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Open mike 03/03/2013

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, March 3rd, 2013 - 55 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…


55 comments on “Open mike 03/03/2013”

  1. mouse 1

    Bernard Hickey nails “the Government’s lack of consistency and adherence to coherent strategy and its bias for doing deals with mates.”


    • freedom 1.1

      it reads as if it is an intro to a much longer, more detailed piece that got truncated becuase it was veering off the pre-set editorial highway and risked hitting a lightpole of reality.

      • tc 1.1.1

        Yes more of that ‘see look here we aren’t bias’ from granny. However this type of article should fill granny everyday as this corrupt nasty gov’t has plenty that could be written up about it.

        It’s like they give it up for some limited balance on weekends then back come oshillivan, Johnny wannabe key Armstrong and daudrey etc weekdays to go with their radio equivalents of Leighton, larry, mikey, etc to keep that constant pro NACT push in the MSM.

        • prism

          My feeling that Joyce is not the man to run run Mobie because he has not the expertise with all of his money-making ability coming from building a web of commercial radio is strengthened the more I road here. We can’t get through to a really experienced businessman – we are fobbed off with someone who has managed to find a niche where he could attach his money IV bag to his veins. Yet he has so much gravitas. Is this justified? I think, looking at the results, we are being hornswggled.

  2. Lanthanide 2

    This ‘alternative census’ run on Stuff last week has the results published:

    It was run on a Sunday, but one of the questions here can give us an idea of the demographics of people who visit stuff, and therefore the type of people that vote on their online polls:

    Which of these groups does your total household income come into. Please include the income before tax from everyone in your household, from all sources
    7% – Up to 20,000 a year 385 a week
    13% – 20,001 to 40,000 a year 386 to 770 a week
    25% – 40,001 – 70,000 a year 771 to 1345 a week
    20% – 70,001 – 100,000
    34% – More than 100,000

    • just saying 2.1

      Ta Lanthanide.

      An overwhelming majority living on more than half of all NZanders. What a surprise. Do you think they’ll mention the demographically skewed sample, and its effect on the reliability of the results, next time they publish one of their polls, now that they have conclusive proof?

      And an indictment on the intelligence and/or taste of the better off in reading the most shallow of the main msm

      • Colonial Viper 2.1.1

        Note – the question said “household income”. The median household income in NZ is currently in the low $60K pa range IIRC

        • just saying

          Is there an embarrassed tag?

          Will pay more attention in future.

          • Lanthanide

            Well it’s still true, since its’ 54% over $70k, so if the median is $60k something then it’s still higher than that.

        • Fran

          The idea of household income is interesting as there are many families where adult children earning low incomes are still resident with parents. 6 adults living in one household all earning minimum wage are over that magic $100K as a household. No-one is well off individually but by pooling resources everyone is managing, just. It is too easy to make all kinds of assumptions without enough data and to just have the total figure without knowing how many people are contributing to it renders any conclusions meaningless.

          • Lanthanide

            Actually 6 adults on minimum wage pooling their money completely freely would be better off than 2 adults on higher wages earning the same amount, since the people on minimum wage would be paying quite a bit less tax.

            This isn’t taking into account the realities of running a household: with 6 people there’d be more cooking, cleaning and general chores required than in a 2 person household, however if we’re assuming 40 hrs/week for each individual then I don’t think their homelife would really be worse off at all in terms of being able to get the chores done.

            • Lanthanide

              Actually I just realised how stupid that comment was, I really wasn’t thinking:
              With 3x the number of people you need 3x the amount of food. You’d likely need to run at least 3 cars, probably more like 4-5 for everyone to work. You’d also likely use much more electricity than 2 people. So all of that would likely gobble up any tax savings.

              • Colonial Viper

                There are inconveniences but you can divide up the chores and organising a bit better – more like communal living. What you can’t have is 6 people living as fully separate independent units because in that scenario you are correct, many costs just multiply.

                Someone who is not working full time devotes a couple of hours a day looking after the vege patch. You only have one car between the entire household (less practical in Auckland admittedly).

                Showers limited to 5 minutes wet time and group cooking holds power costs down signficantly. You can’t have each person heating up their own bedroom with a spaceheater.

                And everyone puts in $10/week to run the still…

  3. Dogberry 3

    An insight into Tory thinking – from the UK but I’m sure it’s equally relevant here:

    “The defence secretary, Philip Hammond, has warned that he will resist further cuts to the armed forces in George Osborne’s forthcoming spending review.

    He told the Daily Telegraph that other Tory cabinet ministers believed the greatest burden of any cuts should fall on the welfare budget.


    Hammond said the “first priority” for the government should be “defending the country and maintaining law and order” and that further defence cuts were not possible while meeting stated security objectives.”


    Apart from the obvious inanity as to exactly who he thinks the UK needs defending from – needing multi-billion pound nuclear submarines and aircraft carriers to do it with – and the rather sinister suggestion that ‘maintaining law and order’ is ultimately a matter for the military, the idea that a Government exists merely to defend the borders leaving the citizenry within them free to make their own provision for food, shelter, health, education &tc as best they can and the devil take the hindmost is pure Laissez-faire thinking any Eighteenth Century Government would have been comfortable with.

    Mind you, I expect the dozen or so readers of the Torygraph he was addressing were all nodding happily in the leather arm-chairs of their London Clubs chumbling ‘hear-hear’ into their brandy-and-sodas.

    Ah well. Leopards and spots.

  4. AsleepWhileWalking 4

    Thumbs down to the NZDF for their enabling of anti gay culture in our military.

    I note they refused to answer reporters questions such as, “As per the inquiry recommendation, has the NZDF reviewed its policies for providing support to homosexual personnel? What came out of that? “, but the NZDF refused to answer on privacy grounds.


    • Te Reo Putake 4.1

      Ironic that the Oz defence forces made history yesterday by challenging anti-gay prejudice in a very, very public way:


    • Jane 4.2

      As always it’s a sad story when some dies in this way, a tragedy. I do have sympathy for the NZDF and the personnel involved, having faced a similar situation in a ‘normal’ workplace and how complex that was I would think that having it happen on a active forward patrol base in a war zone where you live 24 hours a day would be incredibly difficult for everyone.

    • Treetop 4.3

      Being vulnerable in an environment which has a negative culture toward gay personnel makes those in charge culpable.

      • kiwi_prometheus 4.3.1

        The witch hunt has started…

        • Treetop

          Had Hughes not been singled out he may still be alive.

          “… witch hunt…” is not going to bring him back. A healthy culture toward gay personnel is going to prevent a person from being bullied and treated with contempt.

        • QoT

          I really love the way “witch hunt” has been appropriated by privileged groups to demonise any investigation of how their privilege harms other people. Because actual witch hunts were usually all about entrenched religious power structures maintaining their authority through fear and misogyny.

          But I would say that as a neo-anarcho-Marxo-deconstructiono-fluffy-bunny-radical feminist-authoritarian-jiggery-pokery-noodle-head, wouldn’t I?

  5. AsleepWhileWalking 5

    Herald declares welfare numbers “swell” under Bennett:


    When it comes to the worst DPB, sickness, and invalid
    benefit numbers, these have all been since 2010 and under
    Paula Bennett,” Ardern said. “Interestingly, the two highest
    figures for the DPB were both after the introduction of
    Bennett’s welfare reforms, which mostly targeted DPB
    recipients by increasing their work obligations.”


    • AsleepWhileWalking 5.1


      Once her new welfare reforms go through, the benefit categories we have now will be reduced down to just three: supported living, job seeker, and sole-parent support. This will essentially make it impossible to compare the impact of the welfare reforms.

      Ahhh, yes! The real reason to change computer systems, stationary (how many thousands is THAT going to cost?), and confuse the already befuddled frontline staff.

    • Liberty 5.2

      The story is a jack up by socialist Cindy
      The moment I saw this story, I had a fair idea of what the actual data would show. Yes more people on those benefits between those two dates, but not a linear pattern. Of course Jan 2009 was as the GFC was in full force, and hence job losses occurring. Also the comparison stops 12 months ago. Why?
      Let’s look at the actual data, in terms of increase or decrease each year. For DPB they are
      • 2008 +2,128
      • 2009 +9,007
      • 2010 +3,576
      • 2011 +1,365
      • 2012 -5,112
      I think we now understand why Jacinda left the 2012 figures off. What I don’t know if why the Herald on Sunday did.
      Let’s do the same with Invalid’s Benefit numbers.
      • 2008 +3,419
      • 2009 +1,537
      • 2010 +67
      • 2011 -1,062
      • 2012 -472
      And for those interested in the Unemployment Benefit.
      • 2008 +7,760
      • 2009 +35,820
      • 2010 +756
      • 2011 -7,120
      • 2012 -6,217
      They all show the same thing. The increase in benefit numbers started in 2008 (under Labour) and worsened in 2009 as the Global Financial Crisis struck. Despite patchy economic growth since 2009, benefit numbers in all three categories have fallen in the last two years.

      • Arfamo 5.2.1

        It’s not the benefit numbers that bother me it’s the size of the debt National has foisted on us all.

      • Colonial Viper 5.2.2

        People who work an hour a week are clearly not unemployed though, right?

        • Arfamo

          🙂 Ok, let me put it another way. It’s not the benefit numbers that bother me, it’s the size of the debt National has foisted on us all, which requires them to change the accounting to disguise the number of people who aren’t in full-time jobs.

          • Arfamo

            Government stats are joke as an indicator of anything. Stats show crime is increasing. The number of police is increased. Stats then show overall crime has reduced. The number of police is cut. So…they want overall crime to go up again. Then they’ll increase the number of police again? Fark.

      • bad12 5.2.3

        You choose to highlight 2 years out 5 years of figures, hardly smart,

        DPB after 4 years of National Government = +10,864,
        Invalids Benefit after 4 years of National = +4489,
        Unemployment benefit after 4 years of National = +30,999,

        After 4 years of this National Government just in those 3 category’s of Benefits it is +46,352 more reliant on just those 3 category’s of benefit,

        Hardly a victory for National and when the Official information act request comes through you will find that all of those who these figures have shown to have moved off these 3 benefits are now either being paid the same amounts ‘to train’ or industry are being paid the same amounts to ’employ’ them,

        In dollar terms for this National Government then NO difference in the expenditure what-so -ever, and simply using the figures by you to trey and tell the same sort of lie that Bennett has become accustomed to…

    • Murray Olsen 5.3

      Is Jacinda saying that she’d be better at denying people benefits than Paula has been? I wish she’d learn to think before Mallard opens her mouth.

  6. Treetop 6

    Can some sort of legal review be held on the grounds that “… coroner Gordon Matenga declined to open an inquest into the death.”

    I would like to know what policy is in place for those who are on a deployment when there is a risk of self harm?

    The sergeant was not medically quailified and the fact that the soidier was checked for a weapon tells me that the soldier was known to be upset.

  7. Polish Pride 7

    I knew that this was in the pipeline last year. I recommend that you take the time to read and understand what this means as it may be useful for you in your dealings with govt entities from this point.


    You are now essentially at the start of the path to freedom and a better world.

  8. Rogue Trooper 9

    a Complimentary Sunday Roast (with Wontons along-side stuffed mushrooms)
    from the box-
    -“razor-wire insurers”
    -“tractor” drags down the taxpayer highway (now that’s funny)”

    -mundane -atemporal –lapsarian = a -sensible -lunar -orbit so buckle up and get comfortable:
    (Addison, The renal tourniquet Campaign is trifling)

    listened to Laidlaw this am before sallying forth;
    immediately after 3pm last Wed Garner announces on Radio Live (dead) that the Supreme Court decision has upheld maori claim followed truck and trailer 😉 by a Herald reporter squawking the same tune…
    Hahahahahaha / Holey Herald on Sunday Batman, KaPow!

    so mind the Kaitangata Twitch, go Beyond The Occult, Wilson, sail after The Celestine Prophecy to God and The Evolving Universe, James (it’s The Power of Diversity, Barbara, or else)
    God gave you style and gave you grace, now, put a smile on your face 🙂
    One Big Love (Tyndale was an Outlaw) Wycliffe a translator

    and some desert from 1 3 17
    If anyone has material possessions and sees his brother in need but has not pity on him, how can the love of God be in him? (does anybody here remember vera Lynn? how she said that we would meet again some sunny day…) Dear children, let us not love with words or tongue 😉 but with actions and in truth. This then is how we know that we belong to the truth, and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence whenever our hearts condemn us. For God is greater than our hearts and he knows everything (seed has to evolve somewhere). Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us we have confidence before God and receive from him anything we ask (like the new Southern Star cycle he provided today, O Tautau’s the place to see) because we obey his commands (love the big G and your neighbour as yourself) and attempt to do what pleases him…
    And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gives us (and the free lunch, very enjoyable thanks Majors).

    -from the Padua of both Anthonys; Tempted? to see Pigs on The Wing! 10 Million crickets can’t be wrong by Jiminy.

    There is ALWAYS a Redemption Song. I Remember You: Sebastian Bach.

  9. 3 March 2013

    Press Release from: Westmere Heritage Protection Association

    Every wondered why Auckland house prices are going crazy or why you can’t even afford to buy in?

    Here is the Real Oil.

    I have just spoken to my contacts in the banking system and most of the properties in the (Auckland) including the Western Bays areas Ponsonby, St Mary’s Bay, Westmere, Grey Lynn and Point Chevalier are being purchased at inflated prices by two specific groups

    1) Queen Street Speculators / Investors, land banking and renting the properties at high rates waiting for intensification to be instigated by the govt or council.

    2) Asian Nationals (Chinese) on work or holiday permits!

    What is skewing the lack of affordability of our inner city suburbs is that both these groups are buying Cash Up Front!

    Ordinary home owner can not compete.

    This in turn means that these people will want to capitialise on their investments and start to build multi story buildings or units to maximise their profits.

    Tight controls are needed to:

    To stop this sort of speculative behaviour we need to pass laws NOW to:

    a) Ensure that people are NZ citizens before they can buy (which is the law in Australia see below)

    b) Your first home is exempt from any tax, all other properties are subject to capitial gains and property taxes etc.

    c) The law is changed so that Heritage Protection makes our inner suburbs unattractive for Developers to decimate.

    We as a group are not against intensification in Brown-Fields areas, in fact we suggest it is the best way to restore our city ruined by uncontrolled industrial sprawl.

    The reason we insist that the law is changed and action taken immediately is that The National government is under the influenced of the Speculator & Developer lobby and the RMA is being changed to benefit them, making the Council impotent to protect to our neighbourhoods

    We encourage the Auckland Council to take the lead and curbing inappropriate develop, protect heritage and stop council officer making decisions that benefit the Speculators & Developers lobby. Re introduce the Character coalition proposal as part of the Unitary Plan.

    The Australian have strict rules around who can buy a house and where and for what purpose! why don’t we?


    Lisa Prager
    Westmere Heritage Protection Association


    Forwarded in the public interest by Penny Bright.

    • handle 10.1

      So you are not against intensification unless it is in your inner-city suburb. There’s a word for that.

  10. Addison 11

    Not citizens penny. Permanent residents are enough. Even if you don’t meet that criteria you can still apply to purchase and it’s otter granted.

  11. geoff 12

    Does anyone know of website for dealing with common right wing arguments?
    Something that takes an approach like http://www.skepticalscience.com/ does for climate change.

    • Treetop 12.1

      Try the Act Party website if they still have one.

      • geoff 12.1.1

        I just had a look at the ACT party website and took a gander at their ‘principles’. If you didn’t know anything about them you’d almost think it sounded like a nice party! Here it is…


        The principal object of the ACT Party is to promote an open, progressive and benevolent society in which individual New Zealanders are free to achieve their full potential.

        To this end the ACT Party upholds the following principles:

        that individuals are the rightful owners of their own lives and therefore have inherent rights and responsibilities; and
        that the proper purpose of government is to protect such rights and not to assume such responsibilities.

        According to our constitution, the ACT Party shall promote, develop and pursue policies and proposals which:

        encourage individual choice and responsibility and the pursuit of excellence in all fields of human endeavour;
        enhance living standards for all New Zealanders through sustainable economic growth and international competitiveness;
        enhance choice and diversity, and raise standards of achievement in education;
        ensure that all New Zealanders have access to quality health care and have security in retirement;
        maintain social and economic support for those unable to help themselves and who are in genuine need of assistance;
        provide for the nation’s security and the protection of individual lives and property;
        explore and implement practical and innovative ways to protect the natural environment;
        maintain sound economic management, including (but not limited to) a balanced government budget, price stability and a free and open market economy; and
        limit the involvement of central and local government to those areas where collective action is a practical necessity.

        These guys sound great!

        • Treetop

          Lol I to looked at the site to see what a party to the right had to say. I really don’t know what right wing and left wing is anymore.

      • geoff 12.2.1

        No I haven’t seen that before. It’s always nice to get fresh info on the particulars of ACT’s crookedness. Thanks, Jim.

  12. just saying 13

    Just in case it’s important LPrent, the timing on this site is wrong at the moment. Commenters are commenting later than the actual time, according to the time stated on the comments.

    As an example – the comment above says 9.23pm. It is 9.08pm right now.

    • lprent 13.1

      Ummm. That is a problem. The time is taken off the server time at time of insertion in the database and adjusted to timezone.

      I haven’t set up a NTP client so it picks the time of a timer server. So the real time clock at the server is drifting too far. I will fix tomorrow night.

    • bad12 13.2

      Lolz, 9.32pm to be precise, noticed that reading the post on welfare, bit of a head-scratch, check the time on the phone, wonder if it isn’t the end of daylight saving,

      Hmmm them computers are messin with our time now, pretty soon they will make it feel like we don’t know what day it is,

      i tho have a cunning plan, i don’t…

  13. KhandallaViper 14


    Hekia Parata and John Key.
    I watched the movie “Game Change” which follows John McCain’s2008 Presisential campaign from his selection of Sarah Palin as his running mate to his ultimate defeat by Obama. A great movie.

    Pailin and the McCain/Palin relationship have many parallels with Parata and her relationship with Key.

  14. prism 15

    This morning on Radio NZ this USA woman was interesting. She has been thoughtful and politically aware since a young age. She said that she considers the USA to be a pluralism of wealthy groups not a democracy.
    10-11am: Feature interview – Cisco Systems co-founder and Jane Austen expert Sandy Lerner

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    2 weeks ago
  • Call for all-party round table on homelessness
    Labour is calling on the Government to take part in a roundtable meeting to hammer out a cross-party agreement on ending homelessness.  Labour’s housing spokesperson Phil Twyford said the country wanted positive solutions to homelessness, and wanted the political parties ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Seclusion rooms in schools
    Schools are undoubtedly stretched and underfunded to cope with students with high learning support needs. But this cannot justify the use of rooms (or cupboards) as spaces to forcibly isolate children. It has emerged via media that this practice continues ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty
    2 weeks ago
  • Public should get a say on new Waikato power station
    I had an opinion piece published in the Waikato Times about a controversial proposal to build a new gas-fired power station. It’s not on their website yet, so here it is: If you think the public would get a say ...
    GreensBy Gareth Hughes
    2 weeks ago
  • MSD and their investment approach
    The Government talks about investment but there is no investment. It is not investment if it isn’t over the whole of life and if there is no new money  — Shamubeel Eaqub   Investment sounds like adequate resourcing but this ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie
    2 weeks ago
  • Certainty needed for community services
    A couple of months ago I was at a seminar where three community organisations were presenting. Two of the three presenters were waiting to find out if their organisation would get a contract renewed with MSD. Not knowing if their ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie
    2 weeks ago
  • Domestic Violence – some advice for the media
    For the purpose of this piece, I’m going to use Domestic Violence (DV) as a proxy for intimate partner violence. DV is not isolated to physical abuse in a relationship between people with the same power. DV is a pattern of ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie
    3 weeks ago
  • Leroy’s New Paw Prints
    Leroy, an Auckland great dane recently received a new 3D printed bionic leg after cancer was discovered. I think this is a fantastic story and highlights the real potential of additive manufacturing, or 3D printing Leroy’s prosthetic was printed in titanium and was ...
    GreensBy Gareth Hughes
    3 weeks ago