"For the next four months, a doctor will be available just three days a week at the medical centre, instead of five, and many of those consultations will be by video, not in person."
People will still be able to make appointments to see Reefton’s rural nurse specialist and practice nurse, including on weekends and holidays, and they will be available on-call for emergencies.
I would have thought teleconsults could be done from Chch too, so it's not entirely clear what is happening here.
The problem is that if you have "a" GP they never get time off. They are on call 24 hours of every day and holidays become almost impossible to arrange. It would need more than providing a house to overcome that problem.
At least a doctor who works in a big city Medical Centre can take holidays.
Reported my + covid result yesterday afternoon. My GP called me on my mobile last night to ensure I was ok, stocked up with medication and supplies, and to ensure I knew the signs of significant problems. Offered a loan of a pulse oximeter, they have 15 for loaning out, but my daughter had bought me one (and a body temp sensor) about 6 months back.
I don't think you'd get better service from a GP than that.
I don't understand your question though in terms of your original comment. When you said "a GP to live in that area would be to gift them some land with a decent house on it." I assumed you meant a permanent resident, not a locum. Were you suggesting a house for a locum would be an incentive?
If, on the other hand, you were suggesting that the permanent doctor could get a locum so they could take a holiday I don't see how they could do it. If the DHB can't find locums how is an individual doctor going to do any better?
The DHB can find locums, just not enough in the current system. Who do you think does the three days a week currently? Having a permanent GP would change things a lot, then bring in locums as the GP needs to go on holiday, have breaks etc. It's not an all or nothing.
From the link,
The Reefton clinic serves a population of about 1000 people and is staffed by GP locums supplied by the DHB, who often stay locally. Some have worked in the town for several months at a time.
My late father did a locum for a rural GP in the mid 1950's. He was advised that many of the locals had not yet grasped the principles of a cash economy. He got the GMS benefit for everyone he saw, but the rest was very much "in kind". Fortunately my mother was raised on a farm and her father was a butcher so being confronted with large lumps of recently demised animal or bird (often complete with shotgun pellets) did not worry her. She could also pluck and dress a chicken. We were particularly happy if someone had been over to the coast and we got fresh or smoked fish or crayfish. When there was not produce it was "mow your lawn Doc?" or "clean your car Doc?". We certainly ate well and his tax return was very good that year,
Might work for a couple who are both GPs? But assuming they have accommodation for locums, I was thinking a freehold house would be the kind of incentive for someone to make the move permanently.
"Chair Lisa Neil says the absence of a GP will load more work on to the minimal nursing staff at the medical centre.
“We have a vulnerable elderly community here and the nurses are already under pressure dealing with Covid in the community.”
Cutting services at a time when Reefton people are in the thick of the epidemic and under stress from spiralling living costs is a bad idea, Neil says.
“It’s a real blow. People are reluctant to front up [with depression] as it is, and if you’re dealing with an intimate problem, elderly people especially won’t be comfortable talking to a TV screen and having an extra person in there with them as well.”
The co-founders of Groundswell admit they have not read the three waters legislation they are so vehemently against.
[…]
Groundswell co-founders Laurie Paterson and Bryce McKenzie also said they haven't read the proposed legislation. Paterson says, nonetheless, they're opposed to what's on the table.
Yup, same attitude and response from ‘critics’ of Three Waters roaming free here on TS. They refuse to engage with the proposals, they choose to close off their minds, and they self-justify this by pointing at all sorts of things being thrown around in the MSM and by the opposition parties, i.e. pointing at ‘hidden agendas’, alleged ‘secrecy’ and ‘dishonesty’, ‘stealth’, et cetera. They will never have to find out how good or bad the reforms might be (very bad, of course) and they simply stick their fingers in their ears. But at the end of the day it is always the same as from the outset: prejudice, pure & perfect prejudice. However, never say this to those people because they’ll flip their lid in a fit of incongruence rage.
Co-governance is a thorny one. Take the Canterbury Regional Council (Ngāi Tahu Representation Bill) currently going through parliament. To my mind Ngāi Tahu getting to appoint two representatives to an elected board is undemocratic.
But of course, the same people vigorously race baiting over this co-governance arrangement were more than happy in 2010 when National dumped the elected councillors and replaced them with commissioners to enable the pillaging and theft of Canterbury's water resources on behalf of corporate dairy interests.
So the opposition to Ngāi Tahu getting two representatives isn't so much a principled defense of democracy as being aggrieved the wrong people are getting a nice salary for life.
Personally, I strongly doubt the Ngāi Tahu representatives will prove to be any better guardians of the waters of Canterbury than some entitled cocky whose family arrived on the Charlotte Jane in 1850. The squabble is really over which bunch of entitled twots get to make money out of the commons that is water. To that extent, I oppose co-governance – to my mind, greed is colour and race blind and the only way to really keep an eye on these wannabe rentiers for life and keep them in check is full participatory democracy.
Ngai Tahu are one of (if not) the biggest owners of dairy farms in Canterbury. If any other sector were given 2 seats on ECAN it would be called a Conflict of Interest.
If you’re referring to royalties, I’ve seen arguments these could have advantages over the non-pricing structure currently in place for drinking water. I fail to see, at present, that this is a get-rich-quick scheme for anybody, but greed is not in my nature.
The only consistent prejudice I see on display here is the one that says anything to do with white people is to be discounted, deplored and derided at every opportunity.
According to Witi Ihimaera it is a Maori Universe after all.
It’s amusing that a farmer from Gore has taken a position opposing the 3 Waters reforms.
Gore has a combined sewage / stormwater system. A throwback from the 19th century and rather expensive to fix. It’s also got a shrinking ratepayer (dying) ratepayer base. Without the socialisation of costs that 3 Waters will bring Gore will probably cease to exist as the rates required will be unsustainable.
A combined sewer-stormwater system is a modern septic outrage.
WTF is that Council doing?
Auckland Council's Stormwater team and Watercare only finished separating out flows from the whole of the Ponsonby-Herne Bay-Freemans Bay-Wynyard Quarter catchment last year. Including a 3.3metre diameter stormwater line 600 metres long.
They still have 2 years to go doing the Central Interceptor project that separates most of the previously joined system. That's over $1b of work in that one alone.
Well they’ve got a seriously good Art Gallery… But they are thinking about it and I think they will start in a few years, it’ll probably take 20 years at what they can afford. If there’s a poster child for 3 Water it’s Gore Anywhere else would have been amalgamated three reforms ago
But as you’ve pointed out Auckland isn’t too flash in this regard, and at a much larger and more public scale. This gets hard to fix and most TAs don’t have Aucklands scale and resources
In much / most of Gore and Mataura there is only one pipe for sewage and stormwater. When it rains the lot goes into the shit ponds which discharge into the river. Hasn’t been ideal practice since about 1900.
My reckons is there is no further polling damage 3-Waters can do to the government. The legislation will be implemented without fuss. But it will take over a decade to notice much difference.
The really big difference is the state fresh water regulator enforcing the National Fresh Water Drinking Standards, upon water systems from lazy shitty little farmer-owned councils who didn't give a damn for decades.
My only reservations about three waters is water governance is being consolidated into a nice ripe target for privatisation by a future National government (which will inevitably involve a grubby little cronyist deal with corporate Iwi that'll entrench rentier lifestyles for all those lucky enough to be at the table when the divvy up is done) and a real sadness that it signals a complete and utter failure of local democracy.
I would have preferred the government had spent a few hundred million on a local democracy revival project before declaring them all incompetent.
"My reckons is there is no further polling damage 3-Waters can do to the government."
I respectfully disagree. There are tens of thousands of people invested in privately owned rural schemes (plus the people in the hundred or so rural council owned schemes) who will suddenly find the schemes they have paid for they no longer control. There is the ongoing and deep set resentment across local government towards central government at the perceived loss of control over ratepayers assets. and at the way the process has been undertaken. And then there's the commitment of both National and Act to overturn the entire structure.
"But it will take over a decade to notice much difference."
Certainly there will be no benefit before the next election, and that is a huge problem, because over the next year the media will be full of reports of the cost of establishing the entities. This is a big play by Labour, and it will be interesting to see how the politics plays out.
"I'm sure there are indeed several thousand on private water systems, but seriously Labour never had them to start with."
I have a friend who lives on a lifestyle block near Masterton. He's one of the many rural people who is part of a private scheme, and he voted for Labour in Wairarapa in 2020, along with significant others that saw the seat go red. He's one of many that will vote blue in 2023 due significantly because of 3Waters. That will play out across provincial NZ, IMHO.
When I was in a private developers scheme, I heaved a sigh of relief when the local council took over that ongoing liability, even though it cost a considerable sum at the time, to get the scheme connected to the public one.
Many of the smaller council's in particular, should be relieved that the costs will now be shared over a much wider area.
Economies of scale set against increased bureaucracy, larger and disparate areas of activity, promised improvement of both delivery and standard and thousands more employed.
Simply that the cost and efficiency of the water and waste water plants per user, improved, when going from about a hundred houses, in the private scheme, to being shared amongst over 8000.
Originally there was no water or sewage plant, except for the development.
Which of course was paid for by buyers, including myself, in the subdivision.
We would have had to pay all the ongoing costs ourselves of the rather expensive to run water and wastewater scheme split amongst a hundred households.
Noting that unit costs drop as plant gets bigger.
The rest of the town was on tank and septic tank.
Later the rest of the town was reticulated to the extended private scheme. Both water and wastewater supply.
Further down the track this was inadequate, as the town grew, and a new scheme was built. Every section paid a levy for the new scheme and ongoing running costs became part of rates.
Much cheaper per household than the original scheme. And saving a nice bit of coast from leaking septic tanks.
You are using terms you apparently dont understand….yes your (future) personal expense was reduced because it was met by a larger group whos future expense was increased…this is contrary to both what is promised by 3 Waters and economy of scale.
Rates which are less than the ongoing costs per household, if the scheme wasn't done.
Originally non reticulated households, also benifited from the initial work and plant built and paid for by the houses in the private scheme, so if there was any cross subsidy, it was from those of us who paid for the private scheme at the start.
Everyone gained from the new scheme. At reduced ongoing cost per household.
@pat, we had a similar situation in our rural community.
However, in this case the local government solution was to require the developer to provide a considerably bigger upgrade for wastewater treatment than his resource consent number of properties warranted.
Once in place, other rural land was rezoned, and the council charged those developments to connect to the now upgraded system.
Other rural land in the area with Grade I soil, has followed with residential zoning, partly justified by the access to the waste water system which retains excess capacity.
A particularly pernicious way of rezoning rural land. In this case there are other factors that make this rezoning not as bad a full greenfields development but it does indicate the lack of transparency.
I have no idea what is grade 1 soil but guess it is productive(?)
However designated land use is imo likely the only effective way of addressing the multitude of issues we face though it would need to be considered in a holistic manner…and it would be deeply unpopular.
When it comes to water infrastructure the problems and solutions remain the same regardless of governance form, management style or political persuasion.
@pat. Yes, Class I soils are productive. There are/were issues with the soil classifications maps that could be up to 5km out in some places. That might have been resolved.
However, the rural land here was not only zoned Class I, it was historically and currently used for food production.
The alternate reasons why this development is not as bad as it could be. There is a geological (topographical) limit to residential expansion, where the sprawl is contained. The community has a long history – pre treaty, and so is well serviced in terms of services and recreational community assets that have built up over time. There is remnants of a train station, with a working rail line. If passenger trains were reinstated to this line, residents would have a viable alternative to car travel.
In my opinion, this is a significantly different situation to other rural developments that have been permitted without connection to existing communities or public transport links.
Many rural communities have historically survived and thrived without the 'benefit' of the latest infrastructure, however the environment (in both senses) has changed….and not for the better.
As one commenter noted a few days ago our population is widely dispersed and many of our communities small and distant from large scale infrastructure removing the option of consolidation….all of these will still require access to potable water, and to meet the standards for waste….and no one has yet addressed the question of contamination of water supplies be it nitrates, PFOS or whatever other contamination we discover that is both extremely difficult and expensive to remove and is historical.
Much has yet to be determined…there are areas where the new entities will have an impact on private schemes and there is also concurrent reform with Taumata Arowai
Gee I wouldn’t go that far. We know enough to determine the scheme is inferior to alternatives.
But look I’ll be generous and save you some time. When you said “Private schemes are outside the Three Waters reforms” you obviously weren’t aware of this:
Acquisition and Vesting of Private 3-waters Schemes Policy
2.2.1 PRIVATE/SMALL DRINKING WATER SCHEME OPERATORS CAN EXPECT TO SEE:
· Increased and immediate investment requirement in backflow prevention.
· Increased monitoring of water schemes and treatment to meet DWSNZ.
· Requirement to develop and administer a drinking water safety plan and a source water risk management plan (catchment).
· Increased costs of source water quality monitoring and testing.
· Increased personal liability to directors with heavy fines for incidences, up to and including imprisonment.
2.2.2 PRIVATE/SMALL WASTEWATER AND STORMWATER SCHEME OPERATORS CAN EXPECT NEW LAWS EMPOWERING TAUMATA AROWAI TO:
· Compile information about wastewater and stormwater networks in a national public database:
· Set environmental performance measures, which wastewater and stormwater operators will have to report against annually:
· Publish an annual report on the environmental performance of wastewater and stormwater networks and their compliance with applicable regulatory requirements (such as resource consents): · Identify and promote national good practice for the design and management of wastewater and stormwater networks.
I don't know how you managed to make the html in that comment so complicated, but I've stripped it out and made it more readable. It's good practice to put links in the clear especially if they are to PDFs. People need to see what they are clicking on.
I don’t have time to rebut this properly. Unfortunately, and unsurprisingly, you have not clarified anything, not cleared up the confusion but only added to it.
Clearly, you have an anti-Three Waters Reforms agenda. You quote some stuff to prove something but it isn’t clear what that is except to bolster your agenda of negativity.
Just briefly, from your linked PDF:
3-waters Reform – Governance, administration and operation of Council 3-waters networks are likely to be transferred to new regional entities from 1 July 2024 (subject to legislation).
…
Until the full enactment of 3-waters reforms underway, Council is the operational and controlling authority responsible for the supply, treatment, reticulation/conveyance and discharge of public 3-waters services (excluding private networks) within the District. [my italics]
Your PDF also states:
Check the Department of Internal Affairs Three Water Review1 for updates.
Which means that you can go there and find out that private schemes are outside the Three Waters reform, as I correctly stated before. Unless you can find more recent info that contradicts this, e.g. because Government has done a U-turn.
So you are given a list of requirements proposed for private schemes and you double down! Your comment about private schemes being “outside the Three Waters reforms” was incorrect.
On the wider issue of 3Waters, I suggest you read the article by Sandra Coney in the Herald about the Waitakete Ranges.
[Link required. Don’t expect others to do the donkey work for you. And you have to explain why and how the NZH article is relevant to the discussion thread about Three Waters Reform and private schemes, not just point to it and say ‘read it’ – Incognito]
I suggest that when you make a suggestion for somebody to read something you include a link and spell names correctly. And if it is in the NZH then it better be not behind the pay-wall or it could be conceived as a troll comment by you – the onus is on you to avoid wasting other people’s time and not put them on wild goose chases through Google, the internet, and then find a brick wall and a hard stop when the article is finally found. I hope for your sake that this is not the case because you will receive a Mod note soon.
Since you seem be adamant on heaping confusion on the matter at hand rather than helping to clarify things I’ve made some time to do some digging.
Can you handle a one-page Summary Fact Sheet on Three Waters Reform – Rural water supplies? Sure you can; you handled the 18-page QLDC policy no sweat.
Under the reforms, only council-owned assets necessary for the delivery of drinking water, wastewater or stormwater services will be transferred to the new water service delivery entities. Privately owned supplies or people who supply their own water for their house will not be impacted.
There are a range of existing service delivery arrangements between councils and community/rural schemes. These will be worked through with all parties during the transition period. This will ensure services continue with appropriate agreements in place with the new entities – for example, private community operated services that require technical assistance.
And
Only council-owned assets necessary for the delivery of three waters services will be transferred to the new entities. Privately owned schemes and supplies will not be transferred.
And
The recently passed Water Services Act will require all drinking water suppliers, other than domestic self-suppliers, to provide safe drinking water and meet drinking water standards. This is to ensure all communities receive safe drinking water, no matter where they live or who supplies this service.
Private drinking water suppliers currently registered under the Health Act will have a year to comply under the Water Services Bill – this includes all public supplies and some large networked rural supplies. Suppliers that are not currently registered under the Health Act will have four years to register with Taumata Arowai (the new water regulator); and seven years to comply.
The NZH article is relevant to the wider discussion about 3Waters and it’s merits. It’s worth purchasing a copy for.
[So, still no link to the NZH article and still no explanation why and how it is relevant to the discussion here. And now you suggest I and other readers here should pay and purchase a copy!? Because it’s worth it, in your opinion, without explaining why and how!?
The link I requested was to the NZH article. But you know that.
However, you provided the same link to the QLDC policy draft again, for the third time, after extensively and selectively quoting irrelevant stuff. I referred to it in my reply @ 11 June 2022 at 2:15 pm and I’ve quoted from it myself. But you know that.
It is unclear and ambiguous to refer to the “original post” without being more specific about which exact comment you mean. When I refer to the OP I refer to the blog/article/piece written by the Author, not to the beginning of a discussion thread or sub-thread. In any case, it is not clear what you’re referring to and this is OM!?
So, you’re a disingenuous troll here, baiting, diverting, obfuscating and you’re wasting Moderator time. Take a week off – Incognito]
"Can you handle a one-page Summary Fact Sheet on Three Waters Reform – Rural water supplies? "
And then you go on to provide a link about transfer of ownership. Your claim was "Private schemes are outside the Three Waters reforms." and yet your own reference states:
"Private drinking water suppliers currently registered under the Health Act will have a year to comply under the Water Services Bill – this includes all public supplies and some large networked rural supplies."
If the scheme has to comply with any new regulations under 3Waters, it is simply false to suggest the scheme is ‘outside’ of the reforms.
And in anticipation that you will try to claim your comment was about 'ownership', the comment you were replying to when you made your claim, and my subsequent comments, have referred to 'control' not 'ownership'.
Nope, neither control nor ownership are transferred out of and away from private schemes. You’re confusing compliance with the new regulations and regulatory framework with loss of control, which is bot inaccurate and incorrect and amounts to fearmongering. The same fearmongering and propaganda as we might expect from some rural quarters with hysterical outburst and frankly ridiculous claims such as "They're stealing our water!", FFS. https://www.ruralnewsgroup.co.nz/rural-news/rural-general-news/they-re-stealing-our-water
To have something stolen from you, you have to own it in the first place. Some rural folk seem to think that they own the commons and because they have been free to use it and waste it they own it, for all intents & purposes. Now, who are the real thieves here?
By all accounts you’re quite intelligent, yet you don’t do anything to help clearing up confusion. Rather, you antagonise and obfuscate. The most obvious conclusion is that you have a deliberate agenda in stalling Three Waters Reform as much as possible and ideally make it fail.
The Three Waters Reforms are complex. This has meant there is some confusion about the reform proposals. The following slides discuss some common misconceptions or myths about the three waters service delivery reforms.
Question: Will the Three Waters Reforms take private water supplies / take back water allocations
Answer: No. The Three Waters Reforms aim to reform council-owned services only. This discussion is not about taking over operation of privately-owned supplies. However, the Government is working with a Rural Supplies Technical Working Group to understand how the proposed entities may support private supplies who currently receive assistance from councils.
The proposed entities will continue to operate within the resource management system – the Three Waters Reforms will not alter resource consents, allocations, or address ownership of freshwater. This is subject to work of the Ministry for the Environment.
I cannot make it any clearer for you or for anybody else. To draw conclusions that are in direct contradiction with the information provided is a sure sign of being disingenuous and not commenting & debating here in good faith. This is the very strong impression you create time after time.
There is a full on white panic going on in certain parts of the country right now, assiduously dog whistled by an army of GOP adjacent racists and/or culture warriors like Laurie Paterson and in the MSM by an army of right wing opinionistas.
That this is a race based backlash can be discerned from the targets – co-governance, smearing Mahuta and attacking Poto Williams, racist fear mongering over three waters, the vigorously pumped conspiracy theories from He Puapua to white paranoia about rigging elections (see National MP David Bennett) to far out conspiracy theories like the great replacement theory which is increasingly being mainstreamed on the NZ right and popping up in comments sections of the likes of the NZ Herald.
But it's not about race, it's about privatisation….
The council-iwi working group, on which Smith was a member, had recommended an entrenched clause to stop the water assets' privatisation. The sale or transfer of even a single pipe would require the agreement of at least 75 percent of all MPs.
[…]
Infrastructure Minister Grant Robertson called on opposition parties to "step up" if they believed in public ownership. "We've heard certainly from the National Party that they've been throughout this process concerned about the loss of ownership in communities," he said. "Now they can step up and say 'we will agree that these assets won't be sold'."
But it's understood the National Party did not agree to support the entrenched clause, protecting against privatisation – it is ironic for Jason Smith that it is the party he has just joined that has effectively blocked the requirement for a super-majority.
Got it in one Sanctuary. And its percolating through centrist communities too. If you confront them – as I have with a few family members – they descend into fits of outrage because it's not racism. Oh yeah.
I have been following stories on the trip to England by Prince Harry and Meghan Markle. There it is again. Racism in all its glory. Hatred and vitriol abounded in subtle and less subtle guises. They are dammed if they do and damned if they don't. I can't even begin to imagine the uproar if it had been their little boy, Archie who played up on the balcony and elsewhere.
It will be understandable if they never return to racist Britain.
It will be understandable if they never return to racist Britain.
I'm sure Britain will be ecstatic.
Meanwhile they're living in considerably-more-racist USA.
Really, you care what the H&M roadshow says or does? Talk about the pinnacle of irrelevance. At least the R Family (privileged though they may be) actually work [truly, you couldn't pay me to do their jobs, be in that goldfish bowl, and live a life in the public eye]
I had sympathy for H&M when they wanted to ditch it all; but the sympathy waned rapidly when it was apparent that they actually wanted to live like A-list celebrities, and were perfectly prepared to sacrifice their precious privacy at the altar of their new god, Netflix.
Actually I was picking up on Sanctuary @3.4 and talking about racism Belladonna. The example I gave is just the latest.
Don't care what you may think I care or don't care about, or for that matter what you may care or not care about. Don't do Netflix and don't follow the pair's antics in the US so don't know what you're talking about. And just so as you get the message I don't care either. 😈
I care about racism and other forms of destructive prejudice. I don't care about the circumstance or past mistakes of the individual/individuals who happen to be the targets.
A less judgemental approach to commenters based on… zero knowledge of their backgrounds or the extent of their "research" endeavours into matters that happen to be of interest to them would be helpful. You might find the favour being returned.
Don't care what you may think I care or don't care about, or for that matter what you may care or not care about. Don't do Netflix and don't follow the pair's antics in the US so don't know what you're talking about. And just so as you get the message I don't care either.
It's pretty obvious that you've done little or no research.
And I suggest a mirror, when you're talking about "less judgemental approach"
Apart from the people who drafted it, I doubt even the minister has read the whole thing. It would be more to the point to ask if they'd read the summary of the Bill and the discussion document.
the National Party is still perceived by New Zealanders as most capable of managing 4 of the top-5 issues, a significant shift compared to June 2021, when Labour was seen as most capable of managing 19 of the 20 issues.
The top five issues are:
1. Inflation/cost of living.
2. Housing/price of housing.
3. Healthcare/hospitals.
4. Petrol prices/fuel.
5. Crime/law and order.
National should be delighted with the attention Labour is giving 3 Waters.
I don't think they care about reelection at this point. I think the cabinet of mediocrity is simply hoping it gets as many of its social engineering reforms through by mid 2023 as possible.
They are doubling and trippling down on everything that makes them unpopular and have abandoned anything remotely popular.
People voted labour because they thought they might do something about unaffordable housing, unaffordable rents, living costs, mental health, welfare ,health, tax reforms and in 2017 Jacinda even said she supported drug reform.
Instead all those problems are worse and labour is worrying about Geoffrey Palmer esque pie in the sky constitutional reforms and social engineering.
Tens of thousands wait on social housing lists and labour won't increase the percentage of social housing in total supply better to just copy national and throw them in costly motels rather than build state housing which is revenue asset for the govt but nevermind.
Private Rentals are impossible to find but theres a hundred thousand empty houses in NZ the govt just shrugs. Instead of developing land and building houses we give land to developers to sell extremely overpriced two bedroom boxes that sit empty.
Cost of living is out of control and our supermarket duopoly greed is hurting our people and a war with them would be extremely popular, the govt spends months saying it'll do something major doesn't even do the bare minimum. Another failed opportunity
Instead of spending loads on training new nurses and doctors for free we spend loads on centralizing healthcare bureaucracy. While dying people sit in beds in our ers.
Drops a CGT as soon as they start polling highly after March 15. wasted opportunity
Pm whose popularity, like way Trudeau would have gotten weed reform Says she supports drug reform in 2017, the party doesn't wrote a coherent drug policy, pm refuses to say she supports drug reform Incase it costs her a single vote but will support euthanasia, the result is pretty much 50/50 and immediately govt rules out any reform desire weed reform being popular with half the country. Another cynical wasted opportunity and if you look at the weed industries around the world, one that is leaving NZ behind. Failure to get any drug reform from this govt is shameful.
Instead of things on housing,cost of living , health, things people actually vote labour for we get hate speech laws, woke extremists running an anti terrorist unit, 3 waters, centralization, more hotels, a broadcast merger, co-govt constitutional reforms and a few crumbs like wage rises, benefit rises, bland climate reforms, weak workers rights reforms and more and more unaffordable empty box apartments.
Yippie.
Then there's the off touted COVID response , the one praised for not clogging up our healthcare system…. Except…… ambulances are so busy they aren't taking calls heart attacks have 1/4 survival rate, hospitals are chocker full and ambos are just dropping patients to emergency bay and picking which ones get treated and which ones don't…. Boy seems like we just postponed the health crisis by two years and didn't do anything with the two extra years to increase health care capacity.
Thank God for vaccinations because otherwise we really would be upshit creek. Which is a credit to the govt but not increasing capacity is a discredit.
In previous elections labour used to say we'd love to do this or that if only we had a majority. Now we know they what they will do with a majority. Constitutional reforms rather than economic or housing reforms. Yay!
I hope labour wins a third term.
Not because I think they'll do anything, they ruled out anything that would get people excited, I hope labour wins a third term cos national and act would be horrifically bad for many of my friends and families living standards. Labour just won't make it much worse.
But if labour loses I hope it's a nat/nzf /act govt or nat/Maori/act govt cos those two centerist parties would stop act and national reeking too much ruthanasia on the poor.
But if labour loses I hope it's a nat/nzf /act govt or nat/Maori/act govt cos those two centerist parties would stop act and national reeking too much ruthanasia on the poor.
Hope you're right, remembering that Richarsdon was a National party MP, finding her natural home (the Association of Consumers and Taxpayers NZ party, founded by Douglas and Quigley), only after she departed Parliament.
Yes Ross, it is always easier to sit on one side throwing rocks into the kitchen.
Being able to produce change in an unstable world is harder. You did not mention 3 huge problems. Covid War Climate Change.
All we hear from National is "We could do it better and cheaper"
Righto!! Why do you think that would be? You new boss says "He would do the same"
"He would spend the same" So what exactly would change….. Tax cuts?? How did that work for 90% of us???
Oh I gedditt!! You would have a Big Daddy in charge.!! Not a "Girl"
Guess what?? He needs to do more homework. This is not a company There is a big bad world out there having an effect on us. We can't ignore that for political convenience. Most countries are struggling.
Don't forget when Labour were in opposition, they threw plenty of rocks and were going to fix the homeless issue, child poverty etc. and Kiwi build 10k houses a year, fix the state house wait list and hospital wait lists. All oppositions can promise the world as they don't have to deliver.
How is that going now that they have been in government for nearly five years?
"European Parliament lawmakers on Wednesday voted to support an effective EU ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2035, rejecting attempts to weaken the proposal to speed Europe's shift to electric vehicles."
Germany getting people out of their cars. But they’ve got a proper train set.
. Millions of Germans are expected to take advantage of a summer of cheaper travel from next month under government plans to boost public transport use and give financial relief to consumers facing a cost of living crisis.
A €9-a-month ticket scheme is to be introduced from 1 June allowing travel on all modes of city and regional transport. The ticket will apply nationwide and will be available for three months until the end of August.
[…]
The cost of the ticket is a fraction of the normal cost of travel, amounting to around a sixth of the price of the cheapest monthly ticket available for Berlin’s central zones.
Is everyone comfortable that around 20 people are dieing from Covid 19 related illness each day? That' over 100 deaths per week and the way its going looks odds for over 5,000 by years end. The business lobby won and the old, infirm and (probably) poor lost. I'll still vote Labour but when backbone was needed they didn't stand up for their people – it's a sore point for me and whilst I think that overall Covid was handled really well if we get to the next election with 10,000 dead from Covid it will be hard to use the handling of the pandemic as a reason to vote Labour. .
I don't think anyone is "comfortable about it". Certainly still very concerned about the vulnerable around me.
Once omicron was in the country, and everyone that could, or would be, was vaccinated, it is hard to say what else could be done. It is doubtful if enough people would have supported further lockdowns to make them effective. As we could see at the end of the last Auckland lockdown.
Even China's draconian lockdowns are leaking. With pretty dire results in areas with around 60% vaccination rates.
Keeping covid out until we had 95% vaccinated, has saved thousands of lives, compared with countries that didn't reach those levels before opening up.
Interesting interview Jamie McKay had with soil scientist, Doug Edmeades. Some main points:
1- Farmers need to realise urea isn't the best source of nitrogen, clover pasture is. Emades believes growing good clover pasture has become a lost art.
Yeah, but urea gets a hell of a fast result even though much is lost into the atmosphere. And…I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to.
2- Soil does not produce nutrients, so fertiliser is a must. In the 80s when many farmers cut back on fertiliser, those who continued fertilising came out of the then farming slump in a much better position. When you use less fertiliser you need to reduce your stock numbers.
3- Farmers use too much phosphate. That's a problem in NZ. I used bat guano for a few years. The phosphate reading when taken was off the charts. In alternative medicine, excessive phosphate is considered a cause for cancer and other diseases.
Now for the contentious issue – Methane .
Quote:
''Yes, ruminants produce CH4. Yes it is a greenhouse gas. Yes it may be possible to come up with interventions to reduce emissions from the animal.
BUT! Let me explain.
Methane is short-lived in the atmosphere. It hangs around for about 10 years before it is converted to CO2. For every unit of carbon the animal emits as CH4 it must ingest the same amount of carbon from its plant-based feed source, which, remember, comes initially from the CO2 in the atmosphere.
From the animals perspective every bit of carbon it emits as methane it mopped up as carbon in its feed. The animal is both the source of the carbon in methane and it is also the sink for the equivalent amount of carbon in CO2. In this sense the carbon-methane cycle: methane-to-CO2-to-forage-plants-to-animals-to-methane, is a closed cycle.''
Dr Doug Edmeades, MscHons, ONZM (Services to Agriculture), is an independent soil scientist based in Hamilton. He welcomes feedback – doug.edmeades@agknowledge.co.nz
In Vino has replied yesterday to some of these similar points:
''Blade – I read that crap in the local café. Utter baloney – the guy lies about methane, claims a closed system when much of his 'disappearing methane' converts to carbon dioxide, and peddles a load of wishful garbage.
He claims that 'methane is gone in ten years.' If I remember correctly, that approximate figure is its half-life. And what is the point if farmers are replenishing it with a new full amount every year? No mention of methane being up to 60 times worse that CO2 as a heat-retaining gas.''
One-eyed, wishful drivel.
My point here is, and has always been, we don't see enough Edmeades in the media because they have issues with some mainstream narratives on climate change.
Edmeades is a major drag on progress here in New Zealand.
You're such a wag, Blade, waving your ineptly-baited hooks around here on TS. You do get nibbles, but to those watching, you're a subtle as, well, Edmeades himself.
The methane excuse is utter nonsense. The hydroxyl argument is a red herring (note the continued fishing theme). In Vino said,
"One-eyed, wishful drivel."
Pretty fair comment, that.
This, from you:
"I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to."
Classic, though poorly expressed, trolling clap-trap. Red meat stuff. Carelessly expressed though – "anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales" won't in fact, attest that you hate clover pasture.
You might like to drop Edmeades a line yourself:-) and ask him why, if livestock methane is carbon-neutral and nothing to worry about, are farmers and their representatives etc. gleefully accepting the millions of dollars from the Government to research … methane reduction?
I don't usually respond to you, Robert, because I consider you a soundbite karen. But as you have extended yourself let's have looksee.
''Edmeades is a major drag on progress here in New Zealand.''
Based on what? Your ideology?
''You're such a wag, Blade, waving your ineptly-baited hooks around here on TS. You do get nibbles, but to those watching, you're a subtle as, well, Edmeades himself.''
I put this up for debate because it is current in the media; it stops the blog becoming an echo chamber and as I'm continually considered nuts because I don't believe in manmade climate change shouldn't I be able to defend myself? Hooks and nibbles is more to do with your mind set.
"I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to." Classic, though poorly expressed, trolling clap-trap.
In fact it was side comment as to the extreme weight of clover bales. Some can come in at 70-80kgs wet. I can’t see you hacking that work, Robert. Again your unusual mind set on display.
''Red meat stuff.''
We can't have that can we, Robert. Although the world loves our pasture fed red meat.
''You might like to drop Edmeades a line yourself:-) ''
Why don't you drop him a line? When you don't get a reply you may like to ask yourself why?
Sorry, Blade, but you have maxed out again. I think I did a lot more hay-bale lifting that you ever did. Through all my Uni years it was my summer holiday job. 3 of us running one truck plus a loader (good boss back then – we shared driving once every 3 loads of 120 bales, but at the barn we all had to stack like hell..
My one little concession to capitalism: we were paid per bale moved. We were efficient. The few times we saw guys being paid by the hour, they were so slow that we felt nothing but contempt.
So yes – reward productivity.
Clover bales were lovely when properly dried. They hurt your thighs much less! Heavier when wet, and more likely to cook and catch alight if stacked in a barn too wet.
I picked up bales each summer starting 1965 til 1970. I had hoped it would make me a muscleman, but it just made me skinny and wiry with little, bumpy arm muscles. And it made me very fit, but I have slowly worked that off.
Edmeades as I see it does not prove a closed system for farming. His argument that farms absorb as much carbon dioxide as they produce does not counter the carbon dioxide produced as the methane magically disappears. Nor does he seem bothered about the seriously more damaging effect of methane itself.
We need to reduce methane urgently, not rabbit on about theoretically closed systems.. Edmeades appears to be aiding an interested status quo party to my mind.
Great story. I only did two seasons. And yes, I, like you, only put on arm muscle. But I was lean and mean…and bloody fit. I also saw 3 people walk off the job because they couldn't hack it. Lord knows how many would walk off the job nowadays.
Only just got through my first week. Several guys dropped out after a day or so.. Including a police trainee.
Maybe we were still under the effects that the Great Depression had on our parents… There are still plenty of good young guys (Covid has just forced my retirement from Secondary School Relief Teaching) and there are also heaps of tough-looking young guys that would not hack it.
More worrying – there are also disaffected young guys who would put that kind of effort in for a gang, but not for a standard job.
Low wage economy makes hard work a sucker's game nowadays?
And how did we end up with an unproductive, low-wage economy?
I blame Roger Douglas. I heard him say on the radio in early days that we must do all his reforms, but NOT become a low-wage economy.
Every reform he did weakened unions, and promoted a low-wage economy.
A reply will either show him to be incompetent, or it will as Earle Kirton was fond of saying, ''be good night nurse'' for some experts on this thread.
I'm teaching you nothing. Incognito laid down the kaupapa and suggested we follow it. That's what I'm doing and from my perspective KJT isn't.
You also called me a troll. You will need to back that up and show me where I'm trolling. And no, posting articles that aren't kosher from a Leftie perspective is not trolling in my opinion.
The good news for you is if I'm not booted off before hand , I will be gone for good after the next election. This will be no place for a Rightie to ply his trade. So grit ya teeth. Time will fly… and before you know it Luxon will be pontificating on the podium about how National is going to make NZ great again.
This is not the case with methane. The methane-carbon mop is built in. The animal is both the source and the sink – you cannot have one without the other. The animal is CH₄-carbon neutral.
Seems Dr Edmeades' ONZM award (2013) for Services to Agriculture was well-earned.
Increase in atmospheric methane set another record during 2021
[7 April 2022]
NOAA’s preliminary analysis showed the annual increase in atmospheric methane during 2021 was 17 parts per billion (ppb), the largest annual increase recorded since systematic measurements began in 1983. The increase during 2020 was 15.3 ppb. Atmospheric methane levels averaged 1,895.7 ppb during 2021, or around 162% greater than pre-industrial levels. From NOAA’s observations, scientists estimate global methane emissions in 2021 are 15% higher than the 1984-2006 period.
How necessary and feasible are reductions of methane emissions from livestock to support stringent temperature goals? [27 Sept 2021]
Most fundamentally though, none of the mitigation pathways and options discussed in our study will come to pass without targeted policies to address greenhouse gas emissions, reduce the global demand for emissions-intensive livestock products and provide for transitions of those most affected by the necessary transformative changes. The significant potential for the reduction of livestock CH₄ emissions can only be realized if agriculture, and livestock systems in particular, become part of mainstream climate policies, while recognizing their unique and multiple interacting social, cultural and environmental functions.
And what Robert Guyton wrote @8.1. Sand still not bothering you? What’s your secret?
We may have too many cattle beasts but they are not the main cause of increasing atmospheric methane, indeed those studying it are struggling to account for it.
There is a real complex ecosystem there,which is difficult to model,With coastal wetlands they do not produce so much CH4 due to SO2 from the sea (acid rain) from algae.
Poission is right. Wetlands will be the saving of us (those of us who live in regions where wetlands were, pre-agriculture, vast wetlands – put them back)!!
Not ban wetlands; fens, bogs, swamps and mires – make more of them!!
Many more. The benefits are enormous! Food production from wetlands is something that was once well known, but has been forgotten, mainly, til now. Eels, crayfish, mussels and more, not counting plants (watercress etc.
Best thing though, the filtering, cleansing, water-slowing effects of wetlands. Uncounted savings to all regions, subject to flooding.
With a 500b$ foreign liability,and a country that is fiscally restrained destocking of Bovine /ovine biomass needs to be matched by the removal of equivalent human biomass from NZ.
No welfare state,15-20% mortgages,councillors reduced to minimum hourly rate for meetings only,a reduction in MP'S a population of around 1990 or less.
Curbing methane emissions: How five industries can counter a major climate threat [23 Sept 2021]
Companies can take three no-regrets actions to begin reducing methane emissions Action 2: Support sustainable consumption. Stakeholders could develop mechanisms to differentiate assets and score products based on their methane footprints. If every kilogram of rice, million British thermal units (MMBtu) of natural gas, ton of steel, pound of meat, barrel of oil, and ton of coal came with a methane-intensity label, the market signals could support a more orderly decarbonization transition. With this, retailers and consumers could make more informed purchasing decisions, producers could define new foundations for competitive advantage, and investors could better understand portfolio risk.
Or we can support unsustainable consumption – it's a 'free' choice.
New analysis shows microbial sources fueling rise of atmospheric methane [17 June 2021]
The sudden and sustained rise in atmospheric levels of the potent greenhouse gas methane since 2007 has posed one of the most significant and pressing questions in climate research: Where is it coming from?
Fossil fuel emissions? Biological sources? A diminished capacity by the atmosphere to break down methane? A climate tipping point?
…
Lan said the data pointed to microbial sources, such as natural wetlands, shallow lakes and rivers, and human-managed sources like livestock, landfills, rice paddies, and wastewater treatment.
Quantifying fossil fuel methane emissions using observations of atmospheric ethane and an uncertain emission ratio [25 March 2022]
Using the joint methane–ethane inverse model, we estimate annual mean UK methane emissions of approximately 0.27 (95 % uncertainty interval 0.26–0.29) Tg yr−1 from fossil fuel sources and 2.06 (1.99–2.15) Tg yr−1 from non-fossil fuel sources, during the period 2015–2019. https://acp.copernicus.org/articles/22/3911/2022/acp-22-3911-2022.html
The half-life of methane in the atmosphere is around 9.1 years so NO it has not all disappeared in 10 years. Only half of it has converted into CO2 and water vapour – both also GHGs. After another 9.1 years another 1/4 of the original amount will have converted into CO2 and water vapour, and then another 9.1 years later 1/8 and so on. That is how half-lifes work.
My point here is, and has always been, we don't see enough Edmeades in the media because they have issues with some mainstream narratives on climate change.
The main point is that Edmeades represents about 2.5% of scientific opinion on the matter. The jury is well out against him and for good reason. There are numerous papers and reports that show that the Methane cycle is out of balance – largely caused by increased numbers of agricultural livestock. A fair summary is here:
A 2006 UN FAO report reported that livestock generate more greenhouse gases as measured in CO2 equivalents than the entire transportation sector. Livestock accounts for 9 percent of anthropogenic CO2, 65 percent of anthropogenic nitrous oxide and 37 percent of anthropogenic methane. A senior UN official and co-author of the report, Henning Steinfeld, said "Livestock are one of the most significant contributors to today's most serious environmental problems."[63]
Recent NASA research has confirmed the vital role of enteric fermentation in livestock on global warming. "We understand that other greenhouse gases apart from carbon dioxide are important for climate change today," said Gavin Schmidt, the lead author of the study and a researcher at NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York City and Columbia University's Center for Climate Systems Research.[64] Other recent peer reviewed NASA research published in the journal Science has also indicated that the contribution of methane to global warming has been underestimated
''The half-life of methane in the atmosphere is around 9.1 years so NO it has not all disappeared in 10 years. Only half of it has converted into CO2 and water vapour – both also GHGs. After another 9.1 years another 1/4 of the original amount will have converted into CO2 and water vapour, and then another 9.1 years later 1/8 and so on. That is how half-lifes work.''
Could you please provide a link ? That's not how I understand things.
Half-life is defined as the amount of time it takes a given quantity to decrease to half of its initial value. The term is most commonly used in relation to atoms undergoing radioactive decay, but can be used to describe other types of decay, whether exponential or not.
Methane has a large effect but for a relatively brief period, having an estimated mean half-life of 9.1 years in the atmosphere,[21][page needed] whereas carbon dioxide is currently given an estimated mean lifetime of over 100 years.
The globally averaged concentration of methane in Earth's atmosphere increased by about 150% from 722 ± 25 ppb in 1750 to 1803.2 ± 1.2 ppb in 2011.[22] As of 2011, methane contributed radiative forcing of 0.48 ± 0.05 Wm−2,[23] or about 17% of the total radiative forcing from all of the long-lived and globally mixed greenhouse gases.[citation needed] According to NOAA, the atmospheric methane concentration has continued to increase since 2011 to an average global concentration of 1892.2 ppb as of December 2020.[24] The March 2019 peak was 1866.2 ppb, while the April 2020 peak was 1876.0 ppb, a .5% increase.[24]
If the concept of half-life will take you a few days to mull over, how long did it take you to mull over magnetism and paramagnetism? The mind boggles …
"Seabird colonies in New Zealand represent the rich diversity of coastal and pelagic seabirds, and are hotspots of intense nutrient and trace element cycling that provide examples of natural nutrient enrichment in terrestrial and stream ecosystems."
Quote from the first paragraph of the review conclusions.
We are talking high density farming with no biomass accumulation as in a forest.
Talking of fert , I have tried nearly everything. Yet I've narrowed things down to seaweed, lawn clippings and salt. Salt has all the minerals many soils need due to depletion. My crops go crazy.
Could you pass this on to Rob, Weka. Best it comes from you.
farmers can make their crops go crazy in various ways. Or they can ask nature for a helping hand and make their farms live in perpetuity once the fossil fuels and artificial inputs are gone.
Agree 100%. I'm an organic farmer. Although it must be remembered organic farming like vegan diets demands very careful management and in some cases isn't superior to conventional farming ( in my opinion). Beetroots for example have a higher nitrate content when grown conventionally. And that's what health nuts and body builders want – a high nitrate profile.
"Aotearoa New Zealand’s pastoral agriculture has been entirely based on this through the use of grass and clover pastures. Indeed until the expansion of dairying since the 1990s, pastoral and arable farming here used no nitrogen fertilisers – all the nitrogen came from clovers biologically fixing it. This is how organic agriculture that prohibits the use of nitrogen fertilisers works. It is therefore possible to farm without using any nitrogen fertiliser at all, in contrast to lithospheric fertilisers. Yes, compromises have to be made in the production system and there can be profit implications, but, Aotearoa New Zealand farmed for nearly its entire history without nitrogen fertilisers so it is possible to do so again."
I see it as akin to our use of PKE….we waste over a billion a year (IIRC) importing a product that is effectively unnecessary. A lot of our issues can be traced back to the need to service greatly inflated land values that force everyone to maximise every possible skerrick of production to satisfy the bank.
In my forest garden, I've included a wide range of leguminous plants; clovers, vetches, lupines, peas, beans, kakabeak, kowhai, tagasaste, laburnum, gleditsia, etc. to serve as nitrogen-collectors for the benefit of the other plants.
New Zealand farmers will return to plant-generated nitrates for their pastures before too long. Many already have.
I hope the warming environment doesn’t favour weevils.
I'm betting farmers don't choose "the need to service greatly inflated land values that force everyone to maximise every possible skerrick of production to satisfy the bank." either.
Well the capital gains farmers, which appears to be the majority of "farm investors" these days, chose it, in the expectations of high returns on selling the farms.
Like the “house hoarders”, capital gains, not the long term future of farming, is the goal.
In old terms – all up, 10 acres. When I say lawn clippings, that also includes other green matter as well. The place was liberally coated with rock dust about 15 years ago, not so much for the minerals, but for the paramagnetism.
''Unless your lawn is huge. What percentage of your farm is lawn? It would have to be considerable to be able to service 10 acres.''
About one third. Also boundary weeds and leaves etc. Bio Char is interesting. It is self perpetuating. But in some respects has been over sold. How Bio Char was used in the Amazon is still not completely understood.
''If you are using seawater, you'd need a considerable amount to cover 10 acres; how do you collect that much seawater.''
Fair questions. It's not viable for most farmers. Hence ocean solids are mixed with farm water and then spread. This dude in the clip is obviously a hobby farmer like me. Other clips will show how salt in used in bigger operation.
I buy. But for someone like you with plenty of prunings ( I would assume) you could make your own quite easily. Just remember to inoculate it.
"The place was liberally coated with rock dust about 15 years ago"
I didn't realise you are still applying it – why is that? Does your land need a top-up?
I only applied it once as stated above for the paramagnetism. People forget rock dust can take ages to be broke down by bacteria. It is not bio available for a long time. Hence by using salt I am not doubling up on minerals or applying rock dust in a different form each year.
Interesting to hear about your "Viktor Schauberger like tech." for vortexing your water. Those are pretty cool technologies – where did you get yours? What form does it take? It is possible to make your own – is that what you've done. Interesting stuff, Blade. I'd like to hear more!
I see..yes, I still buy it but not for my own use at present. We are soaking dust in water and using it in compost at a rellies place. He likes to grow herbs. I have told him he may be wasting his time with rock dust. He see's thing differently, time will tell. If I'm wrong, I learn something new.
I had mine made. It's a very simple affair. Something like the copper pipe in this link.
But before you doing anything like that. Do this. Buy one. The price is highway robbery. I bought a packet of them for $4, I think, a while back on Ali express. But with postage delay at present, it's better to pay the higher price.
Then you can experiment. Minimum four twists one way, four the other way. Then water a pot plant etc. Better still, drink a cup of the water and if liver isn't clean, or your body needs a clean out, you will be down with flu like symptoms.
Yet I've narrowed things down to seaweed, lawn clippings and salt…
My crops go crazy.
Blade, do you mean NaCl (sodium chloride) salt, or nitrogen, potassium, sulfur, and phosphorus (mineral) salts? Just asking because I would have thought NaCl (sea salt) couldn't be too good for your orange tree.
My small orange tree does alright with a few NPK granules springled along the drip line twice a year. NaCl would be much cheaper. Should I apply sparingly?
Don't want my orange crop to become completely deranged
No, ordinary unrefined sea salt. Trust me ,when I first heard of this I called bs. I was wrong. It's one of the most potent fertilisers I have ever used . See my links.
The ratio is three and a half litres of water to 1 teaspoon of salt, once per month.
Others use way more. Some less. I also sprinkle a handful of salt around a mature tree once a year.
The salt must be unrefined. The minerals in unrefined salt provides a degree of buffering. Refined salt is worthless and will kill your plants. It's not good for human health either. Makes a good weed killer though.
Even though I get great results, I was brought up on the notion salt is a poison for plants. I can't shake that mind conditioning. I still freak out when using salt on my plants. So I suggest you carry on with what you are doing with your orange tree and just use salt on a test plant to put your mind a ease.
Salt water from the sea can be applied directly once a month. Others suggest 1/3 sea water to 2/3 tap water.
It's true some plants are salt sensitive. Your link says that about citrus. But I have never had a problem with the above routines. However, it may be prudent to take a year off now and again.
Good luck. You could use a variety of fertilisers and have all bases covered.
I must warn you, if Doug Edmeades comments on this thread, and sees this he’s going to call me a quack and you a fool. Crikey, the irony.
Quote:
''Analysis of economic detriments. Dr Edmeades estimated the economic detriments as follows: "Assuming a farm (either dairy or sheep/beef) with optimum soil fertility. The science tells us that production will decline by about 5% per annum if the nutrients lost from the farm annually (i.e. in products off the farm, from leaching and runoff of nutrients, and transfer of nutrients to non-productive areas) are not replaced with fertilizer inputs. The important nutrients in this regard are P, K, S and Mg. Probitas when used as recommended contains insignificant amounts of these nutrients and therefore will not maintain the soil nutrient levels against the losses.''
It's not super-duper phosphate, Robert. It was meant to be spread with equal parts Dolomite. Now you know why much of our pastural land is out of kilter.
Not research -practical applications. I understand. It's a little too advanced. And you cannot conceive of me doing such stuff. But Robert, you didn't fool me. Anyone could see you were stringing me along. You don't go from trolling me, to suddenly hanging off my every word.
So why did I waste my time on you? Simple. As a testament to the machination of an Immoral Lefty mindset that knows no limits. A future reference for those asking for proof about the faults of Lefties I supposedly write about.
"As a testament to the machination of an Immoral Lefty mindset that knows no limits. A future reference for those asking for proof about the faults of Lefties I supposedly write about."
Our damned fine Minister of Police, in response to a sarcastic question from little David, as to how she would characterise her comment to bully boy Mercenary Mitchell as 'riding shot-gun with the boys,' she replied as pretty accurate!
Slap down!
Poto is another one of many fine Labour Government ministers.
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The podcast above of the weekly ‘Hoon’ webinar for paying subscribers on Thursday night features co-hosts & talking about the year’s news with: on climate. Her book of the year was Tim Winton’s cli-fi novel Juice and she also mentioned Mike Joy’s memoir The Fight for Fresh Water. ...
The Government can head off to the holidays, entitled to assure itself that it has done more or less what it said it would do. The campaign last year promised to “get New Zealand back on track.” When you look at the basic promises—to trim back Government expenditure, toughen up ...
Open access notables An intensification of surface Earth’s energy imbalance since the late 20th century, Li et al., Communications Earth & Environment:Tracking the energy balance of the Earth system is a key method for studying the contribution of human activities to climate change. However, accurately estimating the surface energy balance ...
Photo by Mauricio Fanfa on UnsplashKia oraCome and join us for our weekly ‘Hoon’ webinar with paying subscribers to The Kākā for an hour at 5 pm today.Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream for our chat about the week’s news with myself , plus regular guests and , ...
“Like you said, I’m an unreconstructed socialist. Everybody deserves to get something for Christmas.”“ONE OF THOSE had better be for me!” Hannah grinned, fascinated, as Laurie made his way, gingerly, to the bar, his arms full of gift-wrapped packages.“Of course!”, beamed Laurie. Depositing his armful on the bar-top and selecting ...
Data released by Statistics New Zealand today showed a significant slowdown in the economy over the past six months, with GDP falling by 1% in September, and 1.1% in June said CTU Economist Craig Renney. “The data shows that the size of the economy in GDP terms is now smaller ...
One last thing before I quitI never wanted any moreThan I could fit into my headI still remember every single word you saidAnd all the shit that somehow came along with itStill, there's one thing that comforts meSince I was always caged and now I'm freeSongwriters: David Grohl / Georg ...
Sparse offerings outside a Te Kauwhata church. Meanwhile, the Government is cutting spending in ways that make thousands of hungry children even hungrier, while also cutting funding for the charities that help them. It’s also doing that while winding back new building of affordable housing that would allow parents to ...
It is difficult to make sense of the Luxon Coalition Government’s economic management.This end-of-year review about the state of economic management – the state of the economy was last week – is not going to cover the National Party contribution. Frankly, like every other careful observer, I cannot make up ...
This morning I awoke to the lovely news that we are firmly back on track, that is if the scale was reversed.NZ ranks low in global economic comparisonsNew Zealand's economy has been ranked 33rd out of 37 in an international comparison of which have done best in 2024.Economies were ranked ...
Remember those silent movies where the heroine is tied to the railway tracks or going over the waterfall in a barrel? Finance Minister Nicola Willis seems intent on portraying herself as that damsel in distress. According to Willis, this country’s current economic problems have all been caused by the spending ...
Similar to the cuts and the austerity drive imposed by Ruth Richardson in the 1990’s, an era which to all intents and purposes we’ve largely fiddled around the edges with fixing in the time since – over, to be fair, several administrations – whilst trying our best it seems to ...
String-Pulling in the Dark: For the democratic process to be meaningful it must also be public. WITH TRUST AND CONFIDENCE in New Zealand’s politicians and journalists steadily declining, restoring those virtues poses a daunting challenge. Just how daunting is made clear by comparing the way politicians and journalists treated New Zealanders ...
Dear Nicola Willis, thank you for letting us know in so many words that the swingeing austerity hasn't worked.By in so many words I mean the bit where you said, Here is a sea of red ink in which we are drowning after twelve months of savage cost cutting and ...
The Open Government Partnership is a multilateral organisation committed to advancing open government. Countries which join are supposed to co-create regular action plans with civil society, committing to making verifiable improvements in transparency, accountability, participation, or technology and innovation for the above. And they're held to account through an Independent ...
Today I tuned into something strange: a press conference that didn’t make my stomach churn or the hairs on the back of my neck stand on end. Which was strange, because it was about the torture of children. It was the announcement by Erica Stanford — on her own, unusually ...
This is a must watch, and puts on brilliant and practical display the implications and mechanics of fast-track law corruption and weakness.CLICK HERE: LINK TO WATCH VIDEOOur news media as it is set up is simply not equipped to deal with the brazen disinformation and corruption under this right wing ...
NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi Acting Secretary Erin Polaczuk is welcoming the announcement from Minister of Workplace Relations and Safety Brooke van Velden that she is opening consultation on engineered stone and is calling on her to listen to the evidence and implement a total ban of the product. “We need ...
The Government has announced a 1.5% increase in the minimum wage from 1 April 2025, well below forecast inflation of 2.5%. Unions have reacted strongly and denounced it as a real terms cut. PSA and the CTU are opposing a new round of staff cuts at WorkSafe, which they say ...
The decision to unilaterally repudiate the contract for new Cook Strait ferries is beginning to look like one of the stupidest decisions a New Zealand government ever made. While cancelling the ferries and their associated port infrastructure may have made this year's books look good, it means higher costs later, ...
Hi there! I’ve been overseas recently, looking after a situation with a family member. So apologies if there any less than focused posts! Vanuatu has just had a significant 7.3 earthquake. Two MFAT staff are unaccounted for with local fatalities.It’s always sad to hear of such things happening.I think of ...
Today is a special member's morning, scheduled to make up for the government's theft of member's days throughout the year. First up was the first reading of Greg Fleming's Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill, which was passed unanimously. Currently the House is debating the third reading of ...
We're going backwardsIgnoring the realitiesGoing backwardsAre you counting all the casualties?We are not there yetWhere we need to beWe are still in debtTo our insanitiesSongwriter: Martin Gore Read more ...
Willis blamed Treasury for changing its productivity assumptions and Labour’s spending increases since Covid for the worsening Budget outlook. Photo: Getty ImagesMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Wednesday, December 18 in The Kākā’s Dawn Chorus podcast above ...
Today the Auckland Transport board meet for the last time this year. For those interested (and with time to spare), you can follow along via this MS Teams link from 10am. I’ve taken a quick look through the agenda items to see what I think the most interesting aspects are. ...
Hi,If you’re a New Zealander — you know who Mike King is. He is the face of New Zealand’s battle against mental health problems. He can be loud and brash. He raises, and is entrusted with, a lot of cash. Last year his “I Am Hope” charity reported a revenue ...
Probably about the only consolation available from yesterday’s unveiling of the Half-Yearly Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) is that it could have been worse. Though Finance Minister Nicola Willis has tightened the screws on future government spending, she has resisted the calls from hard-line academics, fiscal purists and fiscal hawks ...
The right have a stupid saying that is only occasionally true:When is democracy not democracy? When it hasn’t been voted on.While not true in regards to branches of government such as the judiciary, it’s a philosophy that probably should apply to recently-elected local government councillors. Nevertheless, this concept seemed to ...
Long story short: the Government’s austerity policy has driven the economy into a deeper and longer recession that means it will have to borrow $20 billion more over the next four years than it expected just six months ago. Treasury’s latest forecasts show the National-ACT-NZ First Government’s fiscal strategy of ...
Come and join myself and CTU Chief Economist for a pop-up ‘Hoon’ webinar on the Government’s Half Yearly Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) with paying subscribers to The Kākā for 30 minutes at 5 pm today.Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream to watch our chat. Don’t worry if ...
In 1998, in the wake of the Paremoremo Prison riot, the Department of Corrections established the "Behaviour Management Regime". Prisoners were locked in their cells for 22 or 23 hours a day, with no fresh air, no exercise, no social contact, no entertainment, and in some cases no clothes and ...
New data released by the Treasury shows that the economic policies of this Government have made things worse in the year since they took office, said NZCTU Economist Craig Renney. “Our fiscal indicators are all heading in the wrong direction – with higher levels of debt, a higher deficit, and ...
At the 2023 election, National basically ran on a platform of being better economic managers. So how'd that turn out for us? In just one year, they've fucked us for two full political terms: The government's books are set to remain deeply in the red for the near term ...
AUSTERITYText within this block will maintain its original spacing when publishedMy spreadsheet insists This pain leads straight to glory (File not found) Read more ...
The NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi are saying that the Government should do the right thing and deliver minimum wage increases that don’t see workers fall further behind, in response to today’s announcement that the minimum wage will only be increased by 1.5%, well short of forecast inflation. “With inflation forecast ...
Oh, I weptFor daysFilled my eyesWith silly tearsOh, yeaBut I don'tCare no moreI don't care ifMy eyes get soreSongwriters: Paul Rodgers / Paul Kossoff. Read more ...
This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Bob HensonIn this aerial view, fingers of meltwater flow from the melting Isunnguata Sermia glacier descending from the Greenland Ice Sheet on July 11, 2024, near Kangerlussuaq, Greenland. According to the Programme for Monitoring of the Greenland Ice Sheet (PROMICE), the ...
In August, I wrote an article about David Seymour1 with a video of his testimony, to warn that there were grave dangers to his Ministry of Regulation:David Seymour's Ministry of Slush Hides Far Greater RisksWhy Seymour's exorbitant waste of taxpayers' money could be the least of concernThe money for Seymour ...
Willis is expected to have to reveal the bitter fiscal fruits of her austerity strategy in the HYEFU later today. Photo: Lynn Grieveson/TheKakaMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Tuesday, December 17 in The Kākā’s Dawn Chorus podcast ...
On Friday the government announced it would double the number of toll roads in New Zealand as well as make a few other changes to how toll roads are used in the country. The real issue though is not that tolling is being used but the suggestion it will make ...
The Prime Minister yesterday engaged in what looked like a pre-emptive strike designed to counter what is likely to be a series of depressing economic statistics expected before the end of the week. He opened his weekly post-Cabinet press conference with a recitation of the Government’s achievements. “It certainly has ...
This whooping cough story from south Auckland is a good example of the coalition government’s approach to social need – spend money on urging people to get vaccinated but only after you’ve cut the funding to where they could get vaccinated. This has been the case all year with public ...
And if there is a GodI know he likes to rockHe likes his loud guitarsHis spiders from MarsAnd if there is a GodI know he's watching meHe likes what he seesBut there's trouble on the breezeSongwriter: William Patrick Corgan Read more ...
Here’s a quick round up of today’s political news:1. MORE FOOD BANKS, CHARITIES, DOMESTIC VIOLENCE SHELTERS AND YOUTH SOCIAL SERVICES SET TO CLOSE OR SCALE BACK AROUND THE COUNTRY AS GOVT CUTS FUNDINGSome of Auckland's largest foodbanks are warning they may need to close or significantly reduce food parcels after ...
Iain Rennie, CNZMSecretary and Chief Executive to the TreasuryDear Secretary, Undue restrictions on restricted briefings This week, the Treasury barred representatives from four organisations, including the New Zealand Council of Trade Unions Te Kauae Kaimahi, from attending the restricted briefing for the Half-Year Economic and Fiscal Update. We had been ...
This is a guest post by Tim Adriaansen, a community, climate, and accessibility advocate.I won’t shut up about climate breakdown, and whenever possible I try to shift the focus of a climate conversation towards solutions. But you’ll almost never hear me give more than a passing nod to ...
A grassroots backlash has forced a backdown from Brown, but he is still eyeing up plenty of tolls for other new roads. And the pressure is on Willis to ramp up the Government’s austerity strategy. Photo: Getty ImagesMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy ...
Hi all,I'm pretty overwhelmed by all your messages and emails today; thank you so very much.As much as my newsletter this morning was about money, and we all need to earn money, it was mostly about world domination if I'm honest. 😉I really hate what’s happening to our country, and ...
A listing of 23 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, December 8, 2024 thru Sat, December 14, 2024. Listing by Category Like last week's summary this one contains the list of articles twice: based on categories and based on ...
I started writing this morning about Hobson’s Pledge, examining the claims they and their supporters make, basically ripping into them. But I kept getting notifications coming through, and not good ones.Each time I looked up, there was another un-subscription message, and I felt a bit sicker at the thought of ...
Once, long before there was Harry and Meghan and Dodi and all those episodes of The Crown, they came to spend some time with us, Charles and Diana. Was there anyone in the world more glamorous than the Princess of Wales?Dazzled as everyone was by their company, the leader of ...
The collective right have a problem.The entire foundation for their world view is antiscientific. Their preferred economic strategies have been disproven. Their whole neoliberal model faces accusations of corporate corruption and worsening inequality. Climate change not only definitely exists, its rapid progression demands an immediate and expensive response in order ...
National has only been in power for a year, but everywhere you look, its choices are taking New Zealand a long way backwards. In no particular order, here are the National Government's Top 50 Greatest Misses of its first year in power. ...
The Government is quietly undertaking consultation on the dangerous Regulatory Standards Bill over the Christmas period to avoid too much attention. ...
The Government’s planned changes to the freedom of speech obligations of universities is little more than a front for stoking the political fires of disinformation and fear, placing teachers and students in the crosshairs. ...
The Ministry of Regulation’s report into Early Childhood Education (ECE) in Aotearoa raises serious concerns about the possibility of lowering qualification requirements, undermining quality and risking worse outcomes for tamariki, whānau, and kaiako. ...
A Bill to modernise the role of Justices of the Peace (JP), ensuring they remain active in their communities and connected with other JPs, has been put into the ballot. ...
Labour will continue to fight unsustainable and destructive projects that are able to leap-frog environment protection under National’s Fast-track Approvals Bill. ...
The Green Party has warned that a Green Government will revoke the consents of companies who override environmental protections as part of Fast-Track legislation being passed today. ...
The Green Party says the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update shows how the Government is failing to address the massive social and infrastructure deficits our country faces. ...
The Government’s latest move to reduce the earnings of migrant workers will not only hurt migrants but it will drive down the wages of Kiwi workers. ...
Te Pāti Māori has this morning issued a stern warning to Fast-Track applicants with interests in mining, pledging to hold them accountable through retrospective liability and to immediately revoke Fast-Track consents under a future Te Pāti Māori government. This warning comes ahead of today’s third reading of the Fast-Track Approvals ...
The Government’s announcement today of a 1.5 per cent increase to minimum wage is another blow for workers, with inflation projected to exceed the increase, meaning it’s a real terms pay reduction for many. ...
All the Government has achieved from its announcement today is to continue to push responsibility back on councils for its own lack of action to help bring down skyrocketing rates. ...
The Government has used its final post-Cabinet press conference of the year to punch down on local government without offering any credible solutions to the issues our councils are facing. ...
The Government has failed to keep its promise to ‘super charge’ the EV network, delivering just 292 chargers - less than half of the 670 chargers needed to meet its target. ...
The Green Party is calling for the Government to stop subsidising the largest user of the country’s gas supplies, Methanex, following a report highlighting the multi-national’s disproportionate influence on energy prices in Aotearoa. ...
The Green Party is appalled with the Government’s new child poverty targets that are based on a new ‘persistent poverty’ measure that could be met even with an increase in child poverty. ...
New independent analysis has revealed that the Government’s Emissions Reduction Plan (ERP) will reduce emissions by a measly 1 per cent by 2030, failing to set us up for the future and meeting upcoming targets. ...
The loss of 27 kaimahi at Whakaata Māori and the end of its daily news bulletin is a sad day for Māori media and another step backwards for Te Tiriti o Waitangi justice. ...
Yesterday the Government passed cruel legislation through first reading to establish a new beneficiary sanction regime that will ultimately mean more households cannot afford the basic essentials. ...
Today's passing of the Government's Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill–which allows landlords to end tenancies with no reason–ignores the voice of the people and leaves renters in limbo ahead of the festive season. ...
After wasting a year, Nicola Willis has delivered a worse deal for the Cook Strait ferries that will end up being more expensive and take longer to arrive. ...
Green Party co-leader Chlöe Swarbrick has today launched a Member’s Bill to sanction Israel for its unlawful presence in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, as the All Out For Gaza rally reaches Parliament. ...
After years of advocacy, the Green Party is very happy to hear the Government has listened to our collective voices and announced the closure of the greyhound racing industry, by 1 August 2026. ...
In response to a new report from ERO, the Government has acknowledged the urgent need for consistency across the curriculum for Relationship and Sexuality Education (RSE) in schools. ...
The Green Party is appalled at the Government introducing legislation that will make it easier to penalise workers fighting for better pay and conditions. ...
Thank you for the invitation to speak with you tonight on behalf of the political party I belong to - which is New Zealand First. As we have heard before this evening the Kinleith Mill is proposing to reduce operations by focusing on pulp and discontinuing “lossmaking paper production”. They say that they are currently consulting on the plan to permanently shut ...
Auckland Central MP, Chlöe Swarbrick, has written to Mayor Wayne Brown requesting he stop the unnecessary delays on St James Theatre’s restoration. ...
Kiwis planning a swim or heading out on a boat this summer should remember to stop and think about water safety, Sport & Recreation Minister Chris Bishop and ACC and Associate Transport Minister Matt Doocey say. “New Zealand’s beaches, lakes and rivers are some of the most beautiful in the ...
The Government is urging Kiwis to drive safely this summer and reminding motorists that Police will be out in force to enforce the road rules, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“This time of year can be stressful and result in poor decision-making on our roads. Whether you are travelling to see ...
Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says Health New Zealand will move swiftly to support dozens of internationally-trained doctors already in New Zealand on their journey to employment here, after a tripling of sought-after examination places. “The Medical Council has delivered great news for hardworking overseas doctors who want to contribute ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has appointed Sarah Ottrey to the APEC Business Advisory Council (ABAC). “At my first APEC Summit in Lima, I experienced firsthand the role that ABAC plays in guaranteeing political leaders hear the voice of business,” Mr Luxon says. “New Zealand’s ABAC representatives are very well respected and ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has announced four appointments to New Zealand’s intelligence oversight functions. The Honourable Robert Dobson KC has been appointed Chief Commissioner of Intelligence Warrants, and the Honourable Brendan Brown KC has been appointed as a Commissioner of Intelligence Warrants. The appointments of Hon Robert Dobson and Hon ...
Improvements in the average time it takes to process survey and title applications means housing developments can progress more quickly, Minister for Land Information Chris Penk says. “The government is resolutely focused on improving the building and construction pipeline,” Mr Penk says. “Applications to issue titles and subdivide land are ...
The Government’s measures to reduce airport wait times, and better transparency around flight disruptions is delivering encouraging early results for passengers ahead of the busy summer period, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Improving the efficiency of air travel is a priority for the Government to give passengers a smoother, more reliable ...
The Government today announced the intended closure of the Apollo Hotel as Contracted Emergency Housing (CEH) in Rotorua, Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka says. This follows a 30 per cent reduction in the number of households in CEH in Rotorua since National came into Government. “Our focus is on ending CEH in the Whakarewarewa area starting ...
The Government will reshape vocational education and training to return decision making to regions and enable greater industry input into work-based learning Tertiary Education and Skills Minister, Penny Simmonds says. “The redesigned system will better meet the needs of learners, industry, and the economy. It includes re-establishing regional polytechnics that ...
The Government is taking action to better manage synthetic refrigerants and reduce emissions caused by greenhouse gases found in heating and cooling products, Environment Minister Penny Simmonds says. “Regulations will be drafted to support a product stewardship scheme for synthetic refrigerants, Ms. Simmonds says. “Synthetic refrigerants are found in a ...
People travelling on State Highway 1 north of Hamilton will be relieved that remedial works and safety improvements on the Ngāruawāhia section of the Waikato Expressway were finished today, with all lanes now open to traffic, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“I would like to acknowledge the patience of road users ...
Tertiary Education and Skills Minister, Penny Simmonds, has announced a new appointment to the board of Education New Zealand (ENZ). Dr Erik Lithander has been appointed as a new member of the ENZ board for a three-year term until 30 January 2028. “I would like to welcome Dr Erik Lithander to the ...
The Government will have senior representatives at Waitangi Day events around the country, including at the Waitangi Treaty Grounds, but next year Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has chosen to take part in celebrations elsewhere. “It has always been my intention to celebrate Waitangi Day around the country with different ...
Two more criminal gangs will be subject to the raft of laws passed by the Coalition Government that give Police more powers to disrupt gang activity, and the intimidation they impose in our communities, Police Minister Mark Mitchell says. Following an Order passed by Cabinet, from 3 February 2025 the ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Justice Christian Whata as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Whata’s appointment as a Judge of the Court of Appeal will take effect on 1 August 2025 and fill a vacancy created by the retirement of Hon Justice David Goddard on ...
The latest economic figures highlight the importance of the steps the Government has taken to restore respect for taxpayers’ money and drive economic growth, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. Data released today by Stats NZ shows Gross Domestic Product fell 1 per cent in the September quarter. “Treasury and most ...
Tertiary Education and Skills Minister Penny Simmonds and Associate Minister of Education David Seymour today announced legislation changes to strengthen freedom of speech obligations on universities. “Freedom of speech is fundamental to the concept of academic freedom and there is concern that universities seem to be taking a more risk-averse ...
Police Minister, Mark Mitchell, and Internal Affairs Minister, Brooke van Velden, today launched a further Public Safety Network cellular service that alongside last year’s Cellular Roaming roll-out, puts globally-leading cellular communications capability into the hands of our emergency responders. The Public Safety Network’s new Cellular Priority service means Police, Wellington ...
State Highway 1 through the Mangamuka Gorge has officially reopened today, providing a critical link for Northlanders and offering much-needed relief ahead of the busy summer period, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“The Mangamuka Gorge is a vital route for Northland, carrying around 1,300 vehicles per day and connecting the Far ...
The Government has welcomed decisions by the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) and Ashburton District Council confirming funding to boost resilience in the Canterbury region, with construction on a second Ashburton Bridge expected to begin in 2026, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Delivering a second Ashburton Bridge to improve resilience and ...
The Government is backing the response into high pathogenic avian influenza (HPAI) in Otago, Biosecurity Minister Andrew Hoggard says. “Cabinet has approved new funding of $20 million to enable MPI to meet unbudgeted ongoing expenses associated with the H7N6 response including rigorous scientific testing of samples at the enhanced PC3 ...
Legislation that will repeal all advertising restrictions for broadcasters on Sundays and public holidays has passed through first reading in Parliament today, Media Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “As a growing share of audiences get their news and entertainment from streaming services, these restrictions have become increasingly redundant. New Zealand on ...
Today the House agreed to Brendan Horsley being appointed Inspector-General of Defence, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “Mr Horsley’s experience will be invaluable in overseeing the establishment of the new office and its support networks. “He is currently Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, having held that role since June 2020. ...
Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says the Government has agreed to the final regulations for the levy on insurance contracts that will fund Fire and Emergency New Zealand from July 2026. “Earlier this year the Government agreed to a 2.2 percent increase to the rate of levy. Fire ...
The Government is delivering regulatory relief for New Zealand businesses through changes to the Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financing of Terrorism Act. “The Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financing of Terrorism Amendment Bill, which was introduced today, is the second Bill – the other being the Statutes Amendment Bill - that ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed further progress on the Hawke’s Bay Expressway Road of National Significance (RoNS), with the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) Board approving funding for the detailed design of Stage 1, paving the way for main works construction to begin in late 2025.“The Government is moving at ...
The Government today released a request for information (RFI) to seeking interest in partnerships to plant trees on Crown-owned land with low farming and conservation value (excluding National Parks) Forestry Minister Todd McClay announced. “Planting trees on Crown-owned land will drive economic growth by creating more forestry jobs in our regions, providing more wood ...
Court timeliness, access to justice, and improving the quality of existing regulation are the focus of a series of law changes introduced to Parliament today by Associate Minister of Justice Nicole McKee. The three Bills in the Regulatory Systems (Justice) Amendment Bill package each improve a different part of the ...
A total of 41 appointments and reappointments have been made to the 12 community trusts around New Zealand that serve their regions, Associate Finance Minister Shane Jones says. “These trusts, and the communities they serve from the Far North to the deep south, will benefit from the rich experience, knowledge, ...
The Government has confirmed how it will provide redress to survivors who were tortured at the Lake Alice Psychiatric Hospital Child and Adolescent Unit (the Lake Alice Unit). “The Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care found that many of the 362 children who went through the Lake Alice Unit between 1972 and ...
It has been a busy, productive year in the House as the coalition Government works hard to get New Zealand back on track, Leader of the House Chris Bishop says. “This Government promised to rebuild the economy, restore law and order and reduce the cost of living. Our record this ...
“Accelerated silicosis is an emerging occupational disease caused by unsafe work such as engineered stone benchtops. I am running a standalone consultation on engineered stone to understand what the industry is currently doing to manage the risks, and whether further regulatory intervention is needed,” says Workplace Relations and Safety Minister ...
Mehemea he pai mō te tangata, mahia – if it’s good for the people, get on with it. Enhanced reporting on the public sector’s delivery of Treaty settlement commitments will help improve outcomes for Māori and all New Zealanders, Māori Crown Relations Minister Tama Potaka says. Compiled together for the ...
Mr Roger Holmes Miller and Ms Tarita Hutchinson have been appointed to the Charities Registration Board, Community and Voluntary Sector Minister Louise Upston says. “I would like to welcome the new members joining the Charities Registration Board. “The appointment of Ms Hutchinson and Mr Miller will strengthen the Board’s capacity ...
More building consent and code compliance applications are being processed within the statutory timeframe since the Government required councils to submit quarterly data, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “In the midst of a housing shortage we need to look at every step of the build process for efficiencies ...
Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey is proud to announce the first three recipients of the Government’s $10 million Mental Health and Addiction Community Sector Innovation Fund which will enable more Kiwis faster access to mental health and addiction support. “This fund is part of the Government’s commitment to investing in ...
New Zealand is providing Vanuatu assistance following yesterday's devastating earthquake, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. "Vanuatu is a member of our Pacific family and we are supporting it in this time of acute need," Mr Peters says. "Our thoughts are with the people of Vanuatu, and we will be ...
The Government welcomes the Commerce Commission’s plan to reduce card fees for Kiwis by an estimated $260 million a year, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says.“The Government is relentlessly focused on reducing the cost of living, so Kiwis can keep more of their hard-earned income and live a ...
Regulation Minister David Seymour has welcomed the Early Childhood Education (ECE) regulatory review report, the first major report from the Ministry for Regulation. The report makes 15 recommendations to modernise and simplify regulations across ECE so services can get on with what they do best – providing safe, high-quality care ...
The Government‘s Offshore Renewable Energy Bill to create a new regulatory regime that will enable firms to construct offshore wind generation has passed its first reading in Parliament, Energy Minister Simeon Brown says.“New Zealand currently does not have a regulatory regime for offshore renewable energy as the previous government failed ...
Kick Back has growing concerns about the impact that denying young people access to shelter is having on the mental health and physical safety of the young people we serve. ...
By Litia Cava, FBC News multimedia journalist Fiji Prime Minister Sitiveni Rabuka has revealed how arms and ammunition used to conduct the 1987 military coup were secretly brought into Fiji on board a naval survey ship. Speaking at the commissioning of a new research vessel for the Lands and Mineral ...
Youth advocates are worried tighter rules for emergency housing could lead to someone dying due to the impacts on mental health and physical safety for those denied shelter. ...
“We urge the Health Select Committee to extend the date for submissions,” concluded Rev Bush. “There is too much at stake to leave the outcome of this review only in the hands of politicians or those with vested interests.” ...
A separate passport, citizenship and membership of the United Nations are only available to fully independent nations, Winston Peters' office says. ...
By Emma Andrews, Henare te Ua Māori Journalism Intern at RNZ News The New Zealand fuel company Z Energy is swapping out street names for “correct” kupu on service stops around the country, with the help of local hapū. When Z took over 226 fuel sites from Shell in 2010, ...
Summer reissue: Was it a false measurement, a full-blown conspiracy or just some mild incompetence? Mad Chapman uncovers the truth of Maddi Wesche’s final throw. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julie Old, Associate Professor, Biology, Zoology, Animal Science, Western Sydney University Dmitry Chulov, Shutterstock At this time of year, images of reindeer are everywhere. I’ve had a soft spot for reindeer ever since I was a little girl. Doesn’t everyone? ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Grozdana Manalo, Career Services Manager (Education), University of Sydney hedgehog94/Shutterstock Getting casual work over summer, or a part-time job that you might continue once your tertiary course starts, can be a great way to get workplace experience and earn some extra ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ty Ferguson, Research associate in exercise, nutrition and activity, University of South Australia Peera_Stockfoto/Shutterstock It’s never been easier to stay connected to work. Even when we’re on leave, our phones and laptops keep us tethered. Many of us promise ourselves we ...
The NZ Media Council upheld the complaint under principle four: comment and fact On 5 September 2024, The Spinoff published a brief article titled Made in Palestine, found in 1970s Hastings, which highlighted an upcoming art exhibition featuring photographs of vintage cosmetic products labelled “Made in Palestine.” The piece, described ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kasey Symons, Lecturer of Communication, Sports Media, Deakin University We are well and truly in cricket season. The Australian men’s cricket team is taking centre stage against India in the Border Gavaskar Trophy series while the Big Bash League is underway, as ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Andrew Woods, Lecturer, Nursing, Faculty of Health, Southern Cross University FTiare/Shutterstock Summer is here and for many that means going to the beach. You grab your swimmers, beach towel and sunscreen then maybe check the weather forecast. Did you think to ...
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Gutten Tag from Austria.
No masks, no mandates' life is normal in Europe. Weather is warm.
Things are cheap as compared to NZ.
[No follow-up response received to Mod notes; take the 2 weeks off and enjoy your trip – Incognito]
Mod note
Coming to a town near you.
"For the next four months, a doctor will be available just three days a week at the medical centre, instead of five, and many of those consultations will be by video, not in person."
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/cuts-to-gp-service-alarm-west-coast-town
The NZ growth in video doctor consults is massive. Do it from your bed!
Death bed?
*wry smile
I would have thought teleconsults could be done from Chch too, so it's not entirely clear what is happening here.
Best way I can think of to get a GP to live in that area would be to gift them some land with a decent house on it.
The problem is that if you have "a" GP they never get time off. They are on call 24 hours of every day and holidays become almost impossible to arrange. It would need more than providing a house to overcome that problem.
At least a doctor who works in a big city Medical Centre can take holidays.
Reported my + covid result yesterday afternoon. My GP called me on my mobile last night to ensure I was ok, stocked up with medication and supplies, and to ensure I knew the signs of significant problems. Offered a loan of a pulse oximeter, they have 15 for loaning out, but my daughter had bought me one (and a body temp sensor) about 6 months back.
I don't think you'd get better service from a GP than that.
Do you know what a locum is?
Well yes, I do know what a locum is.
I don't understand your question though in terms of your original comment. When you said "a GP to live in that area would be to gift them some land with a decent house on it." I assumed you meant a permanent resident, not a locum. Were you suggesting a house for a locum would be an incentive?
If, on the other hand, you were suggesting that the permanent doctor could get a locum so they could take a holiday I don't see how they could do it. If the DHB can't find locums how is an individual doctor going to do any better?
The DHB can find locums, just not enough in the current system. Who do you think does the three days a week currently? Having a permanent GP would change things a lot, then bring in locums as the GP needs to go on holiday, have breaks etc. It's not an all or nothing.
From the link,
Perhaps two GPs – one full-time and one who wants to reduce workload and willing to work part-time and be on call.
My late father did a locum for a rural GP in the mid 1950's. He was advised that many of the locals had not yet grasped the principles of a cash economy. He got the GMS benefit for everyone he saw, but the rest was very much "in kind". Fortunately my mother was raised on a farm and her father was a butcher so being confronted with large lumps of recently demised animal or bird (often complete with shotgun pellets) did not worry her. She could also pluck and dress a chicken. We were particularly happy if someone had been over to the coast and we got fresh or smoked fish or crayfish. When there was not produce it was "mow your lawn Doc?" or "clean your car Doc?". We certainly ate well and his tax return was very good that year,
Might work for a couple who are both GPs? But assuming they have accommodation for locums, I was thinking a freehold house would be the kind of incentive for someone to make the move permanently.
Yes, I agree.
But was thinking a family home with a separate apartment would work.
Buy two houses and then they have more choice.
$350,000 – $400,000 each. Wonder how much the DHB is spending on travel and accommodation now.
True. I was thinking for attracting young people sometimes low maintenance is attractive. So is extra income option with Air B n B.
"Chair Lisa Neil says the absence of a GP will load more work on to the minimal nursing staff at the medical centre.
“We have a vulnerable elderly community here and the nurses are already under pressure dealing with Covid in the community.”
Cutting services at a time when Reefton people are in the thick of the epidemic and under stress from spiralling living costs is a bad idea, Neil says.
“It’s a real blow. People are reluctant to front up [with depression] as it is, and if you’re dealing with an intimate problem, elderly people especially won’t be comfortable talking to a TV screen and having an extra person in there with them as well.”
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/cuts-to-gp-service-alarm-west-coast-town
Who needs a face to face with a GP anyway…..hopefully nobody.
Whatever it is, they're against it!
The co-founders of Groundswell admit they have not read the three waters legislation they are so vehemently against.
[…]
Groundswell co-founders Laurie Paterson and Bryce McKenzie also said they haven't read the proposed legislation. Paterson says, nonetheless, they're opposed to what's on the table.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018845171/groundswell-co-founders-haven-t-read-bill-they-re-vehemently-against
Yup, same attitude and response from ‘critics’ of Three Waters roaming free here on TS. They refuse to engage with the proposals, they choose to close off their minds, and they self-justify this by pointing at all sorts of things being thrown around in the MSM and by the opposition parties, i.e. pointing at ‘hidden agendas’, alleged ‘secrecy’ and ‘dishonesty’, ‘stealth’, et cetera. They will never have to find out how good or bad the reforms might be (very bad, of course) and they simply stick their fingers in their ears. But at the end of the day it is always the same as from the outset: prejudice, pure & perfect prejudice. However, never say this to those people because they’ll flip their lid in a fit of incongruence rage.
Co-governance is a thorny one. Take the Canterbury Regional Council (Ngāi Tahu Representation Bill) currently going through parliament. To my mind Ngāi Tahu getting to appoint two representatives to an elected board is undemocratic.
But of course, the same people vigorously race baiting over this co-governance arrangement were more than happy in 2010 when National dumped the elected councillors and replaced them with commissioners to enable the pillaging and theft of Canterbury's water resources on behalf of corporate dairy interests.
So the opposition to Ngāi Tahu getting two representatives isn't so much a principled defense of democracy as being aggrieved the wrong people are getting a nice salary for life.
Personally, I strongly doubt the Ngāi Tahu representatives will prove to be any better guardians of the waters of Canterbury than some entitled cocky whose family arrived on the Charlotte Jane in 1850. The squabble is really over which bunch of entitled twots get to make money out of the commons that is water. To that extent, I oppose co-governance – to my mind, greed is colour and race blind and the only way to really keep an eye on these wannabe rentiers for life and keep them in check is full participatory democracy.
Labour just sacked the democratically elected DHBs /shrug.
Bit of a difference between an entity being disestablished and the board being sacked while the entity continues operating.
sacking was a reference to when National sacked the elected members of the Area Health Boards in the early 90s.
Ngai Tahu are one of (if not) the biggest owners of dairy farms in Canterbury. If any other sector were given 2 seats on ECAN it would be called a Conflict of Interest.
If you’re referring to royalties, I’ve seen arguments these could have advantages over the non-pricing structure currently in place for drinking water. I fail to see, at present, that this is a get-rich-quick scheme for anybody, but greed is not in my nature.
The only consistent prejudice I see on display here is the one that says anything to do with white people is to be discounted, deplored and derided at every opportunity.
According to Witi Ihimaera it is a Maori Universe after all.
Do we have to take the my dad's better than your dad plagiarist, or anything he writes, seriously?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/reviewer-claims-more-plagiarism-in-ihimaera-novel/4I62ATPIUE5GXEVO3757AR3JYM/
I’ve long given up on the idea that one size fits all.
Two things frighten them. Anything that eats into profit, and anything that gives Maori any say in the environment.
It’s amusing that a farmer from Gore has taken a position opposing the 3 Waters reforms.
Gore has a combined sewage / stormwater system. A throwback from the 19th century and rather expensive to fix. It’s also got a shrinking ratepayer (dying) ratepayer base. Without the socialisation of costs that 3 Waters will bring Gore will probably cease to exist as the rates required will be unsustainable.
A combined sewer-stormwater system is a modern septic outrage.
WTF is that Council doing?
Auckland Council's Stormwater team and Watercare only finished separating out flows from the whole of the Ponsonby-Herne Bay-Freemans Bay-Wynyard Quarter catchment last year. Including a 3.3metre diameter stormwater line 600 metres long.
They still have 2 years to go doing the Central Interceptor project that separates most of the previously joined system. That's over $1b of work in that one alone.
Well they’ve got a seriously good Art Gallery… But they are thinking about it and I think they will start in a few years, it’ll probably take 20 years at what they can afford. If there’s a poster child for 3 Water it’s Gore Anywhere else would have been amalgamated three reforms ago
But as you’ve pointed out Auckland isn’t too flash in this regard, and at a much larger and more public scale. This gets hard to fix and most TAs don’t have Aucklands scale and resources
After the 1990's nact inflicted disasters that beset the city Whanganui was unable to afford a ten year waste water separation scheme. But we did.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/whanganui-chronicle/news/stormwater-separation-129-houses-from-completion/UXGZEVBHTCGMXEFBCNAGVYD6M4/?c_id=1503426&objectid=11011217
apart from the financial forecast, what problems does Gore have with its drinking water, greywater and sewerage?
In much / most of Gore and Mataura there is only one pipe for sewage and stormwater. When it rains the lot goes into the shit ponds which discharge into the river. Hasn’t been ideal practice since about 1900.
My reckons is there is no further polling damage 3-Waters can do to the government. The legislation will be implemented without fuss. But it will take over a decade to notice much difference.
The really big difference is the state fresh water regulator enforcing the National Fresh Water Drinking Standards, upon water systems from lazy shitty little farmer-owned councils who didn't give a damn for decades.
My only reservations about three waters is water governance is being consolidated into a nice ripe target for privatisation by a future National government (which will inevitably involve a grubby little cronyist deal with corporate Iwi that'll entrench rentier lifestyles for all those lucky enough to be at the table when the divvy up is done) and a real sadness that it signals a complete and utter failure of local democracy.
I would have preferred the government had spent a few hundred million on a local democracy revival project before declaring them all incompetent.
I can't think of a single Wellington bureaucrat who would support strengthening local government.
They've gutted them ever deper since 1989.
and then they wonder why there is resistance.
The fresh water regulator is a positive step.
"My reckons is there is no further polling damage 3-Waters can do to the government."
I respectfully disagree. There are tens of thousands of people invested in privately owned rural schemes (plus the people in the hundred or so rural council owned schemes) who will suddenly find the schemes they have paid for they no longer control. There is the ongoing and deep set resentment across local government towards central government at the perceived loss of control over ratepayers assets. and at the way the process has been undertaken. And then there's the commitment of both National and Act to overturn the entire structure.
"But it will take over a decade to notice much difference."
Certainly there will be no benefit before the next election, and that is a huge problem, because over the next year the media will be full of reports of the cost of establishing the entities. This is a big play by Labour, and it will be interesting to see how the politics plays out.
I'm sure there are indeed several thousand on private water systems, but seriously Labour never had them to start with.
There will certainly be structural setup stories, but the river pollution stories are going to get bigger and bigger.
"I'm sure there are indeed several thousand on private water systems, but seriously Labour never had them to start with."
I have a friend who lives on a lifestyle block near Masterton. He's one of the many rural people who is part of a private scheme, and he voted for Labour in Wairarapa in 2020, along with significant others that saw the seat go red. He's one of many that will vote blue in 2023 due significantly because of 3Waters. That will play out across provincial NZ, IMHO.
When I was in a private developers scheme, I heaved a sigh of relief when the local council took over that ongoing liability, even though it cost a considerable sum at the time, to get the scheme connected to the public one.
Many of the smaller council's in particular, should be relieved that the costs will now be shared over a much wider area.
Would you be as equally relieved if the water authority determined your scheme was no longer viable?
They did, down the track, and rebuilt it into a new reticulation and treatment scheme.
and reduced your rates 80% at the same time?
No. Rates over the whole town went up a little to pay off the new scheme.
Much cheaper than we would have had to pay in annual levies for the private scheme,which only served about a hundred odd houses.
Economies of scale. Eh?
Or cross subsidy.
Economies of scale set against increased bureaucracy, larger and disparate areas of activity, promised improvement of both delivery and standard and thousands more employed.
Something dosnt add up.
Simply that the cost and efficiency of the water and waste water plants per user, improved, when going from about a hundred houses, in the private scheme, to being shared amongst over 8000.
"No. Rates over the whole town went up a little to pay off the new scheme."
Originally there was no water or sewage plant, except for the development.
Which of course was paid for by buyers, including myself, in the subdivision.
We would have had to pay all the ongoing costs ourselves of the rather expensive to run water and wastewater scheme split amongst a hundred households.
Noting that unit costs drop as plant gets bigger.
The rest of the town was on tank and septic tank.
Later the rest of the town was reticulated to the extended private scheme. Both water and wastewater supply.
Further down the track this was inadequate, as the town grew, and a new scheme was built. Every section paid a levy for the new scheme and ongoing running costs became part of rates.
Much cheaper per household than the original scheme. And saving a nice bit of coast from leaking septic tanks.
You are using terms you apparently dont understand….yes your (future) personal expense was reduced because it was met by a larger group whos future expense was increased…this is contrary to both what is promised by 3 Waters and economy of scale.
No. You fail to understand.
Their future expense went down.
No more maintaining septic tanks.
As did mine.
Economies of scale.
Again
"No. Rates over the whole town went up a little to pay off the new scheme."
Rates which are less than the ongoing costs per household, if the scheme wasn't done.
Originally non reticulated households, also benifited from the initial work and plant built and paid for by the houses in the private scheme, so if there was any cross subsidy, it was from those of us who paid for the private scheme at the start.
Everyone gained from the new scheme. At reduced ongoing cost per household.
@pat, we had a similar situation in our rural community.
However, in this case the local government solution was to require the developer to provide a considerably bigger upgrade for wastewater treatment than his resource consent number of properties warranted.
Once in place, other rural land was rezoned, and the council charged those developments to connect to the now upgraded system.
Other rural land in the area with Grade I soil, has followed with residential zoning, partly justified by the access to the waste water system which retains excess capacity.
A particularly pernicious way of rezoning rural land. In this case there are other factors that make this rezoning not as bad a full greenfields development but it does indicate the lack of transparency.
@ Molly.
I have no idea what is grade 1 soil but guess it is productive(?)
However designated land use is imo likely the only effective way of addressing the multitude of issues we face though it would need to be considered in a holistic manner…and it would be deeply unpopular.
When it comes to water infrastructure the problems and solutions remain the same regardless of governance form, management style or political persuasion.
@pat. Yes, Class I soils are productive. There are/were issues with the soil classifications maps that could be up to 5km out in some places. That might have been resolved.
However, the rural land here was not only zoned Class I, it was historically and currently used for food production.
The alternate reasons why this development is not as bad as it could be. There is a geological (topographical) limit to residential expansion, where the sprawl is contained. The community has a long history – pre treaty, and so is well serviced in terms of services and recreational community assets that have built up over time. There is remnants of a train station, with a working rail line. If passenger trains were reinstated to this line, residents would have a viable alternative to car travel.
In my opinion, this is a significantly different situation to other rural developments that have been permitted without connection to existing communities or public transport links.
@Molly
Many rural communities have historically survived and thrived without the 'benefit' of the latest infrastructure, however the environment (in both senses) has changed….and not for the better.
As one commenter noted a few days ago our population is widely dispersed and many of our communities small and distant from large scale infrastructure removing the option of consolidation….all of these will still require access to potable water, and to meet the standards for waste….and no one has yet addressed the question of contamination of water supplies be it nitrates, PFOS or whatever other contamination we discover that is both extremely difficult and expensive to remove and is historical.
These schemes have ben paid for by private citzens, who are quite happy to control their system, and not at all happy having it stolen from them.
Private schemes are outside the Three Waters reforms.
That's not what Keiran McAnulty told a meeting in the Wairarapa.
It's also not what people are being told in areas such as Queenstown.
I suspect there is some confusion.
Much has yet to be determined…there are areas where the new entities will have an impact on private schemes and there is also concurrent reform with Taumata Arowai
Perhaps you could dig into it and clear it up for us and your friend in Masterton?
Perhaps the government should have thought all this through before effectively stealing assets paid for by ratepayers and private citizens.
And again, you have no game
If I had more time to spend on this I would. In the meantime, confusion reigns, which suits you, doesn’t it?
Gee I wouldn’t go that far. We know enough to determine the scheme is inferior to alternatives.
But look I’ll be generous and save you some time. When you said “Private schemes are outside the Three Waters reforms” you obviously weren’t aware of this:
https://www.qldc.govt.nz/media/hv4bxvy3/acquisition-and-vesting-of-private-3-waters-scheme-policy-draft-rev-1-16-12-2021.pdf
I don't know how you managed to make the html in that comment so complicated, but I've stripped it out and made it more readable. It's good practice to put links in the clear especially if they are to PDFs. People need to see what they are clicking on.
I don’t have time to rebut this properly. Unfortunately, and unsurprisingly, you have not clarified anything, not cleared up the confusion but only added to it.
Clearly, you have an anti-Three Waters Reforms agenda. You quote some stuff to prove something but it isn’t clear what that is except to bolster your agenda of negativity.
Just briefly, from your linked PDF:
Your PDF also states:
Which means that you can go there and find out that private schemes are outside the Three Waters reform, as I correctly stated before. Unless you can find more recent info that contradicts this, e.g. because Government has done a U-turn.
So you are given a list of requirements proposed for private schemes and you double down! Your comment about private schemes being “outside the Three Waters reforms” was incorrect.
On the wider issue of 3Waters, I suggest you read the article by Sandra Coney in the Herald about the Waitakete Ranges.
[Link required. Don’t expect others to do the donkey work for you. And you have to explain why and how the NZH article is relevant to the discussion thread about Three Waters Reform and private schemes, not just point to it and say ‘read it’ – Incognito]
I suggest that when you make a suggestion for somebody to read something you include a link and spell names correctly. And if it is in the NZH then it better be not behind the pay-wall or it could be conceived as a troll comment by you – the onus is on you to avoid wasting other people’s time and not put them on wild goose chases through Google, the internet, and then find a brick wall and a hard stop when the article is finally found. I hope for your sake that this is not the case because you will receive a Mod note soon.
Since you seem be adamant on heaping confusion on the matter at hand rather than helping to clarify things I’ve made some time to do some digging.
Can you handle a one-page Summary Fact Sheet on Three Waters Reform – Rural water supplies? Sure you can; you handled the 18-page QLDC policy no sweat.
And
And
https://www.dia.govt.nz/diawebsite.nsf/Files/three-waters-reform-programme-2021/$file/rural-water-supplies-fact-sheet-three-waters-reform-programme.pdf
Mod note
The link is in the original post. But you know that.
https://www.qldc.govt.nz/media/hv4bxvy3/acquisition-and-vesting-of-private-3-waters-scheme-policy-draft-rev-1-16-12-2021.pdf
The NZH article is relevant to the wider discussion about 3Waters and it’s merits. It’s worth purchasing a copy for.
[So, still no link to the NZH article and still no explanation why and how it is relevant to the discussion here. And now you suggest I and other readers here should pay and purchase a copy!? Because it’s worth it, in your opinion, without explaining why and how!?
The link I requested was to the NZH article. But you know that.
However, you provided the same link to the QLDC policy draft again, for the third time, after extensively and selectively quoting irrelevant stuff. I referred to it in my reply @ 11 June 2022 at 2:15 pm and I’ve quoted from it myself. But you know that.
It is unclear and ambiguous to refer to the “original post” without being more specific about which exact comment you mean. When I refer to the OP I refer to the blog/article/piece written by the Author, not to the beginning of a discussion thread or sub-thread. In any case, it is not clear what you’re referring to and this is OM!?
So, you’re a disingenuous troll here, baiting, diverting, obfuscating and you’re wasting Moderator time. Take a week off – Incognito]
Mod note
"Can you handle a one-page Summary Fact Sheet on Three Waters Reform – Rural water supplies? "
And then you go on to provide a link about transfer of ownership. Your claim was "Private schemes are outside the Three Waters reforms." and yet your own reference states:
"Private drinking water suppliers currently registered under the Health Act will have a year to comply under the Water Services Bill – this includes all public supplies and some large networked rural supplies."
If the scheme has to comply with any new regulations under 3Waters, it is simply false to suggest the scheme is ‘outside’ of the reforms.
And in anticipation that you will try to claim your comment was about 'ownership', the comment you were replying to when you made your claim, and my subsequent comments, have referred to 'control' not 'ownership'.
Nope, neither control nor ownership are transferred out of and away from private schemes. You’re confusing compliance with the new regulations and regulatory framework with loss of control, which is bot inaccurate and incorrect and amounts to fearmongering. The same fearmongering and propaganda as we might expect from some rural quarters with hysterical outburst and frankly ridiculous claims such as "They're stealing our water!", FFS. https://www.ruralnewsgroup.co.nz/rural-news/rural-general-news/they-re-stealing-our-water
To have something stolen from you, you have to own it in the first place. Some rural folk seem to think that they own the commons and because they have been free to use it and waste it they own it, for all intents & purposes. Now, who are the real thieves here?
By all accounts you’re quite intelligent, yet you don’t do anything to help clearing up confusion. Rather, you antagonise and obfuscate. The most obvious conclusion is that you have a deliberate agenda in stalling Three Waters Reform as much as possible and ideally make it fail.
https://www.dia.govt.nz/diawebsite.nsf/Files/Three-waters-reform-programme-2022/$file/Three-Waters-Reform-boiled-down-May-2022.pdf
I cannot make it any clearer for you or for anybody else. To draw conclusions that are in direct contradiction with the information provided is a sure sign of being disingenuous and not commenting & debating here in good faith. This is the very strong impression you create time after time.
There is a full on white panic going on in certain parts of the country right now, assiduously dog whistled by an army of GOP adjacent racists and/or culture warriors like Laurie Paterson and in the MSM by an army of right wing opinionistas.
That this is a race based backlash can be discerned from the targets – co-governance, smearing Mahuta and attacking Poto Williams, racist fear mongering over three waters, the vigorously pumped conspiracy theories from He Puapua to white paranoia about rigging elections (see National MP David Bennett) to far out conspiracy theories like the great replacement theory which is increasingly being mainstreamed on the NZ right and popping up in comments sections of the likes of the NZ Herald.
But it's not about race, it's about privatisation….
The council-iwi working group, on which Smith was a member, had recommended an entrenched clause to stop the water assets' privatisation. The sale or transfer of even a single pipe would require the agreement of at least 75 percent of all MPs.
[…]
Infrastructure Minister Grant Robertson called on opposition parties to "step up" if they believed in public ownership. "We've heard certainly from the National Party that they've been throughout this process concerned about the loss of ownership in communities," he said. "Now they can step up and say 'we will agree that these assets won't be sold'."
But it's understood the National Party did not agree to support the entrenched clause, protecting against privatisation – it is ironic for Jason Smith that it is the party he has just joined that has effectively blocked the requirement for a super-majority.
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/three-waters-entrenchment
Got it in one Sanctuary. And its percolating through centrist communities too. If you confront them – as I have with a few family members – they descend into fits of outrage because it's not racism. Oh yeah.
I have been following stories on the trip to England by Prince Harry and Meghan Markle. There it is again. Racism in all its glory. Hatred and vitriol abounded in subtle and less subtle guises. They are dammed if they do and damned if they don't. I can't even begin to imagine the uproar if it had been their little boy, Archie who played up on the balcony and elsewhere.
It will be understandable if they never return to racist Britain.
I'm sure Britain will be ecstatic.
Meanwhile they're living in considerably-more-racist USA.
Really, you care what the H&M roadshow says or does? Talk about the pinnacle of irrelevance. At least the R Family (privileged though they may be) actually work [truly, you couldn't pay me to do their jobs, be in that goldfish bowl, and live a life in the public eye]
I had sympathy for H&M when they wanted to ditch it all; but the sympathy waned rapidly when it was apparent that they actually wanted to live like A-list celebrities, and were perfectly prepared to sacrifice their precious privacy at the altar of their new god, Netflix.
Actually I was picking up on Sanctuary @3.4 and talking about racism Belladonna. The example I gave is just the latest.
Don't care what you may think I care or don't care about, or for that matter what you may care or not care about. Don't do Netflix and don't follow the pair's antics in the US so don't know what you're talking about. And just so as you get the message I don't care either. 😈
Then perhaps you should use an example where you do care, and have bothered to do a minimal level of research.
I care about racism and other forms of destructive prejudice. I don't care about the circumstance or past mistakes of the individual/individuals who happen to be the targets.
A less judgemental approach to commenters based on… zero knowledge of their backgrounds or the extent of their "research" endeavours into matters that happen to be of interest to them would be helpful. You might find the favour being returned.
I you make a statement that
It's pretty obvious that you've done little or no research.
And I suggest a mirror, when you're talking about "less judgemental approach"
A LOT of venting about bullies….and Maaries and WHO should own the Water. Well, them Farmers of course ! (They already do……)
Apart from the people who drafted it, I doubt even the minister has read the whole thing. It would be more to the point to ask if they'd read the summary of the Bill and the discussion document.
Bad news for the Government.
The top five issues are:
1. Inflation/cost of living.
2. Housing/price of housing.
3. Healthcare/hospitals.
4. Petrol prices/fuel.
5. Crime/law and order.
National should be delighted with the attention Labour is giving 3 Waters.
https://www.ipsos.com/sites/default/files/ct/news/documents/2022-06/17th%20Ipsos%20New%20Zealand%20Issues%20Monitor%20-%207%20June%202022%20%28report%29.pdf
And when have the top five issues ever been anything else other than the ones quoted. You're a gullible idiot!
I'm sorry, I must have missed morning report. What do you mean?
I don't think they care about reelection at this point. I think the cabinet of mediocrity is simply hoping it gets as many of its social engineering reforms through by mid 2023 as possible.
They are doubling and trippling down on everything that makes them unpopular and have abandoned anything remotely popular.
People voted labour because they thought they might do something about unaffordable housing, unaffordable rents, living costs, mental health, welfare ,health, tax reforms and in 2017 Jacinda even said she supported drug reform.
Instead all those problems are worse and labour is worrying about Geoffrey Palmer esque pie in the sky constitutional reforms and social engineering.
Tens of thousands wait on social housing lists and labour won't increase the percentage of social housing in total supply better to just copy national and throw them in costly motels rather than build state housing which is revenue asset for the govt but nevermind.
Private Rentals are impossible to find but theres a hundred thousand empty houses in NZ the govt just shrugs. Instead of developing land and building houses we give land to developers to sell extremely overpriced two bedroom boxes that sit empty.
Cost of living is out of control and our supermarket duopoly greed is hurting our people and a war with them would be extremely popular, the govt spends months saying it'll do something major doesn't even do the bare minimum. Another failed opportunity
Instead of spending loads on training new nurses and doctors for free we spend loads on centralizing healthcare bureaucracy. While dying people sit in beds in our ers.
Drops a CGT as soon as they start polling highly after March 15. wasted opportunity
Pm whose popularity, like way Trudeau would have gotten weed reform Says she supports drug reform in 2017, the party doesn't wrote a coherent drug policy, pm refuses to say she supports drug reform Incase it costs her a single vote but will support euthanasia, the result is pretty much 50/50 and immediately govt rules out any reform desire weed reform being popular with half the country. Another cynical wasted opportunity and if you look at the weed industries around the world, one that is leaving NZ behind. Failure to get any drug reform from this govt is shameful.
Instead of things on housing,cost of living , health, things people actually vote labour for we get hate speech laws, woke extremists running an anti terrorist unit, 3 waters, centralization, more hotels, a broadcast merger, co-govt constitutional reforms and a few crumbs like wage rises, benefit rises, bland climate reforms, weak workers rights reforms and more and more unaffordable empty box apartments.
Yippie.
Then there's the off touted COVID response , the one praised for not clogging up our healthcare system…. Except…… ambulances are so busy they aren't taking calls heart attacks have 1/4 survival rate, hospitals are chocker full and ambos are just dropping patients to emergency bay and picking which ones get treated and which ones don't…. Boy seems like we just postponed the health crisis by two years and didn't do anything with the two extra years to increase health care capacity.
Thank God for vaccinations because otherwise we really would be upshit creek. Which is a credit to the govt but not increasing capacity is a discredit.
In previous elections labour used to say we'd love to do this or that if only we had a majority. Now we know they what they will do with a majority. Constitutional reforms rather than economic or housing reforms. Yay!
I hope labour wins a third term.
Not because I think they'll do anything, they ruled out anything that would get people excited, I hope labour wins a third term cos national and act would be horrifically bad for many of my friends and families living standards. Labour just won't make it much worse.
But if labour loses I hope it's a nat/nzf /act govt or nat/Maori/act govt cos those two centerist parties would stop act and national reeking too much ruthanasia on the poor.
Hope you're right, remembering that Richarsdon was a National party MP, finding her natural home (the Association of Consumers and Taxpayers NZ party, founded by Douglas and Quigley), only after she departed Parliament.
Yes Ross, it is always easier to sit on one side throwing rocks into the kitchen.
Being able to produce change in an unstable world is harder. You did not mention 3 huge problems. Covid War Climate Change.
All we hear from National is "We could do it better and cheaper"
Righto!! Why do you think that would be? You new boss says "He would do the same"
"He would spend the same" So what exactly would change….. Tax cuts?? How did that work for 90% of us???
Oh I gedditt!! You would have a Big Daddy in charge.!! Not a "Girl"
Guess what?? He needs to do more homework. This is not a company There is a big bad world out there having an effect on us. We can't ignore that for political convenience. Most countries are struggling.
Don't forget when Labour were in opposition, they threw plenty of rocks and were going to fix the homeless issue, child poverty etc. and Kiwi build 10k houses a year, fix the state house wait list and hospital wait lists. All oppositions can promise the world as they don't have to deliver.
How is that going now that they have been in government for nearly five years?
The EU has just voted to ban diesel and electric new cars by 2035.
That's a good signal from the world's 3rd largest co2 polluter.
I can't remember what our target is.
Ad, this is what I read, published 8 hours ago.
"European Parliament lawmakers on Wednesday voted to support an effective EU ban on the sale of new petrol and diesel cars from 2035, rejecting attempts to weaken the proposal to speed Europe's shift to electric vehicles."
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/eu-lawmakers-support-effective-ban-new-fossil-fuel-cars-2035-2022-06-08/
They're not banning electric cars by 2035 are they Ad?
Just the way you worded your comment made me think they were phasing out EV's!
Just banning all others petrol and diesel I think.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/eu-lawmakers-support-effective-ban-new-fossil-fuel-cars-2035-2022-06-08/
That's it.
From the Shaw carbon plan we don't have a target for combustion engine vehicles. Other than the bus fleet.
Germany getting people out of their cars. But they’ve got a proper train set.
.
Millions of Germans are expected to take advantage of a summer of cheaper travel from next month under government plans to boost public transport use and give financial relief to consumers facing a cost of living crisis.
A €9-a-month ticket scheme is to be introduced from 1 June allowing travel on all modes of city and regional transport. The ticket will apply nationwide and will be available for three months until the end of August.
[…]
The cost of the ticket is a fraction of the normal cost of travel, amounting to around a sixth of the price of the cheapest monthly ticket available for Berlin’s central zones.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/may/20/germany-public-transport-boost-9-euro-month-ticket
Looks like it's on everything except their cool fast trains.
An unforeseen consequence.
https://twitter.com/taxevaderism/status/1532728239327744001
Is everyone comfortable that around 20 people are dieing from Covid 19 related illness each day? That' over 100 deaths per week and the way its going looks odds for over 5,000 by years end. The business lobby won and the old, infirm and (probably) poor lost. I'll still vote Labour but when backbone was needed they didn't stand up for their people – it's a sore point for me and whilst I think that overall Covid was handled really well if we get to the next election with 10,000 dead from Covid it will be hard to use the handling of the pandemic as a reason to vote Labour. .
I don't think anyone is "comfortable about it". Certainly still very concerned about the vulnerable around me.
Once omicron was in the country, and everyone that could, or would be, was vaccinated, it is hard to say what else could be done. It is doubtful if enough people would have supported further lockdowns to make them effective. As we could see at the end of the last Auckland lockdown.
Even China's draconian lockdowns are leaking. With pretty dire results in areas with around 60% vaccination rates.
Keeping covid out until we had 95% vaccinated, has saved thousands of lives, compared with countries that didn't reach those levels before opening up.
One thing that was conceded to business, which may have slowed the spread more, is the required length of self isolation. Ten days, not seven, would have accorded more with the probability of being infectious. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/02/17/1081510375/isolation-testing-omicron-infection
Interesting interview Jamie McKay had with soil scientist, Doug Edmeades. Some main points:
1- Farmers need to realise urea isn't the best source of nitrogen, clover pasture is. Emades believes growing good clover pasture has become a lost art.
Yeah, but urea gets a hell of a fast result even though much is lost into the atmosphere. And…I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to.
2- Soil does not produce nutrients, so fertiliser is a must. In the 80s when many farmers cut back on fertiliser, those who continued fertilising came out of the then farming slump in a much better position. When you use less fertiliser you need to reduce your stock numbers.
3- Farmers use too much phosphate. That's a problem in NZ. I used bat guano for a few years. The phosphate reading when taken was off the charts. In alternative medicine, excessive phosphate is considered a cause for cancer and other diseases.
Now for the contentious issue – Methane .
Quote:
''Yes, ruminants produce CH4. Yes it is a greenhouse gas. Yes it may be possible to come up with interventions to reduce emissions from the animal.
BUT! Let me explain.
Methane is short-lived in the atmosphere. It hangs around for about 10 years before it is converted to CO2. For every unit of carbon the animal emits as CH4 it must ingest the same amount of carbon from its plant-based feed source, which, remember, comes initially from the CO2 in the atmosphere.
From the animals perspective every bit of carbon it emits as methane it mopped up as carbon in its feed. The animal is both the source of the carbon in methane and it is also the sink for the equivalent amount of carbon in CO2. In this sense the carbon-methane cycle: methane-to-CO2-to-forage-plants-to-animals-to-methane, is a closed cycle.''
Dr Doug Edmeades, MscHons, ONZM (Services to Agriculture), is an independent soil scientist based in Hamilton. He welcomes feedback – doug.edmeades@agknowledge.co.nz
In Vino has replied yesterday to some of these similar points:
''Blade – I read that crap in the local café. Utter baloney – the guy lies about methane, claims a closed system when much of his 'disappearing methane' converts to carbon dioxide, and peddles a load of wishful garbage.
He claims that 'methane is gone in ten years.' If I remember correctly, that approximate figure is its half-life. And what is the point if farmers are replenishing it with a new full amount every year? No mention of methane being up to 60 times worse that CO2 as a heat-retaining gas.''
One-eyed, wishful drivel.
My point here is, and has always been, we don't see enough Edmeades in the media because they have issues with some mainstream narratives on climate change.
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/the-country/news/dr-doug-edmeades-should-methane-be-included-in-the-ets/2RTYB2WJE5HMP4Y2V2J4ZQ66X4/
Edmeades is a major drag on progress here in New Zealand.
You're such a wag, Blade, waving your ineptly-baited hooks around here on TS. You do get nibbles, but to those watching, you're a subtle as, well, Edmeades himself.
The methane excuse is utter nonsense. The hydroxyl argument is a red herring (note the continued fishing theme). In Vino said,
"One-eyed, wishful drivel."
Pretty fair comment, that.
This, from you:
"I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to."
Classic, though poorly expressed, trolling clap-trap. Red meat stuff. Carelessly expressed though – "anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales" won't in fact, attest that you hate clover pasture.
You might like to drop Edmeades a line yourself:-) and ask him why, if livestock methane is carbon-neutral and nothing to worry about, are farmers and their representatives etc. gleefully accepting the millions of dollars from the Government to research … methane reduction?
Perhaps you can answer that question yourself?
I don't usually respond to you, Robert, because I consider you a soundbite karen. But as you have extended yourself let's have looksee.
''Edmeades is a major drag on progress here in New Zealand.''
Based on what? Your ideology?
''You're such a wag, Blade, waving your ineptly-baited hooks around here on TS. You do get nibbles, but to those watching, you're a subtle as, well, Edmeades himself.''
I put this up for debate because it is current in the media; it stops the blog becoming an echo chamber and as I'm continually considered nuts because I don't believe in manmade climate change shouldn't I be able to defend myself? Hooks and nibbles is more to do with your mind set.
"I hate clover pasture, as anyone who has lifted and stacked clover hay bales will attest to." Classic, though poorly expressed, trolling clap-trap.
In fact it was side comment as to the extreme weight of clover bales. Some can come in at 70-80kgs wet. I can’t see you hacking that work, Robert. Again your unusual mind set on display.
''Red meat stuff.''
We can't have that can we, Robert. Although the world loves our pasture fed red meat.
''You might like to drop Edmeades a line yourself:-) ''
Why don't you drop him a line? When you don't get a reply you may like to ask yourself why?
Sorry, Blade, but you have maxed out again. I think I did a lot more hay-bale lifting that you ever did. Through all my Uni years it was my summer holiday job. 3 of us running one truck plus a loader (good boss back then – we shared driving once every 3 loads of 120 bales, but at the barn we all had to stack like hell..
My one little concession to capitalism: we were paid per bale moved. We were efficient. The few times we saw guys being paid by the hour, they were so slow that we felt nothing but contempt.
So yes – reward productivity.
Clover bales were lovely when properly dried. They hurt your thighs much less! Heavier when wet, and more likely to cook and catch alight if stacked in a barn too wet.
I picked up bales each summer starting 1965 til 1970. I had hoped it would make me a muscleman, but it just made me skinny and wiry with little, bumpy arm muscles. And it made me very fit, but I have slowly worked that off.
Edmeades as I see it does not prove a closed system for farming. His argument that farms absorb as much carbon dioxide as they produce does not counter the carbon dioxide produced as the methane magically disappears. Nor does he seem bothered about the seriously more damaging effect of methane itself.
We need to reduce methane urgently, not rabbit on about theoretically closed systems.. Edmeades appears to be aiding an interested status quo party to my mind.
Great story. I only did two seasons. And yes, I, like you, only put on arm muscle. But I was lean and mean…and bloody fit. I also saw 3 people walk off the job because they couldn't hack it. Lord knows how many would walk off the job nowadays.
Only just got through my first week. Several guys dropped out after a day or so.. Including a police trainee.
Maybe we were still under the effects that the Great Depression had on our parents… There are still plenty of good young guys (Covid has just forced my retirement from Secondary School Relief Teaching) and there are also heaps of tough-looking young guys that would not hack it.
More worrying – there are also disaffected young guys who would put that kind of effort in for a gang, but not for a standard job.
Low wage economy makes hard work a sucker's game nowadays?
And how did we end up with an unproductive, low-wage economy?
I blame Roger Douglas. I heard him say on the radio in early days that we must do all his reforms, but NOT become a low-wage economy.
Every reform he did weakened unions, and promoted a low-wage economy.
Great. Thanks a million, Rogernomes.
On second thoughts I will drop him a line with a link to this thread. Let's see what the cat drags in.
Please don't. One ignorant F-wit per thread is enough!
No abuse please. We have been warned enough.
A reply will either show him to be incompetent, or it will as Earle Kirton was fond of saying, ''be good night nurse'' for some experts on this thread.
Blade – you are the recent arrival, and the troll. Don't presume to teach us manners.
I'm teaching you nothing. Incognito laid down the kaupapa and suggested we follow it. That's what I'm doing and from my perspective KJT isn't.
You also called me a troll. You will need to back that up and show me where I'm trolling. And no, posting articles that aren't kosher from a Leftie perspective is not trolling in my opinion.
The good news for you is if I'm not booted off before hand , I will be gone for good after the next election. This will be no place for a Rightie to ply his trade. So grit ya teeth. Time will fly… and before you know it Luxon will be pontificating on the podium about how National is going to make NZ great again.
Seems Dr Edmeades' ONZM award (2013) for Services to Agriculture was well-earned.
And what Robert Guyton wrote @8.1. Sand still not bothering you? What’s your secret?
And the source of that increase in ppm methane is?
Leaky pipes,emissions from coalfields, flaring ,flatulence from Kale.
https://twitter.com/IEA/status/1523671693805473798?cxt=HHwWjMC–aXVlaUqAAAA
NZ total ch4 emissions are not even the standard error.
Indeed…and the largest source of biogenic methane (that which is part of the carbon cycle) is wetlands.
https://newscenter.lbl.gov/2020/08/13/global-methane-emissions-soaring-but-how-much-was-due-to-wetlands/
We may have too many cattle beasts but they are not the main cause of increasing atmospheric methane, indeed those studying it are struggling to account for it.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/climate-environment/2020/02/19/were-vastly-undercounting-methane-emissions-fossil-fuels-scientists-say/
Wetlands are interesting insofar as they have a huge ability to lay down carbon,
https://cdiac.ess-dive.lbl.gov/trends/ecosystems/gajewski.gif
There is a real complex ecosystem there,which is difficult to model,With coastal wetlands they do not produce so much CH4 due to SO2 from the sea (acid rain) from algae.
Poission is right. Wetlands will be the saving of us (those of us who live in regions where wetlands were, pre-agriculture, vast wetlands – put them back)!!
I fear another forest carbon credit debacle is in the offering…..are we to ban rice paddies next?
Probably right.Ted talks and investor conferences.
Not ban wetlands; fens, bogs, swamps and mires – make more of them!!
Many more. The benefits are enormous! Food production from wetlands is something that was once well known, but has been forgotten, mainly, til now. Eels, crayfish, mussels and more, not counting plants (watercress etc.
Best thing though, the filtering, cleansing, water-slowing effects of wetlands. Uncounted savings to all regions, subject to flooding.
But they produce methane Robert….public enemy number one!
If farmers can claim a natural methane cycle for their animals, wetland defenders can surely claim the same for their waterbodies!
Carbon sequestration by wetlands is beyond "significant". We'd be fools to talk wetlands down.
Or…
If wetlanders can claim a natural methane cycle farmers can claim the same for their stock.
Carbon sequestration on farms is significant. We'd be fools to talk food production down.
With a 500b$ foreign liability,and a country that is fiscally restrained destocking of Bovine /ovine biomass needs to be matched by the removal of equivalent human biomass from NZ.
No welfare state,15-20% mortgages,councillors reduced to minimum hourly rate for meetings only,a reduction in MP'S a population of around 1990 or less.
"…a reduction in MP'S a population of around 1990 or less."
Every cloud has a silver lining
We'd be fools not to recognise that "food production" does not equal "livestock farming as presently practiced".
It's not a binary.
There are many other food production models and many other foods.
Milk is not King!
"There are many other food production models and many other foods.:
Indeed there are….however methane accounting is not being used as a reason to remove them (at least not here)
Or we can support unsustainable consumption – it's a 'free' choice.
The half-life of methane in the atmosphere is around 9.1 years so NO it has not all disappeared in 10 years. Only half of it has converted into CO2 and water vapour – both also GHGs. After another 9.1 years another 1/4 of the original amount will have converted into CO2 and water vapour, and then another 9.1 years later 1/8 and so on. That is how half-lifes work.
The main point is that Edmeades represents about 2.5% of scientific opinion on the matter. The jury is well out against him and for good reason. There are numerous papers and reports that show that the Methane cycle is out of balance – largely caused by increased numbers of agricultural livestock. A fair summary is here:
''The half-life of methane in the atmosphere is around 9.1 years so NO it has not all disappeared in 10 years. Only half of it has converted into CO2 and water vapour – both also GHGs. After another 9.1 years another 1/4 of the original amount will have converted into CO2 and water vapour, and then another 9.1 years later 1/8 and so on. That is how half-lifes work.''
Could you please provide a link ? That's not how I understand things.
https://gml.noaa.gov/education/info_activities/pdfs/CTA_the_methane_cycle.pdf
https://www.calculator.net/half-life-calculator.html
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_methane
Thanks, Macro.
I tried to put the half-life thing to Blade a few days ago, but he ignores and pretends not to get it.
He obfuscates deliberately. That is his role.
Easy cowboy… be careful before you jump to conclusions. That half-life thing is interesting… I'll mull over it for a couple days. You should too.
If the concept of half-life will take you a few days to mull over, how long did it take you to mull over magnetism and paramagnetism? The mind boggles …
"In this sense the carbon-methane cycle: methane-to-CO2-to-forage-plants-to-animals-to-methane, is a closed cycle.''
Claptrap.
In a "closed cycle" you don't have to keep adding nutrients, including soil carbons.
N2O is even worser 🙂
"Soil does not produce nutrients"
Oh Lordy, protect is from these fools!
I wonder how anything grew at all, in the millions and millions of years that preceded the discovery of urea and super-duper phosphate?
Poor know-nothing Mother Nature!
Those sneaky forests too, must be running a black market import of fert. From somewhere.
Seabirds import fertiliser to some forests.
"Seabird colonies in New Zealand represent the rich diversity of coastal and pelagic seabirds, and are hotspots of intense nutrient and trace element cycling that provide examples of natural nutrient enrichment in terrestrial and stream ecosystems."
Quote from the first paragraph of the review conclusions.
https://newzealandecology.org/nzje/3455.pdf
isn't it cool?! So much that nature does that we would be learning from.
We are talking high density farming with no biomass accumulation as in a forest.
Talking of fert , I have tried nearly everything. Yet I've narrowed things down to seaweed, lawn clippings and salt. Salt has all the minerals many soils need due to depletion. My crops go crazy.
Could you pass this on to Rob, Weka. Best it comes from you.
You have a lawn?
Living in the Stone Age still!
No matter. Converting it into soil is something.
Keep piling on the salt, Blade.
That'll teach you.
Ignorance is bliss. Allow me to learn you, Robert.
https://www.hpj.com/archives/bumper-crops-defy-expectations-in-indonesia-s-tsunami-ravaged/article_ba79a238-af56-5ba5-98bd-eb77f7b19e3c.html
https://www.oceansolution.com/our-services-1
I will from time to time give you new knowledge. I suggest you hang off my every word and learn.
farmers can make their crops go crazy in various ways. Or they can ask nature for a helping hand and make their farms live in perpetuity once the fossil fuels and artificial inputs are gone.
Agree 100%. I'm an organic farmer. Although it must be remembered organic farming like vegan diets demands very careful management and in some cases isn't superior to conventional farming ( in my opinion). Beetroots for example have a higher nitrate content when grown conventionally. And that's what health nuts and body builders want – a high nitrate profile.
"I am an organic farmer"
You use lawn clippings primarily, as fertiliser, Blade?
How big is your farm?
A piece you may (or perhaps not) enjoy Robert.
"Aotearoa New Zealand’s pastoral agriculture has been entirely based on this through the use of grass and clover pastures. Indeed until the expansion of dairying since the 1990s, pastoral and arable farming here used no nitrogen fertilisers – all the nitrogen came from clovers biologically fixing it. This is how organic agriculture that prohibits the use of nitrogen fertilisers works. It is therefore possible to farm without using any nitrogen fertiliser at all, in contrast to lithospheric fertilisers. Yes, compromises have to be made in the production system and there can be profit implications, but, Aotearoa New Zealand farmed for nearly its entire history without nitrogen fertilisers so it is possible to do so again."
https://www.newsroom.co.nz/farmers-dont-need-nitrogen-fertilisers-at-all
Interesting expansion on what Edmeades said about clover pasture use being a lost art in NZ.
I see it as akin to our use of PKE….we waste over a billion a year (IIRC) importing a product that is effectively unnecessary. A lot of our issues can be traced back to the need to service greatly inflated land values that force everyone to maximise every possible skerrick of production to satisfy the bank.
This is not news to me, pat.
In my forest garden, I've included a wide range of leguminous plants; clovers, vetches, lupines, peas, beans, kakabeak, kowhai, tagasaste, laburnum, gleditsia, etc. to serve as nitrogen-collectors for the benefit of the other plants.
New Zealand farmers will return to plant-generated nitrates for their pastures before too long. Many already have.
I hope the warming environment doesn’t favour weevils.
"New Zealand farmers will return to plant-generated nitrates for their pastures before too long."
I expect so, though not necessarily by choice.
I'm betting farmers don't choose "the need to service greatly inflated land values that force everyone to maximise every possible skerrick of production to satisfy the bank." either.
Well the capital gains farmers, which appears to be the majority of "farm investors" these days, chose it, in the expectations of high returns on selling the farms.
Like the “house hoarders”, capital gains, not the long term future of farming, is the goal.
Hobsons choice
In old terms – all up, 10 acres. When I say lawn clippings, that also includes other green matter as well. The place was liberally coated with rock dust about 15 years ago, not so much for the minerals, but for the paramagnetism.
You fertilise your entire 10 acre block with "seaweed, lawn clippings and salt"?
Hmmm….
That's a fairly thin application of lawn clippings, Blade.
Unless your lawn is huge. What percentage of your farm is lawn? It would have to be considerable to be able to service 10 acres!
How much "salt" do you need to cover that area?
If you are using seawater, you'd need a considerable amount to cover 10 acres; how do you collect that much seawater?
You also need a huge volumn of seaweed to cover 10 acres. How do you do this?
Your farm sounds very interesting.
Question: was your rockiest Israelii?
Rock dust. Did it come from Israel?
Nope. Up North. I originally bought it from a defunct outfit in Mt Maunganui.
I now buy it from: https://environmentalfertilisers.co.nz/contact/
Check them out. Some of their organic mixes are excellent.
I also use Bio Char, and my water is vortexed using Viktor Schauberger like tech.
Pressed for time. Will answer your other questions later.
Oh – seaweed meal. Beach seaweed when I have time. You cannot harvest living seaweed.
''Unless your lawn is huge. What percentage of your farm is lawn? It would have to be considerable to be able to service 10 acres.''
About one third. Also boundary weeds and leaves etc. Bio Char is interesting. It is self perpetuating. But in some respects has been over sold. How Bio Char was used in the Amazon is still not completely understood.
''If you are using seawater, you'd need a considerable amount to cover 10 acres; how do you collect that much seawater.''
Fair questions. It's not viable for most farmers. Hence ocean solids are mixed with farm water and then spread. This dude in the clip is obviously a hobby farmer like me. Other clips will show how salt in used in bigger operation.
3 acres of lawn? Wow! HUGE lawn!!
What do you make your biochar from?
"The place was liberally coated with rock dust about 15 years ago"
I didn't realise you are still applying it – why is that? Does your land need a top-up?
''What do you make your biochar from?''
I buy. But for someone like you with plenty of prunings ( I would assume) you could make your own quite easily. Just remember to inoculate it.
"The place was liberally coated with rock dust about 15 years ago"
I didn't realise you are still applying it – why is that? Does your land need a top-up?
I only applied it once as stated above for the paramagnetism. People forget rock dust can take ages to be broke down by bacteria. It is not bio available for a long time. Hence by using salt I am not doubling up on minerals or applying rock dust in a different form each year.
Oh, I see. It's just that you wrote:
"I now buy it from: https://environmentalfertilisers.co.nz/contact/"
I wondered if you are still applying rock dust.
Interesting to hear about your "Viktor Schauberger like tech." for vortexing your water. Those are pretty cool technologies – where did you get yours? What form does it take? It is possible to make your own – is that what you've done. Interesting stuff, Blade. I'd like to hear more!
I see..yes, I still buy it but not for my own use at present. We are soaking dust in water and using it in compost at a rellies place. He likes to grow herbs. I have told him he may be wasting his time with rock dust. He see's thing differently, time will tell. If I'm wrong, I learn something new.
I had mine made. It's a very simple affair. Something like the copper pipe in this link.
https://www.alivewater.com/vortex-water-revitalizer-product-description
But before you doing anything like that. Do this. Buy one. The price is highway robbery. I bought a packet of them for $4, I think, a while back on Ali express. But with postage delay at present, it's better to pay the higher price.
Then you can experiment. Minimum four twists one way, four the other way. Then water a pot plant etc. Better still, drink a cup of the water and if liver isn't clean, or your body needs a clean out, you will be down with flu like symptoms.
https://nzl.grandado.com/products/vortex-bottle-connector-tornado-in-a-bottle-cyclone-tube-tornado-maker-magic-toy-9?variant=UHJvZHVjdFZhcmlhbnQ6MjA4NzA4NDk4
More questions about your organic practices, Blade – what do you do with the biochar you buy?
Blade, do you mean NaCl (sodium chloride) salt, or nitrogen, potassium, sulfur, and phosphorus (mineral) salts? Just asking because I would have thought NaCl (sea salt) couldn't be too good for your orange tree.
My small orange tree does alright with a few NPK granules springled along the drip line twice a year. NaCl would be much cheaper. Should I apply sparingly?
Don't want my orange crop to become completely deranged
I would have guessed he means unprocessed 'sea salt' – which contains a pretty wide range of minerals.
Yes, a wide range of minerals, but mostly NaCl, which is why I was asking if NaCl is good for citrus. Wouldn't have thought so – happy to learn otherwise.
No, ordinary unrefined sea salt. Trust me ,when I first heard of this I called bs. I was wrong. It's one of the most potent fertilisers I have ever used . See my links.
The ratio is three and a half litres of water to 1 teaspoon of salt, once per month.
Others use way more. Some less. I also sprinkle a handful of salt around a mature tree once a year.
The salt must be unrefined. The minerals in unrefined salt provides a degree of buffering. Refined salt is worthless and will kill your plants. It's not good for human health either. Makes a good weed killer though.
Even though I get great results, I was brought up on the notion salt is a poison for plants. I can't shake that mind conditioning. I still freak out when using salt on my plants. So I suggest you carry on with what you are doing with your orange tree and just use salt on a test plant to put your mind a ease.
Salt water from the sea can be applied directly once a month. Others suggest 1/3 sea water to 2/3 tap water.
It's true some plants are salt sensitive. Your link says that about citrus. But I have never had a problem with the above routines. However, it may be prudent to take a year off now and again.
Thanks Blade, I will try diluted seawater – certainly cheaper than Yates Thrive (Citrus & Fruit). There are, of course, a range citrus fertilisers.
Good luck. You could use a variety of fertilisers and have all bases covered.
I must warn you, if Doug Edmeades comments on this thread, and sees this he’s going to call me a quack and you a fool. Crikey, the irony.
Quote:
''Analysis of economic detriments. Dr Edmeades estimated the economic detriments as follows: "Assuming a farm (either dairy or sheep/beef) with optimum soil fertility. The science tells us that production will decline by about 5% per annum if the nutrients lost from the farm annually (i.e. in products off the farm, from leaching and runoff of nutrients, and transfer of nutrients to non-productive areas) are not replaced with fertilizer inputs. The important nutrients in this regard are P, K, S and Mg. Probitas when used as recommended contains insignificant amounts of these nutrients and therefore will not maintain the soil nutrient levels against the losses.''
https://comcom.govt.nz/news-and-media/media-releases/archive/$272,500-penalty-for-deceptive-claims-about-probitas-fertiliser
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/farmer-fined-260000-for-snake-oil-fertiliser/S7R5X57DPTAXSSOFZW23RLYONI/
ps – the above has nothing to do with salt. But I doubt that will matter.
It's not super-duper phosphate, Robert. It was meant to be spread with equal parts Dolomite. Now you know why much of our pastural land is out of kilter.
You sure learned me good tonight, Sensei!
Right. Now it's your turn to learn me something I can use.
My Bullshit detector keeps annoying me. It won't turn off.
Great trolling, I have to admit.
I wouldn't have a clue what you are talking about. Sometimes changing the battery helps.
You are watering your farm with one of those??
Now I AM astonished!
Well, In Vino only has a quarter acre. So he can spread his bs to a reasonable concentration.
Like In Vino, I think you are bullsh*tting 🙂
Then why did you feign interest and waste my time? I put some effort into those posts?
You do seem to have done some research, Blade and it shows.
Not research -practical applications. I understand. It's a little too advanced. And you cannot conceive of me doing such stuff. But Robert, you didn't fool me. Anyone could see you were stringing me along. You don't go from trolling me, to suddenly hanging off my every word.
So why did I waste my time on you? Simple. As a testament to the machination of an Immoral Lefty mindset that knows no limits. A future reference for those asking for proof about the faults of Lefties I supposedly write about.
Thankyou.
"As a testament to the machination of an Immoral Lefty mindset that knows no limits. A future reference for those asking for proof about the faults of Lefties I supposedly write about."
Juicy, crunchy word-salad!
Yummies!
It matters not what you think. Only what you wrote. I was hoping for more. But you scribbled enough.
Your detector is in fine shape, In Vino.
Ahh – my eventual conclusion is that Blade was really being truthful at
9.2.1.1.1.1 when he wrote, 'I wouldn't have a clue..'
Credit where credit's due.
Yes, he gracefully apologised in a way. Then abused me with basically the same cant on a different thread. I can't win
You shouldn't jump to conclusions In Vino….you know why
Loved it!
Our damned fine Minister of Police, in response to a sarcastic question from little David, as to how she would characterise her comment to bully boy Mercenary Mitchell as 'riding shot-gun with the boys,' she replied as pretty accurate!
Slap down!
Poto is another one of many fine Labour Government ministers.
If you say so.
"Poto is another one of many fine Labour Government ministers."
Goldsmith for Māori-Crown Relations would be gold – Reti could focus on Health.
Nikki Kaye incorrectly describes Paul Goldsmith as Māori defending diversity of National's Shadow Cabinet
And Collins to take over Mitchell’s SFO role – she’s all over the SFO
Are you saying Poto is only there for diversity?
Wasn’t that's what you were alluding to @10.2 Jimmy?
My recent focus has been more on the behaviour of opposition MPs – mostly the Nats, but also (since November 2020) all those new ACT stars.
link broken
Sorry about that Incognito, and thanks.
https://thespinoff.co.nz/politics/26-11-2021/the-five-most-terrible-horrible-no-good-very-bad-days-in-recent-national-party-history
P.S. Here’s another, by Henry Cooke at Stuff.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/300464539/four-years-of-opposition-national-partys-years-of-shame-blamed-on-lightweights-and-personal-ambition
What’s a blow to Apple is good for Apple.
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/world/468734/eu-agrees-to-single-mobile-charging-port-in-blow-to-apple
Nek minit, a whole new set of lovely iphones for people to upgrade to. Make it right to repair Brussels and then I'll be impressed.
although the OS and software is the sticking point.