Open mike 10/11/2011

124 comments on “Open mike 10/11/2011 ”

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1. Bored 1

   10 November 2011 at 6:46 am

   History never repeats…well it does.

   Back in the early 80s Ruthenasia Richardson was promoting border dyke irrigation on the Canterbury Plains to be done by the MOW (Ministry of Works for those too young to remember the state used to have a public works capability) and paid for by the tax payer (Ruth the free marketeer had no problem with looting the public purse….for her mates the farmers). The whole concept was more sheep, for which the farmers received SMPs (a per head price subsidy paid for by the taxpayer). So to sum up we the citizens paid taxes that were to be used to pay for a scheme to grow more grass, more sheep and to pay a priveleged sector for a product we could not sell.

   Last night Key announced a $400 million irrigation fund for a Crown irrigation company to grow more grass for more cows paid for by (you guessed it) the taxpayer. Sectoral venality at your expense. Pollution and salination at your expense. Two free marketeers ripping off the public purse.
   • insider 1.1

     10 November 2011 at 10:50 am

     They announced a potentially $400m investment fund in the Budget in March. Is this the same thing?
     • Draco T Bastard 1.1.1

       10 November 2011 at 12:16 pm

       Looks like it.
2. Tigger 2

   10 November 2011 at 7:00 am

   http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10764979
   Leaky schools. Labour blamed for not doing enough. Questions: when were the leaks discovered? What did Labour do? And whose fault is this really if we’re finger pointing?
   • ianmac 2.1

     10 November 2011 at 9:27 am

     It is seldom remembered that it was National during the early 90s who relaxed the building regulations as a sort of Free Market rules. This caused the Leaky buildings. National caused the problem. They must own both the cause and the solution.
     • Pete George 2.1.1

       10 November 2011 at 9:39 am

       No. It was a combination of building products and building practices – and new home builders price priorities also played a part.
       • fender 2.1.1.1

         10 November 2011 at 10:39 am

         Can’t wait to see you with the silverware on your head after you take the leadership from Dunne there Petey.
         • Pete George 2.1.1.1.1

           10 November 2011 at 11:06 am

           Close but lacking din – my primary focus is leadership for Dunedin.

           Getting a very good response via candidate meetings – from individuals, groups, other party candidates and even MPs.
           • sophie 2.1.1.1.1.1

             10 November 2011 at 11:55 am

             Well then you will be able to thank all the kind people who voted for you and all the others who said they would!
       • Lanthanide 2.1.1.2

         10 November 2011 at 10:40 am

         National allowed the combination to begin with.
       • Puddleglum 2.1.1.3

         10 November 2011 at 10:56 am

         “It was a combination of building products and building practices – and new home builders price priorities also played a part.”

         Yes, it was what emerged from an unregulated/’self-regulating’ free market (i.e., National Party policy priority ‘Number One’), as you so succinctly put it, Pete George. 
       • ianmac 2.1.1.4

         10 November 2011 at 11:43 am

         If the Government says you can drive at whatever speed you want and all traffic enforcers are withdrawn and then there is a pileup of cars travelling at 150kmh across town would you blame the cars or the lack of speed limit?
         • Pete George 2.1.1.4.1

           10 November 2011 at 12:48 pm

           I’d primarily blame stupid drivers. Wouldn’t you?
           • Puddleglum 2.1.1.4.1.1

             10 November 2011 at 12:54 pm

             No. I’d see it as a failure of collective decision making (i.e., a political failure).

             A simple reduction of the social to the individual is pretty poor thinking. 
           • ianmac 2.1.1.4.1.2

             10 November 2011 at 12:57 pm

             Of course we would blame the drivers, but do you not think that the disaster could have been prevented with a bit of Governmental common sense? Government absolved do you think?
           • McFlock 2.1.1.4.1.3

             10 November 2011 at 1:09 pm

             Primarily – maybe.
             Secondarily – the dick who created the systemic problem.

              
             Or do you assign blame exclusively to those at the point of contact?
       • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1.5

         10 November 2011 at 12:22 pm

         …and new home builders price priorities also played a part.

         Was it the purchasers pricing or the profit motive? Because looking at history I don’t see prices for houses going down but I do see developers making higher profits.
         • Herodotus 2.1.1.5.1

           10 November 2011 at 2:32 pm

           Perhaps this displays best what the building industry is like and how sub-servient our govt is towards them. A $900k is no punishment, I would imagine thatthe profit margins were still excessive even allowing for the fine.
           http://www.constructionnews.co.nz/articles/dec10/Carter-Holt-Harvey-warned.php
           http://www.comcom.govt.nz/fair-trading-media-releases/detail/2007/carterholtharveyexecutivefinedover
           And even Labour failed to see this issue for what it was and now we have a $20+b issue. At least this will increase our GDP- and what a waste of resources, time and stress
           http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=3006431
           Just because building standards were lowered- is that any excuse for the govt to reduce theirs. The schools could have been built using alternative cladding e.g. tilt slab.
           And ianmac- Nat were the govt yet it was the building regulators that said it was all ok e.g. Brandz and supposed “experts” many representing the building suppliers. All care and no responsibility
       • mik e 2.1.1.6

         10 November 2011 at 8:17 pm

         what a load of bullshit PG Deregulation caused the problem Shifting the blame is Nationals solution.Band aid solution .National have come up with $500million to fix a $32 billion dollar problem typical National party.
       • fmacskasy 2.1.1.7

         10 November 2011 at 11:34 pm

         *sighs*

         Never let it be said that neo-liberals take responsibility for anything.

         Beneficiaries – yes.

         Neo-libs – no. It was someone else whut done it.
     • Uturn 2.1.2

       10 November 2011 at 10:22 am

       As I recall they allowed members of suppliers to the industry onto the group that defines material codes. Then blamed the existence of amateur owner builders for the failure of commercial builds and formed professional registers to prove they weren’t cowboys themselves. It was like watching a bunch of slow-witted toddlers trying to conceal the turd in their pants.
     • KJT 2.1.3

       10 November 2011 at 3:14 pm

       All those who voted National; in the 90’s should be levied for leaky buildings.

       OR maybe we should charge politicians, with criminal negligence, as any other profession would be if they were in charge of such a major fuckup.
3. Colonial Viper 3

   10 November 2011 at 7:22 am

   John Key – Safe hands, Forked tongue

   On Stuff! no less!

   http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/fairfax-media-poll/5939285/John-Key-Safe-hands-forked-tongue
   • Carol 3.1

     10 November 2011 at 7:29 am

     Yes. Saw that. The narrative is building, and JK won’t be very much of a poster boy by the end of a second term… if he makes it that far. It wil also undermine him somewhat this election.

     Contradictory though – how do people know he’s a safe pair of hands with the economy if they can’t trust what he says?
   • Salsy 3.2

     10 November 2011 at 8:20 am

     In my view, what has emerged is the unthinkable. Goff has managed to “tear the teflon” right off Key and the liar brand is sticking. Theyve been given a gift this morning with Nick Smith annoucing 100% Pure Brand essentially will be scrapped in favour of irrigation and intensive dairying – lets see if Labour can claw a few points out of this?

     http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10764987
   • Puddleglum 3.3

     10 November 2011 at 11:04 am

     Even more interesting was this comment piece by Vernon Small.

     Online it is headed: ‘John Key finds ready answers to queries’

     In the print edition it was headed “Bend it like Key” (as in ‘bending the truth’). 
     • ianmac 3.3.1

       10 November 2011 at 11:37 am

       By Hartevelt not Small. Small writes to praise Ceasar not to point at the borer infesting Key’s feet.
       • Puddleglum 3.3.1.1

         10 November 2011 at 11:44 am

         Ooops! You’re right of course. Too many ‘V’s and ‘e’s in their names … 
   • Draco T Bastard 3.4

     10 November 2011 at 12:25 pm

     The poll showed voters had a nagging underlying fear that there was something to Mr Key they hadn’t yet seen.

     That’s because the MSM have been having a love-in with NAct rather than doing their job of investigation and reporting.
   • Mac1 3.5

     10 November 2011 at 4:20 pm

     Wine being released nationally. Supply available to 26 November. Then remaindered.

     Pinot Cchio vintages 2009, 2010, 2011.

     The PM’s favourite, with a nose that is steadily developing.
   • fmacskasy 3.6

     10 November 2011 at 11:35 pm

     Better still – someone at Fairfax can’t count! This was picked up by Mathew, one of our commentators: http://fmacskasy.wordpress.com/2011/11/10/someone-at-fairfax-cant-count/
4. mickysavage 4

   10 November 2011 at 7:29 am

   I went to the Whenuapai meet the candidates meeting last night.  Key was there along with Labour’s Jeremy Greenbrook-Held, the greens Jeanette Elley, some guy from ALCP who made lot of sense at times, an ACT candidate who is not going to vote for himself and an unfortunate Conservative Party candidate who promised to actually do what he promises unless a binding referendum said otherwise.

   Jeremy performed really well and Jeanette was also impressive.  They both knew their stuff and spoke from the heart.

   Key was superficially impressive.  He is like a little kid with a stick trying to upset a hive of bees.  He relishes any sort of argument.

   But I kept thinking of what he said and I have to conclude that he keeps saying fibs.

   On unemployment he said National had created 60,000 jobs over the last year.  He did not acknowledge the promise to create 170,000 or that under his watch unemployment has doubled.

   And fiscal responsibility was one of his main themes.  Without being embarrassed he kept saying National was responsible and Labour was irresponsible with the finances.

   He promised $400 million for the irrigation fund Bored mentioned.  Yesterday National also promised the delay in some sectors coming into the ETS at a cost I understand of $500 million.

   So where is the money coming from John?  And when is the MSM going to call him for what he is, a fibber? 
   • madagascar 4.1

     10 November 2011 at 8:11 am

     I just saw a short clip of the meeting on the news, Jeremy did have a bit of the ‘possum caught in the headlights’ look about him.
     • Colonial Viper 4.1.1

       10 November 2011 at 8:14 am

       That’s the usual TV ‘show the candidate picking his nose’ editing.
   • Puddleglum 4.2

     10 November 2011 at 11:07 am

     “And when is the MSM going to call him for what he is, a fibber? ”

     Vernon Small comes pretty close. See my link in the comment above. 
     • Puddleglum 4.2.1

       10 November 2011 at 11:46 am

       Make that ‘John Hartevelt’
5. drx 5

   10 November 2011 at 8:01 am

   What happened to to $50? payment by people convicted to their victims?
   How much has been collected, how much distributed?
6. Hilary 6

   10 November 2011 at 8:10 am

   Radio NZ reported this morning that work has been going for months getting our state assets ready for sale and Key has said they will start selling straight after election if they are the govt.

   I don’t understand why the majority of NZers who value holding on to our state assets are so keen to vote for the man who is hellbent on selling them as quickly and cheaply as possible.
   • Colonial Viper 6.1

     10 November 2011 at 8:18 am

     Country is disconnected with itself presently. Its waking up but too slow.
   • Deuto 6.2

     10 November 2011 at 10:04 am

     As reported, they have been pressing ahead regardless. This was also “lost” in Stuff’s business news yesterday

     http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/5886811/Govt-appoints-Lazard-for-asset-sale-advice

     Accordiang to the one comment on the article, Lazard have also been advising the Greek government!
   • Puddleglum 6.3

     10 November 2011 at 11:16 am

     This is Duncan Garner’s take on it.

      It’s been said many times before, but a significant number of people don’t appear to be voting for Naitonal (or its policies) but, instead, for Key.

     Stephen Franks welcomed the emphasis on personalities at interest.co.nz a few weeks ago. 
     • Colonial Viper 6.3.1

       10 November 2011 at 11:50 am

       Yep. A lot of National supporters I talk to buy into Brand Key. Brand National’s actual policies? Way less so.
7. Satty 7

   10 November 2011 at 8:24 am

   Could someone please confirm, the petrol price did hardly change the last four weeks?

   The reason, I ask this question, is the oil price increased somewhere around 15 to 20% to 97 US Dollar per barrel recently and the exchange rate against the US Dollar improved only marginal. Begin of the year, this would have meant a significant price increase at the petrol pump.

   Why is the change of the oil price not reflected at the petrol pump?
   Surely, a 10 cent increase a couple of week before an election would cause a complete outrage.

   Also the World Energy Outlook 2011 by the International Energy Agency was released yesterday:
   – Expected oil crises around 2015 unless significant investments of 100 Billion US Dollar anually are done… Mainly in not so stable countries in the Mid-East and North Afrika.
   – In the next 20 years additional 2/3 of today’s output has to be found and come “online” so it covers the decline and we still have approximately 67 Million barrels per day of conventional oil consumed globally. We are not even talking about meeting the increased demand by developing countries!

   And a bit of a joke… Big success story: In Brasil they found another “huge” oil field with a total reserve of over 600 Million barrel or, taking the 87 Million barrel consumed daily into account, around 7 to 8 days of global oil consumption.
   • Lanthanide 7.1

     10 November 2011 at 10:55 am

     What oil price are you referring to?

     NZ petrol is sourced from Dubai Crude, which is different from Brent and WTI. Also the price that matters is actually refined product, not crude. They usually move in tandem, but not always.

     Also, the recent flooding Thailand may have caused a drop in demand, which decreases the price for the rest of us.

     If you look into the price of Dubai Crude, it’ll probably match up with the pump price a lot better.
     • insider 7.1.1

       10 November 2011 at 11:14 am

       You need to ignore the price of oil and focus on the cost of refined fuel out of Singapore.

       We use lots of different oil grades, mostly heavier sour Arabian crudes which is why NZRC has a dirty great hydrocracker, but also lighter Malaysian/Indonesian and local ones too, and blendstocks to balance things out. The price of these affects us over the medium term. But it is the price of refined fuel ex Singapore and the margins over that that really drives our day to day pricing. MED has it on their website and it is relatively up to date.

       Note fuel prices dropped this week about 3cpl.
       • Lanthanide 7.1.1.1

         10 November 2011 at 12:28 pm

         Thanks insider.
   • Colonial Viper 7.2

     10 November 2011 at 11:54 am

     I saw the petrol price at the pump this morning and thought the same.

     The corporates are absorbing oil price rises currently IMO, for whatever reason.

     BTW for those referring to WTI, Brent, Dubai crude – all valid points, but very little of the worlds oil are traded through visible exchanges so all of them are very indicative only.
     • insider 7.2.1

       10 November 2011 at 1:33 pm

       That said they will have a benchmark value for inter/intra company trades or will reflect the off market trading values.

       Note that Countdown are promoting a 25cpl discount this weekend. No doubt P&S will be matching
8. Janice 8

   10 November 2011 at 8:35 am

   Wellington’s Women’s Trade Union Choir Choir Pants on Fire singing about election policies
   
   • ianmac 8.1

     10 November 2011 at 9:09 am

     Been removed by User.
9. travellerev 9

   10 November 2011 at 8:51 am

   http://aotearoaawiderperspective.wordpress.com/2011/11/10/odious-debt-john-keys-legacy/ Enjoy!
10. AAMC 10

    10 November 2011 at 9:00 am

    “World headed for irreversible climate change in five years, IEA warns”

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2011/nov/09/fossil-fuel-infrastructure-climate-change
11. Campbell Larsen 11

    10 November 2011 at 9:01 am

    Allegations of Herald political bias disproved:

    A convincing rebuttal of recent allegations of bias (/sarc) has played out in the letters to the editor section of the Herald after a couple of letters were published accusing the paper of favoritism for National. Subsequently another letter was published accusing the paper of favoritism for the left. A final letter letter was published today asserting that all the complaints were just ‘bleating’ and that the paper has got the balance ‘about right’ because there was a complaint from both sides.
    The Herald itself had no comment to make on the matter.

    Well nothing to see here then I guess.
    • Lanthanide 11.1

      10 November 2011 at 11:01 am

      I like how if “both sides complain, there’s no bias” is somehow seen as a reasonable argument.
12. thejackal 12

    10 November 2011 at 9:04 am

    John Key’s baby-killing spree has no effect on poll numbers

    This latest victory for National comes on the heels of Key’s three-handshake at the World Cup presentation ceremony which won the social retard vote, and his “show me the money” jibe at the town hall debate which saw both Jerry Maguire fans and Scientologists declare for National.
13. Pete George 13

    10 November 2011 at 9:10 am

    A good election forum in Dunedin tonight – a Sustainable Dunedin and Forest & Bird sponsored look at candidate and party views on sustainability and environmental issues.

    7.30pm, Hutton Theatre, Otago Museum

    You’re welcome to say hello – or heckle if you prefer.
    • Ianupnorth 13.1

      10 November 2011 at 10:04 am

      Hey, I saw your glorious leader on Breakfast this morning – has he ever been described to you as a leech?
       
      He seems to want to cling to whoever he fancies at the time. Please can you advise exactly what is the significance of United Future? Frankly I see it as a pointless exercise, other than keeping your leader in a job.
14. M 14

    10 November 2011 at 9:54 am

    John sez “It really is all about me”

    http://nz.news.yahoo.com/election/a/-/11526953/criticism-of-pms-breach-of-mourning-moment/
15. Adrian 15

    10 November 2011 at 10:22 am

    Duncan Garner arced up on TV3 this morning apparently, said the underclass had grown undeniably under National and the gap between rich and poor had widened massively. Hidden in the Chch quake news in the Herald is ” Labour ahead in the South’. Hidden because nothing in the story justifies it being in quake news and that will only be read by Cantaburians. There is a slight seachange in the MSM, except for boofhead Alexander who has obviously been offered the job Garner thought he was getting.
16. Penny Bright 16

    10 November 2011 at 10:55 am

    (Mainstream media are blocking this info.
    If anything is useful – please ‘help yourselves’. 🙂

    PRESS RELEASE: Penny Bright Independent Candidate for Epsom
    “Does ACT Leader Don Brash have a PhD in ‘Hypocrisy’?

    “Does ACT Leader (former National Party Leader) Dr Don Brash, have a PhD in ‘Hypocrisy’?” asks Penny Bright Independent Candidate for Epsom, responding to reported comments in his latest speech, where Mr Brash said Act “remains committed to equality before the law for all New Zealanders”.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10764866

    “How come ACT’s ‘one law for all’ doesn’t appear to apply to ‘white collar criminals’ – only Maori?”, continues Ms Penny Bright.

    “Does ACT Leader , (former National Party Leader) Dr Don Brash, agree that this ‘one law for all’ policy should equally apply to himself, and ACT candidate for Epsom (former National Government Minister for Police and Local Government) John Banks?

    Does ACT Leader , (former National Party Leader) Dr Don Brash, agree that this ‘one law for all’ policy should equally apply to himself, and ACT candidate for Epsom (former National Government Minister for Police and Local Government) John Banks, and that both should equally face criminal charges for misleading investors when former Directors of Huljich Wealth Management (NZ) Ltd, as did fellow former Director Peter Huljich?

    If not – why not?”

    “Why should the voting public trust a word from the lips of ACT Leader, (former National Party Leader) Dr Don Brash, and ACT candidate for Epsom (formally National Government Minister for Police and Local Government) John Banks, when the ‘one law for all’ that they espouse – does not equally apply to themselves?”

    “Are ACT Leader, (former National Party Leader) Dr Don Brash, and ACT candidate for Epsom (former National Government Minister for Police and Local Government) John Banks going to support the Finance Markets Authority (FMA) equally filing criminal charges against each of them for allegedly misleading investors when former Directors of Huljich Wealth Management (NZ) Ltd. – or not?”

    “Does the ACT candidate for Epsom, (former National Government Minister for Police and Local Government) really think that National Party Leader, and NZ Prime Minister John Key should publicly endorse an alleged ‘white collar’ criminal, such as himself, who has yet to be charged, let alone convicted, because the ‘one law for all’ principle has yet to apply to John Banks, former fellow Director of Huljich Wealth Management (NZ) Ltd?”

    “ACT’s leadership supports ‘one law for all? – yeah right”, concludes Ms Penny Bright.

    Penny Bright
    Independent Candidate for Epsom.
    Campaigning against ‘white collar’ crime, corruption (and its root cause – privatisation), and ‘corporate welfare’.
    Attendee: Australian Public Sector Anti-Corruption Conference 2009
    Attendee: Transparency International’s 14th International Anti-Corruption Conference 2010

    Ph (09) 846 9825 Mob 021 211 4 127 [email deleted]
    • mik e 16.1

      10 November 2011 at 8:26 pm

      Keys insider trading should be brought before the courts .Merrill Lynchs $79 trillion US in toxic derivatives has Keys hands all over it this debt didn’t build up overnight Key was an instrumental part of it being in charge of currency trading
17. ak 17

    10 November 2011 at 11:44 am

    KEY’S CUTLERY CLANGER NO WORRY SAY DOCS

    11.27 LATEST: A slippery scallop is blamed for a minor injury to Prime Minister John Key on the election trail in New Plymouth today. “It’s nothing actually,” Key told journalists outside Taranaki District Health Board’s emergency department. “Just a nick. I’ve had plenty of those.” A spokesman for National’s campaign downplayed the incident. “They knew the Prime Minister was in town and knew exactly what to do. Minister Ryall has ensured that all ED’s in the country are well prepared to deal with a forked tongue.”

    In other news, volunteers at Port Taranaki were relieved after a false alarm sparked a callout to a nearby beach. “We thought for a minute it might be another Rena,” said Morris Heyhey, the retired engineer who first noticed a suspicious oily slick along the tidal mark. “but then they told us John Key had just walked along that morning.”
    • ianmac 17.1

      10 November 2011 at 11:53 am

      Do you need to be slickly oiled in order to speak with a forking tongue?
18. Draco T Bastard 18

    10 November 2011 at 12:02 pm

    Al Jazeera interview with Slavoj Zizek

    In his distinct and colourful manner, he analyses the Arab Spring, the eurozone crisis, the “Occupy Wall Street” movement and the rise of China. Concerned about the future of the existing western democratic capitalism Zizek believes that the current “system has lost its self-evidence, its automatic legitimacy, and now the field is open.”
    • AAMC 18.1

      10 November 2011 at 1:18 pm

      Hey Draco, any chance of re posting that link. Just takes me to Standard home page. Would love to see it.
    • joe90 18.2

      10 November 2011 at 1:46 pm

      http://english.aljazeera.net/programmes/talktojazeera/2011/10/2011102813360731764.html
      • AAMC 18.2.1

        10 November 2011 at 5:08 pm

        Brilliant, thank you! I shall watch that now.
    • uke 18.3

      10 November 2011 at 2:15 pm

      It should be remembered that earlier this year Zizek ranted against young people taking part in the London “riots”. And as this article explains:
       

      Zizek has a political history as a founder and candidate of Slovenia’s Liberal Democratic Party (LDS), which oversaw the reorganization of the former Yugoslav Republic along free market capitalist lines.
       

      Interestingly, he is also apparently something of an admirer of Joseph Stalin.
       
    • joe90 18.4

      10 November 2011 at 2:41 pm

      http://www.iep.utm.edu/zizek/
19. thejackal 19

    10 November 2011 at 12:07 pm

    Smiths Environmental Failures

    Per capita, New Zealand is currently third at producing non-organic and non-recyclable waste. Auckland alone creates 180,000 tonnes of waste each year… 14% of this being potentially hazardous…
    • Lanthanide 19.1

      10 November 2011 at 12:30 pm

      I wonder if this is due to lack of recycling/organic bin programmes around the country.

      For example in CHCH we had green recycling tubs for quite a while, and then 3 years ago they introduced 3 wheeley bins for organic, recyclable and landfill waste. I believe this has cut down the amount of waste going to landfill quite a lot.

      In Oamaru however, they just have rubbish bags that everything gets put into.
      • Draco T Bastard 19.1.1

        10 November 2011 at 2:56 pm

        introduced 3 wheeley bins for organic, recyclable and landfill waste.

        We’re getting something like that in Auckland over the next few years. My landlord/flatmate is complaining about it because the bins are going to be chipped and charged on a per weight basis I believe. Personally, I think it’s great as it will encourage people to produce less waste and start people to question why they’re paying so much for the junk mail* they get that they don’t want and don’t read.

        * Junk mail is the original spam and should have been banned along with the electronic version.
        • wtl 19.1.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 5:21 pm

          A good idea in essence, perhaps. Not sure how it will work in practice. For example, how will you prevent others from adding their waste to your bin without your permission?
          • felix 19.1.1.1.1

            10 November 2011 at 8:05 pm

            For most people that would imply someone actually sneaking onto your property and finding your bins around the back of your house. Not sure that’s a huge issue really.

            In other situations where your bins have to be in a public area there’s no reason they couldn’t have a padlock on the lid.
            • wtl 19.1.1.1.1.1

              10 November 2011 at 9:34 pm

              I was thinking of when your bins are outside waiting for collection.
              • felix …

                10 November 2011 at 10:42 pm

                Ah so
              • Mac1 …

                10 November 2011 at 10:58 pm

                The bin would be full, anyway, when put out for collection?
    • tekapodreaming 19.2

      10 November 2011 at 12:40 pm

      ‘Per capita, New Zealand is currently third at producing non-organic and non-recyclable waste. ‘

      Have you got a link for that Jackal ? I’d be interested to have a read.
      • thejackal 19.2.1

        10 November 2011 at 2:00 pm

        The graph Proportion of ‘other’ waste in OECD countries on this Ministry of Environment webpage shows that New Zealand produces the third most overall waste. However their preamble says that New Zealand ranks 28th worst out of 30 OECD countries.
        • tekapodreaming 19.2.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 8:16 pm

          I think you’re reading the dataset incorrectly.

          “New Zealand ranks 28th out of 30 OECD countries in the ‘other’ category; with our proportion being one-and-a-half times the OECD average. The high proportion of ‘other’ waste in New Zealand is likely to reflect the relatively large proportions of rubble from landscaping waste and timber from residential waste. Australia has a much lower proportion of ‘other’ waste than New Zealand and ranks seventh out of the OECD countries.”

          “Overall, New Zealand has comparatively low proportions of paper waste disposal, average proportions of glass, organic, metal and plastic waste disposal and high proportions of ‘other’ waste disposal compared with other Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) countries.”

          I don’t think you can make the comment you have, however, there is no doubt that there is considerable room for improvement.
          • felix 19.2.1.1.1

            10 November 2011 at 9:07 pm

            Yes timber waste is a huge problem but just identifying it doesn’t mean you get to subtract it from the total.

            It’s a bit like saying “Yes officer I’ve had about 20 drinks tonight but quite a few of them were wine, so we’re sweet yeah?”
20. Bored 20

    10 November 2011 at 12:17 pm

    Asset sales…..asset sales.

    Ever wondered whats behind it? Its not ideology (neo lib is too discredited) and its neither good nor rational economics (no semi comatose business would sell off its key income earners).

    Think this way, the Euro is crashing ( http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2011/nov/09/european-debt-crisis-eurozone-breakup ) cash is escaping Europe into US Treasury bonds and into the US stock markets which have risen steadily in the last months (but started crashing last night)….so where is a safe haven for the cash? Chinas economy is at a standstill as demand falters…..and they hold huge US debt notes which will soon be worthless.

    Where can Key and the international money junKeys find a safe haven, a sure thing for their millions to be invested in? Not in stocks anywhere, Treasury Bonds depend upon the country not defaulting or being able to pay, so where?

    Where indeed is “safe”? Good “monopoly” rentals from you and me are available fby stripping our necessary assets. Electricity SOEs, coal SOEs etc. Ma and Pa NZers consisting our own 1%ers….

    I feel a Jacobin moment coming on.
    • Puddleglum 20.1

      10 November 2011 at 12:44 pm

      On a side note, the article you link to states that Italy is thought “too big to rescue”.

      That’s an interesting switch from banks that are “too big to fail”. Of course, Italy is only a country with people in it. Banks are pivotal transnational corporates with lots of capital in them. No contest, really, when it comes to taxpayer bailouts.
      • Bored 20.1.1

        10 November 2011 at 1:05 pm

        The world of fantasy digits meets the world of real people…..too big to fail was always a chimera, an impossible fantasy. “Occupy” signals a broader intention, a seminal zeitgeist emerging…we aint going to take it. The resurrected spirit of the inner Jacobin.

        Democracy tamed by the owners of digital promises to pay will transform into the mob versus the digit holders.
    • Draco T Bastard 20.2

      10 November 2011 at 1:23 pm

      +1

      State assets sales have never been about efficiency but about giving our assets to the rentiers so that they have a nice, safe, government guaranteed income from other peoples work.
21. Anne 21

    10 November 2011 at 12:38 pm

    Thanks for that Bored. Been wondering lately… what exactly is the link between the global financial crisis… the rapidly spreading Occupy Movement (and it’s off shoots)… and the almost desperate desire by Key and co. to sell off our biggest assets. The last ditch attempt by the global rich-pricks at holding on to their power and their wealth?
    • Bored 21.1

      10 November 2011 at 1:14 pm

      Yes Anne, the lack of awareness of the larcenous nature of the “corporate state / big finance nexus” is a tribute to their propaganda powers, the common consent manufactured by an owned media and compliant state. To regain our democracy we need to break “big media” as well.
22. Brett Dale 22

    10 November 2011 at 1:03 pm

    Having a go at Key’s private FAMILY holidays now, is there no low Goff wont stoop too.
    • Bored 22.1

      10 November 2011 at 1:08 pm

      Having a go at what is mine and yours too, is there no low to which Key wont stoop? His holidays, our assets. Burglars and larcenists normally get state funded holidays.
    • Zorr 22.2

      10 November 2011 at 1:45 pm

      Didn’t you know Brett? Key works 19hrs a day, 7 days a week for us! He is such a marvelous man he must also be magical to be able to fit holidays to Hawaii in there too! When does he sleep? Is he trying to one up Maggie?
      • Brett Dale 22.2.1

        10 November 2011 at 8:32 pm

        Goff should argue policies not having a go at where someone takes their family on holiday.
    • Deuto 22.3

      10 November 2011 at 2:29 pm

      What I have found farcial with Key is that he was intent upon becoming Minister of Tourism from day one – but at every opportunity he heads off overseas and particularly to Hawaii for his holidays. Certainly not walking the talk.
    • William Joyce 22.4

      10 November 2011 at 2:36 pm

      For a start Brett, I doubt there is anything that Goff does that would impress you so you missed a few important things in your rush to denigrate Goff.
       
      Family doesn’t enter into. Goff never attacked his family and (despite what you think of him) Goff is just not that sort of guy.
      However, it is a valid political move to compare the circumstances of people trapped in poverty with someone who, even outside his PM’s salary, has such freedoms that his wealth affords him, that he can escape whatever situation he may find himself in in NZ by holidaying at his own home in Hawaii.

      It is a valid political comparison because the very people affected by his policies, unlike him, are unable to break out of their context and have to take whatever shit policies Key decides to deliver to them. I’m sure the poor would just love to take their families to Hawaii for a holiday – even just once – even in a ratty hotel – let alone every year or whenever the whim takes them!
       
      It is also valid for an opposition to question whether such wealth, and the freedom of choice it brings, blinds Key to the true mental and emotional prison that people in poverty endure.
       
      It is no longer acceptable for people to give Key a break on the Crosby/Textor crafted narrative of poor boy made good. He has not been that poor boy for many years.
      And most importantly, that story has not translated into action for the poor. On his watch the rich have got richer and the poor have got poorer. He had three years to help the poor out of their situation but he has not only failed but shown every sign of being the right wing fat cat bastard we suspected that he was underneath.
       
      He, like Bennett, have pulled the ladder after him. Tax breaks for the rich, hob-nobing with the rich and famous while driving a knife into the poor and neglecting the economy.
      • Brett Dale 22.4.1

        10 November 2011 at 8:35 pm

        William Joyce:

        Goff was having a cheap shot, talking to people in south auckland, saying “this guy is rich he goes to hawaii, bad man bad man”

        I guess he forgot to them he took his family to Europe.

        shhhhhh.
        • Ianupnorth 22.4.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 9:41 pm

          Next thing you’ll say it was envy – go away troll
23. randal 23

    10 November 2011 at 1:31 pm

    I see the eager beaver steven joyce delayed the introducyion of important legislation on April 1 in case people thought it was a joke.
    well that just about takes the cake.
    what does he take us for.
    ninnies like him and his national cabinet.
    deosn’t he think kiwis know how to doa nything unless it is spoon fed.
    gahhhhhhhhh. this government gets more and more horibbler by the minute.
    out with them.
    • William Joyce 23.1

      10 November 2011 at 2:19 pm

      How patronising can Joyce be? The man is a totally arrogant pompous ass!
      This decision and it’s reasoning is an insult to the NZdrs he expects to vote for him and his elitist wankers.
24. Trowlie 24

    10 November 2011 at 2:07 pm

    I was just called at home by Research International and asked if I would be willing to do a political poll. I was more than happy to as I had never been called before.

    The questioner asked which electorate I was enrolled in. Answer – Ilam.
    Questioner – Where is that?
    Me – Ilam in Christchurch.
    Questioner – Is that Christchurch east?
    Me – No.
    Questioner – Is that Waimakiriri?
    Me – No, it’s Gerry Brownlee’s electorate. Have you heard of him?
    Questioner – No I haven’t. I need to talk to someone enrolled in Waimakiriri. The MP is Catherine, umm, Catherine someone in that electorate.
    Me – I don’t know a Catherine anyone but the MP in Waimak is Clayton Cosgrove.
    Questioner – Sorry, Clayton who?
    Me – Clayton Cosgrove, from Labour.
    Questioner – Oh right, I don’t think you can do the poll. It’s got to be a person enrolled in Waimak.
    Me – Maybe you should call homes that are actually in the Waimakiriri electorate then.
    Questioner – Oh yeah. Thanks for your time

    Whoever is paying research international should get their money back.
    • happynz 24.1

      10 November 2011 at 2:34 pm

      That’s hilarious. 🙂

      The person making the calls is obviously out of his/her depth. Research International ought to put in a bit more effort in their business.
      • Ianupnorth 24.1.1

        10 November 2011 at 4:25 pm

        Did they have a hint of a Bangalore accent?
        • Trowlie 24.1.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 10:07 pm

          Just a plain old kiwi accent. They did say that their supervisor could be listening in to see how they were going.

          It will just be poor staff training. Kind of felt sorry for her and disappointed that I didn’t get to answer the questions.
25. ianmac 25

    10 November 2011 at 2:57 pm

    This must have slipped past the Herald censors. Someone there will get sacked! Herald Online:

    “Grant Robertson has accused Prime Minister John Key of “ducking the tough questions”
    and: “He (Key)has refused to go head-to-head in a live debate with Labour Leader Phil Goff for the Herald; with Morning Report because he was ‘too busy to prepare’; with Close Up twice; and Radio Live.

    “He (Key)continues to give Campbell Live the cold shoulder and Radio New Zealand confirmed last month it had only been able to get him on its programmes a handful of times in the past year. ”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10765098
26. The Voice of Reason 26

    10 November 2011 at 3:32 pm

    Just in time for the first anniversary, charges get laid against those responsible for killing 29 miners at Pike River. No names yet, but here’s hoping Peter Whittall is prominent among them.
    • prism 26.1

      10 November 2011 at 9:18 pm

      The evidence of this Japanese engineer in another four or five days should be interesting and informative. He made a rational decision to leave based on known factors likely to result in an explosion. We have short-changed our miners and ourselves in NZ with our she’ll be right approach. It wasn’t so easy for our people to leave, they just worked on and hoped for the best, and that wasn’t wise.

      If they had gone on strike would anything have been done to improve conditions?? Or would it have been a case of ‘put these blokes in their place’, cosh a few if necessary and get them back to work instead of wasting time over their endless grievances and demands. I think it would have been the last.

      Emil Zola – we need you. Emil ZOLA’s novel Germinal is the heading to get on to his novel about coal mining in northern France with miners being paid for output and having to shore up the mines themselves. Their working conditions and safety were their own problem. When the price of coal fell of course they got paid less for their output but still had the same hazards.
27. Dave Kennedy 27

    10 November 2011 at 4:48 pm

    If National get in for a second term one of the biggest casualties will be education.
    http://localbodies-bsprout.blogspot.com/2011/11/education-is-investment-in-our-future.html
28. chris73 28

    10 November 2011 at 7:32 pm

    Oh dear…

    http://tvnz.co.nz/election-2011/drop-in-support-national-and-labour-poll-4520729

    I think the best way to arrest this slide is to keep attacking Key, maybe even point out he has holidays in Hawaii

    Yep that’ll work
    • McFlock 28.1

      10 November 2011 at 8:16 pm

      That would be why Key etc look so confident and in no way worried, then. /sarc
       
      All or nothing – the money-trader’s gamble, because they don’t have a stake in it themselves.
29. Bovver 29

    10 November 2011 at 8:05 pm

    Gotta be a rogue poll Chris73 by those naughty people from the MSM
30. prism 30

    10 November 2011 at 8:46 pm

    I am really brassed off. The road rules are being changed at the end of March next year back to how they used to be. On a whim and a theory that it would be better, we were forced to change some time ago from left having right of way, now the bureaucrats want to change back and I bet on no better arguments than for the original change.

    And it will cause more accidents for some time I think. And our roads will have to be remarked, in some cases redesigned and traffic lights recalibrated or whatever, and how can we afford this unnecessary carry-on. How can we stop this waste of money?
    • Draco T Bastard 30.1

      10 November 2011 at 9:24 pm

      …now the bureaucrats want to change back and I bet on no better arguments than for the original change.

      Actually, my quick reading of the literature awhile back showed a couple of good reasons:
      1.) It’s actually more logical
      2.) We’re the last place on Earth to have such backward road rules and so it confuses drivers from other countries
      3.) The change will result in less accidents see 1.)
      • prism 30.1.1

        10 November 2011 at 9:28 pm

        Oh OK. I’ll just lie down and think of England.
        • Anne 30.1.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 9:32 pm

          Have a cup of tea first. 🙂
          • prism 30.1.1.1.1

            10 November 2011 at 9:43 pm

            I don’t know which is right or left now. Should I have English Breakfast or Gumboot and erupt kicking and shouting?
            • felix 30.1.1.1.1.1

              10 November 2011 at 10:41 pm

              Green
      • prism 30.1.2

        10 November 2011 at 9:41 pm

        1.) It’s actually more logical

        Does that mean we went through the original kerfuffle for an illogical reason? It has been made to work, and assists those turning right to achieve their requirements. So that is illogical is it.
        • Draco T Bastard 30.1.2.1

          10 November 2011 at 9:46 pm

          Yes, because people behind the left turning car but going straight ahead aren’t giving way to the right turning car which results in accidents when the right turning car pulls across in front of them.
31. prism 31

    10 November 2011 at 9:59 pm

    I am getting vengeful in my old age. Where are the people who made us change our original driving patterns to give way to the right turning? I would like to have a few words with them, and also get payment for all the road and sign changes made then, and to be done in the next few months. And also kick them up the bum.
    • rosy 31.1

      10 November 2011 at 10:19 pm

      If I remember correctly the change to give way to right turning traffic was made to prevent huge queues forming in the middle of the roads when right-turning traffic had to give way and there was not enough room for cars from behind to pass safely along the left of them. To me, and a few international friends I’ve discussed this with, the NZ system works well.

      However, the research seems to have been done and the conclusion is that it apparently causes more accidents so it’s being changed back. I hope they have it right because it would piss me off intensely if the change was being made simply to fall in line with international practice and a different set of intersection accidents increase (thinking here, in particular, of long queues on high-speed rural roads that might be have quite different characteristics to the international rural roads that may have been used in comparative studies).
      • Carol 31.1.1

        10 November 2011 at 10:33 pm

        The change from the original rule happened when I was overseas. After a couple of decades overseas, all using the rule the way it used to be in NZ, it was very hard to change to the “new” NZ rule when I came back. It took 2-3 years to be able to follow the rule without thinking. I used to curse it. Because I’d remind myself about the rule when I set out driving somewhere, but when I did a left turn, decades of driving habit kicked in and I’d turn without waiting for the cars in the middle of the road.
        • rosy 31.1.1.1

          10 November 2011 at 10:40 pm

          Yeah, I reckon that difference is part of the problem with the accidents. I’m just worried that NZ’s difficult rural roads might end up with more serious accidents. C’est la vie.
32. pollywog 32

    10 November 2011 at 10:32 pm

    I feel so dirty.

    Quick…someone hose me down !

    🙂
    • prism 32.1

      10 November 2011 at 10:46 pm

      pollywog I’m not with you. What are you feeling so dirty about? Do tell.
      • pollywog 32.1.1

        11 November 2011 at 8:46 am

        Pig wrestling with nutjobs down at the ‘bog.
33. rosy 33

    10 November 2011 at 11:23 pm

    Nice, Patrick Gower…. Raising minimum wage won’t cost jobs

    The Department of Labour says the rise will cost 6000 jobs. But Treasury has a counter view; “This has not been true in the past. The balance of probabilities is that a higher minimum wage does not cost jobs.”
    Not all employers are worried about a hike either. Andy Martin runs a pub, employing 26 people in Oamaru.
    He says put the wage up and people just spend more money – everyone wins.
    “$15 is fair,” he says.

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