The Blue Green oxymoron

Written By: mickysavage - Date published: 9:18 am, January 28th, 2019 - 252 comments
Categories: Deep stuff, Environment, greens, national, Politics, same old national, Simon Bridges, spin, sustainability, you couldn't make this shit up - Tags: erica stanford, vernon tava

There has been a lot of conjecture recently on the possibility of no friends National creating a puppet party like ACT so that it has friends. Except this one would try and create warm obligation free fuzzies about the environment. Although as Idiot Savant puts it in his particularly direct way the party would be a farce:

[I]f they do, then its a clear signal that the party isn’t really green. Because National’s policies of supporting the dairy, oil and trucking industries, sucking the rivers dry, and dragging their feet on climate change in the name of “balance” with economic growth are inherently anti-environment, and any environmentally-minded voter can see that.
Which makes their “BlueGreen” astroturf idea laughable – the only people it convinces are people who don’t understand environmental issues at all. But like Colin Craig, Kim Dotcom and Gareth Morgan, they probably think they can simply throw money at the problem and buy the votes they need, with a fallback of hoping to buy enough votes away from the actual Green Party to drive them out of Parliament – a deeply undemocratic goal. But unlike National, I think environmentally-minded voters are smart enough not to fall for it.

This is nothing new. The Blue Greens have been part of National for a while and have failed because National’s environmental credentials are so poor.

Likely leader Vernon Tava says that it is not an astroturf exercise and has not spoken to any National MPs about it. Not even his good friend Erica Stanford. I am sure that if something happened to her career he would not want National to do an ACT Epsom type deal. And of course he has not spoken to her or any other National MP about this. Of course not. Right wing political activists never chat about such things like how to restore National to its divinely mandated role.

In this Radio New Zealand interview he said that when he challenged the Green’s leadership in 2015 he asked the question if the Greens were a left wing party.

Yep he was surprised that the party of Rod Donald, Jeanette Fitzsimons and Sue Bradford cared so much about poor people. And would not contemplate supporting National.

Bridges thinks the party is a good idea because it is not fair that the Environmental Party has been hijacked by environmentalists. From Radio New Zealand:

But he said he agreed with Mr Tava that it was not fair any one party should have a monopoly on environmental concerns in New Zealand.
“At the moment you have a Green Party that very much is to the left of Labour, it will only go with Labour, there will be a group of New Zealanders there … who say ‘well actually, they’re not representing me’.”
Mr Bridges said the party would be a potentially valuable addition but it would need to be organic and to drive itself.
Mr Bridges said he has heard from New Zealanders about “the tragedy of a Green Party in name, but is to the left of Labour and is not able to get the wins to the environment that would be there were they to sit in the middle”.
Mr Bridges said it was very early days in regards to such a new environmental party and at this stage nothing was either on or off the table.

National has talked about this for a while. As pointed out by Idiot Savant its major problem is that its record on the environment is so appalling.

What can be the motiovation?

Presuming the party is launched the various possibilities are:

It fails completely.
National gives it a lifeline seat and it creates a degree of political confusion. Mission accomplished.
It fails and takes more votes off National than the Greens. The Greens survive.
It fails but takes more votes off National than the Greens and the Greens dip below 5%. Mission accomplished.
It succeeds. The farming lobby and the coal industry and oil industry rejoice although they will also rejoice if possibility 4 occurs.

National is really hurting over the fact that it is the “biggest” party and is not in Government thanks to those pesky smaller parties whose votes should not count. I suspect that driving the Greens to under 5% is a big part of National’s thinking.

I suspect this is a story that will develop over the next few months.

Twitter has some of the best analysis:

So basically a Blue Green Party is one which cares about the environment but makes no effort to help it.
— Jo (@phdwahine) January 27, 2019

Vernon Tava says NZ deserves more choice because the only environmentalist party is "a long way to the left".

Could this be maybe – just stick with me here Vern – because decades of right-wing politics has largely contributed to fucking the environment? #BlueGreenShamParty
— Ben G (@aotearoa_ben) January 27, 2019

https://twitter.com/Dovil/status/1089295803057729536

https://twitter.com/TristanRS/status/1089357665187258368

https://twitter.com/nealejones/status/1089291373910548480

The use of the word ‘movement’ is absurd and highlights the problem. Every long-term smaller party – NZF, Greens, even ACT have organically formed based on genuine community movements. This is an artificial construction for electoral purposes. https://t.co/tT0XJSUFrl
— Michael Wood (@michaelwoodnz) January 27, 2019

252 comments on “The Blue Green oxymoron ”

Comments are now closed

Michelle 1

28 January 2019 at 9:37 am

he wont get in another idiot we already have enough
- xanthe 1.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 2:57 pm
  
  what about a green green party! Now that woild get my vote and a tsunami of others
  
  Make no mistake the “greens” are not languishing at 6% because they are green but because they are not!
- Michael 1.2
  
  29 January 2019 at 4:41 am
  
  It can’t be correct to hold monopoly at all. Live entrepreneurship moves this world forward. Government should definitely support smaller parties because its hard for them to cope with bigger ones . For example my friend http://myfolio.com/NathanLuise told me to always try hard nevertheless the consequences of the result.
  ” It’s better to regret what you have done than what you haven’t.”
  
  ― Paul Arden,
Alan 2

28 January 2019 at 9:38 am

scared? you should be
Morrissey 3

28 January 2019 at 9:47 am

Listening to Vernon Tava this morning, the emphasis is definitely on “moron” rather than “oxy.”
Bewildered 4

28 January 2019 at 9:52 am

Greens and Nzf will be packing themselves, a true environmental party green all the way through that will work on both left and right will shaft the watermelon party royally even if it only picks up 1 pr 2pc. Further more a resurgent Conservative party will do the same to Winston first who won’t have the advantage of opposition to spout his bs, Fun days ahead
- mickysavage 4.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:07 am
  
  Can you identify what National’s environmental credentials are?
  - Bewildered 4.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:14 am
    
    It’s Vernon credentials and who he builds his party with that matters, he has also indicated he will work with both sides of the house which is big political advantage over the watermelons
    - Robert Guyton 4.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 10:21 am
      
      What are Vernon’s credentials, Bewildered and why is he having to build his party with another, when he’s claiming to be “willing to work with all parties”?
    - mickysavage 4.1.1.2
      
      28 January 2019 at 10:48 am
      
      I quite like watermelons.
      - Andre 4.1.1.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 3:03 pm
        
        Would you still like them if they were green all the way through?
        
        mickysavage 4.1.1.2.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 9:42 pm
        
        Haha possibly not to eat …
    - You_Fool 4.1.1.3
      
      29 January 2019 at 8:51 am
      
      But how does this new “blue-Green” party work with National and keep anything resembling green credentials?
      
      I mean if the plan is for them to work with either side, then both sides need to be able to work with them, i.e. have green positive policies… Unfortunately one side currently does not have that, which is why, coincidentally, the green-greens don’t go with National…
    - Visubversa 4.1.1.4
      
      31 January 2019 at 4:52 pm
      
      Since when has greasy opportunism and waka jumping been counted as credentials? The Nats won’t respect him in the morning either.
- Marcus Morris 4.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:15 am
  
  You really are bewildered. I was closely involved with the Green party for some years before returning to the Labour fold (as so many Greens have done in the last eighteen months). I would be amazed if this so called Blue/Green party, if it ever gets any traction, attracts more than a handful of Green supporters, if any at all. Any support will come from “bewildered and befuddled” Nat supporters
  - Bearded Git 4.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 2:56 pm
    
    real Greens would not support this Labour Party
    - soddenleaf 4.2.1.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 9:56 am
      
      reasons? That they’d vote for a Green party that can work with the big polluter party?
      
      German has two business parties, it ain’t doing so badly. A neolib and an available to work with the left party. It’s because nobody can see the relative support for the neolib wing. Australia has two, Nats and libs. So this new Green party needs to target the NAt vote, be a NAt light.
  - Pat 4.2.2
    
    28 January 2019 at 8:44 pm
    
    It may not attract many current Green supporters but I wouldnt dismiss it entirely….I suspect there is a base for a less socially conscious but environmentally focused party, and theres only one way to find out for sure.
    
    The real question is who they take their support from…my suspicion is it will largely be a straight transfer from National…so a zero sum game
    - You_Fool 4.2.2.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 12:10 pm
      
      I am worried that it’s true purpose is to try and get 1-2% of green party support, to drop Greens below 5%… whether or not it gets a seat itself will then become irrelevant as it’s job will have occurred (TOP party anyone?)
      - Pat 4.2.2.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 2:18 pm
        
        to drop GP below threshold they would have to take 20% or more of current GP support….possible but is it likely?
        
        Pat 4.2.2.1.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 9:02 pm
        
        who are you quoting?…and what is its relevance to my comment?
  - Booker 4.2.3
    
    29 January 2019 at 2:03 pm
    
    “Any support will come from “bewildered and befuddled” Nat supporters”
    
    This. Unless, or until, the National party acknowledge the overwhelming scientific evidence that the climate is changing and human activity is the cause, any Blue-Green party or coalition is a pipe dream, and anyone who really cares about the environment knows this.
    
    At the moment this “party” seems to be nothing more than Vernon, who has already failed to get into parliament in two parties and seems desperate to make his wish come true.
    
    The Nats seem to be far more interested in fomenting the false idea that the Greens won’t work with them and crying “waaaah not fair!”. When in reality it’s them who are refusing not only to work with the Greens but still think they know better than the world’s scientists.
- Robert Guyton 4.3
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:23 am
  
  Bewildered, how do you think this proposed/imagined “true environmental party green all the way through” will vote on a cannabis bill, or one on euthanasia? How will they determine their positions? Those are not “green all the way through” issues.
  - You_Fool 4.3.1
    
    29 January 2019 at 12:11 pm
    
    Maybe they will abstain on those votes… I mean it isn’t like National complained about the Greens abstaining on votes from 2005-2008
    - Robert Guyton 4.3.1.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 2:11 pm
      
      Who’d vote for a party that planned to abstain on all issues that weren’t “core environmental” issues?
      - You_Fool 4.3.1.1.1
        
        30 January 2019 at 8:25 am
        
        National party strategists ‘ theoretical voters?
Dennis Frank 5

28 January 2019 at 9:58 am

A good overview, MS. Time again to recycle Yogi Berra: deja vu all over again. The re-run of the post 2014 election theorising, which featured Gareth Morgan’s call for a bluegreen part to be formed. Same rationale.

So what’s new about it? National’s desperation. Scepticism about Vernon’s claim to have had no discussions with Nat MPs is understandable, but he’s always struck me as a straight-shooter. If true, it suggests either naivety (unlikely) or a genuine impetus derived from holiday brainstorming sessions with unidentified folks.

I pointed out the groundswell feasibility on Open Mike. But that ain’t new! What’s missing from the picture is market research. We don’t have a measure of the percentage of the electorate who are insufficiently attached to National via tribalism, or insufficiently attached to the Greens via leftism. The numbers involved seem huge if you use the 80% indicator from the recent poll as a guide. But they need a sufficiently powerful magnet to make them actually switch their vote.

The smartest option for National is to tell their bluegreen MPs to agree amongst themselves on who ought to go with Vernon, and Bridges ought to use his leadership to persuade caucus to vote in favour of them doing so. A democratic mandate would be a sound basis for success, particularly if they authorised use of the bluegreen brand.
- lprent 5.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:17 am
  
  National party has never been happy with shedding MPs or voters. And they are a conservative party. I don’t think that they will change now.
  
  It’d be interesting to see if they can learn this late to sacrifice for power.
  - Dennis Frank 5.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:35 am
    
    Yes, precisely! So there’s a battle looming in National: conservatives vs pragmatists. I’m betting on the pragmatists defeating the conservatives, but I agree it’ll be a close call. Key behind-the-scenes advisor: Simon Upton. “In April 2017, he was appointed by Parliament to be the next Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment.”
  - Michelle 5.1.2
    
    29 January 2019 at 11:30 am
    
    national are a conservative party when it suits them to be one. To say sarah dowie has been an effective politicians (soimon said) when she has spent the last 2 years on her back having an affair with her work colleague is not acting very conservative or along the lines of conservativism. Southland has an ageing population are they happy with their representative carrying on like this cause her carry on is not very professional or of the high standard or conduct you would expect from someone in her position and in a party that prides itself on high standards and is quick to judge others. Its seems morals are no longer important.
mauī 6

28 January 2019 at 10:00 am

Tava talks about addressing the water quality crisis, biodiversity loss and pest control issues in his interview.

Um… that’s what the Green party is already doing and from Government a-hole lol.
- Wayne 6.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 1:00 pm
  
  While it might be true that the Green Party is doing these things it has also said it will only ever go left. The membership is totally opposed to National as in fact this post by MS demonstrates. A Green Party that could go either left or right would be better.
  
  However there is no prospect that I can see that another Green Party can get 5%, and MS knows perfectly well they would never get gifted a seat.
  
  So unless there is a major shift in voting behaviour this is going nowhere. A new Green Party is unlikely (though it is possible) to drive the existing Green Party under 5%. Surely just about all existing Green Party voters are left.
  
  The most likely new 5% party would be a Christian Conservative party. They have come close twice before (1996, 2014) but the “brand” is surely severely damaged by Craig’s ructions.
  - Adrian 6.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 1:11 pm
    
    They have been damaged because a significant number of any of the ” Christian ” party leaders have subsequently been found to be kiddy-fiddlers.
    Don’t expect anything different of any new iteration. Just arrest the sanctimonious arseholes as soon as they put their hand up.
  - Sacha 6.1.2
    
    28 January 2019 at 1:24 pm
    
    “A Green Party that could go either left or right would be better.”
    
    Better for who?
    - Enough is Enough 6.1.2.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 11:00 am
      
      Better for anyone who wants the Environment to be front and centre of every government’s agenda.
      
      At some point in the future National will lead the government. It would be better that when that time comes a “Green” party acts as hand brake on their more idiotic policies.
      
      A National Party with no such influence is a very dangerous beast indeed
  - Dennis Frank 6.1.3
    
    28 January 2019 at 1:46 pm
    
    Surely just about all existing Green Party voters are left
    
    I’ve dealt with that misapprehension here in years past, but here goes again. In 2015 Russel Norman led a conference session in which he conducted a straw poll of attendees (I counted 65). It split 2:1 on the identity question of whether members self-identified as neither right nor left, or leftist.
    
    I took that as representative of Green voters, because the Green movement was apolitical back when I first became part of it. Then the Values Party schismed as a result of an emerging twin tribes divide. I had already rejected both sides of the establishment long before that, so have long been an advocate of triangulation, and now the third tribe is a dormant force sufficiently large in number to change everything.
  - Bearded Git 6.1.4
    
    28 January 2019 at 3:04 pm
    
    The core Green vote is 7 to 9 per cent….pretty solid…if the Greens could get over 5 per cent at the last election after the MT disaster they will never fail UNLESS like the German greens they move to the centre
Nic181 7

28 January 2019 at 10:04 am

Interestingly, Blue-Green Algae are also known as the Cyanobacteria. Included in this group are the toxic algae. I cannot think of a better name for a party to support National. “The Blue-Green Toxic Algae” Party. Perfect partners for the National Party and in line with their view on the environment.
- marty mars 7.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:14 am
  
  + 1 yep
  
  I also think people are dreaming if they think this will help the environment in any way. This is designed to muddy the waters and ensure less gets done and some individuals make massive money.
  - Bewildered 7.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:30 am
    
    Nup way more effective as not simply reliant on a labour government All people care about the environment not just hard left virtue signallers
    - marty mars 7.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:12 am
      
      Rubbish. All people don’t care. The gnats don’t care. It is just positioning and bullshit. We all know it but the thick righties will pretend just like they do about ao much.
    - Robert Guyton 7.1.1.2
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:17 am
      
      Did John Key care about the environment?
      Did Bill English care about the environment?
      Did Gerry Brownlee care about the environment?
      Does Simon Bridges care about the environment?
      - Bewilderd 7.1.1.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 11:34 am
        
        Yes to all questions
        
        Robert Guyton 7.1.1.2.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 11:37 am
        
        What examples of their decisions can you give to support your assertion?
        
        greywarshark 7.1.1.2.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 1:46 pm
        
        What to expect from bewildered – a pussy or (pusy) yes-man to the Right.
        
        Bewildered …
        
        28 January 2019 at 2:26 pm
        
        Keyboard warrior talk greywarshark, only one pussy in this debate with a slightly fishy smell to boot 👍
        
        Grey Area …
        
        28 January 2019 at 6:43 pm
        
        You haven’t answered Robert’s question.
- WeTheBleeple 7.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 12:17 pm
  
  The cyan party. Sighin’ party.
  - Dennis Frank 7.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 1:14 pm
    
    Turquoise, more likely. Cyan has more green in it. And probably more grunting than sighing. I’m old enough to remember when it was the primary form of male communication. In the hinterland, probably has been passed down a couple of generations as part of the macho scene.
    - RedLogix 7.2.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 1:21 pm
      
      A well timed, heartfelt grunt can speak volumes 🙂
      - Robert Guyton 7.2.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 1:32 pm
        
        We’ve seen 2001-a space odyssey, sure!
  - greywarshark 7.2.2
    
    28 January 2019 at 1:47 pm
    
    WtB
    Firing on all cylinders – zoom. Lol.
- Bearded Git 7.3
  
  28 January 2019 at 3:05 pm
  
  +100
- mary_a 7.4
  
  28 January 2019 at 3:27 pm
  
  Brilliant @ Nic181 (7). Love it.
  
  Perfect name for the murky blue/green sludge lurking at the bottom of the fetid swamp 🙂
Ad 8

28 January 2019 at 10:06 am

Any policies?

They’d be useful if they just pressured the current government who, other than a bit more money for Conservation, continue to do fuck all for the environment whether it’s in water management and regulation, electricity generation and regulation, more national parks or conservation areas, any marine reserves, decreasing fishing quota, or much else.
- Robert Guyton 8.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:19 am
  
  “They’d be useful if they just pressured the current government”
  May as well be a lobby group then. The Greens already exert as much pressure as possible from within the Government. Or do you somehow think they’ve abandoned all their principles and policies for a comfortable salary and seat? I don’t believe that for a moment.
  - Ad 8.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:26 am
    
    Outside a less-than-expected budgetary increase for Conservation, what exactly have the Greens improved in our environment?
    
    Go right ahead.
    - Robert Guyton 8.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 10:29 am
      
      I take it then, Ad, you do believe, as I asked above, that “they’ve abandoned all their principles and policies for a comfortable salary and seat? ” and not exerted ” as much pressure as possible from within the Government”?
      You haven’t answered those kindly-put questions before firing off your own – would you care to?
      - Ad 8.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:51 am
        
        I believe Green Party Members of Parliament and Ministers are people.
        Mere people.
        
        That means they have a smidgen of principle, substantial ego, and a focused self interest no different to any other MP.
        
        Pull the veil from your eyes and look at those MPs dispassionately.
        
        What you are unable to do outside of meekly personalizing their feelings, is hold them to account according to their results.
        
        They have very, very little.
        Which puts whatever you impute of their principles into the reality of changing New Zealand for the good. That is I expect what you voted them in for.
        
        And yes, when we are paying their salary, that matters.
        
        Robert Guyton 8.1.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 11:22 am
        
        “What you are unable to do outside of meekly personalizing their feelings, is hold them to account according to their results.”
        Meekly? Do you know any of the Green MPs, AD, past and present.
        I do and did. The principles and beliefs of individual MPs is at the heart of how a party behaves. You’re railing at your perception that The Greens haven’t achieved much for the environment is firstly, questionable, secondly, subject to factors you seem unwilling to consider (it takes time etc.) and completely ignores the calibre and qualities of the MPs involved. You just seem disgruntled .
        
        Dennis Frank …
        
        28 January 2019 at 1:19 pm
        
        Well, he’s a Labour supporter. How could he ever be gruntled? But I agree with him that realism is the best frame for viewing the GP situation, and agree with you that they are good people doing their best.
        
        greywarshark …
        
        28 January 2019 at 1:59 pm
        
        Yeah as Red Logix says a good ‘grunt’ can speak volumes. The Greens can’t afford to be thinking in disgruntled mode like Ad. They have to push shit uphill like Sisyphus.
        
        Hard work for little recognition and long lead-up times for projects with barriers galore; hard work, and dirty but someone has to do it and keep on keeping on. Thank goodness for the Greens. They aren’t fabulous like the Gnats. Or awkwardly placed like Labour straddling the class divide, leaning to the academic theories and the middle to upper class, and at the same time spouting concern for the working man and woman, and denying Labour’s role in the growth of the unemployed and working poor class with diminishing welfare and support just when they need it.
        
        Meanwhile the Greens persist in doing the unglamorous grunt work for the environment and trying to retain some of the old fizz for better treatment of women and parents.
        
        Ad …
        
        28 January 2019 at 2:18 pm
        
        Don’t worry I have plenty of grunt. Greens show they have none in government at all.
        
        Every politician uses a few principles. And as the Greens showed before the election and after the coalition was formed, once those are used, they have others.
        
        As the Prime Minister says regularly, what gets measured, gets done.
        Best for the Greens not to put any measures over their work.
        
        Raise your expectations of your party, Robert, and actual environmental improvement is more likely to occur.
        
        We do it regularly in Labour.
        
        Meantime, we’ll keep carrying your lot through to 2020 like the political passengers they show themselves to be.
        
        Bearded Git …
        
        28 January 2019 at 3:08 pm
        
        Sounds like tribal LP bollocks to me
        
        patricia bremner …
        
        28 January 2019 at 8:37 pm
        
        Ad this divide is exactly what the gnats want.
      - Jenny - How to get there? 8.1.1.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:39 pm
        
        Sure, why not.
        
        Robert Guyton 8.1.1.1.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:52 pm
        
        Well, yes, none of us should be complacent but disgruntlement isn’t necessarily a good driver for change and certainly doesn’t rally the troops, in my view. We all know our leaders, and they are us, are way behind the play, but will grizzling about those who made it to the dizzying heights of Central Government help matters?
  - Jenny - How to get there? 8.1.2
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:51 am
    
    The Greens already exert as much pressure as possible from within the Government.
    
    Robert Guyton
    
    Really?
    
    The Green Party are not exerting as much pressure as possible within the government. Instead the Green Party leadership are spending a lot of their political capital sucking up to the National Party for a climate accord.
    
    I and others have lobbied various Green MPs to raise in parliament through private member bills, and other parliamentary means, removing the Andarko Amendment that makes it illegal to protest deep sea oil exploration and drilling.
    
    The Green MPs we approached after initially being quite warm to the idea, suddenly changed tack and flatly refused to do anything to remove the Anadarko Amendment.
    
    I and others have lobbied various Green MPs, to raise in parliament through private member bills, and other parliamentary means, removing the amendment to the RMA that makes it illegal to raise climate change as an objection in planning hearings.
    
    The Green MPs we approached after initially being quite warm to the idea, suddenly changed tack and flatly refused to do anything to remove the amendment to the RMA that makes it illegal to raise climate change evidence as an objection in planning hearings.
    
    Initially discussions with some Green MPs, on parliamentary action to remove these two above iniquitious laws relating to climate change, were going well – that is, until the order came from on high to shut down all discussion on any parliamentary action by any Green MP aimed removing these two laws. The reason that we were given was that action to repeal these two laws would damage sensitive discussions with the National Party over a climate accord.
    
    That and the complete invisibility of the Green Party leadership from public life and political discourse does possibly open up a space for something else.
    
    But I cannot see any room on the political spectrum for a Blue/Green Party. We already have one.
    - Jenny - How to get there? 8.1.2.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 12:00 pm
      
      P.S. I might add here Robert, the above abandonment of Parliamentary activism by the Green MPs is one of the reasons, I have asked the Green MPs to at least consider giving a lead outside of parliament, with a ban on domestic air travel.
      - Robert Guyton 8.1.2.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:19 pm
        
        ” removing the amendment to the RMA that makes it illegal to raise climate change as an objection in planning hearings.”
        This, btw, is an issue close to my heart and as an elected councillor, I have railed against it on a number of occasions – it’s deeply frustrating. I can see the rationale, but strain at the leash it becomes.
      - Bearded Git 8.1.2.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 3:12 pm
        
        blame Labour intransigence here not the Greens
    - Robert Guyton 8.1.2.2
      
      28 January 2019 at 12:17 pm
      
      “The Green Party are not exerting as much pressure as possible within the government. ”
      In your personal opinion. You’ve listed issues you believe The Greens should be acting upon, but you’re not showing how, within the constraints they must be finding themselves, they are doing anything less than is possible. If you can’t know their constraints, you can’t rightly say that they’re not doing everything possible.
      - Jenny - How to get there? 8.1.2.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 1:03 pm
        
        You’ve listed issues you believe The Greens should be acting upon, but you’re not showing how, within the constraints they must be finding themselves, they are doing anything less than is possible. If you can’t know their constraints, you can’t rightly say that they’re not doing everything possible.
        
        Hi Robert,
        
        I have tried on many occasions to point out how. I can sum this policy up in one sentence.
        
        “Just as activists must become politicians. Politicians must become activists”
        
        Occasio Cortez, Bernie Sanders, Greta Thunberg, embody this principle.
        
        In the struggle against nuclear ships Labour MPs took to the water in boats to impede the passage of nuclear warships.
        
        Their activism gave great impetus and momentum to the anti-nuclear movement. This movement shifted National Government MPs Mike Minogue and Marilyn Waring to cross the floor and vote with the opposition. Which brought down the Muldoon Government and ushered in the Lange/Douglas administration on a promise of making New Zealand ‘Nuclear Weapons Free’.
        
        Not least in this campaign was the Labour opposition private members bill raised in parliament that highlighted the issue, and brought the matter to a head.
        
        To bring the issue of the Anadarko Amendment to a head in parliament, why can’t the Green MPs bring themselves to put in the ballot a private members bill to remove the Anadarko Amendment?
        
        Seems simple. Don’t you think?
        
        Why can’t the Green MPs do the same for the amendment to the RMA that makes it illegal to raise climate change as an objection in planning hearings?
        
        Something that you say, “…is an issue close to my heart”.
        
        You tell me that I don’t know the constraints that they are working under, that prevents them taking these actions.
        
        “If you can’t know their constraints, you can’t rightly say that they’re not doing everything possible.”
        
        Robert Guyton
        
        Hi Robert, can you tell us what you think these constraints are?
        
        Jenny - How to get there? 8.1.2.2.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 2:13 pm
        
        P.S I am pretty sure I know what their constraints are. (and also how to get around them). But I would like to hear it from you first.
        
        As an elected councillor you must have a few insights into what makes up these “constraints”.
        
        So let’s hear them. And let us discuss if we can work within them, or around them.
        
        Cheers J.
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        28 January 2019 at 3:38 pm
        
        Well, Jenny, my point was that the constraints The Greens have to work under are not going to be known or knowable to the general public, due to their complex and subtle natures. I can easily see that even unspoken “rules of engagement” between coalition partners could influence behaviours and levels of courage amongst MPs, influencing decisions made. There will be inter-personal weightings as well, historical incidents, lobbying of various sorts, financial constraints etc. My point being, it’s easy enough to take pot shots at the MPs from a distance, but the details of what constrains them cannot be easily known. It’s a matter of trusting those you give your vote to, making sure that you explore as far as possible, their likely positions and behaviours before electing them, involving yourself with the mechanics of the party, in the case of The Greens, keeping in touch as far as it’s possible with them as they discharge their duties throughout the term, and generally hoping for the best. Your method here of calling them out, poking their borax and demanding they do this and that, is quite valid, but has an air of intolerance about it. That might sit easy with some, but I’m for encouraging the team, publicly at least, as that level of interaction influences not only the MPs but also their supporters.
        
        Andrea …
        
        28 January 2019 at 9:23 pm
        
        “The Greens have to work under are not going to be known or knowable to the general public, due to their complex and subtle natures.”
        
        If the Greens are that patronising (and it would appear that the present crop is so inclined) then one of their damn’ soon missions is to CLARIFY those complex and subtle etc.
        
        Because, if they can’t, then they’re unfit to serve a democracy.
        
        They represent US and we need to be clear that they are doing so for the greater good of all.
        
        Obscure is unhealthy.
        Remind them. If they won’t, and if Labour won’t co-operate in that very worthwhile endeavour, then throw the scoundrels out. We don’t need any more arcane rubbish while the environment we all count on is under massive threat.
        
        PS National is NOT ‘conservative’. Only in name, not in nature.
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        28 January 2019 at 9:38 pm
        
        The Greens are not being patronising at all. They are, I believe, discharging their obligations to the best possible extent – they are as good as it gets, so far as acting genuinely and with integrity goes, in my opinion. That there is criticism of their effectiveness from opponents and supporters alike is just politics as usual, I reckon. They are not “being obscure”, it’s just difficult for those of us outside of their caucus to track the full extent of the constraints they face. The environment we all count on has been under serious threat for tens of thousands of years. The Greens have the best story I’ve seen yet, from any political party, on what to do about that. Bagging them for not curing the problem inside of 2 years in Government, is shallow, imo.
        
        gsays …
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:00 am
        
        g’day Robert, I thought the reasons given for allowing the purchase of land and expansion of a water bottling plant in Whakatane, were lacking in imagination and totally reinforcing the status quo.
        
        the balancing act of ‘the law’ and 60 jobs vs green core issues, eg tiriti obligations, water as a taonga, more single use plastic, selling ‘important’ land.
        
        i doubt there would be many green members or voters that approve of the taking of this water.
        
        I accept minister Sage is a good, competent person and minister.
        This was a great opportunity for the greens to demonstrate their credentials, motivate the party membership throughout, and signal there are changes afoot.
        
        who knows what would come if the party, as a whole, worked to come up with soloutions to stymie the water commodifying process.
        requiring the company to demonstrate taking 1.1 billion litres of water annually will have no impact on the aquifer, for example.
        
        what if the minister didn’t follow the law?
        would she be arrested?
        
        again i am critical of the party as a whole on this, not solely the minister.
        the first hurdle once they were in power and they failed.
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        29 January 2019 at 2:16 pm
        
        You think Eugenie Sage seeks to totally reinforce the status quo around water bottling, gsays?
- Bewildered 8.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:21 am
  
  Spot on, a true Green Party with out baggage of far left crazies will get things done and be able to work with all stakeholders including business way more cohesively without the idealogical left wing nonsense This is especially so with business which is key here re the answer and the problem
  - Robert Guyton 8.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:26 am
    
    So, Bewildered, a party that lines up with business to improve the environment.
    How might they cooperate with Big Oil, do you think? Fonterra? Coal mining companies? Herbicide manufacturers? The GE industry?
    Keen to hear your views.
    - Ad 8.2.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 10:57 am
      
      You can tell exactly what this government is doing.
      
      Here’s their latest.
      
      It’s called The Aotearoa Circle.
      
      http://www.theaotearoacircle.nz
      
      It will be “a coalition of public and private sector leaders committed to halting and reversing the decline of New Zealand’s natural resources.”
      
      Of course it’s a replacement for the collapse of PureAdvantage.
      
      It has wonderful ambition, flu of the usual bloated rhetoric, with no measures, no specific task, no specific agenda.
      
      It’s a blue-green lobbying group.
      
      Its founding partners are:
      – Air New Zealand
      – Auckland Airport
      – Auckland Council
      – Department of Conservation
      – Designworks
      – EnvirNZ
      – Fonterra
      
      etc etc etc
      
      They are hiring now just in case you’re interested.
      
      But you can totally guarantee that tonnes of money will be spend on consultants, lots of photos with politicians, and fuck all achieved for our environment.
      - Sacha 8.2.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:57 pm
        
        “the collapse of PureAdvantage”
        
        Do you have any links about that?
        
        Dennis Frank 8.2.1.1.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:17 am
        
        Website thinks it hasn’t collapsed: https://pureadvantage.org/who-we-are/
        
        Other lot are different people: https://www.theaotearoacircle.nz/who-we-are/
Bewilderd 9

28 January 2019 at 10:35 am

Simple, Responsible policy / regulation and supporting innovation Politics of responsibility not Politics of ideology and virtue signalling
- Robert Guyton 9.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:43 am
  
  Your comment seems to mean nothing much at all, being vague and unspecific. Perhaps you could describe one regulation “your” party might introduce? And I think you’ll find the present Government, Greens and all, “support innovation”.
  So let’s read something actual from you – so far you sound very airy-fairy, green-wishy-washy – a little “hippy” in fact – do you Morris dance, perchance?
  - Bewildered 9.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:18 am
    
    Sorry robert see 13 for response
roy cartland 10

28 January 2019 at 10:46 am

I’m going to say it.

I think the idea that the right is somehow now willing to even contemplate giving the slightest shit about the environment is a good thing. Yes, it’s a bit of a smokescreen; and no, green and profit-first values are incompatible…

But wouldn’t it be nice to think that the Nats could actually be white-anted into thinking about something other than feeding the corporate trough?
- RedLogix 10.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 1:27 pm
  
  and no, green and profit-first values are incompatible…
  
  You do realise that it’s a peculiarly left wing conceit to imagine that we have an exclusive monopoly on caring about the environment.
  - McFlock 10.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:06 pm
    
    Care is one thing.
    
    But the standard right wing mix of market forces and deregulation is incompatible with any effective prevention of negative externalities, including environmental harm. Self-regulation is a joke, trading schemes get gamed, and small subsidiaries and contractors bear the brunt and file for limited liability on the rare occasionas costs can’t be dodged from the start.
    
    It’s not just the environment – anything that gets in the way of a buck. Worker safety, consumer safety, fair trading, it doesn’t matter. Recent history is littered with sidestepped corporate responsibilities.
    
    The individuals might “care”, but caring doesn’t get them an annual or quarterly bonus.
  - Macro 10.1.2
    
    28 January 2019 at 10:36 pm
    
    The point is Red, in a finite world struggling to provide sufficient resources to all peoples in a sustainable manner, profit (which essentially relies on “growth”) is something that must take second place to the equal distribution of goods and services.
    When you provide aid to the children of Somalia – do you expect to make a profit?
    These people are world citizens, just as you and I, and are entitled to their share of the world’s worth, just as is Bill Gates. Obviously we can’t all share that wealth to the extent of Bill Gates – there just is insufficient. Then it becomes a matter for environmental regulation – just how much we can use this or that resource in a sustainable way, in order not to deprive future generations. If we concentrate our thinking on profit first, this flies in the face of environmental concerns. Thus the idea that you can successfully protect the environment whilst still profiting is flawed.
    If the world was not so heavily populated, then that might be ok. Essentially that was the state of affairs and thus the fallacy that Adam Smith and Hume fell into when they laid out the foundations for the modern exposition on Capitalism encapsulated in the “Wealth of Nations” and Hume’s “Treatise on Government”. These were written at the time when England was beginning its colonisation of America, and there was apparently unlimited land for the taking. (lets overlook the ethical problems of indigenous peoples – because of course for the colonists they were not a consideration, as they were not using the land “productively”) World resources were, to all intents and purposes, infinite. But that is no longer the case. The basic assumptions of Adam Smith’s “Wealth of Nations” have been shown to be false.
    At this point in time, we need a far more sustainable economic theory. One which recognises the finite nature of the Earth on which we live, and also values equity. In a world with limited resources, for a few to accumulate vast wealth, is essentially to steal from others, what is rightfully theirs.
    - Andre 10.1.2.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 6:40 am
      
      Profit doesn’t rely on growth. It relies on doing something that adds more value than it costs to add that value. I’m aware of several businesses that have gone on for decades, sometimes growing sometimes shrinking, that have stayed profitable pretty much throughout. They’re pretty much the same size now as they were when I first became aware of them.
      
      Of the people I’m aware that are strongly concerned for the environment, but probably hold their noses and vote Nat despite the Nat environmental vandalism, there are some common threads.
      
      There’s a perception that there’s a vast excess of dumb rules and regulations that are a compliance nightmare and left-leaning governments are almost solely responsible for this. (Whether that perception is accurate is a whole ‘nother topic)
      
      They want to see environmental damage reduced by some kind of market/price based mechanism rather than inflexible regulations.
      
      They have a strong belief in the idea that private companies are more efficient than government, so they generally support privatisation. (Again arguable but a separate topic).
      
      They are strongly bought into the “personal responsibility” frame when it comes to welfare state topics. So they take the occasional story of the solo mum who’s never worked with lots of kids by several different absent fathers as being representative of where most welfare money goes, rather than seeing the reality of small amounts of top-up assistance going to many people struggling to do their best in a system seemingly designed to expressly discourage additional effort.
      
      Talk of lowering income taxes particularly gets their juices flowing. They will generally comment something along the lines of ‘the government takes the rewards from my work to pay people to come tell me some stupid rule that I can’t do what I want, pay welfare queens to lie around and breed, waste money pretending to do stuff a private company would do in half the time and half the cost … ‘
      
      We could argue forever about how wrong-headed those right wing ideas are. But they aren’t anti-environmental and they aren’t anti-sustainable in and of themselves. But they are very incompatible with left ideals.
  - Roy cartland 10.1.3
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:06 pm
    
    @RL
    Yes, I’ve heard that suggestion thrown about, it’s just a straw-man argument. Of course we all care, or at least say we do, which is true in an abstract way. The difference is: does the right care enough to compromise any of their other principles? Actions would say not – the environmental positives from the Nat govt were either instigated by greens, or used as an excuse against other interests (such as the kermadec sanc – “fine, have a sanctuary, but it can be in someone else’s back yard”).
    
    Incidentally caring about the environment, if it doesn’t touch one’s precious personal rights to do as one pleases, is not quite the same as putting the environment first.
    - RedLogix 10.1.3.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 5:02 am
      
      OK so now do a mind experiment; let’s privilege the environment above human activity. The exact opposite of what we do now.
      
      For a start we wouldn’t be typing this out on the internet. The way we live our modern lives would be an entirely different, materially primitive, compromise.
      
      Right wing priorities certainly do compromise the environment, but they are also what ensure our current systems continue to function. This is a point I see the left overlook all the time; we dream of utopian futures, but persist in overlooking the essential miracle of where we are right now.
      
      This doesn’t mean we can stand still; it’s obvious the Second Industrial Revolution based on fossil carbon is unstable, we must move on from it. But implying we must first collapse back to the Stone Age is absurd.
      
      Socialism and capitalism are the familiar, twin political engines of the era we have just lived through, but each will be transformed when our technologies enable it into something we cannot yet recognise. Just as a Roman grain merchant could have no inkling of say the NYSE.
      
      The left persists in getting cause and effect inverted, we like to imagine it was a social revolution that ended slavery, or emancipated women, but in reality it was science, tech and engineering that enabled these social movements to have effect. If we project this simple observation forward, it will be the technology transformations of the Third Industrial revolution that will enable capitalism and socialism to evolve into new more efficient forms, that hopefully will not impose such a human cost onto the natural world.
      - Dennis Frank 10.1.3.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 6:16 am
        
        You could broaden the meaning of tech into know-how (gnosis). De-materialising it gets you down to a more fundamental level. What is defeating progressive politics, in this frame, is not any obvious enemy, it’s stale thinking.
        
        I do agree that tech powers progress – anyone who reads history sees how inexorable it is. But if we focus on how mind-sets lock people into recycling tradition ad nauseum, we can see that changing our minds is the pre-requisite to making progress happen.
        
        Paradigm-shifting is the frame that caught on in the eighties. MMP was the obvious consequence in our politics. The rainbow coalition was a seventies frame that was likewise transformational. So progressive politicos must focus on what stances & syndromes are preventing progress, and start shifting them to catalyse progress.
        
        As I’ve mentioned several times in the past here, this leads us to the unexplored mental terrain of political psychology. We ought to pioneer development of this field, I reckon. Forget the academics, they clearly have been unable to cope with the cerebral challenge! 😎
        
        RedLogix 10.1.3.1.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 8:34 am
        
        Yes … I’m not discounting the importance of social movements. For 10,000’s years there must have been countless slave revolts, but until coal and steam made slavery economically obsolete, nothing changed.
        
        But suddenly an important and impassioned campaign in Britain ended it.
        
        It’s worth noting that conservative minded people by nature (and we can be grateful to them for this) keep our existing systems going, but when the ground shifts under us all, they need convincing to shift. And the legitimate role of the left is to catalyse this shift.
        
        We are an intensely social creature, and when our story (paradigm if you will) changes, we can transform with remarkable speed and energy.
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        29 January 2019 at 8:47 am
        
        At this point in time we are paralysed by comfort and our ears stuffed with cotton wool. We don’t want to, and can’t hear any story other than the one whispering to us in our heads, “Stay warm, stay safe”.
        
        roy cartland …
        
        29 January 2019 at 9:11 am
        
        Sure, RL, I’ve done that thought experiment. But I think you’ve highlighted a couple of the fundamental problems of the right:
        “they are also what ensure our current systems continue to function”
        current systems in this sense conflates the infrastructure we enjoy with the massive profits extracted for a few AND environmental degradation. I don’t believe that we can’t have the one without the others.
        
        Which leads to the second point:
        The argument you’ve put forward feels like that disingenuous one that’s always levelled at the Greens: “They’ll have us back to horses and carts!”
        Well, no. Green thinking is about investigating newer tech, not clinging to the old. But while so much human energy is wasted lining the pockets of shareholders and “owners” of IP – since workers have to fund these parties as well as their own wages – the momentum gets stymied every time.
        
        And back to the original point – there’s enough labour, enough knowledge but not enough will: certain parties just don’t want to work and would rather just spend that energy protecting their own patch.
        
        greywarshark …
        
        29 January 2019 at 9:43 am
        
        What’s the catalyst for change. Is it just money and power, and comfort and the good life as defined at the time. The poor people may concentrate on the basics, stay warm, stay safe, but the ambitious will charge through with ideas that need financial and implementation input and will get that input, even exploiting the poor if need be. If there is a counter-meme circulating that can be appealed to, some change may be organised by social conditions heroes.
        
        But it is hard work getting people to limit their ambitions for attractive outcomes for themselves, and enabling others from a lower financial strata to step up a notch. It needs the ambitious to see the connections of their resources and power to advantage, and their understanding that a healthy economy spreads that around more widely (distribution).
        
        This group of economists will have something useful to say about distribution economics. The ‘Institute for New Economic Thinking’.
        https://www.ineteconomics.org/research/programs/political-economy-of-distribution
        
        Most mainstream approaches towards inequality explain growing inequality primarily as a labor market phenomenon conditioned by one of four developments:
        (1) skill-biased technological change;
        (2) liberalization of labor markets;
        (3) winner-take all markets for “superstars”; and
        (4) globalization, where this is taken primarily to mean increased competition for unskilled labor.
        We bring together researchers to offer a complementary but neglected hypothesis: that historically changing institutions, legal frameworks, and structural features of the economy are key causes of inequality.
Bazza64 11

28 January 2019 at 10:48 am

I’m sure there is room for a Green party that doesn’t lean as left as the current one. A lot of people sympathise with the green position, but won’t vote green as they get all the other left wing stuff with it. Some of the older Green party members resigned over the party’s support of Metiria Turei during her over claiming of benefits. These were long term members who thought the Green party had lost its way & its original purpose.
- roy cartland 11.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 10:57 am
  
  Can you elaborate please? What “other left wing stuff”?
  
  (BTW, I understand they didn’t exactly resign over MT “claiming benefits”.)
  - Bazza64 11.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:06 am
    
    Why can’t the greens be more green ?
    
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/97083457/why-cant-the-greens-be-more-green
    
    Re MT benefits – should have said her historic benefit fraud
    - roy cartland 11.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 12:15 pm
      
      That article doesn’t really explain much. Of course everyone wants a pretty environment, but when the most un-green businesses are based on mining (including mining the value out of land and leaving shit in its place) the two can’t co-exist.
      
      Maybe that’s the issue – the Greens see that as self-evident (because it is), hence their social justice platforming.
- Jess NZ 11.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:08 am
  
  There just isn’t room.
  
  The current Green Party is made up of various counterculture cause parties that teamed up because none of them had the numbers.
  
  So yes, you have the ‘pure’ environmentalists who think poor people only have themselves to blame and technology will save the earth if we just invest enough into green business, and you have the lefties who want the universal income but don’t care what car you drive, and everything in between where the social and environmental are all connected. And they all fight amongst themselves and drag each other down.
  
  And then National win. Let’s not go there….
  - Bazza64 11.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:17 am
    
    Yep Jess you’re probably right that in small country can’t get enough people to form a pure environmental party, so there will always be a mix.
    - Incognito 11.2.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 9:48 pm
      
      I don’t think that’s what Jess NZ was saying.
      
      In any case, it’s not the size of the country (as in: population or electorate) but the lay of the (political) land IMO. Our country is relatively isolated from the political scene in Europe, for example. Although we may have ‘imported’ MMP from Germany and technically implemented it here, it’s still relatively young and hasn’t yet delivered the political diversity that is one of its purported advantages (over FPP).
      
      Denmark has a population only slightly larger than ours (but no MMP). It has 175 MPs, currently nine parties represented in Parliament, and a 2% electoral threshold. In my opinion, our 5% threshold is way too high and one of the main reasons why we haven’t seen more party diversity in our Parliament.
      
      It seems that the strategy behind a Blue-Green party in NZ is to pull the Green Party below the 5% threshold. The result would be that the environment will lose possibly its strongest defender in Parliament. How the BG voters will reconcile this will be very interesting indeed.
      - greywarshark 11.2.1.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 9:55 am
        
        Incognito and others
        What do you think would be a reasonable level of voting for admission to Parliament. 5% is a high barrier. A small drop to 4% would be safe. But should we go to 2% like Denmark. How would that affect our politics here?
        It seems to me our politicians are more volatile and confused than those of Denmark. We have a subversive, wild west inclination that arises; the abrupt change in 1984 is an example.
        
        No judicious thinking there; driven more by emotion and the knowledge of worldwide financial changes approaching. We need to make changes they thought. What about us being in at the first, introduce it while we are in power and have the opportunity, Treasury leading us, and the assistance from overseas economic planners. Let’s show we can skinny-dip in ice-cold water beyond our depth the plotters thought.
Morrissey 12

28 January 2019 at 10:49 am

Hard to imagine a more craven, cynical and dishonest campaign than this.

They think people are stupid.
- Bewildered 12.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:14 am
  
  Yep bit like 100000 kiwi homes, a billion trees, oh by the way we are going to close down and industry, no increase in industrialal action …….agree Mozz people are pretty stupid On political front though this is a smart strategy where the ends “trump” the means for the greater good
- Chris T 12.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:34 am
  
  Someone is scared
  - Robert Guyton 12.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:44 am
    
    Simon Bridges?
    Scared of what, exactly.
Bewildered 13

28 January 2019 at 11:11 am

I will sit around for 9 years and then form 300 working groups and come back to you in a year, does that work for you Robert ? 😊
- Robert Guyton 13.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:26 am
  
  Since you asked, I’d prefer you got out and did something useful, Bewildered, plant some trees or if that’s too “huggy” for you, support someone who does. If you’re rolling in dosh, give some of it away to someone busy improving the environment; they’ll probably not refuse it on the basis of what you’ve been saying here 🙂
  - Bewildered 13.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:38 am
    
    Got nearly 5000sqm of trees Robert, also trapping, doing my bit 👍
    - Robert Guyton 13.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:42 am
      
      Good man. Did you vote Green?
      🙂
      - Bewildered 13.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 11:53 am
        
        Unfortunately not but rwnj do care about the environment, hence the arguement they do not is counter productive 👍
        
        Robert Guyton 13.1.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:07 pm
        
        I’m not saying they don’t. I do think the “Right” approach to the issue of a degrading environment is the wrong one and in fact exacerbates the problems – burn gas to save the planet!
        
        Gabby 13.1.1.1.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:01 pm
        
        They want clean water to wash their suvs beewee. The peasants can drink it afterwards at a price.
Jess NZ 14

28 January 2019 at 11:12 am

The current Green Party is made up of various counterculture cause parties that teamed up because none of them had the numbers.

So yes, you have the ‘pure’ environmentalists who think poor people only have themselves to blame and technology will save the earth if we just invest enough into green business, and you have the lefties who want the universal income but don’t care what car you drive, and everything in between where the social and environmental are all connected. And they all fight amongst themselves and drag each other down.

And then National win. Let’s not go there….
- Alan 14.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:20 am
  
  yep, you got it
Cinny 15

28 January 2019 at 11:36 am

Trying to contain my laughter, it’s difficult.
- Bewildered 15.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 11:41 am
  
  Hope you sell laughing in 2020 Cinny 😊
  - Robert Guyton 15.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 11:43 am
    
    “Hope you sell laughing in 2020 Cinny”
    I knew it! Righties believe everything has a price!!!
    - Cinny 15.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:46 am
      
      Nailed it Robert, well said indeed.
    - Bazza64 15.1.1.2
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:48 am
      
      Think of the GST & taxes the government would rake in ….
      - Cinny 15.1.1.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:00 pm
        
        GST and taxes on cannabis maybe?
        
        Wonder what the blue/green stance is on that.
    - Bewildred 15.1.1.3
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:55 am
      
      Fair cop
      - Robert Guyton 15.1.1.3.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:09 pm
        
        Lucky break. In any case, I’m beginning to enjoy discussing the topic with you, Bewildered, as I think you’re sincere. We all might learn something from each other.
    - WeTheBleeple 15.1.1.4
      
      28 January 2019 at 12:25 pm
      
      I sold laughing. Did well at it too.
      - Robert Guyton 15.1.1.4.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 12:53 pm
        
        So, someone could sit in the audience, contain their mirth, then ask for their money back?
        
        WeTheBleeple 15.1.1.4.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 2:04 pm
        
        Use of the word mirth disqualifies you from a refund.
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        28 January 2019 at 3:41 pm
        
        Dammit! I meant guffaws!
      - greywarshark 15.1.1.4.2
        
        29 January 2019 at 10:01 am
        
        WtB
        Are you on youtube?
        
        WeTheBleeple 15.1.1.4.2.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:07 am
        
        No. I find endless self promotion repugnant. But I absolutely adore making people laugh. It’s a toughie but with my insecurities/conditions that cause egoic/social problems already… I opted out of the spotlight. I cringe at that clamoring for attention that is showbiz and all manner of social media but I was directed to participate in it upon a return to the arts. Seems venues expect you to be all over media like an attention whore now so they can clip your popularity ticket. I lasted all of six months then left the industry and social media for several years now. TS is the only format I’m on, that only recent, and not for comedy.
        
        Sparked a rant. Touchy subject. I am an artist! 😀 Baahaaa!
        
        It was easier to run the show, promote my peers and tag along as a byline, that way I got to play but didn’t have to pander to industry or press. I stop for years then return with new stuff.
        
        Nearly time to do a stint again.
        
        ‘Me too. Times have changed. Cook the man some fucken’ eggs is simply not acceptable anymore…
        
        Cook the man some free-range fucken’ eggs.
        
        Yeah bitch, you want me to smash your avocados.’
        
        I know I’m good… 😀
        
        greywarshark …
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:18 am
        
        WtB
        You are certainly good to read, full of useful stuff WtB so if you want to add in a few jokes that is doubly fine with me.
        
        Self-deprecating jokes are the real ones that touch the funny-bone And come from understanding of not only oneself but the general human condition.
- greywarshark 15.2
  
  29 January 2019 at 10:00 am
  
  Cinny
  Don’t please leave us in suspenders – what particular funny thing has tickled you?
Akjs 16

28 January 2019 at 12:02 pm

There’s one thing i have never understood: Apart from the ‘run off’ – which,in my humble naive opinion, could be easily fixed with many options – if heads were put together to work them out (I have workable ideas): Why is it seen as ‘wrong’to support the dairy industry? This is a Vital industry to our country. Milk products and beef are better homegrown than imported. During both Great Wars NZ was the off-shore pantry for Great Britain, without our input they would’ve had it much tougher!
Our dairy industry has been a huge contributor to our export market since it began. I’d prefer to see cows, sheep and farms than concrete jungles. Those who suffer allergies or who are vegan and have their opinions – sure, i respect your ideas but tell me, can you seriously live without milk, cheese, butter, yoghurt? All of which are proven to be beneficial to the human body.
Bones and teeth need these nutrients. I’ve been told by specialists that my healthy intake of dairy, from infancy, contributed to my badly broken knee knitting together in half the time expected and, despite the arthritis and nerve damage, the bone is solid. My teeth are healthy because of dairy intake, as well as oral care, the dentine is in perfect health – i’ve only ever had 4fillings and needed them replaced once, my son is 17 and never had a filling, my brother, who neglected his teeth for years, has very few fillings, strong teeth and bones.
Dairy is an all-in-one food source for many nutrients that the body needs. Science proves that human bodies have evolved to need dairy for health.
I know people who’ve lived without and as they’ve aged they’ve developed severe skeletal issues and their teeth are in very poor condition. They blame fluoride in water, but i have always drunk the same water, as has my family, and many others, i don’t buy into fluoridation being the cause of dental decay – that’s b.s.
I support the need for a dairy industry, instead of not supporting it, we ought to be putting our heads together to become, yet again, ‘the 1st country in the world to’ find a ‘green’ solution to farming. It isnt only dairy farming that causes emissions and run off, and frankly, i dont want to live in a country where there are no farms and i dont want to live in a concrete jungle of roads, highways and selfish attitudes to nature where humans force nature to live around us instead of us respecting nature and living alongside.
We could have both: more nature, better environment and sustainable farming.
Farms could easily be made ‘greener’ and many countries overseas are working towards implementing changes whilst retaining everday oldfashioned farms. And to those who say butter and full milk are bad – it has been scientifically proven to be otherwise.
Keep dairy, just find ways to stop the runoff into waterways, turn the effluent into positive use, plant more trees on farmland, there has to be a way.

As to Blue/Green party – Peacocks have the most beautiful colouring on the outside, however they also have an accurate reputation for pompous displays of ego to gain attention (a trait known in humans as ‘narcissism’). The ‘blues’are a wilfully ignorant lot of ego-driven arrogant fools. They think with tunnel vision and cannot, and will not, use ‘bigger picture’ peripheral thinking. They’ve proved how stupid they are by selling all our assets! Including farmz and forests!! Given these fools half a chance, they’ll sell our lakes and rivers next!!
- Robert Guyton 16.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 12:13 pm
  
  Could you share your “workable ideas” on run off with us/me, Akjs – I’m genuinely interested to hear them. I wonder if t’s the dairy industry, in the form it has taken here in NZ, that people believe is “wrong”, rather than dairying, in the sense of non-industrial farming where care for everything, rather than profit, is the driving factor.
  - Cinny 16.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 12:25 pm
    
    +1
- Cinny 16.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 12:24 pm
  
  Personally am just not into industrial dairy farming, it’s ruining our country.
  
  Greed for the white/gold seems to have clouded the judgement of some.
  
  Yes please more trees on farmland, among other things.
  
  Times they are a changing. We are kidding ourselves if we think dairy is a growth industry anymore.
  
  Growth needs to be put into other industries that aren’t so reliant on the climate.
- Psycho Milt 16.3
  
  28 January 2019 at 12:53 pm
  
  Dairy is excellent food, yes. However, intensifying dairy production to the point where we’re damaging waterways and contributing to the destruction of rainforests (via importing PKE to feed to cows) was a bad idea and environmentalists are right to want it stopped.
  - left_forward 16.3.1
    
    29 January 2019 at 3:45 pm
    
    ‘Dairy is excellent food, yes.’
    For baby cows maybe!
- Gabby 16.4
  
  28 January 2019 at 6:58 pm
  
  Those countries who import dairy from us must disagree on that akjsy.
- greywarshark 16.5
  
  29 January 2019 at 10:04 am
  
  Peacocks make a weird noise that is unpleasant. Some of the Blue Party the same. Rather a good analogy I think.
bwaghorn 17

28 January 2019 at 12:27 pm

Arden better not rule out working with the tava greens .

I bet there is more than a few wealthy green voters in the leafy suburbs who could easily vote for a non socialist green outfit

I guess the nats would see it as a win if all the tava greens achieved was to take enough votes to bury the green party.
- Robert Guyton 17.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 12:56 pm
  
  If they ever get off the ground, they won’t be “anything”greens. The brand’s taken 🙂
  Those wealthy voters in the leafy suburbs who won’t vote socialist – they’d vote for a neo-lib green party?
  - Puckish Rogue 17.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 6:54 pm
    
    Just out of curiosity does anyone know what electorates supply the most Green party votes because I wouldn’t be surprised if the majority of their party votes came from middle to wealthy suburbs
    - Andre 17.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 7:04 pm
      
      Knock yourself out.
      
      https://www.electionresults.govt.nz/electionresults_2017/electorate-status.html
      
      Prepare to be unsurprised. The green vote is fairly high in places like Epsom, Auckland Central, Wellington Central, and pretty low in places like Mangere, Manurewa, Dunedin South.
      - Puckish Rogue 17.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:15 pm
        
        So this party could, potentially, be very damaging to the Greens.
        
        The next election could be very interesting indeed
        
        McFlock 17.1.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:30 pm
        
        lols
        
        Sounds like another political hail mary to me.
        
        Basically, if the BGs are after the voters who don’t like the Green left wing policy but want clean streams, I suspect most of them didn’t vote Green in 2017. But they might have voted blue.
        
        So which electorate do you think the nats will choose to ask to prop up the new party to coattail in some lickspittles? Kick Rimmer out of Epsom? Or maybe Nelson area?
        
        veutoviper …
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:38 pm
        
        Southland. After all Dowie is their current Spokesperson on Conservation (and does have a background in Conservation having worked for DOC). But the bets on her remaining or being successful next election …
        
        And what a dilemma for Robert Guyton. LOL
        
        Stir, stir …
        
        Robert Guyton …
        
        29 January 2019 at 7:44 am
        
        A letter to the editor in today’s Southland Times:
        “Sarah Dowie must resign immediately. We deserve better.”
        P Clifford
        
        Sacha …
        
        28 January 2019 at 8:26 pm
        
        Maybe Nelson? Nuck Smith for deputy!
        
        Dennis Frank 17.1.1.1.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:45 pm
        
        “Our Bluegreens caucus has grown from the two founding members in 1998 to the current diverse team.” https://bluegreens.national.org.nz/about_bluegreens
        
        “New Zealand’s environment is at the core of our quality of life, our national identity, and our competitive advantage. .. Good environmental practice is not only important to protect our natural heritage, but is crucial in securing the sort of future we want for our children. That is why National founded the Bluegreens in the 1990s and it continues to grow in strength and numbers. It is one of the most active of National’s Policy Advisory Groups and now works closely with a strong Caucus group chaired by Scott Simpson MP.”
        
        Now if you look at that website photo – “National’s Bluegreen Executive is made up of members and MPs from around the country” – you can count 27 members of this Executive. Do you believe this is true? Are the leader & deputy truly members of this Bluegreen Executive?? Or is the caption a lie?
        
        solkta …
        
        28 January 2019 at 7:52 pm
        
        It’s an environmental party full of environmentalists mate.
        
        greywarshark …
        
        29 January 2019 at 10:13 am
        
        The first thing that National could do to show their shift to the green side, is to encourage buildings to be painted pale green, as a quiet and permanent reminder of their presence and direction. At present the choice of business and government tends to coffee-latte, or steel grey
        which is dull and depressing; beige almost everything. The pale green shift would herald the new political environment.
- Sacha 17.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 1:20 pm
  
  “I guess the nats would see it as a win if all the tava greens achieved was to take enough votes to bury the green party.”
  
  That is their aim, yes.
- Graeme 17.3
  
  28 January 2019 at 6:48 pm
  
  And that would kind of stuff it for National if both green flavours got seats, and both ended up supporting a Left leaning coalition. It would be smart politics to do whatever it took to get them both, and really, the blue / greens or whatever they call themselves would find life a hell of a lot easier being on the right side, but nowhere near the right edge, of a left wing government than on the left, and probably extreme left, of a National government.
  
  OK the party will appeal to the leafy suburbs, so that’s taking votes off National primarily, and maybe the odd one or two off the Green Party, but they’d mostly be National. And National are concerned about loosing those leafy suburbs to the left via a green party, hence the effort they put into attacking the Green Party in these areas.
  
  So I really doubt Labour would “rule out” working with them. Their strategists are probably welcoming the opportunity.
  
  More germane would be whether Tava would “rule out” working with Labour or the Green Party.
Jenny - How to get there? 18

28 January 2019 at 1:27 pm

AWOL

Simon Bridges has just come on the news saying the idea of a setting up a Blue/Green Party as an alternative partner to the Greens, “has some merit’.

How does this gell with the National Party’s so called “good faith” negotiations with James Shaw for a climate accord.

Not very well, I would have thought.

Saying that we are going to do our best to destroy you electorally, by supporting a patsy support partner, following behind a public attack piece penned by the National Climate Change Spokesperson in which he said the “Government is blinded by Green ideology”, pretty much torpedoes any good faith by-partisanship negotiations between the Climate Change Minister and National Party for a climate accord.

When will James Shaw enter the public debate to defend the government and his party from the Opposition’s attacks?

Politics is the battle for ideas, conducted in the public arena, a fact that the National Opposition understand very well.

When will James Shaw end his invisibility and give his rebuttal?

The future of his party as an electoral force may depend on it.
- Bearded Git 18.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 3:28 pm
  
  you used good faith and simon bridges in the same sentence there…unicorn thinking
- Dennis Frank 18.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 3:58 pm
  
  Seems to me you ought not to try diverting James from his consensus-building. His co-leader, otoh, has no similar demand on her time. Why not lobby her??
- Chris T 18.3
  
  28 January 2019 at 6:19 pm
  
  “When will James Shaw end his invisibility and give his rebuttal?”
  
  He won’t
  
  The Greens became gimps, the moment they said they would only go with Labour, which also ended any chances of getting major policy through.
  
  Apart from the cannabis referendum
  
  Way to show people your priorities as an environmental party
  
  This party if it happens will split the Green vote and they will drop below threshold and Winston is already out in the polls
  
  Too make it worse, I would think National will gift Tava a safe seat
  
  How the worm turns
  - Dennis Frank 18.3.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 7:59 pm
    
    Your confidence in your ability to predict the future may lapse. Jacinda’s x-factor is fading, so the Labour refugees she attracted back will probably return to the Greens by next election. They’d only be keepers for Labour if it achieved big political gains via performance. No sign of that.
    
    It hinges on whatever social policies any alternative Green option adopts. Insufficiently inspiring will only attract Green mainstreamers, who probably have long voted National due to the Bluegreens within. Hard to see a radical centrist option being provided, yet that is the only path to sustainability & survival downstream. Complacency still rules the thinking of mainstreamers.
- Sacha 18.4
  
  28 January 2019 at 8:21 pm
  
  “Simon Bridges has just come on the news saying the idea of a setting up a Blue/Green Party as an alternative partner to the Greens, “has some merit’. How does this gell with the National Party’s so called “good faith” negotiations with James Shaw for a climate accord.”
  
  A long-term climate accord has nothing to do with parties working together (or not) in other ways.
Andre 19

28 January 2019 at 1:41 pm

Just implement the recommendations of the MMP review and drop the threshold. Preferably lower than the recommendation, say 2.5% or 3% or so.

We’ll find out real quick if there actually is an unmet need for a CentristGreen or RightGreen party.
- Jenny - How to get there? 19.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 2:02 pm
  
  Indeed.
  
  At 2.5% or 3% the National Party’s need for a tactical vehicle to cannibalise the Green Party vote, to push them below 5% and keep them out of parliament, would be quashed.
  - Graeme 19.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 6:56 pm
    
    It’d also provide National with a plethora of single issue nut job parties to prop them up. Same could happen on the left, but history has them all in National’s patch. Can see that ending really well for all concerned….
    - Sacha 19.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 8:24 pm
      
      I’d love to watch the Nats negotiate a governing agreement with the Christian Soldiers, Rural Hunters and Truckies United parties.
greywarshark 20

28 January 2019 at 2:11 pm

Her historic benefit fraud? MT had an extra tenant to give her enough money so that she could finish her University degree, and not end up thrown on the scrapheap where so many NZ parents have been piled. She had guts of the type that NZ needs but you whingers just love the tall poppy cut. I don’t know if you fell trees, but you are very capable at the easy blow of cutting down people who try and break through the ties of hate that RW governments have wound round NZ young people limiting their lives and opportunities.
- Shadrach 20.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 7:32 pm
  
  Benefit fraud is a crime, is it not? Oh and having a tenant wasn’t the problem. The problem was not being honest about it.
  - greywarshark 20.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 8:46 pm
    
    Shadrach
    You belong to the great lynching mob that love to take down beneficiaries wherever some transgression can be found. And of course the more oppressing the legislation is, the harder to break out of the hated group of poverty-afflicted in society, the more chances that bennies will break some of gummints and agencies’ onerous regulations.
    - Shadrach 20.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:50 pm
      
      Most beneficiaries are cheats. Metiria was.
      
      Meanwhile you belong to the great crim hugging mob who condone fraud. Well done son.
    - Shadrach 20.1.1.2
      
      28 January 2019 at 11:50 pm
      
      Sorry meant to say most beneficiaries are NOT cheats. At least in my experience.
      - greywarshark 20.1.1.2.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 10:17 am
        
        Shadrach
        Frankly nothing you say seems to have any weight or thought so don’t bother
        to correct yourself you remain in the same place, just turned to a different point on the compass.
        
        shadrach 20.1.1.2.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:16 am
        
        That’s not a rational response. Metiria committed benefit fraud. In doing so she brings the welfare system into disrepute, and provides ammunition to those who oppose it. You are effectively condoning criminal behaviour that ultimately and unfairly reflects on other recipients of assistant.
        
        greywarshark …
        
        29 January 2019 at 11:29 am
        
        Shadrach you bring the benefit system into disrepute with your vituperations. The benefit system as I understood it was meant to help people as needed, and enable them to get on their feet and have the standing of a capable individual and respected citizen with a good lifestyle as part of an enterprising, working community.
        
        The fact that successive governments have acted to shut down the opportunity referred to above, deliberately, and then blast off at beneficiaries trying to achieve the outcome of being a capable individual etc. seems to appeal to you as an objective. You appear to dislike humanity, and don’t see other people’s intrinsic worth. Are you also a self-hater?
        
        Shadrach …
        
        29 January 2019 at 4:34 pm
        
        Your second sentence I can agree with. The problem with where you then proceed to is that you ignore the realty that the welfare system moved to be a dependency trap, rather than a liberation. Hence the need in recent times to wind it back. And I can easily demonstrate I’m correct by simply pointing to the fact that we now have an increasing number of people on benefits when unemployment is dropping, due significantly to the easing of sanctions. I support welfare for those genuinely in need.
        
        veutoviper …
        
        29 January 2019 at 12:05 pm
        
        shadrach, my advice (meant well) is to just leave it, ignore and move on.
        
        I see your replies as more to the point than the responses you have received and I hear what you are saying and agree for the most part. The latest replies indicate some very narrow/inaccurate views about our overall society and the purpose of our social contract safety net. They also contain personal attacks, addressing the messenger as opposed the message – probably in breach of the Rules for this website as set out in the Policy section. But you also did the same in one.
        
        It really is not worth bothering about. IMO you are not going to change this type of thinking. Kia kaha.
        
        Shadrach …
        
        29 January 2019 at 4:35 pm
        
        Thank you. I’ve had one more shot, in the assumption that Grwy is engaging in good faith.
        
        Bazza64 …
        
        29 January 2019 at 12:47 pm
        
        Shadrac, agree with you 100%. You aren’t a beneficiary hater, just want people to not break the law.
        
        Shadrach …
        
        29 January 2019 at 4:35 pm
        
        Indeed.
  - UncookedSelachimorpha 20.1.2
    
    29 January 2019 at 1:25 pm
    
    put this one up a few times now…
    
    “The law, in its majestic equality, forbids rich and poor alike to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal their bread.”
    
    ― Anatole France
    - Bazza64 20.1.2.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 2:27 pm
      
      An interesting quote re the law written a long time before there was any welfare state.
      - UncookedSelachimorpha 20.1.2.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 9:44 pm
        
        Little has changed, for many
Nic the NZer 21

28 January 2019 at 3:30 pm

“What can be the motiovation?”

I think Bridges is thinking about what to do once he is inevitably knifed in the back and tossed away by the National party.
- xanthe 21.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 4:07 pm
  
  heh heh, first two candidates , simon and jamie
ken 22

28 January 2019 at 4:55 pm

Blue Green and toxic like Blue-green Algae (Cyanobacteria).
Puckish Rogue 23

28 January 2019 at 6:56 pm

I’d strongly consider giving this my party vote
- Jenny - How to get there? 23.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 7:10 pm
  
  Great, one less vote for National.
  - Puckish Rogue 23.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 7:13 pm
    
    If the party does come to be created and National gifts them a seat then you might regret those words
    - You_Fool 23.1.1.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 12:31 pm
      
      Why? This new party can work for both sides right? Might ensure Labour head further left… win/win all around… or even better, Green/Lab/BG government, no need for winnie and we get a strong env/sustainability focus in government
- Cinny 23.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 7:38 pm
  
  Might want to wait until they have a party and some policy Pucky.
  
  Blue/greens sounds very nick smith styles…. think I’ll give it a miss.
  - Puckish Rogue 23.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 8:26 pm
    
    Oh for sure, it’ll have to be good policies for me to forsake Jude
    - Sacha 23.2.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 8:56 pm
      
      You’ll have her blessing to dally with the teal.
      - Puckish Rogue 23.2.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 9:57 pm
        
        But I want to leave the warm bosom of her inspiring leadership for an unknown quantity…decisions decisions
        
        veutoviper 23.2.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:13 pm
        
        Come on e hoa – after all you are now a card-carrying member of the Union!
        
        FYI, Swordfish the guru of election results has appeared at 29/30 below after I made a wish when reading your 17.1.1. etc re Green electorate results.
        
        As usual, some good statistics are down there at 30 that you may be interested in. I also asked Swordfish if he/she had anything to add to what Andre said in reply to you.
        
        veutoviper …
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:56 pm
        
        Also a good reply from Swordfish to me is now in the 29 thread (?) with analysis done at the time of the 2017 general election which is very interesting.
timeforacupoftea 24

28 January 2019 at 8:24 pm

Kennedy Graham will make a great leader for this new Green Party.

I can hear him sharpening his knives already.

Good Bye Green Party as we have known it.

Kennedy Gollan Montrose Graham(born 1946)
is a New Zealand politician and former Member of Parliament for the Green Party.

He has served in the New Zealand Foreign Service for sixteen years, and lectured at the University of Canterbury and Victoria University of Wellington.

He is the brother of Sir Douglas Graham, a former National Party MP (1984–1999) and cabinet minister (1991–1999). He is also a great-grandson of Robert Graham, an MP from 1855 to 1868.
- Psycho Milt 24.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 8:58 pm
  
  How much interest would he have in running a sock puppet on behalf of the National Party? That can hardly be an attractive gig for someone with any sense of integrity.
- greywarshark 24.2
  
  29 January 2019 at 10:23 am
  
  Is he the uncle of Carrick Graham? Having a long connection with politics, sounds similar to Roger Douglas once Labour, now left the planet for Mars with Elon ‘bite my dust’.
RRM 25

28 January 2019 at 8:28 pm

Whereas the ACTUAL GREEN GREENS have been SOOO STRONG on the environment since their election to government:

Kermadec Sanctuary – Winston says no

Cameras on fishing boats – Winston says no

Chlöë Swärbröök’s marijuana bill – Winston says no (and voted down FFS! Its government vs. government!)

Principled opposition to Waka Jumping Bill – Winston says no.

Another day, another shit sandwich for the greens. Eat up, James! Yum yum.
- Psycho Milt 25.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:04 pm
  
  Really? The wailing and gnashing of teeth over at Kiwiblog over the government nixing future oil and gas exploration has been a wonder to behold, and that’s even before the zero carbon bill hits their radar. Picture the exploding heads when that one turns up…
  
  If the Greens are having little effect, you wouldn’t know it from those comments threads. Even funnier – the wailing and gnashing of teeth was often accompanied by complaints that NZ First had allowed the Greens to walk all over them. You guys really don’t understand coalition government at all, do you?
Fireblade 26

28 January 2019 at 8:35 pm

You might think we look the same, but we’re not the same, we’re not the same at all. Cause I’m Green and I’m Blue…
Morrissey 27

28 January 2019 at 8:42 pm

What Green supporter could ever ally with a party that had THIS as a water policy?

https://resources.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/l/f/i/z/s/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.1240×700.1lfi0o.png/1504501119377.jpg
millsy 28

28 January 2019 at 8:50 pm

We already have a blue green party. It’s called TOP. If Tava wants to join, he only needs to pull their website up and punch in his credit card numbers.

TOP has the advantage of giving a shit about the environment.
- Psycho Milt 28.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:06 pm
  
  TOP has the advantage of giving a shit about the environment.
  
  Yep, but that’s exactly the reason National has to start its own “environmental” party -for TOP, there are no quotation marks around “environmental.”
- Morrissey 28.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:27 pm
  
  TOP has the advantage of giving a shit about the environment.
  
  So does the National Party, in a really disgusting, retrograde and polluting way…..
  
  https://resources.stuff.co.nz/content/dam/images/1/l/f/i/z/s/image.related.StuffLandscapeSixteenByNine.1240×700.1lfi0o.png/1504501119377.jpg
Incognito 29

28 January 2019 at 9:02 pm

ANALYSIS: Data suggests the supposed “teal” section of National-leaning Green voters is tiny.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/110207099/teal-vote-within-green-party-minuscule-data-suggests
- swordfish 29.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:12 pm
  
  Ha, you beat me to it !
  
  Started composing my comment before yours turned up.
  - veutoviper 29.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 9:44 pm
    
    Great to see you. While you are here …
    
    I was wishing you were here when I read the conversation some hours ago back up thread between Puckish Rogue and Andre starting at 17.1.1 about which electorates supply the most Green party votes.
    
    Andre is of the view that the green vote is fairly high in places like Epsom, Auckland Central, Wellington Central, and pretty low in places like Mangere, Manurewa, Dunedin South from the 2017 election results, which seems right to me.
    
    IIRC you have done work on this and I wondered whether you – and/or Matthew Whitehead – could add anything more to that conversation and here you are.
    
    Any comments on this aspect?
    
    PS – pleased to see you have regard for young Mr Henry Cooke. I have been impressed with him since he started life as a journalist, and have not been disappointed.
    - swordfish 29.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 10:25 pm
      
      My comments from 2017, Vv (with links to even earlier debates):
      
      https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25082017/#comment-1373292
      
      https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25082017/#comment-1373773
      .
      - swordfish 29.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:38 pm
        
        (In the above comment … I linked to my actual (25 Aug 2017) comments 6:16am (top of post) & my reply to Ad at 10:34am … but all this new-fangled technology appears to have simply restricted you to a link to the overall 25/08/2017 Open Mike post as a whole … Dang !)
        
        So here are my two 2017 comments:
        
        First: 6.16am
        swordfish
        25 August 2017 at 6:16 am
        
        Latest analysis from the New Zealand Election Study’s Jack Vowles (hot off the Press and just launched by Helen Clark at Victoria University) raises a series of interesting points about Green support:
        
        (1) It appears to confirm what I’ve been arguing for quite some time (eg here … https://thestandard.org.nz/breaking-news-russell-norman-resigning-from-parliament/#comment-1069442 and here … https://thestandard.org.nz/the-political-machinations-of-the-flag-debate/#comment-1074477) … namely: that – far from being a Party supported solely (or even largely) by the affluent urban upper-middle classes – the Green support-base is, in fact, quite diverse: the party draws fairly similar levels of support from the various socio-economic strata. Indeed, if anything, the 2014 NZES suggests the Greens drew slightly greater support from people on lower incomes with few if any assets than from those on high incomes.
        
        Which isn’t to say the Green Constituency sees itself as subjectively “working class” exactly … their voters tend to eschew any class identity. They’re also more likely than average to be university educated.
        
        (2) The Greens’ dependable core-vote is probably smaller than most pundits assume.
        
        The NZES flow-of-the-Vote data suggests less than half of 2011 Green voters remained loyal at the 2014 General Election. About a quarter of 2011 Greens swung to Labour, with a little less than one fifth going to the Nats and NZF (each).
        
        However, there were significant reciprocal swings. The Greens lost more to Labour than they gained from the Larger Centre-Left Party, but most of the vote inflow that the Green’s did receive in 2014 came from former Labour supporters as well as from previous Non-voters – thus largely (but not entirely) compensating for their lost 2011 votes.
        
        As Vowles argues: ” … the apparent stability of Green voting support is something of an illusion”
        
        In other words … not the same 11% voting Green in 2011 and 2014. Around 5% of all voters (just under half of 2011 Greens) voted Green in both Elections, the rest were new.
        
        And this isn’t actually anything new – go back to earlier NZES polling (late 90s / early zeros Elections) and you’ll see the same inherent volatility in the Green vote.
        
        Clearly, at the very least a large minority (and quite possibly a majority) of Green voters in both 2011 and 2014 had been Labour supporters at some time in the recent past. A lot of movement back and forth between the two parties over consecutive Elections.
        
        So, I’d argue the Greens’ base vote is more like 5%.
        
        Jacindamania + the Greens turmoil in this campaign will probably mean the Party won’t receive its usual amount of (significant and vital) Labour-supporter froth on top of that core vote. Probably just enough to raise it to 6-8%.
        
        NOTE: If the Greens are averaging anything less than about 6.5% in the final round of pre-Election Polls then I myself am going to be forced to switch my Party Vote from Labour to the Vegetable Rights and Peace Party, just to ensure they return.
        
        (3) The NZES confirms once again (as in previous NZES studies) that Green voters view themselves – and are viewed by others – as ideologically to the Left of Labour. The Greens constituency is essentially Left-libertarian (there are relatively few Blue-Greens among the Party’s support-base), with a particularly marked emphasis not on the liberal attitudes that most pundits might assume but rather on the economic Left dimension. While Social libertarians are certainly much more likely to vote Green than Social authoritarians … holding Left-wing economic views is still around 3 times more important in predicting Green electoral support than moral liberalism.
        
        So the idea popular among pundits that there exists some kind of mis-match between the Greens’ left-wing social justice policies and their supposedly affluent, centrist, morally-liberal but purely environmentalist urban support-base really holds no water.
        
        veutoviper 29.1.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:52 pm
        
        Thanks so much, Swordfish.
        
        I thought you had done some indepth analysis about that time. Sorry, too tired tonight to relook at in depth as have been awake since 4am and time for bed.
        
        Our wonderful lprent is doing a lot of work on the site at present etc and currently it doesn’t seem to be possible to link to actual comments – only the post. Or, he has done that deliberately to stop people like me doing it too often! LOL.
        
        swordfish 29.1.1.1.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:52 pm
        
        Second 10:34am
        
        swordfish
        26 August 2017 at 10:34 am
        
        Ad:
        
        Which electorates are they strongest in?
        
        The New Zealand Election Study’s Jack Vowles
        
        Some journalists have also suggested that the Greens’ failure to attract voters on the right was less about the ability to demonstrate a capacity for economic management and environmental pragmatism, and more about how their position on issues of social justice connected or did not connect with their electoral support. For example, political commentator Duncan Garner (2014) argued that ‘the Greens talk poverty and social justice, but the poor aren’t listening—and they’re certainly not voting for them’. He identified ‘telling statistics’ from party vote data across electorates: the Green Party polled much better in upper-income electorates than in those with high proportions of people on lower incomes. But Garner’s observation is based on what is known as the ecological fallacy: it is dangerous to infer individual behaviour from differences between large groups of people such as those contained in electorates. At the individual level, as Chapter 4 has shown, the Greens were slightly more likely to gain votes from people on lower incomes than those on upper incomes.
        
        Contrary to Garner’s claims, lower incomes and fewer assets are associated with Green voting. However, as Figure 7.2 shows, Green voters are not working class and do not see themselves as such. They also do not identify as middle class, given the width of the confidence intervals, mainly identifying with no class at all.
        
        I made essentially the same point as Vowles back in the 2015 thread I Iinked to https://thestandard.org.nz/the-political-machinations-of-the-flag-debate/#comment-1074477
        
        Duncan Garner certainly wasn’t the only journo to rely on seat-by-seat data
        
        In his 2012 Listener Interview with Russel Norman – Guyon Espiner suggested
        .
        
        If you doubt the rich bias among Green voters, consider this: in the country’s wealthiest electorate of Epsom, 4424 people gave their party vote to the Greens. That is more than the combined total of Green voters in the poor Auckland electorates of Mangere (962), Manurewa (995) and Manukau East (913)..
        
        Apart from falling for the ecological fallacy – what Guyon also conspicuously failed to notice was the marked discrepancy between similarly affluent seats like Epsom (Green 4424 in 2011) & Wellington Central (10903)
        or
        very Low Income Dunedin North (Green 7010 in 2011) & either the 3 poorer South Auckland electorates or indeed affluent Epsom.
        
        _____________________________________________________________________
        
        Right … so all above this = my 2017 10:34am reply to Ad
        
        My 2019 self will just add here (no cheap pun intended) … that (historically) decidely weak Pasifika support for the Greens goes some way to explaining the Party’s weakness in the big Labour strongholds of South Auckland. (If I remember rightly … I made this point in one of those earlier debates on TS from 2015 or there abouts)
- Dennis Frank 29.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:36 pm
  
  That’s reassuring. It disposes of the scaremongering. I suspect voters returning due to the fading of the Jacinda effect will outnumber those pulled by Vernon.
  
  I doubt he’s silly enough to plan on pulling voters from the Greens anyway. The number of mainstreamers who have environmentalist concerns is vastly greater – over 80% of the electorate according to a recent poll. So he’s thinking of fishing in that pool.
swordfish 30

28 January 2019 at 9:10 pm

Micky

I suspect that driving the Greens to under 5% is a big part of National’s thinking.

Absolutely. In fact, the entirety of their strategy, I’d say. They know full well a Blue-Green vehicle won’t even remotely approach the 5% hurdle.

Trouble (for the Nats) is … the Turquoise constituency within the Green’s voting base is vanishingly small.

The 2008-2014 New Zealand Election Study found that Green voters were not only overwhelmingly liberal on the Moral Liberal vs Conservative spectrum but also heavily Left on the core Economic Left vs Right spectrum. And overwhelmingly preferred a Labour rather than Tory givernment.

And now … one of the best of the younger journos (Henry Cooke) has just updated with the 2017 NZES stats … confirming the same essential ideological proclivities of the Green voting base. (this, incidentally, is the first time I’ve seen any stats from the 2017 iteration of the Study).

https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/110207099/teal-vote-within-green-party-minuscule-data-suggests
- Sacha 30.1
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:34 pm
  
  Let’s see if Henry’s tweets with graphs embed OK:
  
  https://twitter.com/henrycooke/status/1089668192593600512
  - swordfish 30.1.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 9:44 pm
    
    Brilliant !
    
    And, as I say, it’s been the case for quite some time.
    
    A chunk of Left-Labour & former Alliance / New Labour* voters headed in that direction (especially at the 2011 General Election … when a somewhat moribund Goff leadership saw a swathe of Labour’s moral liberal supporters swinging to the Greens / and a section of its moral conservatives moving to NZF).
    
    * it’s interesting that while many Alliance activists entered the Green Party immediately after 2002 … the NZES of the time suggested a large majority of former Alliance voters swung to Labour rather than the Greens. Almost a decade later … they join younger Lefties in finally following their former activists.
    - Sacha 30.1.1.1
      
      28 January 2019 at 9:47 pm
      
      Indeed. Sure did not take long for Hooton to diss the notion either: https://twitter.com/MatthewHootonNZ/status/1089209227695063040
      - Sacha 30.1.1.1.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:06 pm
        
        I have no idea what makes one tweet show up here and another not.
      - Dennis Frank 30.1.1.1.2
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:10 pm
        
        So he thinks it’s just a Nat-split thing. I mostly agree, but reckon it would pull some Labour voters who don’t like National but would go for a centrist Green option. Say 2.5% of the electorate. Combine that with reluctant Nat voters who want a progressive Green option, say 3%, and you have a goer…
        
        This commenter amused me: “My thinking is a party like this is after my vote and people like me. We’re swing voters, sit in the middle and would vote Green if they’d not be a bunch a former commies. I’ll never vote Labour or Nats and Winston is out. What’s left? My segment easily makes 5% I reckon.” 🤣
        
        veutoviper 30.1.1.1.2.1
        
        28 January 2019 at 10:19 pm
        
        Am I right or wrong in thinking that comment is a wonderful example of an oxymoron? LOL
        
        Dennis Frank …
        
        29 January 2019 at 6:01 am
        
        I had to consult the bible: “An oxymoron is a rhetorical device that uses an ostensible self-contradiction to illustrate a rhetorical point or to reveal a paradox. A more general meaning of “contradiction in terms” is recorded by the OED for 1902.” [Wikipedia]
        
        I think you’re right: it’s the original meaning that seems to apply to him rather than the later, general meaning. The commie reference means his political consciousness was formed no later than the seventies, but his photo showed a man who seemed younger than me, so probably born mid-late fifties.
        
        The interesting bit is why someone so averse to marxists also never votes National. It does make him genuinely centrist. Yet seeing the GP as too leftist makes him non-progressive, so genuinely conservative. Yet he doesn’t rate Winston an option, nor does he cite the New Conservatives! If he’s being honest, we may have found a unicorn in the political forest. And when you find one example of a species in an ecosystem, you know there’s more…
        
        veutoviper …
        
        29 January 2019 at 1:41 pm
        
        It really is a wonderful comment! I am still laughing and have bookmarked it in My Laughs folder. Thanks again.
- Dennis Frank 30.2
  
  28 January 2019 at 9:45 pm
  
  Yes, once they get their heads around this data their enthusiasm will cool. However the recent poll suggests the numbers available to be pulled via suitable niche-marketing are huge, so they won’t discount the option much.
  
  From a marketing perspective, giving voters a choice is a smart move. National, for reasons that are obscure to me, is diffident about marketing its in-house bluegreen brand. The Tava option presents them with a way to test the market. All they need do is signal a partnership to the electorate. Swing voters usually determine our election result, and often only 3% of the electorate suffice to do so, right?
  - Sacha 30.2.1
    
    28 January 2019 at 9:49 pm
    
    Maybe it will encourage the potential christian or hunting parties to make a play.
Dennis Frank 31

28 January 2019 at 10:00 pm

“A big part of our problem in New Zealand is actually not the rules themselves, it’s the lack of enforcement.” You betcha! Labour & Nat govts both guilty in the past.
https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/01/waterways-might-not-need-tougher-pollution-rules-potential-blue-green-party-leader-vernon-tava.html

“There are a lot of people… who are to the right of centre, or are very much centrist – maybe swing voters, but not people who are to the left of Labour – who would give a party vote to an environmental party. I’ve lost count of the number of conversations I’ve had with people who’ve said they’d vote for that kind of party. Of course that’s anecdata”. Not market research

If the Nats have done it, looks like they haven’t given it to their members. But I posted evidence that their leadership group doesn’t even share polling data with caucus the other day, so no surprise! Such distrust and lack of team-spirit!

Bridges predicts “you will organically see parties coming up to fill I suppose what is a void in the centre.” He “denied being involved in setting up the new party”.
Dennis Frank 32

29 January 2019 at 6:32 am

Stuff editorialises on the potential: https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/opinion/110205536/is-a-bluegreen-party-a-real-possibility

“A blue-green party that is sensible and strategic, without TOP’s communication issues, could promote itself as an environmental handbrake on a centre-Right Government. With the Green Party consistently ruling itself out of a coalition with National, there may finally be a place in New Zealand politics for a party that can figure out how to combine pragmatism and principle.”

Analogous to the handbrake NZF applies to Labour & Greens aspirations in the coalition. Vernon has the clarity of vision and managerial competence to do that.
- WeTheBleeple 32.1
  
  29 January 2019 at 9:03 am
  
  Vernon is a spotlight hungry egomaniac with no loyalty. Just watch him in public being handsy with women. I don’t mind touchy people, sexually selective touchy = creep.
  
  You say “clarity of vision and managerial competence”, I say opportunist.
That_guy 33

29 January 2019 at 10:29 am

I’d like to propose a name for this new party that evokes images of greenness, flowing rivers, nature, that kind of thing. How about “Greenwash”?
That_guy 34

29 January 2019 at 12:18 pm

On reflection this could actually work.

The entire thing seems to be predicated on two delusions: one, that the “environment” is something that you visit on the weekends and is an optional extra that you throw some attention at after the “core” issues of the Very Serious People are addressed, and two, that it’s possible to do this without spending any money or making any sacrifices.

But, a LOT of people have these delusions. So it could work if the party grabs 1% off the greens and 4% off the Nats, NZF, Labour and ex-TOP.

It’s the kind of thing my mum would vote for so that she can imagine that she’s ticked the “Green” box.
- UncookedSelachimorpha 34.1
  
  29 January 2019 at 1:36 pm
  
  “one, that the “environment” is something that you visit on the weekends”
  
  Yeah, but you can just tow it “beyond the environment”…a fantastic old skit from John Clarke:
  - That_guy 34.1.1
    
    29 January 2019 at 2:21 pm
    
    Comedy gold thx
DJ Ward 35

29 January 2019 at 2:22 pm

As a person who fits into this voter demographic I have had no voting options, forever.

Greens have just been captured by the hate men feminists. Shown by there political motivation in getting the Ministry of Women portfolio. Playing into the steriotype that the greens are not a Green Party. Just a social justice party, and one that rejects a significant minority of voters, men. Many like me that would vote for the party, but due to flying a false flag are happy to see any attempt resulting in the present parties demise.

Recently I read the Conservatives platform. Amazingly in the Family’s area they propose equality at separation. Sadly the rest is fruitcake religous stuff. Amazing that the Conservative party is more Feminist than the people who cliam to be feminists.
- McFlock 35.1
  
  29 January 2019 at 2:31 pm
  
  Well, have fun with the others in your demographic voting for the new party, then.
- That_guy 35.2
  
  29 January 2019 at 2:32 pm
  
  I don’t understand why you think the Greens hate men. Genuinely interested in why you think this.. are there specific incidents or policies you can refer to?
  
  I’m a straight white guy and I never got this vibe from them.. been in the party, attended conferences, talked to the candidates personally.
  
  Genuine question.
  - DJ Ward 35.2.1
    
    29 January 2019 at 2:48 pm
    
    Can you link to a pro men’s issues statement from them. Don’t bother with the pro women ones as that’s virtually all of them. Try JAG and Jan Logie, as I’m sure they are demanding change in the endless list of bad stats for men and boys.
    
    Hmm no! More bigoted women’s services funding, more persecution of males, more turning a blind eye to women’s offending, more removal of males from parenting roles.
    
    Did anybody ask. “What is your men’s policy?, who has the men’s portfolio?” It’s called Gynocentrism, fronted by misandrists.
    - That_guy 35.2.1.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 3:00 pm
      
      Well, Chloe Swarbrick is on the mental health portfolio and is always talking about the high suicide rate, which is biased towards men. So there’s that.
      I guess I was hoping for something a bit more specific than “they fund things for women therefore they hate men”. I don’t agree that a lack of statements about men’s issues equates to hatred, but perhaps we can agree that a few statements recognizing the problem of young men’s suicide rates (and including the word “men”) wouldn’t go amiss. It’s just… hate? It’s a bit strong. The worst you could really accuse them of is inattention.
  - Dennis Frank 35.2.2
    
    29 January 2019 at 2:52 pm
    
    Yeah, likewise. But I get why he feels that way. The Greens are so staunch about equality of gender & minority representation that it has produced discrimination to some extent – although that is probably debatable. Anyone interested in the reality of that should check the list & do the stats. It’s definitely true that Greens political marketing has a black hole where white males ought to be, and voters stay away as a result. Not easy for the leftist decision-makers to grasp this fact…
    - That_guy 35.2.2.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 3:04 pm
      
      Maybe it wouldn’t be a bad idea for the Greens to put out some comms about our high male suicide rate and how they often occur in the wake of a relationship breakup, and how it might be a good idea for everyone to end relationships in a way that’s a bit nicer, and not at all relate this in any way to anything that’s currently in the media about certain Nats.
    - McFlock 35.2.2.2
      
      29 January 2019 at 3:15 pm
      
      Fortunately, there is literally every other political party on hand to rectify that fact (only being a little bit facetious).
      
      I was surprised that the Green caucus has so many women in it compared to men, but then remembered they had to replace three senior mps just before the election.
      - DJ Ward 35.2.2.2.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 4:01 pm
        
        Because they didn’t support the position of condoning female offending, in regard to benifit fraud.
        It wasn’t a dispute on Green policy.
        
        McFlock 35.2.2.2.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 4:43 pm
        
        It had nothing to do with “female” offending.
        
        It had everything to do with the forced criminalisation of the needy, where the system intentionally gives beneficiaries insufficient funds to sustain life and then pillories people for committing fraud.
        
        and it had everything to do with Green party policy. If benefit levels aren’t currently providing a “basic, liveable income”, then everyone on a benefit is either slowly dying or committing some manner of fraud to live.
Dennis Frank 36

29 January 2019 at 3:08 pm

“Environmentalism and sustainability need not fall on the political left or right, and there’s space for a more centrist party, former Green MP Kennedy Graham says.” https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/political/381175/former-green-mp-kennedy-graham-backs-new-centrist-party

“Dr Graham says he’s not part of any discussions to form a new party but he does think there is room for one that is not wedded to the political left.” “He rejected the suggestion the new party would be ‘blue-green’. “It’s neither red green nor blue green but … would work with the left or right, it would be a quintessentially centrist party.””

Remarkably perceptive for such an establishment gent, eh? He continues “you have government and you have opposition and if a political party says it’s only going to work with one side of that house, then you’re not going to get a long-term binding genuine consensus. That is required in any country – including New Zealand – for effective long-term or even medium term sustainability: you need environmental philosophy to be placed in the centre and to be working with both left and right.”

Just as true as it ever was. Failure to adopt the correct praxis continues to afflict the GP. However the argument that National have made collaboration impossible also has considerable merit!

“He also rejected joining such a party, should it come to pass. “I’ve met on a couple of occasions with Vernon, he remains a friend and a colleague but … I haven’t discussed it with him. “For that matter I meet with James Shaw from time to time too. My active political career is over, I’m just interested in the theory and philosophy of sustainability.””
- That_guy 36.1
  
  29 January 2019 at 3:23 pm
  
  I think the Green’s position is that you can’t have infinite growth in a finite system, and that 26 people owning more than half the planet is not a good political outcome. The first is just physics. The second is arguably left-wing I guess. But a more nuanced viewpoint is that, after a certain point, inequality actually leads to more inefficiencies in the economy, and that we’re well past that point. So for me it’s just a matter of basic physics and economics.
  
  I prefer to think in terms of “correct vs incorrect” rather than “left vs right”. It’s not my problem if the right wing parties are subscribing to economic and physical theories that aren’t accurate.
  - Pat 36.1.1
    
    29 January 2019 at 3:31 pm
    
    hear hear….and if a Blue/Green start up is full of contradictions hopefully their target market will be unimpressed…although theres no guarantee
    - That_guy 36.1.1.1
      
      29 January 2019 at 3:42 pm
      
      The National party is totally based on an economic theory that isn’t correct and they got 40%. Like I said above, I think a blue-green party could work because it’ll be based on delusions that people want to believe.
      
      I don’t think they’ll get many votes from the Green voters. Just as likely they’ll siphon off 4.9% of National’s vote, which would be hilarious.
      - Pat 36.1.1.1.1
        
        29 January 2019 at 3:59 pm
        
        as you say it may work (that is reach threshold) but if they do its far more likely at the expense of existing Nat vote rather than from the current GP support
Brutus Iscariot 37

29 January 2019 at 3:20 pm

I’d be wary of using income data to work out the Green’s voter demographic. A good portion of their base are middle class white students and the like, not much nominal income but often very affluent and inclined to a protest vote against National-voting Mummy & Daddy. Or consider the marketing executives etc from Ponsonby who make plenty of money but feel guilty about it every day.

As noted above, the proof is in the electorates their success is concentrated in. But whether these voters are “teal” is another question altogether…i suspect not in most cases.

I love the concept of a pragmatic environmentally aware centrist party, but as said above, it already exists in the form of TOP, which was built as a movement based on genuine conviction. Tava’s concept is just a shill party that makes a mockery of voter’s intelligence.
- Dennis Frank 37.1
  
  29 January 2019 at 4:01 pm
  
  Well, let’s put your cynicism in a suitable context! Here’s his leadership rationale from May 2015:
  
  “I have asked a question that is a perennial one for the Green Party. Are we a left wing party that includes the environment as part of its policy mix? Eco-socialists? Red Greens? Or are we a true party of sustainability – environmental, social, cultural and economic – willing and able to be an independent entity with a decisive influence on government policy? Whichever parties may comprise the government. The left-right spectrum is only one aspect of political action and if we limit ourselves to only being able to deal with one end of that spectrum we are far less able to move the focus of politics to genuine sustainability.”
  
  “The urgency of interconnected local and global crises – climate change, biodiversity loss, mass extinctions, inequality – all demand that we work across political lines. It is easy to glibly dismiss such a question as mere philosophical speculation, or ‘just about political positioning’. But it is far more fundamental than that.”
  
  “My vision for the Greens is that we be the sustainable axis around which governments turn. I am not advocating that we become a Blue-Green Party. It is a real failure of imagination to think that this is the only alternative to a Red-Green political project and it fails to appreciate that the old, stale politics of the left-right axis are of limited use when facing the unprecedented challenges of the 21st century.”
  
  https://vernontava.com/2015/05/30/final-speech-to-the-green-party-agm-for-the-male-co-leader-contest/
Chris 38

29 January 2019 at 9:03 pm

“But unlike National, I think environmentally-minded voters are smart enough not to fall for it.”

Sure, but there are also a lot of either uninformed or very stupid NZers who’re capable of falling for anything. It’s a big problem.
Muttonbird 39

29 January 2019 at 10:28 pm

Two massive cock-ups in this piece by National Party public relations manager, Brigitte Morten. She claims:

However, the Greens have not maintained a steady vote since formation.

I’d say the Green vote at +5% over the last 20 years has been remarkably steady in comparison to other minor parties. Perhaps by steady she means the sub-1% performances by ACT.

And she laments that single issue parties struggle for mandate and broad policy:

Like any party that campaigns on a single issue, how do they vote in parliament on issues they didn’t get a mandate for?

while criticising the Greens for having exactly that.

They may be able to pick up some swing voters who care about environmental issues but are put off by the Greens’ wider policy platform

No wonder the Nats are in opposition with such muddled MMP thinking.

https://www.radionz.co.nz/news/on-the-inside/381235/new-green-party-viable-option-or-wishful-thinking

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Hi,It’s my birthday on Christmas Day, and I have a favour to ask.A birthday wish.I would love you to share one Webworm story you’ve liked this year.The simple fact is: apart from paying for a Webworm membership (thank you!), sharing and telling others about this place is the most important ...

David FarrierBy David Farrier

2 days ago
Love, happiness, blur

The last few days have been a bit too much of a whirl for me to manage a fresh edition each day. It's been that kind of year. Hope you don't mind.I’ve been coming around to thinking that it doesn't really matter if you don't have something to say every ...

More Than A FeildingBy David Slack

3 days ago
All I Want For Christmas

The worms will live in every hostIt's hard to pick which one they eat the mostThe horrible people, the horrible peopleIt's as anatomic as the size of your steepleCapitalism has made it this wayOld-fashioned fascism will take it awaySongwriter: Twiggy Ramirez Read more ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

3 days ago
The 1 Good Thing Left In Journalism

Hi,It’s almost Christmas Day which means it is almost my birthday, where you will find me whimpering in the corner clutching a warm bottle of Baileys.If you’re out of ideas for presents (and truly desperate) then it is possible to gift a full Webworm subscription to a friend (or enemy) ...

David FarrierBy David Farrier

3 days ago
Bernard’s Picks ‘n’ Mixes for Monday, December 23

This morning’s six standouts for me at 6.30am include:Rachel Helyer Donaldson’s scoop via RNZ last night of cuts to maternity jobs in the health system;Maddy Croad’s scoop via The Press-$ this morning on funding cuts for Christchurch’s biggest food rescue charity;Benedict Collins’ scoop last night via 1News on a last-minute ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

3 days ago
2024 SkS Weekly Climate Change & Global Warming News Roundup #51

A listing of 25 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, December 15, 2024 thru Sat, December 21, 2024. Based on feedback we received, this week's roundup is the first one published soleley by category. We are still interested in ...

Skeptical Science

4 days ago
Dance Magic

Well, I've been there, sitting in that same chairWhispering that same prayer half a million timesIt's a lie, though buried in disciplesOne page of the Bible isn't worth a lifeThere's nothing wrong with youIt's true, it's trueThere's something wrong with the villageWith the villageSomething wrong with the villageSongwriters: Andrew Jackson ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

4 days ago
Government Forces Universities to Enforce “Free Speech” While Limiting Universities&#821...

ACT would like to dictate what universities can and can’t say. We knew it was coming. It was outlined in the coalition agreement and has become part of Seymour’s strategy of “emphasising public funding” to prevent people from opposing him and his views—something he also uses to try and de-platform ...

Sapphi’s SubstackBy Sapphi

4 days ago
Fact brief – Are we heading into an ‘ice age’?

Skeptical Science is partnering with Gigafact to produce fact briefs — bite-sized fact checks of trending claims. This fact brief was written by Sue Bin Park from the Gigafact team in collaboration with members from our team. You can submit claims you think need checking via the tipline. Are we heading ...

Skeptical Science

5 days ago
As Our Power Lessens: Published

So the Solstice has arrived – Summer in this part of the world, Winter for the Northern Hemisphere. And with it, the publication my new Norse dark-fantasy piece, As Our Power Lessens at Eternal Haunted Summer: https://eternalhauntedsummer.com/issues/winter-solstice-2024/as-our-power-lessens/ As previously noted, this one is very ‘wyrd’, and Northern Theory of Courage. ...

A Phuulish FellowBy strda221

5 days ago
By Any Other Name.

The Natural Choice: As a starter for ten percent of the Party Vote, “saving the planet” is a very respectable objective. Young voters, in particular, raised on the dire (if unheeded) warnings of climate scientists, and the irrefutable evidence of devastating weather events linked to global warming, vote Green. After ...

Bowalley Road

5 days ago
Bernard’s last Saturday Soliloquy for 2024

The Government cancelled 60% of Kāinga Ora’s new builds next year, even though the land for them was already bought, the consents were consented and there are builders unemployed all over the place. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that mattered in Aotearoa’s political ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

5 days ago
Bernard’s Picks ‘n’ Mixes for Saturday, December 21

Photo by CHUTTERSNAP on UnsplashEvery morning I get up at 3am to go around the traps of news sites in Aotearoa and globally. I pick out the top ones from my point of view and have been putting them into my Dawn Chorus email, which goes out with a podcast. ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

5 days ago
2024 OIA stats

Over on Kikorangi Newsroom's Marc Daalder has published his annual OIA stats. So I thought I'd do mine: 82 OIA requests sent in 2024 7 posts based on those requests 20 average working days to receive a response Ministry of Justice was my most-requested entity, ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

6 days ago
Climate Change: A perverse incentive

The government published its first Biennial Transparency Report under the Paris Agreement yesterday, and the media has correctly noted that it is missing any plan to actually meet our target. While it hypes domestic emissions reductions so far - which have been good, but will likely get worse thanks to ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

6 days ago
Economic Bulletin December 2024

Welcome to the December 2024 Economic Bulletin. We have two monthly features in this edition. In the first, we discuss what the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update from Treasury and the Budget Policy Statement from the Minister of Finance tell us about the fiscal position and what to ...

NZCTUBy Jack McDonald

6 days ago
NZCTU make submission in opposition to Treaty Principles Bill

The NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi have submitted against the controversial Treaty Principles Bill, slamming the Bill as a breach of Te Tiriti o Waitangi and an attack on tino rangatiratanga and the collective rights of Tangata Whenua. “This Bill seeks to legislate for Te Tiriti o Waitangi principles that are ...

NZCTUBy Jack McDonald

6 days ago
ZB’s Power Couple

I don't knowHow to say what's got to be saidI don't know if it's black or whiteThere's others see it redI don't get the answers rightI'll leave that to youIs this love out of fashionOr is it the time of yearAre these words distraction?To the words you want to hearSongwriters: ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

6 days ago
Austerity thumps GDP most since 1991

Our economy has experienced its worst recession since 1991. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Friday, December 20 in The Kākā’s Dawn Chorus podcast above and the daily Pick ‘n’ Mix below ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

6 days ago
Weekly Roundup 20-December-2024

Twas the Friday before Christmas and all through the week we’ve been collecting stories for our final roundup of the year. As we start to wind down for the year we hope you all have a safe and happy Christmas and new year. If you’re travelling please be safe on ...

Greater AucklandBy Greater Auckland

6 days ago
The Hoon around the year to December 20, 2024

The podcast above of the weekly ‘Hoon’ webinar for paying subscribers on Thursday night features co-hosts & talking about the year’s news with: on climate. Her book of the year was Tim Winton’s cli-fi novel Juice and she also mentioned Mike Joy’s memoir The Fight for Fresh Water. ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

6 days ago
The baby-boomers’ last gasp

The Government can head off to the holidays, entitled to assure itself that it has done more or less what it said it would do. The campaign last year promised to “get New Zealand back on track.” When you look at the basic promises—to trim back Government expenditure, toughen up ...

PolitikBy Richard Harman

6 days ago
Skeptical Science New Research for Week #51 2024

Open access notables An intensification of surface Earth’s energy imbalance since the late 20th century, Li et al., Communications Earth & Environment: Tracking the energy balance of the Earth system is a key method for studying the contribution of human activities to climate change. However, accurately estimating the surface energy balance ...

Skeptical Science

7 days ago
Join us at 5pm for 2024’s last Hoon

Photo by Mauricio Fanfa on UnsplashKia oraCome and join us for our weekly ‘Hoon’ webinar with paying subscribers to The Kākā for an hour at 5 pm today.Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream for our chat about the week’s news with myself , plus regular guests and , ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

7 days ago
Christmas Gifts: Ageing Boomers, Laurie & Les, Talk Politics.

“Like you said, I’m an unreconstructed socialist. Everybody deserves to get something for Christmas.”“ONE OF THOSE had better be for me!” Hannah grinned, fascinated, as Laurie made his way, gingerly, to the bar, his arms full of gift-wrapped packages.“Of course!”, beamed Laurie. Depositing his armful on the bar-top and selecting ...

Bowalley Road

1 week ago
GDP Figures No Christmas Present for New Zealand

Data released by Statistics New Zealand today showed a significant slowdown in the economy over the past six months, with GDP falling by 1% in September, and 1.1% in June said CTU Economist Craig Renney. “The data shows that the size of the economy in GDP terms is now smaller ...

NZCTUBy Stella Whitfield

1 week ago
Cheeseburgers and Stunt Monkeys

One last thing before I quitI never wanted any moreThan I could fit into my headI still remember every single word you saidAnd all the shit that somehow came along with itStill, there's one thing that comforts meSince I was always caged and now I'm freeSongwriters: David Grohl / Georg ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

1 week ago
MSD rejecting 220 pleas for food grants each day

Sparse offerings outside a Te Kauwhata church. Meanwhile, the Government is cutting spending in ways that make thousands of hungry children even hungrier, while also cutting funding for the charities that help them. It’s also doing that while winding back new building of affordable housing that would allow parents to ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

1 week ago
The Wing Parties’ Economic Policies.

It is difficult to make sense of the Luxon Coalition Government’s economic management.This end-of-year review about the state of economic management – the state of the economy was last week – is not going to cover the National Party contribution. Frankly, like every other careful observer, I cannot make up ...

PunditBy Brian Easton

1 week ago
Back on Track

This morning I awoke to the lovely news that we are firmly back on track, that is if the scale was reversed.NZ ranks low in global economic comparisonsNew Zealand's economy has been ranked 33rd out of 37 in an international comparison of which have done best in 2024.Economies were ranked ...

Mountain TuiBy Mountain Tūī

1 week ago
Book Review: How Big Things Get Done

This is a guest post by George Weeks, reviewing a book called How Big Things Get Done by Bent Flyvbjerg and Dan Gardner Want to know how to do something big? Ask someone who has done it before! Professor Bent Flyvbjerg has spent his career studying megaprojects. In 2023, ...

Greater AucklandBy Guest Post

1 week ago
Gordon Campbell On Why We Can’t Survive Two More Years Of This

Remember those silent movies where the heroine is tied to the railway tracks or going over the waterfall in a barrel? Finance Minister Nicola Willis seems intent on portraying herself as that damsel in distress. According to Willis, this country’s current economic problems have all been caused by the spending ...

WerewolfBy ScoopEditor

1 week ago
Dragging our way towards the finish line, the end of this year can’t come soon enough for many…

Similar to the cuts and the austerity drive imposed by Ruth Richardson in the 1990’s, an era which to all intents and purposes we’ve largely fiddled around the edges with fixing in the time since – over, to be fair, several administrations – whilst trying our best it seems to ...

exhALANtBy exhalantblog

1 week ago
Handling Democracy.

String-Pulling in the Dark: For the democratic process to be meaningful it must also be public. WITH TRUST AND CONFIDENCE in New Zealand’s politicians and journalists steadily declining, restoring those virtues poses a daunting challenge. Just how daunting is made clear by comparing the way politicians and journalists treated New Zealanders ...

Bowalley Road

1 week ago
Open letter to the Minister of Dwindling Finances

Dear Nicola Willis, thank you for letting us know in so many words that the swingeing austerity hasn't worked.By in so many words I mean the bit where you said, Here is a sea of red ink in which we are drowning after twelve months of savage cost cutting and ...

More Than A FeildingBy David Slack

1 week ago
Open Government: The joke ends

The Open Government Partnership is a multilateral organisation committed to advancing open government. Countries which join are supposed to co-create regular action plans with civil society, committing to making verifiable improvements in transparency, accountability, participation, or technology and innovation for the above. And they're held to account through an Independent ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

1 week ago
An unusual sort of press conference

Today I tuned into something strange: a press conference that didn’t make my stomach churn or the hairs on the back of my neck stand on end. Which was strange, because it was about the torture of children. It was the announcement by Erica Stanford — on her own, unusually ...

Sapphi’s SubstackBy Sapphi

1 week ago
This substack has talked about this government’s seeming corruption & pro-corporate issues...

This is a must watch, and puts on brilliant and practical display the implications and mechanics of fast-track law corruption and weakness.CLICK HERE: LINK TO WATCH VIDEO Our news media as it is set up is simply not equipped to deal with the brazen disinformation and corruption under this right wing ...

Mountain TuiBy Mountain Tūī

1 week ago
NZCTU: Minister needs to listen to the evidence on engineered stone ban

NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi Acting Secretary Erin Polaczuk is welcoming the announcement from Minister of Workplace Relations and Safety Brooke van Velden that she is opening consultation on engineered stone and is calling on her to listen to the evidence and implement a total ban of the product. “We need ...

NZCTUBy Stella Whitfield

1 week ago
Wednesday 18 December

The Government has announced a 1.5% increase in the minimum wage from 1 April 2025, well below forecast inflation of 2.5%. Unions have reacted strongly and denounced it as a real terms cut. PSA and the CTU are opposing a new round of staff cuts at WorkSafe, which they say ...

NZCTUBy Jack McDonald

1 week ago
Can the government change its mind on the ferries?

The decision to unilaterally repudiate the contract for new Cook Strait ferries is beginning to look like one of the stupidest decisions a New Zealand government ever made. While cancelling the ferries and their associated port infrastructure may have made this year's books look good, it means higher costs later, ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

1 week ago
Notes from Afar: Will Luxon Attend Waitangi Day? And Opposition Calls Out Nicola Willis for “C...

Hi there! I’ve been overseas recently, looking after a situation with a family member. So apologies if there any less than focused posts! Vanuatu has just had a significant 7.3 earthquake. Two MFAT staff are unaccounted for with local fatalities.It’s always sad to hear of such things happening.I think of ...

Mountain TuiBy Mountain Tūī

1 week ago
Member’s morning

Today is a special member's morning, scheduled to make up for the government's theft of member's days throughout the year. First up was the first reading of Greg Fleming's Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill, which was passed unanimously. Currently the House is debating the third reading of ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

1 week ago
Going Backwards

We're going backwardsIgnoring the realitiesGoing backwardsAre you counting all the casualties?We are not there yetWhere we need to beWe are still in debtTo our insanitiesSongwriter: Martin Gore Read more ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

1 week ago
Blaming Treasury & Labour, Willis looks for even more Austerity

Willis blamed Treasury for changing its productivity assumptions and Labour’s spending increases since Covid for the worsening Budget outlook. Photo: Getty ImagesMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Wednesday, December 18 in The Kākā’s Dawn Chorus podcast above ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

1 week ago
December-24 AT Board Meeting

Today the Auckland Transport board meet for the last time this year. For those interested (and with time to spare), you can follow along via this MS Teams link from 10am. I’ve taken a quick look through the agenda items to see what I think the most interesting aspects are. ...

Greater AucklandBy Matt L

1 week ago
The Making of a Mental Health Rockstar

Hi,If you’re a New Zealander — you know who Mike King is. He is the face of New Zealand’s battle against mental health problems. He can be loud and brash. He raises, and is entrusted with, a lot of cash. Last year his “I Am Hope” charity reported a revenue ...

David FarrierBy David Farrier

1 week ago
It could have been worse

Probably about the only consolation available from yesterday’s unveiling of the Half-Yearly Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) is that it could have been worse. Though Finance Minister Nicola Willis has tightened the screws on future government spending, she has resisted the calls from hard-line academics, fiscal purists and fiscal hawks ...

PolitikBy Richard Harman

1 week ago
The Deep Divisions of Local Government

The right have a stupid saying that is only occasionally true:When is democracy not democracy? When it hasn’t been voted on.While not true in regards to branches of government such as the judiciary, it’s a philosophy that probably should apply to recently-elected local government councillors. Nevertheless, this concept seemed to ...

Sapphi’s SubstackBy Sapphi

1 week ago
Willis’ austerity strategy just isn’t working

Long story short: the Government’s austerity policy has driven the economy into a deeper and longer recession that means it will have to borrow $20 billion more over the next four years than it expected just six months ago. Treasury’s latest forecasts show the National-ACT-NZ First Government’s fiscal strategy of ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

1 week ago
Sabin 33 #7 – Are solar projects hurting farmers and rural communities?

On November 1, 2024 we announced the publication of 33 rebuttals based on the report "Rebutting 33 False Claims About Solar, Wind, and Electric Vehicles" written by Matthew Eisenson, Jacob Elkin, Andy Fitch, Matthew Ard, Kaya Sittinger & Samuel Lavine and published by the Sabin Center for Climate Change Law at Columbia ...

Skeptical Science

1 week ago
Join us for a pop-up Hoon at 5pm on HYEFU

Come and join myself and CTU Chief Economist for a pop-up ‘Hoon’ webinar on the Government’s Half Yearly Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) with paying subscribers to The Kākā for 30 minutes at 5 pm today.Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream to watch our chat. Don’t worry if ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

1 week ago
‘Ideas Worth Saving’: A Call for Papers

Some years ago, I found myself pondering the power of literature to endure. Or at least the power of some of it to endure, while the rest vanishes in mere decades: https://phuulishfellow.wordpress.com/2019/08/07/look-on-my-works-ye-mighty-and-despair-the-literary-future/. I have similarly had fun with the subject in some of my short stories, such as Another Alexandria ...

A Phuulish FellowBy strda221

1 week ago
Corrections is torturing prisoners again

In 1998, in the wake of the Paremoremo Prison riot, the Department of Corrections established the "Behaviour Management Regime". Prisoners were locked in their cells for 22 or 23 hours a day, with no fresh air, no exercise, no social contact, no entertainment, and in some cases no clothes and ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

1 week ago
HYEFU and BPS data shows New Zealand is way off track

New data released by the Treasury shows that the economic policies of this Government have made things worse in the year since they took office, said NZCTU Economist Craig Renney. “Our fiscal indicators are all heading in the wrong direction – with higher levels of debt, a higher deficit, and ...

NZCTUBy Jack McDonald

1 week ago
“Better economic management”

At the 2023 election, National basically ran on a platform of being better economic managers. So how'd that turn out for us? In just one year, they've fucked us for two full political terms: The government's books are set to remain deeply in the red for the near term ...

No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant

1 week ago
Shameless, clueless

AUSTERITYText within this block will maintain its original spacing when publishedMy spreadsheet insists This pain leads straight to glory (File not found) Read more ...

More Than A FeildingBy David Slack

1 week ago
Minimum wage ‘increase’ is an effective cut

The NZCTU Te Kauae Kaimahi are saying that the Government should do the right thing and deliver minimum wage increases that don’t see workers fall further behind, in response to today’s announcement that the minimum wage will only be increased by 1.5%, well short of forecast inflation. “With inflation forecast ...

NZCTUBy Jack McDonald

1 week ago
Crazy ’bout a Sharp-dressed Man

Oh, I weptFor daysFilled my eyesWith silly tearsOh, yeaBut I don'tCare no moreI don't care ifMy eyes get soreSongwriters: Paul Rodgers / Paul Kossoff. Read more ...

Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel

1 week ago
How much should you worry about a collapse of the Atlantic conveyor belt?

This is a re-post from Yale Climate Connections by Bob Henson In this aerial view, fingers of meltwater flow from the melting Isunnguata Sermia glacier descending from the Greenland Ice Sheet on July 11, 2024, near Kangerlussuaq, Greenland. According to the Programme for Monitoring of the Greenland Ice Sheet (PROMICE), the ...

Skeptical Science

1 week ago
8% ACT Party Creates One Ring To Rule Them All

In August, I wrote an article about David Seymour 1 with a video of his testimony, to warn that there were grave dangers to his Ministry of Regulation:David Seymour's Ministry of Slush Hides Far Greater RisksWhy Seymour's exorbitant waste of taxpayers' money could be the least of concernThe money for Seymour ...

Mountain TuiBy Mountain Tūī

1 week ago
When austerity worsens public debt & cuts GDP

Willis is expected to have to reveal the bitter fiscal fruits of her austerity strategy in the HYEFU later today. Photo: Lynn Grieveson/TheKakaMōrena. Long stories short, the six things that matter in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, climate and poverty on Tuesday, December 17 in The Kākā’s Dawn Chorus podcast ...

The KakaBy Bernard Hickey

1 week ago
Govt to double number of toll roads

On Friday the government announced it would double the number of toll roads in New Zealand as well as make a few other changes to how toll roads are used in the country. The real issue though is not that tolling is being used but the suggestion it will make ...

Greater AucklandBy Matt L

1 week ago
Luxon’s pre-emptive strike

The Prime Minister yesterday engaged in what looked like a pre-emptive strike designed to counter what is likely to be a series of depressing economic statistics expected before the end of the week. He opened his weekly post-Cabinet press conference with a recitation of the Government’s achievements. “It certainly has ...

PolitikBy Richard Harman

1 week ago

National’s Greatest Misses 2023-4

National has only been in power for a year, but everywhere you look, its choices are taking New Zealand a long way backwards. In no particular order, here are the National Government's Top 50 Greatest Misses of its first year in power. ...

Labour Blog

6 days ago
Release: Minister’s plan for tertiary sector a backwards step

Returning to the model that was failing for most polytechnics and Institutes of Technology is not the answer. ...

Labour Blog

6 days ago
Release: National buries 1019 planned homes

It’s been revealed that National has cancelled 60 percent of its housing projects planned before mid-2025 amidst housing woes. ...

Labour Blog

6 days ago
Release: Rule-Czar bill a right-wing power grab

The Government is quietly undertaking consultation on the dangerous Regulatory Standards Bill over the Christmas period to avoid too much attention. ...

Labour Blog

6 days ago
Release: Why not both? Luxon shuns Waitangi celebrations

Prime Minister Christopher Luxon is running away from problems of his own creation, with his decision not to go to Waitangi. ...

Labour Blog

7 days ago
Govt’s ‘free speech’ legislation stokes fear, not freedom

The Government’s planned changes to the freedom of speech obligations of universities is little more than a front for stoking the political fires of disinformation and fear, placing teachers and students in the crosshairs. ...

Greens

7 days ago
Release: Nicola Willis spirals country deeper into recession

The economy shrank 1% this quarter and New Zealand has tumbled into the depths of a recession of Nicola Willis’ making. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Release: Hikes for company directors but not ordinary Kiwis

Working people are going backwards while company directors are being given huge pay hikes. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
ECE no place to cut corners

The Ministry of Regulation’s report into Early Childhood Education (ECE) in Aotearoa raises serious concerns about the possibility of lowering qualification requirements, undermining quality and risking worse outcomes for tamariki, whānau, and kaiako. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Release: Strengthening Justice Services for New Zealanders

A Bill to modernise the role of Justices of the Peace (JP), ensuring they remain active in their communities and connected with other JPs, has been put into the ballot. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Release: Labour will continue fight against destructive projects

Labour will continue to fight unsustainable and destructive projects that are able to leap-frog environment protection under National’s Fast-track Approvals Bill. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Green Government will revoke dodgy fast-track projects

The Green Party has warned that a Green Government will revoke the consents of companies who override environmental protections as part of Fast-Track legislation being passed today. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Government for the wealthy keeps pushing austerity

The Green Party says the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update shows how the Government is failing to address the massive social and infrastructure deficits our country faces. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Release: Visa changes let migrant workers be paid less

The Government’s latest move to reduce the earnings of migrant workers will not only hurt migrants but it will drive down the wages of Kiwi workers. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Release: Nightmare before Christmas for Nicola Willis

With more debt and a larger deficit, Nicola Willis’ reputation is in tatters after her failure to return the Government’s books to surplus. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Warning to Fast-Track Applicants – ‘Exploit the Whenua, Face the Consequences’

Te Pāti Māori has this morning issued a stern warning to Fast-Track applicants with interests in mining, pledging to hold them accountable through retrospective liability and to immediately revoke Fast-Track consents under a future Te Pāti Māori government. This warning comes ahead of today’s third reading of the Fast-Track Approvals ...

Māori Party

1 week ago
Release: Govt cuts wages for lowest paid NZers… again

For the second year running, the government has effectively cut wages for the lowest paid workers in New Zealand. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Govt’s miserly 1.5% minimum wage will take workers backwards

The Government’s announcement today of a 1.5 per cent increase to minimum wage is another blow for workers, with inflation projected to exceed the increase, meaning it’s a real terms pay reduction for many. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Release: Govt shirking responsibility for rate hikes

All the Government has achieved from its announcement today is to continue to push responsibility back on councils for its own lack of action to help bring down skyrocketing rates. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Luxon’s ‘localism’ strikes again

The Government has used its final post-Cabinet press conference of the year to punch down on local government without offering any credible solutions to the issues our councils are facing. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Release: Govt breaks promise on EV chargers

The Government has failed to keep its promise to ‘super charge’ the EV network, delivering just 292 chargers - less than half of the 670 chargers needed to meet its target. ...

Labour Blog

1 week ago
Greens call for end to subsidies for Methanex

The Green Party is calling for the Government to stop subsidising the largest user of the country’s gas supplies, Methanex, following a report highlighting the multi-national’s disproportionate influence on energy prices in Aotearoa. ...

Greens

1 week ago
Govt child poverty targets allow for increase in poverty

The Green Party is appalled with the Government’s new child poverty targets that are based on a new ‘persistent poverty’ measure that could be met even with an increase in child poverty. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Release: Four weeks annual leave under threat

The Government’s attack on workers continues with news it is scrapping work on the Holidays Act. ...

Labour Blog

2 weeks ago
Govt’s emissions plan for measly 1% reduction

New independent analysis has revealed that the Government’s Emissions Reduction Plan (ERP) will reduce emissions by a measly 1 per cent by 2030, failing to set us up for the future and meeting upcoming targets. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Greens stand in solidarity with Whakaata Māori on sad day

The loss of 27 kaimahi at Whakaata Māori and the end of its daily news bulletin is a sad day for Māori media and another step backwards for Te Tiriti o Waitangi justice. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Sanctions regime to create more hardship for families

Yesterday the Government passed cruel legislation through first reading to establish a new beneficiary sanction regime that will ultimately mean more households cannot afford the basic essentials. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Govt gifts renters housing anxiety for Christmas

Today's passing of the Government's Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill–which allows landlords to end tenancies with no reason–ignores the voice of the people and leaves renters in limbo ahead of the festive season. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Release: National Party urged to support modern slavery legislation

Labour is urging the Prime Minister to walk the talk and support legislation combating modern slavery. ...

Labour Blog

2 weeks ago
Release: Labour has lost confidence in the Speaker

The Speaker of the New Zealand Parliament made an unprecedented decision on the government amendment to the Fast Track Approvals Bill last night. ...

Labour Blog

2 weeks ago
One year on, still no progress on new ferries

Today’s announcement from the Government on its plan for new ferries throws more uncertainty on the future of the country’s rail network. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Release: Nicola Willis’ smaller ferries will cost more

After wasting a year, Nicola Willis has delivered a worse deal for the Cook Strait ferries that will end up being more expensive and take longer to arrive. ...

Labour Blog

2 weeks ago
Bill to sanction unlawful occupation of Palestine

Green Party co-leader Chlöe Swarbrick has today launched a Member’s Bill to sanction Israel for its unlawful presence in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, as the All Out For Gaza rally reaches Parliament. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Release: Labour fully supports greyhound racing ban

The Government has done the right thing in moving to ban greyhound racing. ...

Labour Blog

2 weeks ago
Greyhound racing industry ban marks new era for animal welfare

After years of advocacy, the Green Party is very happy to hear the Government has listened to our collective voices and announced the closure of the greyhound racing industry, by 1 August 2026. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Rangatahi voices must be centred in Government’s Relationship and Sexuality Education refresh

In response to a new report from ERO, the Government has acknowledged the urgent need for consistency across the curriculum for Relationship and Sexuality Education (RSE) in schools. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Govt introduces archaic anti-worker legislation

The Green Party is appalled at the Government introducing legislation that will make it easier to penalise workers fighting for better pay and conditions. ...

Greens

2 weeks ago
Winston Peters – Kinleith Mill Speech

Thank you for the invitation to speak with you tonight on behalf of the political party I belong to - which is New Zealand First. As we have heard before this evening the Kinleith Mill is proposing to reduce operations by focusing on pulp and discontinuing “lossmaking paper production”. They say that they are currently consulting on the plan to permanently shut ...

NZ First Press Release

2 weeks ago
Swarbrick calls on Auckland Mayor to end delay of revival of St James Theatre

Auckland Central MP, Chlöe Swarbrick, has written to Mayor Wayne Brown requesting he stop the unnecessary delays on St James Theatre’s restoration. ...

Greens

3 weeks ago
He Ara Anamata: Greens launch Emissions Reduction Plan

Today, the Green Party of Aotearoa proudly unveils its new Emissions Reduction Plan–He Ara Anamata–a blueprint reimagining our collective future. ...

Greens

3 weeks ago

Be wise around water this summer

Kiwis planning a swim or heading out on a boat this summer should remember to stop and think about water safety, Sport & Recreation Minister Chris Bishop and ACC and Associate Transport Minister Matt Doocey say. “New Zealand’s beaches, lakes and rivers are some of the most beautiful in the ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

3 days ago
Drive safely this summer

The Government is urging Kiwis to drive safely this summer and reminding motorists that Police will be out in force to enforce the road rules, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“This time of year can be stressful and result in poor decision-making on our roads. Whether you are travelling to see ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

3 days ago
Internationally-trained doctors jump at chance to boost health workforce

Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says Health New Zealand will move swiftly to support dozens of internationally-trained doctors already in New Zealand on their journey to employment here, after a tripling of sought-after examination places. “The Medical Council has delivered great news for hardworking overseas doctors who want to contribute ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

4 days ago
PM appoints business leader to APEC Business Advisory Council

Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has appointed Sarah Ottrey to the APEC Business Advisory Council (ABAC). “At my first APEC Summit in Lima, I experienced firsthand the role that ABAC plays in guaranteeing political leaders hear the voice of business,” Mr Luxon says. “New Zealand’s ABAC representatives are very well respected and ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
New intelligence oversight appointments

Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has announced four appointments to New Zealand’s intelligence oversight functions. The Honourable Robert Dobson KC has been appointed Chief Commissioner of Intelligence Warrants, and the Honourable Brendan Brown KC has been appointed as a Commissioner of Intelligence Warrants. The appointments of Hon Robert Dobson and Hon ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
New housing developments able to progress more quickly

Improvements in the average time it takes to process survey and title applications means housing developments can progress more quickly, Minister for Land Information Chris Penk says. “The government is resolutely focused on improving the building and construction pipeline,” Mr Penk says. “Applications to issue titles and subdivide land are ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Actions to speed up air travel delivering results

The Government’s measures to reduce airport wait times, and better transparency around flight disruptions is delivering encouraging early results for passengers ahead of the busy summer period, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Improving the efficiency of air travel is a priority for the Government to give passengers a smoother, more reliable ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Ending contracted emergency housing in Rotorua

The Government today announced the intended closure of the Apollo Hotel as Contracted Emergency Housing (CEH) in Rotorua, Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka says. This follows a 30 per cent reduction in the number of households in CEH in Rotorua since National came into Government. “Our focus is on ending CEH in the Whakarewarewa area starting ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Vocational education and training decisions support return to regions

The Government will reshape vocational education and training to return decision making to regions and enable greater industry input into work-based learning Tertiary Education and Skills Minister, Penny Simmonds says. “The redesigned system will better meet the needs of learners, industry, and the economy. It includes re-establishing regional polytechnics that ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Reducing the environmental impact of synthetic refrigerants

The Government is taking action to better manage synthetic refrigerants and reduce emissions caused by greenhouse gases found in heating and cooling products, Environment Minister Penny Simmonds says. “Regulations will be drafted to support a product stewardship scheme for synthetic refrigerants, Ms. Simmonds says. “Synthetic refrigerants are found in a ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Ngāruawāhia section of Waikato Expressway back to 4 lanes for Christmas

People travelling on State Highway 1 north of Hamilton will be relieved that remedial works and safety improvements on the Ngāruawāhia section of the Waikato Expressway were finished today, with all lanes now open to traffic, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“I would like to acknowledge the patience of road users ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

6 days ago
Appointments to the ENZ board

Tertiary Education and Skills Minister, Penny Simmonds, has announced a new appointment to the board of Education New Zealand (ENZ). Dr Erik Lithander has been appointed as a new member of the ENZ board for a three-year term until 30 January 2028. “I would like to welcome Dr Erik Lithander to the ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

7 days ago
Government to celebrate Waitangi Day around NZ

The Government will have senior representatives at Waitangi Day events around the country, including at the Waitangi Treaty Grounds, but next year Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has chosen to take part in celebrations elsewhere. “It has always been my intention to celebrate Waitangi Day around the country with different ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

7 days ago
More gangs added to Gangs Act list

Two more criminal gangs will be subject to the raft of laws passed by the Coalition Government that give Police more powers to disrupt gang activity, and the intimidation they impose in our communities, Police Minister Mark Mitchell says. Following an Order passed by Cabinet, from 3 February 2025 the ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Judicial appointment announced

Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Justice Christian Whata as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Whata’s appointment as a Judge of the Court of Appeal will take effect on 1 August 2025 and fill a vacancy created by the retirement of Hon Justice David Goddard on ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
GDP data highlights importance of growth

The latest economic figures highlight the importance of the steps the Government has taken to restore respect for taxpayers’ money and drive economic growth, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. Data released today by Stats NZ shows Gross Domestic Product fell 1 per cent in the September quarter. “Treasury and most ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Strengthening Free Speech in Universities

Tertiary Education and Skills Minister Penny Simmonds and Associate Minister of Education David Seymour today announced legislation changes to strengthen freedom of speech obligations on universities. “Freedom of speech is fundamental to the concept of academic freedom and there is concern that universities seem to be taking a more risk-averse ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Launch of Emergency Cellular Priority Service

Police Minister, Mark Mitchell, and Internal Affairs Minister, Brooke van Velden, today launched a further Public Safety Network cellular service that alongside last year’s Cellular Roaming roll-out, puts globally-leading cellular communications capability into the hands of our emergency responders. The Public Safety Network’s new Cellular Priority service means Police, Wellington ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Minister reopens Mangamuka Gorge

State Highway 1 through the Mangamuka Gorge has officially reopened today, providing a critical link for Northlanders and offering much-needed relief ahead of the busy summer period, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.“The Mangamuka Gorge is a vital route for Northland, carrying around 1,300 vehicles per day and connecting the Far ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Funding confirmed for second Ashburton Bridge

The Government has welcomed decisions by the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) and Ashburton District Council confirming funding to boost resilience in the Canterbury region, with construction on a second Ashburton Bridge expected to begin in 2026, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Delivering a second Ashburton Bridge to improve resilience and ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Government boosts support for avian influenza response

The Government is backing the response into high pathogenic avian influenza (HPAI) in Otago, Biosecurity Minister Andrew Hoggard says. “Cabinet has approved new funding of $20 million to enable MPI to meet unbudgeted ongoing expenses associated with the H7N6 response including rigorous scientific testing of samples at the enhanced PC3 ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Levelling the playing field for media advertising

Legislation that will repeal all advertising restrictions for broadcasters on Sundays and public holidays has passed through first reading in Parliament today, Media Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “As a growing share of audiences get their news and entertainment from streaming services, these restrictions have become increasingly redundant. New Zealand on ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Inspector-General of Defence appointed

Today the House agreed to Brendan Horsley being appointed Inspector-General of Defence, Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith says. “Mr Horsley’s experience will be invaluable in overseeing the establishment of the new office and its support networks. “He is currently Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, having held that role since June 2020. ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Fire and Emergency New Zealand final levy rates confirmed

Minister of Internal Affairs Brooke van Velden says the Government has agreed to the final regulations for the levy on insurance contracts that will fund Fire and Emergency New Zealand from July 2026. “Earlier this year the Government agreed to a 2.2 percent increase to the rate of levy. Fire ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
More AML relief on the way for Kiwi businesses

The Government is delivering regulatory relief for New Zealand businesses through changes to the Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financing of Terrorism Act. “The Anti-Money Laundering and Countering Financing of Terrorism Amendment Bill, which was introduced today, is the second Bill – the other being the Statutes Amendment Bill - that ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Hawke’s Bay Expressway moving at pace

Transport Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed further progress on the Hawke’s Bay Expressway Road of National Significance (RoNS), with the NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) Board approving funding for the detailed design of Stage 1, paving the way for main works construction to begin in late 2025.“The Government is moving at ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Government seeks partnerships to plant trees on Crown-owned-land

The Government today released a request for information (RFI) to seeking interest in partnerships to plant trees on Crown-owned land with low farming and conservation value (excluding National Parks) Forestry Minister Todd McClay announced. “Planting trees on Crown-owned land will drive economic growth by creating more forestry jobs in our regions, providing more wood ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Wide ranging legislation to make justice system more efficient

Court timeliness, access to justice, and improving the quality of existing regulation are the focus of a series of law changes introduced to Parliament today by Associate Minister of Justice Nicole McKee. The three Bills in the Regulatory Systems (Justice) Amendment Bill package each improve a different part of the ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Diverse skills in community trust appointments

A total of 41 appointments and reappointments have been made to the 12 community trusts around New Zealand that serve their regions, Associate Finance Minister Shane Jones says. “These trusts, and the communities they serve from the Far North to the deep south, will benefit from the rich experience, knowledge, ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Torture redress for survivors of the Lake Alice Unit

The Government has confirmed how it will provide redress to survivors who were tortured at the Lake Alice Psychiatric Hospital Child and Adolescent Unit (the Lake Alice Unit). “The Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care found that many of the 362 children who went through the Lake Alice Unit between 1972 and ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
A busy year in the House

It has been a busy, productive year in the House as the coalition Government works hard to get New Zealand back on track, Leader of the House Chris Bishop says. “This Government promised to rebuild the economy, restore law and order and reduce the cost of living. Our record this ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Consultation opens on working with engineered stone

“Accelerated silicosis is an emerging occupational disease caused by unsafe work such as engineered stone benchtops. I am running a standalone consultation on engineered stone to understand what the industry is currently doing to manage the risks, and whether further regulatory intervention is needed,” says Workplace Relations and Safety Minister ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Greater reporting on Treaty settlement commitments

Mehemea he pai mō te tangata, mahia – if it’s good for the people, get on with it. Enhanced reporting on the public sector’s delivery of Treaty settlement commitments will help improve outcomes for Māori and all New Zealanders, Māori Crown Relations Minister Tama Potaka says. Compiled together for the ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
New appointments to the Charities Registration Board

Mr Roger Holmes Miller and Ms Tarita Hutchinson have been appointed to the Charities Registration Board, Community and Voluntary Sector Minister Louise Upston says. “I would like to welcome the new members joining the Charities Registration Board. “The appointment of Ms Hutchinson and Mr Miller will strengthen the Board’s capacity ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Building consent processing times improve

More building consent and code compliance applications are being processed within the statutory timeframe since the Government required councils to submit quarterly data, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “In the midst of a housing shortage we need to look at every step of the build process for efficiencies ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Faster access to support through Innovation Fund

Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey is proud to announce the first three recipients of the Government’s $10 million Mental Health and Addiction Community Sector Innovation Fund which will enable more Kiwis faster access to mental health and addiction support. “This fund is part of the Government’s commitment to investing in ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
New Zealand to assist Vanuatu on earthquake response

New Zealand is providing Vanuatu assistance following yesterday's devastating earthquake, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. "Vanuatu is a member of our Pacific family and we are supporting it in this time of acute need," Mr Peters says. "Our thoughts are with the people of Vanuatu, and we will be ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Government takes steps to reduce card fees for Kiwis

The Government welcomes the Commerce Commission’s plan to reduce card fees for Kiwis by an estimated $260 million a year, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly says.“The Government is relentlessly focused on reducing the cost of living, so Kiwis can keep more of their hard-earned income and live a ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Review recommends ECE regulation shakeup

Regulation Minister David Seymour has welcomed the Early Childhood Education (ECE) regulatory review report, the first major report from the Ministry for Regulation. The report makes 15 recommendations to modernise and simplify regulations across ECE so services can get on with what they do best – providing safe, high-quality care ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago
Offshore Renewable Energy Bill passes first reading

The Government‘s Offshore Renewable Energy Bill to create a new regulatory regime that will enable firms to construct offshore wind generation has passed its first reading in Parliament, Energy Minister Simeon Brown says.“New Zealand currently does not have a regulatory regime for offshore renewable energy as the previous government failed ...

BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz

1 week ago

Publisher tells of storytelling and its role in shaping Fiji’s identity

By Cheerieann Wilson in Suva Veteran journalist and editor Stanley Simpson has spoken about the enduring power of storytelling and its role in shaping Fiji’s identity. Reflecting on his journey at the launch of FijiNikua, a magazine launched by Prime Minister Sitiveni Rabuka on Christmas Eve, Simpson shared personal anecdotes ...

Evening ReportBy Asia Pacific Report

54 minutes ago
All 29 road tunnels in New Zealand ranked from worst to best

Summer reissue: From the unstable and drippy to the hi-tech and pretty, here’s our ranking of all the tunnels you can drive through in this country. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter ...

The SpinoffBy Group Think

3 hours ago
A life story

Summer reissue: David Hill remembers an old friend, who you’ve probably never heard of. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be a member today. Doug (I’ll call him ...

The SpinoffBy David Hill

5 hours ago
‘The mission is clearly possible’: On watching every single Tom Cruise movie ever made

Summer reissue: I watched all 46 of Tom Cruise’s films over the past 12 months. The question on everyone’s lips: why? The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be ...

The SpinoffBy Caroline Shepherd

8 hours ago
A trip to the beach with the poo detectives

Summer reissue: In recent years, checking online for a green tick has become a necessary habit for Aucklanders heading to the beach. Shanti Mathias tags along with the team tasked with testing the water for pollution – and figuring out how to stop it. The Spinoff needs to double the ...

The SpinoffBy Shanti Mathias

9 hours ago
Who killed the Johnsonville mall?

Summer reissue: After two decades of promised redevelopment, Johnsonville Shopping Centre remains neglected and half empty. Joel MacManus searches for answers in the decaying suburban mall. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter ...

The SpinoffBy Joel MacManus

9 hours ago
Daily crossword, Thursday 26 December

The post Daily crossword, Thursday 26 December appeared first on Newsroom. ...

NewsroomBy Newsroom Puzzles

9 hours ago
Newsroom daily quiz, Thursday 26 December

Loading…(function(i,s,o,g,r,a,m){var ql=document.querySelectorAll('A[data-quiz],DIV[data-quiz]'); if(ql){if(ql.length){for(var k=0;k<ql.length;k++){ql[k].id='quiz-embed-'+k;ql[k].href="javascript:var i=document.getElementById('quiz-embed-"+k+"');try{qz.startQuiz(i)}catch(e){i.start=1;i.style.cursor='wait';i.style.opacity='0.5'};void(0);"}}};i['QP']=r;i[r]=i[r]||function(){(i[r].q=i[r].q||[]).push(arguments)},i[r].l=1*new Date();a=s.createElement(o),m=s.getElementsByTagName(o)[0];a.async=1;a.src=g;m.parentNode.insertBefore(a,m)})(window,document,'script','https://take.quiz-maker.com/3012/CDN/quiz-embed-v1.js','qp');Got a good quiz question? Send Newsroom your questions. .wp-block-newspack-blocks-homepage-articles article .entry-title { font-size: 1.2em; } .wp-block-newspack-blocks-homepage-articles .entry-meta { display: flex; flex-wrap: wrap; align-items: center; margin-top: 0.5em; } .wp-block-newspack-blocks-homepage-articles article .entry-meta { font-size: 0.8em; } .wp-block-newspack-blocks-homepage-articles article .avatar { height: 25px; width: ...

NewsroomBy Newsroom Puzzles

9 hours ago
Digging up dirt in our own wee patch

Comment: I’ve been digging up dirt over the past few weekends. I plan to dig up more over summer.As global geo-politics heats up, I’ve impulsively turned to tending my wee patch of the world. The world is complex and messy. But I’m determined my quarter acre won’t be. Apparently, this is ...

NewsroomBy Jo Cribb

16 hours ago
Seymour takes aim at politics, the media, and economic recovery

Winston Peters was 47 when he founded NZ First. David Seymour is 41. “It’s probably unlikely I’ll still be in Parliament when I’m 47,” he tells Newsroom.“I always said, I have no intention of being a Member of Parliament when I’m 70-something.”In saying that, Seymour has already exceeded his own ...

NewsroomBy Laura Walters

16 hours ago
Gaza Christians pray for end of Israeli war’s ‘death and destruction’

Asia Pacific Report Silent Night is a well-known Christmas carol that tells of a peaceful and silent night in Bethlehem, referring to the first Christmas more than 2000 years ago. It is now 2024, and it was again a silent night in Bethlehem last night, reports Al Jazeera’s Nisa Ibrahim. ...

Evening ReportBy Asia Pacific Report

23 hours ago
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon shares Christmas message

"From our family to yours, we hope you have a very Happy Christmas," Christopher Luxon posted to social media. ...

Radio NZ – political

1 day ago
From dead galaxies to mysterious red dots, here’s what the James Webb telescope has found in just ...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Themiya Nanayakkara, Scientist at the James Webb Australian Data Centre, Swinburne University of Technology Dust in the heart of galaxy NGC628. NASA / ESA / CSA / Judy Schmidt, CC BY On this day three years ago, we witnessed the nail-biting launch ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

1 day ago
Returning to a different New Zealand after 32 years away

Summer resissue: Has the country changed all that much in three decades? Loveni Enari compares his two New Zealands. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be a member ...

The SpinoffBy Loveni S Enari

1 day ago
I survived five hours on Christchurch’s first murder mystery train ride

Summer reissue: Alex Casey goes on a killer journey aboard the Tormore Express. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be a member today. It was a dark and ...

The SpinoffBy Alex Casey

1 day ago
The need for speed: What I learnt competing in an online jigsaw puzzle competition

Summer reissue: Speed puzzling is like a marathon for the mind – intense, demanding, surprisingly exhausting. But does turning it into a sport destroy it as a relaxing pastime? The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read ...

The SpinoffBy Calum Henderson

1 day ago
The complete top 100 NZ TV shows of the 21st Century

Summer reissue: In October, we counted down the top 100 New Zealand TV shows of the 21st century so far (read more about the process here). Here’s the list in full, for your holiday reading pleasure. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue ...

The SpinoffBy The Spinoff's Top 100

1 day ago
The epic inside story of The Spinoff’s first 10 years

Summer reissue: Told in one crucial moment from every year, by The Spinoff’s founder Duncan Greive. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be a member today. 2014: An ...

The SpinoffBy Duncan Greive

1 day ago
Daily crossword, Wednesday 25 December

The post Daily crossword, Wednesday 25 December appeared first on Newsroom. ...

NewsroomBy Newsroom Puzzles

1 day ago
Newsroom daily quiz, Wednesday 25 December

Loading…(function(i,s,o,g,r,a,m){var ql=document.querySelectorAll('A[data-quiz],DIV[data-quiz]'); if(ql){if(ql.length){for(var k=0;k<ql.length;k++){ql[k].id='quiz-embed-'+k;ql[k].href="javascript:var i=document.getElementById('quiz-embed-"+k+"');try{qz.startQuiz(i)}catch(e){i.start=1;i.style.cursor='wait';i.style.opacity='0.5'};void(0);"}}};i['QP']=r;i[r]=i[r]||function(){(i[r].q=i[r].q||[]).push(arguments)},i[r].l=1*new Date();a=s.createElement(o),m=s.getElementsByTagName(o)[0];a.async=1;a.src=g;m.parentNode.insertBefore(a,m)})(window,document,'script','https://take.quiz-maker.com/3012/CDN/quiz-embed-v1.js','qp');Got a good quiz question? Send Newsroom your questions.The post Newsroom daily quiz, Wednesday 25 December appeared first on Newsroom. ...

NewsroomBy Newsroom Puzzles

1 day ago
An AI system has reached human level on a test for ‘general intelligence’. Here’s what that me...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michael Timothy Bennett, PhD Student, School of Computing, Australian National University OLaLa Merkel / Shutterstock A new artificial intelligence (AI) model has just achieved human-level results on a test designed to measure “general intelligence”. On December 20, OpenAI’s o3 system ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
‘Ambitious’ climate claim against Judith Collins dismissed

The Court of Appeal has dismissed Mike Smith’s “ambitious” climate claim against Attorney-General Judith Collins.Smith, a Māori climate activist, and Ngāpuhi and Ngāti Kahu elder, appealed a High Court decision that found his claims against the Crown – that its action on climate change was inadequate – untenable.The Appeal Court’s ...

NewsroomBy David Williams

2 days ago
Trish McKelvey: ‘It’s a big honour, truly humbling’

Trish McKelvey is listed 139 times in the index of the New Zealand women’s cricket tome The Warm Sun On My Face, authored by Trevor Auger and Adrienne Simpson.She wrote the foreword for the book and headlines two chapters addressing crucial events in the evolution of the sport.McKelvey’s appointment as New Zealand ...

NewsroomBy Adam Julian

2 days ago
‘A curse and a blessing’: Ginette McDonald on how Lyn of Tawa changed her life

Summer reissue: The New Zealand comedy legend takes us through her life in television, including the time she hugged Elton John and the unshakeable legacy of a girl named Lyn. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please ...

The SpinoffBy My Life in TV

2 days ago
Making a splash: Is this the most impressive select committee submission ever?

Summer reissue: You really won’t guess how it ends. The Spinoff needs to double the number of paying members we have to continue telling these kinds of stories. Please read our open letter and sign up to be a member today. First published October 4, 2024. Parliament’s Economic Development, Science ...

The SpinoffBy Stewart Sowman-Lund

2 days ago
How to get the kids through a long car trip without screens or losing your mind

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Mary-Rose McLaren, Professor of Teaching and Learning and Head of Program, Early Childhood Education, Victoria University Collin Quinn Lomax/ Shutterstock Some years ago, my daughter was set a maths problem: how much does it cost to drive a family of ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
Keep calm and carry on your routines: how to manage kids’ ‘Christmas crankies’ over the holida...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Catherine E. Wood, Associate Professor and Clinical Psychologist, Swinburne University of Technology Asier Romero/ Shutterstock Christmas is coming, and with it many challenges for parents of young children. You likely have one festive event after another, late nights, party ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
I’ve calculated Santa’s speed on Christmas Eve – and this is what it would do to Rudolph’s n...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Laura Nicole Driessen, Postdoctoral Researcher in Radio Astronomy, University of Sydney Tayla Walsh/Pexels With billions of children around the world anxiously waiting for their presents, Father Christmas (or Santa) and his reindeer must be travelling at breakneck speeds to deliver them ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
How parents can safely navigate their kid’s first sleepover

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Daryl Higgins, Professor & Director, Institute of Child Protection Studies, Australian Catholic University Feeling unsure about your child going to a sleepover is completely normal. You might be worried about how well you know the host family, how they manage supervision or ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
50 years ago, Cyclone Tracy flattened Darwin – and Australia’s attitude to disasters changed for...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Milad Haghani, Senior Lecturer of Urban Risk & Resilience, UNSW Sydney Exactly 50 years ago, on Christmas Eve 1974, Cyclone Tracy struck Darwin and left a trail of devastation. It remains one of the most destructive natural events in Australia’s history. Wind ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
Work or play? The rise of online ‘kidfluencers’ is raising complex legal and ethical questions

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Irmine Keta Rotimi, Doctoral Candidate, Marketing and International Business department, Auckland University of Technology Videos of children opening boxes of toys and playing with them have become a feature of online marketing – making stars out of children as young as two. ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
My dance school is closed for the summer, how can I keep up my fitness?

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Joanna Nicholas, Lecturer in Dance and Performance Science, Edith Cowan University Tatyana Vyc/Shutterstock Once the end-of-year dance concert and term wrap up for the year it is important to take a break. Both physical and mental rest are important and taking ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
The Christmas album that heralded the end of a folk musical era: The Kingston Trio’s The Last Mont...

Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kit MacFarlane, Lecturer, Creative Writing and Literature, University of South Australia Capitol Records For those looking to introduce some musical conflict into the holidays, Bob Dylan’s Christmas in the Heart remains a great choice in its 15th anniversary – like it ...

Evening ReportBy The Conversation

2 days ago
Hopes for 2025: To revitalise Tauranga

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Shane Jones wants coal in his stocking

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Daily crossword, Tuesday 24 December

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NewsroomBy Newsroom Puzzles

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