Smug hermit king

Written By: - Date published: 9:44 am, September 27th, 2021 - 127 comments
Categories: brand key, covid-19, health, john key, Judith Collins, Media, national, same old national - Tags:

John Key is doubling down.

You have to wonder that the game plan is here.  National has its big Covid policy announcement this week and Key going early will not only invite comparisons to see if there are differences between his musings and the party’s policies but also make you question if he is trying to play four dimensional internal political chess.

He went onto Morning Report this morning.  How he must miss being in the limelight.

His analysis was horrendously simplistic.  All he thinks the Government has done is lock us down.  And we have to be able to travel.  The experience of Europe, the United Kingdom, the USA and pretty well all Western nations suggest otherwise.

He said this:

The government has had 18 months to come up with a coherent plan.  What they have managed to do is make people fearful.

Every country in the world is fearful of Covid John.

Within seconds he pirouetted from criticism of fear to proposing the use of fear on the young by stopping them from visiting concerts, night clubs and bars.  It seems his only focus is on the inability to engage in international travel.

He is obsessed with the Government announcing a date.  I do not know why.  I would prefer the Government decides to open the country up after it is safe and at this stage there is still a lot of doubt about if and when this stage will be reached.

He thought that the country should have spent more on obtaining vaccines.  Money is always the solution.

You have to wonder about the game plan behind this.  Why now and why Key?  Is the conservative think thank that desperate that they want to side step the Parliamentary National Party because they are frustrated with the way things are going?

This unfortunate private message from the Herald’s Fran O’Sullivan to Key, broadcast via tweet, would suggest that the basic concern is that scientists and not businessmen are calling the shots.  Hendy’s analysis has driven very good decision making.  Overseas in countries where economic voices have dominated scientific voices they are still soaking up the damage.

https://twitter.com/hendysh/status/1442033029602480129

I suspect this is going to smolder on for a while.  And Key’s intervention into the debate is not going to have the benefit for National that he may have intended.

Update:  O’Sullivan has claimed on twitter that the message was meant for Rodney Jones who had said that Hendy’s analysis was overcooked and rushed.

127 comments on “Smug hermit king ”

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  1. Robert Guyton 1
    27 September 2021 at 9:52 am

    Key's strategy always was to attack his opponent's strongest position, not go for the weaknesses, as other leaders did. It's the same thing here with a full-frontal assault on Jacinda/Labours Covid response. He's not mucking around criticising 3-Waters reform, for example, he's attempting to wrest public confidence around the Covid response from the Government and take it for the National Party. Nothing new here.

    • tc 1.1
      27 September 2021 at 10:10 am

      Totally. A dwindling audience.

      Using the dirty politicing ex PM who refused to deal with his rogue minister for oravida should pan out well for them.

    • chris T 1.2
      27 September 2021 at 12:14 pm

      TBF he was pretty good at it though.

      Odd time for him to pop up, I thought. Not like he is probably going to get back into it.

      Hopefully it the only upside I can see is it pushing the govt to make shit a bit clearer on targets and options

      • Drowsy M. Kram 1.2.1
        27 September 2021 at 12:26 pm

        Hopefully it the only upside I can see is it pushing the govt to make shit a bit clearer on targets and options

        Maybe Key's pop-ups will push the odd Nat MP to be less shitty and dirty – maybe.

        • chris T 1.2.1.1
          27 September 2021 at 12:31 pm

          That is the other side of the coin. Don't disagree.

          Just seems odd timing to me.

        • chris T 1.2.1.2
          27 September 2021 at 12:34 pm

          Maybe Key has got bored in lock out and decided to waltz up and sort the Nats shit out in the background.

          Doubt that is true, but if by some miracle it is, Collins will be gone burger

  2. observer 2
    27 September 2021 at 9:54 am

    "Key slams Ardern", "Ardern hits back". It's a lively debate between the PM and leader of the opposition.

    Judith Collins no longer exists.

  3. tc 3
    27 September 2021 at 9:59 am

    Boardroom trout O'Sullivan exposes the 'logic' and shows her hand.

    Hendys models are 'bogus' eh coming from her that's rich indeed as a copy/paste corporate mouthpiece.

    • Stuart Munro 3.1
      27 September 2021 at 3:57 pm

      Fran's a curious beast – she can do cracking good journalism when she sets her mind to it – just that her political preferences have her led her astray, leaving her unduly forgiving of the dog's breakfast that is NZinc.

  4. dv 4
    27 September 2021 at 10:00 am

    In a response to setting a date for re opening Adern said "Ok June 31 2024"

  5. Anne 5
    27 September 2021 at 10:08 am

    This is political micky as I'm sure you know. It's aim is to discredit the government on its Covid response even though it is regarded as one of the best and most successful responses in the world.

    National plus their apologists in the media are in full cahoots and it is a response to their abysmal ratings. They will stoop as low as they need to go in order to regain the treasury benches. They have even resurrected Cameron Slater to do the really dirty stuff.

    Hang on to your hats… Dirty Politics 2 has arrived.

    • tc 5.1
      27 September 2021 at 10:11 am

      It never went away…..Jude's MO knows little else.

      • observer 5.1.1
        27 September 2021 at 10:14 am

        This isn't Judith. It's a big mistake to think this is all a cunning plan by a united National. There's a civil war going on.

        It is about her replacement. Key is for Luxon.

      • Chris 5.2.1
        27 September 2021 at 10:36 am

        The government never really managed to debunk that lie. They're going to have to now. I hope Ardern takes a slightly more mongrel approach to this when doing it.

        • Patricia Bremner 5.2.1.1
          28 September 2021 at 12:19 pm

          Government did not need to debunk his idea Chris, Pfizer did!!!

          • Chris 5.2.1.1.1
            28 September 2021 at 12:51 pm

            I had the misfortune of hearing some clowns talking this morning on talkback radio and the announcer was parroting everything Key said about the government's lack of a post-pandemic plan. I sense he's being believed. If he is then the government needs to make sure his lie is exposed.

      • alwyn 5.2.2
        27 September 2021 at 11:27 am

        Is that the Neale Jones who was Chief of Staff to Andrew Little and then Jacinda Ardern?

        I thought he had left that job of being the apologist in chief but he would appear to still be on the payroll.

        • Incognito 5.2.2.1
          27 September 2021 at 11:33 am

          I thought he had left that job of being the apologist in chief but he would appear to still be on the payroll.

          Accusing someone of being an undeclared paid tool demands strong evidence or it strays into dubious legal territory. You do have this evidence, don’t you? So, why don’t you produce it here or apologise and withdraw.

          • alwyn 5.2.2.1.1
            27 September 2021 at 11:42 am

            No, I have no evidence at all that he is being paid. I shouldn't have implied that it was a possibility.

            I shall amend it to "I thought he had left that job of being the apologist in chief but he would appear to still be supporting her views".

            That better?

    • DukeEll 5.3
      27 September 2021 at 12:53 pm

      You see dirty politics every time you sit down for breakfast. It wouldn’t be post on the standard without Anne cranking up the dirty politics gramophone. You’ll be seeing nats under your bed soon

      this looks like an ex prime minister coming out and giving his viewpoint on the work of the current prime minister. It’s not uncommon.

      he was the last elected prime minister before Ardern was elected.

      • Anne 5.3.1
        27 September 2021 at 1:33 pm

        This looks like an ex prime minister coming out and giving his viewpoint on the work of the current prime minister. It’s not uncommon.

        Yes it is. Former prime ministers of both hues make a point of not criticising current prime ministers. Helen Clark never criticised John Key. She very occasionally commented on specific topics when approached my media, but she never went out of her way to make provocative statements about him and his government. That is exactly what he has done, and it is no coincidence others are doing it too. A well coordinated political ploy. Have to concede the Nats do it well.

        I like the way you call me out for mentioning DP when others have done the same on this post. Could it have something to do with me being a woman……?

        • DukeEll 5.3.1.1
          27 September 2021 at 7:30 pm

          I called you out as you are metronomic in your ability to swing the conversation to dirty politics if anyone oppositional to your view point has criticism.

          John Key, rightly or wrongly, has come out on a very specific issue. COVID and the way into post covid.

          • Anne 5.3.1.1.1
            27 September 2021 at 7:37 pm

            Bullshit. I wish it were true but. laugh

          • observer 5.3.1.1.2
            27 September 2021 at 7:52 pm

            @DukeEll

            That might be true if it were, say, comments in a general interview that get turned into a story. But obviously this was a co-ordinated move, which took some planning. I can't recall any former PM having all media publishing an opinion piece in this way, and the (pre-arranged) interviews afterwards, across every media outlet.

            I'm not saying he can't do it – of course he can if he wishes. But it was planned for a reason, and that wasn't Covid. Nor was it to support Collins (who he didn't co-ordinate with at all). It was to pre-empt Collins on Wednesday, whose announcement is now reduced to an afterthought.

            Let's not be naive about how internal party politics works.

          • Drowsy M. Kram 5.3.1.1.3
            27 September 2021 at 8:12 pm

            There's been a bit of COVID-related dirty politicking about, e.g. Boag, Walker, Woodhouse, Collins and Slater, not to mention Penk's 30,000 word missive criticising the government's "lockdown lunacy" and calling its initial response to Covid-19 "shockingly slack" and "incompetent".

            Regardless of the (self-interested and/or political) intent behind Key's latest 'COVID contribution', he did foster dirty politics as National’s modus operandi – his most enduring and poisonous political legacy, imho. Lest we forget.

          • Muttonbird 5.3.1.1.4
            27 September 2021 at 8:38 pm

            Jong Kee has come out on a very specific issue.

            Indeed. And he's organised all digital and broadcast media to cover it heavily.

            He' also used provocative, pejorative language to generate attention, drama and division.

            "Smug hermit kingdom". "North Korean model". He describes the Prime Minister's Covid communication as "self-congratulatory".

            This is very deliberate and reminds me and everyone else of the 'get some guts' days.

            You are trying to frame Kee's sudden ejaculation as reasonable and constructive. But it's not, is it.

            It is inflammatory, political, deceptive, and destructive. And it’s probably not even about Covid response at all.

          • Patricia Bremner 5.3.1.1.5
            28 September 2021 at 12:33 pm

            It was—- Dirty Politics though. Key under mines their Leader, tells porkies, smiles but has lost his charm.

            He has lost some flunkies to the real court and the court of opinion, so has to get down and dirty. Think of the past Leaders he had a cup of tea with…lol that went well for them didn't it? sarcdevil Personally I could see his eyes in the earlier photo', no smile there- just the lips!!

      • Incognito 5.3.2
        27 September 2021 at 1:49 pm

        Before you start singling out and attacking specific commenters with your accusations maybe read this comment first: https://thestandard.org.nz/keys-baaaack/#comment-1818932. AFAIK, Grammarly does not yet have a DP filter setting.

  6. Tiger Mountain 6
    27 September 2021 at 10:12 am

    The Parnell ponytail puller has always served international finance capital first and foremost throughout his career. From NZ Foreign exchange market, to Merrill Lynch to NY Federal Reserve Bank to creating a short lived NZ tax haven, he is a money man and his defence of the other money men never sleeps.

    So indeed, why has Sirkey popped up again at this time? Others using his brand perhaps to get some stuff done and sort out NZ National’s woeful state–but–is he past his useby? Who gives one in 2021 about the ex PM who scuttled off during his third term when he could have reasonably expected a fourth…

    At this stage there is still majority support according to one poll for not doing what he suggests. But that could change, which is why he needs to be jumped on and firmly challenged.
    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/452308/covid-19-poll-lockdown-supported-but-not-indefinitely

    • Anne 6.1
      27 September 2021 at 10:29 am

      At this stage there is still majority support according to one poll for not doing what he suggests. But that could change, which is why he needs to be jumped on and firmly challenged.

      Yes. A little bit of mongrel is going to be required and both Ardern and Robertson are capable of it without tipping into the gutter as we saw with the Key administration.

    • roblogic 6.2
      27 September 2021 at 4:11 pm

      Remember his role as the smiling assassin brought in as a corporate fixer. He is about to rejoin the Nats to do some culling. He will be instrumental in selecting the next fall guy to lose the election, then install his proxy Chris Luxon.

      Maybe they will try for a merger or hostile takeover of ACT and NZ First. Desperate times.

  7. Gezza 7
    27 September 2021 at 10:13 am

    Why now and why Key? Is the conservative think thank that desperate that they want to side step the Parliamentary National Party because they are frustrated with the way things are going?

    I think you've hit the nail on tbe head there. He's either been roped in by Goodfellow, or he's volunteered, to do Collins job – seeing she stuffs up trying to do it, constantly. Key can stay on message. Collins can't.

    I'll have a listen to his RNZ interview….

    • Gezza 7.1
      27 September 2021 at 10:39 am

      Corin Dann basically picked what Key was saying to pieces & just laughed at him. It was all high level "visualising" of things Ardern has said the guvermint is planning to do anyway, or impossible to do stuff like somehow magic up massively increased MIQ capacity – which you just can't properly do at the drop of an Op Ed.

      I bet Key didn't win any more voters over to National with that pathetic effort. What a dickhead.

      At least it & Collins upcoming announcements probably will focus Ardern & her administration on setting out a rough plan. Key's financial reward for vacinv plan is too mingy. We need multiple strategies – many involving input & involvement by people IN the groups who're still to catch up getting both jabs.

      Community leaders, influencers, celebrities, Church Ministers, MPs, etc. It'll happen.

      • Gezza 7.1.1
        27 September 2021 at 10:42 am

        Arrgh!! 😡

        "…reward for vaccine plan"

      • alwyn 7.1.2
        27 September 2021 at 11:17 am

        "Corin Dann basically picked what Key was saying to pieces".

        I would have liked to have heard what Key was saying rather than having a somewhat hysterical Dann shouting him down to the extent that all we heard was Mr Dann's wailing.

        Still, Red Radio does what it is told to do by the Government that funds them.

        • Gezza 7.1.2.1
          27 September 2021 at 12:00 pm

          Hard to say whether Dann was doing what he’s been told by the government – or whether he’s just an Ardern supporter anyway. Same with Suzy Fergusson.

          Both of them always seem to me to have just downed a good strong mug of Woke before they start Morning Report. I suspect John Campbell & his co-presenters of Breakfast on One buy the same brand.

          Can be too much for me sometimes. I don’t listen for too long these days.

          They do, however, seem to give non-Labour MPs & party leaders a tougher time than they always give Ardern. They don’t usually press her for answers. They move on fairly smartly after her first diversion.

          I didn’t hear any wailing from Dann. Mostly he was … sort of … sniggering.

          • Incognito 7.1.2.1.1
            27 September 2021 at 12:26 pm

            Hard to say whether Dann was doing what he’s been told by the government –

            No, not hard to say at all and if you do say it you will have to accompany it with your strong evidence. He was doing his job and whether he did a good or a bad one and whether you agreed or disagreed are your judgements and opinions, but not facts.

            • Gezza 7.1.2.1.1.1
              27 September 2021 at 1:22 pm

              I was responding to alwyn’s assertion to that effect. I’m well aware that Opposition-favouring commenters on, say Kiwiblog, frequently accuse “Red Radio” presenters of having been – effectively – paid to more or less toe the Labour government line.

              I meant it’s hard for ME to say whether he’s right.

              I don’t actually know whether that does affect how individual presenters may interview the PM or Ministers – and Opposition spokespeople. Radio NZ has had a role in the past of being a government-oriented broadcaster providing a public service, & I think in some ways perhaps it still is. Not a bad thing, imo.

              I wasn’t agreeing with alwyn. Nor did I state anything as fact. I clearly was stating my opinion, based on listening to them fairly solidly for about 3 months, but nowadays I listen less to RNZ, or any radio station for that matter. Haven’t hot the patience, especially after scoring only 8/15 two mornings running in Stuff’s morning quiz.

              I’d rather be reading interested people’s comments, opinions & links here – on TS.

              • weston …
                27 September 2021 at 9:50 pm

                Rather silly i think to imagine presenters on rnz to be being told what to say by the government .We,re not a totalitarian state yet and red radio if i remember correctly was a phrase invented by slater .At the height of the whole dirty politics drama as it unfolded i was amazed that rnz didnt grill the culprits harder but then as is now it might make a little difference if you,d voted for them .

                • Gezza …
                  27 September 2021 at 10:29 pm

                  Yes, I agree. From my observations presenters (like those on TV too) are people. They vary (from my perspective) in that they sometimes conduct hard & soft interviews, sometimes boring in to their guests & challenging what they say; sometimes, for no obvious reason, giving them plenty of time & leeway to say what they want uninterrupted.

                  As humans they will have their own personal views & biases, which might on occasion influence to some extent HOW they interview or interrogate a topic or a guest. Even when they are trying to be strictly professional in how they proceed.

                  There’s no strict set of guidelines for questions to ask etc. And both the topic & the interviewee are never the same. So interviewers usually have to wing it.

  8. Ad 8
    27 September 2021 at 10:14 am

    There needs to be more pressure on this government, not less.

    I don't even care if Key is wrong. This government has had ample time to bring together our business community to re-launch how kinds of industry will have a revised role in New Zealand. The government have had 18 months to figure what a travel passport with biometric proof looks like.

    I am getting pretty tired of this government being last.

    • Alan 8.1
      27 September 2021 at 10:40 am

      aye to that Ad, broad debate and suggestions should be applauded

    • Enough is Enough 8.2
      27 September 2021 at 10:42 am

      Well said

      And I am getting tired of people being accused as being a right wing troll, or unpatriotic, simply because they dear to ask questions or critique the government.

      There is so much uncertainty out there. A lot of that is because this evolves continuoulsly. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't all be demanding answers from, and putting pressure on the government.

      • Ad 8.2.1
        27 September 2021 at 10:54 am

        Slap me down for pessimism but Auckland voters in October 2023 aren't going to look back on this government and thank them.

        Control and management is two thirds of the government. The missing third is co-creating a new future.

    • Ghostwhowalksnz 8.3
      27 September 2021 at 12:20 pm

      'The government have had 18 months to figure …[insert meme]'

      Thats a well worn national party talking point which means nothing other than make it appear they know what they are talking about.

      Im sure even experts are divided on what a biometric travel passport would be like.

      Hint ..it would need world wide acceptance

      18 months ago a vaccine was just a hopefull possibility , which could have been years away.

      • Enough is Enough 8.3.1
        27 September 2021 at 2:57 pm

        Thats a well worn national party talking point

        Point proven. Being critical of the government is not all part of a vast right wing conspiracy. The majority of us have broadly supported the government's response. But critique and even criticism should be encouraged, even from the government's biggest supporters.

        Has it got to the point where you are either for everything the government does, or you are Nat?

  9. Maurice 9
    27 September 2021 at 10:16 am

    WE ain't seen nothing yet … two years out from the election

    Should the unvaxxed – vaxxed or both start dropping like flies think of the pile on

    … think of the pile on if there are no more Covid deaths at all ….

  10. Treetop 10
    27 September 2021 at 10:52 am

    Key is testing the waters to see what he throws out there. In this case opening up the borders.

    He does not need to worry about the reaction because he is no longer an MP. Key is doing Collin's job on opening up and this makes Collins look weak.

    Last election was won by Labour because of the uncertainty of Covid and which party was going to put health ahead of the economy. The voters had their say. Key thinks both (health and economy) can co exist at this time. I think being premature and rushing it is fool hardy.

    • Gezza 10.1
      27 September 2021 at 11:05 am

      How long before Collins is turfed, do you reckon?

      It seems to me that they might want to sort out & install a new National leadership team well before Xmas. Collins than has the Xmas break to plan her retirement from politics.

      She won't play well in the team after she's been shoved out of the captaincy. 😐

      • Treetop 10.1.1
        27 September 2021 at 1:24 pm

        How long before Collins is turfted, do you reckon?

        Next February she will be gone because her party rating will be below 20. If the Delta out break can be contained, then the public of NZ will have their health freedom. If the Delta out break is not contained then the public of NZ will be living with Covid transmission not knowing whether they or their family could end up in hospital.

        This is why vaccination is so important.

    • gsays 10.2
      27 September 2021 at 12:39 pm

      For all their faults, this regime has shown health and the economy can co-exist.

      The key (see what I did there) is to look after people first and the fiction that is the economy will flourish.

      • Treetop 10.2.1
        27 September 2021 at 1:36 pm

        I agree when it comes to the internal economy of NZ that health and the economy can co exist.

        Business owners need to consider where their business is going to go if the owner has long Covid.

        Key wants his massive immigration policy and education institutes to return. I do not know what the insurance cover for Covid is.

      • Patricia Bremner 10.2.2
        27 September 2021 at 4:37 pm

        I agree gsays. he tangata he tangata. The basis is the people.

  11. Tony Veitch (not etc.) 11
    27 September 2021 at 10:55 am

    Well, I have to admit when I heard the RNZ interview this morning my first thought was

    it's a bit early for Key to hit the turps!

  12. Tricledrown 12
    27 September 2021 at 11:03 am

    Coward Collins hides from media while Key takes over Nationals attack lines.

    Nothing new in Keys comments stating the obvious.

    Now vaccine trials have been completed on 5 to 12 yr old children we should hold off opening the boarders till this cohort has been vaccinated.

    Then most likely 6 month to 5 yr olds have finished vaccine trials.

    No need to panic.

    Key is spreading fear and panic.

    When we have the advantage of time.

  13. Ghostwhowalksnz 13
    27 September 2021 at 11:09 am

    In the same Herald this morning

    The New Zealand Herald

    Poll shows kiwis keen on Hermit Kingdom

    Almost two-thirds of respondents to a new poll did not believe New Zealand's borders should be relaxed until we reach 90 per cent vaccination coverage.

    Although they do there best to hide the results in the article headline

    • alwyn 13.1
      27 September 2021 at 11:37 am

      Unfortunately a lot of the population are, as Micky Savage seems to be, only too happy to cower here in fear of the great big world out there.

      I am on Key's side of the argument. He appears to be following the path of the great President Franklin D Roosevelt rather than the hapless Herbert Hoover. As Roosevelt put it in his first Inaugural Address

      "So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance."

      Ms Ardern, and her Government seem to be consumed by, and to be infecting the New Zealand public with, a terror that is paralysing her.

  14. newsense 14
    27 September 2021 at 11:39 am

    Is Key here for Thiel, Bojo or Xi?

    These are his mates or so he says.

    Couldn’t go on Morning Report as NZ PM, but it’s fine as PR for whoever.

  15. newsense 15
    27 September 2021 at 11:39 am

    And now we also know what that Rodney Watsit bs was about

  16. Adrian 16
    27 September 2021 at 11:47 am

    Is Collins MIA because of the last few weeks of truly erratic behaviour, erratic for others probably not so much for her, but the last public interview was strangely muted, almost comatose by her standards. Maybe a drug testing kit left over from the Olympics may be called for.

  17. Incognito 17
    27 September 2021 at 11:55 am

    Where is Des? Oh, Des is talking to Kate. What is he saying? That National’s Covid policy will have striking resemblance to Plan B? Bad audio quality.

  18. observer 18
    27 September 2021 at 12:02 pm

    Anna Fifield, take a bow …

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/opinion/300416664/anna-fifield-no-sir-john-key-new-zealand-is-not-like-north-korea

    She's visited North Korea 12 times. Who would have thought that she would ever have had to explain the obvious … but now she has.

  19. francesca 19
    27 September 2021 at 12:08 pm

    After reading this article and discovering how much the CIA was involved, operating out of Hawaii, I began to wonder if the John Key/Jason Eade era of dirty politics was also aided and abetted by certain Hawaiian contacts .The golf course may not have been the only reason Key went back as often as he did

    https://covertactionmagazine.com/2021/09/24/how-the-cia-tried-to-overthrow-new-zealands-progressive-labor-government-by-stoking-white-racial-rage-against-the-indigenous-maori-population/

    • Tricledrown 19.1
      27 September 2021 at 1:02 pm

      Francesca .Nothing changes Cameron Slaters free trip to Israel the spying and hacking centre of the world.

      With Morrison embracing nuclear subs the pressure on NZ to conform will be pushed at every opportunity.Expect more Dirtier politics.

      The US can't win wars but it can't stop meddling in every country it can.

  20. gsays 20
    27 September 2021 at 1:05 pm

    Thanks Francesca, that is a fascinating read.

    Just remember,' China bad mmmkay?'. /sarc.

  21. Muttonbird 21
    27 September 2021 at 1:10 pm

    It seems clear to me the extraordinary outburst from Keys over the last few days has been triggered by the Shaun Hendy press conference.

    One thing the RWNJs do not like is highlighting the death their policies inevitably cause. Seymour hates it too, downplaying Covid casualties by saying the other day, 'we can't prevent all the deaths (ironic from the man who brought us euthanasia)'.

    Truth is, these guys want to minimise what will happen once we open up and let it rip. So Hendy coming out with his modelling during the week sent them into panic mode and they had to shut him down.

    Fran O' got in on the act today too.

  22. Adrian 22
    27 September 2021 at 1:15 pm

    Note to Alwyn and Chris T, John Key confirms he is a liar when he said he had no idea that National was releasing its Covid Plan on Wednesday. Even my near comatose dog knows that was all the go.

    • alwyn 22.1
      27 September 2021 at 1:41 pm

      As the moderators occasionally ask me.

      Can you prove he knew? What is your evidence to prove it.

      • Ghostwhowalksnz 22.1.1
        27 September 2021 at 1:56 pm

        Circumstantial is still evidence.

        It could also be proof under 'the standard of more likely than not' he knew their plan was a few days away and what was in it.

      • Incognito 22.1.2
        27 September 2021 at 1:59 pm

        At least three false equivalences/strawmen:

        1) You are not a Moderator, so don’t compare yourself to them;

        2) Moderation is not to score points or win debates;, unlike some of your deliberate attempts here;

        3) Some of your assertions are intentionally misleading and biased. [See what I did there?]

        • alwyn 22.1.2.1
          27 September 2021 at 4:42 pm

          "See what I did there?"

          Oh dear. This appears to be a challenge to interpret the words of the Delphic Oracle.

          1. I think I may be wise to assume that I am unlikely to be invited to be a moderator on this site. Perhaps it merely means that the chances of this happening are rather less than the chance that I will be invited to become a member of the Augusta National Golf Club.

          2. It is almost certainly the case that you are not going to ask Adrian for his evidence that Key knew about the National Party plans for a Covid announcement. This would probably extend to it being most unlikely that anyone will be asked to prove any derogatory claim they may make about John Key.

          3. You claim that I make deliberately misleading statements. You do not offer any evidence that this is the case.

          How am I going?

          • Incognito 22.1.2.1.1
            27 September 2021 at 7:02 pm

            Oh dear, here we go again with alwyn digging a bigger hole again for himself. Let’s see if we can avoid moderation this time.

            Re. #1: You introduced the referential comparison to what Moderators occasionally (!) ask you. Now, you’re shifting the posts to an imaginary invitation to become a caddie on the site.

            Re. #2: Adrian consulted his comatose dog; no further questions are required.

            Re. #3: Your intentions here can be spotted from a mile away, but to be sure, I checked with my parsnip.

            My advice: let it go alwyn.

  23. Muttonbird 23
    27 September 2021 at 1:17 pm

    Surge-on and the Hologram show:

    COVID-19: John Key and David Seymour say private MIQs the way – but how does it work overseas and is it foolproof?

    The article says a Taiwanese businessman was fined $50K for breaching quarantine. Great, the state is $50K richer, but the virus still gets out.

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/09/covid-19-john-key-and-david-seymour-say-private-miq-s-the-way-but-how-does-it-work-overseas-and-is-it-foolproof.html

    • alwyn 23.1
      27 September 2021 at 1:52 pm

      Perhaps you could tell me the answers to the following questions?

      Are the state-controlled MIQs in New Zealand foolproof, or do some people breach the quarantine?

      Was it not the New Zealand Government, in the person of Ms Ardern, who has proposed that some people, who she suggests would be particularly trustworthy, should be allowed to self-isolate in their homes and that a introduction of this policy was proposed for the last quarter of this year?

      Do you support her going ahead with this approach, and if so how would you select these people. Should it be a lottery like the current allocation of MIQ places?

      • Muttonbird 23.1.1
        27 September 2021 at 2:05 pm

        It should be well managed and policed, and paid for by business.

        Problem is the private sector is very loose with abiding by the rules. As always, the profit motive wins, so any and every corner will be cut.

  24. Muttonbird 24
    27 September 2021 at 1:25 pm

    I don't know if anyone has done a Newshrub poll before, but it is extremely right leaning in the response, and of course not scientific.

    Usually you can pick the way it's going to look before you even click yes/no.

    But I was wrong this time when answering the question: Do you agree with Sir John Key's COVID response comments?

    I confidently predicted the response would be 2:1 saying, "yes".

    The opposite happened…

    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2021/09/have-your-say-do-you-agree-with-sir-john-key-s-covid-19-response-comments.html

  25. Byd0nz 25
    27 September 2021 at 1:25 pm

    Whatever influence you may think Key has will be blown away with tonight's TV poll.

    Key only influences greedy people, who think they are the center of the universe, and like Key they become arrogant, that runs against the Kiwi grain.

    • alwyn 25.1
      27 September 2021 at 1:56 pm

      Are you suggesting that Colmar Brunton have managed to set up and run their poll starting after Key's op-Ed pieces appeared in, I believe, yesterday's papers?

      If not how could the poll be a measure of the influence he has regarding the proposals he put out yesterday?

  26. Robert Guyton 26
    27 September 2021 at 1:31 pm

    Martyn Bradbury does good 🙂

    "All Key is channeling is impatience."

    "Key’s belief that he can just bribe young people and Maori with gift cards and trinkets…"

    https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2021/09/27/planet-key-vs-smug-hermit-kingdom/

  27. mac1 27
    27 September 2021 at 2:00 pm

    A straw poll on Newshub is 68% to 32% not agreeing with Key's criticism.

    Personally I switched off when Key used the word 'shambles'. Overused, ill-informed, trigger word which is rhetorical hyperbole, unsubstantiated and indicative of shallow analysis.

  28. Reality 28
    27 September 2021 at 2:27 pm

    Key says we are all fearful of Covid. Has he been hiding away in his mansion sulking because he can't come and go to Hawaii at present. He has been able to enjoy a very comfortable life however – not having to scramble onto public transport, does not work in a health or public capacity or in an essential workplace.

    Of course people are fearful when they have seen and heard of the worldwide devastation caused by Covid. His sneering about smugness is an insult coming from the master of smugness. His involvement in dirty politics has left him with a legacy which is a disgrace.

    • SPC 28.1
      27 September 2021 at 2:54 pm

      In 2003 he suggested that MP's should look at the United States,

      "which has a minimum of two weeks holiday a year, and the economic prosperity in the US is so much greater than New Zealand's".

      (Hollow Man source no longer online)

      I also recall him saying that the 2005 tax cuts proposed by National would have people working weekends rather than at their children's sports (as if that family time was a wasted economic resource).

      It speaks for a regard for the "economy", and the primacy of money in the order of society governance.

  29. roblogic 29
    27 September 2021 at 2:58 pm

    Has anyone checked on Mike Hosking? He could hurt himself while he swoons over the return of his hero. He won't be needing Viagra this weekend.

  30. coreyjhumm 30
    27 September 2021 at 3:06 pm

    Thing is the govt pretty much announced all of this six weeks ago and I don't remember the outrage even though there should have been outrage when the govt was allowing employers to self quarantine their employees and was talking about opening up travel next year.

    This just seems like faux outrage cos a former leader from the other team came out and said what our team ultimately plans on doing.

    I mean "he must miss the limelight" same could be said about Aunty Helen who appears on the media circuit far more regularly than Key and it is said … By the Nats whenever she says something cos she's a former leader of the other team which is just ridiculous. If a former pm has an opinion why shouldn't they say something especially the most recent three two of which spent nearly two decades in power between them. Even if I disagree with what they say.

    That's all this is, faux outrage cos someone from the other team is asking for a plan and has ideas that are a sugar free version of the one our team already ultimately wants

    Ardern herself implied last week unvaxed people wouldn't be able to participate in society fully. No outrage about that from our team.

    I don't like Key at all. Everytime he opens his mouth I'm angry about how living standards, homelessness, child poverty,house prices, rents skyrocketed under him … in nearly 7 years national botched the chch rebuild And then I get even angrier because being reminded of him reminds me

    Everythings as bad or worse under this govt as it was under him hell the current govt goes to half built city and talks about what a success the rebuild WAS as if it's over and to them it jsy, but instead of being as mad at the current govt as we were at the previous govt my comerades are too busy praising and defending their team because they like Pepsi and the other lot who did nothing are coke and coke is much worse because…. Reasons…

    Pepsi and coke both are more interested in profit and helping rich keep their wealth except Pepsi has better marketing.

    I actually think Ardern, Key and Clark are all exceptional people for different reasons and are all probably quite good and nice people…

    I don't think any of them are real leaders and I think their disagreements on policy are just nuances rather than radically differing visions for nz case in point Ardern praising Amazon and protecting wealth at all costs and ruling out a capital gains tax but increasing the bright line test like Key did, the differences are semantics… Key wanting to change the flag, labour wanting to change the flag too but opposing it because they disagreed with the way the referendum was organized…semantics…

    Billionaires and the rich have nothing to fear from a labour govt or a national govt or any combination of our parliamentary parties, the poor, the vulnerable the mentally ill the homeless… They have nothing to hope for regardless of whether Pepsi or coke are in power…

    But …. The other team are worse cos they'd do the same thing we're doing slightly different… Let's all get mad and angry about it cos bugger the other team.

    • roblogic 30.1
      27 September 2021 at 4:30 pm

      Key in person might initially seem "good and nice". An exceptionally smooth and polished salesman, his verbal dexterity and persona had the ability to deceive the whole country.

      But in reality he was anything but "good and nice", he is a glib and careless self-aggrandising corporate tool who would sell his onw grandmother for a buck, indeed he made at least $10 million from selling his Parnell place after recklessly inflating housing for 9 years.

  31. Leighton 31
    27 September 2021 at 3:28 pm

    Not that it excuses the behaviour but why are you so certain that the Fran tweet was meant for Key? The Key opinion piece was only published yesterday (26/9), so she could only have been referring to that in a tweet on Saturday afternoon if she was given an advance copy. She says the tweet was intended for Rodney Jones although as best I can tell he didn't actually write an article last week (although he was quoted in the Herald as being critical of Hendy's modelling).

  32. Adrian 32
    27 September 2021 at 4:10 pm

    Unusual for a former PM to insult every NZer who has done their best over the last 18 months, but then he was always a bit of an entitled shit. I have had a wee think and have come round to agreeing that yes we are a little like North Korea certainly after he left our hospital system in the state it was but even they have not stooped to shitting in their hospital walls.

  33. AB 33
    27 September 2021 at 5:54 pm

    Covid has got everyone stressed. How else would an esteemed former PM end up sounding like some anonymous far-right nutbar going nuclear on social media and blurting out a North Korea comparison? What next – will Judith compare Ashley with Vlad the Impaler, or Jacinda claim that FranO is the business establishment's Dr Goebbels? It's terribly shocking what the denial of nice overseas holidays does to the middle-class mind.

    • Drowsy M. Kram 33.1
      27 September 2021 at 6:52 pm

      COVID’s been a pitiless leveller in the the overseas travel arena – patience people.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patience

    • Anne 33.2
      27 September 2021 at 6:54 pm

      It's terribly shocking what the denial of nice overseas holidays does to the middle-class mind.

      You can say that again. I've been witness to it from a few rellies. They seem to have lost all sense of reality. They think the government has set out to destroy them. It's all Cindy's fault. I've manage thus far not to read the riot act but don't know how much longer that is going to last. angry

    • Graeme 33.3
      27 September 2021 at 8:08 pm

      In our esteemed former PM's case I get a slight wiff of the aroma of imminent pecuniary disadvantage. I wonder if any of his tourism / travel holdings are about to report results.

  34. SPC 34
    27 September 2021 at 8:05 pm

    It's Key who is playing the fear card – he is saying that nations that step out of the neo-liberal orbit are seen as fair game to be attacked – first in the media as collectivist/socialist/not part of the global market regime – then second to be undermined with sanctions/punishments.

    We have been this way before (when National made anti-nuclear ship visits bi-partisan), most of you did not even notice the white clover leaf weevil, the varrua jacobsini beemite or the didymo – a systematic attack on the land of milk and honey and tourism waterways (and also lamb tariffs). This while Josiah "5 Eyes" Beeman was ambassador.

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