black Lives Matter, according to prosecutors. One advertisement shortly before the election promoted the Green party candidate Jill Stein, who is blamed by some Clinton backers for splitting the anti-Trump vote.
In August 2016, Russian operatives communicated with Trump campaign staff in Florida through their “@donaldtrump.com” email addresses to coordinate a series of pro-Trump rallies in the state, according to Mueller, and then bought advertisements on social media to promote the events.
At one rally in West Palm Beach, a Russian operative is even alleged to have paid Americans to build a cage on a flatbed truck and to have an actor posing as Clinton in a prison uniform stand inside.
…
The Russians are also accused of working to suppress turnout among ethnic minority voters. They allegedly created an Instagram account posing as “Woke Blacks” and railed against the notion that African Americans should choose Clinton as “the lesser of two devils” against Trump.
In early November 2016, according to the indictment, the Russian operatives used bogus “United Muslims of America” social media accounts to claim that “American Muslims [are] boycotting elections today.”
Following Trump’s victory, the Russian operation promoted allegations of voter fraud by the Democratic party, according to Mueller’s team. Around that time, Trump repeatedly claimed without evidence that he would have won the popular vote if not for large-scale voter fraud.
It did not take long for Trump to change his view from there was no collusion to there was collusion but it was Hillary’s and the Democrat’s fault.
General McMaster forgot to say that the results of the 2016 election were not impacted or changed by the Russians and that the only Collusion was between Russia and Crooked H, the DNC and the Dems. Remember the Dirty Dossier, Uranium, Speeches, Emails and the Podesta Company!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 18, 2018
And he even managed to blame the FBI investigation into Russian interference in the election for the recent Florida School shooting. Has he no shame?
Very sad that the FBI missed all of the many signals sent out by the Florida school shooter. This is not acceptable. They are spending too much time trying to prove Russian collusion with the Trump campaign – there is no collusion. Get back to the basics and make us all proud!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 18, 2018
Fox News also managed to rail between claims there was nothing to worry about to actually conceding that Russian interference with American politics had occurred.
Indictment reveals Russians also organized anti-Trump rallies after election https://t.co/0TqCDPsd4F
— Fox News (@FoxNews) February 17, 2018
Mueller’s questioning of Trump must be close. Interesting times …
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Teanau Tuiono’s Member’s Bill, the Citizenship (Western Samoa Restoration) Amendment Bill, has passed its third reading and will become law. ...2 days ago
- Release: Minister of Education thinks New Zealand ends at the Bombay Hills
The Minister of Education has shown complete disregard for rural communities and their school bus routes in Question Time today. ...2 days ago
- Economists sound alarm on Government’s slash-and-burn approach
A group of prominent economists has released an open letter to the Government, raising grave concerns about the far-reaching consequences of its fiscal policy. ...2 days ago
- Release: Smoking numbers up under Costello’s watch
National’s repeal of Labour’s smokefree legislation has taken New Zealand further away from achieving a Smokefree 2025 and a smokefree generation. ...2 days ago
- Release: Call for Palestine recognition by NZ, Australian and Canadian MPs
Parliamentarians from Australia, Canada and New Zealand have written an open letter to their respective Prime Ministers calling on them to recognise Palestine. ...2 days ago
- Justice Select Committee opens floor for Treaty Principles submissions
Today, the Justice Select Committee has decided to officially open submissions for the controversial Treaty Principles Bill. ...3 days ago
- Power of the people on full display as hīkoi approaches Parliament
Today, Hīkoi mō te Tiriti arrived in Wellington, with thousands gathering to march in unity against the divisive Treaty Principles Bill. ...3 days ago
- Hypocrisy as Te Whatu Ora contractor bill balloons
Te Whatu Ora’s bill for contracting and consulting staff has ballooned by nearly 20 percent under the National Government, breaking a promise they made during the election campaign to cut contractors. ...4 days ago
- Release: Growing pressure to scrap Section 7AA Repeal Bill
The newly released Section 7AA Repeal Bill's select committee report is further evidence that the Government should scrap it. ...5 days ago
- Government’s move to monetise access to nature a slippery slope
The Green Party is voicing serious concerns over the Government’s proposal to charge for access to public conservation land, released today. ...1 week ago
- Green Party condemns the passage of Treaty Principles Bill
The Green Party condemns the passing of the Treaty Principles Bill at first reading, and is clear that the fight is not over. ...1 week ago
- Stand Up for Te Tiriti
Te Tiriti o Waitangi is our country’s founding document. It forms the basis of the relationship between Māori and the Crown – and the Aotearoa New Zealand we live in today. ...1 week ago
- Release: Over 15,000 sign Labour’s open letter to Luxon
As the hīkoi to Parliament continues, Labour has sent an open letter to Prime Minister Christopher Luxon in a last-ditch attempt to get him to kill the Treaty Principles Bill. ...1 week ago
- Fast Track Bill threatens environment, climate and reputation
The fast-track legislation passing its second reading in Parliament is another step towards environmental ruin. ...1 week ago
- Greens join King’s Counsel in calling for Treaty Principles Bill to be abandoned
The Prime Minister must answer the call from a group of senior lawyers of the King’s Counsel to abandon the divisive Treaty Principles Bill. ...1 week ago
- Chris Hipkins’ apology statement to state and faith-based care survivors
...1 week ago
- Release: Labour formally apologises to state and faith-based care survivors
Labour joins with the Government in unreservedly apologising for the abuse, neglect and trauma including torture in state and faith-based care and for ignoring the voices of survivors for too long. ...1 week ago
- Green Party stands in support of survivors of abuse in care
Today, the Green Party stands alongside the survivors of abuse in state care and faith-based care as the Government issues an historic apology. ...1 week ago
- Green Party calls for conscience vote on Treaty Principles Bill
The Green Party has written to the Speaker of the House requesting he enable a personal vote on the Treaty Principles Bill. ...2 weeks ago
- Govt move to exclude journalist risks chilling effect
The Green Party is alarmed by the Government’s move to exclude a journalist from covering this week’s apology for the survivors of abuse in state and faith-based care. ...2 weeks ago
- Without action, an apology will be empty air
For tomorrow’s apology to survivors of abuse in state and faith-based care to hold any water, the Government must not pursue the same policies that drove the abuse in the first place. ...2 weeks ago
- Release: Concerns remain over tobacco interference
Concerns about the tobacco industry’s ability to interfere in government policy making remain, despite the inability of the Office of the Auditor-General to investigate the Government’s decision to halve the excise tax on heated tobacco products. ...2 weeks ago
- Urgent wake-up call on climate
The Climate Change Commission’s latest advice indicates Aotearoa needs to be stepping up on climate action. ...2 weeks ago
- Green MP’s Meme-ber’s Bill set to save the world
Break out the punchlines and dust off your meme folder: Green Party MP Kahurangi Carter’s Copyright (Parody and Satire) Amendment Bill was pulled from the Ballot yesterday. ...2 weeks ago
- Release: Poroporoaki: Ta Robert (Bom) Gillies
Kua hinga te manawa kairākau o Te Rua Tekau Ma Waru Tiwhatiwha te po! Kakarauru i te po! Ka rapuhia kei hea koe kua riro! Haere e te Ika a Whiro ki o tini hoa kua ngaro atu ki te Pō ...2 weeks ago
- Labour, Greens and Te Pāti Māori call on the Prime Minister to block the Treaty Principles Bill
The opposition parties stand united for an Aotearoa that honours Te Tiriti, rather than seeking to rewrite it. Labour, the Greens and Te Pāti Māori are working together against the Government’s divisive Treaty Principles Bill. ...2 weeks ago
- Release: Labour, Greens and Te Pāti Māori call on the Prime Minister to block the Treaty Principle...
The opposition parties stand united for an Aotearoa that honours Te Tiriti, rather than seeking to rewrite it. Labour, the Greens and Te Pāti Māori are working together against the Government’s divisive Treaty Principles Bill. ...2 weeks ago
- NZ must pursue independent foreign policy
The Green Party says the need is greater than ever for Aotearoa New Zealand to pursue an independent foreign policy. ...2 weeks ago
- Appointments strengthen Predator Free 2050
The latest Predator Free 2050 Board appointments will help to strengthen biodiversity efforts across Aotearoa New Zealand, Conservation Minister Tama Potaka says. Mr Potaka today announced two appointments to the Board of Directors of Predator Free 2050 Limited, a key player in the wider Predator Free 2050 Programme. “The Predator ...2 hours ago - New facility in Christchurch will improve the lives of young New Zealanders
Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey today opened Kahurangi, an innovative and much-needed facility for Canterbury’s Child, Adolescent, and Family Mental Health Services. “The new state of the art outpatient facility opened today will be a gamechanger for the way mental health is delivered for young people in Canterbury,” says Mr ...2 hours ago
- Driver safety screens to be installed on Auckland buses
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed news from the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) that bus driver protection screens will be installed across Auckland’s bus fleet by 2026.“The Government is committed to improving the safety of working environments for bus drivers, and Budget 2024 allocated $15 million of Crown funding over ...2 hours ago
- Government action provides Southland farmers more time to meet plan requirements
The Government is taking action to ensure Southland farmers and growers are not affected by unreasonable regional farm plan deadlines, Agriculture Minister Todd McClay, Environment Minister Penny Simmonds and Associate Environment Minister Andrew Hoggard say.“Cabinet has agreed to provide more time for farmers and growers to comply with regional rules ...19 hours ago
- Bill reaffirms Government’s commitment to crack down on serious youth offending
The Oranga Tamariki (Responding to Serious Youth Offending) Bill had its first reading at Parliament today. The Bill reaffirms the Government’s commitment to crack down on serious youth offending, Minister for Children Karen Chhour says. “In recent years we have seen an unacceptable spike in youth offending. “This Bill makes ...19 hours ago
- Critical milestones for earthquake buildings review
Fairer, more sensible rules about managing earthquake risks are a step closer with the passing of legislation and the appointment of an independent chair to provide expert advice, Minister for Building and Construction Chris Penk says. “The Government is committed to reinvigorating our cities and regions to support economic growth, ...20 hours ago
- State of the art radiology machine for Auckland
People in Northland and Auckland will benefit from a new machine for cancer treatment installed at the Regional Cancer and Blood Service at Auckland City Hospital. The MV5 linear accelerator, or LINAC machine, officially opened today targets cancer tumours with pinpoint accuracy. Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says this new, ...20 hours ago
- Foreign Minister to visit Europe
Deputy Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Winston Peters will travel to Europe for high-level talks with France, Germany and the United Kingdom next week. "Since taking office almost a year ago, the Coalition Government has emphasised the importance we place on New Zealand's traditional and likeminded diplomatic and ...21 hours ago
- First arrests made under gang patch ban
Police have made their first arrests under the new gang patch legislation, with two gang members arrested, says Police Minister Mark Mitchell. “Just before 11 this morning, Police in Wairoa apprehended a gang member for wearing a patch to the supermarket. He has been arrested and will now face enforcement ...22 hours ago
- Better support for victims of sexual violence
The Government is proposing two major changes to name suppression laws that will put the views of victims of sexual violence first, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “We are committed to restoring law and order and these two proposed changes will help ensure the victims of crime are put at ...23 hours ago
- Government moving forward with Regional Deals
Cabinet has agreed to invite all regions to submit proposals for Regional Deals between central and local government that drive economic growth and deliver the infrastructure our country needs, Local Government Minister Simeon Brown and Infrastructure Minister Chris Bishop say. Inviting all regions to propose a Regional Deal that boosts ...23 hours ago
- MSA pilot participant update
One of the ten young men selected to participate in the Military-Style Academy Pilot has allegedly reoffended. Children’s Minister Karen Chhour is disappointed but says it would be naïve to think that none of these young men would reoffend. “I’m saddened that this young person has not taken this opportunity ...24 hours ago
- Fighting for Kiwis in Trade
Delivered at Auckland Trade and Economic Policy School Good morning and thank you Deputy Vice Chancellor Lithander for your warm welcome and for inviting me to open Auckland Trade and Economic Policy School today. A Special thanks to the University of Auckland, the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade and ...1 day ago
- Attendance rates increase, again
Associate Education Minister David Seymour says that school attendance is continuing to rise. In Term 3 of 2024 51.3 per cent of students attended school regularly, an increase of 5.3 percentage points from 46 per cent in Term 3 of 2023. “This Government has prioritised student attendance and it is ...1 day ago
- Improving the lives of young New Zealanders
Ensuring New Zealand is the best place in the world for children and young people is the vision at the heart of the Government’s new Child and Youth Strategy, Child Poverty Reduction Minister Louise Upston says. “Childhood represents a huge opportunity to set people on a positive path towards living ...1 day ago
- Government continues work to reinstate livestock exports by sea
The Government is reinstating the trade of livestock exports by sea while ensuring the highest standards of animal welfare, says Associate Minister of Agriculture Andrew Hoggard.“The Government will introduce legislation changes to reinstate the trade, enhance oversight, and strengthen requirements for exporters to identify risks and manage the welfare of ...2 days ago
- Speech to the National Quality Forum 2024
Tēnā koutou katoa – it is a pleasure to be here today. I would like to begin by acknowledging the important leadership role you all play in ensuring a quality health system New Zealanders can trust. There is enormous clinical expertise in this room covering a wide range of disciplines. ...2 days ago
- New Zealand’s COP29 National Statement
Tēnā koutou katoa. Mr President, Excellencies, Delegates. New Zealand, and all nations represented here today, are already dealing with the impacts of climate change. Our households, businesses, and economies are bearing the costs of its effects. The choices we make now will shape the severity of these impacts for generations ...2 days ago
- Latest Quarterly Investment Report released
The Government has released its second Quarterly Investment Report (QIR) which shows substantial work still to be done by agencies to improve investment reporting and meet the Government’s expectations, Infrastructure and Acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “New Zealand has significant infrastructure and investment needs. The Government is determined to get ...2 days ago
- New Zealand supporting loss and damage fund
Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced New Zealand will contribute NZ$10 million to the new Fund for Responding to Loss and Damage while at the annual United Nations Climate Change Conference (COP29) in Baku, Azerbaijan. “New Zealand is joining the global effort to address the significant challenge of responding to ...2 days ago
- Gang crackdown begins at stroke of midnight
The free ride for gangs is over when the clock strikes midnight tonight, with tough new laws officially coming into effect, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith and Police Minister Mark Mitchell say. “Gang patches will no longer be able to be worn in public. To earn the right to wear a ...2 days ago
- LGFA increases borrowing capacity to support high growth councils
The Government is welcoming the decision by the Local Government Funding Agency to increase access to financing tools for fast growing councils to support greater investment in critical infrastructure, Local Government Minister Simeon Brown says.“Communities across the country are facing an infrastructure deficit and significant population growth is projected in ...2 days ago
- Temporary Traffic Management costs revealed
The Government has revealed that over the past three years, the New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA) has spent an eyewatering $786 million of taxpayers’ money on road cones and temporary traffic management (TTM), Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“When I became Minister, I was surprised to learn that that NZTA did ...2 days ago
- Jurisdiction of Disputes Tribunal to double
Legislation that will double the financial jurisdiction of the Disputes Tribunal from $30,000 to $60,000 has passed first reading in Parliament today, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith. “We need to improve court timeliness and access to justice so that Kiwis and get on with their lives. Court delays affect everyone, the ...3 days ago
- Protecting New Zealand from foreign interference
Legislation that will specifically criminalise foreign interference and strengthen espionage offences has passed first reading in Parliament today, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “It is normal and appropriate for states to interact and work to influence one another. This encourages cooperation and can have mutually beneficial outcomes. “However, the reality ...3 days ago
- Significant milestone for Canterbury Road of National Significance
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed news that the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) Board has approved funding towards pre-implementation and early works on the State Highway 1 (SH1) Belfast to Pegasus Motorway and Woodend Bypass Road of National Significance (RoNS). “Reaching this significant milestone is a reflection of our Government’s ...3 days ago
- Health survey results to help drive change
Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says findings from the annual Health Survey highlight the need to continue driving better health outcomes for New Zealanders. The New Zealand Health Survey is an annual snapshot of key metrics measured from July 2023 – July 2024. Findings released this morning include: In 2023/24, ...3 days ago
- Final push needed to get to Smokefree 2025
A renewed effort to get people to quit smoking will build on what has worked to date and target the groups who most need support, Associate Health Minister Casey Costello said today. “The latest New Zealand Health Survey results show the daily smoking rate at 6.9 per cent and we ...3 days ago
- New diplomatic appointments
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters has announced four new diplomatic appointments. “Our diplomats play an important role in ensuring New Zealand’s interests are maintained and enhanced across the world,” Mr Peters says. “It is a pleasure to announce the appointment of these senior diplomats from the Ministry of Foreign ...3 days ago
- Next steps for Regulatory Standards Bill
Regulation Minister David Seymour has today announced the next steps in the Government’s plan improve the quality of regulation by opening consultation on a proposed Regulatory Standards Bill. “New Zealand's low wages can be blamed on low productivity, and low productivity can be blamed on poor regulation,” says Mr Seymour. ...3 days ago
- Red Tape Tipline goes live
Minister for Regulation David Seymour has today announced that the Ministry for Regulation’s Red Tape Tipline is now live. “We want to hear about your red tape horror stories. From today, New Zealanders will have a say on how they are regulated through an online portal,” says Mr Seymour. The ...3 days ago
- Youth Parliament 2025 announced
The Minister for Youth Matt Doocey has today announced the eleventh Youth Parliament will be taking place in 2025. “Youth Parliament offers a unique youth development opportunity to young people from across New Zealand to experience the political process and learn about how government works,” says Mr Doocey. “The two-day ...4 days ago
- Police stats show promising change
After nearly a year in Government, Kiwis have seen significant change across law and order with promising early results shown across some Police statistics, says Police Minister Mark Mitchell. “In August 2023, I told New Zealanders that if they had not started to see a change in public safety within ...4 days ago
- Better coordination of anti-scam efforts
With the launch of Fraud Awareness Week, the Government is committing to new coordination efforts across industry and government to combat online scams, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says. “Online financial scams are a growing problem for New Zealand. New data released today shows that Kiwis lost nearly ...4 days ago
- Minister to consider 7AA select committee report
Minister for Children Karen Chhour will consider the recommendations made by the Social Services and Community Committee in its report back to Parliament on the Oranga Tamariki (Repeal of Section 7AA) Amendment Bill. “I want to thank the people who made submissions and those who appeared before the committee in ...4 days ago
- Defence Minister to attend ASEAN meeting
Defence Minister Judith Collins will this week attend the Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) Defence Ministers’ Meeting-Plus in Vientiane, Laos. “We need to take every opportunity to engage with our international partners, given the increasingly unstable geo-political situation,” Ms Collins says. “New Zealand has a long-standing commitment to this ...4 days ago
- Launching the White Ribbon Ride
The Minister for the Prevention of Family and Sexual Violence, Karen Chhour, was on hand to wish riders well at the start of the North Island leg of the White Ribbon Ride in Whakatāne this morning. The ride helps mark the International Day for the Elimination of Violence against Women, ...5 days ago
- Construction to begin on next stage of Papakura to Drury
Construction on the next stage of the SH1 Papakura to Drury project will begin early next month, with the contract for works awarded to Fulton Hogan, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. "SH1 Papakura to Drury is a key project that will drive economic growth and productivity, reduce congestion, and enable people ...6 days ago
- NZ signs trade deal with Costa Rica, Iceland and Switzerland
Trade and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay has signed a pioneering trade agreement that prioritises New Zealand’s sustainable exports at a ceremony during APEC in Peru today. “The Agreement on Trade and Sustainability (ACCTS), between Costa Rica, Iceland, and Switzerland was concluded in July of this year and opens up significant ...6 days ago
- Government and iwi work together on aquaculture
Five new Aquaculture Settlement Areas will help ensure Ngāi Tahu shares in the opportunities aquaculture offers for Southland’s economy, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. “The Aquaculture Settlement Areas (ASAs) I’m announcing today set aside space so the Crown and Ngāi Tahu can assess their potential for aquaculture development. ...7 days ago
- Justice Committee Makes Further Decisions About Submissions Process For The Principles Of The Treaty...
The committee plans to hold hearings in the week starting Monday, 27 January and the weeks starting 10, 17 and 24 February 2025. ...48 minutes ago - Watch live: Christopher Luxon faces questions during power station visit
It comes as Labour accuses National of not listening to evidence about boot camps. ...58 minutes ago - Survivors of abuse in care know how redress should work – will the government finally listen?
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Stephen Winter, Associate Professor in Political Theory, University of Auckland, Waipapa Taumata Rau Getty Images When Prime Minister Christopher Luxon stood in Parliament last week to apologise to survivors of abuse in care, his words were among many fine speeches by ...1 hour ago - Review: The Day of the Jackal is a riveting and ridiculous ride
Eddie Redmayne’s globe-trotting assassin thriller on TVNZ is worth putting your phone down for. This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. This is a vulnerable thing to say as someone who often writes about television for a job, but boy am I really ...1 hour ago - RNA editing is the next frontier in gene therapy – here’s what you need to know
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Flora Hui, Research Fellow, Centre for Eye Research Australia and Honorary Fellow, Department of Surgery (Ophthalmology), The University of Melbourne IoanaB/Shutterstock The United States Food and Drug Administration has just approved the first-ever clinical trial that uses CRISPR-Cas13 RNA editing. Its ...3 hours ago
- Yes, you still need to use sunscreen, despite what you’ve heard on TikTok
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Katie Lee, PhD Candidate, Dermatology Research Centre, The University of Queensland Karolina Grabowska/Pexels Summer is nearly here. But rather than getting out the sunscreen, some TikTokers are urging followers to chuck it out and go sunscreen-free. They claim it’s healthier ...3 hours ago
- Humans are killing off the old and wise animals that hold nature together. Here’s what must change
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Keller Kopf, Senior Lecturer in Ecology, Charles Darwin University Laxmikant Ameenagad, Shutterstock In humans and other animals, ageing is generally associated with a decline in biological function. But scientists are now discovering older animals perform vital roles in populations and ecosystems. ...3 hours ago
- A man scouring Google Earth found a mysterious scar in the Australian outback – and now scientists...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Matej Lipar, Adjunct Research Fellow, School of Earth and Planetary Sciences, Curtin University Author provided/Google Earth Earlier this year, a caver was poring over satellite images of the Nullarbor Plain when he came across something unexpected: an enormous, mysterious scar etched ...3 hours ago
- Design as a movement: how First Nations people take ownership of their cultural stories through fash...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Treena Clark, Chancellor’s Indigenous Research Fellow, Faculty of Design, Architecture and Building, University of Technology Sydney Once located 250 metres to the east of the Art Gallery of South Australia, the grand beaux-arts style Jubilee Exhibition Building was constructed to house the ...3 hours ago
- ‘We need more doctors’ – Support for new Waikato medical school
The Association of Salaried Medical Specialists says a third medical school and more students in Auckland and Otago are both needed. ...3 hours ago
- Cricket balls can concuss and even kill batters – at all levels, helmet use must be taken seriousl...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Annette Greenhow, Assistant Professor, Faculty of Law, Bond University Linda George/Shutterstock The ten-year anniversary of the death of much-loved Australian cricketer Phillip Hughes falls on November 27. The 25-year-old’s life was tragically cut short in 2014 when a bouncer ...3 hours ago
- Hold the roosters, no economic dawn yet
Treasury likely to downgrade economic forecast while Chris Bishop says the government won’t be ‘a slave to a surplus’, writes Anna Rawhiti-Connell in this extract from The Bulletin. To receive The Bulletin in full each weekday, sign up here. Recession will be deeper and last longer — Treasury At a recent Spinoff ...4 hours ago
- Knowing superstitions aren’t real doesn’t stop us behaving superstitiously – why?
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Stephanie Gomes-Ng, Senior Lecturer of Psychology, Auckland University of Technology Getty Images Former New Zealand prime minister John Key has three white rabbits painted on his helicopter, a nod to his “massively superstitious” habit of repeating “white rabbits” three times at ...5 hours ago
- Government slammed for pushing ahead with boot camps while trial still under way
The coalition has "absolutely no intention of listening to the evidence that comes out of their experiment", Labour MP says. ...6 hours ago
- Smoke and mirrors in heated tobacco debate
Labour claims Government is ‘cherry-picking’ smoking trends data to hide decade-first increase in daily smokers The post Smoke and mirrors in heated tobacco debate appeared first on Newsroom. ...6 hours ago - Smoke and mirrors in tobacco debate
Labour claims Government is ‘cherry-picking’ smoking trends data to hide decade-first increase in daily smokers The post Smoke and mirrors in tobacco debate appeared first on Newsroom. ...6 hours ago
- Treasury bangs the drum on ‘unsustainable’ superannuation
The Government’s economic adviser is sending a message it doesn’t want to hear – superannuation is increasingly unaffordable The post Treasury bangs the drum on ‘unsustainable’ superannuation appeared first on Newsroom. ...6 hours ago
- Victims of sex offending welcome shift on name suppression laws
A man abused by a former political figure is "immensely relieved" at a government proposal to end secrecy around sex offenders' identities. ...6 hours ago
- This week three parties stood together – can they withstand the storm to come?
There is plenty yet to play out, but the next election is at this rate shaping up as trio versus trio, writes Toby Manhire. A subplot of this week’s historic hīkoi mō te Tiriti has been the sight of the three opposition parties presenting a unified front. Te Pāti Māori ...7 hours ago
- All 33 malls in Auckland ranked from worst to best
From the low lows of abandon empires to the high highs of a mall done just right. This is the second in the Malls of New Zealand series, where we rank the malls in major centres. Next week: Wellington. A note from the editor: This is the hardest ranking we’ve ...7 hours ago
- The cost of being: A clothes-mad 20-something who walks everywhere
As part of our series exploring how New Zealanders live and our relationship with money, a 27-year-old apartment-dwelling marketing exec explains her approach to spending and saving. Want to be part of The Cost of Being? Fill out the questionnaire here. Gender: Female. Age: 27. Ethnicity: Pākehā. Role: Marketing exec at ...7 hours ago
- Burma the flying elephant
After about two and a half years of planning and waiting, New Zealand’s last elephant has moved to her new home at Monarto Safari Park in South Australia.Burma and her “human herd”, that is, her keepers, arrived last week, and she’s settling in well, according to Auckland Zoo’s Andrew Coers.“Something ...7 hours ago
- NZ’s membership of Beyond Oil and Gas Alliance in jeopardy
Senior ministers in the coalition suggested NZ’s membership will be re-evaluated if it restarts offshore oil and gas drilling The post NZ’s membership of Beyond Oil and Gas Alliance in jeopardy appeared first on Newsroom. ...7 hours ago
- Raw Politics: Six months in a leaky Bill
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon did not meet the Treaty Principles Bill hikoi crowd, sees “nothing” of merit in the Act-proposed law but the Parliament his Government dominates will spend six months debating a “divisive” measure.That’s because he has accepted there needs to be “aeration” of people’s views on the Treaty, ...7 hours ago
- Taken to the brink, Govt is now close to selling big Whakapapa ski field
Bidder Whakapapa Holdings walked away from the sales process last year, but says it’s now ‘95% there’ on a purchase agreement – so who blinked first? The post Taken to the brink, Govt is now close to selling big Whakapapa ski field appeared first on Newsroom. ...7 hours ago
- Newsroom daily quiz, Friday 22 November
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- Daily crossword, Friday 22 November
The post Daily crossword, Friday 22 November appeared first on Newsroom. ...7 hours ago
- China likely to strengthen regional relationships in response to another Trump term
Opinion: Recent discussions in Shanghai provide some insight into what’s likely to be on the table The post China likely to strengthen regional relationships in response to another Trump term appeared first on Newsroom. ...7 hours ago
- Nuclear winters know no borders
Opinion: The immediate horror of nuclear weapon explosions – the blinding flash, crushing blast wave, and radioactive inferno – is well documented.But what nuclear-armed nations either don’t grasp or won’t admit, is far more chilling: how their weapons could devastate even countries thousands of kilometres from any mushroom clouds.The collapse ...7 hours ago
- This week’s bestselling books – November 22
FICTION1 Kāwai: Tree of Nourishment by Monty Soutar (David Bateman, $39.99)Sample dialogue, all from one chapter:“That can’t be,” replied Taona doubtfully.“You were right. The pā is unnervingly quiet,” Taona murmured.“The Hākuwai,” Motukia breathed. “Our grandfathers told us they rarely saw the Hākuwai in daylight,” Motukia muttered.“Their fight would have been futile ...7 hours ago
- Watts nears a landmark deal on global carbon trading
A framework for global carbon trading under the Paris Agreement is finally nearing completion at COP29 in Baku, Azerbaijan after years of halting talks.Climate Change Minister Simon Watts is one of two ministers tasked by the COP29 hosts with landing a long-sought deal on Article 6 of the climate accord, ...7 hours ago
- Grattan on Friday: Marles plays a defensive bat on nuclear as the government rushes to get though la...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Richard Marles is an ambitious man who hasn’t given up the dream of one day reaching the top job. But, despite being deputy prime minister, his profile is much lower than that of Treasurer Jim ...12 hours ago
- Fears Māori will pay heaviest price if police carry guns
"Overwhelmingly, those people who die will be young Māori men," the spokesperson for People Against Prisons Aotearoa says. ...14 hours ago
- NEW POLL: Kiwis Overwhelmingly Support MPs’ Expenses Transparency Law Change
62% of respondents support the extension of the OIA to cover MPs’ spending, compared to just 13% opposed and 24% were unsure. ...14 hours ago
- The House: Meanwhile, a week of passing law
The political week has been packed with worthy distractions, but all week Parliament has focused on passing new laws. Here are the highlights. ...15 hours ago
- The biggest difference between Hīkoi mō te Tiriti and past hīkoi: More support from non-Māori
Analysis - The diversity of voices during the hīkoi was noticeable - from tangata moana to young immigrants to elderly Pākehā from the South Island. ...15 hours ago
- The House: Samoan citizenship restoration – ‘It means we belong to this land’
When the bill to restore NZ citizenship to some Samoans passed this week, Parliament's galleries were full to the brim with members of the community. ...16 hours ago
- More Delays In Action On Use Of Puberty Blockers With Children
Women’s Rights Party Co-leader Jill Ovens says the Ministry has put New Zealand children at risk by continuing to allow “off-label” prescribing of puberty blockers at far higher rates than other similar countries. ...17 hours ago
- Police Minister adamant he wasn’t aware of gang members training at gun clubs
That is despite two papers from police that raised the matter with him. ...17 hours ago
- Shorten declares himself ‘a proud moderate’, saying Australians ‘in the middle’ shouldn’t ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra Bill Shorten has declared himself “a proud moderate” in a valedictory speech declaring parliament has the responsibility to ensure the extremes of left and right do not set the terms of political debate. Shorten, ...18 hours ago
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Careful! Yevgeniy Prigozhin wants the Internet to forget about him.
I haven’t been able to find the Forbes article in question. Perhaps they spelled the names differently…
One Anonymous Bloke: “Yevgeniy…”
That spelling of the name is Ukrainian. Which may explain your inability to find said article.
Thanks D’Esterre.
It’s the same spelling as in the indictment.
Evgeni, Evgeniy, Evgeny, Evgenii, Evgueni, Eugeny, Eugeniy, Ievgeny, Jevgeni, Jevgeny.
Oh great. 🙂
‘Ukrainian’ ? …… The place where the u.s.a and west spent over 5 Billion dollars to engineer a nazi coup ( I would call them neo nazis but their direct link to the original nazis could make the ‘neo’ label misleading ).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ywecX1RmAnE
“In 2015, Ukraine passed laws that forced its citizens to honour nationalists who briefly collaborated with the Nazis and participated in the mass killing of Jews. No uproar from the West, of course, since we currently support brave little Ukraine against the Russian beast ..” https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/holocaust-israel-poland-history-difficult-acknowledge-netanyahu-jewish-polish-government-a8212071.html
It all sounds as legit as ……… Paul Singer … or other Billionaire vultures ;;; like our chandler brothers
My friend Wasal Holub had his nose cut off because of his direct link to the original nazis.
He was 14 years old.
Joe90, I join you in your disgust at nose cutting sadists and monsters … whatever their politics / ideology .
I presume you do to …. and your comment was not an excuse to support the OUN or UPA ….. Two factions of Ukraine Nazis presently in power because of support from NATO and the west.
“It really was the most blatant coup in history.” http://rinf.com/alt-news/breaking-news/head-stratfor-private-cia-says-overthrow-yanukovych-blatant-coup-history/
Trigger warning and history lesson ….. OUN : “There were 39 methods of torture for small children alone… https://justice4poland.com/2016/09/30/unthinkable-atrocities-of-banderites-which-the-polish-will-never-forget-18/
This video deals with some Ukraine WWII history … but from approx 11mins shows the present day Nazis in the Ukraine …. and their nazi pride. https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=82&v=ut3r_j9Uy0o
Among my base rules …. if I catch myself singing from the same song sheet as Oligarchs, Billionaire vulture capitalists, nazis or neocons …. is Stop … Think … and back the fuck up.
No ones abuses and atrocity s are good … as I’m sure you’ll agree.
Reason: “Ukrainian’ ? …… The place where the u.s.a and west spent over 5 Billion dollars to engineer a nazi coup”
Indeed. A tragedy, and so poorly-reported in the west that most people haven’t the least idea what actually happened. If they remember it at all. The unlovely McCain – mentioned below by Francesca – featured prominently in the Maidan.
“( I would call them neo nazis but their direct link to the original nazis could make the ‘neo’ label misleading ).”
I think that you could call them neo-nazis, in the sense that they’re very much alive. Unfortunately. And the original nazis…. aren’t. Fortunately.
Thanks for your comment D’Esttere …. Life and family have kept me away from the internet and this thread….
And I’ll use your educated post to sign off in it … rather than continue the expanding and degenerating arguments with other posters down thread.
You’ve touched on One of our Medias most used propaganda tool ….which is silence ….. keeping us in the dark or only telling half the story / information.
Oliver Stone …. A great American http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000231/bio?ref_=nm_ov_bio_sm …
has a very good documentary movie on the Ukraine …. telling the other side of the story.
Cheers again D’Esterre
The corruption is so deep in US Politics, most of them are just paid to do what they are told.
‘Has he no shame?’
😆 Not a quark’s worth.
There doesn’t seem to have been any mention of the hacking of the DNC’s server (or Hilary’s server) which seems to have been the original point of Meullar’s investigation.
It should be remembered that the US Constitution protects freedom of speech, so the whole thing sounds to me like a load of bollocks.
the original point of Meullar’s [sic] investigation.
No, it wasn’t. Have you read Mueller’s brief?
So it doesn’t even mention the DNC hack. If Mueller is going to indict anyone from Fancy Bear they would be separate charges from the IRA indictment, because they’d allege a completely different set of crimes.
I do wonder where you picked up your completely false impression though.
PS: your impression of the First Amendment is equally flawed. For one thing, it protects US citizens, and yet they can still be charged for fraud when they tell lies.
The Constitution protects anyone acting within US boundaries, whether they are citizens or not. Interfering with US elections doesn’t imply telling lies, although it would include hacking the DNC server.
US citizens and persons acting within US boundaries are not protected from prosecution by the First Amendment in cases of Identity theft, wire fraud, bank fraud or other crimes of dishonesty.
You may recall that several people have admitted lying to the FBI. Where was their First Amendment protection then?
Oh; – the FBI doesn’t lie; – and isn’t protected if it does?
Oh look, another person who thinks that “he did it too!” is a defence.
Do you dispute that Gates and Flynn have entered guilty pleas? That would be amusing.
The “he did it too!” comparison / dismissal is misleading in its unbalance OAB ….
No country, bar none ….. has behaved like the u.s.a in its continual illegal interference in other nations politics*…..
A more accurate analogy ….. would be that the the u.s.a is like the most prolific compulsive deviant serial rapist …..and they’re alleging some russian pervert has touched their dick.
Meanwhile AIPAC zionists have circumcised them ….. right back to the ball sack …. .
And I’m not being frivolous …… rape and war crimes as a result of u.s.a ‘national interests’ …… would run into the millions and millions of victims.
I wonder what Martin Luther King or Nelson Mandela would have said about the present russia-gate farce ………….
* post WWII
I’m aware of that analysis.
During that time, we’ve also seen Pol Pot, Mao, Stalin, Pinochet, etc., and yet despite that, Steven Pinker can present convincing (and yet-to-be refuted) evidence that suggests military violence is at an all-time low.
It’s relevant to Flynn and Gates pleading guilty how, exactly?
*For the benefit of lackwits*:
This comment means exactly what it says: no more, no less. Any attempt to imply that it in some way endorses violence, or this or that foreign policy, will be met by well-deserved relentless withering scorn.
The 13 Russians don’t appear to have been accused of lying. Rather they have been accused of interfering another ways.
Not all lying is criminal. Only when it’s fraudulent or perjurous. However I don’t think the question is relevant in this instance.
Wire and bank fraud are crimes of dishonesty.
Are you reading the replies at all?
“I do wonder where you picked up your completely false impression though. ”
Paul Craig Roberts …. heard of him ? …..
https://www.unz.com/proberts/the-result-of-muellers-investigation-nothing/
“Note that the hyped Russian hacking of Hillary’s emails that we have heard about every day is no where to be found in Mueller’s charges. In its place there is “use of social media to sow discord.” I mean, really! Even if the charge were correct, considering the massive discord present in the last presidential election, with the Democrats calling Trump voters racist, sexist, homophobic white trash deplorables, how much discord could a measly 13 Russians add via social media?”
He witters on about the investigation as though it were over.
Woohoo, the left doing right wing attacks and encouraging the new mccarthyism spreading across the USA
What a truly wonderful time this is to live in.
Bugger arguments over policy and failed election promises.
Let’s all act like right wing trolls.
And yet I’m pretty sure one of the reasons you don’t like Sky City is the money laundering. Never mind those Panama Papers, fraud is just a witch-hunt, eh.
White supremacist serial rapist president? But But But Hillary!
Pfft.
I never mentioned h.r.c.
Funny how you did – how is it with her rapist husband, how that playing out for you?
It isn’t playing out for me at all, since I never set any store in him or his wife in the first place.
Just so long as they leave the money launderers alone, eh.
Where would you be without your ability to attack from the hard right ah?
No, it’s just too hard to actually call out the red-roster on terrible policy and broken election promises. Rather name calling, and this watered down piece of crap – which by the way, does damage to the left.
Protest organised by Russia, people have no agency, it’s all a Russian plot, communist I tell yah – Mccarthyism much!!!
This just helps the right crush all left wing opposition in the USA – and you attack me, sad man, just really sad.
By the way your false flag attacks are dull, get on point, rather than your usual making shit up approach.
I’m out to get you with my false flag attacks. Make sure you watch your windows and sleep with one eye open 😆
You just make shit up.
Probably the better explanation for you.
Edit: and you derail
and you never respond to points
It would be absolutely terrific if they got Trump for money laundering. At least it would be a genuine criminal activity. You are very naive in your trust of spy agencies and the workings of the oligarchs that rule the USA to think that there is even a remote chance that this is the charge that will be laid against Trump. How many billionaires do you think there are that arent laundering money one way or another? Its a very stressful thing trying to give all your illgotten gains legitimacy.
My trust of spy agencies? 😆
Meanwhile, on Earth, you may recall that my opinion of spy agencies is derived from Sun Tzu, who wrote “all warfare is based on deception”.
As to who might “get Trump”, that’s a job for the House and the Senate. Apart from impeachment proceedings I can’t see him standing trial at all.
OAB;
Did you feel that the FBI were also slack at not inditing Hilary after she destroyed the 32000 emails on her cellphone after the FBI has officially requested them from her complete?
Did you question the deliberate destruction of federal properly then that she deliberately destroyed?
We all were suspicious of that issue and how FBI failed to carry out judicious proceedings against her then.
Are you not that inquisitive?
Yes, I recall when they didn’t even investigate it, and they didn’t call her or any of her staff in for questioning. I didn’t question it at all, because I’m the ignorant biased idiot in your “mind”.
No, wait, actually I’m lying: I did question it, but it’s much more fun ridiculing your whataboutism before saying so.
So the next time you affect to be a mind-reader, and ask me a bunch of shithead loaded questions, I’m going to do it again.
What a lot of silly men there are on this site now. Boring, dull and over indulged.
Do you think the issuing of the indictment is not newsworthy?
And isn’t protection of democracy important?
And there are multitudes of posts on this site discussing Trump’s policies and how bad they would be for the US of A.
No, it’s not ‘newsworthy’…it’s fragrant propaganada…nothing newsworthy in that…
No, it’s not about ‘protection of democracy’…any more than the TPP is about free trade…
Yes, many articles written…a number of them by MS…
I’d say the majority have been along these lines, with a bit of policy thrown in.
How does this save democracy, when the left ends up being the one hurt by this stuff?
And no in my opinion it’s not newsworthy, it’s divisive.
Adam’s tree step plan to damage the left:
1. Mueller investigation.
2 ???
3. Damage!
One Anonymous bloke, just making up shit again.
You’re a bit to much like james in argument style for my tastes.
You’re the one saying the Left is “hurt by this stuff”.
Oh was that your point, I just thought it was more attacks by you.
Did you not read the post, now they saying the left like Stine, Sanders and others are Russian pawns. That’s helpful.
That the anti-trump rallies were Russian organized, yeah right.
And the crack down on YouTube and Facebook has been on who in the wake of the so called “russian hacking” – not to many right wing sites suffering in that social media forum.
Mind you are part of it, you attack anyone who does not spout the official narrative.
“Russian pawns”.
I see you saying that, Official Narrative Boy.
Again with the gosman, have a nice day.
😆
You just don’t like getting your own back, do you Adam. It’s fine for you to impugn my motivation and opinions, but as soon as some comes back at you it’s the living end.
Raise the double standard, Mr. Bellman.
Oh relax petel, all that smelling of your own farts is making you loopy.
If you’re going to attempt floral insults, learning to spell them is probably a good idea.
I can just imagine what the Republicans would have done if there was even a hint of Russia meddling at the behest of Obama.
It is clear from this investigation and the reaction from the GOP regarding the most recent shooting that they have no interest at all in governing and only enrichment and power. The democrats aren’t much better but at least they have a few people willing to do what is right (Sanders, Warren etc).
The only Republican I have seen make any sort of stand on anything is McCain
Yep
A great supporter of the far right in Ukraine
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/john-mccain-meets-oleh-tyahnybok-in-ukraine-2013-12?r=US&IR=T
and Al queda in Syria
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/jon-soltz/mccain-poses-with-terrori_b_3360762.html
Certainly making a stand!
I was talking specifically about domestic issues
It’s worth noting that the investigation also shows Russian activity stirring up Bernie and Stein supporters (better not to vote than to vote for Clinton). It’s being framed as collusion with Trump’s team (and I’m pretty sure they’ll succeed in showing this) but as much as anything it was an anti-Clinton campaign, and I remember plenty of people on this site putting forward the same points of argument that were being promoted by these professional trolls.
I know one US guy here in Dunedin who was so riled up about the whole email server thing that he (usually a Dem) voted for Trump! Didn’t like him or his policies, acknowledged that hewas a misogynistic racist arsehole, but still though that somehow he’d clean things up in Washington. No logic at all – got all his news via facebook and other sites and had been thoroughly indoctrinated. Interesting (and disturbing) to see close up.
So another supporter of attacking the left in the USA, sheesh red-blooded your onto a winner there.
So the same people who discredited Stine saying she was an anti-vaxxer, are now saying that everyone on the left were dupes of the Russians.
RED SCARE!!!
RED SCARE!!!
RED SCARE!!!
Save the poor people who have opinions of their own, and are fighting against capitalism – they must be dupes of the Russian conspiracy.
Sound like more hard right b.s to me.
“Red scare”
😆
Heads up: the kleptocrats in the Kremlin are not communists.
Now you’re a literalist.
Way to go One Anonymous Bloke, but hey, you gotta have your attack lines – otherwise what are you good for.
Noticing that the Mueller investigation is not “attacking the left in the USA”, and that Red-Blooded isn’t either, no matter how much you throw your toys and stamp your little feet.
Poor One Anonymous Bloke, it’s too hard for you to make the connections between this and the new Mccarthyism.
Make the connections for me, then, Mr. Bellman.
So in your mind there is no new cold war? In your mind the corporate media are telling you the truth? And in your mind Russia bad, America good?
Too many dots?
Actually outside of Fox News most of the ‘corporate media’ are wondering what the fuck is going on and are in no way “Russia bad, America good”. It’s more ‘WTF America?’
Just as I thought: you have no clue what, or even how I think.
Hint: false binary choices don’t come into it.
Well OAB if you actually spent more time in exposition rather than point scoring I might understand what your saying. And the question marks were there for a reason, apart from the abundance of emojis, hard to know what you stand for.
Hard to know what you stand for.
Human rights, the rule of law, and strong environmental ethics. The Tao te Ching is quite impressive, except that it’s pretty much impossible to be a Taoist without the cultural framework that goes with it.
I don’t like binary thinking much: the world is far too complex to reduce it to yes/no, good/evil. right/wrong answers.
Apart from that, I’m as stupid and biased as the next person.
So, as a follow of the rule of law One Anonymous Bloke, How do you feel about the precedence this indictment sets. 1: Pressing charges against non-USA citizens. 2: The potential to shutdown any non-USA journalist/blogger/commentator talking about USA elections?
1. It isn’t a precedent.
2. [citation needed]
“…a follower of the rule of law”.
I’m not convinced I can “follow” something that only exists as a concept.
Unless you can point to a country where the law applies to all with neither fear nor favour, that is.
One Anonymous Bloke: “….the kleptocrats in the Kremlin…”
Produce the evidence for this assertion, if you would be so good. Proper, well-found evidence, mind: not the witterings of the NYT or the WaPo.
Including, but not limited to: Putin’s Kleptocracy Karen Dawisha.
Transparency in Corporate Reporting: Assessing the Russia’s Largest Companies. Transparency International
Holy crap. That wouldnt be the same war mongering McCain that was hob nobbing with Ukrainian neo fascists. I don’t think hes ever seen a military intervention he didnt like.
https://www.counterpunch.org/2015/07/20/the-horrors-of-john-mccain-war-hero-or-war-criminal/
And one of the biggest hawks on Russia there’s ever been
Obama was the establishment’s man so they were never going to try to undermine him in any serious way. Trump (and I’m no supporter) wanted to make peace with Russia so they could do business but this upset the war lobby who stand to lose out if the US stops producing the ludicrous amount of weaponry they currently put out.
Most US presidents have skeleton’s lurking in the closet but so long as they play by the establishment’s rules there are no problems. The last President to get offside with the establishment was Nixon and look what happened to him. Whether there is truth in the accusations is irrelevant, the only thing that matters is that the establishment (or enough of it) don’t want them upsetting the status quo and will manufacture a campaign against them.
The scary thing is how many in the media have fallen into line of this subject. It’s like they’ve got no judgement or investigative abilities at all.
Whether there is truth in the accusations is irrelevant, the only thing that matters is that the establishment (or enough of it) don’t want them upsetting the status quo and will manufacture a campaign against them.
You’re ignoring the fact that the FBI also had a very public investigation into Clinton, and re-opened it right before the election, undermining her campaign significantly. Or do you see her as anti-establishment and an upsetter of the status quo as well?
‘Classy’ use of the latest mass shootings to push his own agenda there from the Donald.
He is the USA’s version of the new statesman….RIP Rik Myall.
+many 100’s for Rik Myall
This bloke has had a bit to say about narcissistic personality disorder so I’m inclined to pay attention.
(1/6)
https://twitter.com/HoarseWisperer/status/965216377740124161
Sounds “explosive” however, as much as one might like to depose Trump by whatever means available, wishful thinking may not cut the mustard
Always worth testing your prejudices / ardent desires with divergent analyses
https://off-guardian.org/2018/02/18/mueller-indictments-truth-v-liespin-the-observer-view/
https://ntknetwork.com/facebook-vp-russian-goal-was-to-divide-not-to-swing-election/
So now we’re getting from “Russia hacked the elections!”,
to “Russia sought to influence the elections”
To” Russia seeks to divide us”
Oh dear, as if America’s problems are nothing to do with unresolved racial tensions, vast gun ownership, crippling of Unions, corporatisation of the media and government, the gutting of the middle class through neoliberal trade deals, and the violence wreaked by militarism and violence abroad coming home to roost.
Actually the list goes on
School shootings, fentanyl addiction and overdoses as the result of profit driven pharmaceutical influence on the medical fraternity, PTSD and suicide amongst veterans
gunning down by police officers of unarmed citizens etc etc etc
The wily Russians have certainly done a lot on a budget of $100,000
Right, so everyone turn a blind eye to fraud and money laundering, because there are some other problems.
No-one has resiled from the allegation that Fancy Bear hacked the DNC, nor the attempts to hack voting machines. I wonder how you came by the completely false impression that they have.
Or maybe you’re trying to create that false impression.
Which is it?
Nope, I’m all for prosecuting fraud and money laundering, but to try and turn it in to a big Russian conspiracy campaign, that’s what I balk at.
Get Trump fair and square, using provable facts.Don’t dress it up to serve as the latest bogey man freak out to justify further aggression against competitors
And neither have the allegations about Fancy Bear been proved
And why all this “allegation ” stuff. The NSA should know, if there was a hack, exactly when the system was hacked.
Nada
The security firm employed by the DNC, Crowdstrike has a “moderate “confidence that Fancy Bear hacked the DNC, as does “Fireye”
Moderate is not a slam dunk in my book
I am merely noting the original shrieking headlines
The Russians hacked our elections!!
which seem to have dwindled rather pathetically to The Russians seek to divide us
And pointing out that divisions have existed since the original genocide of the indigenous people
One reason the NSA probably won’t release their specific findings is because that would make it easier for their targets to protect themselves.
In the unlikely event that any of these alleged perpetrators is brought before a court, I daresay they might have to show that evidence to the judge, but I still wouldn’t expect it to be made public.
So you’d still be able to believe whatever you want.
As for “getting Trump with provable facts”, are guilty pleas facts?
What are you proposing, exactly? That Bernie Sanders closes down the Mueller investigation? That you know how Mueller should proceed better than he does? That the investigation is worthless unless it helps the Democrats win the midterm elections?
Heres what 3 ex NSA experts have to say .And one of them designed many of the programs in use today
https://lawandcrime.com/high-profile/bombshell-nsa-experts-say-dnc-hack-was-actually-a-leak-and-inside-job/
So what am I proposing?
Healthy scepticism and exercise of critical faculties no matter the temptation to believe any old bollocks if it serves your own emotional biases
Meanwhile, on Earth, I distinctly recall saying “allegation”.
So why are you blithering about “belief”?
Ooh looky, I got linkys too. Questioning the claim that the download speed was too fast so it had to be someone with physical access:
https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20170814/11490537992/stories-claiming-dnc-hack-was-inside-job-rely-heavily-stupid-conversion-error-no-forensic-expert-would-make.shtml
Plus another questioning whether the metadata showing the high speed transfer that allegedly shows (questionably) that it had to be physical access wasn’t just the last transfer, for instance transferring the files to a thumb drive to hand off to a cutout.
http://thehill.com/policy/cybersecurity/346468-why-the-latest-theory-about-the-dnc-not-being-a-hack-is-probably-wrong
Then how was it that the NSA was able to track Chinese hackers who’d got in to US military and defence industry installations and determine the building they operated from
They had no qualms publishing this info in the NYT.Apparently no worries about alerting their targets to protect them selves in that instance
Different strategies for different situations and adversaries is my guess. Sending a message to the PLA versus staying hidden for Fancy Bear, perhaps.
I’m picking Fancy Bear (or whatever they’re calling themselves now) are still an active target, too. If the NSA can find a ‘smoking gun’ connecting them to the Kremlin the way they connected PLA Unit 61398 to well, the PLA, that would be a major coup.
Might even impress the Dutch.
Dutch hackers are impressive.
Actually “they” never called themselves Fancy Bear or Cozy Bear. Dmitri Alperovitch was the first to assign that name. Other security agencies have assigned their own names
Did you grasp the difference between them and PLA Unit 61398 though?
Both have been attributed to foreign state control
However, Wikileaks revealed in Vault 7 how the CIA can hack and then leave “footprints”implicating foreign entities.
Utilising a program called UMBRAGE
Cut, copy and paste from Wikileaks
With UMBRAGE and related projects the CIA cannot only increase its total number of attack types but also misdirect attribution by leaving behind the “fingerprints” of the groups that the attack techniques were stolen from.
Any cyber attack inevitably leaves traces. This is as true for the CIA as anyone else. When you put on someone else’s shoes, you leave fingerprints on the shoes.
I wouldn’t be so quick to trust Wikileaks these days. Their library only has books on one side.
I note that the narrative has changed from “it was a leak” to “it was a hack, but the CIA done it”.
The Daily Beast.
Did you know this before you brought up Umbrage, and just “forgot” to mention it, or is it news to you?
As already mentioned, the CIA and NSA are expert at conducting false flag cyber attacks.
They can infiltrate a server at some boring Russian company in Vladivostok and launch a bot attack from there, making it look completely Russian in origin.
Surely you understand this?
The laughable thing are so called Russian hacking attacks which apparently leave behind cyrillic fonts and timestamps corresponding to Moscow time as “proof” that it was Putin.
Only MSM influenced westerners would consider professional Russian Govt cyberwarfare units that obviously lazy, stupid and incompetent.
No. Just turn a bind eye unless its the evil Russians
evil
🙄
There’s that religious terminology again. Two days ago, I posted a link about an Algerian national who’d been extradited from Thailand to stand trial in Atlanta, on charges of wire and bank fraud. Guess what the IRA has been charged with (among other things). That’s right, wire and bank fraud.
Tell me again who turns a “blind eye”, and then we can talk about Finn Batato.
Give it a rest OAB,
We can see that you are a Democrat and we want to believe in honesty not this ‘red under the bed’ crap.
McCarthy-ism again eh? get over it, the ‘Washington Swamp’ is a bad place with bad people.
Don’t back them as they are pure evil.
Who is this “we” you affect to speak for? Multiple personalities? You think you’re the Queen perhaps?
You can see about as far as the end of your nose, but don’t despair, it may yet grow long enough to improve your vision.
This is nothing like McCarthyism! If you think that Mueller’s investigation is anything like McCarthy’s witch hunt, you are seriously misinformed.
If anything it’s the other way around – all those indicted have been associated with the Trump campaign and are far from the left politically.
You and the rest are repeating alt-right slogans and propaganda.
I’m sorry you can’t see it, but you have been duped.
This is exactly what Putin is laughing about. Not the fact that his troll factory has been found out – but because people are now shouting at each other. This dissent is exactly what he wanted, and the West is giving it too him in spades.
And I would have far preferred Bernie to be the Democrat candidate – but he wasn’t. But if you think that Hillary would have presided over a similar train wreck that has been the US over the past year – you are delusional.
You and the rest are repeating alt-right slogans and propaganda.
I’m sorry you can’t see it, but you have been duped.
Well said Macro.
” Putin is Laughing”… and your repeating Legatum grade propaganda Marco ..
Here’s a link about Legatum …….. https://www.rt.com/op-ed/322968-legatum-kgb-russia-applebaum/ ”’but as you probably wont visit it for fear of being brainwashed I’ll quote extensively from it.
“While many Western commentators on Russia are stuck in a Cold War mentality, Legatum’s top brass actually seem to believe that era never ended.”
“Anne Applebaum, the director of Legatum’s ‘Transitions Forum’ earned around $800,000 in 2013. For a journalist, this is mega money.”
“Legatum’s “Visiting Senior Fellow” (they love to give each other grandiose sounding titles) Anton Shekhovstov was straight out to bat for his boss. “WikiLeaks now seems to be fully under control of Russia’s security/intelligince (sic) services,” he alleged.
““Legatum turns out to be a project of the most secretive billionaire vulture capital investor you’ve (and I’d) never heard of: Christopher Chandler, a New Zealander who, along with his billionaire brother Richard Chandler, ran one of the world’s most successful vulture capital funds—Sovereign Global/Sovereign Asset Management. That family of funds, based in the offshore haven of Monaco, operated until 2004, when the Chandler brothers, Richard and Chris, divided their billions into two separate funds. Brother Christopher Chandler took his billions to Dubai, where he launched Legatum Capital, and, in 2007, the Legatum Institute, where Peter Pomerantsev serves as a Senior Fellow.”
“The Chandler brothers were the largest foreign portfolio investors in Russia throughout the 1990s into the first half of the 2000s, including the largest foreign investors in natural gas behemoth Gazprom. The Chandler brothers reportedly were the single biggest foreign beneficiaries of one of the greatest privatization scams in history: Russia’s voucher program in the early 1990s, when each Russian citizen was given a voucher that represented a share in a state concern to be privatized . . . and most naive Russians were fooled or coerced into dumping their vouchers for next to nothing, snapped up by clever vulture capitalists and factory directors from the inside. Institutional Investor magazine described how the Chandlers benefited by snapping up Russians’ vouchers and converting them into stakes in some of the largest and most lucrative companies in the world,”
“The Legatum team and their associates seem to pine for a time when Russians were impoverished and Oligarchs ran wild in the country. A period when the state effectively collapsed.”
Now Marco ….. you must know all about the NZ chandler Bros ….. as your not a dupe.
So do you think they have more of an axe to grind with Russia …….. Than the AIPAC / usa combo ……….. who lost to Russia .
Specifically when the Israelies could not patch up their Syrian ISIS fighters …using Israeli doctors and medical facilities ….. quicker than the Russians were killing them.?.
And have I been duped? … are ISIS the good guys ???????
And what does that rant have to do with what I said above?
You have obviously lost your capacity for reason – the power of the mind to think, understand, and form judgements logically.
“And what does that rant have to do with what I said above?” …
consider me one of “the rest” Marco ….. “You and the rest are repeating alt-right slogans and propaganda. I’m sorry you can’t see it, but you have been duped.”
How do you like being called a clown or a dupe ?.
For one who writes “to think, understand, and form judgements logically” … you should practice what you preach ….
The New Zealand Chandler Bros / Legatum link was shining the light on a Billionires “troll factory”….. Informing you …. so you don’t have to make half arsed judgements.
The last bit I wrote relates to motive …. “the AIPAC / usa combo ……….. who lost to Russia .
Specifically when the Israelies could not patch up their Syrian ISIS fighters …using Israeli doctors and medical facilities ….. quicker than the Russians were killing them.?.” …
And to inform about Israel providing the highest standard medical help …for terrorists…..
Feel free to point out to this dupe …. what part of my post, which was mainly quotes … was a rant ?.
I’m specifically meaning inaccuracies … or misrepresenting opinion as fact ….. ie “This is nothing like McCarthyism!” ….!
“She’s palled up with the neocons responsible for the Iraq War and she’s grabbed on to this sort of neo-McCarthyist hysteria about Russia ” … http://theweek.com/speedreads/645239/julian-assange-tells-megyn-kelly-why-wikileaks-isnt-releasing-dirt-donald-trump
http://observer.com/2016/11/mccarthyism-2-0-has-infected-the-democrats/
https://consortiumnews.com/2017/03/09/democrats-mccarthyism-hits-greens-stein/
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/446148/russian-farce-trump-collusion-hysteria-diverts-attention-surveillance-scandal
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/neo-mccarthyism-serves-to-mask-the-real-problems-america_us_585a986ae4b014e7c72ed917
etc etc etc etc … etc
Nothing like McCarthyisim …. just Putins troll factory…. Fuck its big though ..eh ?
Good God!
Tin foil hat time!
You are aware that the “deep state” who are running this investigation in the US are all Republicans – some even appointed by Trump. Mueller is a bi-partisan appointment supported by both Republicans and Democrats. The US citizens who have been indicted are all Republicans. While the investigation is wide ranging insofar as it investigates both Russian involvement (which was far more than a few ads on google) and the possible collusion of the Trump campaign, it in no way approaches the extent of terror that was McCarthyism which lasted from 1947 until 1956 and impinged on the lives of tens of thousands of innocent US citizens.
The misinformation that is being spread by some “useful idiots” in the West wrt this investigation fueled by RT and its ilk, is exactly what Russia was hoping for in the first place! They began this campaign of spreading discord in 2014 – long before the entrance of Trump onto the scene. Probably as a response to the perceived interference by the US in the Ukraine. Trump was a gift they could not refuse. There is ample evidence that they have been misusing social media and google for sometime now and it is “incontrovertible”* This from National Security Adviser H. R. McMaster – appointed by Trump. There is evidence to suggest they they are still at this nasty game with Pro-Gun Russian Bots flooding Twitter after Parkland.
Even here we have the likes of yourself and a raft of other dupes saying “No it’s not true! Russia would never do a thing like this. It’s all Hillary. etc etc.” Such thinking bears no relationship to the facts.
More will be revealed as time goes by and there are a few here who will be forced to eat humble pie.
As for the Chandler Bros / Legatum link – you had better be careful what you say – one blogsite has already been forced to remove a slanderous article and apologise for giving false information.
https://leftfootforward.org/2018/02/why-weve-taken-down-an-article-on-christopher-chandler-and-the-legatum-institute/
*Incontrovertible evidence is a colloquial term for evidence introduced to prove a fact that is supposed to be so conclusive that there can be no other truth to the matter; evidence so strong it overpowers contrary evidence, directing a fact-finder to a specific and certain conclusion.
Strzok and Lisa Page were definitely Democrat and definitely anti-Trumpers pro-Clintonistas.
But more importantly the ‘Persistent Deep State’ is neither Democrat nor Republican – its agenda is beyond both but also uses both.
For instance, the Obama Administration prepared a massive weapons deal for Saudi Arabia. The Trump Administration signed off on it and put it into action.
‘Persistent Deep State’ purpose of ensuring that Saudi Arabia continues to act to contain Iran, work alongside Israel while profiting the Military Industrial Complex accomplished.
One last common misconception: Trump is neither Republican nor Democrat. The establishment powers of both parties want him gone. The establishment Democrats wanted Clinton, the establishment Republicans wanted Bush.
No one wanted Trump.
I have missed your perception and insight on these issues.
Thank you for the research you do and the time you spend explaining your point of view.
Thank you for your kindness, Ed.
I would really like to hear what you think is going on in Syria at the moment. Not today – but when you have time.
I guess a post is out of the question?
Writing what I would like to write and having anyone see it seems unlikely.
The main thing about the Syrian conflict now is that it is a completely different war than 3 years ago.
Mainly and scarily, it is no longer a proxy war. The international players who were always behind the elimination of Assad (“Assad MUST GO”) have, thanks to Iran, Russia, China and Hizb’allah, now had to place their own actual pieces on to the actual board instead of borrowing others.
Very dangerous.
Any predictions?
Long painful and drawn out with lots of little escalations and lots of emergency diplomatic work to try and prevent shit from getting too real.
Interests of a religiously and ethnically diverse but secular Syria at the bottom of the heap for a couple more years yet to come, sadly.
And hope that Israeli internal politics don’t lead to a major military conflict being used as a nice distraction from local problems.
Keep an eye out for the Chinese in Syria. The Russians are obvious high profile players but the Chinese are also putting themselves on the line, and not on the side of the Anglo-US-Israeli triumvirate.
…very dangerous to Ergodan’s domestic reputation.
The NATO troops at Incirlik Air Base, the Kurdish/US alliance* forces in Rojava, not so much.
*which, for the benefit of lackwits, may yet prove to a devil’s bargain.
“Strzok and Lisa Page were definitely Democrat and definitely anti-Trumpers pro-Clintonistas.”
They were not involved in the Trump investigation and were removed immediately, and Strzok is now under investigation.
But that’s not part of the narrative .
Explain this sentence further if you could? Neither were involved in the investigation?
Amongst other things, there is suspicion – but no public proof – that they played some role in helping set up the circumstances around the ‘Russia narrative’ which led to Special Counsel Mueller being appointed in the first place.
The ‘narrative’ I am following on this is likely not one that you have heard unless you have been paying attention to the non-MSM media.
One last common misconception: Trump is neither Republican nor Democrat. The establishment powers of both parties want him gone.
You don’t seem to recall the Republican Primaries?
Who voted for Trump to be their candidate – oh that’s right – Republicans.
As for wanting him gone…
There are is almost one reason a day presented to them by the Idiot in Chief for impeachment – Clinton was impeached for infidelity there are two current accusations and 20 other women who have accused the man of sexual abuse. There are 50 votes already in the Senate who would vote for impeachment – it just requires 16 Republicans to gain some moral compass and the man is gone, but the Rupugnants sit on their hands. I wonder if it was because of the big wonderful xmas present they just gave themselves at the expense of everyday US citizens?
Yep – ordinary rank and file. Very few elected Republicans, RNC officials and big Republican donors came out in support of Trump until very late, and some big players like Mitt Romney vociferously opposed Trump.
Bill Clinton was impeached for lying to a grand jury and obstructing justice.
And you can’t be impeached for things you did not do as President.
BTW impeachment has to first pass the House.
Strzok was on the investigation into the Clinton emails at the time of the offending texts – indeed he supported the reopening of the investigation which Comey announced just prior the election. It was not until later that he was appointed to the number 2 position on the Russian investigation.
btw if you think that the Russian government cyberwarfare strategy is based on a tiny quantity of Facebook ads (mostly purchased after the 2016 election) and some automated Twitter bots endlessly and obviously retweeting BS, you are really underestimating your enemy.
and where did I ever state that!
Macro has enemies? 😆
there are a few here who will be forced to eat humble pie.
In the event of guilty verdicts, (as opposed to plea bargains) I’m picking the majority of them will claim “the jury was rigged”, and then double-down and call the whole thing a false flag attack.
There will definitely be guilty verdicts, but nothing to do with Russian interference in the US election and nothing to do with collusion of the Trump campaign/Trump transition/Trump administration with Russia.
Clinton associates are in deep do-do.
Do-doo.
I shall look forward to the indictments. And if they never eventuate, I will know it’s likely because the Deep State likely something mumble something.
Marcos gone from dupes …. to rants …. and now his slam dunk … tin-foil hats…..
‘all republicans’ …. that’s wrong / fake
‘perceived interference by the US in the Ukraine.’ … $ 5 Billion worth of perception there buddy …. why cant you just admit it … Like Nuland did ?.
I could go on and on about your ‘rant’ …. but I’ll let your paranoid ramblings speak for themselves .
P.s thanks for sticking up for the Chandler vultures … “you had better be careful what you say” ….it was your high point …. threatening on behalf of poor persecuted Billionaires is a sure way to win people over.
I’ve never been so vain and presumptuous to be a Self appointed moderator of others .
I’ll take heed of the sites real ones…..
So you have no explanation for you spurious assertions other than to spread further bile.
Forgive me if I don’t bother to reply again – I have better things to do with my life than to try to reason with unreason.
Marco, by definition neo-McCarthyism will be an attack on the left: socialist, anarchist, social democrats and communists. I’m not sure how you think it’s some alt-right plot, feels like some weird conspiracy theory to me. Mind you the who get trump thing is falling into a conspiracy theory. Like I said early your all attacking trump from the right, it’s pretty darn ugly. When his policies – increased military spend alone is beyond frightening is where to attack this muppet, and his broken promises are a weakness. Insted we get a bullshit indictment, where you want me to believe 13 people conspired to get the red muppet into power through the power of facebook. Like I said, sounds a bit to much like a conspiracy theory, and a bad one at that.
Marco, by definition neo-McCarthyism will be an attack on the left: socialist, anarchist, social democrats and communists.
That is what I have been saying!
So to call the investigation of Russian involvement in the US elections by Mueller – instigated at the behest of both Republicans and Democrats -“McCarthyism” is completely absurd. An attack on the political stability of a foreign country has nothing to do with left or right politics – its an investigation into the soundness or otherwise of the US political process, and whether or not, it was interfered with by an outside agency (in this case Russia).
A foreign spy did indeed interfere in the US elections and destabilise US democracy. His name was Christopher Steele.
Steele involved Russians in a plot to not only interfere in the US elections, but to undermine and damage the winning candidate after the elections.
Steele, a foreign national and foreign spy, not only involved Russian government sources and officials in his efforts, he passed money that he was given on to them as payment for their efforts.
These Russian sources/officials (and quite possibly Russian counter-espionage operatives) took the chance to supply materials, information and disinformation to Steele.
All of which were used by Steele – and Steele’s handlers – to affect not just the proceedings of the 2016 election, but to attack the duly elected President of the United States afterwards both in public and in private.
The most insidious part of this was that Steele’s efforts formed the core of misrepresentations to the FISA court, providing specious grounds for turning the US surveillance apparatus against the President Elect himself and his Transition team.
The goal was to sow mass division and disinformation amongst American voters.
Now that’s what I call “foreign interference.”
And yes, lots of people are going to be indicted over this.
LOL
🙄
I used to respect what you wrote here CV, and at one stage when you were banned, I along with many others, added CV to our handle in protest.
I’m sorry to say that now all I see is someone completely loopy along with the other duped “useful idiots” spreading the Russian Propaganda of RT and other sites of similar ilk. Regrettably I personally have experienced this all before. I grew up in a household where Russian Propaganda was freely available and partly fell for it. It was all lies.
You support Trump as much as you like – however, as far as the US is concerned he is rated as the worst President of all time, and has achieved that infamy after only 1 year in office.
http://www.newsweek.com/trump-worst-president-expert-ranking-survey-reveals-presidents-day-812042
Even Pence would rate better than Trump – at least there would be a little more sanity in the Oval Office than what exists at present.
What he and his administration have done to woman’s rights, LGBT rights, Health care, Education, The environment, Climate Change, de-militarisation, and social justice generally is unconscionable. The world is a far more dangerous place with him and his big nuclear button, and as for reducing tensions in the middle east the less said about that the better.
“Even Pence would rate better than Trump”
I think you need to look into that monster a bit more Macro. Don’t get me wrong trump is awful, but I think Pence is much worse, he’s a fundamentalist of the worst type.
not just a fundie, but also a long time establishment denizen of the Military Industrial Surveillance Complex.
That’s why I called him a monster.
Been hearing he was the one who put forward the idea of the huge increase to the military for the budget.
You’re too old to be a fool, Macro, and I know that you’ve seen and done too much to be one.
But I bet you haven’t heard that in the last couple of months black unemployment in the USA has hit an all time record low since statistics began.
That’s right, an all time low since they started keeping statistics.
And I bet you hadn’t heard that Hispanic unemployment is at a 4 decade low.
And I bet you hadn’t heard that according to the Economist/YouGov poll that Trump’s approval rating amongst both blacks and Hispanics is now higher than at the 2016 election.
Ask yourself
1) Why haven’t you heard these things (and why I have).
2) Who is the one being propagandised when I know these things and (I assume) you didn’t.
3) How is it that Trump – having achieved the lowest black unemployment of all time (give Obama half the credit if you like) – is rated by the MSM as the worst President of all time, even worse than the slave driving plantation owning Presidents.
Also, exactly what “rights” do LGBT and women not have today under Trump that they had under Obama??? Enumerate them for me please because I cannot think of a single one.
What exactly has Trump done against de-militarisation that makes Nobel Peace Prize Winning extrajudicial US-citizen Droner Obama look so good in your eyes? And once again be specific please.
So this is not happening, nothing to see here move along.
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/02/watch-jill-stein-comes-unglued-asked-visit-russia-bonkers-msnbc-interview/
https://latest.com/2018/02/see-it-jill-stein-has-epic-meltdown-on-msnbc-when-asked-about-russian-meddling/
By the way watched the video, Dr Stine defended her self well. And did not do anything these hacks tried to say about her.
Seem Bernie is suffering the same attacks
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/feb/19/jill-stein-bernie-sanders-under-fire-robert-muelle/
https://www.theblaze.com/news/2018/02/19/russian-election-interference-aimed-to-help-bernie-sanders-and-jill-stein-not-just-donald-trump
And just a simple attack piece you might like… Again nothing to see here.
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/commentary/ct-perspec-wilhelm-heather-bernie-sanders-0220-story.html
Serious question – what’s stopping trump from just pardoning himself and everyone around him?
Ordinarily the answer would be “some last shred of decency”, but in his case…
It’s not settled law as to whether Trump can actually pardon himself. It would certainly breach the notion that no person may judge their own case, which is a solid part of any functioning justice system worth the name. There’s nothing in the constitution either way, which may be a reflection that the framers never contemplated the possibility that someone so unfit would actually become president. After all, that was part of the purpose of the electoral college (see Federalist Papers 68).
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-10-30/trump-russia-and-the-early-murmurs-about-pardons-quicktake-q-a
When someone gets pardoned, they lose the ability to take the Fifth since they are no longer at threat of prosecution. So if the spraytan stalin does issue pardons to those around him, then they have to spill the beans about him when asked or risk contempt of court.
There’s also the issue that the turd tornado can only issue pardons for federal crimes. State judicial systems can still pursue state crimes.
This is untrue – the Fifth Amendment is not a constitutional right which simply disappears in some circumstances.
Except that pardons are not a judgement of guilt or innocence.
Trump can issue himself a broad pardon before he leaves office – the real issue is that in doing so it would be tantamount to admitting his guilt.
AFAIK, you have to be convicted before you can be pardoned.
I don’t think that’s legally the case, it’s more of a convention. Paragraph 6 in the Bloomberg link above hints at cases where a pardon might be issued without a conviction.
Gotta love it. There has to be concern now that Russia is behind every progressive movement in the US including Black Lives Matter, Jill Stein, Bernie, United Muslims of America.
What if it all went horribly wrong for the Ruskies and they actually got Bernie elected instead using their elaborate $2 Bernie cartoon caricature coloring in book facebook ads. It would be panic stations at the shadowy troll farm no doubt.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/nov/2/buff-bernie-sanders-coloring-book-ad-part-of-weird/
What will this dastardly troll factory come up with next.. Pokemon?… https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WW4ARP7lgvs
I note the Guardian article skirts around the same parts of the indictment as Moonofalabama. They don’t fit the whataboutery narrative, so let’s just pretend they don’t exist, right?
No skirting. Just if its such a heinous crime surely youd want to round up everyone involved. But no. Part of the crime is that you have to be an evil Russian.
Or an Algerian living in Thailand. Or Bram van der Kolk.
Yeah as a few have mentioned above, not so sure these developments support the initial concern that there was collusion between the campaign and Russia. Plus if you ever checked out the Yuri Bezmenov lectures, it’s clear to see that the methodology carrying over from the Soviet period was always about sewing division, rather than seeking the outcome of electing a ‘friendly’ leader. They’re fairly aware that even the Americans would kinda notice something that obvious.
But hey, let’s face it. When your right and left wing political establishments lose to a disorganized, shambolic, largely amateur-staffed campaign involving the hilarious spectacle of Donald-fucking-Trump running as a Republican, I can well see how you’d want to believe that Russian spies must be responsible. The idea that your mates got beaten by this hot populist mess is just too much for the in-crowds of American politics and media to bear.
Another But But But Hillary argument. Do you actually believe the FBI is the DNC?
Cow excrement One Anonymous Bloke, but I’m sure if you repeat it enough you will believe that excrement.
Oh wait you do…
I do believe that the FBI is not the DNC, and that blithering about making excuses for losing the election inevitably conflates the two organisations, as though the FBI is helping the DNC make excuses.
If you want to concentrate on the DNC’s failings, fine, but why that means anyone else has to ignore fraud and money-laundering hasn’t been adequately explained. Some of us can even do both.
Making shit up again, you’re good at that.
Me I’d rather support my left wing friend in the USA, rather than see them go down in this hard right neo-Mccarthyism crap fest.
How about you help non-corporate democrats with the upcoming midterms?
Can a human fail the Turing test?
Lol!
that is the best comment so far in 2018
Let me know when anyone is charged with money laundering
Rick Gates and Paul Manafort.
100% I love that. Adam. – 12.1.1
The feeling is mutual, lackwit.
Poor poppet, talking shit and waving arms – but it’s been your day for that.
The Turing Test failure is back again. Even your flaccid insults are cut ‘n’ paste jobs from more articulate contributors.
yawn
…’Cos they certainly weren’t acting in the DNC’s interests when they publicly opened up the server investigation again a fortnight or so out from the election!
It seems that lots of people here think they can judge better than the people who are actually seeing and hearing all the evidence and following where it leads. On the basis of what special insights, information or skills, I wonder?
I saw where it all led to in 2003 in Iraq, and 2011 in Libya. And pardon me if I don’t share your confidence in the American justice system
Newsflash: Red-Blooded didn’t express confidence in the US justice system: they just observed that it’s more reliable than your opinion.
Thats your opinion and not necessarily supported by fact
🙄
Specialist subject: the bleedin’ obvious.
Can’t get much more obvious than James Clapper perjuring himself before Congress
Can’t get much more obvious than you trying to misrepresent what Red-Blooded said and then flailing wildly rather than just admitting you were wrong.
Red blooded affected amazement that people would distrust those up close who were seeing and hearing all the evidence
Me, after those debacles I mentioned, lost the starry eyed belief in the integrity of those insiders
English comprehension time:
Red Blooded pointed out that people here are less equipped to judge the facts than those who are seeing and hearing all the evidence.
That is true, no matter how many strawmen you can twist into existence.
“Another But But But Hillary argument. Do you actually believe the FBI is the DNC?”
Not an argument.
Why should the FBI give a damn for “The idea that your mates got beaten by this hot populist mess”?
Whether or not the IRA managed to affect the US election is irrelevant: it has no bearing on the crimes alleged in the indictment.
If you were one of the people affected by identity theft, would you want the FBI to take it seriously or not? Come back David Garrett, all is forgiven?
I’m not talking about the FBI, they are conducting a professional investigation into the question of whether or not the Trump campaign colluded with Russia in an open minded spirit of enquiry. I’m talking about a professional tier in media and politics who have a near-apocalyptic collective orgasm about the scandal they think is about to envelop the Trump administration every time Mueller does something, despite these things time and again looking to be of major public interest in and of themselves, but hardly supportive of the claim that the collusion thesis is about to be found correct. Usually, the result is a let down for anyone hoping for that outcome.
And per. statements from Rod Rosenstein, who has been clear that these latest indictments are not collusion related, this is actually yet another blow to the collusion narrative. Manafort’s crimes are the crimes of a sleazy lobbyist, I have no sympathy. Flynn seems to me he kinda got tricked, I somewhat have sympathy, but he’s an adult and made his own bed. Probably should have known better than to talk to the Feds without a lawyer.
So, collusion narrative blown, you’re now forced to move on to the next claim, one in which the 1.2 billion spent on the Democratic campaign of Clinton (I really didn’t want to mention her name, it seems to have a triggering effect on you) was utterly outflanked by a few thousand dollars worth of social campaigning and some spicy memes. And of course, we know how insanely implausible that sounds, which is why collusion is the outcome this system needs.
Otherwise, you’re left still to explain how spicy memes, a few grand’s worth of Russian facebook posts, and a campaign featuring the ultralecherous, serial philandering liberal businessman Donald Trump running as a conservative Republican swept the GOP primaries and then beat a 1.2 billion funded (trigger warning!) Clinton campaign. It has to be the Russians, otherwise the disconnect between the public and their ‘betters’ is more cavernous than ever before. And I’m rubbing my eyes in amazement at the idea this needs even needs explaining on a left wing blog, where resident posters seem more keen on seeing Red Scare v.2 being unleashed in defence of grubby plutocrats simply because they happen to prefer the grubby plutocrat who lost to the grubby plutocrat who won.
collusion narrative blown
Nonsense. Mueller hasn’t laid out the case for it yet, if there is one. Those guilty pleas are sort of indicative, but.
I don’t have to explain a damn thing, but I will, just for you:
Clinton lost the election because she was a shit candidate from an utterly compromised party: “bought” as Dylan Ratigan said.
So your fantasies about who I “prefer” are total bullshit.
“Clinton lost the election because she was a shit candidate from an utterly compromised party: “bought” as Dylan Ratigan said.”
In the words of Charles Bukowski, “the truth at last”.
Fair enough if you are just into Red Scare v.2 for non-Clinton preferring reasons. I just can’t imagine what they’d be given there’s so little likelihood of collusion evidence appearing, and per. Rosenstein no evidence so far that the actions of those indicted Russians moving the needle at all on the election outcome.
So we’re back to this:
‘[How] spicy memes, a few grand’s worth of Russian facebook posts, and a campaign featuring the ultralecherous, serial philandering liberal businessman Donald Trump running as a conservative Republican swept the GOP primaries and then beat a 1.2 billion funded (trigger warning!) Clinton campaign.
Glad to see you seem to recognize why Ratigan (who I always liked) at least gets the point. I’m guessing he’s gonna be off Maddow’s Christmas card list for that one!
Nope, “we’re” not back to this at all, since I was never there in the first place. That was just you projecting your BS onto me.
Ok, those of us interested in a wider discussion of the culture war and the failure of the American left to adequately represent the powerless are back to this. You do what you please.
Problem is, you keep linking the wider issue of how shite are the Democrats, to the Mueller investigation into Trump. And they’re just not connected in any meaningful way.
Also, off-topic discussion tends to get shifted to Open Mike with a moderator warning.
It might also be a good sub-thread on today’s post about gun control.
Yes I’d hate to be in the shoes of a mod, it’s hard to separate the wider contextual discussion of an issue with OT train spotting.
But no, as much as I mock the idea that the Mueller investigation will find anything of value, my main focus is entirely on the unseemly spectacle political/media normie class blowing their collective load each time Mueller indicts, even though each of these events seems to drift further from the collusion which they believe his investigation will uncover.
Insert here the George Orwell quote I can’t be bothered Googling about some ideas being so stupid only intellectuals could believe them.
What people were affected by identity theft?
The social security numbers that can be bought for setting up a pay-pal account do not affect the person whose social security number was used. And I can’t see the FBI giving a shit about someone’s stolen facebook page, can you?
Or do you think I ought to get onto the SIS over that Hotmail account that was nicked way back when? 🙂
Repeating but but but Hillary is also not an argument
Good job I didn’t then.
But hey, let’s face it. When your right and left wing political establishments lose to a disorganized, shambolic, largely amateur-staffed campaign involving the hilarious spectacle of Donald-fucking-Trump running as a Republican, I can well see how you’d want to believe that Russian spies must be responsible. The idea that your mates got beaten by this hot populist mess is just too much for the in-crowds of American politics and media to bear.
That argument ignores the wider cultural context that President Cheetos Shit-stain blundered into.
For instance, Fox News and their regional affiliates have spent the better part of 30 years actively stoking paranoia, fear, and outright lies about a whole range of imaginary enemies of the United States (e.g. Muslims, Blacks, Latinos, the poor, Democrats, Atheists, gun control advocates… the list goes on).
Ordinarily, Republican candidates have shied away from those paranoid views. Both Romney and McCain saw the Latino community as an untapped source of votes for Republicans and attempted to moderate the GOP into a more inclusive broad-church party. Then, along comes President Tiny-hands Pussy-grabber and he leans in hard on the Fox fantasy. He’s been lapping up their bile and regurgitates it back to the masses.
It’s not ignoring it, it’s prompting a proper and extensive discussion of it. Which would be of more benefit that pretending that if we can just impeach Trump for being an FSB asset, this will all be over.
Impeach Trump, slide Pence into the Presidency.
The Republican Establishment would have precisely zero issue with that.
Worthwhile remembering that Trump isn’t on the Democrat side, and he isn’t on the Republican side. At least, neither are on his side.
I know, it’s like they can’t see how counter-productive it would be. Mike Pence is rubbing his jumper cables with glee…
Thinking at least one step ahead should be done from time to time, yes. Otherwise bad unintended consequences are likely to result…
The “critical” stage (first line of the post) is that it’s falling flat on its face.
There is nothing in the indictment that doesn’t apply to many, many people of multiple nationalities in various parts of the world who use multiple false facebook IDs, sign up to various groups, and take outrageous stories from whatever source to push/seed through social media to get advert clicks and income.
Trump stories were favoured because they were the best click-bait and click-bait = income.
Were Russians doing it? Yes. Greeks? Yes. Americans? Yes.
Did some people organise their operations better than others? Yes. Did some people write their own pieces as well as taking pre-existing pieces from various sources? Yes.
The suggestion that there’s a link back to the Kremlin is laughable. Mueller should be pictured jumping a shark, not riding one.
“Mueller should be pictured jumping a shark, not riding one.”
It’s definitely a window into the soul of the US media right now. A second hand meme pressed into service of an embarrassing delusion.
“Information warfare against the USA”. That doesn’t apply to many many people of multiple nationalities in various parts of the world. It applies to thirteen named individuals and three organisations, and those are their own words.
But you already knew that.
The indictment doesn’t allege any links to the Kremlin, and you probably knew that too.
“Information warfare against the USA” doesn’t make any damned sense. What does it mean OAB? Is the USA now some sentient entity that can assimilate information?
Given that the same and similar stories as those allegedly coming from the IRA were also coming from Greek teens and however many other sources, and that many of those stories originated in the USA and were then cut and pasted for the sake of making money (sometimes the headline was changed to be more “sexy”) …how does it follow, even if it could be made to make any sense, that there was “information warfare against the USA”?
And why (if it can be made to make sense) is the allegation or charge being reserved for 13 Russian nationals, and not any of the other hundreds or thousands of non-Russians (many known) who were doing the exact same shit?
doesn’t make any damned sense
I daresay the original phrase was written in Russian, so something may have been lost in translation. It’s right there in the indictment, though, among some other direct quotes which I pointed out multiple times yesterday, and am reluctant to waste my time repeating again.
You’re suggesting a phrase used in a US legal document is a poor translation of a Russian phrase?
So there is no charge pertaining to any “information warfare against the USA” then. I mean, that’s what your saying, right? That the phrase doesn’t exist, as in have any meaning, although (as you say) it’s right there in the indictment document as a charge.
It goes to motivation. The counter-narrative is that the sole motivation was to make money, like those kids in Macedonia.
Motivation pertains to all the charges.
No. Goes to nationality. Evjl Russians. Not evil Macedonians since they also admitted to wishing to affect the election.Just like evil Russians not evil Israelis in Flynns taped phone call.
Hi there Spikeyboy. Do you know anyone who can translate this article better than Google Translate can?
Сотни троллей за миллионы
It’s a 2014 document release from Anonymous International.
As a language teacher, I would warn you that even in its latest mode, Google translate is still not your friend. Cannot help with Russian, sorry.
PS: “laughable”, and based on multiple reports spanning several years, including (but not limited to) the article I linked yesterday that dates from 2015. From Latvia. Ignore it, it doesn’t suit the narrative.
I don’t have a narrative OAB.
I just splutter coffee when I’m asked to believe in all seriousness that the Russian government had a dastardly plan to undermine the political processes of multiple other countries and their elections via fucking facebook and twitter stories/shares/likes.
Sure. You believe that fucking facebook and twitter stories/shares/likes can influence purchasing decisions, but not votes.
I guess there’s no point in the Green Party maintaining a social media presence then.
You’re flailing. I’ve never said anything about fb posts influencing purchasing decisions – not in relation/comparison to influence on voting intentions, nor in relation to anything else.
Adverts generate income when they are merely clicked on.
You said the kids in Macedonia are doing it for money. If their activities can’t influence purchasing decisions, where’s the money coming from?
Umm, from people clicking the adverts, like he said?
It was quite widely reported in mainstream media outlets that kids in Greece and elsewhere were doing it for the money. (Funny how those same outlets seem to have “forgotten” now that “Russia” 😉 )
Merely clicking on an advert generates income.
So, y’know, if you want TDB to get a bit of income, just pop over there and click on all the ads. No need to buy jack-shit.
Ok, so the advertisers believe that Macedonian trolls can help them sell things. If they’re right, the same dynamic might apply to votes too.
Meduza, 2015.
It’s all just a money-making scheme, though. 🙄
Keep waving you arms like this and you’e going to have to tie helium balloons to your computer or do air borne handstands OAB 🙂
You want to believe that what Mueller and the rest are spreading is worthwhile information? Then coorie up to it if that’s what gets you through. I sense the church is thinning out and that people are losing faith and departing though.
I could be wrong mind. But I don’t think I’m wrong.
air borne handstands
😆
I give up. I doubt the same can be said of Mueller, though, now Gates has turned too. I don’t know who “the rest” are supposed to be.
OAB, I’m afraid you’re incorrect on this count. The majority of Russian spending on Facebook, tiny as it was, occurred AFTER the 2016 Presidential election.
The Russians were NOT trying to swing the results of the 2016 election.
Indeed, the Mueller indictment explicitly states that no election outcome was affected by the Russian activities described within the prosecution document.
The Russians were NOT trying to swing the results of the 2016 election.
What Rob Goldman actually said is:
My emphasis.
As for whether they succeeded or not, please read previous discussion before commenting: what’s relevant is that they made the attempt.
Neither you or I are naive.
The US Government tries to swing elections all around the world using billions of dollars. (Five billion US dollars in Ukraine alone, according to Victoria Nuland).
This is what great powers do.
You want to see examples of Joe Biden in the Ukraine and Obama in the UK trying to push REMAIN?
A few Russian trolls on a shoestring budget who placed ads mostly *AFTER* the election?
Meh.
Goldman goes on to say in that article:
Seriously, who believes this shit. So the 13 russian super-trolls managed to create sophisticated large scale online groups from another country and went onto make them protest against eachother in the streets while they operated out of their troll cave. F**king hell..
Stupid question really: apparently Goldman believes it.
What a pity the stupid question is irrelevant, because (for the ‘n’th time) the alleged crime was in the attempt, rather than the success or failure of the operation.
Man those Russians are superhuman!
Poor innocent Americans, manipulated every which way
I wonder if they run workshops?
We could have the Greens in for ever!
Lusk,Slater,Williams , eat your heart out
for the ‘n’th time) the alleged crime was in the attempt, rather than the success or failure of the operation.
Beginning to think that you’re actually incapable of grasping this. I suppose I should be charitable and assume bias instead.
I’m sorry, but such a feeble attempt with so little resources and effort made, and no realistic chance of any success on any metric, can’t be considered credible in the least.
Hence the focus on it is a distraction.
But that the dreadful,wiley, manipulative, meddling,Clinton hating Putin would invest such a piddling puny amount, and think it would stack up against the campaign scores of millions spent by his nemesis., well sorry , but I can’t take that seriously
And him with all his supposed hidden billions, the richest man in Europe so they say.
Oh but hang on, there’s no connection with the Kremlin, its just RUSSIANS… but yeah RUSSIANS… bad ass genetic rotters the lot…
Sorry, but it really doesn’t stick.
The main irony: how the US deep state/corporate shills has for decades consistently undermined American democracy and effectively disenfranchised its own voters at every turn possible.
But now they CRY OUTRAGE that “Russia Russia Russia” might have waved a few tweets and Facebook ads around their precious 2016 election.
The Russia baiting ‘reds under the bed’ scaremongering is something to behold. McCarthy would be proud.
rather deflecting from the fact that the majority of stories were posted after the election .So not quite sure how they were meant to influence any damned thing.
The fact that the US was hugely divided anyway explains why clickbait profits were maximised by covering all the hot topics, throw in a few cute puppies and kaching!
The IRA stated its own aims in its own words, and conducted activities in pursuit of those aims before the election.
If they had any influence, why would they give it up afterwards?
I note the narrative has changed from “no troll farm” to “but it’s only motivation was cash”.
If anyone’s trying to deflect, it’s you.
Actually, as Trump himself tweeted, the issue is not about Russian troll farms, it never has been.
It’s about Trump Administration / Trump Transition collusion with the Russians.
Didn’t happen.
All the noise about Russian troll farms *is* the distraction. It’s the new ‘Reds under the Bed’ scare designed to distract citizens away from how the US corporate-deep state has already thoroughly undermined US democracy.
Russia troll farms are approx no. 94 on a list of problems to do with US democracy.
Actually, your words have no value and neither have his.
You’re getting a wee bit mixed up there OAB, a bit punch drunk, replying to the wrong post
False attributions, I have never used the term troll farm for instance
Not sure about the legitimacy of those emails you refer to .
Not quite the language of spies and espionage operatives
I’m talking about the “official” narrative, the one POTUS is playing pick-up-sticks with on Twitter.
I’m not sure about the legitimacy of the emails either, and we already covered that at 9.1.1.1.
I’m curious as to what you think “the language of spies is”. I doubt they talk about tradecraft, pavement artists and lamplighters in a troll farm.
They certainly exerted themselves to do just that in numerous former soviet satellites. Why would an espiocrat change his spots? People tend to keep doing what they perceive as being successful.
Did they Stuart? And “they” is the Russian government, yes? And what they did in former Soviet satellites was spread stories on facebook, yes? The Russian government, that is – not individuals and groups of people (whether in the form of companies or what-not) pursuing that most capitalist of endeavours – that of perceiving an opportunity to make money and exploiting it.
The fact that very thing has been well covered in articles from The Washington Post, Guardian and New York Times (just to name the obvious mainstream outlets) is to be thrown aside and discounted “because Russia”.
ffs
“dastardly plan to undermine the political processes of multiple other countries ”
There’s reasonably consistent evidence of this. Facebook is an innovation in the US instance because they can’t just trundle troops over the borders in mufti the way they do with their neighbours.
http://ssi.armywarcollege.edu/pubs/parameters/issues/summer_2016/5_bukkvoll.pdf
I am fascinated that you think that modern day Russia has much to do any more with the shortlived (3 generation) abberation known as the USSR.
In other words, the USSR isn’t the baseline in outlook, behaviour, military, diplomatic or economic strategy for the Russian people, indeed, far from it.
It appears to me that you are the one still fighting the Cold War, even as you project to us that it’s Putin and the Ruskies who are stuck in the past.
Once you’ve read a few years of the likes of Dmitri Orlov or the Saker, you’re just never going to get a sane conversation on this topic, CV.
+1
Peter Lavelle on Crosstalk is good too.
Yes, I do appreciate Lavelle. My introduction to that world was very much the work of Sean Guillory, Mark Ames, Yasha Levine etc. back when they were all still based in Moscow. Even that far back they were pointing out that western correspondents in Russia were rarely speakers of the language and basically spent their days doing the rounds of the US and UK embassies along with any of the usual outside institutions (EU etc.) and then spending their days in the Green Ring of Moscow interviewing English-speaking ‘pro-western’ liberals with US/UK connections who pass for ‘sources’ in the world those who can’t meet actual Russians. Sounds like things have only gotten worse in the last 10 years…
History isn’t something you get to elide just because it shows you in a bad light. Czarist Russia attempted a Chechen genocide, soviet Russia almost achieved it by transportation, post-soviet Russia has almost completed it by occupation.
We have to fight the cold war because Putin has been fighting it since he won his first rigged election. You may prefer to roll over for the oligarchs but I’ve seen them up close before. There’s nothing good there.
I suppose if strong authoritarian leadership is your model government Putin might have a superficial appeal. Weak minds do need strong leaders. It cannot remotely be mistaken for democracy however.
Do tell us the moral basis for your tragic sellout to Russian cryptofacism. The old Reds at least had the excuse of believing Russia was committed to a reforming political movement.
Though of course if you’d bothered to read the link you’d know it referred to contemporary actions against the Ukraine.
There’s no doubt that US financial actions in the Ukraine were ill-advised, and constituted undue interference. There’s also no doubt that the Russian backed insurgency there, employing as it did, serving Russian military personal out of uniform, was as illegitimate as any of the notorious US uses of so-called ‘military advisors’.
Why illegitimate?
Russia was not going to let the US successfully destabilise yet another border area after the US sponsored an unconstitutional coup in Ukraine.
The US cannot act against Russian interests right on Russian borders, and then complain when the Russians respond with counter actions to neutralise such activities.
The Anglo-US empire has to learn that it no longer gets things all its way any more.
Why illegitimate?
Because sending soldiers to destabilize a bordering state does not respect the democratic preferences of that polity.
Even if your own country’s geopolitical ambitions require it.
You may be a moral vacuum who supports invasions of sovereign states, but most of us are not.
The US had more right to put money into the Ukraine than the Russians had to shoot down civilian airliners for example.
But you’re ok with the murder of civilians as long as it’s Putin doing it. Your teachers went to great lengths to teach you critical thinking and here you are kissing the feet of a tawdry murdering dictator.
For shame!
What just fucking boggles my mind is everyone who brings up the DNC/Clintons etc etc
We are not talking about them and they aren’t holding the presidency. Trump is and him and his lackeys seem to have attempted activities with amount to sedition.
Fine, fucking hate on the Clintons – I don’t like them much myself – but we are talking about Trump, no one else. Want to start an investigation on Clinton? Well go right ahead but just because Clinton and the DNC might be dirty too in no way absolves Trump.
But then again , do we want to see a politicised department of justice, not interested in looking at all the irregularities of the election,(Brazile leaking questions, Bernie shut out ,dirty info against Trump bought from Russians by the Clinton campaign) only interested in whatever brings down Trump.
If I was an American, I would feel a little dismayed, just as I did when the head of the SIS colluded with Key against Goff
only interested in whatever brings down Trump.
Why are you running Republican party attack lines? Christopher Steele didn’t even know who he was working for. Read Glenn Simpson’s testimony.
Why are you running 1950s McCarthy attack lines?
Such as? Is inventing false and insulting smears an indication that you have no substantive response to the arguments I’m making?
Yes: when you have nothing, you demonstrate it by lashing out.
Do you understand the points Glenn Simpson made in his testimony, regarding the motivations and practice of Fusion GPS? Do you understand his statements about the circumstances of Christopher Steele’s employment by Fusion GPS?
If you grasp those two things, you will also read those Republican attack lines I mentioned, because Simpson’s testimony responds to precisely the accusations you’re levelling.
I bet you haven’t even read the testimony, and your repetition of the smears is entirely unwitting. Either that or you’re just lashing out again.
What “we” want is a large number of conservative liberal clowns to breathlessly propagate a slather of nonsense coming from a backwards and paranoid “radical centre”.
What “we” want is for “you” to sense that all perceived threats to the “the radical centre” are threats to “yourself”, and that “you” can only neutralise those threats by lending support and votes to politicians of “the radical centre”.
“We” want “you” to believe “Russia” and “fascism”, and for the Bernie Sanders, the Melenchons, Corbyns and any others whose politics pose a threat to the “radical centre”, whether journalists, politicians or ordinary unassuming people, to be marginalised and silenced. That way “we”, and by extension, “you” will be safe.
“We” want “you” to embrace the truly dull and deadening world of the Blairs, Clintons, Macrons, Arderns and Trudeaus. It’s time “you” committed to being at home with “us”. For always. 😉
Bill I agree with you OAB is a ‘dead post’ unlovable so I give him his swing song here.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8WtVTvZ-Mog
Original – Bobby Bare. Bill Parsons’ wrote the lyrics. Bobby Bare went to Army
The reason that the DNC, Obama and the Clintons are brought up over and over with regards to this topic is because they set up the Russia framing firstly to attack Trump during the campaign, and when that failed, to undermine his White House and his Presidency.
Even going so far as to use state powers to spy on the President Elect and his Transition Team by obtaining FISA warrants on false pretenses, and then widely leaking the information they gained.
Your use of the word “sedition” is therefore quite apt, but aimed in the wrong direction.
Cheers.
lol. Bullshit from start to finish.
If you have any counter arguments to make, please feel free. As it stands however, several Obama/Clinton associated officials have placed themselves in significant legal jepeordy.
There is also a suspicion that senior FBI officials altered their original 302 interview notes of General Flynn. A big no-no.
And yet it’s the trump ones confessing to crimes.
“There is also a suspicion that senior FBI officials altered their original 302 interview notes of General Flynn.”
Probably from the same people who think there are child slave camps on mars.
I’m quite glad I didn’t waste time on an argument, given your refusal to believe Flynn’s guilty plea when it’s linked.
The guilty plea won’t stand – the DOJ and FBI likely acted illegally to pressure Flynn into signing it.
Likely did they? Gosh, likely something to think likely about then, likely.
Whatever, neo. I’m off to bed, and the wheels of justice roll inexorably onwards.
So, Manafort is dead in the water.. unless he coughs up a bigger fish.
A former top aide to Donald Trump’s presidential campaign will plead guilty to fraud-related charges within days – and has made clear to prosecutors that he would testify against Paul J. Manafort Jr., the lawyer-lobbyist who once managed the campaign.
The change of heart by Trump’s former deputy campaign manager, Richard W. Gates III, who had pleaded not guilty after being indicted in October on charges similar to Manafort’s, was described in interviews by people familiar with the case.
http://www.latimes.com/politics/la-na-pol-rick-gates-plea-deal-20180218-story.html
“I get the feeling the Robert Mueller investigation is reaching a critical stage.”
And you believe this stuff? I see your Mueller fantasies and raise you weapons of mass destruction, yellowcake, Valerie Plame, Scooter Libby, the former Yugoslavia, Kosovo, the Ukraine, the Crimea. And that’s just some of the last 25 years or so, never mind further back in history.
What happened to lefties accusing the msm of peddling fake news (which said msm did in all of the above cases)? Do you believe the McCarthyist Mueller’s claims, just because you’ve fallen for the anti-Russia schtick? Please approach all of this with a large handful of salt….
Que?
There have been three guilty pleas to charges laid. Lots of info suggesting foreign involvement in the US election result. Is this something that should be ignored just because it is anti Russian?
The US system is one where authorities often threaten those accused with massive trumped up charges and prison time. Which can be avoided if you just agree to a little plea bargain. Which means that you plead guilty and the case that the prosecutors have never ever gets examined in full by a judge or jury.
Would you prefer to be bankrupted by the state through the courts over a 5 or 6 year process and risk 150 years in prison? Or would you rather plead guilty to something relatively minor, serve 12 months and then get on with your life?
It’s a corrupt system.
They got General Flynn to plead guilty on a minor process technicality – not any crime to do with anything Russian (because he didn’t do anything wrong).
You mean the minor process technicality of running an illegal foreign policy to undermine the presidency of the day and then lying to law enforcement about it?
Totally can’t understand why that would be a felony /sarc.
None of your comments are correct, thanks. As incoming NSA, Flynn would be expected to have immediate contacts with representatives from all over the world as part of normal Transition activities.
That’s why I added the link. That’s merely what Flynn signed. You might call him a liar, but that doesn’t matter because that’s exactly what he confessed to.
And no, Flynn was still expected to work within the constraints of the actual presidency’s foreign policy during the transition. To run a parallel foreign policy while a private citizen is actually illegal, which is why Flynn lied about it.
General Flynn signed that confession of process crimes under illegal threats to him and his son.
They couldn’t get him on actually doing anything wrong in his role as incoming NSA, and certainly nothing that would stand up in court
In other words, they (Obama and Clinton loyalists in the DOJ and FBI) targetted Flynn and framed him.
So they had done nothing illegal, the FBI “certainly” didn’t have a case at all, so Flynn confessed anyway.
“Process crimes”: lol giving false information to law enforcement.
General Flynn expected to withdraw guilty plea in light of prosecutorial misconduct.
https://twitter.com/LionelMedia/status/966629698246725632
Which doesn’t explain why he pled in the first place, if the FBI certainly had nothing that would stand up in court. Like what you said.
But anyway, we’ll see what happens. It’s a process. If he committed the “process crime” of impeding a federal investigation by supplying false statements to investigators, and withdraws his guilty plea, then they’ll simply start from where they left off when he pled guilty.
Except if they deliberately hid exculpatory evidence from him, or obtained other evidence illegally.
In which case the DOJ has no case.
If he tries to withdraw the plea, and the withdrawal is accepted by the judge, and there is no legitimately-gathered evidence of the crimes he pled to or other offences that were not pursued because of the plea deal, then yes, Flynn would be in the clear.
Lots of “ifs”, though.
And only Flynn would be in the clear. They had another guilty plea from someone else a few days ago. The list is growing.
The list is growing? Growing in your dreams, perhaps.
In terms of Trump’s team helping the President Elect to collude with the Russians, the feds have nothing.
Manafort and Gates are accused of various financial crimes committed many years ago. Nothing to do with Trump. (Clinton associates have done the same in Ukraine/Russia, but they are protected for now).
Didn’t a Dutch lawyer take a plea recently?
yup.
Same link says two others also took a plea, in addition to Flynn.
But yes, Trump has not been formally charged or accused of anything yet, as far as I know. Obviously that means he’s completely in the clear and will be forever /sarc
In terms of Trump’s team helping the President Elect to collude with the Russians, the feds have nothing.
And continue to have nothing.
Because “charges not levelled yet” is the same as “the authorities currently have absolutely no evidence of wrongdoing by the person, and never ever will”.
At least try to keep your cheerleading within throwing distance of reality, please.
Hi McFlock,
Happy to wait for when it goes to court. Thanks.
You’re doing a lot of commenting for someone who’s happy to wait.
This is also untrue, thanks.
never heard of the Logan Act, then?
Please list all the successful prosecutions under said “Logan Act”
Don’t need to. It exists.
No successful prosecutions under the Logan Act at all in its century plus existence? Oh dear. Looks like it is either unenforceable, or irrelevant. Or both.
Are you seriously arguing that something must be legal because nobody has been prosecuted for it yet?
If no one has been prosecuted for it in a hundred years despite it happening all the time, yes.
Oh really? So an act says something is illegal, but if nobody does it in a hundred years, then it must be legal?
Or the act says something is illegal, people break it but are always smart enough to avoid prosecution, so when someone isn’t so smart and leaves a trail of evidence, it was actually legal?
The contortions you bend yourself into in order to defend your oompah-loompah overlord…
No, my comment spoke for itself.
If there are no prosecutions for it in a hundred years (or ever) even though it is happening out in the open all the time, then it is legal.
Like not stopping and getting out of your car at each intersection to ensure that there are no horses riders approaching.
vs:
Basic knowledge of the US legal system might be of assistance. To McFlock. CV will have to confirm it with RT first.
OK you guys, please do let me know when the first case ever under the Logan Act is brought to trial and the defendants found guilty.
Do you think it will be before or after the Logan Act turns 300 years?
Lucky for you, I’m a patient man.
CV, there might never be another prosecution under the Logan Act ever again.
But it is still illegal to run a parallel foreign policy while a private citizen of the US, and it will remain illegal until the passage
is repealed.
Hi McFlock,
Happy to wait for when it goes to court. Let me know. Thanks.
So you’ll be restricting yourself to claims that are demonstrable beyond a reasonable doubt from now on?
Just to be clear, is it currently illegal for an unauthorised citizen of the USA to negotiate with foreign governments for particular action or inaction by those governments in relation to any dispute or disagreement those governments might have with the USA?
You say it is McFlock, but your claim has never been tested in court in two centuries. Let me know when it has. Thanks.
Not me. Congress said it was, explicitly, but I guess you know better than to trust unverified reports like “statutes”.
Inside the Troll Factory…
https://www.thedailybeast.com/after-muellers-indictments-an-interview-with-a-mole-who-was-inside-russias-pro-trump-troll-factory?ref=home
Also often reported as the troll farm / troll hub / bot farm / troll army by various media. Obviously they want us to take it seriously.
This is one of the worst arguments I’ve ever seen
A.
Is that a self-referential comment?
^hahahahaha!
rather deflecting from the fact that the majority of stories were posted after the election .So not quite sure how they were meant to influence any damned thing.
The fact that the US was hugely divided anyway explains why clickbait profits were maximised by covering all the hot topics, throw in a few cute puppies and kaching!
Ensure you click the “reply” button right under the comment you are replying to, or your responses will be lost out of the thread and lost out of order.
What do you “think” I meant by “putting on someone else’s shoes”, CV? After all, it’s right there in the exchange you butted into without reading.
Surely you didn’t understand it, nor the reference to leaving fingerprints on the shoes. Sharpen up.
Hi OAB not sure what you mean by your response as I was just trying to ensure that francesca knew about the “reply” button.
I can’t reply to the comment you made at 1:22, which I quoted to give you a great big clue.
So I replied here instead.
Oh I thought you were just being a general clutz. My wrong.
Do you get the point about fingerprints on the shoes now?
If the hired help are any good, they’ll all be wearing linen gloves.
Finally.
Well here I am pressing the reply button
Thanks
Sometimes there is no reply button
Indeed, if you are at the maximum nesting level of replies it doesn’t allow another.
In which case scroll up and just reply to the last available reply button you can see and the system will automatically add your comment on to the end of that particular thread.
Ah, thanks ColVip
What CV said.
Or, find a reply button to the person you actually want to reply to, preferably in the same thread. That can make it easier to parse threads involving prolific commenters like eg: Hornet, or me.
It’s not an exact science 🙂
I see the new “reds under the bed” hysteria is alive and well.
Meanwhile, Kunstler has a great analysis on what the Mueller indictment was actually about:
And also
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-02-19/it-looks-greatest-act-bureaucratic-ass-covering-us-history
BAU: if you want CV’s opinion, read RT and Zerohedge.
Or Infowars.
😆
Or Fox
Maybe not Fox. Well, not if this stuff keeps happening.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/shepard-smith-fox-news-trump-russia_us_5a8b56a4e4b0117adf7108bf
Solved.
Fox is trying to keep up with digital competitors in that realm, too. According to a person familiar with the matter, Fox News is readying a new streaming service that will cost a monthly fee and feature exclusive content from personalities like conservative pundit Tomi Lahren. The service is being imagined for Fox’s most passionate fans — and it will house content that is not available on broadcast. Fox News teased the over-the-top streaming service as a “digital product currently in development” when it announced Lahren’s hire this summer.
https://www.buzzfeed.com/stevenperlberg/rupert-murdoch-isnt-done-fighting-yet?utm_term=.isYDDDQYqG#.tn9zzzYBn1
The Saker is excellent, so is Moon of Alabama.
http://thesaker.is/
http://www.moonofalabama.org/
Yes those two sites look highly credible
Interesting you say that. From The Saker’s biography:
“In 1984 I did my military service in electronic warfare and I was later transferred to the military intelligence service (UNA) as a language specialist where did some work with the Swiss Air Force. I then traveled to the USA where I got a BA in International Relations from the School of International Service (SIS) at the American University and a MA in Strategic Studies from the Paul H. Nitze School for Advanced International Studies (SAIS) at the Johns Hopkins University. Upon my return to Switzerland, I worked as a civilian consultant for the Swiss Strategic Intelligence Service (SND) writing strategic analyses, primarily about the Soviet/Russian military. In the military, I was given the Major-equivalent rank of “Technical Officer”, which is a fancy way of saying that I was an analyst. I also worked as an “enemy operations” (“Red Team” in US parlance) specialist for the operational-level training of the General Staff of Swiss armed forces. I then accepted a position for the UN Institute for Disarmament Research (UNIDIR) where I specialized in peacekeeping tactics and operations.”
Full bio well worth reading in terms of why he’s long been a better read on Russia than anyone you’ll encounter in VOX, Salon, The Hill, etc.
http://thesaker.is/submarines-in-the-desert-as-my-deepest-gratitude-to-you/
Argumentum ad verecundiam.
Emeritus professors unite, you have nothing to lose but your hair, teeth, bone density, and I forgot the other one.
But somewhat more credible than your CV in the field of international relations and defense/security, I dare say.
Nice bit of irrelevant latin mumbo jumbo though.
Anyone who takes the word of an anonymous bloke for anything is an idiot, if you ask me.
Some honesty at last; it is as unexpected as it is appreciated.
Too funny. You just took my word for it.
“Nice bit of irrelevant latin mumbo jumbo though.”
He googled it and put it in italics to make it seem more impressive. Didn’t work though.
It means “the argument from authority”, by contrast to the wild and dangerous idea that arguments survive on their own merits, as opposed to the author’s reputation.
Any fool can have an off day.
Now, point to the specific day.
JohnSelway questioned The Saker’s credibility. I provided some credentials in an effort to persuade him he’s a worthwhile read, accompanied with a link to his full bio in order to keep the post short, but offer the interested reader the opportunity to see that in addition to having more practical experience in matters of strategy and geopolitics than your average liberal hack, he also grew up steeped in the abiding Russian culture of that half of his émigré family.
And it seems to me you would actually agree with this approach. After all, you seemed fine with it here, where you chided Francesca for acting like she knew better than Mueller how to proceed with his own investigation. And fair enough too – it’s an acknowledgement of professional expertise.
https://thestandard.org.nz/mueller-v-russia/#comment-1451005
So, what I pointed out was:
“Full bio well worth reading in terms of why he’s long been a better read on Russia than anyone you’ll encounter in VOX, Salon, The Hill, etc.”
So I was ultimately offering him the opportunity to make his own mind up, you can hardly characterise that as didactic. And certainly not delivered like your appeal to the expertise of Mueller.
Full bio
He’s an anonymous bloke then: I didn’t catch his name.
His real name is Andrei Raevesky. He began writing as an anonymous bloke who identifies as a submarine in the desert, but he eventually named himself.
“Stop the Empire’s War On Russia”.
The article “Escalation in Syria – how far can the Russians be pushed?” caught my eye.
The answer of course, is that like all bullies, they can be pushed forever because if they had any hard power they couldn’t be pushed at all.
the Empire will have to pay
Sure they will. Reminds me of the three young men from my past, retreating down the road yelling “we’ll get you!” They didn’t of course: had they been capable they’d already have done the job.
In a stand up fight, the kleptocrats in the Kremlin are going to be humiliated by the plutocrats in Washington every single time. That’s why they have to resort to ‘kompromat’ and other guerrilla tactics.
Look how whiny they got when Obama removed their precious banking privileges.
This is just my opinion, of course.
Oh, and once again, for the benefit of lackwits, this comment in no way endorses this or that foreign policy or any other aggression.
While Washington more routinely gets embarrassed by a bunch of uneducated jihadists wielding AK47s and RPGs on the back of Toyota pickup trucks.
I mean seriously, what is this “stand up fight” nonsense you talk about? Some sort of wild west standoff between the archetypal black hat and white hat, with tumbleweeds rolling by, waiting for someone to draw first?
Just juvenile.
@CV: what part of plutocrats vs. kleptocrats are you having trouble with?
Which of these are the “white hats” in your “mind”? Lackwit.
My rhetorical tone matches the macho posturing implicit in the statements “the empire will have to pay”, and “how far can the Russians be pushed?”
You didn’t pick up on that, though.
Moon of alabama is great.
And he will always call himself out if he gets it wrong
Will he call himself out for the cherry-picking that’s blindingly obvious in his analysis of the IRA indictment?
He ignores all evidence of the motivation behind the alleged crimes, instead simply assuming it is the same motivation as that of Macedonian teenagers.
Which is odd, because surely he knows that the three pillars of a prosecution case are motive, means, and opportunity.
Of course, it’s always possible he doesn’t know that 🙄
What prosecution case?
As Kunstler adeptly points out, Mueller has zero chance of bringing these characters to trial and knows therefore that there is zero chance of having his “prosecution case” actually tested.
Sure. Unless they happen to get arrested in Thailand on an Interpol warrant, or get ‘Kim Dotcommed’ by some friendly government.
After all, kleptocrats do love to enjoy their ill-gotten gains. And avoid sanctions on their banking activities.
“Adept” at what exactly? Useful idiocy? Sophisticated gobshite?
Has any such Interpol warrant or ‘red notice’ been issued?
How would you know?
Hmmm? I ask only because you brought it up first.
Context:
https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-17-02-2018/#comment-1450273