Williams and Trotter on Carter’s expulsion

13 comments on “Williams and Trotter on Carter’s expulsion ”

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1. Bryce Edwards 1

   12 October 2010 at 11:29 pm

   And for yet another opinion, see my analysis on TVNZ news:
   http://tvnz.co.nz/politics-news/politics-expert-chris-carter-s-dismissal-5-03-video-3833176

   I’ll elaborate on this analysis in a blog post tomorrow afternoon (ie Wednesday).

   Also, check out Brian Edwards’ latest defence of Carter on his blog:
   http://brianedwardsmedia.co.nz/2010/10/a-dissenting-view-on-chris-carters-expulsion-from-the-labour-party/
   • lprent 1.1

     12 October 2010 at 11:45 pm

     I’m sure it will be interesting… I might ask Brian if we can reproduce his post in couple of days. Personally I disagree with it, but it is a a viewpoint more in line with Eddies post the other day – and he raises a different angle. The keep your enemies close…
2. RedLogix 2

   13 October 2010 at 8:08 am

   Vindicated. At the time of the stupid ‘expenses scandal’ I made it very clear Goff should have come out in a strong defence of Carter… and none of this would have happened.
   • the sprout 2.1

     13 October 2010 at 8:33 am

     yep – i really don’t believe expulsion was the fairest or smartest way of dealing with this, despite Carter’s foolishness
     • Carol 2.1.1

       13 October 2010 at 10:59 am

       I tend to agree with RL & Brian Edwards. Goff has totally mismanaged this and should go now. Goff has responded to the credit card spending and other issues in a timid and fearful way, pandering to the MSM. Labour (and NZ) needs a leader (or more leaders like Len Brown), who will make a positive stand on a clear set of values and policies.

       As George Monbiot says:

       http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cif-green/2010/oct/11/left-values-progressive-self-interest

       It goes against our nature; but the left has to start asserting its own values

       The progressive attempt to appeal to self-interest has been a catastrophe. Empathy, not expediency, must drive our campaigns.
       …
       Common Cause proposes a simple remedy: that we stop seeking to bury our values and instead explain and champion them….

       So we must lead this shift ourselves. People with strong intrinsic values must cease to be embarrassed by them. We should argue for the policies we want not on the grounds of expediency but on the grounds that they are empathetic and kind; and against others on the grounds that they are selfish and cruel. In asserting our values we become the change we want to see.
3. grumpy 3

   13 October 2010 at 11:27 am

   I too, feel that Carter has had it tough. When he claims that he is treated differently because of his “gayness”, he is correct. It was his “gayness” that made him such an attractive candidate in earlier times, certainly he does not appear to have strong “left wing” political convictions. His personal characteristics and undoubted intelligence made him strong personal links with Clark, Edwards etc. that are now a liability under Goff.
4. randal 4

   13 October 2010 at 12:21 pm

   sexual politics wil always founder after the prurient and lubricious have had their day.
   sex is okay but it doesnt get the job done.
5. Carol 5

   13 October 2010 at 12:34 pm

   I don’t think Carter, at his best, was just about sexual politics. As a westie, I have been aware of his active involvement in the local community, atending local events and engaging with the local community. His electorate is a lower socio-economic one, and he has held their support over a long period.

   He may suffer from unconcious white, middleclass bias in some ways. But I do think he actively believes in the causes of lower socio-economic people and communities. I think Goff sacrificed Carter in order to pander to the MSM, and make himself look tough. After that, Carter seems to have increasingly “lost it”.
   • Colonial Viper 5.1

     13 October 2010 at 1:20 pm

     Was it RedLogix who suggested that Goff would have looked just as tough by defending Carter on all the spending which *was* approved.
6. tc 6

   13 October 2010 at 3:54 pm

   Yet another example of Phildo’s inability to led with strength and vision, it’s all reactive and often way too late…..he can win 2011 but he’s going to need a personality bypass over the xmas break to present the kind of figure through 2011 that could become the next PM.

   I never rated Carter as a great polly but a very effective and reliable senior minister and Phildo’s rolled the dice over Carters reaction with his actions…. what reaction and cost only time will tell.
7. Anne 7

   13 October 2010 at 7:37 pm

   Phil Goff treated Chris Carter no differently to Shane Jones. In some respects Shane had it worse
   than Chris. He was demoted further down the caucus chain and had to contend with being the butt of jokes and innuendo. The media beat-up on him was equally as bad as it was on Carter, yet Jones took it on the chin and showed real remorse for his actions. Chris on the other hand responded with petulance and ultimately idiotic behaviour. Even so, if he had kept his mouth shut and fronted up to the Labour Council with a genuine show of contrition he would still be a member of the Labour Party. Instead he appears to have indulged in further hissy fits and started issuing threats. I put it to you that was the point when he lost the Labour Council. It was also the point when he lost me and I suspect many other Labour Party members.

   So where was his advice coming from? I think there might be another story there.
   (For the benefit of the RWNJs I’m not referring to anyone currently resident overseas!)
8. Treetop 8

   14 October 2010 at 12:03 pm

   When Carter came back after two months abscence he picked up where he left off. Carter’s view on the leadership was well known and by raking up his view what did Carter think would happen? Did he think that he would recieve support from Labour MPs regarding a coup to replace the leader? I can only conclude that Goff’s leadership within the party is secure.

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1. The Standard: posted on 12 October 2010 at 9:03 am

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