Open Mike 11/12/2018

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, December 11th, 2018 - 128 comments
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128 comments on “Open Mike 11/12/2018 ”

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  1. Macro 1
    11 December 2018 at 7:20 am

    As the old saying goes “Every cloud has a silver lining”

    How Trump made political engagement great again:

    The 2018 midterms had the highest turnout since before World War I!

    Americans are more civically engaged than they have been in more than 100 years.

    The two years between President Donald Trump’s win in 2016 and the 2018 midterms ushered in a new era of political engagement in America, not seen since the early 1900s and the 1960s civil rights and anti-war movements.

    That culminated in November’s midterm elections. While House Democrats picked up 40 seats in a wave election (they didn’t fare nearly as well in the Senate), an important number to focus on is the sheer number of people who voted in 2018, compared to past midterms.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/12/10/18130492/2018-voter-turnout-political-engagement-trump

    • Molly 1.1
      11 December 2018 at 7:42 am

      I would think Brexit has done the same in Britain.

      The referendum for Scotland seemed also to generate a whole new groundswell of political engagement.

    • sumsuch 1.2
      11 December 2018 at 10:15 pm

      Percentage-wise?

      • Macro 1.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 10:38 pm

        Read the link. The actual turnout was over 50% which for a mid – term is the greatest turnout in 100 years and well above the last mid-term which was around 38%. It may not sound very impressive but remember that these polling days are held on a working day, and while in some states it is a requirement for employers to give their employees time off to vote – this is met more in word than in deed. Furthermore in poorer districts there are few polling booths and it can take several hours to cast a vote.

        Presidential elections score between 50 – 60%. However you need to take into account the very active voter suppression that occurs in a large majority of states where certain sectors of society are actively discouraged by a wide range of legalities from voting.

        This is a surprisingly good result considering all the obstacles that state politicians put in the way of the majority.

        • lprent 1.2.1.1
          12 December 2018 at 3:38 am

          Yeah it was probably the most awesome mid-term election in many years. Ummm. lets try this from
          https://www.fairvote.org/voter_turnout#voter_turnout_101

          Yeah. That make the 2018 turnout a bit clearer. It was the highest in a century.

          • Macro 1.2.1.1.1
            12 December 2018 at 2:40 pm

            Thanks for posting that graph Lprent. I have been following the daily train crash in the US for a while now on WTF and some of the commentators there have been very actively involved in the mid-terms and were very heartened by the (for them) massive turnout and the blue wave that resulted in the House – the forecast had been for around a 35 seat swing at best. When the results came through and the Dems kept picking up seats they well elated.
            When I saw that graph on Vox – I thought it was something that needed to be seen here, because there have been a few commentators here, who have been rather disparaging of the efforts of the Democratic party. And while you can’t change an institution overnight the vibes I’m picking up from the on-line community at WTF (hosted by Matt Kiser) are very positive. I have faith that the activism I am seeing there will translate in the future to a much more progressive and viable Left.
            And all thanks to Trump 😉

  2. Ed 2
    11 December 2018 at 7:54 am

    If there is one left wing writer you should follow, it is John Wight.
    Add him to your Twitter feed.
    Here is an excerpt from his most recent article, where he provides insight you rarely see in the corporate media on the events in France.
    This is a war against neoliberalism and austerity

    “Macron’s European army has arrived. It goes by the name Gilets Jaunes

    The French capital is now, for all intents, the frontline in a growing struggle against neoliberalism and its bastard child, austerity, across a European Union whose foundations are crumbling. They are crumbling not due to the devilish machinations of Vladimir Putin (as an increasingly unhinged and out of touch Western liberal commentariat maintains), but instead as the result of a neoliberal status quo that provides far too few with unending comfort and material prosperity at the expense of far too many, for whom dire misery and mounting pain are its grim fruits.

    Not only is this mass grassroots movement of Yellow Vest protesters a problem for Macron, but it is also increasingly a problem for an EU political and economic establishment that is yet to wake up to the fact that the world has changed, and changed utterly.

    Throughout human history hubris has been the undoing of the rich and powerful, along with the empires forged in their name; and hubris is currently well on the way to being the undoing of an EU whose proponents have embraced the unity not of its peoples but of its banks, corporations, and elites.”

    Whole article here.

    https://t.co/HQy75hZTHD?amp=1

    • Jum 2.1
      11 December 2018 at 9:59 am

      And in a world of global consumerism expansion being the base of capitalism, austerity left people with less to spend. Duh.

    • Gosman 2.2
      11 December 2018 at 11:15 am

      The fact you think France is a poster child for neoliberalism is laughable. France’s issues are in fact the result of failing to implement any meaningful policies that equate even remotely with neoliberalism.

      • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 11:47 am

        Wow, you do come out with some whoppers.

        France, being a part of the EU, has had to put in place full neo-liberalism BS and it’s hurting the poor – as it has done throughout history.

        Wonder if we’ll see a Frexit.

        • Wayne 2.2.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 12:29 pm

          Draco,

          You obviously don’t know much about the French economy. France has always stood apart from what they regard as the Anglo neo-liberal consensus.

          Equating all forms of capitalism to neo-liberalism is a serious mistake.

          The basic tenents of neo-liberalism are low barriers to trade, not much state ownership, relatively free labour markets, low regulation, relatively low taxes, and a relatively low share of the state as a share of GDP (less than 35%). France basically doesn’t have any of this. These features are very much the domain of the anglosphere, including NZ. The EU basically resists all these things.

          • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1.1.1
            11 December 2018 at 12:46 pm

            So, neo-liberalism is pretty much what the EU was all about then and France followed the failed ideology.

            https://www.futurelearn.com/courses/european-culture/0/steps/23527

            Dr Marek Neuman explains the consequences of European economic integration on the economic and political powers of member states and why some scholars, practitioners, and citizens have been criticising the EU as a neoliberal project.

            The Political Economy of the Neoliberal Transformation of French Industrial Relations

            Abstract

            The author advances the literature on the role of the state in the decentralization of industrial relations in France by providing a political economic analysis of Right- and Left-backed governments in recent decades. While both have pursued reforms to reduce regulation and to increase labor market flexibility, they have used the state apparatus in different ways to achieve these goals.

            Macron’s tragedy is that he still believes in a discredited economic system

            The tragedy of Macron is that he is a highly articulate upholder of an illusion that has been dispelled time and time again since the subprime crisis. That the defence of an economic system that has exerted such centrifugal pressure on society as to nearly dissolve it can still pass as “pragmatic” is truly staggering, and shows that what goes by the name “pragmatism” has become the most deeply entrenched of ideologies.

            • Wayne 2.2.1.1.1.1
              11 December 2018 at 3:08 pm

              I know some leftists have criticised the EU as a neo-liberal project. They are wrong.

              The EU has its origins in the 1950’s and was designed to make Western Europe a single economy. All about eliminating the threat of war from Germany. Obviously no real barriers between each of them. But they were (and are) all high tax economies with massive welfare networks and massive infrastructure spending. That is why France has the amazing TGV trains, amazing roads, and many dozens of nuclear reactors, and may companies under the control of the state. All built with central planning.

              As a general rule, informed commentators make a distinction between the anglo economies and the European economies, with many Europeans being critical of what they perceive as the US pushing their model onto them. One of the reasons for Brexit is that the UK economy doesn’t easily fit the European model. Many Brits resented the excessive level of micro control that is the norm of the EU.

              Having said that I do know there has been a fear that Macron wanted to introduce more economic flexibility into France and was accused of being a closet neoliberal. He basically succeeded with employment law reform and reducing business regulation, with many French people recognising the current practices were way too restrictive. But that was clearly the limit of what he could do.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                11 December 2018 at 6:44 pm

                The EU has its origins in the 1950’s and was designed to make Western Europe a single economy.

                Which was a bad move as the PIIGs found out. Can’t have a single economy on one currency when all the sub-economies have different taxes, workers rights, different productivity rates etc, and have their ability to control their currency removed.

                Obviously no real barriers between each of them.

                Yes. Neo-liberalism.

                But they were (and are) all high tax economies with massive welfare networks and massive infrastructure spending. That is why France has the amazing TGV trains, amazing roads, and many dozens of nuclear reactors, and may companies under the control of the state. All built with central planning.

                So, you’re now praising a command economy?

                He basically succeeded with employment law reform and reducing business regulation, with many French people recognising the current practices were way too restrictive.

                So, that would make him a neo-liberal and France getting neo-liberal policies despite the fact that the French don’t actually want them. You know, like the article I posted on it said.

                Yeah, I’m getting your argument. Mostly because it seems to be made up out of whole cloth.

      • Tricledrown 2.2.2
        12 December 2018 at 10:14 am

        Gossipboy your attempts to be Relevant are a complete joke its like your on a different planet . Rumplestilskin go back to sleep.

  3. marty mars 3
    11 December 2018 at 7:55 am

    A big issue at this time of year – I think most of us waste food – we have chickens and a friend with pigs – but every time I scrape the plate or pot I cringe a little and feel ashamed that we are wasting food.

    “We’re wasting food that can be utilised by some of our whānau” says Whangārei community trust CEO, Martin Kaipo, who is challenging the government to tackle New Zealand’s food wastage problem…

    … Latest statistics show that 14,000 tonnes of food waste is sent to New Zealand landfills annually. That equates to 3kgs per person annually, a statistic Kaipo says can easily help those most in need.

    “One of the supermarkets, they were throwing out dozens of eggs and they had to break them and we say ‘why don’t you save it? We can give it away’. They say they can’t, they’re not allowed,” says Kaipo, who has been working in the community development sector for over 20 years.

    A 2015 study showed that $900mil of food is wasted by New Zealanders annually.

    “You’re talking about a social accord and meeting the needs of our whānau. I think we should be challenging wastage,” he says.

    https://www.maoritelevision.com/news/regional/maori-ceo-calls-out-nzs-food-wastage-problem

    • dV 3.1
      11 December 2018 at 8:07 am

      Wastage is a an issue, but the numbers are odd and not consistent.

      3 kg per person per year doesn’t seem much seem much.
      AND
      The monetary cost is $180 per person- thus the food cost $50 per kg.

      Or have I just too much time on my hands!!!!

    • Draco T Bastard 3.2
      11 December 2018 at 11:56 am

      Which countries waste the most food?

      The Food and Agriculture Organization of the United Nations (FAO) estimates that, each year, one-third of all food produced for human consumption in the world (around 1.3 billion tons) is lost or wasted. This includes 45% of all fruit and vegetables, 35% of fish and seafood, 30% of cereals, 20% of dairy products and 20% of meat.

      The most waste is, of course, in the highly efficient Developed Nations:

      Not surprisingly, most of this wastage occurs in the developed world; per capita food waste by consumers (not including the production process) in Europe and North America is around 95-115kg per year, compared to just 6-11kg in sub-Saharan Africa and South/South-East Asia.

      This wastage happens because, on average, we’re paid too much. We throw stuff out because we can afford to.

      Like the waste that is personal vehicles this is another symbol of how rich we are. A symbol of how stupid and blasé we’ve become.

      • James Thrace 3.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 1:14 pm

        And the best before dates are usually a crock of shit.

        We opened a still sealed tub of Greek yoghurt that had been sitting in the fridge for a year the other week. BB was November 2017. A year later, still sealed, and kept cool, it was still good to eat.

        • Draco T Bastard 3.2.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 2:07 pm

          You can blame BB dates on consumers themselves. They’d buy processed food and expect it to last forever. They’d then open stuff and find it had gone off and ZOMG, they didn’t know that it had to be used by certain time so should get a refund. Some people would eat it anyway because its canned and should be good right?

          For health and safety of the public BB dates became mandatory.

          Yes, some foods will keep well beyond the BB date but that’s because the BB dates are very conservative and some foods will simply keep longer.

  4. Chris T 4
    11 December 2018 at 8:05 am

    Ardern on Hosking this morning

    Hosking – Asking questions about a possible pay out to Kiwibuild’s Barclay

    Ardern – “I wouldn’t encourage anyone to read between the lines”

    Lol

    http://120.138.20.16/WeekOnDemand/ZB/auckland/2018.12.11-07.30.00-D.mp3

    • marty mars 4.1
      11 December 2018 at 8:19 am

      Such a great sense of humour the PM lol – the righties will be up in arms as they are humourless and rightly so.

      • Chris T 4.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 8:23 am

        If claiming humour makes it less of a dumb thing to say for her, she can roll with that, I guess.

        It would just mean she finds the Sroubek case a laugh

        • Red Blooded One 4.1.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 8:39 am

          What is dumb is someone suggesting that because the PM on an issue said “Read between the line” that she cannot suggest to “Not read between the lines” on a completely different, absolutely no connection, months apart issue. Perhaps it is comments like this that highlight the skill and multi tasking ability of our brilliant PM compared to the desperate and talentless detractors.

          • Chris T 4.1.1.1.1
            11 December 2018 at 8:48 am

            Probably the fact that isn’t what she said

            She said

            “I wouldn’t encourage anyone…..”

            After encouraging it the other day, and it being pointed out how ridiculous the statement was at the time

            • Red Blooded One 4.1.1.1.1.1
              11 December 2018 at 8:56 am

              On THAT issue, can you not see the difference? two separate issues. Are you being purposely dense or does it just come naturally. I will treat your subtle attack on the baby with the silence and contempt it deserves.

            • greywarshark 4.1.1.1.1.2
              11 December 2018 at 12:24 pm

              Chris T
              I know I know. You would do a much better job than the PM. Possibly you put your CV forward to be an advisor and got turned down. Now you are giving her the coaching she needs from TS sidelines. Don’t know if she will welcome it. I certainly don’t. Sniping from a protected place is a low task. that doesn’t result in awards. Why not find another one?

          • Chris T 4.1.1.1.2
            11 December 2018 at 8:50 am

            Just as another point

            What makes her particular talented at multi tasking?

            The baby?

            • OnceWasTim 4.1.1.1.2.1
              11 December 2018 at 9:09 am

              I’m intrigued @ Chris T. What is it that makes you want to come and comment on TS?
              Is it a a genuine desire to counter the politics of the left, or
              Is it more to do with the size of your penis?

              If it’s the latter, Maria Muldaur can offer you some solace (It ain’t the meat, it’s the motion)

              Btw, your mate Matty is having a bit of an epiphany (or maybe a mid-life crisis -take your pick). He’s back from his voyage of discovery in Eurip and could probably offer you some good advice.

            • Cinny 4.1.1.1.2.2
              11 December 2018 at 1:00 pm

              Far out grasping at straws big time today chris t.

              “What makes her particular talented at multi tasking?”

              Probably because she is a mum and that’s what we do, multi-task. It’s quite a talent.

              Ask any mum, ask your own mum.

              Anything else you would like to know about being a working mum with a young baby?

            • McFlock 4.1.1.1.2.3
              11 December 2018 at 1:13 pm

              For one thing, the ability to recognise that different topics have different contexts, and “reading between the lines” might be advisable for one topic but reckless speculation for another.

          • sumsuch 4.1.1.1.3
            11 December 2018 at 10:34 pm

            She’s only been in the background of m ‘mind this year — I account her a talker of the talk but not a walker. ‘Brilliant’ — nay. Her feeling isn’t as good as the work that took up the lives of our founders. She still thinks her feeling matters as much as struggle, work, sacrifice, MJS.

        • veutoviper 4.1.1.2
          11 December 2018 at 9:17 am

          Have you found any actual evidence that Sroubek’s estranged wife was/is under police protection as TRP asked you to provide when you continued to dispute that issue with me?

          Don’t seem to have seen it here yet.

          Also a warning to anyone clicking on the 14+ minute audio link Chris T provided at 4, the first 7+ mins are a news bulletin and the Hoskiing/Ardern interview does not start until after that.

          Also, Ardern’s remark re not encouraging anyone to read between the lines has to be put into the context of her following comments that the Barclay situation is an employment matter that she cannot comment on.

          • Chris T 4.1.1.2.1
            11 December 2018 at 9:45 am

            You posted a direct reply to a question from Winston at question time

            The reply you posted bore no resemblance to any answer Winston gave

            ie You made it up

            • veutoviper 4.1.1.2.1.1
              11 December 2018 at 10:00 am

              LOL. You mean you won’t accept the Parliamentary video and Hansard transcript of what Peters said, because it does not fit with your claims – but you cannot provide any proof for your claim.

              And here you go again, taking Ardern’s comment out of context and made in relation to a completely different issue as has been pointed out to you above.

              We deserve better trolls here than you.

              • Chris T …
                11 December 2018 at 10:01 am

                Nothing in Winston answer to the questions bore any resemblance to what you made up, no matter how much you want to “magic” it there

              • marty mars …
                11 December 2018 at 10:05 am

                He’s struggling for sure. Sad these wingnuts are going low but they are desperate for ANYthing other than the eternal-leakee-I-did-everything-right Simon. It’s also funny imo.

          • Naki man 4.1.1.2.2
            11 December 2018 at 10:07 am

            “Have you found any actual evidence that Sroubek’s estranged wife was/is under police protection as TRP asked you to provide when you continued to dispute that issue with me?”

            How about this:
            “Police Minister Stuart Nash says police should not have shared information with Immigration NZ about the location of the police safe house where the estranged wife of Karel Sroubek is staying.”

            https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12171765

            • OnceWasTim 4.1.1.2.2.1
              11 December 2018 at 11:14 am

              I think one or two ‘officials’ would have to be “thrown under a bus” – that’s if you’re hoping for a reply.
              And we can’t do that @ Naki man! It would undermine EVERYTHING our public service (and its codes of conduct) stands for.
              (/sarc)
              And if we were to do that, there’d be no opportunity anymore for a pompous Wodehouse, or a finger-pumping specimen in a leapoard skin suit feigning outrage, or a struggling Soi-man to ask ‘the hard questions’ as Her Majesty’s Opposishun in Parliament – that’s without appearing like complete hypocritical shmuks.

              (It’s no wonder, I ‘spose) that when I walked past MoBIE yesterday, there were one or two senior ‘officials’ standing outside, desperately sucking on their vape machines inhaling as much flavoured steam as they could get down their throats whilst they were dreaming up the next round of bullshit and spin – have you received any memo yet?)

              • Naki man …
                11 December 2018 at 11:31 am

                What a load of bullshit. Give up the drugs you rambling fool.

                • greywarshark …
                  11 December 2018 at 1:03 pm

                  Yes Naki Man doesn’t OwT ramble on with his thoughts. You, instead, are very short and snappy, probably because you don’t have many thoughts to share.

            • OnceWasTim 4.1.1.2.2.2
              11 December 2018 at 11:35 am

              Oh, btw @ Naki man, I stumbled across this little gem that could be used in the next election campaign and it could draw together a Tolley, a Collins, a Bennett and Barry ( let alone the male aspirants with their woifies behind them ALL THE WAY):

            • veutoviper 4.1.1.2.2.3
              11 December 2018 at 1:47 pm

              That article dated 5 December at 1.19pm and Nash’s statements etc predated the more informed information provided by Ardern, Peters and Galloway in the House in Question Time that afternoon and the following two days, Weds 6 Dec, and Thurs, 6 Dec.

              I suspect/hope that Nash was possibly carpeted for those statements, and told to pull his head in as his statement that police should not have shared information with Immigration NZ about the estranged wife’s whereabouts have since been refuted on several counts, as have the statement in that article that “She is now staying in a police safe house because of fears to her safety.”

              In Question Time on Thursday, 6 Dec, in questions 1 and 2 Peters refuted much of what Nash had said. In brief:

              — Under Question 1, Peters advised that the wife had been offered police protection three times but had declined the offers, and hence she was not in police protection.

              — Under Question 2, Galloway repeatedly stated that Police had not supplied Immigration NZ with the wife’s address as Immigration NZ already knew her address/whereabouts.

              Chris T and I had a lengthy ‘discussion’ on these issues under the thread at 13 on the “Double down – protect parliament – ban Bridges for a month” post by lprent filed at 10.30pm on 5 Dec.

              I am not going to repeat my very detailed responses to him with links and quotes to Peters and Galloway’s replies in the House. These can be seen in the above-mentioned thread starting with Chris T’s 13.2.2.1.1 and continuing for some days resulting in TRP telling him to pull his head in and provide evidence that she was in police protection.

              https://thestandard.org.nz/double-down-protect-parliament-ban-bridges-for-a-month/#comment-1559094

              As well as referencing the information provided in the House by Peters and Galloway, in one of my responses I also provided a very rough summary of the provisions of Part 8 of the Immigration Act 2009 covering the powers of entry, seizure etc of Immigration Officers in relation to possible immigration fraud etc – AND the procedures whereby Police are able under law to work closely with Immigration on such matters including the powers of – and requirements on – both agencies to share information on such matters. (There are also similar requirements for information sharing with and between other government agencies etc). As I noted in that comments, these powers etc were widened considerably under the last Nat govt.)

              Here is the link to that comment – https://thestandard.org.nz/double-down-protect-parliament-ban-bridges-for-a-month/#comment-1559387

              Going back to the Nash article, Nash did not seem to know/understand the provisions of the Immigration Act 2009 (and the Search and Surveillance Act 2012) re these powers and requirements to share relevant information between Immigration NZ and NZ Police in making the statement he did.

              As Ianmac has noted below at 4.1.1.2.3, this subject is up again today in Question Time at Q3.

              • Chris T …
                11 December 2018 at 7:59 pm

                “and hence she was not in police protection.”

                Again that is not what you wrote his answer was.

                Nor what he actually said

                Give it up.

                You made it up

                What you posted he answered

                ” She is not in police protection; Q 1″

                What Hansard says

                “It would be very axiomatic that if on three occasions the police had offered protection and she hadn’t availed herself of it, then maybe when the police came with the immigration officer, she wasn’t under protection.”

          • ianmac 4.1.1.2.3
            11 December 2018 at 12:02 pm

            “Have you found any actual evidence that Sroubek’s estranged wife was/is under police protection?”
            Mitchell is thinking of taking Winston to the Privileges Committee but Mitchell said, “”She’s been taken away to a safe home in a different part of the country that is subject to a police safety plan, and then, unannounced, two police detectives and an Immigration NZ official turned up at the front door.

            “She was asked to do something she felt would make her an even bigger target for Sroubek, felt very uneasy and asked for a support person.”

            That is not the same thing as a Safe House.

            That great questioner Bridges is yet again having a go re Sroubek at the PM today at QT. Q3.

            • Cinny 4.1.1.2.3.1
              11 December 2018 at 12:54 pm

              lmao, just saw that Ian re Qtime today.

              The general ublic are so over it, as they feel closure has already happened.

              But hey if he want’s to keep on going there because he believes said subject is good for nat party polling, then am happy to watch the entertainment.

            • veutoviper 4.1.1.2.3.2
              11 December 2018 at 1:55 pm

              Ianmac – did you watch Q1 and 2 on Thursday last week – a lot revealed there as mentioned in my reply to Naki above at 4.1.2.2.3. I did extensive replies to chris t last week on this and my reply above has links to that info.

              Mitchell has no real grounds to take Peters to the Privileges Committee – imo he is just posturing and may come a cropper if he persists with that line.

              I also now know a lot more re the wife and her family etc and not everything is as it seems but cannot say more. It is a bit of a Through the Looking Glass situation where down seems up and vice versa – and who is the real victim/fall guy/ taking one for the team …………..

              Following the money can lead to interesting results.

              • Chris T …
                11 December 2018 at 8:07 pm

                What you posted he answered

                ” She is not in police protection; Q 1″

                What Hansard says

                “It would be very axiomatic that if on three occasions the police had offered protection and she hadn’t availed herself of it, then maybe when the police came with the immigration officer, she wasn’t under protection.”

        • Gabby 4.1.1.3
          11 December 2018 at 3:18 pm

          Or she’s realised that when some people read between the lines they come up with pretty weird shit christy.

  5. joe90 5
    11 December 2018 at 8:17 am

    Macron – minimum wage to increase by 100 euros a month, tax relief for pensioners/low income workers.

    https://www.france24.com/en/live

    • SaveNZ 5.1
      11 December 2018 at 9:15 am

      French style protest works.

      • joe90 5.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 9:33 am

        He’s thrown a bone from the top table.

        /

        • SaveNZ 5.1.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 9:55 am

          better than NZ, where we get nothing at all and never listened to.

          • joe90 5.1.1.1.1
            11 December 2018 at 10:06 am

            And the last time we took to the streets….oh, that’s right, we don’t.

            We post long, verbose, wittering tracts in lieu ….because we’re a craven, I’m all right Jack, ladder pulling mob.

            • SaveNZ 5.1.1.1.1.1
              11 December 2018 at 10:14 am

              We are short on leaders, but I guess dirty politics also plays it’s part. Also the unions have become very process orientated a bit like the Green Party. But maybe dirty politics also play their part here. We are after all, under mass surveillance and you kinda lose your job or funding if you speak out in NZ.

              • Tricledrown …
                12 December 2018 at 10:36 am

                Save NZ you have got it wrong it’s the support from the middle classes and small businesses who are getting squeezed Macron a cardboard cut out of John Key gave tax cuts to the rich and raised taxes for everyone else the wealthy people and companies pay no tax Macron is one of these uber rich. He got into power promising tax cuts for the over taxed middle classes he didn’t follow through on his promises but still claimed he was a man of his word. So the middle classes are supporting the non violent protest’s outside Paris by feeding and financing protesters. That won’t happen in NZ. The Fascists are causing the violence in Paris because of Bannon is helping the far right racist movement fill a power vacuum the left under Mitterand failed to get the French economy working now Macron is failing Le Pen is stirring up hatred to gain support like Trump. It

        • Tricledrown 5.1.1.2
          12 December 2018 at 10:22 am

          A few crumbs of Cake but he will make cuts elsewhere. Except for the non tax paying uber rich.
          The Gilet Gaunes have won this battle Macron has caved in so that has emboldened the Yellow Jackets now they will push for more concessions.

    • Sabine 5.2
      11 December 2018 at 10:38 am

      gotta love the french.

      And i doubt they are done as of now.

      And i am sure they will be back on the streets if the need arises.

      btw, i think people should refer this not as a ‘french’ movement even tho that france is the one in the news but the gilet jaune/yellow jackets are also active in Belgium, Spain and other places in Europe.
      I don’t thing it will just go away with a 100 Euro per month, but for some families it will mean another week of food.

      • SaveNZ 5.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 12:19 pm

        A French person was telling me you can buy a 2 bedroom apartment in Nice for 50,000 euros. So the other issue is that cars over 10 years are being scrapped or taxed more, but there is a 10,000 euro between the compensation and the new car they need to buy. So they need to come up with a considerable amount of money aka 20% of the amount of an apartment to meet the rules. Meanwhile the oil company apparently pays no tax at all, and the government is doing nothing to tax the big oil who are creating the environmental problems in the first place???

        I have always admired how the french can ensure a decent quality of life for themselves and plenty of benefits because they go crazy when their government tries to take it away and stop the economy working by blocking the streets. Once you do that, you tend to get your way fairly quickly.

        • Sabine 5.2.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 1:14 pm

          i lived in Nice from 1992 – 1998, you never could buy anything for 50.000 euros in Nice.

          sorry, you have been told porkies.

          https://www.french-riviera-property.com/en/apartments-for-sale.cfm?idvl2=10

          The rental market in the Cote d’Azur reflects the fact that it is high value properties over run by tourists from March – October. Most people i knew lived if they could in an HLM – French Social Housing, especially families with kids.

          As for the cars, some cars in France really should not be on the road :), but in saying that, it is a problem that we need to affront at some stage namely that we can’t continue to drive in our single serve boxes, and keep driving really old cars that have terrible exhausts etc.

          As anywhere else in hte world the big corporations pay no more taxes in France then they pay in the US or elsewhere…… is that not what they -pay accountants for?

          Generally this strike really comes down to the fact that the worker in France can’t be squeezed anymore, that the government spends as if they could squeeze the workers some more and that the increase on Gasoline via taxes was the last drop.

          But don’t ever think you can buy an appartment in Nice for 50.000 Euro.

    • Sabine 5.3
      11 December 2018 at 10:41 pm

      Just read on the Nice Matin that the smic will not be increased by 100 euros per month ,but that the increase is actually a top up to a benefit some who are on the smic will receive and that that will happen in steps, i.e. first augmentation of the prime d’activité (similar to our working for families) will be 30 euros, then 20 then 20 etc until a hundred is received.
      In saying that not all workers who only gain smic (minimum wage) will receive la prime d’activite.
      https://www.nicematin.com/politique/non-le-smic-naugmentera-pas-vraiment-de-100-euros-par-mois-284450?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&#Echobox=1544511407

  6. WeTheBleeple 6
    11 December 2018 at 8:26 am

    Western Springs bush is under threat from councils inept planning. Plans to clear fell the pines and replant in natives ignores the already established and ecologically important native bush regenerating on site. A bush decades old.

    My objection is that the bush is a host area for many native fungi, unsung heroes in an important range of ecosystem services. But there’s many plants, birds and insects there that need our help too.

    The bush sits above a stream that flows directly into the Waitemata harbor, so removing vegetation is also risky in this regard. This stream and its tributaries are host to native banded kokopu, bullies, eel, and paratya.

    You may object with a signature, and even a comment, should you wish.

    https://www.toko.org.nz/petitions/save-western-springs-native-forest

  7. SaveNZ 7
    11 December 2018 at 9:54 am

    Worth watching.

    Children in state care fragile after ‘trauma upon trauma’

    https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018674984/children-in-state-care-fragile-after-trauma-upon-trauma

    In my view a lot of the rise of mental illness really goes hand in hand with society dysfunction and that is across the board from high to low socio economic groups but with different issues. The problem can be families are working too much and are not strong enough family supports to encourage strong mental health. Nowadays people seem to be fobbed off with a phone line or some external agency that probably does little to nothing. Neoliberalism has made money more important than society.

    With state care, any kid who is abused then has to endure 30 different homes in 3 years? if you were mentally ok before as a kid, good chance you wouldn’t be after! By fobbing off bad agency systems, onto ‘metal health’ is also an issue because how the state care system seems to function is the bigger problem causing the mental health issues then and later on top of whatever trauma the kids suffered before they were taken away.

    Also hope James Shaw is able to do something about actually creating real data that can be analysed and then better government decisions made. (see video, as the women says, be brave, don’t cover you own ass).

    The need for much better statistics is across the board from justice to social welfare, immigration and state care. I even noticed that police keep ethnicity data on victims but not the perpetrators, or at least not in the information I was looking for online?

    Weird, is this some woke sop type idea so that they don’t actually do anything about it? They analyse the victims but not detailed data on the criminals so that that they can perhaps try to prevent crimes by being clearer on what is the demographic of criminals increasing or decreasing and the types of crimes?

    • Psych nurse 7.1
      11 December 2018 at 10:45 am

      There are two actions that would reduce our mental health crisis to a manageable level. 1. Stop emotionally, physically and sexually abusing children, it makes for disturbed adults. 2. Stop taking illicit drugs, it makes you mad, if already mad, madder. Remove 1 as above from the equation and 2 will not be an issue.

      • SaveNZ 7.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 11:08 am

        I completely agree with you Psych nurse, but also think a good look at how we are raising our children, our values and our society in general needs a good look at, too.

  8. SaveNZ 8
    11 December 2018 at 10:00 am

    Not good enough. We are constantly lowering our standards in NZ and then giving the wrong people too many chances. For a start if a company is not compliant then they should get a massive fine aka $100,000, never be allowed migrant workers sponsored there if they have any, and if they are non compliant again, they get a bigger fine, third time they have license taken away. Also the WOF should have ratings like the restaurants aka A – D ratings so the public can see if they are competent or not.

    Like wise with Labour inspectors. 2 fines, no migrants workers allowed and if they get caught again, their ability to hire any workers is taken away.

    NZTA inspectors tried to warn of non-compliance issues

    https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/checkpoint/audio/2018674668/nzta-inspectors-tried-to-warn-of-non-compliance-issues

    • Draco T Bastard 8.1
      11 December 2018 at 12:29 pm

      For a start if a company is not compliant then they should get a massive fine aka $100,000

      The problem with that is that the company just shuts up shop and never pays the fine. The owners walk away with their ill-gotten gains.

      Need to make the fine far larger and have it land on the owners. The right-wing should celebrate the personal responsibility and so this government shouldn’t have any problems getting bipartisanship on the bill.

      • Gabby 8.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 4:17 pm

        Barclay’s broken down under the pressure of sudden expectations of usefulness. That’s not what he took the job to be.

        • Draco T Bastard 8.1.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 4:50 pm

          WTF?

          I was only commenting on the ineffectiveness of fining a business when that business can simply deregister and not pay it as we’ve seen time and time again.

          • Gabby 8.1.1.1.1
            11 December 2018 at 4:56 pm

            FIIK draccy, I was commenting on minister Twyford’s managers all buggering off.

          • SaveNZ 8.1.1.1.2
            11 December 2018 at 7:21 pm

            You are right so obviously that is the first thing that should be changed aka not being able to shut up shop when you get a fine to avoid your debts. They need to make people bankrupt unable to own a business for 10 years and also be forced to pay what they owe personally especially if it is employment related.

  9. SaveNZ 9
    11 December 2018 at 10:09 am

    On the constant employment issues for the government, (Barclay, Handley).

    You have to wonder how they can justify some of these salaries in particular the Auckland university chancellor who was closing specialist libraries to save money but the third highest paid public servant on over $700,000!

    All these public servants should not be paid more than PM, and the money from McCutcheon bloated un deserved salary (Auckland university gone backwards in international ratings) could have been spent on libraries and saving the 20 jobs and not reducing the quality of Auckland university courses!

    University of Auckland Vice-Chancellor Stuart McCutcheon to step down

    “He is the country’s third highest-paid public official whose salary is fixed by the State Services Commission, earning between $710,000 and $719,999 in the year to June 2017, behind only the heads of the Accident Compensation Corporation ($830,000-$839,999) and the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment ($800,000-$809,999).

    For comparison, Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern earns only $471,000, although former NZ Superannuation Fund head Adrian Orr, whose salary was fixed by the super fund’s board, earned more than any of these at $1.2 million in 2016-17.”

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12144784

    • SaveNZ 9.1
      11 December 2018 at 10:29 am

      While they are about it, the council CEO and exec team should not be paid more than the Mayor in councils. I don’t even think we should have a council CEO. We all got better council services before the bloat of councils, their poorly performing but highly paid lawyers and less leaky buildings.

      I think after Fonterra we can see that a bloated salary does nothing to ensure better candidates and outcomes for our organisations here in NZ.

  10. Ed 10
    11 December 2018 at 10:51 am

    The title of this link is Peter Hitchens and World War 1.
    However, the 15 minute clip looks at the whole history between Germany and Russia, and the Ukraine.
    I recommend you watch it all, but if you’re interested in current affairs in Ukraine, I highly recommend you listen to the clip from 10:55

    It is Hitchens contention that the NATO and the EU is the aggressor- not Putin.
    He parallels the treatment of the Germans by the Allies in the early 1920s to the treatment of Russia by NATO in the 1990s.
    He notes the betrayal of Russia by NATO when they expanded to the western borders of the truncated Russia.
    I totally agree with him.

    • Gosman 10.1
      11 December 2018 at 11:22 am

      NATO (unlike the defunct Warsaw Pact) is a voluntary mutual defence pact. Nations are no coerced to join. If nations that are close to Russia want to join it is not Nato’s fault but Russia’s. Russia should reexamine it’s behaviour rather than seek to blame others.

      • Gabby 10.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 5:45 pm

        It’s about nations NOT joining gozzer. If the yankers agreed no ex warpaccers in nato, and then reneged on that, the ruskers might just be a bit pissed off.

        • McFlock 10.1.1.1
          11 December 2018 at 11:09 pm

          The Soviets would be pissed. But why wouldn’t the jolly nice Russians, who are a completely different government, want to join NATO some time in the future?

    • sumsuch 10.2
      11 December 2018 at 10:57 pm

      Where democracy goes the other democracies must support. It is the only way power can be held up to account. Singapore relies on the fellow-feeling Lee Kuan Yew instituted into the ruling class. Japan — no one knows, except we muchly appreciate the resistance to an aggressive army. America, a republic with a democratic element much like the Roman Republic on which their constitution was modelled. Dictatorships tend to offload the cost on to later and others.

  11. SaveNZ 11
    11 December 2018 at 12:04 pm

    Why councils should stick to their knitting and NOT enter into development projects. Another interesting question is, if a building is oversized and nobody approved it, surely they can work out who did the mistake, and then get them to pay for it?

    $4.5 million build blowout surprise
    https://www.odt.co.nz/regions/southland/45-million-build-blowout-surprise

    Meanwhile councils seem incapable of doing what they should be with water quality. Maybe less development projects and more keeping an eye and spending their budget on what the ratepayers are paying them for aka keep the water clean for example so they are safe?

    US water scientist shocked by NZ’s water quality
    https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/377890/us-water-scientist-shocked-by-nz-s-water-quality?fbclid=IwAR2-PcO80jmPxCCWvC0rX7c1qdTUZGcbKNuG5mXQdUo69Z7vwwctRkgpcYY

    • WeTheBleeple 11.1
      11 December 2018 at 12:38 pm

      It is interesting that poor water quality influenced the local election towards the democrats. Farmers hoist by their own petard.

      Obviously bringing down stock numbers to carrying capacity is an important first step. On top of this we can plant not only riparian edges, but extensively contoured shelter through farms adding water security, flood mitigation, secondary products, fodder, nitrogen fixation and other ecosystem services to offset/nullify various input costs.

      The trees (and accompanying earthworks to store water in the land) are planted in a manner to provide deep access for water as well via species that tap deep through hard substrates. The whole shebang slows water down, thus erosion, thus fertiliser losses and topsoil losses. This saves money on fertiliser requirements and subsequently reduces overall fertilisers used in the environment. The trees, biodiversity, and nitrogen fixing species add to fertiliser requirement reductions.

      Effluent goes to biodigestors to make biogas to power milking machines, heat water, pump water etc. This greatly reduces pathogens. The solids are then composted for a high value soil amendment, further reducing fertiliser requirements. The liquid remainder is polished in wetlands which can also provide various products and ecosystem services.

      With a marked reduction in input costs and some variety in income streams the ‘reduced production’ for farmers, through shifting some land use to tree crops and reducing chemicals, can be just as profitable or even more so. But not so for big oil, big ag, Fonterra et al who all take a cut of the land’s productivity while everyone else pays for it.

      • SaveNZ 11.1.1
        11 December 2018 at 7:24 pm

        Sadly I don’t think it was the poor environmental aspects of the water that made them mad at the Republicans, but the reduction of their property values….

    • Gabby 11.2
      11 December 2018 at 5:50 pm

      Looks a wee bit like a ratepayer subsidy for favoured local businesses. Sure there’s no conflict of interest though.

      • SaveNZ 11.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 7:25 pm

        and favoured local business didn’t actually want the favour by the look of it, because they do not have 100% occupancy anyway…

  12. greywarshark 12
    11 December 2018 at 12:16 pm

    Rod oram on business in NZ:
    Fonterra
    Tip Top
    Trademe (Interesting possible line here with advice on private equity floating companies so investors beware) – about 13-15 mins in.

    business
    https://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/ninetonoon/audio/2018675082/big-changes-at-fonterra

    Big Changes at Fonterra
    From Nine To Noon, 11:09 am today
    Listen duration 15′ :51″
    Business commentator, Rod Oram says there are bigger things happening at Fonterra than putting Tip Top up for sale. The coop has changed its auditors, the first change in 17 years. He’s also been looking into the winners and losers involved in the Metro Glass story.

  13. joe90 13
    11 December 2018 at 12:45 pm

    Oh boy….

  14. Cinny 14
    11 December 2018 at 12:47 pm

    Wow simon is this the best you can do?

    How many questions have now been asked on the subject, at least 20.

    Got any new material simon?

    3. Hon SIMON BRIDGES to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her statements, answers, and actions in relation to Karel Sroubek?

  15. Gosman 15
    11 December 2018 at 1:11 pm

    You should be aware that this is what Opposition parties do in Parliament. The last Labour lead opposition did the same. Check Hansard if you don’t believe me.

    • McFlock 15.1
      11 December 2018 at 1:27 pm

      I’m just impressed he managed to include a specific topic in that question. Obviously plans to spend the day flogging a dead horse.

  16. veutoviper 16
    11 December 2018 at 3:10 pm

    MEDICINAL CANNABIS BILL

    If anyone is interested, the third reading of the above bill is underway in the House. David Clark has just done the opening speech – and big surprise, Simon Bridges has appeared and is now speaking.

    If I heard rightly (Will check later) , he started by saying that this is the first Bill hearing he has spoken in during this Parliamentary session

    AND he is now claiming that the Bill will allow loose leaf cannabis to be smoked openly in public !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ?????????????????????

    Is this his last stand????

  17. Gabby 17
    11 December 2018 at 5:19 pm

    How does the mayor of Clutha know when the tinny houses open?
    Has he passed his information on to the local police?

    • Sabine 17.1
      11 December 2018 at 6:34 pm

      tinny houses have opening hours?

      oh my what is the world coming too.

    • SaveNZ 17.2
      11 December 2018 at 7:29 pm

      They wait until the local police shut shop normally around 4pm in places of high P manufacture like Helensville. In spite of this the police/government don’t think it is a good idea to keep the police open 24 hours in those places and keep a police presence there at night… I posted an article a while ago about monthly burglaries of local business and thy grab what they want cos they know the police are 40 mins away. Probably the same in Clutha.

      • Sabine 17.2.1
        11 December 2018 at 7:34 pm

        i live a sheltered life.

        mind, the shop next to mine in West AKL got done three times in a year. We got really good at taking down details to give to the local copper brigade. Not sure if it helped.

  18. Morrissey 18
    11 December 2018 at 7:37 pm

    Bienvenido al infierno, Señor Betancur

    George H.W. Bush wasn’t the only blood-soaked American POS to kick the bucket recently.

    https://rdln.wordpress.com/2018/12/11/colombia-the-real-and-bloody-legacy-of-belisario-betancur/

  19. eco maori 19
    12 December 2018 at 7:58 am

    Kia ora Newshub Ka pai to Time Magazine for putting Jamal Khashoggi up and naming him person of the year we can not let them kill our truth tellers off.
    Good fantasy it is men who are to blame for the way the world treats wahine all the men in power who cheat and lie to keep wahine out of leadership roles they know the wahine will keep them honest.Ingrid NZ treats our Wahine a lot better than most other country’s I do get what you mean about wahine having to be alerted to dangers of our society everytime they step outside .
    The Salvation Army does a great job YES PEE is a big problem in maori communitys it hooks the user and makes them do anything for there next hit hence my anti CRACK word . Who’s on the air nz board this has the same tune as the digger cutting the fuel pipe . gold smith you would prefer to cut all the trees down and ruin our environment.
    We have reports that the regions have been starved of resources for years poverty big health problem’s .Ka kite ano

  20. eco maori 20
    12 December 2018 at 9:48 am

    Ka pai to the London Mayor for implementing a strategy to drastically reduce carbon use this is what is needed to save our future .The climate change deniers can not see past there hip pockets Muppet.
    Catastrophic climate breakdown might be as little as 12 years away,” she said. “This would have profound impacts on every aspect of our lives in London from flooding and overheating in summers, disruption in our food supply chains as well as in the wider natural world.

    “The mayor needs to be at the forefront of this challenge, declaring a climate emergency and an urgent updating of his carbon reduction targets to make London carbon neutral by 2030, decades ahead of his current plans, setting a precedent for other major and world cities.”

    Khan said he had already introduced a series of measures to tackle climate breakdown – from investing £500m in low carbon technologies to divesting pension funds from fossil fuels. On Sunday 100 academics, philosophers and authors wrote to the Guardian to back a new civil disobedience group – Extinction Rebellion – and called for people around the world to rise up and organise against the “paralysis” of political leaders. Ka kite ano. links below

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/dec/11/london-mayor-sadiq-khan-city-climate-emergency

  21. eco maori 21
    12 December 2018 at 1:11 pm

    Here you go trump and his go oil party are deliberately destroying any chance of there being a positive out come at the UN climate summit ka pai to Vanuatus minister for calling them out over there bulling tact ticks dump trump
    The United States and other high carbon dioxide-emitting developed countries are deliberately frustrating the UN climate summit in Katowice, Poland, Vanuatu’s foreign minister has said. His warning came as Pacific and Indian ocean states warned they faced annihilation if a global climate “rule book” could not brokered.

    In a bruising speech before ministers and heads of state, Vanuatu’s foreign minister, Ralph Regenvanu, singled out the US as he excoriated major CO2-emitting developed countries for deliberately hindering negotiations.

    “It pains me deeply to have watched the people of the United States and other developed countries across the globe suffering the devastating impacts of climate-induced tragedies, while their professional negotiators are here at COP24 putting red lines through any mention of loss and damage in the Paris guidelines and square brackets around any possibility for truthfully and accurately reporting progress against humanity’s most existential threat,” links below ka kite ano.

    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/dec/11/us-accused-of-obstructing-talks-at-un-climate-change-summit

  22. eco maori 22
    12 December 2018 at 4:58 pm

    Eco Maori says when one person makes a call that if he is impeached it tells me that he believes he is guilty NO.
    Former national security adviser to President Donald Trump Michael Flynn has asked a federal judge to spare him from prison time, according to his defense team’s memo before his sentencing
    Flynn is the highest-ranking Trump official to face charges in the Mueller probe. He pleaded guilty in December 2017 to lying to the FBI about his contacts with the then-Russian ambassador to the US. Flynn initially denied — but eventually said — that they had discussed sanctions and a United Nations resolution during the presidential transition. The saga led to his early exit from the White House. Ana to kai links below
    P.S I would not be so focused on this subject if they were not trying to destroy Papatuanuku and all her creatures just for power and money.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/11/politics/flynn-attorneys-response-sentence/index.html

  23. eco maori 23
    12 December 2018 at 6:42 pm

    Kia ora Newshub
    That’s the way Winston banning smoking in homes is a stupid move the smoke tax’s caused the poor to become even poorer and shonky new this its a pity the maori party did not figure that out.
    Air NZ engineer strike is totally unexceptionable at this time of the year they make heaps of profits to pay for good staff it just a neo stunt never had these problems when shonky was in.
    Just depends who is doing the berthing study on the increased risk of getting cancer as they will make the results suit there agenda there is a motive to put Wahine off child birth. I have seen a studys saying marg is better than butter eggs are bad for you ECT any one with a brain can work out the bull from the facts.
    Lloyd the towel need to be thrown in A.
    Ka pai to Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer trying to stop the USA government shut down .
    Personally I strongly discourage Wahine from dating people from dating sights there is to much risk for Wahine.
    Reduced speed limit on the speed limits on the intercity limits of Auckland will save lives and minimize traffic jams .
    Ka kite ano

  24. eco maori 24
    12 December 2018 at 7:20 pm

    Kia ora James & Mulls from the Crowd Goes Wild .
    Its good news Ardie staying in Aotearoa playing rugby.
    Anna I enjoy the company of a horse had many advencers on a horse good luck to Jonelle & Tim in the Badminton in Aotearoa
    I say there will be a good boxing match in Christchurch this weekend guys .
    Kane had a good batting match in the Black caps win Ka pai guys better stick to serfing ka kite ano

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