Written By:
mickysavage - Date published:
10:11 am, March 16th, 2020 - 105 comments
Categories: capitalism, Donald Trump, health, jacinda ardern, politicans, uncategorized -
Tags: coronavirus
The right, typically, think that the best response, after making an absolute pig’s ear of the situation, is to try and buy a vaccine. Not for everyone’s benefit, only for your own people, presumably excluding illegals.
Yes this actually happened.
Trump’s handling of the crisis has been appalling. Trying to buy his way out of the problem and then restricting it from the rest of humanity says so much of his values.
And America’s situation can be directly attributed to a decision made by Trump to cut butgets.
Meanwhile in New Zealand the OCR has been cut to 0.25% and Air New Zealand has announced a trading halt ahead of steep cuts to international travel, which will allow not much more than preservation of routes.
And the Government’s planned response to the crisis is to come tomorrow.
Maybe it is time to talk seriously about fundamental system change?
Now could be a perfect time to learn how to act as a community, to look after each other, reduce need for material wealth and learn to tread more lightly on the planet.
The current rise of populism challenges the way we think about people’s relationship to the economy.We seem to be entering an era of populism, in which leadership in a democracy is based on preferences of the population which do not seem entirely rational nor serving their longer interests. ...
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The stuttering gap-riddled response of our 'government' is terrifying in its failure to protect us from ourselves.
The international 'travel ban' allows travellers in with no medical or even temperature checks. They can travel internally by any means they like to their final destination – presumably visiting cafes, shops etc for refreshments and supplies as they go. Their 'self isolation' is on an 'honesty' basis. So a virus carrier can go from Auckland International terminal to Wellington by domestic flight then public transport – with 'only' the two rows either side 'affected' (according to their theories) That means the one traveller can have sat near five rows x 6 across = 30 on the 'plane, and another five rows x 4 = 20 on the bus totalling 50 'exposures' by the time they get off the bus outside the supermarket, then they catch an Uber home with their groceries having huffed their way around the store. So every 400-passenger international flight exposes 400 x 50 = 20,000 New Zealand residents to risk. Pathetic!
Temperature checks are useful only as theatre to reassure numpties.
Not true. In fact the first Covid-19 case outside China was detected by a temperature check. And while symptoms vary from person to person, 99% of all victims suffer three common symptoms – fever, dry cough and fatigue. (https://www.businessinsider.com.au/what-coronavirus-mild-symptoms-are-fever-2020-3?r=US&IR=T). A heightened screening program, both at our borders and within our communities, would seem to be a sensible approach.
All of those symptoms are shared with the ordinary flu.
Pushing everyone with a 'positive' temperature result at our health system would just overwhelm it even faster.
Screening by asking a few relevant questions is far more productive.
as you couldn't combine the two approaches by gauging all temperatures then asking those people additional questions to the ones already in place….
Relying on temperatures misses everyone who is infected but not showing symptoms like fever.
Yet it picked up the first case outside of China.
One case doesn't demonstrate the utility of a screening test.
I agree. And the temperature test has limitations, but based on the links https://thestandard.org.nz/different-responses-to-the-covid-virus-pandemic/#comment-1691899, it has value as part of a series of screening measures.
Seventeen days after our first case, we have 8. In the same period Singapore went from 1 to 40. Different horses for different courses.
Singapore has a slightly larger population than NZ, but they live on a postage stamp. BTW Singapore have around 226 cases, not 40.
"in the same period". Seventeen days from the first case.
But as you say, there are similarities and differences, including 5 weeks difference in knowledge about covid-19. Like maybe Singapore should have cancelled flights from Wuhan, rather than waving thermometers at people.
Pithy, but not really accurate.
https://www.theaustralian.com.au/world/singapore-early-intervention-offers-a-blueprint-for-success-against-coronavirus/news-story/979f8852b7bf6b989d1aeefe50421482
https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/health/coronavirus-who-praises-singapores-containment-of-covid-19-outbreak
And in direct response to your comment about travel from Wuhan…" By Feb. 1, Taiwan, Hong Kong and Singapore had all proactively implemented travel restrictions on passengers coming from the mainland, contravening the World Health Organization’s [WHO] insistence that travel bans were not necessary. The precautions came at a significant economic cost to these international hubs, which all rely on mainland China as their biggest trading partner and source of tourists. " https://time.com/5802293/coronavirus-covid19-singapore-hong-kong-taiwan/
Singapore is being held up as an example of how to deal with Covid.
Yeah. It really shows the effectiveness of getting your travel bans in early, rather than a week after your first case from that point of origin. By Feb 1 they already had 10 cases.
But a month of greater knowledge about the outbreak, and all that. In late January WHO were still relying on Chinese data for their projections and the true extent was worsening by the day.
Exactly.
"All of those symptoms are shared with the ordinary flu. "
They may well be, b ut that's the reality of what we face. The measures being taken at the moment are far more drastic.
"Pushing everyone with a 'positive' temperature result at our health system would just overwhelm it even faster. "
I didn't advocate for that. I specifically mentioned the three common symptoms.
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/some-countries-use-temperature-checks-for-coronavirus-others-dont-bother-heres-why/
That's one opinion. But there are others:
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/singapore/coronavirus-temperature-screening-important-but-not-foolproof-12507898
https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/covid-19-temperature-screening-still-useful-detecting-cases-despite-limitations-experts
And this one about Singapore:
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6911e1.htm
Working from a library today – the text in my posts displays as all different fonts?
My quote was an expert opinion, correct.
The article as a whole was balanced and told the pros and cons. Have you read it?
My opinion is that it’ll do little good, on balance.
More importantly, local experts who I have worked with and trust say it is a waste of scarce resources. The reckons of armchair worriers add nothing useful.
As I have indicated, I’d agree with your local experts.
To the TS community, I’m just another armchair worrier/warrior so I have to rely on trustworthy primary sources to support my point(s) and on good communication (e.g. clear unequivocal language without jargon, etc.).
And I thank you for that.
I'm really not clear what good some other people think they are doing by spouting off here. Our understandable anxiety is not lessened by trading dodgy information.
True, but please consider that this is a steep learning curve for all; I have not seen so much (medical) science being ‘discussed’ here ever before. One would like to think (hope) that this is a good thing 😉
Plenty of people I know in the health sector say screening should be an essential element of the fight against COVID. In Singapore it was one of the main reasons they have had success in fighting the spread of the virus.
There is plenty of expert opinion that says otherwise.
Sure, there are many opinions, everyone has one, but not all opinions are informed opinions and not all opinions are equal.
These are judgment calls that take many pieces of information and many considerations into account and it’s ok to disagree, especially when you know why you disagree and on what grounds. Bear in mind that you and I have even less of a full picture than those who (have to) make the decisions.
Fair comments. Thanks.
Another local scientist on the usefulness of thermometers..
https://twitter.com/medickinson/status/1239351216829677568
Ignorance – opinion – informed opinion – expert opinion – fact 😉
For NZ residents coming home, what do you suggest?
Not allowing them to? (presumably not letting them get on a plane at an overseas airport in the first place)
or
Incarcerating all of them at Auckland airport, for 2 weeks?
The vast majority of international visitors will be deterred by the new rules (who books a nice holiday in a beautiful country that you won't be allowed to see for 2 weeks?). So we're really talking about Kiwis here. Short of building huge prison camps, what are the alternatives to self-isolation?
Backpackers arriving here on Monday said they had no intention of abiding by the new rules (budgeting for cheap overnight in hostels) .
What about those coming in to spend their two week isolation in camper vans (no homestay or hotel booked) – will they be bound to a fixed place for the 2 weeks?
First rule: Don't let them mingle with the general population.
Given the small numbers involved we should provide dedicated (i.e traveller-only) shuttle bus transport from arrival lounge to home destinations, with similarly dedicated domestic air transport where required. That way we have 'captured' the potential carriers and conveyed them to their homes in a way that eliminates risk to the wider population. This process will also ensure that they do go straight home, and provides for documenting their delivery and enables on-going monitoring.
At present we have the ludicrous situation whereby each infected arrival can infect tens to hundred of innocent local people while the travellers get from airport to home.
Its not rocket science, fer goodness sake!
Good idea. Shuttle drivers could be fully prepared and wearing protective gear. I shudder to think how fast it can spread to and through regular taxi drivers.
How did you work out those numbers, if it is not rocket science?
I thought the numbers were pretty self-explanatory. Eg an infected person sits among five rows with six people in each row gives exposure of 5 x 6 = 30 etc. Plus or minus the individual = 29, if you want to be pedantic. But the individual has also brushed against many others getting along the aisle, they have used the handle of the baggage locker etc etc. So in this example 30 is a good enough round number to give an idea of the potential risk, especially when you consider the arbitrariness of the 'two rows either side' risk zone.
You said this:
What isles, what rows, what transport are you talking about in order to derive these numbers?
Aisle F, where the loorolls live. 🙂
Nah. it's bread now. The panic merchants are cleaning out the bread shelves. It's the second time in as many days I've tried to buy my bread. They must be stuffing their freezers with them.
I gave vent to a few loud expletives today which I'm happy to say was well received by a couple of nearby shoppers.
Pop them in requisitioned ghost houses of course.
you are using reasoned logic observer. will go over the heads of many
NZ residents and citizens can't be refused entry to NZ without changing the Immigration Act, so probably have to allow them to return and isolate as our principal measure.
Sure require
1. check of a pre booked location (hotel or homestay) and a medical certificate sign off before they fly here.
2. the location is in the city of the airport they arrive at.
3. transit to their location is organised for them.
This event is rapidly demonstrating the impotence of nation states to mount an effective defense against a global threat.
A few of us here understood the nature of the threat by late January. In my case largely because of well informed Chinese sources who have proven correct at least a fortnight before everyone else. The failure of multiple govts to fully understand this event is by now indefensible.
There is only one thing that is going to work in addition to a total global travel ban … shut down the entire global economy (except for core essential services, utilities, transport, food and pharmacies) for a period of 3 – 6 weeks. Get the R0 value down to below 1.0 and wait until there are no new cases globally.
Standardised testing, contact tracing, isolation and social distancing and mandatory reporting systems must all be thrown at it. Any nation that fails to comply remains 100% isolated from the world until it does.
Sounds drastic, but in the long run will be by far the lowest cost approach. We have to demand this, because our govts have proven unable to.
Yes – and just create new money drop it into everyone's bank accounts so they can pay for housing, services, food, medicines etc. Emergency UBI in effect. Stay home, drink wine, read a book, talk sh*t on the Standard, and take a couple months away from your bullshit job. May have some other long-term benefits too.
Love it – going to start doing so immediately! lol
Now just waiting for the emergency UBI.
Why would nations without community spread apply a lockdown? I would agree a month long travel ban by those with no community spread at the same time would be OK.
Almost all nations already have community spread, those that don't probably do but don't have any testing capacity.
There may well be some small very isolated places like maybe Tonga that don't have any cases, but they got there by putting pretty strong travel constraints weeks ago.
We have 5 machines for testing – any evidence we have community spread (and that is not partners or family of those who got it offshore)?
I would agree that without a travel ban we will likely have community spread unless we apply the two week isolation better than we plan to.
Apparently (as I understand it) in NZ they refuse to test unless there is a clear connection to overseas. So we are NOT testing patients whose symptoms have popped up the general community. Thus we choose to be ignorant of the potential presence of Covid-19 within the general community.
Thus it is false to say 'We do not have community spread.'.
We can only say that 'We only test where a patient presents with symptoms or history that includes a direct link to oversees sources of infection, and we do not test unless such a link is there. Thus we have no knowledge of the presence or absence of Covid-19 in the general community.'
Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
That deliberate ignorance will cost us dearly in coming times.
It is a judgment call based on an estimated risk analysis by MoH. These decisions are continuously reviewed.
Nor is absence of testing proof of infection.
And if you believe we already have community spread what is your problem with inbound visitors …
Adam Ash
Yep, absolutely. We're just fooling ourselves. Reactive rather than Proactive.
It's not like we lack the capacity to do more testing. Here's New Zealand, Director-General of Health Dr Ashley Bloomfield a few days ago:
The lesson from China, SE Asia vs Italy / Iran / US is: do the maximum you're capable of as early as possible … aggressive & exhaustive testing & contact tracing … and isolation that is enforced & doesn't cut corners timewise.. Flatten the curve or your hospitals will be overwhelmed much sooner than you think.
I'm guessing we actually have somewhere between 40-160 cases (I calculated based on data from both Dr John Campbell & the excellent Tomas Pueyo paper cited here & elsewhere over recent days).
But slowly increasing all the time … then clusters … then BOOM ! … exponential explosion in numbers.
Magical thinking to assume NZ's somehow exempt from the pattern in every other Country. At best, we can only hope that COVID-19 experiences the same Seasonality as the flu … which might briefly delay the speed of spread a little Down Under before we move into Winter … but you wouldn't want to go counting on it.
"…do the maximum you're capable of as early as possible …"
Could not agree more. What do they have to loose?
Test the sewage streams from every major city – that will tell you what is in the community faster than anything.
Random test 100 citizens on the street in the 5 biggest cities daily, and plot the results. At the moment we have no data. 500 negatives every day would be very reassuring.
deliberate ignorance has nothing to do with it…..capacity is the driver.
Until a few days ago all testing was carried out in Australia and I expect their labs are busy enough with their own citizens…testing on the basis of symptoms and or contact is the logical action, especially given the difficulty in detection pre symptom
Yep. If only the real power over all our govts was not from those who will resist all attempts to curb their profits thus..
Yes. There is no question that the form of capitalism we see in much of the world has gone too far, and wields an outsized political influence that one of the staple conversations here at TS.
The problem with all ideologies is that having been successful in solving one class of problem, they tend to believe their ideas can therefore solve all problems. This always goes too far, and always ends badly. There is reason to hope this CV event will reset the excesses of capitalism, something long overdue.
If, as you claim, nation governments have failed, how do you know any pan-nation leadership would be an y more effective? Besides, not all governments have failed. "Singapore implemented strong surveillance and containment measures, which appear to have slowed the growth of the outbreak." https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6911e1.htm
Like individuals some govts will be spectacularly successful and many will fail dismally.
Just as you don't expect individuals to get into their car and make up whatever road rules are going to suit them that day, watching each nation state make up random responses to this crisis isn't really working.
Let me put it this way, you can have each nation handle this event it's own way, and no global travel, but not both.
At this stage it's not possible to determine whether the current approach is working better than a globally coordinated one. I don't agree with everything our government has done or is doing, but I far prefer a regime where decisions are made by an accountable government who is serving the interests of it's own citizenry.
Well the one nation that has claimed to have succeeded against CV is of course China. Good luck with 'accountability' in that sandpit.
China is not an example of an accountable government. Not the last time I checked.
Great opportunity for a think about how we could we live as an Island. Inevitable with scarcity that it probably comes down to that.
On the other hand…….moving the German vaccine research to the US would greatly shorten development time due to the elimination of all the EU barriers to development.
What barriers are you referring to, specifically?
This isn't just about the virus or Trump..its all American politicians and American Health care..
Take Biden for example..as President he wants to cure cancer..presumably because its something that affected him directly..yet he is fine with the current 'balance' in american access to health care.
ie.. About 44 million people in this country have no health insurance, and another 38 million have inadequate health insurance…not to mention the catastrophic closure of medical centres in rural and semi rural areas..whether or not you have insurance
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/447982-biden-says-as-president-he-wants-to-cure-cancer
https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/10/biden-says-he-wouldd-veto-medicare-for-all-as-coronavirus-focuses-attention-on-health.ht
As someone who lives in an area with a supposedly Thriving economy…but no air conditioning in the Public hospital wards..I'm not so sure about our own ability to deal with an escalation of cases..
To inform the discussion, herewith some NZ government sites' info…
NZ Customs Coronavirus (COVID-19) update
INZ response to the Covid-19 (Novel Coronavirus) (Updated 15 March)
To my mind, these 'responses' leave far too much to the discretion of the individual traveller, and do not actively protect the New Zealand public from potential infection from incoming travellers.
For what it's worth, here's my take.
Those responses betray a mindset that would want to put out a forest fire while feeding the campfire that caused the blaze in the first place.
Now could be a perfect time to learn how to act as a community, to look after each other, reduce need for material wealth and learn to tread more lightly on the planet.
And to somewhat repeat what I've said before – since we might be approaching that point where we understand that a financial economy is not as important as a human economy – run an inventory on all economic activity and permanently shut down anything that doesn't have a positive impact on society (the human economy).
Begin to lay in the groundwork for whatever production will be necessary in a world with broken supply chains (eg- generic medicines currently being manufactured in China and India…is that sustainable?)
As of right now, give everyone an emergency payment so the poorer among us can stockpile necessary supplies for upcoming and perhaps extended periods of isolation.
Shut down all air travel (both domestic and international) – planes run recycled air, which ain't flash when looking at airborne infections. Same thing goes for cruise ships (the internal cabins run on recycled air conditioning)
Shut down all activity in buildings that run on recycled air – do it today.
All that said, 'everyone' knows politicians and other decision makers connected to the world of business aren't the sharpest tacks in the box; that they tend towards blunt short term visions, and so will inflict tsunamis and avalanches of bureaucratic incompetence on all of our heads – so, y'know, cut a cash rate, bail out a business, and tell people to wash their hands 🙄
As of right now, give everyone an emergency payment so the poorer among us can stockpile necessary supplies for upcoming and perhaps extended periods of isolation.
The government can make enhanced support for beneficiary's by reducing the cost of electricity (being the majority shareholder in gen,meredian,mercury) by 20-25%)
It could also provide immediate topup,for those pay as you go for an equivalent amount.
I can't speak for everyone, but those kind of reductions would generate the approximate princely sum of $20 a month for me – hardly sufficient in terms of stocking the cupboards for 2, 3 or 4 weeks of isolation.
Bill
As always your first response seems to to introduce a communist style government. You are too much in love with the idea of the local Soviets that were established immediately after the 1917 revolution.
It would be much better to look at what the democracies (us, the UK, the US) did during WW2. And things are not that bad (yet).
Wayne. Go fuck yourself with this constant trolling of me as some Maoist or Bolshevik.
If you sincerely believe that I'm all for introducing some kind of communist state, then you're sincerely stupid.
AGW is driven by the carbon emissions that come from industry's energy sources. The only way to cut those emissions by the required degree is to cut superfluous economic activity.
"You are too much in love with the idea of the local Soviets that were established immediately after the 1917 revolution"
Because the Soviets were elected locally, and then destroyed by an authoritarian vanguardist (Lenin), maybe they don't sound all bad? Though I’d guess you prefer top-down structures where the 'right' people get to make decisions for all of us.
"It would be much better to look at what the democracies (us, the UK, the US) did during WW2."
Like the 94% top marginal tax rate implemented in the USA in 1944? I imagine Bill might be on board for that. Are you trying to acquire lefty street cred Wayne?
The Soviets, Democratic worker committees in every workplace, similar idea to the German Union reps on every board, in that arch ” communist State”, Germany?
Unfortunately purged in short order, by anti Democratic authoritarian arseholes. The problem with violent revolutions.
Democracy. I can see why Wayne doesn't like the idea.
Way to many on the "left" don't like it, either.
"Begin to lay in the groundwork for whatever production will be necessary in a world with broken supply chains (eg- generic medicines currently being manufactured in China and India…is that sustainable?)"
Where do you suggest we get the generic medicines we currently get from South East Asia if not from China/India ? In case you hadn't noticed we have no significant manufacture locally and PHARMAC don't usually like paying for more expensive generics out of Europe/USA.
Shut down all activity in buildings that run on recycled air – do it today.
What like pharmaceutical manufacturing plants ? Hospitals etc.
Where do you suggest we get the generic medicines we currently get from South East Asia if not from China/India ?
As of right now, the US and elsewhere that source generic medicines from China and India is in a precarious situation because supply chains are breaking/broken.
Yes there are some concerns about a few particular molecules where the Indian authorities are limiting export and saving for their home market. However, I don't believe there are any widespread shortages in NZ at this point.
I expect there may be similar supply concerns with medicines coming out of the Eu and North America, but back to the question …
Where do you suggest we get the generic medicines we currently get from South East Asia if not from China/India ?
Yes, well, we've been trying for a long time to explain the downsides of Pharmac's sole supply arrangements with generic companies…
There are certainly pros and cons of their approach.
Important point here from UK, British Society for Immunology president Arne Akbar:
""For example, we don't yet know if this novel virus will induce long-term immunity in those affected as other related viruses do not. Therefore, it would be prudent to prevent infection in the first place."
Herd Immunity
This agrees with Chinese observations that patients can get recurring infections of Covid-19, and the effect of the second infection on a patient already weakened by the first round is increasingly severe.
Bugger.
Would this rule out a vaccine or not…
https://www.rnz.co.nz/audio/player?audio_id=2018731609
Aussie humour!
REALLY – Not the best of looks for The Leader of the Free World
Trump 'offers large sums' for exclusive access to coronavirus vaccine
https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-confirms-that-donald-trump-tried-to-buy-firm-working-on-coronavirus-vaccine/
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/15/trump-offers-large-sums-for-exclusive-access-to-coronavirus-vaccine
Regular flu says, "hi."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017–18_United_States_flu_season
Again, can I ask what the media mass driven hysteria is about?
Coronavirus is not the Spanish fucking Flu, no matter how much some people want it to be!!!
Pandemic-deniers are as bad as their climate equivalent. What do you really think you are contributing?
I’m trying to get my head around the staggeringly unprecedented and damaging reaction to this particular flu which has resulted in the deaths of very very few people.
It seems that because China built a hospital in two days (umm, that’s what China does), and Italy’s notoriously terrible heath system fell over, everyone is kneecapping themselves into recession.
I googled Pandemic-denier and came up with this page telling people how to deal them.
Other advice these helpful people gave:
https://poddtoppen.se/podcast/1063165791/the-health-ranger-report/you-are-more-likely-to-die-from-the-coronavirus-if-you-believe-in-western-medicine
Is this the sort of thing you want to align with?
If you do not understand why all the public health experts in the world are taking this seriously enough to persuade governments to act, perhaps the problem is staring you in the mirror. Time to breathe rather than yell.
I don't think it's public health experts which are persuading governments to act in such over-arching ways, it's the media in whose interests it is to have eyeballs on screens. In Coronavirus they have found themselves a golden egg.
What are those public health experts not advocating non-movement orders every single fucking winter in that case?
This level of lockdown hasn't been tested before. I think it is a shitty, panicky plan loosely brought about by hundreds of disparate and pressured players.
Stock up on that tinfoil.
It's you who needs the tinfoil.
I’m a worker with a family. I care about continuity.
May you find peace.
Not sure how many people who comment on this site have an actual job to lose…
Maybe you'll get it when multiple G8 countries start keeling over.
Not 100% sure what you are referring to but they will keel over only because they over-reacted and have fucked themselves economically by doing so.
How's our curve going? Flat enough?
The 2017 flu was not regular flu, as your own link states.
It was combatted with a vaccine that was only 10% effective, as your link states.
The mortality rate was higher because of systemic shortages of basic medical equipment, as your link states.
And that was 0.3% prevalence in the US. If the yanks stop at a million cases, I guess their day of prayer worked.
As for the media driving NZ's response rather than the expert advisory group or the national pandemic plan, whatevs. And implying that we don't need the protective measures we're implementing because we don't have many cases is headdesk material doctors are pretty used to, now. Antivaxxers use it a lot.
https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1237801364023017472
Is he a bit like Nick Mowbray and Sam Morgan?
Know-nothing right wing entrepreneurs who have weighed in heavy on the government to close borders and schools.
The same guys quoted by Farrar and Simon Bridges…
Maybe closing borders and schools means nothing to you rich types. I don’t know.
https://twitter.com/megarillo/status/1239485081179185152
NZ: 8 cases (all foreigners), 0 hospitalisations, 0 deaths, 20,000 people out of work and counting.
Remember, Muttonbird, NZ is not testing asymptomatic cases.
So we are in the situation where there is no knowledge of what is happening in the general community. We are not asking, so we simply do not know.
Absence of evidence is NOT evidence of absence.
People without symptoms have been found to have higher virus loads than those with symptoms, meaning these unidentifiable carriers are more likely to spread the virus than those showing symptoms.
Health officials indicate that NZ has capacity to do 500 tests a day, yet they are doing very few. How many tests are they doing? Why not use the full testing capacity to explore the general population? To sample arriving travellers? What (apart from the truth) are they afraid of?
This is why we should be testing as much as we can:
CNN: Infected people without symptoms might be driving the spread of coronavirus more than we realized
With a genetic testing machine, not a thermometer.
A flat denial from the company.
https://twitter.com/usbotschaft/status/1239639771313582085