Brexit?

20 comments on “Brexit? ”

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1. OnceWasTim 1

   4 September 2019 at 8:50 am

   Have to say, my only interest in Brexit is out of a ghoulish kind of amusement.

   If you watched their 'Commons' (now there's a misnomer), Rees-Moggy having a lay down – so bloody conservative he's still wearing a suit he bought in the 1950s; a mixture of careerists and hangers-on all pretending a concern for democracy and the will of the British people. Most BBC reporters will be pushing for counselling when its all over. No wonder the bloody empire collapsed – although a good many of them seem to think and act like its still running,
2. Anne 2

   4 September 2019 at 9:54 am

   The moment it happened:

   https://www.theguardian.com/politics/video/2019/sep/03/mps-vote-to-seize-control-of-the-commons-and-force-vote-on-brexit-delay-video

   I love that speaker Bercow. His "ordarrs" are legendary.
   • weka 2.1

     4 September 2019 at 10:08 am

     "Not a good start Boris"

     Lol.
     • Bill 2.1.1

       4 September 2019 at 10:19 am

       Good. Someone around. You mind going back end and releasing that post that's sitting under pending?
3. Waiura 3

   4 September 2019 at 10:05 am

   My God ! Are these the same people who used to rule half of the known world ?
   • tc 3.1

     4 September 2019 at 12:55 pm

     Their ancestors used to run half the world after invading it and setting themselves up as it's rulers….contextually irrelevant in todays world.

     This is the inevtiable decline one gets when priviledge and a 'born to rule' attitude seeps in with subsequent generations that lack empathy or the will to broker a workable solution.

     Their forefathers and mothers understood the value of a win-win, boris's mob want it all.
4. JohnP 4

   4 September 2019 at 10:23 am

   Well, looks like Johnson has had a really GOOD first day.
5. SPC 5

   4 September 2019 at 12:07 pm

   Labour's current policy is

   1. delay a no deal Brexit to force an election

   2. lose the election (given FPP and no deal Brexiteers united behind the Tories)

   3. have a Tory majority parliament enact a no deal Brexit and usher in 5 years of right wing government.

   The alternative

   1. delay a no deal Brexit.

   2. exploit BJ losing MP's to remove the government during this parliament

   3. form a new coalition (with a Tory rebel or ex Labour MP as caretaker PM) and determine on a deal with the EU

   4. send the deal to a referendum for ratification (the deal or Brexit with no deal being the two options).

   5. then hold a new election (with Brexit being settled first).

   The question is why play the losing hand? The answer is because Corbyn prefers the public have the stark choice of right vs left, but is not fussed either way about the EU matter.
6. Wayne 6

   4 September 2019 at 12:24 pm

   SPC

   There is a third much more likely alternative. That bill currently before parliament passes, then there is an election.

   The reason being is that I can’t imagine enough Tory rebel MP’s supporting Jeremy to be the PM for what would probably a year or more. It would take all that time to negotiate a new deal and get it through Parliament.

   The reality is that this parliament can’t produce majorities for anything except delay. It can’t actually vote for a deal.

   So I expect an election probably in November.
   • SPC 6.1

     4 September 2019 at 12:48 pm

     I did not suggest that the leader of any party should be the caretaker PM – that would be inappropriate for such an administration.

     And it should not be hard to form a new government and decide on membership of the customs union and single market (LD want remain Labour something less than this – so it is the obvious compromise). It would not take long to them hold a referendum – months at most.

     The real problem is Corbyn (and I prefer him to the Blairites, but he is strategically inept). There is a majority against a no deal Brexit in parliament and in the country and he will fail to use either to determine the issue. Instead he prefers an election – in which only the no deal Brexiteers are united – and thus under FPP they will win.
     • Agora 6.1.1

       4 September 2019 at 1:30 pm

       "The real problem is Corbyn (and I prefer him to the Blairites, but he is strategically inept). There is a majority against a no deal Brexit in parliament and in the country and he will fail to use either to determine the issue. Instead he prefers an election – in which only the no deal Brexiteers are united – and thus under FPP they will win."

       Government is a team effort and Corbyn might yet rise to the occasion. I remain cautiously optimistic.
       • JohnP 6.1.1.1

         4 September 2019 at 1:40 pm

         Love a strategically inept leader who's the only one left standing since 2016 and who has a good chance of enacting the Brexit policy he's had since 2017's Party Conference, which is supported by the 500,000 members of his party.

         There's a majority against No Deal Brexit, for sure, but there isn't for what should be in its place.

         Many Tories still want A Brexit, which includes some of those who had the whip removed today.

         Liberal Democrats have shifted from Second Referendum which includes No Deal vs Remain on the ballot (and risk accidentally doing No Deal by losing the vote) to a Revoke Article 50 stance which will absolutely energise the Brexiteers of all stripes.

         Labour wants a Labour negotiated deal to be placed against Remain in a referendum

         The eight indicative votes that happened earlier this year demonstrated that aptly, see here: https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-47726787

         The 2017 election and the erosion of the Tory majority was the handbrake on Brexit. Parliamentary arithmetic has been part of the deadlock since then and seen the Tories absolutely tear themselves apart in the process. The only way to resolve that problem is an election.

         Strategically inept Corbyn? You love to see it.
   • Dukeofurl 6.2

     4 September 2019 at 5:57 pm

     Im picking an election sooner than November, 6 weeks from now is Late October.

     Proroguing parliament before a bill has passed through all its stages will kill it before the election, especially a non government bill like the current No deal Brexit bill
   • woodart 6.3

     4 September 2019 at 7:40 pm

     so you dont think any tory m.p.s care more about the future of there bitterly divided kingdom , but are only looking the the road directly in front of the car? surely the proper thing is to offer another referendum, and this time its got to be a 2/3 majority for change. having such a huge longterm change needs to have a proper majority for change. this foolheaded idea has already cost two of your fellow tory p.ms to walk. if they keep on down this track scotland will push for another independence referendum, and this time it very likely will happen. adios united kingdom. of course trump is delighted.
     • Pat 6.3.1

       4 September 2019 at 8:56 pm

       Trump dosnt need or desire a break up of the UK…he does however desire a break up of the EU and Brexit is a step along the way
       • woodart 6.3.1.1

         5 September 2019 at 4:25 am

         no, trump is acutley sensitive to public criticism, he spends most nights watching the media, he will keep up with all that is said about him.now, for the first time since he fell into the presidency, theres an even bigger tool, getting even more abuse. three years of public ridicule by a majority of the people stings even the most orange of hide. but you are correct he doesnt want the u.k. to break up, wouldnt do his golf courses any favours. it makes you value stable competent government by adults, not "lets turn this knob ,and see what happens"experts here will correct me Im sure, but didnt the queen(through govgen)give whitlams legally elected gov the flick, and install fraser. what was that for. I would say that whats happened in the u.k. these past few years is far worse. lizzie should say ', me and the whanau are off, with the paperworks keys, and rights to everything, going to canada, turning that into the new hq of the commonwealth. canada managed to adultly work out their own possible split up .
         • Dukeofurl 6.3.1.1.1

           5 September 2019 at 9:07 am

           "but didnt the queen(through govgen)give whitlams legally elected gov the flick, and install fraser. what was that for."

           Queen wasnt involved , Kerr did it on his on initiative under what he considered his prerogative in the written Australian Constitution ( it was related to the Senate not passing his budget)
           • tc 6.3.1.1.1.1

             5 September 2019 at 11:11 am

             egged on by malcom fraser who siezed upon the opportunity for mayhem.
7. Agora 7

   5 September 2019 at 9:53 am

   "you are correct he doesnt want the u.k. to break up, wouldnt do his golf courses any favours. it makes you value stable competent government by adults, not "lets turn this knob ,and see what happens"

   I'm with you on that one, Woodart. You can sometimes find allies in strange and unexpected places.
   • woodart 7.1

     5 September 2019 at 5:17 pm

     Its funny how the world currently is. the germans chinese and japanese are the adults in the room now.

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