Open Mike 30/11/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 30th, 2016 - 159 comments
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159 comments on “Open Mike 30/11/2016”

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  1. Andre 1
    30 November 2016 at 6:56 am

    Interesting, anti-immigrant groups in the past have used a “competitor standing” doctrine to try to limit immigration on the grounds that immigrants compete with local workers and harm their prospects. Now that doctrine may get used to go after Trump.

    http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/trump-immigration-legal-theory-231899

  2. Rosemary McDonald 2
    30 November 2016 at 7:38 am

    Sit still for a wee while and read this….http://www.radionz.co.nz/stories/201825742/justice-delayed-justice-denied

    “At first she didn’t think of the state welfare homes as incarceration. But when she started to interview people she changed her mind. The regimes they were subject to were very similar to prison regimes.

    “They were horrific. Really austere. Children were left in the secure cell during the day with nothing. Nothing. A concrete plinth. They even removed the mattress so they wouldn’t be comfortable during the day. They’d be boiling in the summer, they’d be freezing in the winter. In some institutions they even had a nodding system where the guards or workers wouldn’t even speak to them. You can’t imagine what that would do to you if you’re an adult let alone if you’re 11, 12, 15, that dehumanisation.”

    That dehumanisation included regular use of physical violence as punishment, including electric-shock therapy. Some victims say the shocks were applied to their genitals and other parts of their bodies. Some children were controlled with drugs that sedated or knocked them out.

    Not only are victims deeply distrustful – the state is still acting in ways that call into question its trustworthiness. Currently the process for making a complaint about abuse in state institutions means going through a system set up and administered by the government department that ran the institutions where the abuse happened.”

    Great work by Aaron Smale supporting this morning’s RNZ’s piece about the reports about abuse in State care.

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport

    Interview with Judge Henwood, and currently Kim Hill has Anne Tolley on the griddle. I hope the audio will be available later.

    Anne Tolley’s current defense is along the lines that only 3.odd percent of the 100,000 who went through State care during this period have made complaints.

    Heartless bastards.

  3. DH 3
    30 November 2016 at 7:44 am

    Meantime back on planet NZ where life still goes on our despicable Government is caught out by whistle-blowing from Housing NZ and no-one appears to have even noticed, likely because they’re too obsessed with Donald Trump.

    The opposition parties have been handed the opportunity of a lifetime and I’ll bet few if any even know it.

    • Ed 3.1
      30 November 2016 at 8:00 am

      OK I’ll bite – I haven’t noticed – do you have a cite?

      • DH 3.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 8:21 am

        Page 72 of their annual report….. hidden away in the notes.

        http://www.hnzc.co.nz/assets/Uploads/Annual-Report-2016.pdf

        • millsy 3.1.1.1
          30 November 2016 at 8:35 am

          ?

        • James Thrace 3.1.1.2
          30 November 2016 at 9:26 am

          If you’re talking about the Tamaki Redevelopment Co notes, that’s already been covered off on an earlier Open Mike.

          The Tauranga and Invercargill property sales are dead in the water.

          If it’s not either of those things, a more specific example that’s not a vague reference to “hidden away in the notes” would be more helpful.

          • DH 3.1.1.2.1
            30 November 2016 at 9:32 am

            Just how hard is it to download the file and read a page James?

            • James Thrace 3.1.1.2.1.1
              30 November 2016 at 11:35 am

              Point.

              >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>You.

              I read it, but it wasn’t immediately obvious to what you were referring to.

              More clarity next time please.

              Thank you.

        • Graeme 3.1.1.3
          30 November 2016 at 10:04 am

          HNZC is a social housing agency.

          But they have to make an allowance in their asset valuations for an impairment for a small proportion of their stock that they are selling to account for being a social housing agency.

          WTF

          So they are valuing their assets, and the return on those assets as if they were a normal commercial landlord. They say themselves that their assets are overvalued by 50 – 60%

          Jeez, if a private sector business tried that on it’d get messy fast.

          • DH 3.1.1.3.1
            30 November 2016 at 10:14 am

            Yup. And a whole lot can be read and concluded from that.

            One logical conclusion is they’ve established a formula for pricing the state houses they intend to sell to social housing providers. They’ve just announced the intended sale of 2400 state houses in ChCh and using their own formula they’d be intending to sell $1 billion worth of property for $380 million.

            Selling significant publicly owned assets for only 38% of their value is not condusive to staying a government. Even National voters wouldn’t wear that, we all know what property is worth.

            • alwyn 3.1.1.3.1.1
              30 November 2016 at 10:47 am

              Really? That sounds exactly like the proposed Labour Party policy of building houses and selling them to people with low incomes at a discount.

              The fact that the Party website says
              “KiwiBuild homes will only be sold to first home buyers. To avoid buyers reaping windfall gains a condition of sale will require them to hand back any capital gain if sold on within 5 years”
              clearly implies they expect to sell them at below market value.

              I wonder how you qualify to buy one? Will production of a Union Card or proof of Labour Party membership be required?

              • DH …
                30 November 2016 at 10:58 am

                You need to go back for further programming alwyn, that was a pretty weak attempt at diversion even by your standards.

                • alwyn …
                  30 November 2016 at 11:09 am

                  You mean it is true and you don’t know how to justify it.

                  • DH …
                    30 November 2016 at 11:16 am

                    Ah, no alwyn. Meaning your hearing is impaired. The information you posted doesn’t sound anything like what you thought you heard. No mention is made there of discounting the houses, indeed they’re doing the opposite in taking any capital gain that might accrue.

                    Now either your reading comprehension is so poor there’s no point in me conversing with you for fear of having my words misread, or you’re merely trying to derail & divert in which case there’s no point in me conversing with you there either.

                    Back to the reprogramming booth for you.

            • Graeme 3.1.1.3.1.2
              30 November 2016 at 12:11 pm

              Good that HNZC recognise that covenants are required to protect the social housing use once sold to the private provider. But that should have been explicit in the valuation, and expected return on that valuation, from the very beginning.

              When the beginning was will have considerable political import, and along the way someone may have miss-understood, or been devious / deceived around the basis of valuation.

              Time to sit well back and see where this cow pat lands.

              It’s not that they were “Selling significant publicly owned assets for only 38% of their value”, the assets were overvalued by 163%

              • DH …
                30 November 2016 at 12:56 pm

                They’re not overvalued Graeme, HNZ are required to declare their housing stock at “Fair Value” according to IFRS rules and have done so for quite some time.

                The social housing providers are non-profit organisations so there is no commercial valuation here. This is really about funding IMO. This tells me the charities that the Govt wants to sell to have no spare money. They look to be needing to borrow the dosh to buy the houses and HNZs income statement reveals the nett rental return from the properties won’t even come close to paying the interest on substantial levels of borrowed funds.

                They can’t fund the deal on borrowed money at market rates, the rental income won’t pay the interest, so I’d expect the only way the deal can proceed is if English gives them a humungous discount or fronts them a low/no interest loan.

                • Graeme …
                  30 November 2016 at 1:15 pm

                  And they would have been valued under the same rules once the covenant / encumbrance had been applied to the property title. But nothing has changed about the property or it’s use, just the expected owner.

                  I see it more as explaining how inappropriate the “dividends” HNZC paid to the shareholding minister were. Both from the moral repugnance of it all and the usurious way that these dividends appear to have been calculated. No wonder the govt got out of there as quickly as they did.

                  • DH …
                    30 November 2016 at 2:21 pm

                    Oh come now Graeme, do you seriously believe that a 25 year encumbrance really lowers the value of a house?

                    Commercial properties are often leased out on encumbrances like 7×7 terms, do you see any of those having their price lowered because they have to be leased for the next 14 years?

                    Get real mate, the encumbrance values are bullshit. All housing NZ properties are rented out at market rates and you’re trying to justify them being sold at a 60% discount to market price?

                    • Graeme …
                      30 November 2016 at 7:53 pm

                      Well one of them is bullshit, as I said at the start nothing has actually changed, just a different way of looking at it.

                      The original valuations would have reflected the commercial value of the properties that could be rented and sold on the open market. The second reflected properties that could be rented as social housing, but not on-sold for capital gain.

                      The govt has got themselves in a bit of a hole there, as it would be politically difficult if the properties were on-sold for a profit, hence the encumbrance.

                      Whether HNZ’s properties were, or could be rented or sold on a commercial basis on the open market is a very debatable concept due to it’s social housing responsibilities and function. It does increase the possible / requires dividend if the assets are viewed as fully commercial however. I tend to the view that it’s actually the first valuations that are questionable.

                    • DH …
                      30 November 2016 at 9:25 pm

                      “Well one of them is bullshit, as I said at the start nothing has actually changed, just a different way of looking at it.”

                      Huh? A very fundamental change has occurred, $240 million worth of a publicly owned asset has been written off for no good reason or reward.

                      “The original valuations would have reflected the commercial value of the properties that could be rented and sold on the open market. The second reflected properties that could be rented as social housing, but not on-sold for capital gain. ”

                      One would need to have come down in the last rain shower to fall for that line Graeme. These new valuations occurred in the context of the Govt being in lengthy negotiations with a potential buyer. It would be a complete fool who gives away their bottom line price to the other party wouldn’t it, clearly the ‘valuations’ were retrospective.

                      Of course they can be on-sold for capital gain. They can be held for 25yrs, amassing very considerable gains, and on-sold to anyone or on-sold earlier to another social housing provider. It’s little different to the situation of operators like Rymans and they don’t get to buy their retirement complexes at 38cents in the dollar do they.

                      “I tend to the view that it’s actually the first valuations that are questionable.”

                      You’d be questioning IFRS there and it’s not really relevant to the topic.

  4. Tricledrown 4
    30 November 2016 at 8:28 am

    Tolley the terrible.
    She is under orders to minimise the financial damage.
    Having an independent agency and enquiry will show its more like 70% of children who were state wards were violently sexually psychologically abused.
    Tolley’s dispicable obfuscation including she was just a child(still).
    I know many many state wards most seriously damaged unable to function as adults.
    Nasty Nasty piece of Work .
    Shame on you Tolley.

    • tc 4.1
      30 November 2016 at 11:15 am

      Thats why she is there along with collins, parata and bennett.

      Nasty people in a nasty party doing nasty things in govt.

      Recall kate wilkinson, far to nice and nowhere near nasty enough so got moved on.

  5. Ad 5
    30 November 2016 at 8:28 am

    The interview with Minister Anne Tolley on RNZ is going to go down in infamy as one of the worst and most heartless pieces of work in modern New Zealand politics.

    Has anyone heard anything like it in the last three decades?

    Also a particularly stupid juxtaposition:

    On the one hand, Minister of Education Hekia Parata shuts down a Special Needs school in Dunedin for allegations about two teachers where the Police don’t see a case to answer, and so far there’s no evidence to be seen anywhere. So far.

    Quite a strong reaction from the state to protect people under its direct control and care.

    And on the same day, the Minister of Social Welfare cannot open her mouth and utter the word “I am sorry” for decades of solidly proven abuse on behalf of the state while protecting people under its direct control and care.

    This story is now set to roll.

    • jcuknz 5.1
      30 November 2016 at 8:42 am

      And also reported one parent who saw nothing untoward at that Dn school.
      Me thinks some stirrers with bees in their bonnet at work. Perhaps that parent has brought up their child correctly?

      • Rosemary McDonald 5.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 8:51 am

        “Perhaps that parent has brought up their child correctly?”

        You might want to back up the judgmental truck there a tad jcuknz.

        The whole issue of managing meltdowns and difficult behaviours is nuanced…requires a little more knowledge and experience that perhaps some commenters lack.

    • Rosemary McDonald 5.2
      30 November 2016 at 8:48 am

      Natrad is on fire this morning!

      Although, having to listen to the smarmy, patronising and eventually whiny tones of both Tolley and Parata in the same morning is almost too much.

  6. Puckish Rogue 6
    30 November 2016 at 9:09 am

    I don’t always agree with him but he’s pretty much spot on here:

    http://www.philquin.com/blog/2016/11/29/castro-mourning-by-hipster-lefties-makes-me-sick

    • joe90 6.1
      30 November 2016 at 9:29 am

      Or is it the 79,000 extrajudicial killings?

      Quin’s source for this figure, his arse or the lunatic claims of the exile community?.

      • Puckish Rogue 6.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 9:44 am

        Phew that’s lucky, here I was thinking Castro was an unpleasant person, glad that’s cleared up:

        https://www.amnesty.org/en/latest/news/2016/11/fidel-castro-s-human-rights-legacy-a-tale-of-two-worlds/

        Upon establishing his provisional government in 1959, Castro organised trials of members of the previous government that resulted in hundreds of summary executions. In response to an international outcry and amid accusations that many of the trials were unfair, Castro responded:

        “Revolutionary justice is not based on legal precepts, but on moral conviction… we are not executing innocent people or political opponents. We are executing murderers and they deserve it.”

        • KJT 6.1.1.1
          30 November 2016 at 9:57 am

          From a supporter of our Government of serial child abusers.

          FIFY.

        • joe90 6.1.1.2
          30 November 2016 at 9:58 am

          Oh, he was a particularly unpleasant person but unless of course Quin counted the estimated Balseros death toll, 79,000 extrajudicial killings, really.

          February 19, 2008 Update on Findings

          This work documents loss of life and disappearances of a political or military nature attributed to the Cuban Revolution. Each documented case is available for review at http://www.CubaArchive.org and substantiated by bibliographic/historic data and reports from direct sources. Due to the ongoing nature of the work and the difficulty of obtaining and verifying data from Cuba, the following totals change as research progresses and are considered far from exhaustive. Cuba Archive is currently examining additional cases –most are expected to be added to this table. Experience has shown that as additional outreach efforts are undertaken, many more cases are likely to be uncovered’.

          […]

          Documented Cases

          Firing squad executions 4,074

          Extrajudicial killings not in prison 1,334

          Missing and disappeared 219

          Other, including deaths in prison(1) 2,215

          http://www.cubaverdad.net/genocide.htm#Other

          • Puckish Rogue 6.1.1.2.1
            30 November 2016 at 10:01 am

            It’s good that since Quinn got those numbers, allegedly, wrong everything else can be safely ignored 🙂

            • McFlock 6.1.1.2.1.1
              30 November 2016 at 12:11 pm

              It does bring to mind the question of the accuracy of “everything else” if estimates vary that wildly.

              Frankly, seven thousand just after the revolution seems a bit low to me – they captured 1200 in the Bay of Pigs, I would have thought many of those would have been put on trial and received severe sentences.

              Even so, Cuba’s better off than if Batista had remained.

      • Gosman 6.1.2
        30 November 2016 at 9:47 am

        The moral bankruptcy of people on the left is truly wonderful to behold. I suspect you think the ends justifies the means.

        • KJT 6.1.2.1
          30 November 2016 at 9:55 am

          You crying for Batista’s bunch of criminals.
          LOL.

          • Gosman 6.1.2.1.1
            30 November 2016 at 9:57 am

            Ummm… you seem to be making a massive leap there. Not surprising for supporters of brutal leftists dictators like Castro. The idea that if you are not with them you must support who they disposed is one of the reasons human rights went out the window when Castro took power.

            • KJT 6.1.2.1.1.1
              30 November 2016 at 10:10 am

              Local councils with democratic control who send remits and consensus upwards to their Government.
              Cubans have more democratic control over things that affect them than we do.

              Meanwhile, in the USA, everyone is terrified of what Trump may do with his dictatorial powers.

              Castro saved Cuba from being one of the many examplars of US controlled South American capitalism.
              Haiti, Nicaragua, Chile, Mexico. All poverty and crime ridden failed States.

              Funny we never hear about all the people trying to leave them. Except for Trump and Obama trying to send them back.

              If you are going on about human rights. There are some really serious and continued abuses in Cuba. In the US controlled Guantanamo Bay.
              Not to mention, on our own doorstep. In Indonesia and Australia/Nauru

              • Gosman …
                30 November 2016 at 10:22 am

                You really think the average Cuban has more control over their life than we do? Pray tell how the average Cuban can afford to go to a holiday resort in their own country without access to hard currency and why should they be denied that right?

                • Clump_AKA Sam …
                  30 November 2016 at 10:23 am

                  I don’t know much about Cuba. But Britians have less control than Cubans

                • Draco T Bastard …
                  30 November 2016 at 11:29 am

                  This may come as a surprise but going to a holiday resort isn’t a human right.

                  • Gosman …
                    30 November 2016 at 11:35 am

                    Except in moderately developed economies the vast majority can afford to spend some time at a holiday resort at some stage.

                    • Draco T Bastard …
                      30 November 2016 at 11:39 am

                      Have you got proof that Cubans can’t?

                    • Gosman …
                      30 November 2016 at 11:47 am

                      If you think the vast majority of Cubans are able to access a resort (even a relatively down market one) more power to you.

                    • KJT …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:01 pm

                      Tell that to the jobless brown kids in Whangarei.

                    • Draco T Bastard …
                      30 November 2016 at 1:29 pm

                      If you think the vast majority of Cubans are able to access a resort (even a relatively down market one) more power to you.

                      Ah, so you don’t have anything to back up your assertion. That would make what you said a lie.

                      But that’s all we can expect from RWNJs – they have to lie because reality doesn’t conform to their delusional beliefs.

                    • ropata …
                      30 November 2016 at 2:55 pm

                      RWNJ’s think that an independent nation should just bend over and take it when US corporations want to rape and pillage.

                      The Cubans should not have stood up for freedom and justice, they should have let themselves be impoverished and exploited by criminal US enterprises.

                      Remind us, which nation throws people into Guantanamo Bay without trial?

            • Tricledrown 6.1.2.1.1.2
              30 November 2016 at 10:33 am

              Was that when the mafia ran Cuba into communism.
              After years of exploitation by the Mafia anything was better as far as the peasants were concerns.
              American foreign policy could have solved the problem but alas just like in Syria the Russians gave Fidel Castro a better deal.
              The Americans have propped up nasty dictators all through Central America for over a century!

              • Gosman …
                30 November 2016 at 10:36 am

                Castro was always a communist dictator (either in waiting OR in power). There was no way he was going to be some sort of Carribean Social Democrat. The Soviet Union didn’t force him to outlaw private enterprise or send Cubans offshore to ferment Communist revolution in other nations.

            • joe90 6.1.2.1.1.3
              30 November 2016 at 10:35 am

              human rights went out the window when Castro took power

              .

              Yeah, if you ignore the 20,000 Cubans murdered by the Batista regime, human rights in Cuba prior to Castro were just fucking peachy.

              • Gosman …
                30 November 2016 at 10:57 am

                So that makes it okay in your book does it? Somehow all Castro’s human rights abuses are fine because the person he replaced was worse. I suppose that would explain why many leftists in the West supported East Germany. At least they weren’t the Nazi’s

                • Draco T Bastard …
                  30 November 2016 at 11:32 am

                  No it doesn’t make it right but it does show that he actually made life better in Cuba from what was before.

                  Unlike our present NZ government which is actively making life worse for the poor so a few rich people can get richer. And, yes, there’s probably deaths involved as well from those policies.

                  • Gosman …
                    30 November 2016 at 11:39 am

                    The average poor person in NZ has a life that the average Cuban could only dream of. That is the tragedy of Cuba. With better economic management the country could have been a success story. Instead it is an economic basket case.

                    • adam …
                      30 November 2016 at 11:52 am

                      Basket case, yeap you put an embargo on NZ for half a century and see where we end up. I like how you cherry pick and ignore facts Gosman.

                    • Red []
                      30 November 2016 at 11:58 am

                      Trade is bad, ask Draco and the Nz loony left, any decent planned economy does not need it, so sorry no out there Also hard to trade with some one that wants to nuke you

                    • Gosman …
                      30 November 2016 at 11:59 am

                      Stop with the nonsense of the embargo. There is not one documented case of Cuba not being able to trade with a nation outside the US as a result of the embargo. Heck the country traded with the Soviet Bloc for 30 years. It can trade with the EU or China or even NZ. Name me one item that it couldn’t get from outside the US.

                    • KJT …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:08 pm

                      Looked far from a “basket case” to me.

                      Actually havn’t seen so many clean, happy leisured people anywhere else, apart from New Zealands dairy farmer retirement towns, Mt Muanganui and Cambridge.

                      Especially glaring compared to parts of New Jersey, and Haiti and Jamaica.

                      You’ve been reading far too much propaganda from the same people who say that Chavez was a dictator?

                    • KJT …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:10 pm

                      Life expectancy in Cuba is better than the USA, and not far behind us.

                    • adam …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:16 pm

                      Car parts. Kiwifruit. There two.

                      Your utter refusal to look at how international politics, and how it works Gossy is outstanding. The Embargo had the effect of stopping trade with anyone who did not want to piss off the USA. Which was a big group, that even NZ was part of till after the fourth labour government.

                      But lets leave aside your lack of understanding of international politics. The other effect was to limit hard currency Cuba could lay it’s hands on. You understand what that does to an economy right?

                    • Gosman …
                      30 November 2016 at 1:15 pm

                      Car parts and Kiwifruit? ?? The Cubans can get those from any number of nations. As for the US applying pressure on countries not to trade, there is no evidence for that. Indeed I believe Mexico is one of Cuba’s largest trading partners. That is not indicative of the US causing problems.

                    • Macro …
                      30 November 2016 at 1:34 pm

                      Facts to Gosman are such horrid things.
                      Cuba is the living example of what life will be like post oil.
                      Gossy take a hard long look and if you happen to be young enough to survive to until the time oil becomes so expensive it is no longer extracted, just think of what it must have been like for Cubans for the past 50 + years.
                      By the way – if you ever need a doctor in that part of the world – make sure you are in Cuba – not the US. In Cuba its free – you will come out minus an arm and a leg in the US.

                    • adam …
                      30 November 2016 at 2:21 pm

                      Are being obtuse Gossy, or are you really that ignorant of international politics and it’s machinations?

                  • Red …
                    30 November 2016 at 11:45 am

                    Yes I give you Castro did well in convincing left ideologues and his people of that, as does North Korea howeve pre and post Cuba economic stats don’t support your rediculous statement, even before contrasting living standards in Cuba vs Latin America, Europe pre revolutions to now

                • adam …
                  30 November 2016 at 11:47 am

                  Geez Gossy your lot have many on the right supporting old PInochet. It’s a dilemma for your lot.

                  The Cuban revolution was better than what became before, I know you find that hard because a leftist made it better. But they were far from perfect. Guess what – it’s a imperfect world.

                  As for many of your dumb assertions over the last few days have been sickening. The Cuban revolution was born out of nasty set of events. It was led by a Castro and like all authoritarian regimes it was crap. But, and it’s a big but, it was better than the authoritarian right wing gangsta nation it was before he came to power.

                  But lets not forget that for 2 million dollars a day the USA put Cuba under an embargo for almost half a century. So, so much for your free trade ah Gosman, so much for freedom there.

                  • Gosman …
                    30 November 2016 at 11:51 am

                    I don’t think many people on the right have claimed Pinochet was anything but a brutal military dictator with blood on his hands. He certainly hasn’t been set up to be some sort of Right wing icon who people should aspire to and that despite Pinochet leaving the country a whole lot better off economically than the mess Allende was making of the place. Noone can claim the same of Castro and Cuba.

                    • adam …
                      30 November 2016 at 11:56 am

                      Actually you just did, by saying he was economically better.

                      You just put him on a pedestal.

                    • Gosman …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:00 pm

                      I’m not putting him on a pedestal. As I stated he was a brutal military dictator with blood of his opponents on his hands. Are you willing to state the same for Castro?

                    • adam …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:06 pm

                      But you did, when you said he was economically better. That is supporting his world view, and economic choices.

                      I have never said otherwise about Castro. But what I have with you is simple, your blanket statements, and ignoring that the Cuban economy was bulldozed by the US.

                      Plus, I think you are conveniently ignoring how bad it was before the revolution. The gangster state before the revolution, was one of the worst in the whole of America’s.

                    • KJT …
                      30 November 2016 at 12:14 pm

                      The economy in Chile took 20years to recover from Pinochet.

                      In what right wing phantasy world did he improve it?

                    • Draco T Bastard …
                      30 November 2016 at 1:25 pm

                      In what right wing phantasy world did he improve it?

                      Rich people got richer and that’s all that the RWNJs care about.

                • Gabby …
                  30 November 2016 at 12:53 pm

                  You agree it was an improvement then.

        • Brigid 6.1.2.2
          30 November 2016 at 10:04 am

          “the ends justify the means” ..like in say Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo Bay?

    • Morrissey 6.2
      30 November 2016 at 10:10 am

      Puckish Rogue, you are a fool to quote Phil Quin for ANYTHING, let alone something where he is clearly so far out of his depth.

      Perhaps the most risible part of the rant you linked to was the sentence beginning: “Anne Applebaum, a brilliant Washington Post reporter, hardly of the right….”

      Anyone who has any familiarity with the views of Anne Applebaum—and Quin obviously does not—would immediately recognize that statement as an absurdity. Applebaum is an “adjunct fellow” at the American Enterprise Institute, a notorious extreme right think tank. Her writing is shrill, biased and the antithesis of scholarly: on one infamous occasion she claimed, outlandishly, that the late Ho Chi Minh, Salvador Allende and Fidel Castro were similar to Stalin, Mao and Kim Il-Sung.

      Applebaum is one of the loudest and most incessant agitators on behalf of the Ukrainian junta, and she has been trenchantly condemned by leading thinkers like Glenn Greenwald.

      On top of all that, she is actively involved in attempts to minimize and trivialize the under-age rape allegations against her friend Roman Polanski.

      Yet Phil Quin, that vacuous chuntering radio ninny, claims she is “brilliant” and “hardly of the right.”

      I don’t expect anything intelligent from Phil Quin, but I must say, Puckish Rogue, that I do expect better from you.

      • Puckish Rogue 6.2.1
        30 November 2016 at 10:48 am

        Fair enough, so whats your take on Castro?

        • framu 6.2.1.1
          30 November 2016 at 12:32 pm

          he appears on way too many t-shirts

        • Morrissey 6.2.1.2
          30 November 2016 at 6:55 pm

          I think Castro was a brave and inspirational leader, and a symbol of freedom and resistance against oppression. However, that doesn’t mean that I think he was not deeply flawed. His intolerance of gays was notorious, which of course makes him pretty similar to a significant portion of the United States House of Representatives. And I never fail to be deeply angry and depressed when I think about Castro’s bumptious and destructive attitude toward the beautiful avante-garde architectural work of the National Art Schools.

          http://www.aljazeera.com/programmes/witness/2015/05/cuba-unfinished-spaces-150519094656409.html

          So my take on him is complicated. But let’s not forget the reality of the situation he faced: He was demonized and targeted for assassination by the United States, which never forgave him for the radical act of leading a popular revolt against Fulgencio Batista, the dictator it backed. Cuba was in a permanent state of siege, as a vengeful superpower pursued a vicious, illegal and internationally condemned jihad against the island state for more than half a century.

          Castro’s legacy should be rigorously criticized—-but by serious scholars, not by shallow know-nothings like Phil Quin.

      • Stunned Mullet 6.2.2
        30 November 2016 at 10:56 am

        4th rate stenographer is outraged….outraged I tells ya !

    • adam 6.3
      30 November 2016 at 11:32 am

      No hipsters are not left Puckish, Liberal (but, so is John Key) but not left. Most hipsters are all about money.

    • reason 6.4
      30 November 2016 at 6:40 pm

      Right wing death squads kill millions and you do not give a stuff ….. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwJMJqjqEdw

      Sick ol Puck …….

      http://www.amara.org/en/videos/lCHCQE8uqUJb/info/jagal-the-act-of-killing-full-movie/

  7. Red 7
    30 November 2016 at 11:03 am

    Cuba income before revolution where 60 pc of European levels, amoung the highest in Latin America they are now the poorest in line with Central America. GDP 1950 per capita was approx 3k still as such in 1999, all hail the planned economy and the great Castro before we even consider the human rights record

    • Gosman 7.1
      30 November 2016 at 11:11 am

      Ah yes but GDP doesn’t count for many leftists. So long as education and health care are ‘free’ that is the real definition of a successful state. No matter that medical professionals don’t earn enough and many have to moonlight in jobs that pay hard currency, or that there is usually not enough drugs or other medical supplies and patients have to provide their own, or that the education they receive hasn’t led to any innovative new businesses or helped develop the Cuban economy at all.

      • Red 7.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 11:31 am

        strange also not many people drowned sailing from Miami to Cuba,

      • Draco T Bastard 7.1.2
        30 November 2016 at 11:38 am

        You do realise that the healthcare available in Cuba is better than that available in the US don’t you?

        In fact, everything you said there sounds like a lie started and propagated through right-wing fake news outlets.

        • Gosman 7.1.2.1
          30 November 2016 at 11:42 am

          No it’s not. What you are stating is the health care in Cuba is better than the health care available in the US for the uninsured. This may well be the case but I suspect in the US poor people are able to access health care of some level that does not need them to provide their own drugs and health supplies.

        • Red 7.1.2.2
          30 November 2016 at 11:48 am

          For the socialist elite and offshore paying customers yes, for the average Cuban, get real, smell the roses Many Cuban doctors are simply sent offshore to generate hard currency for the state

          • Draco T Bastard 7.1.2.2.1
            30 November 2016 at 1:24 pm

            Many Cuban doctors are simply sent offshore to generate hard currency for the state

            [citation needed]

            Although it sounds like more RWNJ false news.

            • alwyn 7.1.2.2.1.1
              30 November 2016 at 6:27 pm

              From the New York Times

              “Havana gets subsidized oil from Venezuela and money from several other countries in exchange for medical services. This year, according to the state-run newspaper Granma, the government expects to make $8.2 billion from its medical workers overseas. The vast majority, just under 46,000, are posted in Latin America and the Caribbean. A few thousand are in 32 African countries.”

              http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/17/opinion/a-cuban-brain-drain-courtesy-of-us.html?_r=0

              The article is quite strongly opposed to the US Government’s action but it does confirm the claim about being a source of income to Cuba.

              • Draco T Bastard …
                30 November 2016 at 6:44 pm

                Ok.

                But this brings up an interesting question:
                What is it about this trade that upsets the right-wing?

                I’m pretty sure that they’ve been telling us how great trade is for centuries. Is it just that there isn’t a private individual making a profit from the work of others as corporations would?

              • reason …
                30 November 2016 at 7:06 pm

                https://www.hrw.org/news/2014/02/28/indonesia-and-act-forgetting

                “I was a couple of months old in October 1965, when the Indonesian government gave free rein to a mix of Indonesian soldiers and paramilitaries to kill anyone they considered to be a “communist.” Over the next few months into 1966, at least 500,000 people were killed (the total may be as high as one million). The victims included members of the Communist Party of Indonesia (P.K.I.), ethnic Chinese, as well as trade unionists, teachers, civil society activists and leftist artists.”

                The Act of Killing

                The film focuses on the perpetrators of the Indonesian killings of 1965–66 in the present day; ostensibly towards the communist community where almost a million people were killed. When Suharto overthrew Sukarno, the President of Indonesia, following the failed coup of the 30 September Movement in 1965, the gangsters Anwar Congo and Adi Zulkadry in Medan (North Sumatra) were promoted from selling black market movie theatre tickets to leading the most powerful death squad in North Sumatra. They also extorted money from ethnic Chinese as the price for keeping their lives. Anwar is said to have personally killed 1,000 people.

                Today, Anwar is revered as the right wing of a paramilitary organization Pemuda Pancasila that grew out of the death squads. The organization is so powerful that its leaders include government ministers who are openly involved in corruption, election rigging and clearing people from their land for developers.”

                A right wing Gangster nation where mass murders are celebrated and walk free …………. I think we either just did a trade deal with them ,,,,,,,,,, or maybe it was a tax haven/offshore network meeting

                Its hard to know with john keys nats ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

              • McFlock …
                30 November 2016 at 7:14 pm

                okey dokey.
                That says 50-odd thousand doctors overseas.

                CIA reckons 6.7 docs per thousand Cubans (looks like 2010 WHO stats).
                Cuban population is 11.1 mil (same source).
                That’s roughly 75 thousand doctors.
                50,000 overseas, that’s 25,000 remaining.
                Or, reversing the process, that’s 2.25 doctors per thousand.
                NZ is 2.74, US is 2.45 per thousand.

                Jamaica is 0.41 per thousand. Just as comparison.

                • alwyn …
                  30 November 2016 at 10:13 pm

                  I really couldn’t care less.
                  DTB asked for a citation that Cuba sent medical people overseas as a way of raising money.
                  I had been talking to a Cuban born friend who was telling me what incredibly low incomes the people in Cuba have. I found this reference when I was googling for info on that subject and remembered it when DTB asked for a reference. I posted it to satisfy his curiosity.
                  For the record I think that Castro was a miserable SOB. Not in the class of Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao or Hitler but a despicable specimen none the less.
                  I am old enough to remember the Cuban missile crisis in October 1962. The one who came out of than looking sane was Khrushchev. Castro wanted to start WW3 and Kennedy wasn’t much different.
                  Castro was willing to destroy the world.

  8. greywarshark 8
    30 November 2016 at 11:11 am

    Hi Robert Guyton
    Are you involved with this new Southland initiative? Sounds promising in the line of other Invercargill moves like adopting toothy Tim as Mayor. You people might be a role model for the Far North, isolated and languishing a bit though trying but with too many conservatives sitting on their prejudices I think – up for violent disagreement with that. (Note a recent radio piece on the police difficulties and understaffing there).

    Southland can only go up along with feisty Stewart Island – after that there is only the Southern Ocean rocky outposts and sealife.

    • The lost sheep 8.1
      30 November 2016 at 1:09 pm

      ‘a bit languishing’
      Violent offense duly taken.
      Southland / Northland
      GDP per capita – 57,135 / 34,825
      Mean household income – 87,100 / 70,000
      Unemployment rate – 3.6% / 8.8%

      ‘Isolated’
      I’ll give you that one, and you forgot to point out that the weather in Southland is shit.

      • Robert Guyton 8.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 1:16 pm

        And Gore, though I think greywarshark was making his languishing comment with regards the Far North, rather than Southland but it certainly brought out the Parochial Defender in you. Good thing too.

        • The lost sheep 8.1.1.1
          30 November 2016 at 1:41 pm

          I’ve spent a bit of time in both places (Dang, sold the holiday home at Shipwreck Bay way too early!).
          IMO the primary reason for the economic disparity between the two regions is that while the kind of grass cows eat grows brilliantly in both, Southland has the good fortune to be crap for growing the kind you smoke.

          • Robert Guyton 8.1.1.1.1
            30 November 2016 at 1:59 pm

            It’s cooler here, so more incentive to dig and delve, rather than head to the beach and the bong.

          • greywarshark 8.1.1.1.2
            30 November 2016 at 3:02 pm

            That’s not a woolly idea. But I figure that with intelligent forward and smart thinking pollies instead of the prim and punitive little greasers we now have…if gummint could get its head around the growing and sale of marijuana under standards they would have a fast-moving expansionist economy. T

            he Northland area would have a ready-made expertise in growing the weed and just need strong guidance to be marketed properly and to standard and be controlled by and keep the returns in, local trusts shared by the community, but employing Maori and pakeha half and half. There would be problems for sure, but just on a better level than at present.

  9. Robert Guyton 9
    30 November 2016 at 11:26 am

    Hi greywarshark
    Do you mean the SoRDS (Southland Regional Development Strategy) that’s being launched this morning in the presence of Steven Joyce and Nathan Guy and seeks to establish fin-fish farms in Fiordland National Park, amongst other things?

    • greywarshark 9.1
      30 November 2016 at 11:39 am

      @Robert G
      Ho ho ho – I little innocent thought that Santa Claus had come with pressies that would be good to play with!

      • Robert Guyton 9.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 12:19 pm

        Sounds like it, doesn’t it. “Swords” though, eh! Economic development, bring in the tourists, double our production, full steam ahead and damn the torpedoes! Pretty keen on drilling and fracking to, that Tom Campbell, Head Sword-wielder. Seen Tom’s name before?

  10. greywarshark 10
    30 November 2016 at 11:55 am

    Ray Columbus has died. Stuff entertainment had this item.
    I thought this was a funny anecdote which relates to Gerry Brownlee – Vicki Anderson at http://www.stuff.co.nz/entertainment/music/87016165/Ray-Columbus-always-had-the-last-word-even-for-Gerry-Brownlee

    2013, I wrote a story about Christchurch talent quest stars the Manetti Brothers, Gerry Brownlee and former schoolmate Richard Holden.
    The pair performed a unique mix of country and western and jazz cover songs around Christchurch bars from 1980 to 1986.

    Towards the end of their career, the Manetti Brothers auditioned in front of Ray Columbus for a TV show.
    “He subtly told us we were crap,” Brownlee told me in 2013.
    He went on to describe the audition as a “cock-up” on Columbus’s part.

    “It was the most appalling thing. We went to the second floor of the now demolished TVNZ building to audition,” said Brownlee.
    “Ray Columbus was there, very small he was. I had to look down to see him, and he said ‘show us what you’ve got’. We only got a little way through our act and he said ‘that’s enough, you guys’. I’m not bitter about it but it was a cock-up in my opinion.”
    Oh how Ray laughed when I read Brownlee’s quote to him.

    • alwyn 10.1
      30 November 2016 at 6:39 pm

      I really think you should have included the last bit of the article

      “”All right,” Ray eventually agreed when I suggested he should have right of reply. “But you can only print this response when I’m gone.”
      As I said, Ray did always like to have the last word.
      “I may be short, Mr Brownlee, but at least I could sing.””

      How true those last 3 words were.

      • greywarshark 10.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 9:46 pm

        Yes Alwyn true, the last three lines are good. But Brownlee has now found how to squeeze the rest of us till we sing.

  11. Rosemary McDonald 11
    30 November 2016 at 12:26 pm

    Deeply insightful piece by renegade farmer journalist Rachel Stewart.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/environment/news/article.cfm?c_id=39&objectid=11756771

    She listened to Guy ‘humans only have ten years left’ McPherson and experienced a personal epiphany….

    “Many try to believe that politicians will soon see the error of their delays, act quickly on our behalf for the good of the planet, and all will be well. Business helps the environment, neoliberalism will save the kea, and continued fossil fuel extraction is a necessary evil. Technology will ultimately save the day. Hurrah!

    I’ve thought hard on what was emotionally so different about McPherson’s short timeframe versus my unquestioning belief in a much longer one. Obviously, the longer timeframe means I’d get to live out my natural life.

    I had never, for one second, consciously entertained the idea that human extinction was conceivable in the near term.

    In other words, I’m basically okay with the sadness and anxiety about some far-off future generation seeing the collapse of humanity. Just not this one. My one.

    Which tells me everything I didn’t want to know about myself. I possess precisely the same procrastination, selfishness and denial that got us into this mess.

    Turns out, I’m only human.”

    • greywarshark 11.1
      30 November 2016 at 12:43 pm

      @Rosemary
      Makes you gulp more than a little. Most people I know are ignoring warnings, but trying to make rational decisions based on the expectation that an ordered society will be possible in the long term. Short term, well more earthquakes, tsunami, a change of government, but near extinction no!

      And how many people are putting the Syrian and African refugees to the forefront. I gave some money some months ago but have been sidetracked by other costs of money and time. Though they are just ordinary people like us who deserve their chance to live and have settled communities without being bombed and murdered because they are inconveniently in the way of strategic assets wanted by giant powers.

      I am part of a group trying to do something for now for the community with an eye for the near to mid- future and having hard enough job to keep people on reality track when their heads are full of untested ideas, beliefs, personality clashes, examples from different times, areas etc which may not be replicated, differing understandings of what we are doing and about, what is of first priority etc. And trying to keep control from being wrested by charismatic loud voices that disdain questioning, quiet and meaningful analysis.

      • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 2:06 pm

        “Short term, well more earthquakes, tsunami, a change of government, but near extinction no!”

        A Young Twentysomething of my acquaintance has (and sometimes is blighted by) what she terms ‘Apocalypse’ nightmares. End of the world stuff in full living colour and 3D. Every disaster, natural or manmade that dominates the headlines results in a sub conscious -produced movie that robs her of the settled sleep she needs to function well. Often this will be a mish-mash of various cataclysms…a bit of earthquake, tsunami with a sub plot of volcanic eruption and civil disorder.

        I can’t say…”Chill, child, it’ll never happen”, that would be lying, but I do try to say that combining all these different types of incidents into one big nightmare is a bit OTT. Then…she points out, that in the middle of the earthquake, and the resulting tsunami warning, miserable scrotes broke into the houses of evacuees and robbed them. Such are humans…and do we really deserve to inhabit, never mind dominate, the planet? I try the “Not all folk are like that”, line, pointing out some of the good stuff that people do…but looking at the Big Picture, the Overall View of The World….???

        • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.1.1
          30 November 2016 at 2:10 pm

          Lyrics…. No lullaby
          Keep your eyes open
          And prick up your ears
          Rehearse your loudest cry.
          There’s folk out there
          Who would do you harm
          So I’ll sing you no lullaby.
          There’s a lock on the window;
          There’s a chain on the door:
          A big dog in the hall.
          But there’s dragons and beasties
          Out there in the night
          To snatch you if you fall.

          So come out fighting
          With your rattle in hand.
          Thrust and parry. Light
          A match to catch the devil’s eye.
          Bring a cross of fire to the fight.

          And let no sleep bring false relief
          From the tension of the fray.
          Come wake the dead with the scream of life.
          Do battle with ghosts at play.

          Gather your toys at the call-to-arms
          And swing your big bear down.
          Upon our necks when we come to set
          You sleeping safe and sound.

          It’s as well we tell no lie
          To chase the face that cries.
          And little birds can’t fly
          So keep an open eye.
          It’s as well we tell no lie
          So I’ll sing you no lullaby.

    • inspider 11.2
      30 November 2016 at 2:33 pm

      McPherson is a moonbat who follows a long line of millerites and millenialists.

      Stewart has been gullible to be sucked in by him as there is little in the way of a life lesson to be drawn from McPherson’s ‘science’ (except perhaps ‘There’s a sucker born every minute’).

      Stewart is particularly obtuse if she’s never encountered the possibility of humanity ending – as an opinion writer she’s remarkably uninformed if she has never read theories or novels on comet impacts, germ warfare, plagues, nuclear war, vogons, zombie apocalypse etc etc.

      • ropata 11.2.1
        30 November 2016 at 3:02 pm

        The IPCC always gives conservative estimates of AGW impact, as I see it McPherson is looking at worst case scenarios. Unlikely perhaps but not outside the realm of possibility.

      • greywarshark 11.2.2
        30 November 2016 at 3:12 pm

        inspider
        Don’t be such a jerk and know all. Plenty of totally unreal things have happened in the last 150 years, they have been real – not unreal, rarely have many imagined their unpleasant possibilities.

        I think you should read this wikipedia page that goes into the realms of thinking and knowing.
        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_are_known_knowns

        And for those others who already know everything and just look sarcastically at others flailing around trying to open and expand their minds – note the numerous thinking pattern systems:

        Black swan theory
        Dunning–Kruger effect
        Epistemic modal logic
        Four stages of competence
        I know that I know nothing
        Ignoramus et ignorabimus
        Ignotum per ignotius
        Johari window
        Known and Unknown: A Memoir
        List of political catch phrases
        Outside Context Problem
        Russell’s teapot
        The Unknown Known
        Wild card (foresight)

        • ropata 11.2.2.1
          30 November 2016 at 5:49 pm

          These are not even unknown or unpredictable events, any science that contradicts the relentless pursuit of profit is treated as a pariah.

          History shows that all civilizations have a limited life span, and there are so many things going wrong with the climate and ecosystems sustaining human civilisation, I think we will see in our lifetimes massive collapses of cities and nations, but hopefully not complete extinction of humanity.

          Our species faces some existential threats but down here in Planet Key we are pretending it’s business as usual for as long as possible. Until it’s too late.

          – record levels of extinctions
          – collapsing bee populations
          – widespread soil degradation
          – increasing pressure on water supplies (fracking, cowshit, mining)
          – human population still growing out of control
          – destruction of remaining rainforests
          – overfishing and fish dumping
          – ocean acidification, warming, and gyres of floating garbage
          – methane emissions from thawing tundra
          – sea level rise and extreme weather events
          – donald trump

  12. Rosemary McDonald 12
    30 November 2016 at 2:36 pm

    Can anyone else hear “Woman of the Year” Helen Kelly cry….YES! ?

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11757719

    “Coroner Bain concluded: “Having reviewed all the evidence, the Court does not support the view that Mr McMurtrie is in effect, the author of his own misfortune. Considerable issues are raised by the family and the Counsel for Trade Unions in respect of fatigue and in the Court’s view this may well have played a significant part in what occurred,” he said.

    “The Court, on the balance of probabilities, finds no fault with Mr McMurtrie.”

    Coroner Bain went on to repeat general findings from three inquest findings released on Friday, in which he said the forestry industry was a far safer place to work now than it was when the eight men died.

    “The primary driver in highlighting the lack of safety in the forestry industry and the need for accountability and urgent safety reforms has been the CTU and, in particular, Helen Kelly,” he said.””

    • reason 12.1
      30 November 2016 at 7:26 pm

      +100……. thanks for the post Rosemary

      It made me happy … and sad.

      For both Helen Kelly and David McMurtrie …

  13. Incognito 13
    30 November 2016 at 3:20 pm

    Many people appear to be concerned about the spread and influence of “fake news” in this so-called post-truth era and agonise about how to deal with it. I don’t think there’s an easy answer – it would be worth a lengthy post here on TS if I knew it would ever get published – but this piece may be a step in the right direction although I don’t think it is nearly enough or sufficient:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/86918289/why-we-should-be-teaching-philosophy-in-schools

    • ropata 13.1
      30 November 2016 at 6:21 pm

      Nope, even philosophy 101 would be far too abstract for most kids.

      Would be good to get the opinion of a teacher, but I remember learning about Nazi propaganda in social studies, and reading ‘1984’ and ‘Brave New World’ (and probably Fahrenheit 451) at various points.

      So I think the basics are covered, if the high school curriculum is anything like it was in the 80s.

      • Incognito 13.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 7:24 pm

        I don’t think philosophy needs to be abstract, rather the opposite, it can be highly practical and relevant. I think it would be great if more emphasis would be given in schools to ethics, logic, analytical thinking, etc. The (human) brain has awe-inspiring capabilities but if we don’t get taught how to engage our brains awful things can and do happen plus it is just a waste of our tremendous potential both individually and collectively IMHO.

        Obviously, you tailor your teaching to the children but IMO philosophy starts at a very young age.

    • Puckish Rogue 14.1
      30 November 2016 at 4:19 pm

      Leggett didn’t leave Labour, Labour left Leggett 🙂

      • James Thrace 14.1.1
        30 November 2016 at 4:53 pm

        Leggett has been right wing all the way through.

        He supports Rogernomics, Goff, hated Cunliffe, and thinks that Labour should focus more on the businessman.

        In short. Typical RWNJ and only out for himself.

    • james 14.2
      30 November 2016 at 4:46 pm

      This was interesting in the same link:

      “There are reports a deal with the Greens to stand aside in Nelson has fractured the local electorate, with as many as eight people said to have quit the party in protest.

      Labour sources suggested to Fairfax there were more.”

      Someone is telling porkies – But it sounds like its possible some of the members are not happy with the MOU implementation.

      • lprent 14.2.1
        30 November 2016 at 5:59 pm

        I believe I have pointed out previously that this is what I’d expect. I’d also expect that the number of people actually voting for the local candidates would drop. I think that the party votes for the area will also drop.

        It may make “political” sense for people in Wellington. However I suspect that overall it is a vote loser.

        Personally as a matter of principal I’d simply vote against whatever party did it. Doesn’t matter if it is National in Epsom or Labour in Nelson. The idea that a political party ‘owns’ votes is just outright dumb. If you have a decent candidate (and Labour and National usually do), then put them up and let the voters make up their mind. Don’t do deals that cut into the voting base.

        We have enough issues with the slow but steady reduction of the turnout already.

  15. McFlock 15
    30 November 2016 at 4:37 pm

    Seems to me that that’s the good direction for Labour to lose members.

    There needs to be a fundamental difference between the two main parties, imo. And a step to the left is illustrated by those who jump to the right 🙂

  16. Ad 16
    30 November 2016 at 5:18 pm

    Very interesting move from the NZ Reserve Bank to seek powers to limit lending to home buyers if they do not earn enough.

    English wants a bit more time to see if the current measures will continue to cool the Auckland market enough. But that’s quite a call if all this debt starts to get riskier.
    I seem to recall Minister Smith this morning saying how important it was that young people didn’t rack up more mortgage debt than they could bear, after figures came in showing the percentage of debt increase for fist home buyers over the last two years. (better jaw jaw than act act, or something).

    For example, events may change fast in the global economy that really push up interest rates up fast, so anyone with a mortgage that isn’t fixed gets in real trouble because it’s just too hard to pay back. Trouble Capital T.

    We will see Ministers meet with the Reserve Bank in the next few weeks to nut this one out. It’s a biggie.

  17. James 17
    30 November 2016 at 11:09 pm

    Latest Roy Morgan is out.

    Ouch for labour. A dismal 23%. Jesus wept.

    National on 49.5%.

    Confidence in the government right up:

    The NZ Roy Morgan Government Confidence Rating has increased strongly to 141pts (up 14.5pts) in November with a high 65% (up 9.5%) of NZ electors saying NZ is ‘heading in the right direction’ compared to only 24% (down 5%) that say NZ is ‘heading in the wrong direction’. This is the rating’s highest score for nearly two years since January 2015.

    • ropata 17.1
      30 November 2016 at 11:19 pm

      The lolly scramble and two-tier economy is working well for Gnat supporters.
      So is the media adulation and careful PR image of AB captain/beer swilling kiwi PM.

      We are ranked near the top of the OECD on all sorts of measures except for absolute basic stuff like education, health, and housing. But that’s all swept under the carpet.

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    An average kiwiBy admin@averagekiwi.com
    1 day ago

  • Chris Trotter on the BFD
    I don't want to give pblicity to certain parts of the internet that are better left to fester in their own irrelevance (I know, a bit like this place) but the listing of Chris Trotter as a 'author' on Cameron Slater's spinoff website, the BFD requires some explanation.Now, I don't ...
    Left hand palmBy lurgee
    2 days ago

  • Sex is not a spectrum
    The text below is a Twitter thread by Heather Heying that explains the essence of sexual reproduction and it long evolutionary history. She is an evolutionary biologist and a “professor-in-exile” after she and her husband, Bret Weinstein, stood up to supporters of an enforced “Day of Absence” for white staff and teachers ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 days ago

  • Climate Change: Trees, aviation, and offsets
    With crunch time for new Zealand climate policy approaching, most of the New Zealand media have got on board with a global reporting effort to cover the issue. There's one strand of stories today about polling and what it shows about changing public attitudes to the crisis, but the strand ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago

  • Pissing-Off The Israelis Is A High-Risk Strategy.
    Dangerous Foes: For those readers of Bowalley Road who feel disposed to dismiss any prospect of an Israeli destabilisation of New Zealand politics, the example of the United Kingdom repays close attention. Ever since the election of Jeremy Corbyn as leader of the British Labour Party, the Israelis have sanctioned, funded and ...
    Bowalley Road
    2 days ago

  • Something to go to in Wellington
    Make It 16, the youth-led campaign to lower New Zealand's voting age, is holding an official campaign launch at Parliament this Friday from 16:30. If you'd like to attend, you can register using EventBrite here. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago

  • A founding member responds to Peace Action Wellington
    by Don Franks It was a lovely sunny Wellington afternoon with blue skies above  the beaches.  In Courtenay Place, political activists packed out a stuffy upstairs room for an important meeting. The assembled pacifists, anarchists, communists and independent young radicals of Peace Action Wellington felt the need for a mission ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 days ago

  • “Mistakes and errors”
    Current and former NZDF top brass are being publicly grilled this week by the hit and run inquiry over their public responses to allegations of civilian casualties. Previously, they've claimed there were no casualties, a position which led them to lie to Ministers and to the public. Now, they're saying ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago

  • “Homosexuality is same-sex attraction and relationships, not heterosexuals with delusions of gende...
    by Rafael D. Quiles (gender-critical gay man from Puerto Rico) The writing on the wall is right in people’s faces and people just don’t see it or don’t want to. What could actually possess a heterosexual male to want to feminize himself and claim that he is a lesbian? Because ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    3 days ago

  • Trump: “Where’s my favourite dictator?”
    From the Wall Street Journal:Inside a room of the ornately decorated Hotel du Palais during last month’s Group of Seven summit in Biarritz, France, President Trump awaited a meeting with Egyptian President Abdel Fattah Al Sisi. Mr. Trump looked over a gathering of American and Egyptian officials and called out in ...
    Left hand palmBy lurgee
    3 days ago

  • Magdalen Burns, 1983-2019, fighter for women’s liberation
    by the Redline blog collective At Redline we are very saddened to hear of the death of Magdalen Burns who passed away on the morning of Friday, September 13 (British time). Magdalen was a great fighter for the rights of women in general and lesbian women in particular, a defender ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    4 days ago

  • Parliament and the Executive
    The Brexit issue has certainly brought with it a series of apparently difficult constitutional issues, many of them concerning the respective roles of the executive and parliament. Most of them arise because of the unwillingness of MPs, despite their professions to the contrary, to be bound by a constitutional rarity ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    4 days ago

  • The Abigail Article; Martyn Bradbury’s Article, and My Response
    . . This blogpost is different to my usual format of reporting on issues… Since July 1011, I have blogged on a variety of political issues; near always political and/or environmental; mostly highly critical of the previous National Government. Other issues included Israeli occupation of Palestinian lands and repression of ...
    Frankly SpeakingBy Frank Macskasy
    4 days ago

  • Police will have to wear silly Buckingham Palace hats from now on, says Police Minister
    Those close to the Police Minister believe the initiative may be the result of Nash “seeing a great deal” on AliExpress. In a move that comes seemingly out of nowhere, Police Minister Stuart Nash announced this afternoon that he expects all frontline staff to don bearskin hats, famously worn by ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    5 days ago

  • A sensible crackdown
    The government has released its Arms Legislation Bill, containing the second tranche of changes to gun laws following the March 15 massacre. And it all looks quite sensible: a national gun register, higher penalties for illegal possession and dealing, tighter restrictions on arms dealers and shooting clubs, and a shorter ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago

  • California bans private prisons
    Private prisons are a stain on humanity. Prison operators explicitly profit from human misery, then lobby for longer prisons terms so they can keep on profiting. And in the US, prison companies run not only local and state prisons, but also Donald Trump's immigration concentration camps. Faced with this moral ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago

  • Why PPPs are a bad idea
    When National was in power, they were very keen on Public-Private Partnerships (PPPs) - basicly, using private companies to finance public infrastructure as a way of hiding debt from the public. They were keen on using them for everything - roads, schools, hospitals. But as the UK shows, that "service" ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    5 days ago

  • A Movement That No Longer Moves.
    Moving And Shaking: There was a time when people spoke matter-of-factly about the “labour movement” – a political phenomenon understood to embrace much more than the Labour Party. Included within the term’s definition was the whole trade union movement – many of whose members looked upon the Labour Party as ...
    Bowalley Road
    5 days ago

  • NZ ‘left’ politically embracing extreme postmodernism
    by Philip Ferguson Much of the left, even people who formally identify as marxists, have collapsed politically in the face of postmodern gender theory of the sort pioneered by American philosopher Judith Butler. For Butler even biological sex is socially constructed. “If the immutable character of sex is contested, perhaps ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    6 days ago

  • The obvious question
    The media is reporting that the (alleged) Labour party sexual assaulter has resigned from their job at Parliament, which means hopefully he won't be turning up there making people feel unsafe in future. Good. But as with everything about this scandal, it just raises other questions. Most significantly: why the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago

  • The moment I found out that you found out, I acted swiftly
    By Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern I am every bit as angry as you are. I am every bit as disappointed as you must be. The people with power, oversight and the ability to do something about these processes within the Labour Party should be ashamed. Whoever those people are, I ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    6 days ago

  • This is why people hate property developers
    Property developers think there is an "oversupply" of houses in Auckland:High turnover rates and falling prices may be a sign that there are too many new houses going in to some parts of Auckland, commentators say. [...] Property developer David Whitburn said there was a "bit of an oversupply" in ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago

  • Australia to Pacific: “Fuck you, you can all drown”
    World leaders are meeting in New York in two weeks for the 2019 Climate Action Summit, where they are expected to announce new and more ambitious targets to stop the world from burning. But the Australian Prime Minister won't be there, despite being in the USA at the time:Scott Morrison ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago

  • Implausible ignorance
    Labour Party president Nigel Haworth resigned yesterday over the party's sexual assault scandal. But while that's good news, its unlikely to take away the stench of a coverup. Because according to Paula Bennett in Parliament yesterday, pretty much everyone in the Prime Minister's office was involved as well:I have been ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    6 days ago

  • Labour’s Fatal Flaw.
     Two-Faced? Labour insiders' commitment to the neoliberal status quo puts them at odds with their party’s membership; its trade union affiliates; and a majority of Labour voters, but this only serves to strengthen the perception they have of themselves as a special elite. Among the lesser breeds, they’ll talk up a ...
    Bowalley Road
    6 days ago

  • Ten reasons the Tories do NOT want an election
    There has been a lot of talk about Boris Johnson wanting an election, and he has blustered with great gusto about 'chicken' Jeremy Corbyn refusing one, but I think there are many reasons why he is secretly glad he has been refused the opportunity:The Tories are an utter rabble,tearing themselves ...
    Left hand palmBy lurgee
    7 days ago

  • Prorogation Illegal, rule Scottish judges
    Scottish appeal court judges have declared that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament in the run-up to the October Brexit deadline is unlawful. The three judges, chaired by Lord Carloway, Scotland’s most senior judge, overturned an earlier ruling that the courts did not have the powers to interfere in the prime ...
    Left hand palmBy lurgee
    7 days ago

  • Let me explain what I meant by Everyday New Zealanders
    By Simon Bridges. The following is a press release from the office of Simon Bridges, leader of The National Party. Key ora, New Zealand. Happy Maori Language Week. Look, I’m writing to you today because I want to clear something up. There’s been a lot of kerfuffle around some things ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    7 days ago

  • Yes, the SIS is subject to the Public Records Act
    I understand there's some stuff going round about how the SIS "was removed from the list of public offices covered by the Public Records Act in 2017". The context of course being their records derived from US torture, which will be disposed of or sealed. The good news is that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago

  • An evidence-based discussion of the Canadian fluoride/IQ study
    Dr. Christopher Labos and Jonathan Jarry discuss the recent Canadian fluoride/IQ research. They provide an expert analysis of the paper and its problems. Click on image to go to podcast. The critical debate about the recent ...
    Open ParachuteBy Ken
    7 days ago

  • Climate Change: Australia in denial
    Australia is burning down again, and meanwhile its natural disaster minister is denying climate change:Australia’s minister responsible for drought and natural disasters, David Littleproud, has said that he doesn’t “know if climate change is manmade”. Clarifying earlier comments that the question is “irrelevant” when considering the Coalition government’s response to ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago

  • Philippines activist speaking on the Duterte tyranny
    Auckland Philippines Solidarity is excited to host Professor Judy Taguiwalo for a speaking tour of NZ in September. She is a well-known activist in the Philippines and was a political prisoner under the Marcos dictatorship. Professor Taguiwalo briefly served as a Cabinet member under President Duterte but was forced from ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago

  • Disgust
    I have no special insights to offer on the Labour sexual assault coverup. All I have is disgust. Disgust that an organisation could fail its people so badly. Disgust that they punished the victims rather than the perpetrator. Disgust that its party hacks are apparently blaming the victims for demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago

  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago

  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago

  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago

  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    1 week ago

  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago

  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago

  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    Bowalley Road
    1 week ago

  • Union solidarity with Ihumatao land occupation
    by Daphna Whitmore Every Sunday for the past two months unionists from First Union, with supporters from other unions, have set out to the Ihumatao land protest, put up gazebos and gas barbeques, and cooked food for a few hundred locals and supporters who have come from across the country. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago

  • Climate Change: The wrong kind of trees?
    Newsroom today has an excellent, in-depth article on pine trees as carbon sinks. The TL;DR is that pine is really good at soaking up carbon, but people prefer far-less efficient native forests instead. Which is understandable, but there's two problems: firstly, we've pissed about so long on this problem that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • No freedom of speech in Turkey
    Canan Kaftancioglu is a Turkish politician and member of the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP). Like most modern politicians, she tweets, and uses the platform to criticise the Turkish government. She has criticised them over the death of a 14-year-old boy who was hit by a tear gas grenade during ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Speaker: Tadhg Stopford: Why I’m standing for the ADHB
    Hi there, just call me Tim.We face tough problems, and I’d like to help, because there are solutions.An Auckand District Health Board member has nominated me for as a candidate for the ADHB, because her MS-related pain and fatigue is reduced with hemp products from Rotorua.  Nothing else helped her. If I ...
    Public Address
    1 week ago

  • Good little vassals
    The Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has published their report on whether the SIS and GCSB had any complicity in American torture. And its damning. The pull quote is this:The Inquiry found both agencies, but to a much greater degree, the NZSIS, received many intelligence reports obtained from detainees who, ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago

  • Who Shall We Turn To When God, And Uncle Sam, Cease To Defend New Zealand?
    Bewhiskered Cassandra? Professor Hugh White’s chilling suggestion, advanced to select collections of academic, military and diplomatic Kiwi experts over the course of the past week, is that the assumptions upon which Australia and New Zealand have built their foreign affairs and defence policies for practically their entire histories – are ...
    Bowalley Road
    1 week ago

  • The Politics of Opposition
    For most of the time I was a British MP, my party was out of government – these were the Thatcher years, when it was hard for anyone else to get a look-in. As a front-bencher and shadow minister, I became familiar with the strategies required in a parliamentary democracy ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago

  • More expert comments on the Canadian fluoride-IQ paper
    The Green et al (2019) fluoride/IQ is certainly controversial – as would be expected from its subject (see If at first you don’t succeed . . . statistical manipulation might help and Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear). Anti-fluoride campaigners have been actively promoting it ...
    Open ParachuteBy Ken
    1 week ago

  • The return to guerrilla war in Colombia
    by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh On August 29th a video in which veteran FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) commander Iván Márquez announced that they had taken up arms again was released. There was no delay in the reaction to it, from longtime Liberal Party figure and former president Uribe, for ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago

  • Air New Zealand identifies this enormous plot of unused land as possible second airport site
    Air New Zealand couldn’t believe its luck that this seemingly ideal piece of real estate had so far gone entirely unnoticed. Air New Zealand’s search for a site to build a second Auckland Airport may have made a breakthrough this afternoon, after employees scanning Google satellite imagery spotted a huge, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago

  • Redline on the Labour Party
    No-one on the anti-capitalist left in this country today puts forward a case that Labour is on the side of the working class.  There are certainly people who call themselves ‘socialist’ who do, but they are essentially liberals with vested interests in Labourism – often for career reasons. Nevertheless, there ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago

  • New Fisk
    Lebanon’s crisis is almost unstoppable. Drone warfare is on the horizon ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

  • Labour’s failure
    When National was in government and fucking over the poor for the benefit of the rich, foodbanks were a growth industry. And now Labour is in charge, nothing has changed: A huge demand for emergency food parcels means the Auckland City Mission is struggling to prepare for the impending arrival ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

  • Ardern attempts to vaccinate Clarke Gayford live on television to prove that it’s safe
    Gayford, pictured here on The Project, before things got wildly out of control. A bold public relations move by the Government to encourage parents to vaccinate their children has gone horribly wrong. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern appeared on tonight’s episode of Three’s The Project, where the plan was for her ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago

  • Has Mr. Whippy gone too far by parking on our front lawns?
    Mr. Whippy’s business model has driven it down a dark road of intimidation. Residents in major centres around the country are becoming disgruntled by the increasingly aggressive actions of purported ice cream company Mr. Whippy, who have taken to parking on people’s front lawns and doorsteps in a desperate attempt ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago

  • Cleaning up the water
    Today the government released its Action Plan for Healthy Waterways, aimed at cleaning up our lakes and rivers. Its actually quite good. There will be protection for wetlands, better standards for swimming spots, a requirement for continuous improvement, and better standards for wastewater and stormwater. But most importantly, there's a ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

  • Fronting up
    Today I appeared before the Environment Committee to give an oral submission on the Zero Carbon Bill. Over 1,500 people have asked to appear in person, so they've divided into subcommittees and are off touring the country, giving people a five minute slot each. The other submitters were a mixed ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

  • Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear
    Anti-fluoride activists have some wealthy backers – they are erecting billboards misrepresenting the Canadian study on many New Zealand cities – and local authorities are ordering their removal because of their scaremongering. Many New Zealanders ...
    Open ParachuteBy Ken
    2 weeks ago

  • Democracy – I Don’t Think So
    So, those who “know best” have again done their worst. While constantly claiming to be the guardians of democracy and the constitution, and respecters of the 2016 referendum result, diehard Remainers (who have never brought themselves to believe that their advice could have been rejected) have striven might and main ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    2 weeks ago

  • Government says it will now build just one really nice home
    Following publication of this article, the Ministry has requested it to be noted that this supplied image is not necessarily representative of what the final house will look like, and it “probably won’t be that nice.” As part of today’s long-anticipated reset of the Government’s flagship KiwiBuild policy, Housing Minister ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago

  • Imperialism and your cup of coffee
    Over the next week or two we will be running three synopses of parts of the opening chapter of John Smith’s Imperialism in the 21st Century (New York, Monthly Review Press, 2016).  The synopsis and commentary below is written by Phil Duncan. Marx began Capital not with a sweeping historical ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago

  • Still juking the stats
    The State Services Commission and Ombudsman have released another batch of OIA statistics, covering the last six months. Request volumes are up, and the core public service is generally handling them within the legal timeframe, though this may be because they've learned to extend rather than just ignore things. And ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

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