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How To Get There 26/5/19

Written By: - Date published: 7:00 am, May 26th, 2019 - 36 comments
Categories: Deep stuff - Tags:

 

This post is a place for positive discussion of the future.

An Open Mike for ideas, solutions and the discussion of the possible.

The Big Picture, rather than a snapshot of the day’s goings on. Topics rather than topical.

We’d like to think it’s success will be measured in the quality of comments rather than the quantity.

So have at it!

Let us know what you think …

36 comments on “How To Get There 26/5/19 ”

  1. Robert Guyton 1

    We can change.

    Mia Sutherland is a student and the secretary of the School Strike 4 Climate NZ chapter. She is Stuff's guest editor during the student-led strike on May 24, 2019. This piece was commissioned for Stuff's Quick! Save the Planet project.

    Describe your feelings towards climate change in three words…

    SUTHERLAND: We can change.

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/environment/climate-news/112939594/climate-change-using-poetry-to-shine-a-light-on-the-environment

    Walpert explained, by studying poetry, people are taught to think ecologically as opposed to linearly.

    "As much as we need information about climate change, I think we desperately need models for thinking like ecologists – in systems," he told Stuff.

    Here is Walpert's poem titled Spotless Crake:

    Consider

    a life of

    introversion:

    A raised word

    at dawn

    or dusk.

    Easy to remain in shadow.

    Some of us

    might not be known at all

    if not for voice

    and our small hungers.

    • greywarshark 1.1

      I was looking at this poem last night!

      If by Rudyard Kipling. (If is a powerful tiny word, with possibilities and hope contained in two little letters. If only is a combination full of regret, let's get behind 'if'!)

      IF – Rudyard Kipling – 1st verse

      If you can keep your head when all about you

      Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,

      If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,

      But make allowance for their doubting too;

      If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,

      Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,

      Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,

      And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise:

      https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems/46473/if—

      (I would like to put up the whole poem but I can't change the line setting which seems set on double spacing. Can someone advise how this can be changed at will. The setting should not be for double spacing on the use of the enter button. The posts are not good for reading with white space occurring where it is not wanted and taking up too much space for paragraphed or short-line comments. lprent can we alter that instruction of the program?)

      • Drowsy M. Kram 1.1.1

        Hi Grey, I don't know how to paste text as single spaced, but if I hold the 'Shift' key down before I press 'Return/Enter', then that forces the new line to in without any (extra) space between lines. If that works for you, then you would still have to delete the space (bringing both lines onto the same line), and then press'Shift'-'Return/Enter' to regenerate the new line without a space. Sorry if this description comes across as a bit garbled!

  2. Robert Guyton 2

    Nick Hunt

    "A central strand of the Dark Mountain Project is seeking writing and art that recognises, or perhaps remembers, that humans are not the centre of the universe, not the most important thing, but merely a small part of the whole – work that attempts to decentre itself from the human experience. The Overstory achieves this better than almost anything else I’ve read, and certainly anything that would normally find its way to the Man Booker shortlist. Is that what you saw yourself as doing when you started writing it? Decentring yourself from the human experience, and writing from outside that bubble?

    Richard Powers

    Yes, that’s a marvellous place to start. At the heart of this book is a very simple idea, and it’s one that has been explored for some time by environmentalists and philosophers and scientists and political activists, and yet hasn’t quite seeped into the arts – and certainly not this most human-centric of arts, the commercial novel. The idea, quite plainly put, is that there is no separate thing called humanity, any more than there is a separate thing called nature."

    https://dark-mountain.net/older-than-writing/

  3. Robert Guyton 3

    Google employees on acid.

    "Michael Pollan has written 5 New York Times best sellers including Food Rules; In Defense of Food; and The Omnivore’s Dilemma. In this talk, he shares insights and answer questions about psychedelics based on research done for his book "How to Change Your Mind: What the New Science of Psychedelics Teaches Us About Consciousness, Dying, Addiction, Depression, and Transcendence"."

    • vto 3.1

      I dont think we know much about the act of death… like the beauty of a wilting rose at the end of its bloom,..

      but so much more than that alone….

    • RedLogix 3.2

      Yes the potential for psychedelics to heal brain injury and trauma is intriguing. Quite a few people, even the unloved Mr Peterson, have been speaking to their potential recently.

      They may even work to reverse or alter the course of age related brain dysfunction, strokes, dementia or even just the loss of memory and confusion that so often accompanies old age.

      In general I'm not a fan of drugs, especially when they have addictive and destructive outcomes, but these seem to be in a different category.

      • Robert Guyton 3.2.1

        I think so, RedLogix. Terrence McKenna takes the ideas a whole lot further and amongst his (self-described) rants, there are precious jewels.

        • RedLogix 3.2.1.1

          I recall a local study over a decade ago (sorry I've no idea how to link to it now) which concluded that in excess of 85% of our prison population had some form of brain injury, often resulting from concussion.

          Imagine the potential role psychedelics could play in rehabilitation. Imagine if we could halve recividism rates even.

      • Incognito 3.2.2

        Is this tapping into, assisting, enhancing self-healing or is it replacing it?

  4. Robert Guyton 4

    How to get there;

    "Instructions" by Neil Gaiman

    Touch the wooden gate in the wall you never

    saw before.

    Say "please" before you open the latch,

    go through,

    walk down the path.

    A red metal imp hangs from the green-painted

    front door,

    as a knocker,

    do not touch it; it will bite your fingers.

    Walk through the house. Take nothing. Eat

    nothing.

    However, if any creature tells you that it hungers,

    feed it.

    If it tells you that it is dirty,

    clean it.

    If it cries to you that it hurts,

    if you can,

    ease its pain.

    From the back garden you will be able to see the

    wild wood.

    The deep well you walk past leads to Winter's

    realm;

    there is another land at the bottom of it.

    If you turn around here,

    you can walk back, safely;

    you will lose no face. I will think no less of you.

    Once through the garden you will be in the

    wood.

    The trees are old. Eyes peer from the under-

    growth.

    Beneath a twisted oak sits an old woman. She

    may ask for something;

    give it to her. She

    will point the way to the castle.

    Inside it are three princesses.

    Do not trust the youngest. Walk on.

    In the clearing beyond the castle the twelve

    months sit about a fire,

    warming their feet, exchanging tales.

    They may do favors for you, if you are polite.

    You may pick strawberries in December's frost.

    Trust the wolves, but do not tell them where

    you are going.

    The river can be crossed by the ferry. The ferry-

    man will take you.

    (The answer to his question is this:

    If he hands the oar to his passenger, he will be free to

    leave the boat.

    Only tell him this from a safe distance.)

    If an eagle gives you a feather, keep it safe.

    Remember: that giants sleep too soundly; that

    witches are often betrayed by their appetites;

    dragons have one soft spot, somewhere, always;

    hearts can be well-hidden,

    and you betray them with your tongue.

    Do not be jealous of your sister.

    Know that diamonds and roses

    are as uncomfortable when they tumble from

    one's lips as toads and frogs:

    colder, too, and sharper, and they cut.

    Remember your name.

    Do not lose hope — what you seek will be found.

    Trust ghosts. Trust those that you have helped

    to help you in their turn.

    Trust dreams.

    Trust your heart, and trust your story.

    When you come back, return the way you came.

    Favors will be returned, debts will be repaid.

    Do not forget your manners.

    Do not look back.

    Ride the wise eagle (you shall not fall).

    Ride the silver fish (you will not drown).

    Ride the grey wolf (hold tightly to his fur).

    There is a worm at the heart of the tower; that is

    why it will not stand.

    When you reach the little house, the place your

    journey started,

    you will recognize it, although it will seem

    much smaller than you remember.

    Walk up the path, and through the garden gate

    you never saw before but once.

    And then go home. Or make a home.

    And rest.

  5. I watched the introduction of the Zero Carbon bill into parliament on Tuesday. It received cross-party support, even from the National Party, but . . .!

    The ‘but’ meant that National, if ever in power again (God forbid) will do nothing.

    The best speaker by a country mile was Cloe Swarbrick, but even she was restrained by the limitations of the legislation. As Russel Norman pointed out, the bill lacks any compulsion, it is merely ‘aspirational.’

    The whole issue is beyond tinkering; if we want to curb radical climate change, which could or would lead to human extinction, we have to be equally radical.

    • we have to recognise the capitalist model will just not deliver the goods. When I hear politicians talking about 2 or 3 per cent growth in this or that, I cringe. You simply cannot have infinite growth in a finite world. Even the term ‘sustainable growth’ is an oxymoron. So, we have to face it, the economy will suffer, will have to change, but as Cloe pointed out, you can’t view the economy in isolation, it is part of society and the environment.
    • the world probably has 4 or 5 billion people too many. We have to limit the birth rate – one woman, one child. The best way to do this is to turn reproduction entirely over to women (Mike Pence and Alfred Ngaro will have a fit). Male chastity and FLRs (Female Led Relationships) should be the future if we humans are to have any hope of avoiding a catastrophe. After all, males got us into this mess!

    Now that I’ve got the wishy-wishy ideas off my chest, more practical steps.

    • a) a ban, becoming effective say in 2022 to allow businesses some time to adjust, on the import of second hand fossil fuel cars and heavy subsidies for electric vehicles. After all, if Norway, an oil producing country, can have 44% of new car sales electric, we should be able to do as well or better.
    • b) all public transport free and frequent, and as soon as possible, electric. Upgrade the rail network and penalise those who still choose to use their petrol or diesel cars.
    • c) impose severe limits on air travel. Perhaps endow every NZer with one (1) flight a year and set up a market for unwanted flights, so the poorer sections of society can trade their rights. Yes, Air New Zealand’s profits would nose dive but . . . (the bloody economy again!)
    • d) there shouldn’t be a house or dwelling built in this country that isn’t carbon neutral and which doesn’t contribute to the national electricity grid. Also have heavy government subsidies on solar panels as incentives to cut electricity bills.
    • e) impose severe limits on immigration. This would happen naturally as the economy shifts to a more subsistence model, but we have to recognise this country will be an attractive bolt-hole when ‘wet-bulb’ temperatures render the tropics uninhabitable.
    • f) I’m sorry, but it is patently ludicrous to exempt agriculture from any attempt to limit greenhouse gases. Agriculture will have to change, and will need assistance to make the necessary changes, but change will have to happen.

    We can no longer shrug our shoulders and point the finger at the USA or China.

    A lot of the more effective (and symbolic) things we could do would have little effect on the ‘economy.’ We (the human species, and every other species on earth) are in a race against time, a race we are currently in danger of losing. Then all the National ‘buts’ in the world will be of no use.

    • greywarshark 5.1

      Capitalists will not help, they will do things that will result in contracts, and to make sales, and they will encourage growth in those areas. In the newspaper a well set-up chap called Kirk-Hope (great name!) who represents business in some way, announces that we need more foreign capital. And so it goes as Kurt Vonnegut would say.

      He was good at irony. May we be able to see things as he did, and carry on with a faint smile as to our ridiculous quest, but keep trying because in that there is honour and value and respect for others. And may we be more successful than Monty Python's Black Knight refusing to acknowledge reality with 'It's just a scratch, a flesh wound'.

    • Janet 5.2

      AAH some nuts n bolts for a change.. and add to that … the government could act right now and regulate to stop the importation of poor quality products – the "planned obsolence" products and the $2 shop rubbish ……but no they pursue Free Trade agreements instead.

  6. greywarshark 6

    On Radionz – https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018696790/dr-oliver-scott-curry-kindness-causing-happiness

    Dr Oliver Scott Curry: Kindness causing happiness

    From Sunday Morning, 9:45 am today Listen duration 10′ :10″

    Dr Oliver Scott Curry is the research director for Kindlab, at kindness.org online. He's also with the School of Anthropology at Oxford University where he led a team researching the impact of kindness, not just in terms of helping people but for the person being kind's overall well-being.

    They were asking whether being kinder could be a way to solve personal problems; how helping someone deal with their problems could in turn work for the person offering help. They analysed 27 experiments to come up with their final conclusions, and it's a fascinating read. Dr Curry speaks to Jim about the kindness and happiness links they uncovered, and why the little things can go a long way.

  7. greywarshark 7

    Things getting better.

    In the Defence Forces for people who are different – transgender, homosexual, or not willing to attack other people in a violent homosexual way! They have changed the way they treat their men; and women too?

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/insight/audio/2018696447/has-the-nz-military-shaken-off-its-anti-lgbtqi-history

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/morningreport/audio/2018696520/i-just-shut-up-man-says-he-was-raped-in-nz-army-in-1970s

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/insight/audio/2018696447/has-the-nz-military-shaken-off-its-anti-lgbtqi-history

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018696789/jimmy-barnes-the-best-is-yet-to-come
    An individual who had a sad childhood and been able to resolve the worst of his memories and seen musician friends commit suicide because they couldn't.

    Jimmy Barnes: "The best is yet to come."

    From Sunday Morning, 10:06 am today Listen duration 42′ :33″

    Legendary Australian rocker Jimmy Barnes is back with another new album, My Criminal Record due out on May 31st. He's also going to be on this side of the Tasman in September performing three dates of his Shutting Down Your Town tour. He joins Jim in the studio to talk about his career, his demons, his talent and why he believes after four decades of making music he believes the best of Jimmy Barnes is yet to come.

  8. greywarshark 8

    26 May 2019 at 11:44 am

    What it's like to take 14 days there and 14 days back when choosing to not fly from UK to China and back.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/2018696783/dr-roger-tyers-the-no-fly-journey-from-england-to-china

    Dr Roger Tyers: The no-fly journey from England to China From Sunday Morning, 8:38 am today Listen duration 17′ :18″

    Dr Roger Tyers is an environmental sociologist at the University of Southampton who's just made a remarkable no-fly journey from Southampton to Beijing. Dr Tyers speaks to Jim about why he has shunned air travel and what he's hoping to achieve along the way.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday Dr Roger Tyers is an environmental sociologist at the University of Southampton who's in China to research attitudes to the environment, the climate emergency and personal responsibility. He felt that given the subject matter he would be a bit of a hypocrite to be flying to Beijing so instead undertook the journey overland by train. It's took him months to plan the trip, but he is part of a world-wide growing movement of people shunning air travel to reduce their carbon footprint. Some campaigners say no flying is as important as reducing plastic and eating less meat. Dr Tyers speaks to Jim about his journey and the challenges he's faced.

  9. Observer Tokoroa 9

    The Future of Travel

    I can see no need for people to travel from one country to another. Nor from one place to another.

    The Digital Camera will give a far better view of what is where, at better depth, and with greater closeups. The world will be held within our mind. Any one part of it available instanly, via our digital scans.

    We will know Criminal from Saint. The former being vaporised and disposed of, The Latter being part of a universal School of Wisdom.

    The Weather will declared Safe or not Safe. The Population numbers suited or not suited.

    Health Services will be given to all those who practice good living. For Obesity, Gluttony, and Narcissims, Alcoholism will be unaccepted, Drugs, Oils and such appalimg things as Diesel which are deadly Carcinogens, will be eradicted.

    Violence, even at a low level, will be Vaporised instantly. Dishonesty and Laziness will be treated the same way.

    All of this because our wonderful Planet is too valuable to be destroyed by Idiots of any kind.

    The wealthy and the aristocracy, and the War Mongrels (such as Donald Trump) will be vaporised. Everyone will be obliged to live as wonderful Humans – not as the savages they currently are. There is no space for Gluttons on Planet Earth.

    The NOW young Gerneration is Global – they will get to see the real New World.

    • greywarshark 9.1

      You seem to have lost it Observer Tokoroa. But then did you ever have it?

    • Robert Guyton 9.2

      Those are fascinating predictions, Observer Tokoroa! You've certainly identified some areas we humans need to address and change our behaviour around; I especially liked your "there is no space for Gluttons on Planet Earth."; gluttony, gastronomic and materially acquisitive, is at the core of our problem; Mammon's in the driver's seat presently and not slowing noticeably. I'd modify your: "Health Services will be given to all those who practice good living" to "Health will be given to all those who practice good living" and I do question your promotion of "vaporising" as a method for changing human behavioursmiley

  10. Observer Tokoroa 10

    Dear Mr Greywarshark

    Do you think you could try and get a bit up to date- and put your little homilies away.

    You are drenched in the past good man. Clearly you do not want any change in our suffering Planet.

    Well, you are not alone in that, But I have to tell you the new Generation is sick of your wars Mr Warshark. They are also sick of your little fairy tales.

    They want their Planet – Earth – cared for by persons who treasure it. Not by war mongerers such as yourself Mr GreyWARshark.

    For once, you must abuse yourself – and not me! old man.

  11. Observer Tokoroa 11

    To: Robert Guyton

    Thank you for your comments on my bare bone piece concerning the Future of Planet Earth.

    Not all that long ago, a genius named Marconi rigged up an extensive and patterned Antenna, thereby making communication between Ireland and New York a reality.

    Digital Technology now is more than capable of beaming all the neccessary binaries and factors world wide – to establish present day visual Communication. With great clarity and fidelity and at relatively low cost.

    As to my Vaporise vagabonds. The Leaders of the World appear to be of very low IQ. And whereas some of them are not fully corrupt, quite a number are totally willing to start and cause wars of all kinds, as well as nuclear destruction. Damage that lasts Thousands upon Thousands of Years.

    War is their God. Threat is their Lust. They have to be withdrawn into places where they can no longer function as idiots.

    Each school Day – and each Corporate Day – should begin and end with a Statement such as " I am a Living Being on Planet Earth. I Promise to Protect every Living Thing that I can. So that Earth may Prosper. I will treat Health and Safety as personal responsibilities. I will treat my neighbour as myself. For the sake of Earth."

    Addendum

    May I add, the Soap Opera "Coronation Street" is beamed endlessly. As best I know, it requires no Aeroplanes to fly the Sky to deliver itself. I do not know what the Program is about. but it must be pretty good. It has been running 58 odd years. It's a Reality.

  12. Robert Guyton 12

    Observer Tokoroa; if Coronation Street represents our culture accurately, then we are in dire straits indeed! Weighed down by stupid is a poor place to be and extracting ourselves from that our greatest challenge; how to get there, how to get there?

    I suspect that fighting the worshippers of the god of war will not end well, fighting being their area of expertise.; planning to vaporise seems a ploy from their play-book rather than ours. What have we got, us peace-lovers, that's effective in changing minds?

  13. Stuart Munro. 13

    Quail, brief mortals!

    Now you're probably thinking that should be 'Cower', and you'd be right if I were Pratchett writing about Death. Unaddressed climactic events are certainly coming for us, and some of the palliatives for it are small steps we can reasonably take at the household level. Quail are one of these.

    Of the early domestications of food species, the chicken is probably number three after emmer wheat and the dairy culture that characterised the Beaker Folk. They recognised they'd found something extraordinary over 2000 years ago, https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/egypt-egg-ovens, a bird that reliably laid eggs pretty much every day, so long as they were not allowed to brood them.

    Quail, it turns out, are another species that do this, there's a relation to daylight length which in electric times presents no difficulty. So why do quail represent an improvement on chickens? Well, they're smaller. They're quiet (roosters being one reason bylaws forbade keeping chooks in Christchurch). And they don't require a great deal of space – something the size of a large rabbit cage is not, for half a dozen quail, an oppression of battery chook proportions.

    Government have, of course, failed to recognise and foster the potential of backyard aquaculture, but thus far at least quail have evaded their pernicious and perennially inept control. They might suit you.

  14. greywarshark 14

    George Washington Carver (1860s–1943) was an American agricultural scientist and inventor. Born into slavery in Diamond, Missouri, he was raised by his master Moses Carver after being emancipated, having been separated from his parents as an infant during a kidnapping incident. After college, Carver became a professor at Tuskegee Institute, where he developed techniques to improve soils depleted by repeated plantings of cotton. He wanted poor farmers to grow alternative crops, such as peanuts and sweet potatoes, as a source of their own food and to improve their quality of life.

    Carver spent years developing and promoting products made from peanuts, although none became commercially successful. Apart from his work to improve the lives of farmers, he was also a leader in promoting environmentalism. Carver received numerous honors for his work…

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Washington_Carver

  15. greywarshark 15

    On Trade Me: Start price $25 auction finishes Sun 2/6.

    Wetland Restoration Handbook for NZ Freshwater Systems
    https://www.trademe.co.nz/books/nonfiction/flora-fauna/listing-2164331245.htm?rsqid=ca55f01c5c9c4b50982bbf8c58a4c1cd-001
    Edited by Monica Peters and Beverley Clarkson

  16. greywarshark 16

    Thinking of the way forward with employment and how many people are underemployed and in multiple jobs that have to be juggled and so on. It seems that a responsible government needs to set up a PersonPower work force that trains people who are available to work in teams for certain periods on certain projects, perhaps through local Councils, and on orchards and seasonal jobs etc.

    I found a report drawn up for MSD in 1995 which did some thinking and would be worth studying for learnings!

    TACKLING UNEMPLOYMENT; THE GOVERNMENT'S RESPONSE TO

    https://www.msd.govt.nz/documents/…work/…/spj6-tackling-unemployment.doc

    Any moves to help young people obtain skills and training and giving work on projects should be done well, with responsibility to a high standard, with a long-term effect in mind and a very adequate budget. The experience of the Cave Creek disaster is an awful example of how careless government causes lives.

    National in 1995 was well into its neo liberal agenda with business boasting about its skill and experience and not needing endless government regulation checks. It was the early innocent days of the new economic approach of Jim Bolger's government. The Cave Creek disaster arose from a project that was a half-hearted attempt by government to boost training and employment and do projects. It put students onto some seemingly straightforward work to someone at a desk. But the job was far too demanding and skilled and responsible workers were needed and apparently in short supply.

    There was a sad result of 14 people killed when it later collapsed. Fourteen young people who deserved a good start in life, and a long one. This is about it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cave_Creek_disaster

    A survivor felt guilty and had to seek help to recover years later. https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10115932
    The commission of inquiry into the cause of the April 1995 tragedy found that the platform was poorly designed and built by unqualified staff but that no individual DoC officers should be blamed.

    The tragedy resulted from combined systemic failure against a background of underfunding.

    Aucklander Graeme Hunt, who wrote a book about the disaster, said he had not heard any allegation that the platform fell due to students shaking the structure.

    "It's a misplaced guilt – the platform could have fallen at any time.

    "There was no question in my mind that it was unstable from the day it was built, whether someone had shaken it or not."

    https://nzhistory.govt.nz/page/cave-creek-disaster

    https://www.nzonscreen.com/title/cave-creek-1998

    https://westcoast.recollect.co.nz/nodes/view/633

  17. greywarshark 17

    I remembered the Mayors' Task Force for Jobs to help with youth employment.

    This is something being done at the moment.

    http://www.mayorstaskforceforjobs.co.nz/ Waitaki & Waimate Work Ready Passport

    The Mayors Taskforce for Jobs is supportive of the Work Ready Passport and would love to see more Council’s throughout New Zealand supported to create their own local Passports, in support with their local community.

  18. greywarshark 18

    Sea level rises. A map showing coast lines at different levels. The scientist says that the rate of the melting of ice is faster than anticipated and it could be considerable.

    http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-encroaching-sea-new-nz-sea-level-rise-maps/

  19. greywarshark 19

    Climate change effects – Being smoked out of your home area.

    Open mike 31/05/2019


    31 May 2019 at 10:52 am #7.1

    See Sacha

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