Selling our soul for 18 jobs

27 comments on “Selling our soul for 18 jobs ”

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1. One Anonymous Knucklehead 1

   31 August 2013 at 11:23 am

   A con to what end? At this point it looks like political donations for the National Party, increased profits for their clients and nothing else.

   Naked greed and corruption.

   Perhaps Dr. Wayne Mapp will be able to set me straight.
2. Sable 2

   31 August 2013 at 11:49 am

   Yet more lies from a political party that seems to have nothing else to offer. Interesting its the Greens not Labour doing the leg work uncovering Nationals dishonesty and dirty deals not Labour. Maybe a few skeletons of their own or some shared in common such as the GCSB??
3. Clement Pinto 3

   31 August 2013 at 11:49 am

   I have stopped giving any benefit of the doubt for this dodgy Government and its dodgy operating head honchos, namely Key, Joyce, English, Ryall, Finlayson, Parata, Collins, Brownlee and Banks. I am now simply waiting for the next election to vote these scoundrels out. I am hoping that lots of others are too.
4. Draco T Bastard 4

   31 August 2013 at 12:04 pm

   It was a con.

   It’s National, it’s always a con.
5. Wayne 5

   31 August 2013 at 12:15 pm

   I am overseas at the moment. But from the TVNZ report iin NZIER’s view it is 340 jobs once the centre is built. Frankly the assertion that it will produce only 18 extra net jobs is nonsense. For that to have any credibility you would have to believe that the centre will attract no international conferences at all.

   One of the key jobs of Ministers is to critically analyse reports, and make their own assessment. Otherwise you might just as well leave government to the civil service and not have elections at all.

   As a general proposition 20 Ministers (whichever the Govt) bring a huge amount of collective experience and jdgement to the role. And can sort out he wheat from the chaff.

   Just because some junior economist in NZIER makes that assertion does not mean they are right. For instance I recall NZTE and MFAT saying in 2008 that the China FTA would only have a modest effect. I said to them they were wrong and that with the growth of China the effect on NZ sales in key products would be huge. And on the Left you will recall Michael Cullens view of some of the Treasury Reports.

   [Wayne, I hope you bothered reading reports better than that when we were paying your salary. The NZIER report says that the convention centre will employ 800 people (340FTEs) but that will be almost entirely offset by job losses elsewhere in the economy so that the net effect is 18 more FTEs nationwide. That’s the price of our country’s legislation now? Eddie]
   • Colonial Viper 5.1

     31 August 2013 at 12:33 pm

     An extra 340 jobs would be roughly $12M pa in increased payroll for SkyCity.

     They would have to attract two maybe three major international conferences a month just to break even.

     In reality though, we know that most of those jobs are going to be casual and minimum wage, with no minimum hours of work per week.
   • framu 5.2

     31 August 2013 at 12:38 pm

     And just because sky city and building industry people claim a number doesnt make them right either does it

     because thats where crony key has got his figures from

     none of your comment even addresses this – and looks only at the actions of ministers after receiving this info

     which is a pretty weak argument

     and its full time equivalent jobs – not “jobs”. You know that its easy to make a job total sound bigger if its made up of part time and casual labour

     ” junior economist in NZIER” – do we know it was a junior? – nice playing of the man wayne
   • One Anonymous Knucklehead 5.3

     31 August 2013 at 12:41 pm

     So, between 18 and 340 jobs (not 800) in Auckland – remind me where the highest unemployment is in NZ – political donations and profits for the National Party’s clients is worth the extra cost to society of gambling misery and getting the government into bed with money laundering?
   • Macro 5.4

     31 August 2013 at 1:53 pm

     Why Wayne, in the course of things, in 5 or so more years – when the dreadful monstrosity is built – and the world is coming to terms with the awful fact that rampant climate change is almost upon them, and the price of oil is going through the roof; why would anyone in their right mind want to organise a convention as far away from the centre of population as possible?
     Perth has such a monstrosity at the present time – underused and a blot on the landscape. These things are fine where there is a population mass that can utilise them, but to build one – just because everyone else has one – is sheer madness!
     Furthermore – is it the intention to hire staff on a casual basis for the occasional influx of conference attendees – and keep them on the books and waiting in the vain hope that there will be further employment? No doubt you will be into this sort of corrupt and abusive employment practice as well and make appropriate law changes as well. (when you say there will be 340 + jobs you are really only talking about these part-time casual jobs) You can’t honestly think that the conference centre will be full all year round. If you do then you are more a fool than I thought!
   • ghostwhowalksnz 5.5

     31 August 2013 at 2:28 pm

     Dont forget Sky City allready has a convention center- they got extra pokies from Judith Collins for building that inside their hotel- so that will be subsumed into the new building.

     As well, Aotea Centre has convention facilities, which most predict to be underused for the big flash cousin up the hill. So expect job losses there too
6. Rich 6

   31 August 2013 at 2:50 pm

   The only people who could benefit from a convention centre are SkyCity, the Auckland hotel industry and the airlines.

   It’ll actually be a negative for other businesses if it puts up hotel rates / airfares during any big conventions that do happen.

   Normally, you’d expect a centre like this to be funded by its operators. If that isn’t viable, then the tourist industry could have raised some sort of levy. If they weren’t prepared to do that, then obviously it isn’t a viable proposition and we don’t need it.
7. Wayne 7

   31 August 2013 at 2:55 pm

   Eddie, as I said, I am overseas at the moment, and your link simply goes to the TVNZ report. But I had worked out that NZIER was dealing with job transfer. I stand by my view that the NZIER report is simply not credible on this point of 18 net jobs. Effectively they are saying the Convention Centre brings no new events from overseas, beyond what we already get. And I don’t accept that.

   And Marco, airlines all over the world are buying new aircraft. The price of air travel today is cheaper than it has ever been, and there is no indication that prices will go up anytime soon. So NZ is going to do OK in tourism (including international conventions). And Aucland is easier to get to than Perth.
   • Colonial Viper 7.1

     31 August 2013 at 3:02 pm

     Effectively they are saying the Convention Centre brings no new events from overseas, beyond what we already get. And I don’t accept that.

     They would have to bring in two or three major events a month to justify the $12M pa payroll associated with 340 new jobs.

     But most of those roles will be casual and part time (and minimum wage), so they could get away with much less.
   • Macro 7.2

     31 August 2013 at 4:15 pm

     ” The price of air travel today is cheaper than it has ever been, and there is no indication that prices will go up anytime soon.” wishful thinking!
     Yes air travel is cheap because airlines are not paying the full price of oil or carbon credits.(ie being effectively subsidized by future generations)..As people wake up to the impending calamity that awaits them with BAU.- that scenario is going to change. I believe it is highly immoral for any government to neglect the needs of future generations, but that is effectively what is happening around the world today.
   • Puddleglum 7.3

     31 August 2013 at 5:51 pm

     “Effectively they are saying the Convention Centre brings no new events from overseas, beyond what we already get. And I don’t accept that.”

     That’s not how I read it Wayne. It seems to me that what they are saying is that any additional jobs created by increased convention patrons will be offset by reductions in jobs elsewhere. Or am I confused – I haven’t read the report, of course.

     Edit: Or, perhaps more accurately, job growth and any new employment will simply be displaced towards the gambling industry?
   • Tim 7.4

     31 August 2013 at 7:42 pm

     They’re buying new aircraft Wayne for a number of reasons – reducing maintenance costs, retiring aging fleets, fuel efficiency and so on. They are not buying new aircraft simply to increase capacity.
     • North 7.4.1

       1 September 2013 at 8:00 am

       However you spin it Wayne the 800 new jobs is and always was a nonsense. And who spouted that nonsense ? A prime minister needing to justify selling legislation to his cronies having no scruples about spouting bullshit to do so.
8. BLiP 8

   31 August 2013 at 4:10 pm

   ‘

   Great to see this back in the news. It is, of course, just one of many lies John Key has told about the Sky City deal . . .

   the Sky City deal will provide 1000 construction jobs and 800 casino jobs

   all five bidders for the convention centre were treated equally

   my office has had no correspondence, no discussions, no involvement with the Sky City deal

   I did not mislead the House (8)

   I can’t remember what was discussed at my meeting with the SkyCity Chief Executive on 14 May 2009

   I have no record of the 12 November 2009 email from Treasury advising that the SkyCity deal was dodgy and needed to be referred to the Auditor General

   there was nothing improper about the Sky City deal

   SkyCity will only get “a few more” pokie machines at the margins

   any changes to gambling regulations will be subject to a full public submission process

   Sky City has approached TVNZ about the purchase/use of government-owned land

   I did not mislead the House (9)

   this government has been very transparent about all its dealings with SkyCity

   I did not mislead the House (10)

   the Auditor General has fully vindicated National over the Sky City deal

   I did not mislead the House (11)

   the Deputy Auditor General supports the view that there was nothing inappropriate about the Sky City deal

   I did not mislead the House (12)

   I did not breach the confidentiality of the Auditor General’s Report into the Sky City deal

   the Labour Government did exactly the same sort of deal back in 2001

   This Sunday is Gamble Free Day. If you’re not going to attend a rally in support of democracy, or the Labour leadership you can, at 4.30pm tomorrow, find out more about the impact gambling has on public health and in communities.
9. irascible 9

   31 August 2013 at 8:30 pm

   Meanwhile PinoKeyo has greater things on his mind than his usual invented “facts & figures”, things more important than running the country.
   This from the STUFF website:
   http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9109505/Today-in-politics-Saturday-August-31

   PM MISSES HOT POOLS, GIVES DIVE BOMB TIPS

   On a visit to the Bay of Plenty yesterday Prime Minister John Key was disappointed he didn’t get to visit the Mt Maunganui hot pools. However, he did share his ‘‘fabulous’’ technique for dive bombs with local reporters. ‘‘I’ve learned from my 18-year-old son, more when he was probably 13 or 12, but the knee tuck is very important. Holding your knees in firmly and showing no fear, I find, are the two pieces of advice I give on doing bombs.’’

   The shining intelligence of the man is revealed.
10. Erentz 10

    1 September 2013 at 7:11 am

    I don’t get the obsession with convention centers. I’ve never seen a good one. They are most of the time empty blights on the city landscape. I will be surprised if this ends up being anything more.

    And why did they not make the new MEC building down on the waterfront a convention center also? It seems mostly empty.
11. Terry 11

    1 September 2013 at 10:29 am

    Let’s get straight to the point – Key is a wanker. Simple.
    • chris73 11.1

      1 September 2013 at 12:56 pm

      Don’t you mean S. Jones is a wanker? (Sorry couldn’t resist)
      • framu 11.1.1

        2 September 2013 at 10:12 am

        theres only two types of people chris73, wankers and liars. 🙂

        (sorry folks – couldnt resist)
12. tracey 12

    1 September 2013 at 11:16 am

    Wayne if you accept 340 as the job number, abd you appear to, then 800 was guilding the lily by over 100% … with full knowledge of the lijely real number. Classy
13. SpaceMonkey 13

    1 September 2013 at 11:22 am

    This is economic treason.
14. Treetop 14

    1 September 2013 at 1:04 pm

    How many extra counselling hours for the new addicts will be required? (40 hrs = 1 job).

    There are other hidden costs.
    1. Police call outs due to domestic violence caused by addiction.
    2. Seeking Winz assistance when food money is sucked by machines.
    3. Burglaries.
    4. Strained family relationships.
    5. Theft in the work place.

    The key thing for me when I look at pokie addiction is when it impacts on another person and the lies that get told. Sadly the biggest lies have come from the government who do not understand what pokie addiction does.
15. tracey 15

    1 September 2013 at 7:41 pm

    And remember the number of people banned from casinos is tiny compared to the number of problem gamblers. I have it on good advice that many of those banned have voluntarily applied to be banned. In otherwords gamblers who have admitted that there is a problem. Tip of iceberg stuff.p

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