Open mike 12/08/2020

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, August 12th, 2020 - 175 comments
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Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

175 comments on “Open mike 12/08/2020 ”

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  1. Rosemary McDonald 1
    12 August 2020 at 7:23 am

    Kim's quite rightly asking the question…"Why only three days?"

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/radio

    Chris Hipkin's standing up to the interrogation quite well.

    Face masks likely to be mandatory or Aucklanders.

    Oh, happy days!

  2. ScottGN 2
    12 August 2020 at 7:40 am

    Haha. Kim just said on Morning Report that general tenor of the comments coming through was that the only person listeners like less than Judith Collins was her!

    • Rosemary McDonald 2.1
      12 August 2020 at 8:32 am

      I got the impression she was pulling her punches a tad with the Minister this morning.

      Like the professional she is, the aim was to extract vital information rather than fingernails.

  3. Tiger Mountain 3
    12 August 2020 at 7:41 am

    One could speculate that extreme Nats might have been waiting for the PM’s announcement of further Covid in the community last night. What–no one would be that nasty? They might be that desperate though.

    NZ National Party senior, and Board member, “Merv the perv’s” little talkback performance was just the latest illustration that dirty tricks and born to rule psychology run deep in National ranks.

    Most people will hopefully take the news in stride however, and swing back into action, with a lot higher use of masks this time.

  4. Ad 4
    12 August 2020 at 8:03 am

    Pretty sad state of Democratic campaign that the most important thing they can announce is who the Vice Presidential nomination is.

    And on the other side, seeing preparations for Republican voter suppression through mailing constraints that amounts to a nationwide version of Lyndon Johnson's team hijacking the boxes in his first Texas Senate result (h/t Anthony Caro).

  5. ScottGN 5
    12 August 2020 at 8:04 am

    The Nats have been pretty quick to raise the “delay the election” scenario again. I wonder why?

    • Cinny 5.1
      12 August 2020 at 8:15 am

      Standby for the mail in vote backlash from judith the trump copycat.

      Was listening to judith yesterday and dang she sure is a nasty nasty person. Like I knew she wasn't nice, but crikey I didn't realise how horrid she is.

      • Wensleydale 5.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 11:12 am

        Yeah, she's genuinely unpleasant. Probably the last person you'd want in charge of things during a global pandemic. (Well, her and Billy TK, who is borderline delusional.)

    • tc 5.2
      12 August 2020 at 8:23 am

      My first thoughts on hearing we had an outbreak was that national would make total mischief with it. It was inevitable as covid's still about as per govt/MOH warnings of vigilence etc

      We've an important election, but with an owned media and an opposition full of dirty tricks and no moral compass I do hope kiwi's see them for what they are.

    • Chris T 5.3
      12 August 2020 at 10:58 am

      Would imagine that you can't vote at level 3

      • lprent 5.3.1
        12 August 2020 at 11:31 am

        Would imagine that you can’t vote at level 3

        Lots of advance voting with socially distanced queues and masks, plus the usual votes at old folks homes, plus overseas. There were nearly 1.24 million advance votes in 2017 inside NZ.

        BTW: This isn’t some third world state like the USA that insists on voting on work days without time off and where corrupt republican officials try to reduce voter turnout by making sure there aren’t enough voting places and allow lines that are kilometers long and take hours to get to vote.

        You really should take more of an interest in our democracy – it will amaze you just how efficient the process is.

        • I Feel Love 5.3.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 12:39 pm

          jeez if RWs want Labour to govern for longer just vote for them.

        • Chris T 5.3.1.2
          12 August 2020 at 1:35 pm

          I am not the one comparing it to the US and I don't want a govt decided by 1.24 mill votes.

          It was bad enough last time when it was just one.

        • McFlock 5.3.1.3
          12 August 2020 at 3:28 pm

          The electoral commission has been planning for it, as one would expect.

          Wasn't the contingency planning around the election one of the things that pissed the nats off a while back?

  6. Robert Guyton 6
    12 August 2020 at 8:20 am

    "Borders closed until 2022?" worries Pete George, who goes on to say,

    "I don’t think anyone can predict how long our borders will be closed…",

    despite just having had a punt at it himself.

    Pete's rattled. So much so that he's happy to imply that the Prime Minister is a liar;

    "Ardern says she was first notified at 4pm yesterday. The first positive test result at least must have been known well before then. So why was she only notified then (if she is being honest with us)?" (my bold).

    • Incognito 6.1
      12 August 2020 at 8:24 am

      Pete’s channelling his inner Gerry.

      • Robert Guyton 6.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 8:34 am

        There's a woodwork teacher inside of each and every one of us?

        I just hope there isn't an arch-eyebrowed Judith as well! It'd be like a Fellini movie in there!

    • lprent 6.2
      12 August 2020 at 11:38 am

      Ardern says she was first notified at 4pm yesterday. The first positive test result at least must have been known well before then. So why was she only notified then…

      FFS: She was notified after Bloomfield. He was notified after there was a second positive result. There is a reasonably high risk of a false positive in most medical tests. That is why they run confirmation tests.

      This appears to be particularly the case with the covid-19 tests because they tend to get triggered by fragments of other corona viruses like the one in the common cold – that most people carry even when they aren't sick.

      • stunned mullet 6.2.1
        12 August 2020 at 1:45 pm

        'There is a reasonably high risk of a false positive in most medical tests. That is why they run confirmation tests.'

        No that is incorrect, the majority of medical tests have a very small risk of false positivity with most the risk is bordering on the insignificant.

        There is certainly a risk of false positivity in PCR testing for COVID19 that is higher than the very low level of false positive testing in most other medical tests.

        • Incognito 6.2.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 1:53 pm

          You must know the false positive rate of the PCR test used in NZ to detect Covid-19. Why don’t you share your knowledge with us here on TS and make a useful contribution?

          • Stunned Mullet 6.2.1.1.1
            12 August 2020 at 3:19 pm

            Use google incognito, I'm sure you have requisite computer skills.

            • Incognito 6.2.1.1.1.1
              12 August 2020 at 3:23 pm

              You offered your personal knowledge but forgot to include the info. Helpful as ever 🙁

              • Stunned Mullet …
                12 August 2020 at 4:01 pm

                Just like lprent ……….guess your opprobrium doesn't extend to him.

                • Incognito …
                  12 August 2020 at 4:26 pm

                  Ah, I see the whataboutery false equivalence pathetic response being wheeled out again.

                  Why do some commenters feel it is too hard to make a useful contribution here, ever so small or brief, yet don’t blink an eyelid or raise an eyebrow posting innumerous vacuous comments?

          • Stuart Munro 6.2.1.1.2
            12 August 2020 at 7:05 pm

            Forgive the intrusion, but this link gives false negative rates (between 2 & 29%), and might address the issue to some extent.

        • Tricledrown 6.2.1.2
          12 August 2020 at 5:56 pm

          Stunned Mullet what a load of Trump tosh.

  7. ScottGN 7
    12 August 2020 at 8:23 am

    Biden has picked Kamala Harris.

  8. Fireblade 8
    12 August 2020 at 8:38 am

    The mobile version is not working and the desktop version (on my mobile) shows zero comments.

    • swordfish 8.1
      12 August 2020 at 9:09 am

      Yep … “No Comments” for every post.

      • lprent 8.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 10:43 am

        That one is just odd. I reverted back from WordPress 5.5 to 5.4.2 – which should have fixed it. But it hasn't.

        Mutter… mutter.. Might have to live with that for the day.

    • lprent 8.2
      12 August 2020 at 10:42 am

      Mobile version should now be back to normal. The CDN broke the CSS.

      I'll have a look at that next time I have some time.

  9. roblogic 9
    12 August 2020 at 8:40 am

    That conspiracy nutjob Billy TK (NZPP) is off his rocker, trying to plan a big protest.

    And it looks like the New Conservative party is trying to join the fuckwittery

    https://twitter.com/publicaddress/status/1293144374579060736?s=20

    https://twitter.com/byroncclark/status/1293269331434827776?s=20

    • Robert Guyton 9.1
      12 August 2020 at 8:47 am

      "Our leader, Leighton Baker, on the latest lockdown replete with undemocratic process.”

      "This is crazy stuff. It's ridiculous!".

      Yep.

    • Robert Guyton 9.2
      12 August 2020 at 8:48 am

      Best question from Mike Will:

      "What goes through the minds of these people when there is a total eclipse?"

  10. I Feel Love 10
    12 August 2020 at 8:43 am

    formatting on mobile screwed up

  11. Rosemary McDonald 11
    12 August 2020 at 8:53 am

    While Draco T Bastard and Greywarshark are plotting the the cull… https://thestandard.org.nz/daily-review-11-08-2020/#comment-1739987

    top journalist celebrates…

    https://twitter.com/kirsty_johnston/status/1293094085054488576

    I’m tempted to pay Stuff some $$$.

    • greywarshark 11.1
      12 August 2020 at 11:22 am

      Rosemary – what has that item about jobs got to do with keeping people who can't do more than a brain-damaged baby alive? Who can't ever have a clear thought, feed themselves, understand anything, control themselves to do simple stuff, are destructive and sometimes violent.

      You are afraid of the possibility of disabled people not being respected for what they are, and not receiving the support that enables and facilitates their lives. I am thinking about people being allowed to die when they have no existence or awareness left for them, if they have no volition or when they wish especially if there is no-one who will adequately look after them.

      When the person is loved and cared for it is a different matter; they are bonded with that person. Hinewehi Mohi tells how she managed to raise her daughter with cerebral palsy in this news report from 2013:

      Twelve Questions: Hinewehi Mohi – https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11112205

      And this is about her music therapy for disabled and an award ceremony which her now adult daughter was able to attend (in the video clip). https://www.nzherald.co.nz/hawkes-bay-today/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503462&objectid=12267202

      This is one philosopher's thoughts on what should be possible for parents of disabled babies which have been rejected by the disabled community. 2020 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/feb/19/peter-singer-event-cancelled-in-new-zealand-after-outcry-over-disability-stance

      With older people, a nurse who has spent time in a secure unit for dementia patients described it to me as awful and dangerous as you can be violently attacked. The patients sound like zombies, stumbling around clawing at the doorlock mechanism.

      We have to face these unpleasant issues occurring in our own locations. We can't just ignore them as we do people suffering overseas – everywhere in the world is suffering from harsh and avoidable problems, and that continues with Covid-19 an addition.

      Very damaged people and those decayed at the end of life are suffering from an unavoidable problem, when the brain and body are too far gone there is no life possible for them that can be lived and enjoyed. So Rosemary be glad that you live in a country that will do stuff for you, be grateful as we all should be. Don't spend all your time trying to villify anyone who speaks reality, and an ethical process for ending such lives.

      • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 11:45 am

        Who can't ever have a clear thought, feed themselves, understand anything,

        Thanks Greywarshark, you make this sooo easy!

        How do you know they don't ever have a clear thought? They don't understand anything?

        And as for feeding themselves…all human infants would be culled if that is your measure.

        ….control themselves to do simple stuff, are destructive and sometimes violent.

        So…I'll repeat the question my partner just asked your mate DTB. What about recidivist offenders…the violent, those with seemingly no control?

        Not so very long ago kids like Chloe would have spent their entire lives in an institution…often with little or no social interaction or mental stimulation. All your evaluations of Ryan would have been applied to many of these children. You have no idea, do you? As I said last night…luckily for you and your ilk most kids with Down Syndrome are terminated these days. The parents who choose to allow life most often treat the child like any other…and in many cases these kids thrive. No-one knows how these children are going to develop…and with the right interventions and supports most can do 'better'.

        Sadly, here in NZ, people like you are in the majority and keep voting in wankery governments that fail term after term to fund proper supports.

        a nurse who has spent time in a secure unit for dementia patients described it to me as awful and dangerous as you can be violently attacked.

        I spent two years, and nine months of my second pregnancy working night shift in such a unit. And yes…can be a challenge, no doubt about that. One does try to remember that these are fellow humans who had real lives and families and fuck me…I'd hope when I'm sundowning and drooling in my soup some other low aid carer might remember that too.

        But you won't have to worry about that will you? You'll get your EOLC Bill passed and all will be well.

        • Molly 11.1.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 2:04 pm

          Hi Rosemary, sorry about the belated tautoko for your reply to DTB and grey. I saw the original comment while on the phone, and was reassured to see your reply.

          This abitrary judging of life is problematic and damaging.

          The value of a life is not able to be quantified in physical or mental fitness. In fact, many of the more atrocious and appalling acts of humankind were most likely implemented by the "fittest" amongst us.

          Such a limited way of thinking, that discards life and the values and gifts that can be provided in many forms.

          I'm disappointed to read such ideas on this blog, and despair that financial quantifying is offered up as a reason.

          • Rosemary McDonald 11.1.1.1.1
            12 August 2020 at 2:38 pm

            Kei te pai, Molly. Appreciated…smiley

            I'm disappointed to read such ideas on this blog, and despair that financial quantifying is offered up as a reason.

            Yes, the New Left. Gotta love 'em.

            Probably the most heartbreaking aspect is that two commenters can explicitly call for the elimination of a particular class of human and it raises not a ripple of interest from the individuals here inclined to cry "Hate Speech!"

            Sadly, last time I checked our Human Rights legislation omits disability as grounds for a claim of discrimination.

            • gsays 11.1.1.1.1.1
              12 August 2020 at 4:48 pm

              Well done from me too, Rosemary.

              I would not be too sure about the ELOC passing in the referendum.

        • I Feel Love 11.1.1.2
          12 August 2020 at 2:42 pm

          I support your comments and experience Rosemary. Amazing in my lifetime (I'm mid 40s) people who were paraplegic were put in those institutions where they'd lie on their backs in these large cubby holes, & look at the world through a mirror above them. For years! Lifetimes.

          • greywarshark 11.1.1.2.1
            12 August 2020 at 7:34 pm

            I hope all you people who are so strong that every baby lives, actually back up your principles by supporting those damaged people with such limited lives. Talk the talk and walk the walk or you are empty vessels.

      • Gabby 11.1.2
        12 August 2020 at 8:47 pm

        Who said life had to be enjoyed?

  12. swordfish 12
    12 August 2020 at 8:56 am

    .
    A Few Random Reckons

    Guessing it'll be significantly more than 3 days (indeed may have been a little white lie by the Govt to soften the blow).

    Presumably a few Aucklanders have assumed the same … hence the brief Supermarket Panic-buying deja vu … wonder if we'll see another toilet paper frenzy with fist-fights breaking out in the Household Cleaners, Personal Hygiene & Toiletries isle?

    And wondering if it's already spread elsewhere .. even if in dribs & drabs …

    … 2 Christchurch retirement villages in partial lockdown after residents began displaying signs of respiratory illness (maybe COVID, maybe not)

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/300079635/two-christchurch-retirement-villages-in-partial-lockdown-after-residents-swabbed-for-covid19

    Postponement of the Election would not entirely surprise me.

  13. dv 13
    12 August 2020 at 9:02 am

    Lets not forget the Natz solutions to the pandemic

    Tax cuts

    Burn the redulations

    Open border with Australia

    • I Feel Love 13.1
      12 August 2020 at 2:45 pm

      you forgot "ban gang patches" & to have stickers on our cars to let others know if we're insured or not.

  14. Adrian Thornton 14
    12 August 2020 at 9:17 am

    How The Guardian Betrayed Corbyn and the Vestiges of British Democracy

    https://consortiumnews.com/2020/08/11/how-the-guardian-betrayed-corbyn-and-the-vestiges-of-british-democracy/

    • Byd0nz 14.1
      12 August 2020 at 10:45 am

      The clue is British Democrasy. There is none. Money systems dont do it.

      • Draco T Bastard 14.1.1
        13 August 2020 at 3:23 am

        I seem to recall similar happening here when David Cunliffe was leader of NZ Labour. In both cases the grass roots voted in the leader that they wanted and many MPs and other leaders of the parties cut them down.

        We actually see this across the world in representative democracies. The rich do not want the people to actually have power. Actual democracy would go against them and they know it. When a politician says that someone has to make the hard decisions what they really mean is that they're going to do something that will be bad for the majority of people, that the majority of people don't want them to do but that the rich want and so it will be done anyway.

        • Andre 14.1.1.1
          13 August 2020 at 5:37 am

          You're making the mistake of thinking that "grass roots" party members are in any way representative of the general public. Or even the smallish segment of the general public that's vaguely interested in politics.

          Political party members tend to skew towards obsessives with just a limited range of topics they have strong feelings about. Which makes them poor judges of what appeals to the general public. Particularly after they gather themselves into echo chambers.

          • Draco T Bastard 14.1.1.1.1
            13 August 2020 at 4:01 pm

            You're making the mistake of thinking that "grass roots" party members are in any way representative of the general public.

            No I'm not because it doesn't matter. The majority of the party wanted those people as their party's leader. People in power were frightened by this and so took actions to remove them.

            Political party members tend to skew towards obsessives with just a limited range of topics they have strong feelings about. Which makes them poor judges of what appeals to the general public.

            Again, it doesn't matter. The grass roots of the party were voting for who they wanted not whom was more acceptable to the general public in the eyes of some petty bourgeoise.

    • tc 14.2
      12 August 2020 at 11:01 am

      Former CEO of guardian group now Premier league CEO. The club's working nicely.

  15. Reality 15
    12 August 2020 at 9:28 am

    Nats also want thousands of international students here so those private education outfits and Auckland University can make money. Hope the more people hear and see Collins they will be even more appalled by her viciousness.

    • Chris T 15.1
      12 August 2020 at 9:36 am

      Think you are confusing make money, with going broke, and having to lay-off half their staff.

      Maybe you should talk to Chippy about his expectations on them still having to make a profit or being taken over by him, which would be a very bad thing.

      • Drowsy M. Kram 15.1.1
        13 August 2020 at 2:32 am

        If the University of Auckland have "to lay off half their staff" because they can't access international students, then the university council has chosen a seriously unsustainable business model. The free market giveth, and Covid taketh away, but don't expect 'our' universities to change their neoliberal ways.

        "The university’s press release on Tuesday packages the slashing of jobs and the reduction of courses as part of a vision, as astigmatic as it might have been. The point being made here is that such reductions were always on the table, factored and measured. There was a “redesign” of the university’s “course architecture”, one designed to “remove much of the complexity” of what was being offered. This is crude code for job cuts, staff losses and, as is the norm, the continued thriving of the vampiric handlers at the top end of the management spectrum. They won’t be offering their heads on the platter of accountability any time too soon."
        https://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL2003/S00100/coronavirus-offerings-and-job-losses-university-reliance-on-china-bites.htm

  16. tc 16
    12 August 2020 at 9:30 am

    Guardians not been that flash over Oz covid either throwing their quarantine regime under the bus.

    Community transmission (6 suburbs) that ozzy don't give a F, I'm all right Jack and an ineffective lockdown seem much bigger issues.

  17. Pat 17
    12 August 2020 at 9:33 am

    “The people we represent don’t give a fuck if we are crude or brutal. In fact, they rather expect it!”

    https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2020/08/12/the-childish-brutality-of-the-national-party/

    Say no more

  18. weka 18
    12 August 2020 at 10:03 am

    Lynn, replies not working for me in this thread either. MacOS Catalina, Firefox.

  19. weka 19
    12 August 2020 at 10:04 am

    nor Safari MacOS

  20. UncookedSelachimorpha 20
    12 August 2020 at 10:13 am

    "No Comments" on all posts and unable to reply. Firefox 68.11.0esr on Windows 10.

  21. Draco T Bastard 21
    12 August 2020 at 10:27 am

    Broken on Firefox 79.0 (64bit) running on Windows as well.

    And I can't do replies either.

  22. Herodotus 22
    12 August 2020 at 10:37 am

    $2 per disposable mask at Supermarket or chemist, and it is already impossible to find any that are longer lasting – How are families under financial pressure suppose to survive?And what should Friday be extended – both the cost and the availability of masks.
    And then you have the environmental aspect to deal with.

  23. Ffloyd 23
    12 August 2020 at 10:44 am

    Judith Collins is a bat out of hell. Huge headlines spitting venom. It’s ALL Jacindas fault for letting Covid back in through the borders. I thought the latest ones were community transmission? Anyway. Let’s politicise the hell out of this says Judith. Bet she’s hoping for a few more deaths to validate her claims of disarray and shambolic mismanagement.

    And, she’s not only a thoroughly nasty person but she is also a FRUMP. Doesn’t matter how she dresses she still looks like a frumpy old bag lady.

    • tc 23.1
      12 August 2020 at 10:59 am

      Those billboards with punch n judy looks like a vote for the bowling club party tbh.

    • weka 23.2
      12 August 2020 at 11:13 am

      you dishonour frumpy old bag ladies, who could probably teach Collins a thing or two about being human.

    • Wensleydale 23.3
      12 August 2020 at 11:22 am

      She'd love nothing more than for this to explode because it's the only way she stands a chance of winning. People need to die, the plague needs to spread, and Judith will be cackling with malevolent glee throughout it all and snarling, "Yes! Everything's going according to plan!" Her strategy is essentially to stoke fear and apportion blame. "The country's falling sideways off a cliff, and it's all Ardern's fault!"

      Keep calm and carry on, New Zealand. We did it once, we can do it again.

      • I Feel Love 23.3.1
        12 August 2020 at 2:47 pm

        even were it to spread, will people really think Collins in the answer? She's sounding like someone totally out of control, she's not very reassuring at all.

  24. lprent 24
    12 August 2020 at 10:48 am

    Reverted to WordPress 5.4.2 which fixed the reply. Fixed some cache issues in the mobile version that were breaking CSS and Javascript.

    The comment count is still outstanding (and really odd). I'll try for a reboot on the database – but I suspect I will have to fix that later in the day.

    • Draco T Bastard 24.1
      12 August 2020 at 10:58 am

      ATM, I got yesterday's daily review showing One Comment, today's Open Mike showing 12 (there's at least 24) and Biden Harris now showing three.

      Seems it may have started counting again after the revert.

    • lprent 24.2
      12 August 2020 at 11:03 am

      Fixed the comments count. I had a filter in to check for the number of trackbacks and ping backs to remove them from the count. It looks like there was a change to the field that it was discriminating on.

      Fixed. It will now be slightly high if a trackback or pingback is in a post. But I will fix that later.

  25. Herodotus 25
    12 August 2020 at 10:57 am

    Something a little less heavy !! to enjoy especially if you agree with SNL and the "More Cow Bell" sketch. Love the guitar solo, Great Canadian band.



  26. Tiger Mountain 26
    12 August 2020 at 11:19 am

    Dissolution of Parliament has been deferred it seems, going by the PM’s statement this morning. That decision may be regretted sooner rather than later, as the move is on from National to push back the General Election date.

    • SPC 26.1
      12 August 2020 at 11:24 am

      Deferred to next Monday .

      The election will be delayed a month. There will be a month at Level 3 nationwide – they willl have no choice. Collins will have a month in the Bridges committee role.

      • Robert Guyton 26.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 11:53 am

        Unless the outbreak is quickly contained.

        • Incognito 26.1.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 12:06 pm

          To ascertain that takes time, about 14 days.

          • stunned mullet 26.1.1.1.1
            12 August 2020 at 12:14 pm

            Not if the MoH has contact tracing capabilities in place that they should have.

            • Incognito 26.1.1.1.1.1
              12 August 2020 at 12:24 pm

              Have they identified the source of community infection yet? The MoH contact tracing capabilities and capacity were improved and met the criteria after the scathing report of the audit by Dr Ayesha Verrall.

              • stunned mullet …
                12 August 2020 at 12:32 pm

                Have they identified the source of community infection yet?

                Close but no cigar, expect the most likely source to be identified by Friday once the suspect source personnel are tested through today/tomorrow and results returned.

                The most disappointing aspect is there appears to have been little testing amongst personnel involved in the return and isolation of inbound passengers at Auckland airport.

                • Herodotus …
                  12 August 2020 at 12:44 pm

                  We are assuming that it was brought in recently – That may not be the case

                  What if the covid 19 has been present but spread by asymptomtic- Then we could be in for an extended lock down and over a wider area of the country.

                  https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/08/10/asymptomatic

                • Poission …
                  12 August 2020 at 12:46 pm

                  Suspicions from the MOH is that the leakage is from a quarantine facility,and testing of ALL staff at the facilities is to be undertaken.

                  As the extent of the spread is unknown,there are a number of other issues that need to be addressed such as immediate border closure (due to limitations in both quarantine facilities and the availability of ICU beds) and a north /south transport suspension of human cargo.

    • PaddyOT 26.2
      12 August 2020 at 11:51 am

      A longer stretch of pain listening to campaigns but may have it's plus side with Judith running out of "fake news". Incredibly irresponsible to public safety, how she's deemed herself an essential worker, flouted her level 3 travel ban to get in front of camera's in Wellington.

      And this dick Bridges suffering from losing limelight too as a disgusting first response.

      " Let’s be honest about how problematic a 19 Sept election in under 40 days is. I’ve just cancelled public meetings and a lot of volunteers doorknocking. Meanwhile, Labour, while suspending campaigning, continues with all machinery of Govt and thus the power of the airwaves." (Twitter Simon Bridges)

      The media no less appaling in lack of resposibility in giving space to politicising other's fears.

      • Incognito 26.2.1
        12 August 2020 at 12:05 pm

        Arguably, the Leader of the Labour Party is at more of a disadvantage than the quasi-Leader of the National Party. One is looking after a strong team of five million while the other one is herding a ragtag of fifty-odd MPs, give or take a few who jumped the sinking ship, and Merv.

      • observer 26.2.2
        12 August 2020 at 12:29 pm

        It's all brilliant chess from Ardern. wink

        Get the opposition to demand that the government doesn't face the voters. She can keep announcing new election dates, then … oh dear, another case.

        It's rare – and bizarre – for a government to stay in power because the opposition desperately want them to, but that's what National have been reduced to.

        • I Feel Love 26.2.2.1
          12 August 2020 at 2:50 pm

          Yes, there's a huge call out from RWs all over to extend the current govts term, crazy times. Utter panic.

  27. Red 27
    12 August 2020 at 12:59 pm

    I now understand labour’s election slogan

    ”let’s get moving” back into lockdown

    [Still trolling? This is your second warning – Incognito]

    • observer 27.1
      12 August 2020 at 1:05 pm

      With such sparkling wit, you must be descended from Oscar Wilde and Dorothy Parker.

    • Incognito 27.2
      12 August 2020 at 1:05 pm

      See my Moderation note @ 12:59 PM.

      • Red 27.2.1
        12 August 2020 at 1:24 pm

        Having a bit of fun, not trying to start a flame war, is it trolling to go against the prevailing narrative with a bit of humour

        will stop if upsetting

        • Robert Guyton 27.2.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 1:32 pm

          "will stop if upsetting"

          Appreciated, thanks.

        • Incognito 27.2.1.2
          12 August 2020 at 1:36 pm

          I was just about to give your third strike warning and a short-sharp ban, which I’ve deleted (for now). What you consider as ‘humour against the prevailing narrative’, I see as stupid trolling and repeating your past behaviour. You may have to explain what you mean by “the prevailing narrative”. I was convinced I will save Moderators much time by banning you until after the election at least but you now you show your kind side; make it work!

          • Robert Guyton 27.2.1.2.1
            12 August 2020 at 1:41 pm

            Red is trolling, no question. Plus, boring. Red might be kind, until you're off-duty…

          • Red 27.2.1.2.2
            12 August 2020 at 1:45 pm

            Done,

            my sense of prevailing narrative is that no one really wants to talk about government accountability here , more so how can we externalise failure here and project on the opposition

            Joking I thought maybe a less harsh and in your face approach

            • Incognito 27.2.1.2.2.1
              12 August 2020 at 1:58 pm

              If you frame it that way, it becomes a false dichotomy and not conducive to good faith discourse here. That’s what you’re doing and I think you’re doing it deliberately, as you were doing in the past.

              For now, I’ve given you the benefit of a tiny amount of doubt. You can build up your ‘credit’ here, if you choose so.

    • solkta 27.3
      12 August 2020 at 1:08 pm

      You are obviously too thick to even quote their election slogan correctly.

  28. Graeme 28
    12 August 2020 at 1:18 pm

    Well one positive of this renewed outbreak is that customers are scanning the tracking code and sanitising as they come in the gallery. Since we opened after lockdown the compliance has been effectively zero, less than 1%.
    Today, 100%. And it’s quite busy for a change. Everyone’s got their phones in hand and ready. Even noticing people turning away from shops that aren’t displaying codes

  29. ianmac 29
    12 August 2020 at 2:16 pm

    If the Government and helpers manage to quickly contain/identify the out break, this would shower praise for the efficiency on the Government and shower sparks from Judith, especially as she is the one who sets out to politicise the outbreak.

    • Red 29.1
      12 August 2020 at 2:23 pm

      I agree if Government can close this down in a week, all kudos to them and election is over rover. I however don’t think virus will accomodate this chain of events I also think Government have really failed at the border. Tough I know but their planning, risk mitigation, resources etc has not being enough. Is this Jacinda direct fault, no, but the buck stops with her 250k of Aucklanders that where working yesterday, are not today, let alone the impact on business, both big and small. It’s simply not good enough and what aboutism and we are doing better than others does not cut it

      • Robert Guyton 29.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 2:25 pm

        "Is this Jacinda (sic) direct fault, no, but the buck stops with her "

        There ya go, Incognito. Red's resigned.

      • Incognito 29.1.2
        12 August 2020 at 2:45 pm

        Can you please make your point in a clearly articulated way that’s intelligible so that we can turn your monologue into a robust debate here? For example, how do we move forward from L2/3 into next week? What needs to be done to go down to L1 and when? Et cetera. As it stands, you sound like JC’s speech notes for the next meeting of the local Merv Fan Club.

        • Red 29.1.2.1
          12 August 2020 at 2:53 pm

          The only way we move down alert levels is if

          source of infection is found next 3 days

          very few new cases arise and it can be ring fenced as a cluster

          This I suggest won’t happen , so it will be level 4 or level 4.1 ( ie a few more things open re learning from last lock down ) next week for 4 weeks at least

          Above is assuming elimination remains the strategy, this should be contested at least

          i won’t post any more, to many sensitive souls No hard feelings 😊

          • Incognito 29.1.2.1.1
            12 August 2020 at 2:59 pm

            You seem confused about what triggers L4 (whatever L4.1 is?).

            Just as well that you “won’t post any more” for the next 3 days and “next week for 4 weeks at least”.

            • Red 29.1.2.1.1.1
              12 August 2020 at 3:08 pm

              breaking my rule Incognito but just to answer your question

              L4, is Alert level 4, 4.1 is simply if we go to 4 I think they will fine tune the rules based on the last lock down

              Was that really that difficult to interpret and a need for me to spell it out, especially In context of the discussion

              • Incognito …
                12 August 2020 at 3:18 pm

                Yes, you’re making up things “only when it suits you”. There is no L4.1, there won’t be an L4.1, L4.1 would be more severe than L4, as it is not a version number but a grading number of severity (of health risk).

                No more rule breaking or you will experience Ban B4.1.

                • Red …
                  12 August 2020 at 3:34 pm

                  Ok where splitting hairs

                  A lotto ticket that if we go to alert level 4 the rules under as such will be slightly different than when we where previously in alert level 4

                  using 4.1 is like Web 2.0, It doesn’t really exist but helps to highlight a point I think you are being overly harsh here re “making stuff up”

                  • McFlock …
                    12 August 2020 at 3:50 pm

                    you're betting that government requirements have changed due to new information analysed in the last few months?

                    Obviously the nats aren't in power. They'd just announce more roads.

                  • Muttonbird …
                    12 August 2020 at 3:52 pm

                    Red backwards spells der.

                  • Incognito …
                    12 August 2020 at 10:59 pm

                    Yup, you’re making stuff up all the time. You also don’t know the difference between chronology and hierarchy. Placing bets on things getting worse is just sick, IMHO.

        • ianmac 29.1.2.2
          12 August 2020 at 4:01 pm

          There are promising signs of finding the source. I think that the 50 year old male working in the Cool Store near Auckland Airport had been off sick for over a week. He worked in an office. That part would be trackable.

          The woman visiting Rotorua was visiting tourist sites but not in close contact.

          Don't trust my memory and maybe it is my friendly optimism writing.

          • Incognito 29.1.2.2.1
            12 August 2020 at 4:33 pm

            Ta

            Finding the source and neutralising the spread by isolating all close contacts ASAP. Then test, test, and test and wait keeping fingers, arms, legs, and toes crossed.

    • Robert Guyton 29.2
      12 August 2020 at 2:23 pm

      Sparks? Derision, more likely.

  30. PaddyOT 30
    12 August 2020 at 2:59 pm

    National party campaign launch conference agenda -:

    THEME :- NATZ- A BEING IN SEARCH OF MEANING.( sorry Plato)

    * Apologies: None, we didn't do
    anything !

    * Debate sesh: "My superiority
    complex is better than yours. "

    *Guest Speaker. Merv on " The
    silence of wearing slippers for
    an ambush."

    * Economy protection and Covid
    response . More Property buying
    sesh.
    https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2019/05/the-number-of-properties-owned-by-mps-revealed.html

    * Tin foil hat making so the
    Academics can't scan your brain.
    (personal preference for the 2nd model )
    https://youtu.be/PS8dNzRhMgk

    * Learning sign language
    https://www.adl.org/hate-symbols?cat_id%5B153%5D=153*

    * Rote mantra classes to memorize
    our "facts". Repeat after me,
    'Jacinda's on my Shitlist'. Again!

    * Using I.T. How to use secret
    modes for dummies. Practical
    sesh sending pics.

    CLOSING ADDRESS from our hero.

    "What you’re seeing and what you’re reading is not what’s happening."
    " I think if this country gets any kinder or gentler, it's literally going to cease to exist." To be blunt, people would vote for me. They just would. Why? Maybe because I'm so ….the best at freaking everything!"

    PARTY ANTHEM SING ALONG.

    https://youtu.be/_MLBfwblps8
    Hoochie Coochie Chuck Berry , "I want you to play with My Ding a ling."

    ( sick bags needed for the sketch artist in video)

  31. Tiger Mountain 31
    12 August 2020 at 3:14 pm

    Dirty filthy Nats want Election shifted to next year! (J. Collins on Nat Radio just after 3pm).

    This Govt. has made a significant tactical mistake by not dissolving Parliament right on schedule–and it may bite them and most of us ordinary citizens if they don’t get their act together immediately. Unecessary appeasement is one of the worst political crimes–particularly with another poll (UMR) out with Nats on 28%! and Labour still over 50%, again.

    • PaddyOT 31.1
      12 August 2020 at 3:48 pm

      30 minutes to make a 1 point press conference

      'Transparency , you're so into transparency Judith.

      Masks?

      Social distancing yes, but after Judith spat her venom, Jerry upped and put his hands on the podium.

      Poor Redunant Reti , GP sad Ashley didn't talk to him.

  32. Anker 32
    12 August 2020 at 3:37 pm

    Anyone got the latest umm poll results? It’s on the heralds website, but paywalled

  33. Muttonbird 33
    12 August 2020 at 4:22 pm

    Seen some support for the infected family but apparently the Americold worker had been off work sick for 9 days prior to today. And a group of them trucked off to Rotorua on the weekend while one was symptomatic.

    Sure, they got themselves tested in the end but far too late.

    The idea was that if you were sick, you stay home and seek advice from your doctor or the health-line, not sit at home silent and otherwise take a road trip down country.

    • mauī 33.1
      12 August 2020 at 4:44 pm

      Easy to say in hindsight, but with no community transmission around, and no links to a known case, I doubt many kiwis would go in for testing.

      • Muttonbird 33.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 4:51 pm

        Thought about this. If I was sick, there's no way my work would allow me onsite. That's because that industry has very high safety protocols generally and did a lot of work on getting sign off from MoH about working post-covid.

        If I showed any symptoms for more than a day I would be straight down to the doctor and would voluntarily isolate. It’s not about testing, it’s about getting advice from your doctor.

        • Draco T Bastard 33.1.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 5:44 pm

          It’s not about testing, it’s about getting advice from your doctor.

          Perhaps he believed that he couldn't afford to go to the doctor. I haven't seen anywhere saying that going to the doctor suddenly got free. I could have missed it but if so then so could he.

        • mauī 33.1.1.2
          12 August 2020 at 6:44 pm

          And what are the chances that your typical hetero, working class male volunteers to go to the doctor to see if they have a disease that appears to have disappeared.

        • Anne 33.1.1.3
          12 August 2020 at 7:04 pm

          Muttonbird @ 33
          It seems that one of them went to a medical clinic in West Auckland about a week ago that were not able to test her for Covid so told her to go straight to the nearest Covid testing facility. She returned to the clinic a couple of days ago and they established she never went to be tested.

          Now that centre has had to close in order to be deep cleaned.

          I have to agree with Muttonbird… there does seem to have been a lack of responsibility in at least a couple of the four Covid victims in question.

          • Muttonbird 33.1.1.3.1
            12 August 2020 at 7:45 pm

            That's what I'm reading, Anne.

            Person felt sick, went to the doctor, so far so good, was referred for a Covid test, DIDN'T DO IT.

            This person has probably cost New Zealand several billion dollars. Kids’ sport, and maybe even school, for the rest of the year? Forget it.

  34. Muttonbird 34
    12 August 2020 at 4:35 pm

    Why is Paula Benefit, still a National Party MP and employee of the state, allowed to run anti-government propaganda in her position as radio host. Why even is she allowed to take up that role while still being paid by the taxpayer?

    • Stunned Mullet 34.1
      12 August 2020 at 4:48 pm

      Because there's no law against it and we don't live in a dictatorship ?

      • Muttonbird 34.1.1
        12 August 2020 at 4:53 pm

        There should be a law against it. What's to stop any and all politicians having their own radio show?

        Benefit is still a National Party MP and her statements on her radio show should be considered campaigning for the party and authorised as such.

      • I Feel Love 34.1.2
        12 August 2020 at 5:04 pm

        Ahhhh, if it's legal it's ethical, gotcha.

    • gsays 34.2
      12 August 2020 at 4:59 pm

      I don't get it either, where is the Electoral Commission on this?

      Do they only act when someone complains?

      • Draco T Bastard 34.2.1
        12 August 2020 at 5:39 pm

        Do they only act when someone complains?

        Pretty much.

        Same goes for pretty much all crime.

    • Chris T 34.3
      12 August 2020 at 5:06 pm

      ..

      • Muttonbird 34.3.1
        12 August 2020 at 5:08 pm

        Speak up!

        • Chris T 34.3.1.1
          12 August 2020 at 5:12 pm

          It actually surprises me you don't think beneficiaries should be allowed to earn a bit extra because they are paid by the tax payer.

          • Muttonbird 34.3.1.1.1
            12 August 2020 at 5:14 pm

            I don't care if she's getting paid by Mediaworks or not. I do care about unauthorised election campaigning.

    • Chris T 34.4
      12 August 2020 at 5:08 pm

      Because people are allowed to take side jobs, as long as they pay the extra tax.

      Not that you have shown she is being paid for it.

      • Muttonbird 34.4.1
        12 August 2020 at 5:10 pm

        Oh yeah, working two jobs is a specialty of Paula Benefit's…

        But central to this is the unauthorised campaigning she is doing for the National Party while still one of their MPs and drawing a salary from the hard working taxpayer.

      • gsays 34.4.2
        12 August 2020 at 5:10 pm

        A clue, it isn't always about money.

        Darren Watson was doing his main job but that was deemed inappropriate.

  35. Gabby 35
    12 August 2020 at 5:22 pm

    I like the idea of taking a pic wherever you go if your phone isn't app capable.

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