New Zealand First

61 comments on “New Zealand First ”

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1. BM 1

   24 June 2017 at 9:55 am

   I can’t really see how Peters could work with either the Labour/Greens coalition or National.

   Maybe apart from a watered down version of number 4, no one’s going to be doing any of that
   • Ad 1.1

     24 June 2017 at 12:45 pm

     Much more likely we’ll get a National+NZF government until 2020.
     • Cinny 1.1.1

       24 June 2017 at 6:12 pm

       I doubt it Ad, but that’s just my humble opinion from watching every question time in the last five years.

       What has surprised me is how many young people are going to vote for Winnie, and even a few hippies.

       Good post btw.

       At least our new PM won’t be able to say “I’m not a lawyer” to defend his guilt and lies. Both Winnie and Alpha have studied law.
   • Draco T Bastard 1.2

     24 June 2017 at 1:03 pm

     With most of those policies I think he can work with Lab/Greens.

     Can’t work with National with any of them though.
     • Ad 1.2.1

       24 June 2017 at 1:11 pm

       National has tonnes of Labour policies now.

       On the cross benches and a good Ministerial slot he’d be just fine.

       At 15% he’s go for PM.
       That would be fun.
       • Draco T Bastard 1.2.1.1

         24 June 2017 at 1:53 pm

         National has tonnes of Labour policies now.

         National copies Labour policy once their own policies are shown to be completely against what the people want – unless it’s selling off of state assets and a few other core National Party principles. In which case they’ll keep them no matter what the people want.

         And that’s what we’re talking about here – principles. NZ1st’s are almost totally opposed to National’s principles. They do align with Labour’s though and could probably work with the Green’s.
         • Ad 1.2.1.1.1

           24 June 2017 at 8:21 pm

           He’s not going to do it that way.

           He is going to run the next 2.5 months so that we follow him, not the other way round.
     • BM 1.2.2

       24 June 2017 at 1:15 pm

       He’s banking on the provincial vote to really lift him this time around.

       That rules out the greens completely.
       • Ad 1.2.2.1

         24 June 2017 at 1:17 pm

         Once votes are cast, the farmers get no say.

         And of course NZF will never say who they are going in with beforehand.
         • BM 1.2.2.1.1

           24 June 2017 at 1:48 pm

           Unless he has no interest in the longevity of NZ First.

           Spending all that time trying to build up a provincial voter base and then to throw it all away by siding with the rather farmer hostile green party does seem counter-intuitive.
           • Draco T Bastard 1.2.2.1.1.1

             24 June 2017 at 1:55 pm

             The Greens aren’t hostile to farmers. Their hostile to destroying the environment for profit.

             It’s a rather critical distinction.
             • BM …

               24 June 2017 at 2:17 pm

               The greens think current farming practices have to stop, if that happens the whole farming sector will collapse and go broke.

               How can Farmers deal with the Greens when they basically want to put them out of business?

               Because of this Peters can’t go into any coalition that involves the Greens.
               • Draco T Bastard …

                 24 June 2017 at 5:40 pm

                 The greens think current farming practices have to stop, if that happens the whole farming sector will collapse and go broke.

                 Which tells us that the current farming practices are wrong.

                 But it’s still not an attack on farmers.

                 And why should we keep subsidising farmers at the cost of our environment?

                 How can Farmers deal with the Greens when they basically want to put them out of business?

                 They don’t want to put them out of business but get them to change their practices to being sustainable. Farmers should, if they were any good at farming, fully understand that.
                 • Ad …

                   24 June 2017 at 8:52 pm

                   Farmers as a whole will not give a flying fuck about the Greens, unless the Greens can figure out how to work with Winston Peters. Because the Greens will not be in government without New Zealand First.

                   New Zealand First on the other hand does not need the Green Party at all.

                   That is not a happy place for the Green Party with 2.5 months to deadline.
                   • Matthew Whitehead …

                     25 June 2017 at 1:36 pm

                     Actually NZ First does need the Green Party, as they’ve made very clear that National doesn’t currently meet their bottom line policies in terms of who they’d form a government with, and Labour has been very clear that the Greens are first in line come coalition talks if Labour is in a position to be forming a government, because they committed to working together ahead of the election.

                     The real question is whether those discussions are moot and it’ll be so close that the Māori Party ends up deciding things. Labour should be buoyed tremendously by this latest controversy for National, but I’ve learned not to underestimate their impressive ability for unforced errors and failing to inspire people.
               • Matthew Whitehead …

                 25 June 2017 at 1:32 pm

                 Mate, the thing you fail to realise is that if stopping the current practices will drive them into financial ruin, whoever runs those farms is eventually heading for financial ruin whether they stop now or stop later, because those practices cannot be sustained in the long term.

                 It’s true the Greens would rather we start now in transitioning less sustainable models of farming, (mostly in the dairy sector) particularly high-intensity models, towards business practice that can be sustained over the long term. But that doesn’t make them enemies of farmers, rather it means that they want farmers to start doing business in such a way that they can pass their farms down several generations, with nobody going broke.

                 Blaming the Greens for bringing it up as a political issue is a classic case of shooting the messenger.
                 • You_Fool …

                   26 June 2017 at 2:43 pm

                   From my understanding, Farmers actually get this and are heading that way anyway, so it is a non-issue.

                   The big farms as a business corporations don’t like it, but that is just rich pricks wanting to rape the land for all its worth and are not worried about the future anyway (and aren’t farmers)

                   Oh and it is also an issue for certain political commentators/junkies who seem to want to ignore everything the Greens say or how it actually aligns with reality and just claim them as impractical hippies who will ruin the world in some way
2. Bill 2

   24 June 2017 at 12:48 pm

   Thanks for compiling the list Ad.

   It’s ironic that an expression of social democracy persisted in NZ in the shape of New Zealand First.

   A conservative party to be potentially courted by what was once a labour party? And that old social democratic party, that’s very firmly from the right of the social democratic spectrum, is more left than the would be liberal seducer…

   Welcome to spaghetti politics.
3. roy cartland 3

   24 June 2017 at 12:49 pm

   You missed repeal the so-called anti-smacking legislation.
   • Ad 3.1

     24 June 2017 at 12:55 pm

     I outlined specific policies.

     If Labour keeps fading NZF have a good chance at 15%.

     They’re a bit retro for me, but they’re important.
     • The Chairman 3.1.1

       24 June 2017 at 12:59 pm

       “If Labour keeps fading NZF have a good chance at 15%.”

       Or more. Winston is out polling Little for preferred PM.
     • mary_a 3.1.2

       24 June 2017 at 1:01 pm

       Sometimes retro isn’t such a bad thing Ad (3.1).
       • Ad 3.1.2.1

         24 June 2017 at 1:09 pm

         Would you vote for him though?
         • Eyre 3.1.2.1.1

           24 June 2017 at 2:02 pm

           Cam Slater and halve of whale oil readers are voting nz first this time round. Strange times.
           • BM 3.1.2.1.1.1

             24 June 2017 at 6:33 pm

             Slater is a pathetic man-child who’s sulking because Bill English told him to go away.

             He’s hoping National loses and English gets replaced with his true love Judith.
             • Eyre …

               24 June 2017 at 7:53 pm

               Also the likud press office
         • mary_a 3.1.2.1.2

           24 June 2017 at 7:34 pm

           @ Ad (3.1.2.1) … no, simply because I don’t trust Winston.

           Voting NZF, despite having some good MPs and policies, could well be a vote for another National government and that’s something I could never live down.

           When I refer to retro, I make reference to the time when NZ was once the envy of the world for its egalitarian social and economic structure. Although it wasn’t perfect, it did work reasonably well. Seems to me this is what NZF is offering up and it’s a pity Winston doesn’t front up and make it clear which side he will be going with prior to the election. His non commitment here, is not beneficial to NZ.
           • Tamati Tautuhi 3.1.2.1.2.1

             25 June 2017 at 8:42 am

             Highly unlikely he will go with National and in a recent survey 71.4% of NZF Voters would prefer a NZF/Labour Coalition, he’s already been shafted by National once. There is an old saying “Once bitten twice shy”.
   • One Anonymous Bloke 3.2

     24 June 2017 at 8:09 pm

     Referendum on the Māori seats.

     All environmental policies will be proactive with a view to creating employment and sustainable wealth whilst improving one of our few competitive advantages…

     protect our social fabric and traditional family values which underpin our society.

     Uh huh.
4. saveNZ 4

   24 June 2017 at 12:49 pm

   NZ First sounds like good policy to me and they look like popular and centre positions. Around the world voters are rejecting neoliberalism. It’s not helping people, it’s taking people’s country out of the local people’s control and ridiculous and dangerous decisions are being made that benefit people who don’t live there at the cost of the community that does.

   Winston’s not stupid and anybody can see all National’s partners end up with declining votes, or befalling an unexpected demise right before the election aka, Conservatives style. I don’t think National will have many takers as coalition partners. Even Bill’s legendary charisma and spaghetti pizza may not tempt them.
   • Tamati Tautuhi 4.1

     25 June 2017 at 8:43 am

     Neoliberalism or Zombie Economics has turned New Zealand into a Dogs Breakfast ?
5. Stuart Munro 5

   24 June 2017 at 1:42 pm

   Good policies for the most part – and the idea of a joined up reform is overdue.

   I just can’t reconcile them with the possibility of leaping into bed with the Gnats.

   It does show I think that Winston was the leader National always needed, but they were too racist for him back in the day, and now they’re too dependent on corrupt commercial relationships to move his way.

   It may mean the Gnats collapse after this electoral loss, and try to rebuild their brand.
   • Ad 5.1

     24 June 2017 at 1:43 pm

     I made sure I only put up the picked lefties would like the most.

     There’s lots of annoying ones as well.
     • Stuart Munro 5.1.1

       24 June 2017 at 1:48 pm

       He has a lot of supporters – but he’s too mercurial for some of us.

       Like TOP, I’d like to see his better policies cherry picked.
     • saveNZ 5.1.2

       24 June 2017 at 7:06 pm

       Yep, so if you find the other ones too annoying, you can vote Labour or Green:) But you can be silent supporters to NZ First and for those voters disenchanted from the darker National side back to the conservative centre, which is NZ First.

       My prediction is the South Islanders are getting sick of the Natz taking them for granted. There has been Pike River, ChCH still not rebuilt and going slower and slower, other quakes, Nick Smith and his Faeces rivers… There is a point where people have had enough of being taken for granted and want to send a message.

       NZ First or Labour or even Greens should pick up the votes. The country has had enough of National.
     • MJH 5.1.3

       24 June 2017 at 8:35 pm

       Comment directed to Ad at 5.1: That is troubling; were you inviting attacks on NZ First policies? Is this a stalking horse post? Until I read this little comment, I assume you believed (as I basically do) that NZ First is, at essence, first and foremost a party that is opposes and seeks to reverse neoliberal economic policy. And that is a goal I believe in 100%. Some of its methods we could quibble with and some of its rhetoric, well…
       But NZ First is the ONLY party [okay, the only party with more than a few thousand supporters] that says no, no, no to the economic path this country has been following for decades. That is why I am supporting it.
       • Ad 5.1.3.1

         24 June 2017 at 8:49 pm

         It really really is time the left took NZF seriously, started interrogating their policies, and not just their leaders’ character. Most of the time I see too many commenters spouting platitudes about moist left stuff that will be of no moment to any future government at all.

         New Zealand First are the only indispensable party in the next government.

         Fantastic to see you nail your colors to the mast here.
6. David Mac 6

   24 June 2017 at 2:02 pm

   Our MMP system amps up the requirement for compromise between parties. When forming a government the compromise trading operates on 2 primary planes. Appointments and Policies: Who sits in what chair and what’s the action plan?

   The natural place for NZ First is with National. But when I consider ‘Does Winston want to play 2nd Fiddle or be 1 of the 3 tenors?’ The left block makes sense.

   When I look at that list of policies and consider ‘Who has to give up the most to accommodate NZ First’s wishes? Again, I think the left would be more accommodating.

   Shane Jones is Nga Puhi as is Winston. if Jones steps up to the plate…Nat lovers are a small minority in that iwi.

   Winston has had a problem with aspects of the Greens. I feel this may be a pre- James Shaw sentiment. His beef with the greens softened by their slide towards broader appeal. eg: Making a career business consultant part boss.

   So yep, on the face of it, NZ First will run with the Nats….but when you start looking at the dissected bits and pieces, I’m not so sure.

   The big winner is NZ First, 2 very suitable suitors, hard to tell who they’ll marry. Both of those boys will spend heaps wooing that girl.
   • Stuart Munro 6.1

     24 June 2017 at 2:55 pm

     Not sure Winston’ll go for Jones – may be a bit wary of possible waka jumpers.
   • Ad 6.2

     24 June 2017 at 8:05 pm

     He will go with National, but not in a formal coalition.

     He will go with Confidence and Supply.

     Unless.

     Unless he is in the position to achieve Prime Minister.

     Then, and only then, it will be a formal coalition with National.

     The point of the post is to show that NZF is the only party with some left credentials with current likelihood to alter the course of the likely next government – a National government.
     • Stuart Munro 6.2.1

       24 June 2017 at 8:21 pm

       I wouldn’t mind a constitutional precedent whereby a coalition partner bringing over 20% gets a spell as PM. The frightening thing about Winston as PM is not what he’d do (he has some understanding of how PMs fail) but the compromises he might be prepared to make to get there.

       Of course that goes for the Greens too – if they break 20, why shouldn’t they have a crack? Somehow I doubt it’ll happen, but it is somewhat in accord with democratic principles.
7. The Pink Postman 7

   24 June 2017 at 2:49 pm

   NZ1 are a racist lot ,Labour should have nothing to do with them.
   Recently their racism is getting worse .I for one find their racist remarks offensive,
   .
8. McGrath 8

   24 June 2017 at 6:09 pm

   How much is Winston First willing to compromise to get the baubles of power? If the above list are absolutes, then I can only see him either on the cross benches or with Labour/Green.
   • Ad 8.1

     24 June 2017 at 8:19 pm

     Don’t be a moron.
     MMP is a negotation.
     Absolutes are for monarchs.
9. Jenny Kirk 9

   24 June 2017 at 6:42 pm

   It’s possible Winston will tell NZF supporters that its necessary to go with the Nats to be able to harness and haul-in their more outrageous policies. Something like that could well be his excuse for going into coalition with the Nats.
   Don’t be fooled by his smiling ways, charm and rhetoric. IMO He wants the baubles only – and he doesn’t really care about the rest of the country or our people.
   • Ad 9.1

     24 June 2017 at 8:09 pm

     You may be right.

     On the other hand, Winston could really be conviction politician.
     It’s there in the policies.
     • Graeme 9.1.1

       24 June 2017 at 8:30 pm

       But most of those policies are the antithesis of what National have been trying to achieve in this and prior governments. Will they go with NZF? They do have some principles, other than being in power.
       • Ad 9.1.1.1

         24 June 2017 at 8:45 pm

         All you have to do is go through the number of massive and era-defining policies from Labour that National have now locked in for good, to understand how far National are going to turn Labour into an irrelevancy by adopting New Zealand First policies.

         Can you list them?
         • Graeme 9.1.1.1.1

           24 June 2017 at 9:41 pm

           And that will be national’s down fall. The more they turn into some populist Labour lite / NZ First clone, the more their core voters will turn away from them.

           Labour isn’t, and won’t be an irrelevancy, Labour’s policies are being maintained, and extended by National. Labour is making National be Labour. This isn’t going to suit National’s donors and eventually those funds will go to a party that represents those donors interests. If National continues their labour lite approach they’ll go the way of the Blarites in UK and become the irrelevance.

           Sorry, I can’t see National adopting NZ First, and really Labour policies ending well for the National Party. It’ll be bloody entertaining while it lasts though.
           • Ad 9.1.1.1.1.1

             24 June 2017 at 9:51 pm

             Net effect either way is to squeeze Labour smaller – whether they are pushing National leftwards or not.

             I mean, I hope you are right. But so far adopting Labor policies are working really well for National. Those donors don’t have too many principles; power and its levers are usually enough.
             • b waghorn …

               25 June 2017 at 7:25 am

               And yet people say labour are not an effective opposition
   • Tamati Tautuhi 9.2

     25 June 2017 at 8:48 am

     NZF Caucus will decide which party they go into coalition with not just Winston.
   • Tamati Tautuhi 9.3

     25 June 2017 at 8:56 am

     NZF look as if they will get around 15% of the Party Vote at the next Election which should be enough to hold the Balance of Power, it is cheap insurance as they will hold whichever party they are in coalition with to account.

     This is what MMP is all about folks, it puts the checks and balances in place, evidently NZF is getting some traction even though MSM and the State Broadcaster Mike Hokins do not give NZF any credibility or media coverage ?

     New Zealand needs NZF if this country is to have any future we are now offshore owned and controlled ?
10. benby 10

    24 June 2017 at 9:24 pm

    In 2005 I stepped off a plane and sat down to enjoy a meal in one of the Asian eateries on upper Queen Street.

    A racist trailer billboard rolled past. It featured Winston Racist Peters.

    How do I vote in a way that keeps him and his racist party away from power?
    • Ad 10.1

      24 June 2017 at 9:33 pm

      You can’t.
      He’s covered both ways this election.
      Vote for some party whose values seem true to you.
11. Incognito 11

    24 June 2017 at 11:38 pm

    NZF has always struck me as a party that’s all about process and not so much about purpose. In a nutshell …
12. gsays 12

    25 June 2017 at 12:12 am

    Kia ora northlanders, how has it been for y’all having Winston as your MP?

    No new bridges yet?
    • Tamati Tautuhi 12.1

      25 June 2017 at 8:49 am

      Can’t do anything in Opposition the Natzis have the cheque book ?
    • You_Fool 12.2

      26 June 2017 at 2:45 pm

      Would those be the bridges that National announced as not being an election bribe, and totally going to happen no matter the outcome of the by-election? Those bridges?
      • gsays 12.2.1

        26 June 2017 at 5:13 pm

        That’s the one!
        Maybe they had their fingers crossed behind their back and meant Simon bridges.
13. millsy 13

    25 June 2017 at 10:40 pm

    NZ First is opposed to the use of 1080, believing that using an army of possum hunters will go on and keep them under control, and enjoy the life of a “Good Keen Man” as depicted in Barry Crump novels.

    They have pretty much lost my vote because of this.

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