Gower – Nats the biggest liars

53 comments on “Gower – Nats the biggest liars ”

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1. Unicus 1

   20 September 2017 at 7:06 am

   The problem is it’s always worked for them in the past .Misinformation and deception are Nationals stock-in -trade .

   Their justification for these tactics is that they are only doing what their opponents do and that’s what politics is all about . They know our dumb-arse rural electorates buy it time after time as they will in this election.
   • left_forward 1.1

     20 September 2017 at 7:26 am

     Hey, hey, quit the single narrative about rural electorates – a handful of ignorant farmers turning up in Morrinsville does not represent us.
     • red-blooded 1.1.1

       20 September 2017 at 7:33 am

       Quite right. Labour needs all the rural votes we can get and there are plenty of people in the regions who want a more progressive government. We won’t win the electorates but that doesn’t mean we should shaft or insult rural voters.
       • left_forward 1.1.1.1

         20 September 2017 at 7:59 am

         The only downside of the Maori electorates is that we lose strong left leaning support in the general seats – this has a significant impact in rural communities with high Maori populations such as Northland, which would otherwise be a strong Labour seat (IMO).
       • cleangreen 1.1.1.2

         20 September 2017 at 8:44 am

         100% Red blooded,

         I live around a lot of farmers, and they are the ‘salt of the earth’ and we need these decent folks with us, as we all pull this country back into a sharing society.

         We are all polluters and should not singily hit out at farmers, as we are guilty to hell, when we drive a car with one person in it.

         http://oecdinsights.org/2016/09/08/air-pollution-tyres-and-brakes/

         Our tyres pollute the waters with tyre dust that is far worse than nitrogen leeching entering our waterways.

         We buy so much stuff wraped in pastic as we can then dump it around our environment.

         Yes our farmers need our support, nothing less; – otherwise we will all fail.
         • ianmac 1.1.1.2.1

           20 September 2017 at 10:00 am

           Jacinda’s message has always been lets work with water users and water polluters to get a shared solution. English’s vicious lies insults farmers if they accept those lies.
           Yes. Farmers. Lets do this.
         • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1.2.2

           20 September 2017 at 1:27 pm

           Our tyres pollute the waters with tyre dust that is far worse than nitrogen leeching entering our waterways.

           [Citation Needed]

           Yes our farmers need our support, nothing less; – otherwise we will all fail.

           We seem to be in a bit of a bind there. Farmers won’t do it themselves, they don’t want the regulations that are needed either and they already get lots of support from us (every time there’s a drought the government hands over millions of dollars).
         • eco Maori/kiwi 1.1.1.2.3

           20 September 2017 at 5:19 pm

           +10000000 cleangreen
     • Unicus 1.1.2

       20 September 2017 at 8:49 am

       Fair enough – I’ll withdraw that reference there are plenty of clever progressive farmers in NZ

       Fact is though rural electorates do return Nat candidates even though central govt spending on rural services is well below urban levels .Also lets remember national governments have been in power for far longer periods than Labour in the past fifty years .
       • tuppence shrewsbury 1.1.2.1

         20 September 2017 at 9:17 am

         so many face-palms in only two comments

         Rural electorates don’t necessarily buy what national is selling but they actively avoid what labour or the greens are pitching as they know they are far worse for their well being than nationals offer, which is traditionally rural and urban friendly.

         Labour doesn’t spend in the provinces. and if it does it takes more away with the other hand. So what on earth does national being in government have to do with how central government spending in rural electorates and therefore where there vote is cast?

         You’ve just shown the sad outlook of modern left leaning voters, not understanding the how wider issues show the country needs to work together to achieve greatness. Oh and the sad notion that people should only vote for those who throw them the most money.
         • Unicus 1.1.2.1.1

           20 September 2017 at 10:23 am

           No you’re quite wrong
           All II need to do is cross the road and ask the share milkers labourer how much he’s paid . Then go to my local village to see how poor his health services are . Then perhaps ask the local teacher how long it is since she had a day off now the school can’t afford relievers – oh and how far my neighbour has to take he pre-schoolers on the odd days theres a place for them – and mental health care – what’s that ?

           Labour does spend on universal services like these – in rural areas it clear National does not .
           • tc 1.1.2.1.1.1

             20 September 2017 at 10:42 am

             Yes the school closures are a classic example of slash and burn with no regard for what their open door immigration was doing.

             Excess travel, emissions, risk on the road and time taking kids past their old local school now mothballed to overcrowded ones in New Plymouth is what locals in the naki were telling me.

             Parata/Tolley have left a trail of community destruction in their wake as these closed schools now have towns with populations large enough to satisfy even there own BS benchmarks.

             It’s leaky buildings V2.0, short term questionable ‘gain’ whilst ignore the other impacts.
           • tuppence shrewsbury 1.1.2.1.1.2

             20 September 2017 at 11:15 am

             The share milkers laborer will be paid at least minimum wage, more than likely more than that. Living in rural areas is cheaper than urban areas and national has increased the minimum wage significantly while maintaining costs of living at a reasonable level. Particularly outside urban centres.

             Basically everything you are saying is that rural people have some slight inconvenience because they live rurally, i.e. away from population, and it’s a massive deal that could be fixed by throwing money at it. Which is fucking retarded as that is the nature of rural living and they wouldn’t want to see a hybrid hosptial / school / kindergarten / psychologist / job centre on every state highway corner. The local township has all these things and they understand the need to travel to get these services. the more specialised the service the further they may need to travel.

             Your comment above is why rural electorates vote national. They understand the reality of what they are doing and feel national understands them better.

             We don’t have feudalism in this country. the serfs aren’t tied to the land as indentured labour. they have the freedom to move to where they feel their life would be better. those who moan about it all not coming to them don’t last long in the country side.
             • left_forward …

               20 September 2017 at 11:38 am

               What is one thing that National has done to maintain cost of living in rural NZ? I am having real trouble working this out.

               How is living in rural areas cheaper that urban areas? – other than the mad capital cost of a land in Auckland – everything else is more expensive from fuel, rates, water, food, and electricity – jobs are harder to find – internet and cellphone services are poor – roading is generally poorer, and public transport is non existent.

               The survival of rural communities is dependent on a Government that recognises the value of distributed public services and understands rural dis-economies of scale – something that this National Government has utterly failed to do.

               Why would any thinking and caring person in rural NZ support National?
             • Unicus …

               20 September 2017 at 12:33 pm

               I’m not interested in relying on stereotypes to support my argument – or stockyard language.

               My concerns are based on the realities of country living I see arround me . And since you mention it there is a whif of fudalisim – definitely classisim – in rural New Zealand . You are correct to say that those who complain about being at the bottom of the heap are given short shift – that’s because farmers being the notorious gossips they are railroad any individual or family who don’t fit their requirements of servitude . That includes anyone who vigourously opposes the National Party .

               As far as the deficits of services in country areas is concerned . It was your own flat earth Fed Farmers who came out with that last week with the figure that there was a 25 per cent Funding gap with urban populations – you know the same guys who told those silly sods to demonstrate in Morrinsville and made such fools of themselves and Every other farmer in the country.
               Because of its unassailable electoral capture of the rural vote National has abused its responsibilities To its voters – that’s why the share milkers labourer and anyone else who doesn’t own land in the country lives like a serf .
             • Draco T Bastard …

               20 September 2017 at 1:50 pm

               The share milkers laborer will be paid at least minimum wage, more than likely more than that.

               National had to change the law about how wages were calculated because otherwise the farmers were going to be done for paying less than the minimum wage. Note: The wages didn’t actually go up.

               Living in rural areas is cheaper than urban areas and national has increased the minimum wage significantly while maintaining costs of living at a reasonable level.

               Actually, living in rural areas is often more expensive because of the added costs of goods and services (don’t have the same economies of scale) and the added distance needed to travel. And National has been increasing the minimum wage at less than needed to cover inflation.

               Also note that if the minimum wage had increased at the rate of productivity since the 1980s then we could expect it to now be over $30/hour:
               http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/02/13/minimum-wage-productivity_n_2680639.html
               https://thestandard.org.nz/the-productivity-lie/

               They understand the reality of what they are doing and feel national understands them better.

               National doesn’t understand reality and, apparently, neither do rural people – well, at least the ones that vote National.
               • eco Maori/kiwi …

                 20 September 2017 at 5:33 pm

                 +100 they are struggling to stay afloat like the city people that is the workers rent mite be cheaper but when you ad travel to school groceries
                 every thing else that one needs It adds up to more than rent in town and they can’t get accommodation supplement for vehicle expences Draco T Bastard. Paddy had a dream about reality
             • lloyd …

               20 September 2017 at 11:36 pm

               So that is why every rural town in New Zealand has no empty shops, why there is a post office, a doctor’s surgery and a Kiwibank in every village and there are buses every hour to the larger centres from every village?
         • left_forward 1.1.2.1.2

           20 September 2017 at 11:25 am

           Stop banging your head mate with your little narrative about rural communities – many of the rural people I know actively support Labour and Greens. Of course Labour invested in the provinces (for those who can remember last decade) and they certainly didn’t shrink investment in health, education, arts, regional development, roads that were not deemed nationally significant, housing, conservation, bio-security and social services as National has.

           I think it is your view that is sad. I for one am happy to pay more taxes if required to support the collective well-being of our communities – both rural and urban.
   • One Anonymous Bloke 1.2

     20 September 2017 at 7:49 am

     Well, to be pedantic, the last time Bill English tried it was a complete disaster for them 😀
2. patricia bremner 2

   20 September 2017 at 7:16 am

   Good on Gower for calling them out. See who follows this up.

   Lies and Liars. That is National. A fraud.
   • Brendon Harre 2.1

     20 September 2017 at 1:12 pm

     I think the lies, misrepresentation is the issue that has most driven me to the left. This is what I posted on FB about it.

     I believe this election is a cognitive dissonance election. It is the election where the government party wants the voting population to accept its word -that they are great economic managers -without question. They want us to believe the emperor has new clothes. They certainly do not want us to look properly and point out the reality. But the cognitive dissonance is getting too big, the nakedness too obvious….. It is getting harder and harder to deny;
     -That the government has lost control of the housing market. Amy Adams in other portfolios was a good performer -but looks stupid on housing -couldn’t even answer a simple question -how many houses were built in Auckland last year. http://www.newshub.co.nz/…/national-s-housing-spokesperson-…
     -Simon Bridges -one of the government’s next generation leaders -has tainted himself by not releasing business cases for $billion road projects. One of which appears to be the most expensive road per km in the world. http://www.newshub.co.nz/…/government-to-build-most-expensi…
     -That the economy is built on, an increasing number of disturbing links by current and former politicians with an anti-democratic one-party state of the biggest country in the world. https://croakingcassandra.com/…/a-near-complete-cone-of-si…/
     -Michael Reddell pointing out that the economy per capita is not performing well, there is no productivity growth and NZ is not catching up with the rich nations it likes to compare itself to. https://croakingcassandra.com/…/working-more-not-getting-mo……
     -Has NZ ever had a Finance Minister that has stretched his credibility with the public as much as Steven Joyce? http://www.newshub.co.nz/…/patrick-gower-half-of-new-zealan…
     Other cognitive dissonance problems include -cleaning waterways by changing the measurement criteria -not by actually improving water quality. Proclaiming the brilliance of targeted social investment, while ignoring unpalatable social statistics, such as increased diseases of housing poverty + malnutrition.http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm…, highest youth suicide in the OECD…. Government’s infrastructure plans not including a plan for dealing with Auckland’s fuel pipeline risk. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm…
     Campaigning on misinformation that opposition parties will raise income taxes, which will stall the economy, when the reality is that government proposes to cut income taxes if elected, while the main opposition parties agree to maintain the current revenue/expenditure percentages wrt GDP. http://www.newshub.co.nz/…/patrick-gower-national-guilty-of…
3. Tekahu 3

   20 September 2017 at 7:24 am

   You are dreaming if you think labour aren’t about putting up taxes. How will they balance the gap between rich and poor without the usual penalise the rich and hand out to the so called poor keeping them attached to the state. None of them are working class battlers if they win they won’t last more than 1 term.
   • ianmac 3.1

     20 September 2017 at 10:05 am

     Our whole country runs on taxes. National can only operate by gathering taxes. Every country in the world operates on collecting taxes so what is so bad about taxes?

     At least one European country collects 50% tax system which is recycled on Health, Education and a prison population 20% of our gruesome numbers.
     So I say increase the taxes!
   • tracey 3.2

     20 September 2017 at 1:00 pm

     National put up 18 in 8.5 years. Did your sky fall?
     • indiana 3.2.1

       20 September 2017 at 3:51 pm

       List the actual new taxes, not the existing taxes that were increased. List also the taxes they reduced as well. And from your tax list, how many of them were directly related to income tax?
       • tracey 3.2.1.1

         20 September 2017 at 3:54 pm

         Which income taxes are Labour putting up? Why should I not list taxes they increased? Tekahu referred to putting taxes up. So you just do not like new or increased taxes if Labour does it, and they have said they arent putting up income tax.

         Werent Labour talking about moving levels that certain tax rates kicked in? If yes, that could mean drop in tax for some at lower ends of moved brackets.
         • indiana 3.2.1.1.1

           20 September 2017 at 6:04 pm

           In Apr 2018, there is legislation that has passed that will alter the tax brackets. Some income tax payers will be better off by $1000. If Labour win, they are repealing this legislation, so no tax cuts will apply.

           Labour may not be increasing taxes (this term), but they will not be giving tax cuts either (or in the future).

           I have no issue with existing taxes/levies being increased so long as they are not related to income tax. National have balanced consumption tax increases by reducing income tax – why is that such a bad thing? Labour have no tax plans that they can execute because they have deferred to a committee.
4. Skinny 4

   20 September 2017 at 8:05 am

   Gower is a cheerleader for Winston trying his best to keep him in the game. Peters tactics of not saying which way NZF are going is failing. A

   The numbers are not there from the Tories, nor from the Left. All he is getting is his core voters who are probably 80% gold card holders.

   NZF would do far better by putting the boot into National over the leaked details of his benefit. The farmers showed the other day they are not trusting him as it is so obvious he is going with Labour, so he should call them out as unfit to govern another term.
   The uncertain left voters not quite happy voting Labour will jump on board the Winston Express and relevant he will be, other than that NZF maybe the shock gone burger.
5. Tautoko Mangō Mata 5

   20 September 2017 at 8:15 am

   Good on Paddy Gower for pointing out this deliberate lie. It is not fair to blame those who believe Bill English when he lies. Most people would expect their MPs to be honest even if giving a more favourable view of their own policy, but the behaviour of many National MPs has moved to such an extent that if this level of dishonesty was perpetrated in business dealings, it would be dealt with by the courts.
   National are playing a game that is devoid of decency and honesty and have forgotten that the government is there to serve the people. not to deceive the people.
   Time for a change to a government with decent ethics..
6. Glenn 6

   20 September 2017 at 8:40 am

   And the media keep chanting…Hosking in granny Herald…that the Greens probably won’t make 5% and voting for them could be a wasted vote.
   Pushing pushing pushing to keep the Green vote down.

   Gower has shown some integrity.
   • tc 6.1

     20 September 2017 at 10:45 am

     One swallow does not make a summer.

     Panic pants Paddys track record suggests he’s a nact sycophant with occasional bursts of logic so obvious people didn’t need him to tell them.

     the electorate knows Nact lie their asses off, stop giving them soapboxes for the BS and start asking them tough questions so the sheeple can see how full of shit they are Paddy.
7. Alex 7

   20 September 2017 at 9:09 am

   Labour are planing to increase personal tax aren’t they? New lower tax rates have been legislatedoing to take effect next year and Labour would have to pass a law to make them higher again. You’re either happy about it or not but that doesn’t change the facts.
   • SpaceMonkey 7.1

     20 September 2017 at 9:46 am

     Here’s the facts… Labour are not increasing taxes; nor are they decreasing taxes. Taxes are staying as they currently are. Labour will repeal that legislation so that the tax cuts don’t come in.
     • indiana 7.1.1

       20 September 2017 at 9:59 am

       So the incentive should be to vote for National, because if you vote for Labour you will not get the tax cut – thanks for clearing that up.
       • One Anonymous Bloke 7.1.1.1

         20 September 2017 at 10:04 am

         So those who are motivated by nothing but money should vote Labour/Greens because of Best Start and the extra earning power a return to collective bargaining will bring.
       • tracey 7.1.1.2

         20 September 2017 at 1:02 pm

         Vote for Labour and 450m goes into health and education. Vote National and get an extra $15 a week.
       • lloyd 7.1.1.3

         20 September 2017 at 11:56 pm

         Just because you don’t get a tax cut doesn’t mean you will be worse off under Labour.

         Your taxes pay for health care. You might need a new kidney next year. A piddly amount of extra taxes might give you twenty years more life. I suspect the odds of directly benefiting from not getting that tax cut are probably better than Lotto.

         Labour have a tradition of managing the economy better than National. One reason is that they spend or give money to the poorer members of our society. This spending has a much higher “churn” in the economy. The taxes go round faster with health, education and social welfare spending than the same money in savings banks. This indirectly benefits everyone in our society. You may find that you get back your taxes indirectly just because we all become wealthier as a nation.

         Even if you don’t you obviously will feel better that your taxes are allowing some chap to get his kidney transplant. After all, as a good Kiwi you wouldn’t want someone to die just so you could stay an extra night at a Fijian resort, would you? Only National and Act supporters are greedy, vicious bastards like that.
     • cleangreen 7.1.2

       20 September 2017 at 10:57 am

       Yes national are tactical here and waiting till ‘next year to ‘legislate’ for a tax cut!!!!!

       If the next Global Economic Crash expected next year comes first they will use this excuse to stop the legislation for tax cuts; – believe me.

       Example;

       We were promised that we would have a re-openning of the rail here by October this year for the link between Napier to Wairoa for logs.

       But yesterday kiwirail (who is now tightly controlled by government since a cash handout was made recently) has announced the line re-openning is ‘fluid’ in which they said in a press release kiwirail is not for sure it will open next year now!!!!!!!

       We only got – Lies lies lies is alll we have from National.
       • tracey 7.1.2.1

         20 September 2017 at 1:03 pm

         How are those 10 bridges in Northland? Or the Health and Education Fund from the proceeds of asset sales?
   • crashcart 7.2

     20 September 2017 at 11:12 am

     Look at it this way. If your boss told you “sorry cause we are losing money I have to give you a pay cut” and then got replaced by someone who said that they were not going to cut your pay now would you be down the pub celebrating your pay rise?

     If all you are interested in is paying less PAYE and you are one of those lucky enough like myself to be in line for the max then sure vote National. There is no need for English to lie to make this point. Of course if you think society as a whole benefitting is more important than short term gain then vote Green or Labour.
8. SpaceMonkey 8

   20 September 2017 at 9:25 am

   I don’t believe it!! Gower… calling out National?? I must’ve awoken today in a parallel universe. But they’ve been at this for years… pity he didn’t call them out then. Maybe he has just “woke” to reality.
   • Bill 8.1

     20 September 2017 at 11:05 am

     Why wouldn’t Paddy call out National? Big mate of Robertson, no? (Yes. That’s just speculation based on his take-down, often via leaks, of every NZ Labour leader who was not from the Robertson faction of caucus.

     He still hammers at the Greens, yes? And he’s still quite accommodating of NZF, yes?

     Maybe that indicates something about where NZ Labour are going to be coming from if Paddy is just doing his master’s bidding 😉
     • tracey 8.1.1

       20 September 2017 at 1:04 pm

       :0
9. Stuart Munro 9

   20 September 2017 at 9:58 am

   Move over Harry Wakatipu.
   • ianmac 9.1

     20 September 2017 at 10:07 am

     Aha. Great read Stuart. Took me many pages to realise that Harry was a horse.
     Jack Lasenby a writer of classics.
10. ianmac 10

    20 September 2017 at 10:10 am

    Great cartoon from Tremain. Tick.

    Though I sometimes think Bryce is working against the Left. His roundups usually disfavour the Left with maybe one or two links in their favour at the end.
11. C Dawg 11

    20 September 2017 at 10:17 am

    Please don’t praise Gower too much on this. 9 years of sweet sweet mouthpiecing and massage to have one semi journalistic critique right when he senses even his corrupt lot might not be able to pull one more off for the corporate overlords. He was still screaming and bashing the Greens as Desperate Liars in the same twitter breathe…
12. cleangreen 12

    20 September 2017 at 10:20 am

    https://thestandard.org.nz/the-climate-debate-tues-7pm/
    My comment on blog 9

    “Lying National says they have spent $6 billion on rail that is a great big fat lie period!!!!
    They have spent 2.4 billion on rail total and have paid nothing for regional rail services and upgrades for several years, in fact they have eagerly closed down four regional rail links that used to send export products to ports in other regions so now they all carry this export freight by road.
    Most of the $2.4 Billion was spent on Auckland commuter rail, rolling stock & Wellington and Christchurch commuter rail.
    National lied again to NZ tonight.
    NZ First have a rail policy that is the very best cast iron way to save our rail in all NZ Regions called ‘Rail of National Importance.'(RONI)”

    http://www.nzfirst.org.nz/transport
    http://kiwirailblog.blogspot.co.nz/2014/07/nz-first-rail-policy-announced-railways.html
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11292777
13. Melanie Scott 13

    20 September 2017 at 12:51 pm

    Here in Northland and just over the border in what used to be Rodney, some dairy farmers are fed up with the dreadful state of much used (so called metal) roads. They are more like mud slurries/dustbowls. Some of the anger is aimed at local government but central government is also in their sights. Water tables are also a big issue. So it will be interesting to see which way they go, NZ First here in Kaipara (Northland) or National. Sadly not enough will be Labour supporters iIm afraid. Incidentally, can anyone explain why no National candidates are standing in the Maori seats? I guess it’s just that National think of the MP as their useful idiot.
    • tracey 13.1

      20 September 2017 at 1:06 pm

      Any progress on those 10 bridges you were all promised?
    • lprent 13.2

      20 September 2017 at 1:55 pm

      Ouch. It was always a pain heading up to my parents farm many decades ago when the local council was in budget saving mode. I had a few slides on exposed clay. When they weren’t in penny pinching mode and the gravel got dropped and spread every year or two, it wasn’t much of an issue. Dust was always a problem on gravel in summer regardless what they lay or did.

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1. Coalition of liars « The Standard: posted on 7 October 2017 at 7:34 am

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