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The puppet party, the Mega party and the pro assault party

Written By: - Date published: 9:30 am, January 12th, 2014 - 201 comments
Categories: act, conservative party, john key, national, rodney hide, same old national, Steven Joyce - Tags:

kim-dotcom-john-banks-song

There are three interesting stories in the media this morning each of which have implications for this year’s election.

Firstly the SST is reporting that there will be a push to put the anti smacking law (or as I prefer to call it the anti child brutalising law) back on the political agenda this year. Apparently there is a groundswell of opposition to the thousands of ordinary kiwi parents being imprisoned for delivering the lightest of physical admonishments to their children. There is also the reality that the law change is causing a positive attitudinal change and that the number of prosecutions are very small and the punishments are light but since when has reality got in the way of conservative belligerence? If only these people were as upset about child poverty …

The second story is about how the real chief of the ACT party, Steven Joyce, visited Rodney Hide to see if he would stand again for the Epsom seat. Rodney has stated that he will not stand. This particular piece of news shows beyond doubt that ACT is a puppet party controlled by National. New Zealand they are twisting electoral rules to gain an unfair advantage.

The third story may be the most significant, Kim Dotcom is said to be planning the launch of his own political party this month. I have mixed views about this. Although it would be very pleasing to see Dotcom confront John Key on the campaign trail, and although I find it hard to believe that someone as interested in meeting local famous people as Dotcom would not have met Key before the raid on Dotcom’s house, I am afraid that he may maroon some protest votes in a party that will not make the threshold and perversely may help National. And although I am sure that his policies on freedom would be sound I am not so sure that his business policies would provide the necessary oversight required. After all he is a German entrepreneur with a dislike of any sorts of restrictions.

It is shaping up to being an interesting year …

201 comments on “The puppet party, the Mega party and the pro assault party”

  1. RedBaronCV 1

    The kiddie bashers want to ride again. What a policy plank?! Hitting people smaller than yourself. Most police involvement has been when concerned bystanders have reported the matter..

    • Murray Olsen 1.1

      The police have always been quite adept at hitting people smaller than themselves. They could set an example and start treating our kids decently themselves.

  2. RedBaronCV 2

    BTW – there are billboards up for the conservatives around Wellington already. Does this eat into election spending limits or should Labour, the Greens, Mana etc do this piece of brand awareness(awful term) as well.

    • Paul 2.1

      Interesting that the Dominion Post chose to make this news.
      Only CC and his nut bar party would benefit from this being an election issue.
      Are there connections between the powers that be and the editors there?
      http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9600491/Smacking-debate-back-in-the-limelight

      • Murray Olsen 2.1.1

        Great that Colin Craig can paint his supporters as people who break the law in private and Key still wants a coalition with him, but I suppose it’s no different from ACT. The number of their MPs that broke laws and behaved unethically was pretty high.

    • lprent 2.2

      Because of the self-serving changes that National put into the replacement Electoral Finance Act back in 2009, they are not.

      The electoral period that political parties have to disclose their expenditure for is limited to something strange and miniscule like 90 days from an election.

      Of course as you have observed, our actual electoral period since about 1999 has in reality been something like 12 months. These days National’s sockpuppet parties tend to awaken just before xmas and campaign for the whole year.

      For that matter so do the major parties according to their budgets. For instance with National trying to talk up the economy. The Greens and Labour tend to be more constrained.

  3. Craig Y 3

    I move that we should label such fundamentalist enthusiasts for corporal punishment ‘sado-maso-Christians!’

  4. Anne 4

    From the linked article:

    Where the government is supposed to serve us the people, we are paying with our taxes that they do a good job for us. But look what they do, they undermine our rights, they destroy our freedoms, they censor our internet, so we are the ones who have to bring that change,” Dotcom said in a documentary by international magazine Vice, released last week.

    “That is why I get involved in politics because I am f . . .ing tired of this nonsense and someone has to stand up and change this,” he said.

    You can’t blame Kim Dotcom for feeling this way, but where does he stand on the NZ political spectrum? Some say he’s Libertarian. Maybe. Bryce Edwards claims he isn’t likely to support the Labour/Green parties. Why? It’s Labour and the Greens who have consistently called out the government on the nonsense he’s so f….ing tired of. He’s stood on various platforms with them over the self-same issues. I’m not suggesting he will openly support them, but he may well be prepared to come to a pre-election arrangement with them. After all, he has a much better chance of getting the changes he wants to see under a centre-left coalition government.

    • Colonial Viper 4.1

      New Max Keiser interview with Dotcom; from 12 minutes in.

      He’s not keen on the way big corporations and US politicians work together. His views on internet freedom are very necessary to push back against totalitarian govt surveillance – and he has the team and the resources to actually do something about it.

    • veutoviper 4.2

      It will be interesting to see the details of the Dotcom (political) party, but it seems we only have another week to wait. Presumably he will unveil some detail at his big party in Auckland on Jan 20 – his birthday and the anniversary of the raid.

      In a tweet this morning he said ” My party will activate non-voters, youth and the internet electorate. We are going to make politics exciting, More on January 20th.” And in another tweet this morning “Get ready for low blows and smears against me and my political party. My attackers are worried. They should be. We will get more than 5%.”

      Re Bryce Edwards’ claims that KDC isn’t likely to support the Labour/Green parties, I agree with your comments. In fact, KDC has had some complimentary things to say in tweets over the last year on Cunliffe and has retweeted a number of his speechs. While KDC may have become mega rich, his childhood does not appear to have been a wealthy one, so he may not be as blind to things like child poverty etc as some may think.

      • veutoviper 4.2.1

        Since submitting the above comment, I have re-watched the video of the GCSB Public meeting on Aug 19, 2013, which Molly linked to in her comment on OM earlier this morning /open-mike-12012014/#comment-756198

        It was well worthwhile seeing it again (thanks Molly) and watching KDC’s very positive reaction to Russel Norman’s speech – particularly KDC’s actions at the end of the speech.

        So,IMO there may well be cooperation/support from KDC and his party to the Labour/Green parties.

        • Colonial Viper 4.2.1.1

          Dotcom is not going to be left wing in the classic sense of the term. But he will fight hard against govt/corporate locking down of innovation, use of patents and copyright as tools of rentier capitalism, fascist law enforcement actions against weak players on behalf of major corporate interests, totalitarian surveillance and control of the internet, etc.

          • veutoviper 4.2.1.1.1

            Agreed, CV. That will be his focus, and thanks for the link to the Max Keiser interview which I have just watched. Was well worthwhile – even if it meant me again procrastinating about going out and mowing the lawns (more like a paddock at present!)

            But if KDC can work alongside Labour and the Greens etc, that would be good. While he donated to Banks, I wonder whether that was more of a personal ‘friend’ thing at the time, rather than ideological support. I certainly don’t see him ‘getting into bed’ with National any time in the near future!

            • Colonial Viper 4.2.1.1.1.1

              That will be his focus, and thanks for the link to the Max Keiser interview which I have just watched.

              I think everyone should have a “work bed” like Kim Dotcom did the interview from…

    • weka 4.3

      I don’t see KDC as being on the political left. He wants freedom but I don’t see any ethics around fairness or looking after everyone. The man donated money to John Banks, just saying.

      He could split votes in some electorates. He’s likely to pick up votes that would otherwise go to the GP or even Labour (including some of the previous non-vote). Might do the same to ACT of course and National. But if he becomes kingmaker, is there not the possibility that he would go with National if he got what he wanted re IT, privacy and security?

      Micky,

      “I am afraid that he may maroon some protest votes in a party that will not make the threshold and perversely may help National.”

      I can never remember how that works. Don’t the votes of under the threshold parties get redistributed somehow?

      • Bearded Git 4.3.1

        No the votes under the 5% threshold are totally wasted votes unless the party gets an electorate MP.

        • Craig Y 4.3.1.1

          Or unless you vote for the Aotearoa Legalise Cannabis Party, thereby sabotaging the electoral status of the Greens and you’re a single-issue purist pothead. Oops-wrong form of ‘absolutely wasted.’

          • phillip ure 4.3.1.1.1

            alcp give every appearance of being an election scam..

            ..they stick their hand out for some of that lovely election-money..

            ..they splash that around..

            ..canniblise a few green votes..

            ..and then they disappear for another three years..

            ..you never hear a peep from them between elections..

            ..as useless as a wet box of matches during a lighter-crisis..

            ..as far as fighting to end prohibition..

            ..that lot..

            ..should be called the aotearoa loot cash party..

            ..phillip ure..

      • fisiani 4.3.2

        Yes the votes do get redistibuted to the parties who do meet the threshold. A Mega party getting 4% of the vote would give National approximately 47% of 4% ie 1.9% taking them effectively to 48.9%

    • Murray Olsen 4.4

      I have never seen anything from Bryce Edwards that I felt should be taken seriously. He really gives the impression he has no idea what he’s talking about and is not much more than a stamp collector.

      • Paul 4.4.1

        Edwards is a careerist who says what he needs to to rise the greasy pole.
        His Herald review is exactly that …stamp collecting.
        Phil Ure’s reviews are way better!

  5. Sabine Ford 5

    it is in the conservative mindset that the man is head of the house and that wife and children should be submissive. It is the fathers right to control both, wife and children, and sometimes smacking is obviously the only way to enforce obedience….this is not new.
    Why would anyone think that the NZ conservative mindset is in anyway different. Next on the agenda, abortion, birth control etc. See the Tea Party in the States.

    As for being a german entrepreneur….worse things could happen, and as for regulations, business, really any business does not like regulations. What do you think the TPP is all about. Surely not about creating jobs that pay more then the minimum wage.

    However, I would like to know what Labour is going to roll out for the election? How will labour tackle unemployment, under employment, low wages that need to be subsidized by welfare, affordable and healthy housing (rental and ownership), crumbling infrastructure?

    If we want peeps to vote for Labour, Labour will need to at least address the issues that most peeps affect, not just point finger.

    I will vote for the greens, and only if I fear that national will kick in again, will I hold my nose and vote Labour. And this is quite sad.

    • QoT 5.1

      I don’t know how openly the Conservatives would attack abortion/birth control, just because right now we have a very restrictive abortion regime – one which a hell of a lot of people disagree with but don’t want to rock the boat over. In my experience, when you inform people about the current situation in NZ, they’re firstly shocked that abortion isn’t actually legal, and secondly agree that it should be liberalised, if only a little.

      On the other hand, I wouldn’t have thought raising the disciplining-your-kids-through-physical-violence issue would be a winner, either. It’s not like there are any good stories to point to and say “look, this Good Hardworking Father was sent to prison For Ten Years for one light smack!” to rally the pro-smackers around.

      • Brett Dale 5.1.1

        QOT:

        The conservative party will be the nail in the coffin for Gay Rights, if they get in and get a few seats and become a coalition party who’s in power, it will be a huge disaster for this country.

        The last thing we want for this country, is a religious right.

        • SHG (not Colonial Viper) 5.1.1.1

          Welcome to Australia 2014.

          http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-01-11/curriculum-critic-wants-more-religion-to-be-taught-in-schools/5195410

          There should be more religious education in Australian schools, says one of the men tasked with reviewing the national curriculum.

          Former teacher and ex-Liberal Party staffer Kevin Donnelly says Australian education has become too secular, and the federation’s Judeo-Christian heritage should be better reflected in the curriculum.

        • millsy 5.1.1.2

          It wont be just Gay Rights, Brett. It will be the rights and freedoms of those who wish to pursue arragements outside what is regarded as the “traditional nuclear family”.

        • QoT 5.1.1.3

          The conservative party will be the nail in the coffin for Gay Rights

          I don’t think you understand how the phrase “final nail in the coffin” works, Brett. For a start, the thing in the coffin has to be something which is practically dead. Rights for same-sex couples are clearly not practically dead. In fact, after the utter victory of marriage equality last year, they’re not even being questioned.

          Also, I don’t think your reply actually has anything to do with my comment, so maybe some work on following-a-conversation-properly would be in order.

          • BM 5.1.1.3.1

            I agree.

            The hysteria shown by the two gay chaps above seem rather disproportionately out of whack to reality.

            It’s 2014 lads, not 1814, no one cares what gays people get up to, I’d bet money Colin Craig doesn’t particularly care either.

            Slightly more important stuff to deal with than what two or more people of the same sex get up to in the privacy of their own homes.

            • QoT 5.1.1.3.1.1

              No, I don’t think you’re agreeing with me at all there, BM. I certainly don’t agree with you.

              But it does seem that you are quite invested in what other people are getting up to in the privacy of their own homes.

              • BM

                You think straight people care what gay people get up to?.

                Hate to burst your bubble, but apart from a few extremist nut bars, no one gives a shit.

                Gays are just like everyone else.

            • Brett Dale 5.1.1.3.1.2

              BM

              Actually people like Colin Craig do care,and a ton of right wingers do care, the hatred they have for gay people are sickening. If Craig really didnt care, why would he bring it up?

              The last thing we want is people like him in Parliament.

          • Craig Y 5.1.1.3.2

            Not if I get my hands on a metaphorical nail gun first and nail him down when it comes to his unpalatable religious social conservative views first 🙂

          • Brett Dale 5.1.1.3.3

            Yo commented on the conservative party, and believe me that would be their main goal. Go after gay marriage, gay adoption, the rest will be on the back burner, things like “Ya can hit ya kids” are just a red herring. This guy is extremely homophobic, and I would say dangerous.

            Oh, I also didnt know a conversation had rules?

      • Colonial Viper 5.1.2

        I don’t know how openly the Conservatives would attack abortion/birth control, just because right now we have a very restrictive abortion regime

        14,745 abortions carried out in 2012. One of the lowest counts for many years according to Stats NZ website.

    • Draco T Bastard 5.2

      I will vote for the greens, and only if I fear that national will kick in again, will I hold my nose and vote Labour.

      I think you’ll find that the Greens are now a permanent member of parliament and so that reasoning doesn’t apply.

      • mac1 5.2.1

        Your comment “you’ll find that the Greens are now a permanent member of parliament’ is presumably over the next one or two elections, Draco T? The historian in me balked at it.

        en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_political_parties_in_New_Zealand

        There have been twenty parties represented in the NZ Parliament which no longer exist. Christian Democrats 1995-98, Christian Heritage 1999, Country 1928-38, Democratic Labour 1940-43, Future NZ 1994-5, Independent Political Labour League 1908-10, Labour (the original) 1910-12, Liberal 1991-27, Liberal 1992, Mana Wahine 98-99, Mauri Pacific 1999, New Labour 1989-91, Pacific 2008, Progressive 2001-11, Reform 1909-36, Social Credit 1966-69 and 1979-87, Social Democratic 1913-16, Socialist ?-1913, United NZ 1995-2000, United Labour 1912-13, United 1927-36.

        What chance that United Future, Maori, Mana, and ACT join this list very soon? (There have been, by the way, 50 parties which never had MPs.)

        Currently there are 8 parties in parliament and another five unrepresented registered parties.

        We have MPs now in office with National 1935-2014, Labour 1916-2014, Green 1996-2014, NZ First 1993-2014, Maori 2004-2014, ACT 1996-2014, Mana 2011-2014 United Future 2002-2014.

        Interesting to look at all this from a historical perspective as to permanence……………. only two have celebrated 21 years in office.

        • Draco T Bastard 5.2.1.1

          The Greens are still gaining in strength and I don’t think that they’ll drop below the threshold again. Of course, it may happen in some distant future but I don’t believe it will happen in the foreseeable future.

          BTW, you should probably trace some of those parties that no longer exist through their name changes and mergers. Once you’ve done that I think you’ll find that a few of them still do exist.

          • mac1 5.2.1.1.1

            I agree, of course, with your first paragraph. I do hope the Greens survive and thrive.

            Your second statement would depend on the meaning of ‘existence’, which philosophically is a rather large topic! I did trace their ancestry btw. However, even the Greens are not the old Values party. I remember their 1972 manifest plank of a basic living wage for all, which is now being discussed again on the Standard as worthy of revisiting.

          • dave 5.2.1.1.2

            i think the greens have a hardcore 9-10 percent cunliffe factor is affecting there vote labour had weak leadership for a long time now they have a leader with super left appeal just look at the membership numbers they have rocketed they will have more volenteers this year than all the other parties combined which is proble a good thing to get the vote out. greens need work hard to keep there vote as will mana because i think labour are going to be vacuming up the votes this year again the cunliffe factor at work and that huge activist base.
            it will be intresting if cunliffe make a move and invites the norman to the labour party congress this year i can see norman getting economic delevlopment.

    • Craig Y 5.3

      Absolutely right about Colin Craig’s threat to women’s reproductive freedom, Sabine. Have you read Gordon Campbell’s interview with him in Werewolf’s December 2013 edition? If so, you should. He’s talking about attacking teenagers access to abortion if people are foolish enough to vote for him…

      http://www.werewolf.co.nz

  6. dotcom could well be ‘the’ story of this campaign..

    ..tho’ i agree going on events to date his personal politics are unknown/murky..

    ..should he breach 5%..i really can’t see him going into govt with his current mortal enemy..key..

    ..eh..?

    ..and just his announcement should put cunnliffe/labour/greens/mana on notice that they had better come up with some seachange-policies in a range of areas..

    ..’cos dotcom will..

    ..and i would bet they will be policies drenched in populist-appeal..

    ..and as just one policy that will garner a lot of that 800,000 labour purports to court..(but from a distance)..

    ..i am picking he will brush aside the other parties scared/tentative-policies..and call for full legalisation/regulation/taxation of cannabis..(argued on economic/citing colorado grounds..)

    ..he will come up with an innovative idea/plan to clean up our waterways..

    ..these are just two examples of policies that will strike a nerve with many people..(esp those 800,00 currently totally cynical/disillusioned about politics ever having a role in making their lives better..

    ..in fact..nine years of neo-lib/uncaring labour ..just confirmed that cynicisim..(hey..!..it did in me..!..)

    ..dotacom will be casting his net wide..

    ..and will ignore the current party ideological-parameters..

    ..and tho’ like all the political-pundits..i am just stabbing in the dark..(but admitting it..unlike say..mccarten in the access-media today..with his stern election-predictions..where dotcom doesn’t rate a mention..despite his party already heralded..w.t.f. was with that..?..)

    ..i think dotcom is smart enough to know that yes..he can harvest votes from all the current parties..(.if he can seize the public-imagination..)

    ..but that his biggest pool is those 800 thousand disaffected..

    ..and as a new/fresh face/party…with the right policies..(and ..no..i don’t see some far-right/libertarian dreamscape as what dotcom will be pushing..)

    ..dotcom has the best chance of getting them off the couch..and voting for him..

    ..and him being a kingmaker after the next election..

    ..fascinating..

    ..and clearly..all the pundits’ previous prognostications are ‘off’

    ..eh..?..

    ..it’s all on..

    ,.and as a political-junkie/one writing/banging-on about this stuff..

    ..i ain’t displeased about that..

    phillip ure..

    • BM 6.1

      He’ll get extradited in April, thus killing the mega party.

    • veutoviper 6.2

      While I agree with a lot of your comments, I doubt that KDC will touch the cannabis issue, PU. He apparently does not touch alcohol or drugs. Big milk drinker!

      • phillip ure 6.2.1

        veuto..even non-users can see the madness/huge-costs that is prohibition..

        ..i am not insinuating he is pothead..i couldn’t care less..one way or the other..

        ..this is an argument that can be made purely on sane/rational economic-grounds..

        ..(and/but he really does need to get off that cancer-causing milk..whoar..!..

        ..go vegan..!..dotcom..!..

        ..use almond-milk as yr methadone..until the withdrawals pass..)

        phillip ure..

        • veutoviper 6.2.1.1

          LOL. I have a high intolerance to diary fat, but cannot stand rice or soy milk. Haven’t tried almond milk, but like coconut milk. Is almond milk readily available, and is it very expensive?

          • phillip ure 6.2.1.1.1

            yes to both on almond milk..v. nice..!

            ..you can also make yr own..even better/cheaper..

            (..asking the all-seeing eye should see you right for how-to’s..

            ..first step:..catch yr almonds..)

            ..and isn’t rice-milk particularly vile..?

            ..like badly-flavoured water..(shudder..!..)

            phillip ure..

            • greywarbler 6.2.1.1.1.1

              phillip u
              Rice milk,must be near to what they made starch from. Feed it to the troops so they stiffen up, stand straight etc. Good stuff for Labour, get all sticking together, no wilting in the tournament.

          • Draco T Bastard 6.2.1.1.2

            I have a high intolerance to diary fat, but cannot stand rice or soy milk.

            And I’m the exact opposite. Always hated cow milk. Can’t even stand it in my coffee these days.

            • veutoviper 6.2.1.1.2.1

              I never particularly liked full cream cow’s milk, either, so its no great loss to have to avoid it. I also have very bad memories of school milk left to go sour in the sun!

          • Colonial Viper 6.2.1.1.3

            I find it really difficult to understand how most of those things can be described as “milk” tbh.

            • weka 6.2.1.1.3.1

              They can’t. Technically milk comes from mammals. They’re promoted as milk substitutes but they’re not really. Ones you buy are highly processed foods that only represent milk in terms of how they look superficially. They don’t taste like milk, they have a different consistency, and their nutritional content is completely different. I don’t like milk myself, so I just don’t drink it (although I find raw milk is yummy and agrees with me better).

              Commercial milk susbstitutes are usually very sweet, far sweeter than milk. I’m guessing this is intentional (to make them taste better). They strike me as about as healthy as commercial fruit juice (that is, not very when eaten daily).

              And don’t get me started on the health problems associated with soy 😉

              Or the environmental issues of milk substitutes.

              • Colonial Viper

                Thanks for that. I think your comments confirm exactly my feelings about these highly processed materials blended in with water and then being sold as food.

              • Draco T Bastard

                Commercial milk susbstitutes are usually very sweet, far sweeter than milk.

                That depends upon which one you get.

                They strike me as about as healthy as commercial fruit juice (that is, not very when eaten daily).

                That depends as well. Fruit juice that has no added sugar is no better nor worse for you than the fruit itself. Yes, it still has a lot of sugar in it but, then, so does fruit.

                • weka

                  A whole apple has nutrients in it that a glass of its juice doesn’t.

                  An apple picked off the tree outside, is a different food than a glass of juice from apples processed commercially.

                  One issue with commercial fruit juices is that they provide an easily accessible form of concentrated sugars. For people that already have too many refined carbohydrates in their diet, that’s not the best. Better than coke, not better than whole fruit. It’s all relative.

                  • veutoviper

                    I agree that most commercial fruit juices have additives including extra sugar, although there are a few that don’t. As you say, whole fruit are much better as they also have the benefits of the fibre, which fruit juice doen’t.

                  • Lanthanide

                    Orange juice has more sugar in it than coke.

              • karol

                I don’t like milk. I us a small amount of almond milk (unsweetened) when I need a liquid alterative for milk to mix into other ingredients. I have never drunk milk or put milk in my coffee or tea, so I don’t require a substitute for it for drinking.

                PS: I’m OK with yoghurt & consume more plain unsweetened yogurt than almond milk.

                And I agree on problems with soya – can do nasty things to my guts/indigestion.

        • phillip ure 6.2.1.2

          dotcom should hire me as a consultant..

          ..if he followed what i would advise..

          ..i would have him off his meds in three months..

          ..and feeling like a million dollars..

          ..phillip ure..

    • as an update/aside…dotcom arguing against his own personal interests..

      ..and for a higher tax rate on the richest..(‘to pay for what need to be done/fixed’..)

      ..would be a brilliant/credibility-enhancing tactical move on his part..

      ..and could well garner him 5% in its’ own right..

      ..eh..?

      ..but as with all other parties..and for the first time in living memory..

      ..it will be policies that will drive voters’ decisions..(esp. on left/soft-centre..)

      ..and all parties had better be aware of that..

      ..they will ignore that ‘new’ fact/reality..to their peril..

      phillip ure..

    • Bearded Git 6.4

      Yeah PU, McCarten is usually a good read in the HOS, but today he was rubbish.

    • Stuart Munro 6.5

      I think Kim Dotcom’s instincts are web libertarian – but he never courted the banksters. He expected he might have to do so settling in NZ, but John Banks let him down badly.

      The thing is neither ACT nor the Gnats were ever remotely progressive, but Dotcom is. He is on good terms with Green leadership, they tweet mutual support.

      A smart progressive party would seize him to consult on tech policy, but even as an independent he would represent the virtues that people criticise Colin Craig for lacking. His is smart, creative, innovative and well-informed. He also likes people, was throwing parties long before he got backstabbed.

      Making him an enemy was one of the biggest mistakes Key ever made, and because of it Kim Dotcom is ready to lead on freedom and privacy issues that people without skin in the game might have allowed to slide. He’s a better man than Key, and in any conflict that disparity gives him an enormous advantage.

      I welcome his presence in New Zealand politics. He narrows the country’s greatest political deficit: talent.

      • Anne 6.5.1

        Couldn’t agree more Stuart Munro.

        Glad to hear he’s on good terms with the Greens and, as far as I know, he’s on good terms with Cunliffe too.

        Making him an enemy was one of the biggest mistakes Key ever made..

        Oh the irony! Couldn’t wait to get into bed with the FBI and the Hollywood moguls “cos I want to be identified with them” and he turns someone who is rapidly becoming one of our most influential personalities. Love it.

      • Tracey 6.5.2

        isnt there the potential problem that he may have broken laws, flagrantly? Or has he successfully nullified that by his campaign to paint himself as the victim?

        I am not sure what the reality is, whether he is criminal or internet freedom fighter, just throwing it out there.

  7. Shorts 7

    Wot… No mention of the Civilian Party?

  8. ianmac 8

    Kim cannot stand as an MP because he is not a NZ Citizen. But as a political leader he could certainly wobble the status quo.

  9. Tanz 9

    The Conservative Party are doing very well in the polls.
    Will Labour work with them if they had to?
    I wouldn’t have thought so.
    Act are indeed, toast.
    I never thought Kimdotcom was a conservative.

    • Colonial Viper 9.1

      Good. I hope the Conservative Party pushes for a Govt inquiry into whether or not the Moon landings actually happened. Colin Craig is right, there are questions which need to be answered.

      • Tamz 9.1.1

        Are you being serious, CV? So what about the moon landings, Craig is entitled to his opinion and there are many that would agree with him. Free speech, remember.

        • Colonial Viper 9.1.1.1

          I hadn’t understood that Colin Craig was going for the conspiracy theory vote until you explained it, but I guess it makes sense the way you put it.

        • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1.2

          People are entitled to their own opinions, they get to use the same facts as everybody else.

        • Brett Dale 9.1.1.3

          Tamz

          yes he is intitled to his opinion.

          But we are talking something that is FACT and not up for debate.

          I dont want someone like that in parliament.

          • Paul 9.1.1.3.1

            Brett, I agree.
            That’s why Rodney Hide should not return as he questions AGW.
            Climate Change, another Scientific fact denied by people unfit for government.

            • Colonial Viper 9.1.1.3.1.1

              If it’s a democracy, voters get to decide who they want in or out as their representatives.

              • Draco T Bastard

                That’s not true. We don’t allow criminals to be elected and I’m really starting to think that we shouldn’t allow people who deny reality to be elected either.

                • One Anonymous Knucklehead

                  Far better to tighten up Parliamentary procedure regarding evidence (for legislation) and judicial review where it is lacking.

                • Tracey

                  do reality deniers include the religious? I think it should. By all means believe in an unproven invisible friend but dont stand for parliament if you do because yuo don’t have a firm enough grasp on reeality.

                  • felix

                    Seems a bit harsh.

                    Plenty of highly intelligent, capable, talented people have faith in unproven invisible friends. It doesn’t necessarily preclude one from making rational decisions.

                    • tracey

                      why the exception? If someone doesn’t believe in climate change, then they can otherwise make rational decisions?

                      the difference between people who deny climate change and those who believe in an invisible friend, is the former don’t ask for special respect for their views, special grants and charitable rebates, want their own schools and so on.

                      what is the difference between someone who believes in someone that is not there and a schizophrenic?

                    • felix

                      I didn’t suggest you give their views any special credence. Quite the opposite.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Are we about to stop those deemed mentally unsuitable or mentally ill from voting too. This is going to be a very fun democracy in a very short space of time.

                    • felix

                      Yeah, if there’s one thing this society needs it’s less awareness of the spiritual side of life and more orientation toward the materialistic.

        • phillip ure 9.1.1.4

          @ tamz..no no..that’s not ‘free-speech’..

          ..that’s moonbat-ery…

          ..and all those that agree with him..?

          ..also moonbats..one and all..

          ..are you wth craig on this one..?

          ..still ‘debatable’..is it..?..

          ..that moon-landing thing..?

          phillip ure..

      • Lanthanide 9.1.2

        Colin said he didn’t know one way or the other whether man landed on the moon.

        That’s not the same as actively disbelieving it, or wanting to investigate whether it happened.

        Basically it’s his way of saying “that doesn’t have any impact on my life, so I don’t care about it”. This is actually a very terrifying viewpoint to have, but it does explain his parties policies and stances on scientific issues in general.

        • Tracey 9.1.2.1

          Are you sure? Couldn’t it also mean I don’t believe they landed on the moon but I know that is not voter palatable so I will twist it about a bit… His version of key’s “I don’t recall:?

          I mean he could have siad “I don’t care I want to talk about X”.

          • felix 9.1.2.1.1

            It could also mean “I am in no position to alienate the few extra voters I might pick up by dropping a few hints about moon landings, 911, and flouride. But I’m not quite stupid enough to side with them out loud.”

    • McFlock 9.2

      lol
      the conservatives are doing slightly better than act in the polls.
      This is not “very well”.

    • millsy 9.3

      Tanz, I should be able to fuck who I goddam well please without you or CC waving a bible at me telling me I am a sinner then petitioning the government to throw me in jail.

  10. George D 10

    The KDCP, even if it goes nowhere, will likely put the TPPA further up the agenda.

    There’s a small section of the electorate amenable to protest voting. Giving them a non NZF and non joke-party/ALCP alternative should increase overall turnout. A good thing.

  11. George D 11

    #An almost duplicate comment, see above ^.

  12. Chooky 12

    the middle pin up party is definitely the most sexy….i vote Labour or Greens try to co-opt Mr Dot Com and the Mega Party…and do a deal …..eg. you dont stand where we are marginal and if you advocate for us we will put you high on the list as technology spokeperson

  13. kerry 13

    I can only see Dot Com taking away valuable votes from Labour or the greens, those votes then wasted as it is highly unlikely he would get over 5%

    • Chooky 13.1

      agreed…that is why Labour or the Greens should absorb him somehow…(maybe he could stand in just one seat…John Key’s for maximum publicity )….and urge all voters to give their party vote to the Greens or Labour

      • Colonial Viper 13.1.1

        not an nz citizen, so cannot stand.

        • Chooky 13.1.1.1

          oh….well is there any other cunning plan to subsume him?….to Mega’s satisfaction and the mutual benefit of the Left

          • Colonial Viper 13.1.1.1.1

            Tough one that, seeing that he is a man used to being in charge, not taking orders and towing the given line…

            • weka 13.1.1.1.1.1

              Not to mention that his politics might not fit with the left.

              • Chooky

                …this is all true….maybe peaceful talks can begin.

                …because Dot Com is going to have a lot of appeal to the young computer nerds who value their freedom on the net and the disaffected who want to give National and the establishment a kick…Dot Com has anarchist pulling power, brains obviously …and a lot of money, so he is a match for Key

            • Tracey 13.1.1.1.1.2

              he doesnt want to be a bureaucrat.

    • @ kerry..

      “.. highly unlikely he would get over 5%..”

      ..with the right populist-policies..

      ..i think it highly likely his party will get 5%…

      phillip ure..

  14. tricledrown 14

    No intake of animal fats can lead to forms of arthritis.
    I’ m a vegetarian.
    Be very careful .
    Milk allergies can be overcome by starting with a small intake and building up.
    Or organic fed cows.
    Goats or sheeps milk.
    Being vegan or non dairy vegetarian is a path that needs a lot of work so you don’t mis out on vital foods.
    Just taking a vitamin pill is not going to fix it as only a max of 15% of the pills nutrients are going to be ansorbef verse 85% from food.

    • @ tricledown..

      “..No intake of animal fats can lead to forms of arthritis..”

      absolute rubbish..

      ..i know people who haven’t eaten animal fats for decades..

      ..they are in fine health..and don’t have arthritis..

      ..and..i don’t take any vitamin pills…and am vegan/plant-based..

      ..have normal blood-pressure etc..

      ..i dunno where you get this stuff..

      ..phillip ure..

  15. tricledrown 15

    Kerry what brings you that opinion.

    • kerry 15.1

      Anyone who is a right leaning voter cant stand the guy, anyone who is a national voter would rather die than give him there vote .So it appears only the left leaning voter would ever vote for him, which in itself is a conundrum because Dot Com has right leaning values, I personally cant see his future party claiming any more votes than 1 – 1.5% .

      • Colonial Viper 15.1.1

        Damn you’ve surveyed hundreds of thousands of National voters really efficiently.

      • phillip ure 15.1.2

        @ kerry..

        ..i think you deserve a special orifice-pluck-award for that one..

        ..assumption piled upon assumption..eh..?

        ..it doesn’t pass for critical-thought..eh..?

        ..phillip ure..

      • Tracey 15.1.3

        Except with his money he can front foot the anti TPP campaign and you will clearly be surprised how many of national’s voters wont like the TPP when it is presented to them by someone with money and the ability to get a message on tv, radio, print, etc… At the moment the govt is getting a free tpp ride hiding behind the superfluous confidentiality clause. can you publish your poll results? The herald would love them I am sure.

  16. Adrian 16

    We’ve been sucking on the tit since the first domestication of animals which must be since the dawn of humankind. If it was bad for us we wouldn’t be here.
    Interesting research came to light last year ( Victoria Uni I think ) about the significant lift in bowel cancers on the cohort that have missed out on school milk, apparently if you were one of the lucky ones to hold down the ” left -in-the-sun-till it-was-undrinkable”,you have real protection from the curse.

    • Colonial Viper 16.1

      The right kinds of bacteria might help the health of the gut…

      • veutoviper 16.1.1

        Exactly, CV. My dairy fat intolerance causes IBS; and school milk did not protect me from very early stage bowel cancer (hopefully now clear). But like a lot of people with dairy intolerance, yogurt is OK; particularly the Keffir yogurt now available (and sold as the tummy yogurt.). But we are well off track from the subject of this post – my apologies. Used to enjoy Weekend posts for these type of subjects – and gardening, birds etc. Back to mowing down more of the paddock before feeding the ‘zoo’ here has to be done.

        • Chooky 16.1.1.1

          @ veutoviper ….gluten/wheat intolerance can cause symptoms of IBS ..and also bowel cancer…it is easy these days to get a blood test for this

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coeliac_disease

        • phillip ure 16.1.1.2

          @ veuto..

          “..and school milk did not protect me from very early stage bowel cancer..”

          um…!..veuto ..sorry to hear about yr cancer..and hope you stay free/clear..

          ..but i’m afraid the bad news is that the ‘dairy-causes-cancer’-news that came out just after xmas..

          ..(with the subtext that the message echoes particularly loud here in nz..

          ..with our world-beating rates in some cancers..

          ..and our world-beating consumption of dairy..)..

          ..and the bad news is that one of cancers that we have world-beating rates in..

          ..and has been linked to dairy consumption..

          ..is bowel cancer..

          ..so dairy most certainly does not ‘protect’ you from bowel cancer..

          ..it is just the opposite..

          phillip ure..

          • Chooky 16.1.1.2.1

            @ phillip ure

            Yes but NZ soils are also very deficient in natural Selenium ( in countries we here Selenium is high there are very low rates of cancer)….also we have high rates of undiagnosed gluten intolerance which lead to all sorts of metabolic disorders…and this can often lead to milk allergies

            The jury is out on whether dairy products lead to cancer or are protective against cancer

            • phillip ure 16.1.1.2.1.1

              no chooky..the jury is no longer ‘out’..

              ..it has been ‘out’..up until the release of this meta-study..focusing on cancer/diet links..

              ..just after xmas..

              ..and i hafta say..the similarities (ie. wholesale denial) in reaction to this new news/meta-study..

              ..so so echo the reactions to the first warnings of tobacco being proven to cause lung cancer..

              ..as everyone went ‘bullshit!’..

              (as they peered thru the clouds of smoke enveloping them..

              ..and sparked up yet another ciggy..)

              ..we are in the same depths of ignorance now about dairy..

              ..as we were about tobacco then..

              ..and a potent comparison is that future hindsight will show clearly that we had may as well have been sticking a couple of ciggies in with the cheese-sarnies..in those school lunch-boxes..

              ..as both ciggies and dairy are addictive..both makes you odds on for cancer..

              ..leading to a premature death..

              ..and if you think yr reactions are bad..

              ..you should see how the dairy-dependant-vegetarians i know are handling my heads-up on this..

              ..i had lunch with five of them yesterday..

              ..their reactions range from denial..to at best a grudging acceptance of the logic/science behind the arguments..

              ..and this is news..like those first tobacco warnings..

              ..that is not going to go away..

              ..eh..?

              phillip ure..

              • Chooky

                philip ure

                can you provide links?

                I have no axe to grind on this…because from a very young age( 6 months old…eczema) I was diagnosed as being allergic to cows milk, consequently I have kept off it as far as possible….but as a child I still had massive allergies ( hayfever/asthma/eczema)… later specialists suspected wheat allergies but there was no way of testing….since my daughter has been tested for gluten allergies and found to be almost celiac …the whole family has been off gluten( easy to do with Healtheries non-gluten flour) ….and I now find I can drink milk….and my partner no longer has IBS

                ……just suggest you keep an open mind….everyone’s metabolism and genetics are different….and it is often unknown how some foods interact with other foods and are processed in the body ….one rule does not apply to everyone
                eg . some have argued that schizophrenia and autism are reactions to gluten…just as for some people dairy is associated with heart disease

                I agree with you on the ethical issues …ie .bobby calves….however i think if cows are treated well …(calves not weaned too soon)and are free-range on grass (similar to free-range hens) then it is ok ethically

                …in fact milk from organic grass fed free-range cows is supposed to be good for many people in studies

                • hi chooky..

                  ..here is the main cache..

                  http://whoar.co.nz/?s=dairy

                  and..

                  http://whoar.co.nz/?s=cancer

                  the new/specific meta-study i cite is 4th down in the cancer-link..

                  ..hope that helps..

                  ..phillip ure..

                  • Chooky

                    @ phillip ure …..well i dont think your evidence is very strong for dairy causing cancer ….and there is an awful lot of evidence for the health benefits of dairy products, especially from organic grass fed cows…( while admittedly there is also a lot of evidence of dairy allergies in some people causing other adverse health effects eg heart )

                    .. I think your strongest case against dairy is the ethics….bobby calves and non organic fed and reared barn cows ( the latter of which we dont have in NZ yet and which will probably downgrade NZ’s dairy industry quality /reputation if we do)

                    PS. i wonder if Mr Mega Dot Com has a lot of dairy?….but then again he may be a vegetarian and eat a lot of carbo and sugar…my gamer son has put on an awful lot of weight since he became vegetarian

                    • @ chooky..a bad/dairy-sodden vegetarian-diet is not good for you..

                      ..as often dairy-intakes jumps..to compensate for no flesh..

                      ..yr son should go vegan..

                      ..here is all the info he needs..

                      http://whoar.co.nz/?s=vegan

                      phillip ure

                    • Chooky

                      agree philip ure….on eating too much dairy on a vege diet

                      …however unless one is a Indian chef and takes the time to slow cook fabulous Indian vegetarian food platters ,the temptation to fill up on dairy for a lazy gamer vegetarian is irresistable …particularly if they are sick of canned beans and dont like veges

                    • chooky..

                      ..here are gourmet-japanese/indian/thai vegan-recipies..and more..

                      http://whoar.co.nz/?s=vegan+recipies

                      heh..!..i just scrolled thru the list..

                      ..and seriously..i have collected/collated more vegan recipies than you can poke a stick at..

                      ..so..chooky..back to yr son..

                      ..have a look for easy-to-do-vegan stuff..(of which there is plenty..)

                      ..and point him at that..

                      ..and buy him a couple of hand-dumbells..

                      ..better food and 2-3 5 min bursts of energy/exercise/curls? a day..

                      ..will see him u-turning..

                      ..good luck with that..

                      ..and yep..!..there are three legs to the vegan-stool..

                      ..help yrslf..

                      ..help the animals..

                      ..help the planet..

                      ..which one is leant on most is not that important..

                      ..to begin with..

                      phillip ure

                    • Chooky

                      philip ure …….agree with you entirely …..however teenagers are not rational people……..and gamers are particularly lazy when it comes to preparing food…he has been a vegan for several months and he ate a lot of beans and carbo and got fat and sick of beans and carbo…so he became a vegetarian and ate dairy…no exercise and no veges to speak of …..last year he was a meat eater and fit and trim as an iron man…..so teenagers!!!

  17. joe90 17

    The mutation that made dairy vital to the survival of my northern ancestors.

    http://www.nature.com/news/archaeology-the-milk-revolution-1.13471

  18. One Anonymous Knucklehead 18

    Mr.com has to get the 500 paid-up members before he can do anything.

    No small hurdle.

    • Draco T Bastard 18.1

      Not small but not particularly large either. The first problem comes in setting up the administration to handle the party (I think most people fail at that as they just NFI as to what’s needed). The second is having the resources needed to get the word of the new party out.

      I don’t think DotCom will problems with either of those.

    • burt 18.2

      Dotcom makes a lot of sense about politicians serving themselves. I’ve been saying that for years.

      I’d say Dotcom with 333,000+ twitter followers will have zero issues getting 500 financial members.

      • One Anonymous Knucklehead 18.2.1

        Assuming Twitter following translates into “I agree with you politically and want to join your party”, I’m sure you’re absolutely right.

      • Tracey 18.2.2

        which is why you cant possibly vote National, Act, Labour…

    • Tracey 18.3

      he could pay the subs for 500 people?

  19. millsy 19

    Depending on the manifesto that DC’s Labour puts up, the chances of New Zealand First getting in, and what KDC’s party is going to promise, I might just vote for it. Face it. a Dotcom party wouldnt do any worse than the parties we have now.

  20. BM 20

    I’d prefer people voted Green, than vote for the German criminal.

    Sooner the prick’s out of the country the better.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 20.1

      I had the opportunity to ask a QC recently for their views on the case. I think you may need to get ready for a bit of a disappointment.

      • BM 20.1.1

        Really?, I hope not.

        I can’t stand the prick, he’s laughing at New Zealand, he thinks we’re all gullible hayseeds that are just here for his amusement.

        He can go get fucked.

        • Murray Olsen 20.1.1.1

          Really? I hope so.

          I can’t stand the prick, he’s laughing at New Zealand, he thinks we’re all gullible hayseeds that are just here for his enrichment.

          He can go back to Hawaii.

          There, fixed it for you, but I thought you liked Key?

          • BM 20.1.1.1.1

            I do like Key and do like the way he’s taking NZ

            He’s doing what he thinks is best for NZ, bit a Clark, Bolger, Lange and the rest of the Kiwi Pms that went before him.

            Unlike the fat German fuck who’s only in it for himself, shame there’s so many dumb uneducated fucks out there in kiwiland that think he’s some sort of messiah that’s going to give them all this free stuff, bunch of dumb arses.

        • Tracey 20.1.1.2

          “I can’t stand the prick, he’s laughing at New Zealand, he thinks we’re all gullible hayseeds that are just here for his amusement.”

          If he follows your posts he would certainly think so.

    • Tracey 20.2

      you must want banks gone too then, asap? Given you believe in guilty til proven innocent. you should begin a letter writing campaign to key to disassociate himself with criminals?

  21. karol 21

    So who would be candidates for Dotcom’s party?

    The linked article says this:

    Rumours around potential candidates include a “well-known broadcast journalist”, according to Edwards. And he believes a number of bloggers and political activists will gravitate towards the new party.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 21.1

      Can anyone say shallow talent pool?

      • Paul 21.1.1

        John Banks?

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 21.1.1.1

          Someone with impeccable anti-surveillance credentials who wants to be a politician but hasn’t already joined another party? The talent pool is getting shallower…

        • Chooky 21.1.1.2

          Paul +1…John Banks is a very good example of shallow pool talent…but he would disagree

      • karol 21.1.2

        The celebrity-culture-in-the-digital-age candidates?

        Not very impressed by this Dotcom move – he’s a man with a big ego and likes to be the centre of attention.

        If he was serious about politics, other than for his own agenda, he’d more likely have supported another party – but I guess their isn’t one with his particular wants/needs – and he maybe feels he’s bigger than someone else’s party.

        • sabine 21.1.2.1

          anyone going into politics has to have a big ego and an overflated sense of self, or else they would not enjoy the rat race.

          Actually, I think there is something that can’t be said of John Key, but is true fro KDC. KDC likes New Zealand and has made the country his home. John Key will bugger off as soon as he is done with his Middle Management Stint as Prime Minister of the little Country NZ.

          And for what its worth, The KDC Party would garner its 5% in its first year. There are just too many disenfranchised voters out there that are neither served by Labour, National or the Greens.
          Also not to be underestimated the appeal KDC has to young, first time voters, left/right leaning libertarians and the disillusioned Labour/Green (insert any other party). As for Prime Minister, how about John Campbell? Head would explode! Lol

          • karol 21.1.2.1.1

            KDC doesn’t just have a big ego – it’s super big. And others still manage to be more interested int he well being of the less well off.

            I don’t underestimate KDC’s appeal to some – we live in a celebrity culture – KDC fits right in.

            KDC has had some pretty unflattering things to say about in NZ at times. Right now, he can’t really go much place else. Wasn’t he living in Hong Kong as well as NZ at one stage?

            KDC’s interest in NZ is quite shallow. His interest is more in the transnational wealthy lifestyle.

            • BM 21.1.2.1.1.1

              This, with bells on.

            • sabine 21.1.2.1.1.2

              and there he joins many others. Fact is this country is being sold to the highest bidder. John Key has opened the gates for this to happen, and I can’t see anyone back tracking on it.

              Question, will Labour do away with the new lending rules? it has been established now that the only ones benefiting from these rules are investors. Where do they come from? overseas?

              is KDC in anyway more big headed then John Key? I can’t say anything about Cunliffe, because really I know nothing of him, and as of now he has not done anything that makes him any better.

              We have to come to grips with the fact that our future politicians will be global, they will live overseas (John Key has done so, Helen Clarke is on her big OE at the moment), To truly have a populist local candidate, I have no one that pops into my mind.

              And as for unflattering things to say about NZ, i thought that was a national sport?

              disclaimer, I am German, NZ resident for over 15 years now and out of reflex vote green. My choice for Prime Minister after Clarke was Fitzsimmonds, but the country was in deep need of a set of balls, no matter how small.

            • Tracey 21.1.2.1.1.3

              Key doesn’t just have a big ego – it’s super big. And others still manage to be more interested in the well being of the less well off.

              I don’t underestimate Ket’s appeal to some – we live in a money chasing culture – Key fits right in.

              Key has had some pretty unflattering things to say about in NZ at times Wellington is ded, prefers to holiday in hawaii). Right now, he can’t really go much place else. Wasn’t he living in New York as well as NZ at one stage?

              Key’s interest in NZ is quite shallow. His interest is more in the transnational wealthy lifestyle.

              FIFY

        • Tracey 21.1.2.2

          “he’s a man with a big ego and likes to be the centre of attention.” So you think he could be prime minister karol? 😉

    • Murray Olsen 21.2

      Paddy Gower? He might be prepared to do a lot for an invite to one of Dotcom’s parties.

      • karol 21.2.1

        Gower? If so, can’t wait to see who the journo will be who keeps thrusting a mic in Gower’s face and asking when he’s going to stage a coup against the leader of his party!

      • Tracey 21.2.2

        dont think he has the money where your mouth balls. Garner? KDC could top up his MP salary so he is not out of pocket

  22. red blooded 22

    Kim Dot Com strikes me as self obsessed and manipulative, not to be trusted. He has only started talking about politics as another way to inveigle himself with the media and general public while he uses his obscene wealth to wage a publicity war on his former friends. These are his natural allies; he’s just annoyed by them, so he’s turning on them.

    As for the whole milk debate; how about a bigger perspective? Milk for human consumption is produced by the slaughter of bobby calves (news item: cows, like people, lactate to feed their young, not to feed other species), has a terrible effect on the environment and is a very inefficient use of land, water and other resources.

    It’s not that hard being vegan and it’s not difficult to have a balanced diet. I cannot imagine going back to eating other animals or eating their milk or eggs. I wonder if the person who commented on this above has actually given veganism a try. If not, one wonders on what basis they are commenting. (Sorry this is out of order – phone comment.)

    • weka 22.1

      “It’s not that hard being vegan”

      Actually for many people it is if they want to be healthy. Any restricted diet takes effort.

      Milk for human consumption is produced by the slaughter of bobby calves (news item: cows, like people, lactate to feed their young, not to feed other species), has a terrible effect on the environment and is a very inefficient use of land, water and other resources.

      You don’t have to slaughter bobby calves to produce milk. Nor do you have to pollute the environment. Those two things and the inefficiency are to do with conventional and industrial dairy farming. Those are all consequences of capitalism, not inherent end points of drinking milk.

      I’d be interested to know how you manage to be vegan without increasing your carbon footprint via food miles, and/or supporting Monsanto. Not saying it can’t be done, just that it isn’t often.

      • phillip ure 22.1.1

        @ weka..

        ..You don’t have to slaughter bobby calves to produce milk..”

        ..but the reality is that this is what happens..

        ..i am unsure what vision of pastoral idyll you are calling upon there..

        ..but for dairy farmers..the bobby calves are money..

        ..they are sent to the slaughterhouse..

        ..to become veal..

        ..and they do not get their mothers’ milk..

        ..once again..that is the farmers’ money..

        ..and as for claim that being a vegan/plant-based person is hard..

        ..um..!..as one..can i just say..it isn’t..

        ..you would be amazed at the world of taste that opens up to/for you once you remove animal flesh as the centre-piece of every meal..

        ..and once you stop smothering everything with gluggy cheese..(ewww..!!..)

        ..and the suffering of/cruelties done to those animals..in your name..

        ..don’t even figure in yr conciousness/considerations..eh..?

        ..and you say you are a ‘green’..?

        ..and you are preaching about ‘supporting monsanto’..?

        ..is that before or after you have wiped the pig-fat from yr lips..?

        ..how about you get that animal-flesh-mote the size of a log out of yr eye..eh..?

        ..”green’..?..don’t make me laugh..!

        phillip ure..

        • weka 22.1.1.1

          ..You don’t have to slaughter bobby calves to produce milk..”

          ..but the reality is that this is what happens..

          ..i am unsure what vision of pastoral idyll you are calling upon there..

          ..but for dairy farmers..the bobby calves are money..

          ..they are sent to the slaughterhouse..

          ..to become veal..

          ..and they do not get their mothers’ milk..

          ..once again..that is the farmers’ money..

          Which is why I don’t support industrial dairying. As I’ve said repeatedly.

          I’ve eaten vegan, which is why I already know that it tastes good and is hard work for most people to do in a nutritionally competent way. I have no trouble believing that you find it easy, but you are not most people.

          The criticisms around ethics and vegan impacts environmentally stand, irrespective of your grossly mis-targeted ad hominems.

          All western diets impact negatively on the planet, I’m just saying that veganism can’t take the high ground you think it can.

          • phillip ure 22.1.1.1.1

            yes weka..everything is relative..

            ..and perfection a difficult state to both attain and sustain/maintain..

            ..but you can hardly defend meat/dairy eating/producing on environmentally-sustainable grounds..

            ..as in meat/dairy better than vegan/plant-based..?

            ..got any facts/figures/links to support that supposition..?

            ..growing meat has been long proven as one of the most inefficient uses of land/water-resources…

            “..The criticisms around ethics and vegan impacts environmentally stand..”

            could you remind me of them..?

            ..(bullet-points will suffice..)

            ..and seriously..!..do you ever see ‘health-experts’ advising:

            ..’eat more meat..!..eat more cheese..!’..

            ..as a road to good-health/chronic-disease-prevention..?

            ..i wonder why the answer to that question is:..’no’..it’s always ‘eat less!’..

            ..now..why do reckon that is..?

            ..and re yr claim that i am somehow ‘different’ ‘ ‘cos i not only enjoy my vegan/plant-based lifestyle..i celebrate it..

            (and be in no doubt..my attitudes are purely from a self-interest p.o.v..in that i feel so much better..than when i was a carnivore..

            ..and feel better than i did during the 15 yrs i spent as a dairy-dependant-vegetarian..

            ..(and yes..when vegetarian..i thought vegans were a bit ‘weird’..heh..!..

            ..had perhaps taken things..just a bit too far..?..)

            ..and i must say..yr last couple of lines have me totally puzzled..

            ..are you advocating ‘living off air..or just shut up!’..

            ..and i should note that i know a community of people who took over a dairy-trashed valley..

            ..and turned it into a form of eden..

            ..a place where they get most of their food off that land..

            ..so yr ‘impact negatively’ is horse-shit really..

            ..you can both live and be kind to the planet..

            ..and once again..’perfection’ is a difficult goal..

            ..but surely having a go at getting as near to that as possible..

            ..as well as being kind to the animals/planet..

            ..is worth the effort..?

            ..d’yareckon..?..

            phillip ure..

    • karol 22.2

      Kim Dot Com strikes me as self obsessed and manipulative, not to be trusted. He has only started talking about politics as another way to inveigle himself with the media and general public while he uses his obscene wealth to wage a publicity war on his former friends. These are his natural allies; he’s just annoyed by them, so he’s turning on them.

      I typed my above comment before reading this – yep, similar to my assessment – self-focused.

      • phillip ure 22.2.1

        are you serious karol..

        ..assumption upon assumption..

        ..all made from a position of total ignorance of the facts of the matter..

        ..but you ‘know’..eh..?

        ..hilarious..!

        phillip ure..

    • Tracey 22.3

      do you think dogs should be fed meat?

      with your concern for the environment I hope you have no soy or corn products of any kind in your pantry or body

      • phillip ure 22.3.1

        @ tracy..i have two dogs that live on a vegan diet..

        ..one is 15 yrs old..and looks/moves/runs about like a 5-6 yr old..

        ..has a wonderful/mellow/happy nature..

        ..and in a lifetime of having dogs around me..she is the best/smartest/best at being on same wavelength..that has been my privilege to care for..

        ..and she often knows what i am going to do before i do it..

        ..it’s kinda spooky sometimes..

        ..and she has a serious internal-clock going on..if we haven’t been for a walk to the park by a certain time..she moves into serious bullying-mode..

        ..and as she is an eye-dog..she is quite good at it..she just locks into yr eyes..

        ..with what i swear is a faint look of impatience on her face..

        .plus..she doesn’t stink of rotting flesh..

        ..her coat is shiny..

        ..you do know that the oldest dog in the world has lived on a vegan diet all its’ life..eh..?

        ..it’s 29..i think..

        ..and if you still disbelieve..i have photo-galleries of vegan-diet dogs at whoar..

        ..phillip ure..

        ..

  23. sabine 23

    Anyone entering Politics need to be manipulative, full of themselves, big ego, big smiles and a cut throat attitude, or else they die the first day in the shark pool.

    Politics is not a polite game.

    • karol 23.1

      That’s a pretty facile defence of a man with a big ego who wants to dabble in the power plays of politics.

      They are not all like Dotcom or John Key. Others have a reasonable ego, but also care about the well being of the people in their country.

      • sabine 23.1.1

        I am a cynic when it comes to Politics. Especially the last 14 years have erased any rose coloured views i might have had of Politicians and their counterparts in business, banks etc.

        So no, i don’t believe that there are many left who actually want to serve the people. Most of them want to serve themselves.

        Maybe i am proven wrong, but i wont hold my breath.

    • Draco T Bastard 23.2

      No, they don’t. They probably need self-assurance and people skills but they don’t actually need to be a psychopath – unless they’re running for a right-wing party such as National.

    • Arfamo 23.3

      I’m thinking, where’s this analysis wrong and then I remember Aaron Whatshisname who met all those criteria and lasted 5 minutes.

      • Tracey 23.3.1

        was dispendable. Banks meets them too, so does Dunne and so on. BUT they weren’t people Key could easily make an example of to garner brownie points.

  24. Jimmie 24

    I have to laugh that KDC who (from a leftie point of view) epitomizes the stereotype of an immoral, capitalistic, rich prick who has amassed his ill gotten millions by ripping off others hard work and who has been convicted during the process of this accumulation is held up by the left as the saviour of their cause for electoral victory.

    Normally most on the left would jump up and down with glee at the prospect of him being dragged off to the US to face the music for his dodgy dealings.
    However because he has become a partial thorn in the side of John Banks/John Key he is is suddenly elevated to the position of Saint Kim by the left hoping fervently that he may be the Achilles heel that will bring them power in 2014.

    It is both funny and sad at the same time in that the only hope of electoral victory for the opposition is an overweight, foreign, helicoptering capitalist, who is likely to face deportation and criminal charges in the near future……..surely the left can come up with something better than this?

    • karol 24.1

      Many of us on the left are not that enamoure with KDC – see my coomments above.

      He has been useful however in showing up some of the dodgy dealings of Key and co – the GCSB etc. But part of that is a battle of egos between KDC & JK.

    • Tracey 24.2

      commenting on his impact on the political scene is not the same as liking or supporting him. I don’t know if he is guilty of what he is charged with. I know very little about him other than what I read and that is not very elucidating on his personal morals or whatever.

      I am amazed at how many on the left are so quick to jump to negative judgments based on so little.

      he could be a fuck, he might not be.

  25. ecossemaid 25

    Oh The Muppet Party (Which I thought was a bad film with Michael Caine as straight Man to Kermit) The Assault Party (Have they all got AK 47’s) The Dot Com Party ( Ok they are now making Parties up) Are some of you people that naval gazing in the extreme that your now concerned about the potential of Parties that don’t exist? Does Your Coffee Latte (No Milk Only Soya) allow you the luxury of worrying about Ghost Parties? Meanwhile….The National Party, you know them? That Massive Elephant In The Room, The One Over There>>> With A Huge smirk on its face and the blood stained axe as they continue to slash, burn destroy our public services strangle our young peoples working chances and destroy welfare. Meanwhile the LBGT / Environmental/(Choose your own one off issue, that you can afford to denote time, resources on) Bickers about Parties that don’t exist,,,,It begs the question that these people haven’t even felt the chill breeze of The Destruction that’s occurring in Real New Zealand as they are just so concerned about satellite reception in Their Ivory Towers!
    Yes it must be difficult to decide what coffee we drink as we sit and pontificate at the local cafe..Telling our friends how very political we are,that we write in a blog on the internet.The sad thing is the only thing it appears that some in here have a grip on is the coffee cup.
    The Nazi Wannabee Party must think all it’s Christmases have come at once with certain elements of the broad left fragmenting any organised form of opposition .By default they have become their Pseudo Allies and they don’t even know it!

  26. Rich 26

    I wonder whether, given Joyce’s actions in directing ACT, National / ACT are approaching the point where ACT should be registered as a component party of National under s127 of the Electoral Act. It may be possible to make a complaint to the Electoral Commission on this?

    • burt 26.1

      Rich

      If ACT keep getting a member elected they will become like Jim Anderton was to Labour. A double dipping leech getting separate party funding while unequivocally supporting National. The irony is the people who defended Anderton will now be on the attack and his previous attackers will be defending [whoever]…

      • McFlock 26.1.1

        No, because anderton’s wasn’t a vote in the house that enabled policies that the majority of new zealanders opposed. Unlike ACT or UF, either of whom could have stopped asset sales

        • burt 26.1.1.1

          Of course, we all wanted stuff banned and everyone wants other people’s money.

          • felix 26.1.1.1.1

            stuff has been banned? About bloody time.

            Seriously though, what was actually banned that you’re still so upset about?

            • McFlock 26.1.1.1.1.1

              He wasn’t allowed to take his thinking-brain dog into the library while he used the public internet connection.

  27. infused 27

    Anyone supporting kim.com is a fucking muppet.

    • Lanthanide 27.1

      Do you disagree with his stance on privacy?

      • infused 27.1.1

        I don’t disagree with much of what he says. but that’s not why he’s doing it.

        With Kim there is one goal. Self preservation.

        He will say anything to get more media attention to keep himself in the spotlight. This is for one reason only.

        It’s so blindingly obvious it hurts. Yet so many fall for it.

        • felix 27.1.1.1

          Yeah it must be annoying watching supposedly intelligent people being taken in by such an obvious charlatan, and enjoying it.

    • Arfamo 27.2

      I didn’t realise they had a muppet for that. Boy they really thought of all sorts of types of muppets didn’t they.

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